[Mastering-perl] RE: Mastering-perl Digest, Vol 10, Issue 2

Messmer, Jason Jason.Messmer at xerox.com
Tue Oct 3 13:30:13 EDT 2006 

I have to say I agree with Brian...Having a Head First 'blah' is really
good for beginners but would not
be useful for advance users.  To me, and I read a couple Head First
books, a Head First book is like going
to kindergarten, your saying your abc's, a is for apple,...,p if for
perl.  Once you understand the subject 
of a Head First book, it is no longer useful, you know it and you move
on to the next grade level.  To me
there not a good reference book... 

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: master perl chapter layout (brian d foy)
   2. Re: master perl chapter layout (Derek B. Smith)
   3. Re: master perl chapter layout (brian d foy)
   4. [PATCH] Typos' Corrections (Shlomi Fish)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 14:49:42 -0500
From: "brian d foy" <brian.d.foy at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Mastering-perl] master perl chapter layout
To: mastering-perl at theperlreview.com
Message-ID:
	<2715accf0610021249y32425ab9n1c0f6ce5a147de96 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

On 10/2/06, Derek B. Smith <derekbellnersmith at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I am reading a book called Head First Java b/c I want
> to learn Java as Java and Perl are a good mix of
> technologies to know.  In this book there are many
> small snippets of code that are short and sweet,
> questions and spaces for me to write down what I think
> is the right answer then at then end of the chapter
> are the correct answers explained...

> Do you plan on have sections where the reader can
> answer and write down answers to questions within each
> chapter? Do you plan on having some of the examples I
> listed above?

I've been asked by O'Reilly about writing a "Head First" book for
Perl, but Mastering Perl is going to be a traditional Nutshell book
with the same format and style as the other O'Reilly Perl books.

I think the "Head First" stuff might work well for introductions to
topics, but the format would seem overly burdensome for advanced
material. You'll notice that all of the Head First books are large,
but that's not because of the amount of information. Having seen only
a couple of the books, I've been disappointed at how much information
they are able to convey due to the limitations of the format. Indeed,
I've been disappointed at the focus on format over good information.

The "Head First" series is basically publishing on the cheap. The art
is freely available clip-art, and the author does the layout and so
on, handing in a ready-to-publish book. This is similar to what WROX
and some other extinct publisher have done. One of the reasons I write
for O'Reilly is that they have a great set of editors. The real
strength of a publisher is the ability of editors to judge and give
feedback on content. The fine folks at O'Reilly aren't going to let us
say grossly incorrect in a Nutshell book. "Head First" books don't get
the same sort of support, and I think its apparent in the quality of
its content.

Kathy Sierra, who came up with the format, says that people certainly
like it a lot, but I haven't ever heard anything about whether people
learn better (or even as much) from the books. It seems to me that it
would be okay to read it the first time, but looking up something
would be particular frustrating when you want to verify something
rather than play along in a graphic novel. I'm sure that people do
like the experience better, but I've also found that what people like
isn't always the best thing for them.

-- 
brian d foy <brian.d.foy at gmail.com>
http://www.pair.com/~comdog/


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 12:56:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Derek B. Smith" <derekbellnersmith at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Mastering-perl] master perl chapter layout
To: mastering-perl at theperlreview.com
Message-ID: <20061002195626.87296.qmail at web42404.mail.scd.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1



--- brian d foy <brian.d.foy at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 10/2/06, Derek B. Smith
> <derekbellnersmith at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > I am reading a book called Head First Java b/c I
> want
> > to learn Java as Java and Perl are a good mix of
> > technologies to know.  In this book there are many
> > small snippets of code that are short and sweet,
> > questions and spaces for me to write down what I
> think
> > is the right answer then at then end of the
> chapter
> > are the correct answers explained...
> 
> > Do you plan on have sections where the reader can
> > answer and write down answers to questions within
> each
> > chapter? Do you plan on having some of the
> examples I
> > listed above?
> 
> I've been asked by O'Reilly about writing a "Head
> First" book for
> Perl, but Mastering Perl is going to be a
> traditional Nutshell book
> with the same format and style as the other O'Reilly
> Perl books.
> 
> I think the "Head First" stuff might work well for
> introductions to
> topics, but the format would seem overly burdensome
> for advanced
> material. You'll notice that all of the Head First
> books are large,
> but that's not because of the amount of information.
> Having seen only
> a couple of the books, I've been disappointed at how
> much information
> they are able to convey due to the limitations of
> the format. Indeed,
> I've been disappointed at the focus on format over
> good information.
> 
> The "Head First" series is basically publishing on
> the cheap. The art
> is freely available clip-art, and the author does
> the layout and so
> on, handing in a ready-to-publish book. This is
> similar to what WROX
> and some other extinct publisher have done. One of
> the reasons I write
> for O'Reilly is that they have a great set of
> editors. The real
> strength of a publisher is the ability of editors to
> judge and give
> feedback on content. The fine folks at O'Reilly
> aren't going to let us
> say grossly incorrect in a Nutshell book. "Head
> First" books don't get
> the same sort of support, and I think its apparent
> in the quality of
> its content.
> 
> Kathy Sierra, who came up with the format, says that
> people certainly
> like it a lot, but I haven't ever heard anything
> about whether people
> learn better (or even as much) from the books. It
> seems to me that it
> would be okay to read it the first time, but looking
> up something
> would be particular frustrating when you want to
> verify something
> rather than play along in a graphic novel. I'm sure
> that people do
> like the experience better, but I've also found that
> what people like
> isn't always the best thing for them.
> 


Thanks for your thoughts, but you did not answer my
question. :)  Will you include a question/answer
section?
Yes good point on the verification of a fact...the
Head First series I could see would not be exact.

Funy thought b/c this book Head First Java is
published by Oreilly??? : )


Head First Java, 2nd Edition Kathy Sierra, et al  
O'Reilly Media, Published 2005, 2nd edition, ISBN
0596009208

Customer Reviews: 

Our Price: $28.95 ~ You Save $16.00 
Availability: In-Stock
View Details | View Cover | Read Reviews 


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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 15:05:56 -0500
From: "brian d foy" <brian.d.foy at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Mastering-perl] master perl chapter layout
To: mastering-perl at theperlreview.com
Message-ID:
	<2715accf0610021305y3d1d7ce6kacf086f957310736 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

On 10/2/06, Derek B. Smith <derekbellnersmith at yahoo.com> wrote:


> Thanks for your thoughts, but you did not answer my
> question. :)  Will you include a question/answer
> section?

As I said, this is a traditional Nutshell format, which doesn't have a
question and answer section.

> Funy thought b/c this book Head First Java is
> published by Oreilly??? : )

The Head First series is a different imprint, but I was imprecise in
my language. O'Reilly Media has branched out quite a bit and has many
different formats and series now. Having been around for awhile, I
still say "O'Reilly" to refer to the Nutshell books that are the core
of their business. :)

-- 
brian d foy <brian.d.foy at gmail.com>
http://www.pair.com/~comdog/


------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 15:19:54 +0200
From: Shlomi Fish <shlomif at iglu.org.il>
Subject: [Mastering-perl] [PATCH] Typos' Corrections
To: mastering-perl at theperlreview.com
Message-ID: <200610031519.55102.shlomif at iglu.org.il>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi all!

Attached is a patch to correct some typos in the trunk.

Regards,

	Shlomi Fish

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      shlomif at iglu.org.il
Homepage:        http://www.shlomifish.org/

Chuck Norris wrote a complete Perl 6 implementation in a day but then
destroyed all evidence with his bare hands, so no one will know his
secrets.
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