[Coco] ROM Copyrights... copyrights in general...

[William Astle]

Indeed. I can echo the sentiment. (warning: off topic "rant" follows)

The fact that Wayne got anything even mentioning a supervisor is 
impressive. Alas, I don't hold much hope of anyone getting anything even 
verging on almost useful as a result. I had a different issue with 
Microsoft that basically boiled down to (paraphrased), which seems to be 
fairly typical:

Me> One of your users is forwarding their email to my gmail account. I 
need it to stop.
MS> I can help! Do I have permission to connect to your desktop remotely?
Me> No. What does my computer have to do with your user forwarding their 
email to me?
MS> We need to check the settings on your gmail account to remove the 
<mumble>@live.fr from your gmail account.
Me> You have it backwards. <mumble>@live.fr is forwarding their email 
*to* my gmail account. You do not need access to my gmail account to fix 
that. In fact, you cannot stop forwarding from <mumble>@live.fr through 
any setting at gmail.
MS> We need to check the settings on your gmail acocunt to remove 
<mumble>@live.fr from your gmail account.
Me> Are you stupid? <mumble>@live.fr is not associated with my gmail 
account. Your user is incorrectly forwarding their email to me.
MS> I can help! We need to check the settings on your gmail account to 
remove <mumble>@live.fr form your gmail account.
*MS support rep hangs up the chat session*

Further, I managed to connect to someone else at Microsoft via an 
alternative communication path. Twice this fellow has indicated that the 
problem is fixed yet they still can't seem to fix it.

To add insult to injury, there's no way for someone who doesn't have a 
Microsoft account to actually contact anyone at Microsoft to report that 
their users are doing something problematic.

On 2017-06-08 09:54 AM, Salvador Garcia via Coco wrote:
> Wayne, I wholeheartedly commend you on your bravery to deal with MS Support. Not many go down this path and come back with their sanity intact.
> 
> I will nominate you for an award for next's year's CoCoFEST!
> 
> Salvador
> 
> 
> 
> 
>        From: Wayne Campbell <asa.rand at gmail.com>
>   To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>   Sent: Wednesday, June 7, 2017 11:40 PM
>   Subject: Re: [Coco] ROM Copyrights... copyrights in general...
>     
> I am currently in a chat with Microsoft support to see if I can find out
> what they want to give us permission to use the ROMs in emulators. I will
> post here when I have an answer. So far, the conversation looks like this:
> 
> OK
> Hello Wayne!
> How may I help you today?
> Your case reference for today’s session: 1388097493. Please make note of
> this number for future use.
> I am nhere to find out what can be done, if anything, to enable us (the
> remaining Color Computer/Dragon users) to use the ROM codes from the
> original machines in emulators that are available.
> Wayne, can you please explain me the issue more?
> I am just trained on download, install and activate of Windows and Office
> products, if you want I can connect you with our Windows technical team.
> Well, the computers haven't been made since the 1980s. The Color Computer 3
> stopped being sold in about 1990-93. There are emulators that have been
> made to emulate the hardware, but without the ROM code they are useless. We
> would like to know what Microsoft would want to give us permission to use
> the ROM code from those computers in the emulators that are out there.
> ROM, its an hardware which is not attached with Microsoft.
> Are you referring to the activation code for Windows?
> No. On the old 8-bit computers, the basic language that you saw when you
> turned on the computer was stored in a ROM chip. The Color Computer and
> Dragon computer used a ROM licensed from Microsoft.
> The languages were called Color BASIC, Extended Color BASIC and Enhanced
> Color BASIC
> Let me check with my supervisor, please wait for some time.
> I will wait
> 
> 
> On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:41 PM, Bill Pierce via Coco <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> Thanks Dennis, I thought I was right on this.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Bill Pierce
>> "Charlie stole the handle, and the train it won't stop going, no way to
>> slow down!" - Ian Anderson - Jethro Tull
>>
>> My Music from the Tandy/Radio Shack Color Computer 2 & 3
>> https://sites.google.com/site/dabarnstudio/
>> Co-Contributor, Co-Editor for CocoPedia
>> http://www.cocopedia.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
>>
>> E-Mail: ooogalapasooo at aol.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Dennis Bathory-Kitsz <bathory at maltedmedia.com>
>> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: Wed, Jun 7, 2017 10:57 pm
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] ROM Copyrights... copyrights in general...
>>
>> On Wed, June 7, 2017 9:26 pm, Bill Pierce via Coco wrote:> Something no
>> one has yet to mention or clarify (Dennis?)...> I've always "heard" that if
>> you own the original roms, you have the right to> make copies for your own
>> personal use... I have no clue if this is true. I> know it did apply to
>> making tape and CD copies of albums I own, but ONLY for> personal use.>
>> "IF" this is true, then many of us have the legal right to have and use
>> copies> of the roms (no, this doesn't cover uploading/downloading "illegal"
>> copies).> Personally, I own all versions of CB, ECB, DECB, & SECB. I even
>> have copies of> CB & ECB (1.01?) on RS cassette tape (factory labeled, and
>> bought from RS as> an upgrade).{All my copyright comments are US only)Since
>> the Sony Betamax case, the courts have held that a copy of any item foryour
>> personal use is allowable. You must legally own the original. You
>> mustdestroy the copy if you give away, sell or otherwise dispose of the
>> original.Not legal advice.Dennis-- Coco mailing
>> listCoco at maltedmedia.comhttps://pairlist5.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> https://pairlist5.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 
>