From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 1 00:28:06 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 00:28:06 -0500 Subject: [Coco] A New Years Prayer In-Reply-To: <20081231.224223.487.0@webmail09.dca.untd.com> References: <20081231.224223.487.0@webmail09.dca.untd.com> Message-ID: <200901010028.06666.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 31 December 2008, brjeremy at juno.com wrote: >My dear friends: >As the Old Year draws to a close and a New Year dawns may God watch over > each of you and those dear to you. May this be a year of health and peace. > May he provide for our needs and even make allowances for some of our > wants. And to adapt a phrase from my Jewish friends,..next year in Elgin. >With all best wishes, >Brother Jeremy, CSJW Thank you Brother Jeremy, and may those things you wish for us be granted for you also. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "...and the fully armed nuclear warheads, are, of course, merely a courtesy detail." From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 1 09:04:36 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 09:04:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow IDE Message-ID: <495CCD74.9020004@gmail.com> Hi Roger, I tried downloading Rainbow IDE from your website today, but I couldn't get it to work. Is there a problem on my end? When I click on download it just does a refresh on web page. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 1 09:06:55 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 09:06:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Bjork 1.90 Beta Message-ID: <495CCDFF.5010301@gmail.com> I tried Bjork 1.90 Beta emulator and it is working great on my laptop PC. I forget when I downloaded this software. Is this the newest version? Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jan 1 10:17:07 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 10:17:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] A New Years Prayer In-Reply-To: <20081231.224223.487.0@webmail09.dca.untd.com> References: <20081231.224223.487.0@webmail09.dca.untd.com> Message-ID: <495C9823.519.3C6FA@jdaggett.gate.net> On 1 Jan 2009 at 4:42, brjeremy at juno.com wrote: > My dear friends: > As the Old Year draws to a close and a New Year dawns may God watch > over each of you and those dear to you. May this be a year of health > and peace. May he provide for our needs and even make allowances for > some of our wants. And to adapt a phrase from my Jewish friends,..next > year in Elgin. With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW > > ____________________________________________________________ Thanks and may God find favor in all that you do. james From 6809er at bjork-huffman.net Thu Jan 1 10:48:14 2009 From: 6809er at bjork-huffman.net (Steve) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 07:48:14 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Bjork 1.90 Beta In-Reply-To: <495CCDFF.5010301@gmail.com> References: <495CCDFF.5010301@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090101154856.AD62120A13@qs281.pair.com> The "Bjork" CoCo emulator changed its name about two years ago to VCC and the latest version is 1.4 and was released in March 2008. Link: http://vcc6809.bravehost.com/index.html While I was honored that he named his great emulator after me, (he was a fan of my games) I had request that he change the name so people would stop thinking I was the one that created it. (I was getting quite a number of emails thanking me for his program.) When someone has worked long and hard on such a key project for the CoCo community they should get all the credit! Steve Bjork At 06:06 AM 1/1/2009, you wrote: >I tried Bjork 1.90 Beta emulator and it is working great on my laptop PC. >I forget when I downloaded this software. Is this the newest version? > >Alan Jones From cyberpunk at prtc.net Thu Jan 1 11:31:29 2009 From: cyberpunk at prtc.net (RJLCyberPunk) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 12:31:29 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Bjork 1.90 Beta References: <495CCDFF.5010301@gmail.com> <20090101154856.AD62120A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve" <6809er at bjork-huffman.net> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2009 11:48 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Bjork 1.90 Beta > The "Bjork" CoCo emulator changed its name about two years ago to VCC and > the latest version is 1.4 and was released in March 2008. > Link: http://vcc6809.bravehost.com/index.html > > While I was honored that he named his great emulator after me, (he was a > fan of my games) I had request that he change the name so people would > stop thinking I was the one that created it. (I was getting quite a > number of emails thanking me for his program.) > > When someone has worked long and hard on such a key project for the CoCo > community they should get all the credit! > > Steve Bjork > First of all I want to say thank you for all the games you wrote, they sure kept me my brothers and my cousins entertained back in the day, I hope you at some point write a sequel in 3D for Ghana Bwana. Wow and for a moment I thought there was another emulator out there with your name on it and was about to ask where to download it, so is VCC after all, huh? From jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk Thu Jan 1 13:43:13 2009 From: jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk (James McKay) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 18:43:13 -0000 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. References: <495C316B.1020406@swbell.net> Message-ID: "Joel Ewy" wrote in message news:495C316B.1020406 at swbell.net... > James McKay wrote: >> Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D >> Deathchase >> for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and is >> available >> in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > > By the way, my son who just turned 6, LOVES "The Glove." Thanks, great to know that the younger generation appreciates it and the CoCo. :) From ed.orbea at gmail.com Thu Jan 1 16:50:13 2009 From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 13:50:13 -0800 Subject: [Coco] CoCo Cartridges Message-ID: <495D3A95.6020904@gmail.com> I have started cleaning out things for the New Year, and came across 3 CoCo game cartridges. Shangai Springster NFL Football II They are free (shipping included, but only in the US) to anybody who wants them, provided they "dump the ROMs and make them available" so that all can share them. I can be contacted off-list at: ed dot orbea at gmail dot com Happy Hew Year Ed From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 1 18:26:53 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 15:26:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Eagle CAD CoCo Edge-Card? Message-ID: <339178.63292.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I downloaded the freeware version of Eagle-CAD because I wanted to fool around with maybe making something for my CoCo. None of the libraries have a .100 center edge-card as used by the CoCo carts, so I was wondering if anyone had developed a CoCo Library for Eagle CAD? I'm just not smart enough to make one myself, at least not yet. I'll keep trying though -JE From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 1 19:14:43 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 16:14:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Eagle CAD CoCo Edge-Card? References: <339178.63292.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <872780.43079.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> okay, never mind - i figured out how to make one :) yay! HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE. yes, I shouted. je ________________________________ From: John Eric To: Coco at maltedmedia.com Sent: Thursday, January 1, 2009 5:26:53 PM Subject: [Coco] Eagle CAD CoCo Edge-Card? I downloaded the freeware version of Eagle-CAD because I wanted to fool around with maybe making something for my CoCo. None of the libraries have a .100 center edge-card as used by the CoCo carts, so I was wondering if anyone had developed a CoCo Library for Eagle CAD? I'm just not smart enough to make one myself, at least not yet. I'll keep trying though -JE -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 1 20:10:16 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 19:10:16 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> At 08:31 PM 12/31/2008, you wrote: >Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D Deathchase >for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and is available >in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > >http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/deathchase.htm > >Happy new year! Could you post the URL to the unzipped .dsk image so I can mount it with CoCoNet? :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 1 20:20:58 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 19:20:58 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090102012100.5E58720A13@qs281.pair.com> At 08:31 PM 12/31/2008, you wrote: >Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D Deathchase >for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and is available >in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > >http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/deathchase.htm I just copied the .dsk image to my PC HD and mounted it from my CoCo 3 and the game plays fine, although the graphics might need a little more work. Nice job. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 1 20:38:22 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 19:38:22 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow IDE In-Reply-To: <495CCD74.9020004@gmail.com> References: <495CCD74.9020004@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090102013824.CB74020A13@qs281.pair.com> At 08:04 AM 1/1/2009, you wrote: >Hi Roger, >I tried downloading Rainbow IDE from your website today, but I >couldn't get it to work. >Is there a problem on my end? When I click on download it just does >a refresh on web page. > >Alan Jones I just fixed the problem. Sorry, once in a blue moon the redirect file on numerous web sites of mine gets erased probably due to too many hits while the server or PHP is doing it's file locking thing. I'm going to add a few lines in the redirection script that replaces the file with a backup copy if it's missing or empty. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Thu Jan 1 20:42:02 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 01:42:02 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Eagle CAD CoCo Edge-Card? In-Reply-To: <339178.63292.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <339178.63292.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <495D70EA.9030207@aurigae.demon.co.uk> John Eric wrote: > I downloaded the freeware version of Eagle-CAD because I wanted to > fool around with maybe making something for my CoCo. None of the > libraries have a .100 center edge-card as used by the CoCo carts, so > I was wondering if anyone had developed a CoCo Library for Eagle CAD? > I'm just not smart enough to make one myself, at least not yet. I'll > keep trying though -JE I have one that I made for the Dragon which is pretty much the same pinout, just with slightly different names for some of the signals. Email me off list if you want a copy. Cheers. Phill. From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 1 23:05:09 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 20:05:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] 256K RAM chips References: , <4952F29A.3080900@gmail.com> <49569607.7330.163194@jdaggett.gate.net> <77801.98754.qm@web111211.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495B75CD.3010707@gmail.com> Message-ID: <758049.31087.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Dennis Weide once did and article in the Rainbow (I found it just the other day) for making a CoCo RAM Pak. You have to overcome the fact that CTS* is read only, so you have to do some memory mapping. His project was for the earlier CoCo's and as such was 16K. With the CoCo 3, you could make a 32k (or bankswitch 32k on a CoCo2). I have some of those chips as well and was considering an attempt at an internal 32k upgrade for an old zx81 I just found. J.eric ________________________________ From: N8WQ To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 7:38:21 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] 256K RAM chips John and James, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you guys. Thanks for all the information on my memory chips. I knew they wouldn't actually work in the CoCo 3 but I thought they might be able to be used in some other creative way. It just seems a waste to through these chips in the trash. I will keep them until some creative project comes my way. Before I forget I hope everyone on the list has a Happy New Year. I finally got all my CoCo's out of storage but I forgot to get my color monitor! :) I will get it on my next trip. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com John Eric wrote: > Those UM61-256K-15 are in fact 256Kbit, 32Kx8 Static CACHE RAM chips. I several tubes of those. You might could use them to make a battery backed RAM Cartridge (32K) ??? JE > > > > > ________________________________ > From: "jdaggett at gate.net" > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 7:54:31 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] 256K RAM chips > > On 24 Dec 2008 at 21:40, N8WQ wrote: > > >> Can you guys tell me if I might be able to use these memory chips in a >> Color Computer 3 project? Any ideas? >> >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/cocoprojects >> >> Alan Jones >> > > > Not without some means of demultiplexing the memory address from the Z-Buss. To achieve the 20 bit address you will need other logic and use the RAS/CAS signals to convert the 10 bit multiplexed address to a 20 bit address to use SRAMs. > james > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 1 23:11:49 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 20:11:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Roger, Tony did an article on this board for Rainbow, I think it was called "Increasing Character Display" and if I'm not mistaken, it's in "A Full Turn of The Screw" which I've found on the maltedmedia ftp. It gives the CoCo's addresses for the register map - i think it was mapped in such a way that you write the address to the chip via a port, then you read or wrote the data to that location, and so on. It worked with basic and OS-9 - the original C-DOS had the D80 ON/OFF commands. I think the one you have supported smooth scrolling (by pixel rather than character). It should be simple enough, with the turn of the screw article, to write a disk basic driver - intercept the RAM Hook for video and route it to the driver. -J.eric ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: cocolist for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 2:02:46 PM Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons Does anyone know how in the heck the addon with the video chip is supposed to output video or how it works? The board also has a clock chip which seems to be running even though the board is old.. you can PEEK from BASIC and see the clock registers changing. I do have the register specs on the clock. The video chip is a CRT9128. There's an 11mhz crystal, HM6116LP-2 chip, 13x2 header, and 2x2 header. I see no other ID marks on the board other than the word "Disto" and two color stickers on the back labeled "M" and "T". I see nothing in the Disto SC docs explaining the details of this board, just a mention that it's one of the add-ons. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 2 00:17:52 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2009 23:17:52 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons In-Reply-To: <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> At 10:11 PM 1/1/2009, you wrote: >Roger, Tony did an article on this board for Rainbow, I think it was >called "Increasing Character Display" and if I'm not mistaken, it's >in "A Full Turn of The Screw" which I've found on the maltedmedia >ftp. It gives the CoCo's addresses for the register map - i think it >was mapped in such a way that you write the address to the chip via >a port, then you read or wrote the data to that location, and so on. >It worked with basic and OS-9 - the original C-DOS had the D80 >ON/OFF commands. I think the one you have supported smooth scrolling >(by pixel rather than character). It should be simple enough, with >the turn of the screw article, to write a disk basic driver - >intercept the RAM Hook for video and route it to the driver. -J.eric I found the directory of Full Turn of the Screw article archives but can't find anything about the Disto SC or add-on cards. Can you point me to the directory or file you're referring to? Thanks -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From mechacoco at gmail.com Fri Jan 2 01:35:17 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 23:35:17 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons In-Reply-To: <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> Try this link Roger: The article is called "Increasing Character Display". Darren --- On 1/1/09, Roger Taylor wrote: > At 10:11 PM 1/1/2009, you wrote: >>Roger, Tony did an article on this board for Rainbow, I think it was >>called "Increasing Character Display" and if I'm not mistaken, it's >>in "A Full Turn of The Screw" which I've found on the maltedmedia >>ftp. It gives the CoCo's addresses for the register map - i think it >>was mapped in such a way that you write the address to the chip via >>a port, then you read or wrote the data to that location, and so on. >>It worked with basic and OS-9 - the original C-DOS had the D80 >>ON/OFF commands. I think the one you have supported smooth scrolling >>(by pixel rather than character). It should be simple enough, with >>the turn of the screw article, to write a disk basic driver - >>intercept the RAM Hook for video and route it to the driver. -J.eric > > > > I found the directory of Full Turn of the Screw article archives but > can't find anything about the Disto SC or add-on cards. Can you > point me to the directory or file you're referring to? > > Thanks > Roger Taylor > From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 2 08:08:17 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 05:08:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <725303.27846.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> that's the one :-) je ________________________________ From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 12:35:17 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons Try this link Roger: The article is called "Increasing Character Display". Darren --- On 1/1/09, Roger Taylor wrote: > At 10:11 PM 1/1/2009, you wrote: >>Roger, Tony did an article on this board for Rainbow, I think it was >>called "Increasing Character Display" and if I'm not mistaken, it's >>in "A Full Turn of The Screw" which I've found on the maltedmedia >>ftp. It gives the CoCo's addresses for the register map - i think it >>was mapped in such a way that you write the address to the chip via >>a port, then you read or wrote the data to that location, and so on. >>It worked with basic and OS-9 - the original C-DOS had the D80 >>ON/OFF commands. I think the one you have supported smooth scrolling >>(by pixel rather than character). It should be simple enough, with >>the turn of the screw article, to write a disk basic driver - >>intercept the RAM Hook for video and route it to the driver. -J.eric > > > > I found the directory of Full Turn of the Screw article archives but > can't find anything about the Disto SC or add-on cards. Can you > point me to the directory or file you're referring to? > > Thanks > Roger Taylor > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From farna at att.net Fri Jan 2 17:27:20 2009 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:27:20 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts Message-ID: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> I have to agree with Paul and Carlos. They are pretty much on the same track -- a nice learning/experimenters computer, cheap enough to be used not only to develop something, but to power it as well. Cost wise, the "CoCo4.exe" will probably be the most effective. PC hardware, especially a couple generations old, is cheap and plentiful, and already has everything built in. Heck, it would be nice to kick DOS, Windows, or Linux completely out of the picture -- the "CoCo4" would in effect be as much an OS as anything else. That would be ideal for DECB anyway, but might hinder running Nitros-9. Of course porting Nitros to the x-86 architecture has always been a possibility for that arena. The cost factor is why Tandy went to the GIME. And that's our biggest hurdle now. Tandy skimped on it - made it "just enough" as far as speed and power, to save money. Can't blame them in a way -- the CoCo was supposed to be a cheap computer and the price of mainstream PCs were spiraling downward, cutting deeply into profit margins. I suppose we really should be grateful that there even was a CoCo3. Any video producing machine will have to have a reverse engineered GIME to be compatible. That has been a major hurdle. With the cost of FPGAs coming down, and I think someone has actually done the ground work, that's not so far fetched. Basing the machine on an existing evaluation board will be expensive though. The price needs to be kept under $300, though I'd really like to see one closer to the vicinity of $200, but I just don't think it's possible. Carlos, I'd love it if you proved me wrong! So what would a new machine have to have as a MINIMUM -- not wants, but needs. That should be the starting point, then add the wants if/as possible. 1. Minimum of CoCo3 software compatibility. I don't think not supporting the older, seldom used graphics modes of the CC1/2 will be a big loss, especially if losing them will save $$$ in the price tag. 2. Capable of using modern peripherals. This looks to be a harder part, but I think it's easier than it sounds. There are USB floppy drives (though only 3.5"), and there are drive emulator boards for USB devices. That might be the easiest way to go. Instead of a hard drive a USB device would be good, or an SD card device. There are affordable 8GB USB thumb drives! Just supporting USB drive emulation might be easier and cheaper than supporting both, and USB is pretty universal. May need a special transfer program to transfer files to/from a PC if any special setup of the device is needed for the CoCo (program for the PC to read/write to the CoCo formatted USB drive). 3. Printers are a different story. There are few "smart" printers around anymore. The only one I know of are a few dot matrix printers still made for multi part forms still used by businesses. Epson still sells a 9 pin 300LX+II with serial, parallel, and USB ports, available for around $200. Would be nice to have ink jet support, but that would require some overhead. Someone wrote about an adapter that would translate ESC/2 codes into something a standard "dumb" inkjet (or dare I say laser?) printer could print, but I'm thinking a micro controller programmed with a printer driver would be the best solution. Of course then it would have to support a limited number of printers -- maybe the HP family? I'm assuming the drivers are all similar though. Probably not -- so any adapter or other solution would be limited to a few specific models. Still, it would probably be best to just leave the serial port (a real hardware port AND a bit-banger port would be nice!) and make a MC converter. A PC can always be used as a printer processor, I guess. I doubt many would be trying to use a new CoCo-like machine for word processing, though a printer for code listings would be nice. If it's as simple as storing the listing on a USB drive and sticking it in a PC (and possibly running a transfer program) to transfer and print, I could live with that. Or buy a $200 (or used) dot-matrix printer. 4. Video. Must be CC3 compatible, and I'd really like to see video on board. If on board it must be compatible with off the shelf monitors. If the new machine's main purpose is for experimenters/learning basics, however, it could rely just on a TV for a monitor. I don't like the idea of having to rely on a PC, but in reality it could be a hardware board that could work alone, but require a PC for video and programming input. Most would really like to see higher resolution -- at least 640x480. 640x192 is the highest the CC3 will produce. More than 640x480 would probably take costs way up due to memory and hardware requirements. 5. There are experimenter computers out there now, so the further we go in that direction instead of a stand-alone programmable learning/experimenting/game machine similar to the original CoCo, the less applicable it becomes. I mean it would just be of fleeting interest to CoCo people if it's only partially CoCo3 compatible and requires a PC to work. The only advantage such a machine would have is that the board could be programmed then disconnected from the PC to "do its thing". So do PIC controllers, BASIC Stamps, and several others though. If you're building a retro computer do it all the way! 6. Then there's this little beastie: http://www.multilabs.net/Retro.html. It's very similar to a CoCo1. It has 64K (32K for ROM and graphics, but the graphics memory isn't accessible, and 32K program memory), low res graphics (CoCo1 had some better modes), etc. If nothing else, the interfacing devices offered by this company may help. Their ezVGA module will only produce 320x240 graphics though. They have PS/2 to serial keyboard and mouse adapters, and even a serial VGA adapter. This might be all most experimenters need, and the Retro is only $99. I'm thinking that a CoCo3-like computer similar to this is what people would really like to see. ----------------- Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:42:24 -0500 From: "Paul E. Jones" My son has a Lego Mindstorm NXT robot. While I am quite interested in it -- pretty cool with the Bluetooth interface and programmable microcontroller -- he is far less interested. The reason is that if he creates something, he can't share his creations. He gets more enjoyment out of scripting on video games sites and updating his own web site. Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 21:07:06 -0600 From: Carlos Santiago My view of the Coco family of computers has always been as a hobbyist. Anyone that is interested in a Coco as their primary machine, will demand many new features and applications that already exist in a PC or Mac. These users will have a hard time because they will try to mould the Coco into something that it is not. As for a Coco4.exe Steve Bjork is already working on this along with a new version of Basic. These will satisfy the need for something that runs on the PC, but it will not allow you to develop any new Coco specific hardware. The Coco has alway been a computer for those interested in writing programs and adding new and interesting hardware features. A hobbyist computer. My interest is to rekindle that spirit. A new Coco4 will allow those who had great ideas about Coco software and hardware to implement them. I would like to start a list of people that are interested in the idea of a Coco4 and also those of you that are capable of contributing. This would be a project for the Coco community to provided those of you with the type of machine you dream about. Some of the feedback I received was that it would cost too much. Or that the design would be too complex. I have been a hardware engineer since 1979 and have spent much time developing products that are low cost and feature rich. On thing that is clear is that the Coco4 may materialize in the near future as software or hardware. If you would like a specific feature or capability, the only way to obtain it is by being involved. I mean in the real sense, not just to request a crazy feature to see if it can be done. The start of all this will be a development document that will define the boundaries of the project. Once this is complete and agreed upon, the design work can start. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 2 18:54:05 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:54:05 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com > References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090102235433.2E12420A13@qs281.pair.com> At 12:35 AM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >Try this link Roger: > > > >The article is called "Increasing Character Display". > >Darren I suppose the article came before Tony actually built the SC version of that project. I'm not sure the board is worth messing with right now considering I still don't know what header pins the video signals are on and exactly what type of monitor (obtainable today) would work with it. It does sound ideal for giving 80 columns on a CoCo 1/2 from OS-9, or giving dual 80-column displays on a CoCo 3. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk Fri Jan 2 19:30:57 2009 From: jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk (James McKay) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 00:30:57 -0000 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: "Roger Taylor" wrote in message news:20090102011020.091B920A13 at qs281.pair.com... >>Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D >>Deathchase >>for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and is available >>in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > > Could you post the URL to the unzipped .dsk image so I can mount it with > CoCoNet? :) An interesting idea, I've stuck it up at: http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/dchs.dsk Should see whether you can load a new game directly from a rather far away location on the internet. :) Regarding the graphics, they are actually the old monochrome ones running in 2 bpp mode, they are going to get a full revamp - including the all important horizon line. bye, James McKay. From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 2 19:52:13 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 18:52:13 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. In-Reply-To: References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090103005230.51E3720A13@qs281.pair.com> At 06:30 PM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >"Roger Taylor" wrote in >message news:20090102011020.091B920A13 at qs281.pair.com... > >>Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D > >>Deathchase > >>for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and is available > >>in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > > > > Could you post the URL to the unzipped .dsk image so I can mount it with > > CoCoNet? :) > >An interesting idea, I've stuck it up at: >http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/dchs.dsk > >Should see whether you can load a new game directly from a rather far away >location on the internet. :) The disk mounted in less than a second, but it's garbled, probably due to the fact that CoCoNet currently only reads the direct-sector based formats with no header info, truncated portions, etc. I need to work on that this weekend. A common 35-track direct virtual disk would be 161280 bytes in size (157.5K). -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 2 20:19:09 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 20:19:09 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons In-Reply-To: <20090102235433.2E12420A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> <20090102235433.2E12420A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901022019.09957.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 02 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >At 12:35 AM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >>Try this link Roger: >> >>>llTurn_P125_134.pdf> >> >>The article is called "Increasing Character Display". >> >>Darren > >I suppose the article came before Tony actually built the SC version >of that project. I'm not sure the board is worth messing with right >now considering I still don't know what header pins the video signals >are on and exactly what type of monitor (obtainable today) would work >with it. It does sound ideal for giving 80 columns on a CoCo 1/2 >from OS-9, or giving dual 80-column displays on a CoCo 3. I don't happen to have a set of specs on that particular crt controller Roger, but I would suspect a simple doubling of the dot clock crystal would make it compatible with vga, which needs a minimum h rate of 31.5Khz. That would make it a 29 Mhz crystal I believe. That might however, need a 2x faster character data rom too. My WP-RS was running on the usual 14.x Mhz crystal, but with reworked blanking and sync times so it ran at about 18Khz h rate, and 70 Hz v rate. A Maggy 12" PC Monitor 80 was happy as a clam running at that speed for over a decade once the h oscillator coil slug was backed out for the higher sweep rate. That all served to make the display much bigger and more easily read, which was the main idea. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) A pound of salt will not sweeten a single cup of tea. From bookworm at cavenet.com Fri Jan 2 21:17:27 2009 From: bookworm at cavenet.com (BookWorm) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 02:17:27 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Why do we need a CoCo 4? (Long irrelevant rant) References: <495924C3.17393.326761@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: > A new GIME chip is farther along that you might think. In fact about 60% > coded. Several of the hurdles that I have struggled with over the past 6 > months have now beed resolved and design is moving slowly forward. *Wow*! > I have finally decided on a desktop screen resolution of 800x600 at 256 > colors. *WOW*!!! > TCP/IP is best done via a peripheral processor. I'll never admit it, but you may be right. Ok, why not design a new RAM board with 2Mb and a 68000? The RAM has to be 16- bit for the GIME anyway, and if we memory map the 68k, we could even run OSk in a NitrOS-9 window. I probably have no idea what I'm talking about, but it sounds good. :) From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 2 21:19:24 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 20:19:24 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons In-Reply-To: <200901022019.09957.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> <20090102235433.2E12420A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901022019.09957.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090103022032.3B13520A15@qs281.pair.com> At 07:19 PM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >I don't happen to have a set of specs on that particular crt >controller Roger, >but I would suspect a simple doubling of the dot clock crystal would make it >compatible with vga, which needs a minimum h rate of 31.5Khz. That would >make it a 29 Mhz crystal I believe. That might however, need a 2x faster >character data rom too. My WP-RS was running on the usual 14.x Mhz crystal, >but with reworked blanking and sync times so it ran at about 18Khz h rate, >and 70 Hz v rate. A Maggy 12" PC Monitor 80 was happy as a clam running at >that speed for over a decade once the h oscillator coil slug was backed out >for the higher sweep rate. That all served to make the display much bigger >and more easily read, which was the main idea. I first looked all over the web and couldn't find any pinouts of the CRT9128. It looks like Tony's article covers all that, but it's a scanner capture of the magazine pages and I'm not sure if there's any text copy there for engines to see. I wonder if that particular add-on was a dud compared to his other popular boards? Anyway, I'm looking forward to making some personal experimental add-ons one day using the MEB connector. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jan 2 22:12:39 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2009 22:12:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts In-Reply-To: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> Message-ID: <495E9157.3620.9FCB49@jdaggett.gate.net> On 2 Jan 2009 at 17:27, Frank Swygert wrote: > 4. Video. Must be CC3 compatible, and I'd really like to see video on > board. If on board it must be compatible with off the shelf monitors. > If the new machine's main purpose is for experimenters/learning > basics, however, it could rely just on a TV for a monitor. I don't > like the idea of having to rely on a PC, but in reality it could be a > hardware board that could work alone, but require a PC for video and > programming input. Most would really like to see higher resolution -- > at least 640x480. 640x192 is the highest the CC3 will produce. More > than 640x480 would probably take costs way up due to memory and > hardware requirements. Frank 640x480 in itself is not that expensive an overhead. In fact 8Megs of SDRAM is as cheap if not cheaper than 512K of Static RAM. So doing 640x480 in 256 colors is not a real cost increase. More an issue is which block of 512k to use. 640x480 256 colors will require 307.2Kbytes of memory. That more than fits in the base 512K CC3. In a 2M CC3 we have four such 512K blocks. That then could allow a desktop of 800x600 256 colors. 480Kbytes. Inside the FPGA this is easy to do. The harder part maybe in adapting the OS to recognize this enhancement. Still a dedicated CC4 PCB is going to be in the range of $8-$12 a square inch. Much will depend on how many are produced. Better of is to optain an FPGA development board with enough expansion to add a dedicated I/O card. One in mind is the Digilent Inc Nexsys2 board. At $99, it has a Spartan 3E 500K that is more than large enough to do a CC4. for $20 more one can expand up to a 1200K gate FPGA. An I/O card then could run in the $40 to $70 range and still meet the $200 criteria. james From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 00:22:57 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 21:22:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons References: <20081230200329.33EED20A13@qs281.pair.com> <516510.64605.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090102051801.82AF820A13@qs281.pair.com> <5d802cd0901012235h346099b0u612b5c1ab61771c6@mail.gmail.com> <20090102235433.2E12420A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49986.94859.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> The output was composite and worked well with monitors such as the Amdek 300 and 300A. I will do some research and see what I can come up with. The board was actually one of Tony's first add-ons for the original SC - later versions of the display 80 had smooth scrolling and switchable between the CoCo video and the d80 so a single monitor could be used (this required a monitor driver in the coco for coco video). The MEB header doesn't have the video signals so there should be another smaller header somewhere or some other connections for that. A friend of my Uncle actually had one of these which he bought about 4 years before I was even born. I have such fond memories of the coco growing up and am glad I have some of the equipment to play around with these days. My uncle said if you can find older disto catalogs from 1985 - 1987 that Tony used to list the memory maps and functions in all of his catalogs. but by 1988 (a year before I was born :) had stopped this practice, but I can't say for sure myself - i'll take his word though. -JEric p.s. there is a much better scan of the whole book if you check here: ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/VARIOUS/TUTORIALS/HARDWARE/FULLTURN/FullTurn.pdf it prints out nicely as compared to the sections. ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 5:54:05 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto SC add-ons At 12:35 AM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >Try this link Roger: > > > >The article is called "Increasing Character Display". > >Darren I suppose the article came before Tony actually built the SC version of that project. I'm not sure the board is worth messing with right now considering I still don't know what header pins the video signals are on and exactly what type of monitor (obtainable today) would work with it. It does sound ideal for giving 80 columns on a CoCo 1/2 from OS-9, or giving dual 80-column displays on a CoCo 3. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 00:53:14 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 21:53:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Message-ID: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette drives to DSDD 360K units. After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I thought. One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? Thanks - JEric From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 01:06:32 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 22:06:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was meaning is if I jumper two drives as drive 1 and connect them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b connectors, that should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended for a tape drive, that should work as coco drive 2. I'm going to go ahead and order the idc crimp tool as I realize it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 extender cable, etc. jeric ________________________________ From: John Eric To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 11:53:14 PM Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette drives to DSDD 360K units. After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I thought. One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? Thanks - JEric -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Sat Jan 3 01:59:25 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 22:59:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <876040.49429.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Not quite correct. For Drive 0, it would require different signals sent. drive 1 would work properly though. The signals needed to select and turn on drive 0 would not involve D1 and Motor signals... IIRC it was D0 and D2 signals were needed. To get it to work und DECB would require patching, OS-9 would require it too, and any program that bypassed DECB to access the floppies would run into problems without being patched (making them unusable on a non IBM cabled FDD system). -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Fri, 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > From: John Eric > Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 11:53 PM > Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, > I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy > cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, > right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy > + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at > the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) > and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of > cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type > connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if > I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will > access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the > cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third > connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, > before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors > (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with > a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? > > Thanks - JEric > From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 02:03:46 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 23:03:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <876040.49429.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <349624.56761.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> okay, thanks. I was thinking that the twist in the ibm cable meant that both drives had to be set as drive 1 and the twist in the cable allowed them to be accessed as 0 (a) and 1 (b). I guess I would be better served simply to make new cables from scratch. Thanks -Jeric ________________________________ From: Bill Barnes To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 12:59:25 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Not quite correct. For Drive 0, it would require different signals sent. drive 1 would work properly though. The signals needed to select and turn on drive 0 would not involve D1 and Motor signals... IIRC it was D0 and D2 signals were needed. To get it to work und DECB would require patching, OS-9 would require it too, and any program that bypassed DECB to access the floppies would run into problems without being patched (making them unusable on a non IBM cabled FDD system). -Later! -WB- -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Fri, 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > From: John Eric > Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 11:53 PM > Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, > I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy > cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, > right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy > + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at > the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) > and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of > cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type > connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if > I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will > access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the > cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third > connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, > before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors > (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with > a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? > > Thanks - JEric > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Sat Jan 3 02:10:15 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 23:10:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Forgot to mention, as in the IBM case, you can only use two drives with the IBM cabling. The way the CoCo signals are, can only use three drives in DSDD mode. -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Sat, 1/3/09, John Eric wrote: > From: John Eric > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 12:06 AM > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was > meaning is if I jumper two drives as drive 1 and connect > them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b connectors, that > should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended > for a tape drive, that should work as coco drive 2. I'm > going to go ahead and order the idc crimp tool as I realize > it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 extender > cable, etc. > > jeric > > > ________________________________ > From: John Eric > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 11:53:14 PM > Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette > drives to DSDD 360K units. > After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate > jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the > terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I > thought. > > One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. > The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. > > Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, > apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - > Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I > had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, > drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right > in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In > fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. > > Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, > I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy > cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, > right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy > + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at > the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) > and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of > cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type > connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if > I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will > access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the > cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third > connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, > before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors > (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with > a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? > > Thanks - JEric > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 02:39:43 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 23:39:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Yes, I remembered reading that the CoCo used the side select signal as the drive3 (4th drive) select. The IBM cables I have (actually 3M) are the same as the old IBM cables with the exception of an added connector intended for a tape drive, but which is actually just another 5.25" type edge connector. Looking at these cables, I could probably snip the two end connectors (after the twist) off and use the one intended for a tape drive and the one intended for ibm drive b for the coco drives, then I would only need to replace the header connector with an edge connector to connect to the coco fdc. I do have a homemade fdc that I made from a TMS2793 and i allowed for either edgecard or header type connection to the controller when I built it. It was a pain getting it to work (getting the two variable resistors set properly - finally had to buy an oscilloscope, or maybe that was just an excuse because I wanted a scope :) I really didn't design it - I based it on a schematic of a Dragon controller I found last year - only 10 I.C.'s counting the eprom and smaller than the fd-502. I had to get a friend to layout and make the pcb - I'm no good at that - he has since moved away, thus I am trying to learn EAGLE. If I can just find what i did with the schematic, I could upload it. The original schematic used a 2797 but I was able to get it to work with a 2793. Jeric ________________________________ From: Bill Barnes To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 1:10:15 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Forgot to mention, as in the IBM case, you can only use two drives with the IBM cabling. The way the CoCo signals are, can only use three drives in DSDD mode. -Later! -WB- -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Sat, 1/3/09, John Eric wrote: > From: John Eric > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 12:06 AM > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was > meaning is if I jumper two drives as drive 1 and connect > them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b connectors, that > should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended > for a tape drive, that should work as coco drive 2. I'm > going to go ahead and order the idc crimp tool as I realize > it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 extender > cable, etc. > > jeric > > > ________________________________ > From: John Eric > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 11:53:14 PM > Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette > drives to DSDD 360K units. > After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate > jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the > terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I > thought. > > One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. > The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. > > Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, > apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - > Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I > had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, > drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right > in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In > fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. > > Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, > I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy > cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, > right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy > + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at > the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) > and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of > cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type > connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if > I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will > access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the > cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third > connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, > before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors > (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with > a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? > > Thanks - JEric > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mechacoco at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 04:34:44 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 02:34:44 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901030134g61339b8am4cf09626882f7ca6@mail.gmail.com> On 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was meaning is if I jumper two > drives as drive 1 and connect them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b > connectors, that should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended for a tape drive, > that should work as coco drive 2. I'm going to go ahead and order the idc > crimp tool as I realize it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 > extender cable, etc. > > jeric -- A standard PC floppy cable twists wires 10 through 16. To use two drives that are both jumpered as Drive 1 with a CoCo, you need a cable that only twists wires 10 through 12. Darren From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 04:39:07 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 01:39:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <5d802cd0901030134g61339b8am4cf09626882f7ca6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <411390.864.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Okay. Thanks. I've already decided just to make some cables from scratch - it'll cost maybe $4 not counting the crimp tool, but no headaches that way :)jeric ________________________________ From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 3:34:44 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives On 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was meaning is if I jumper two > drives as drive 1 and connect them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b > connectors, that should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended for a tape drive, > that should work as coco drive 2. I'm going to go ahead and order the idc > crimp tool as I realize it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 > extender cable, etc. > > jeric -- A standard PC floppy cable twists wires 10 through 16. To use two drives that are both jumpered as Drive 1 with a CoCo, you need a cable that only twists wires 10 through 12. Darren -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 04:44:33 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 01:44:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <215044.21617.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <906778.96229.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <5d802cd0901030134g61339b8am4cf09626882f7ca6@mail.gmail.com> <411390.864.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <972704.42723.qm@web111212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I should have searched first, here's a write up on the thing: http://www.pcguide.com/ref/fdd/confCable-c.html (firefox prevents a pop-up, so be warned.. i despise popups.) Explains why they did it that way - they were lazy :) jeric ________________________________ From: John Eric To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 3:39:07 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Okay. Thanks. I've already decided just to make some cables from scratch - it'll cost maybe $4 not counting the crimp tool, but no headaches that way :)jeric ________________________________ From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 3:34:44 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives On 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was meaning is if I jumper two > drives as drive 1 and connect them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b > connectors, that should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended for a tape drive, > that should work as coco drive 2. I'm going to go ahead and order the idc > crimp tool as I realize it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 > extender cable, etc. > > jeric -- A standard PC floppy cable twists wires 10 through 16. To use two drives that are both jumpered as Drive 1 with a CoCo, you need a cable that only twists wires 10 through 12. Darren -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 09:42:07 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 09:42:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> Hi John, If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. Have a nice day. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com John Eric wrote: > Yes, I remembered reading that the CoCo used the side select signal as the drive3 (4th drive) select. The IBM cables I have (actually 3M) are the same as the old IBM cables with the exception of an added connector intended for a tape drive, but which is actually just another 5.25" type edge connector. Looking at these cables, I could probably snip the two end connectors (after the twist) off and use the one intended for a tape drive and the one intended for ibm drive b for the coco drives, then I would only need to replace the header connector with an edge connector to connect to the coco fdc. I do have a homemade fdc that I made from a TMS2793 and i allowed for either edgecard or header type connection to the controller when I built it. It was a pain getting it to work (getting the two variable resistors set properly - finally had to buy an oscilloscope, or maybe that was just an excuse because I wanted a scope :) I really didn't design it - I based it > on a schematic of a Dragon controller I found last year - only 10 I.C.'s counting the eprom and smaller than the fd-502. I had to get a friend to layout and make the pcb - I'm no good at that - he has since moved away, thus I am trying to learn EAGLE. If I can just find what i did with the schematic, I could upload it. The original schematic used a 2797 but I was able to get it to work with a 2793. Jeric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Bill Barnes > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 1:10:15 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > Forgot to mention, as in the IBM case, you can only use two drives with the IBM cabling. The way the CoCo signals are, can only use three drives in DSDD mode. > > -Later! -WB- -- BABIC Computer Consulting. > > > --- On Sat, 1/3/09, John Eric wrote: > > >> From: John Eric >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives >> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >> Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 12:06 AM >> I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was >> meaning is if I jumper two drives as drive 1 and connect >> them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b connectors, that >> should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd >> drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended >> for a tape drive, that should work as coco drive 2. I'm >> going to go ahead and order the idc crimp tool as I realize >> it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 extender >> cable, etc. >> >> jeric >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: John Eric >> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts >> >> Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 11:53:14 PM >> Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives >> >> I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette >> drives to DSDD 360K units. >> After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate >> jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the >> terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I >> thought. >> >> One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. >> The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. >> >> Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, >> apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - >> Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I >> had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, >> drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right >> in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In >> fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. >> >> Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, >> I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy >> cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, >> right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy >> + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at >> the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) >> and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of >> cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type >> connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if >> I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will >> access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the >> cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third >> connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, >> before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors >> (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with >> a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? >> >> Thanks - JEric >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 10:19:45 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 07:19:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> Message-ID: <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> i can't find my fdc schematic so i'm sitting here with an ohmeter re-reverse engineering the thing. may have it done in a few days and i'll send it to you. -JE ________________________________ From: N8WQ To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:42:07 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Hi John, If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. Have a nice day. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com John Eric wrote: > Yes, I remembered reading that the CoCo used the side select signal as the drive3 (4th drive) select. The IBM cables I have (actually 3M) are the same as the old IBM cables with the exception of an added connector intended for a tape drive, but which is actually just another 5.25" type edge connector. Looking at these cables, I could probably snip the two end connectors (after the twist) off and use the one intended for a tape drive and the one intended for ibm drive b for the coco drives, then I would only need to replace the header connector with an edge connector to connect to the coco fdc. I do have a homemade fdc that I made from a TMS2793 and i allowed for either edgecard or header type connection to the controller when I built it. It was a pain getting it to work (getting the two variable resistors set properly - finally had to buy an oscilloscope, or maybe that was just an excuse because I wanted a scope :) I really didn't design it - I based it > on a schematic of a Dragon controller I found last year - only 10 I.C.'s counting the eprom and smaller than the fd-502. I had to get a friend to layout and make the pcb - I'm no good at that - he has since moved away, thus I am trying to learn EAGLE. If I can just find what i did with the schematic, I could upload it. The original schematic used a 2797 but I was able to get it to work with a 2793. Jeric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Bill Barnes > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 1:10:15 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > Forgot to mention, as in the IBM case, you can only use two drives with the IBM cabling. The way the CoCo signals are, can only use three drives in DSDD mode. > > -Later! -WB- -- BABIC Computer Consulting. > > > --- On Sat, 1/3/09, John Eric wrote: > > >> From: John Eric >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives >> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >> Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 12:06 AM >> I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was >> meaning is if I jumper two drives as drive 1 and connect >> them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b connectors, that >> should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd >> drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended >> for a tape drive, that should work as coco drive 2. I'm >> going to go ahead and order the idc crimp tool as I realize >> it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 extender >> cable, etc. >> >> jeric >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: John Eric >> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts >> >> Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 11:53:14 PM >> Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives >> >> I decided to upgrade two of my CoCo's floppy diskette >> drives to DSDD 360K units. >> After installing drives 0 and one, setting the appropriate >> jumpers and making sure only the second drive had the >> terminator resistor pack, I was ready to go... or so I >> thought. >> >> One of the units, both drives worked fine, as DSDD. >> The other unit, one of the drives couldn't read squat. >> >> Although both appeared to be Tandy's cabling, >> apparently one of the cables differed. A quick look - >> Tandy's nonsense of pulling pins to select the drive. I >> had forgotten about that. Looking at the original drives, >> drive 0 had both the 0 and 1 select jumpers soldered right >> in, and the second drive had only the drive 1 jumper. In >> fact, all of my Tandy drives were like this. >> >> Simple solution, crimp new connectors on a cable. However, >> I just had a thought. If I were to use IBM type floppy >> cables and jumper both drives as drive 1, that should work, >> right? I ask because I have a box full of 3M IBM type floppy >> + Tape drive cables - they have the standard 4 connectors at >> the end - 3.5" and 5,25" for Drive A (IBMspeak) >> and the same for drive B, separated by about 6" of >> cable, and then about 6" later, another 5.25" type >> connector intended for a tape drive. So, my thinking is, if >> I jumper two drives as drive 1, the end connectors will >> access them as drive 0 and 1 (because of the twist in the >> cable), and if I jumper a third drive as drive 2, the third >> connector should acces it as the third CoCo drive. So, >> before I order the IDC cable crimper and some connectors >> (the end that hooks to the FDC will have to be replaced with >> a CoCo type connector) - does this sound right? >> >> Thanks - JEric >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 3 10:20:39 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 10:20:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901031020.39548.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 03 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >Hi John, >If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be >interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. >Have a nice day. > >Alan Jones The eagle to pcb interface, using a milling machine rather than chemistry seems to be made do-able by a .zip file I just picked up from a link I followed off of http://millpcbs.com. But I was probably 8 or 9 tabs to the right of that site when I found the file 'pcb-gcode-3.5.2.3.zip'. This seems to be a beta, and is under quite active development. Now all I need is a spindle capable of that sort of work, I need about 20x the rpm's mine has. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I am NOT a nut.... From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 11:15:32 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 11:15:32 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <495F8F24.9050408@gmail.com> John, Thanks and I look forward to receiving it. Best of success with your re-reverse engineering! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com John Eric wrote: > i can't find my fdc schematic so i'm sitting here with an ohmeter re-reverse engineering the thing. may have it done in a few days and i'll send it to you. -JE > > > > > ________________________________ > From: N8WQ > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:42:07 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > Hi John, > If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be > interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. > Have a nice day. > > Alan Jones > > From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 11:36:17 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 08:36:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F8F24.9050408@gmail.com> Message-ID: <782010.92733.qm@web111205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> shouldn't be too hard found the original schematic i based it on, just got 2 re-implement the changes i made for the 2793 ________________________________ From: N8WQ To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 10:15:32 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives John, Thanks and I look forward to receiving it. Best of success with your re-reverse engineering! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com John Eric wrote: > i can't find my fdc schematic so i'm sitting here with an ohmeter re-reverse engineering the thing. may have it done in a few days and i'll send it to you. -JE > > > > > ________________________________ > From: N8WQ > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:42:07 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > Hi John, > If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be > interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. > Have a nice day. > > Alan Jones > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 11:38:10 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 11:38:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <200901031020.39548.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> <200901031020.39548.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <495F9472.1050607@gmail.com> Hi Gene, I was looking at your milling setup a couple of weeks ago on your web site. I like how you put the CoCo to work! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Gene Heskett wrote: > On Saturday 03 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: > >> Hi John, >> If you ever get Eagle figured out please let me know! BTW, I would be >> interested in any circuits you have for the CoCo or CoCo related projects. >> Have a nice day. >> >> Alan Jones >> > > The eagle to pcb interface, using a milling machine rather than chemistry > seems to be made do-able by a .zip file I just picked up from a link I > followed off of http://millpcbs.com. But I was probably 8 or 9 tabs to the > right of that site when I found the file 'pcb-gcode-3.5.2.3.zip'. This seems > to be a beta, and is under quite active development. Now all I need is a > spindle capable of that sort of work, I need about 20x the rpm's mine has. > > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 3 11:52:37 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 11:52:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <495F9472.1050607@gmail.com> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901031020.39548.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <495F9472.1050607@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901031152.37539.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 03 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >Hi Gene, >I was looking at your milling setup a couple of weeks ago on your web site. >I like how you put the CoCo to work! > >Alan Jones You must have been looking at George's site. Mine is at I run my little mill with a linux box (dumpster dive special, with used cpu & memory) running emc-2.2.8. The complete kit of that software is available in the ubuntu repo's. It was once a Harbor Freight micro-mill but has been heavily reworked by me. Its most recent duty last week was making a new air output manifold for my small air compressor from a 1x2x4" block of alu, the pot metal original had cracked and the leak couldn't be stopped. Works great. I can leave a framing nailer plugged in overnight and it might run once in the night now. Was every 2 minutes. Bad leak. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I tried the clone syscall on me, but it didn't work. -- Mike Neuffer trying to fix a serious time problem From theother_bob at yahoo.com Sat Jan 3 12:09:23 2009 From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (theother_bob) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 09:09:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives Message-ID: <380156.55836.qm@web81508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Well I've slept since then and killed many thousands of brain cells, but I could swear I've used the post-twist end of a PC cable to succesfully connect a drive to a CoCo3. It was just a test and ultimately since I just needed the two connectors on the untwisted part I just cut off the twisted end with a good sharp razor blade and then replaced the IDC at the controller end. Of coure I then found the two drive connectors were too close together?so I had to reposition one, which might make you think that making a new cable from scratch would have been a better choice; to which my reply would be "What's the point of all this packratting if I'm not going to use what I've been hoarding?" ;) Also I found that a good sized?channel lock wrench?works great to crimp IDCs, just protect the plastic?with some popsicle sticks or something. Unless you're planning to do a *lot* of cables. Then the proper tool is the way to go, but I couldn't justify the expense for a once-every-few-years use. Cheers, Bob ----- Original Message ---- From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 3:34:44 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives On 1/2/09, John Eric wrote: > I wasn't too clear at the end of this. What I was meaning is if I jumper two > drives as drive 1 and connect them to the IBM cables drive a and drive b > connectors, that should give me drive 0 and 1 on coco and if I jumper a 3rd > drive as drive 2 and connect it to the connector intended for a tape drive, > that should work as coco drive 2. I'm going to go ahead and order the idc > crimp tool as I realize it will have many uses, such as making a CM-8 > extender cable, etc. > > jeric -- A standard PC floppy cable twists wires 10 through 16.? To use two drives that are both jumpered as Drive 1 with a CoCo, you need a cable that only twists wires 10 through 12. Darren -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 12:15:29 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 12:15:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <200901031152.37539.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901031020.39548.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <495F9472.1050607@gmail.com> <200901031152.37539.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <495F9D31.1090006@gmail.com> Gene, Sorry I mixed you guys up and congrats on your dumpster dive. That is a nice web site you have. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Gene Heskett wrote: > On Saturday 03 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: > >> Hi Gene, >> I was looking at your milling setup a couple of weeks ago on your web site. >> I like how you put the CoCo to work! >> >> Alan Jones >> > > You must have been looking at George's site. Mine is at > > I run my little mill with a linux box (dumpster dive special, with used cpu & > memory) running emc-2.2.8. The complete kit of that software is available in > the ubuntu repo's. It was once a Harbor Freight micro-mill but has been > heavily reworked by me. Its most recent duty last week was making a new air > output manifold for my small air compressor from a 1x2x4" block of alu, the > pot metal original had cracked and the leak couldn't be stopped. Works > great. I can leave a framing nailer plugged in overnight and it might run > once in the night now. Was every 2 minutes. Bad leak. > > From petrander at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 15:35:13 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 21:35:13 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts In-Reply-To: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> Message-ID: Hi guys, Great discussion! Here is my 25 cents regarding marketing... How about the CoCo as a cheap but powerful computer for poorer countries, like Nicholas Negropontes "100-dollar computer" (now: *One Laptop Per Child*)? Heck we could maybe even offer an even cheaper computer that would be powerful enough for the basics and be a powerful tool for education and extending the global village! More info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Laptop_per_Child There are other similar projects around. Check out the external links at the bottom... Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/2 Frank Swygert > I have to agree with Paul and Carlos. They are pretty much on the same > track -- a nice learning/experimenters computer, cheap enough to be used not > only to develop something, but to power it as well. > Cost wise, the "CoCo4.exe" will probably be the most effective. PC > hardware, especially a couple generations old, is cheap and plentiful, and > already has everything built in. Heck, it would be nice to kick DOS, > Windows, or Linux completely out of the picture -- the "CoCo4" would in > effect be as much an OS as anything else. That would be ideal for DECB > anyway, but might hinder running Nitros-9. Of course porting Nitros to the > x-86 architecture has always been a possibility for that arena. > > The cost factor is why Tandy went to the GIME. And that's our biggest > hurdle now. Tandy skimped on it - made it "just enough" as far as speed and > power, to save money. Can't blame them in a way -- the CoCo was supposed to > be a cheap computer and the price of mainstream PCs were spiraling downward, > cutting deeply into profit margins. I suppose we really should be grateful > that there even was a CoCo3. > Any video producing machine will have to have a reverse engineered GIME to > be compatible. That has been a major hurdle. With the cost of FPGAs coming > down, and I think someone has actually done the ground work, that's not so > far fetched. Basing the machine on an existing evaluation board will be > expensive though. The price needs to be kept under $300, though I'd really > like to see one closer to the vicinity of $200, but I just don't think it's > possible. Carlos, I'd love it if you proved me wrong! > > So what would a new machine have to have as a MINIMUM -- not wants, but > needs. That should be the starting point, then add the wants if/as possible. > > 1. Minimum of CoCo3 software compatibility. I don't think not supporting > the older, seldom used graphics modes of the CC1/2 will be a big loss, > especially if losing them will save $$$ in the price tag. > 2. Capable of using modern peripherals. This looks to be a harder part, but > I think it's easier than it sounds. There are USB floppy drives (though only > 3.5"), and there are drive emulator boards for USB devices. That might be > the easiest way to go. Instead of a hard drive a USB device would be good, > or an SD card device. There are affordable 8GB USB thumb drives! Just > supporting USB drive emulation might be easier and cheaper than supporting > both, and USB is pretty universal. May need a special transfer program to > transfer files to/from a PC if any special setup of the device is needed for > the CoCo (program for the PC to read/write to the CoCo formatted USB drive). > > 3. Printers are a different story. There are few "smart" printers around > anymore. The only one I know of are a few dot matrix printers still made for > multi part forms still used by businesses. Epson still sells a 9 pin > 300LX+II with serial, parallel, and USB ports, available for around $200. > Would be nice to have ink jet support, but that would require some overhead. > Someone wrote about an adapter that would translate ESC/2 codes into > something a standard "dumb" inkjet (or dare I say laser?) printer could > print, but I'm thinking a micro controller programmed with a printer driver > would be the best solution. Of course then it would have to support a > limited number of printers -- maybe the HP family? I'm assuming the drivers > are all similar though. Probably not -- so any adapter or other solution > would be limited to a few specific models. Still, it would probably be best > to just leave the serial port (a real hardware port AND a bit-banger port > would be nice!) and make a MC conv > erter. A PC can always be used as a printer processor, I guess. I doubt > many would be trying to use a new CoCo-like machine for word processing, > though a printer for code listings would be nice. If it's as simple as > storing the listing on a USB drive and sticking it in a PC (and possibly > running a transfer program) to transfer and print, I could live with that. > Or buy a $200 (or used) dot-matrix printer. > 4. Video. Must be CC3 compatible, and I'd really like to see video on > board. If on board it must be compatible with off the shelf monitors. If the > new machine's main purpose is for experimenters/learning basics, however, it > could rely just on a TV for a monitor. I don't like the idea of having to > rely on a PC, but in reality it could be a hardware board that could work > alone, but require a PC for video and programming input. Most would really > like to see higher resolution -- at least 640x480. 640x192 is the highest > the CC3 will produce. More than 640x480 would probably take costs way up due > to memory and hardware requirements. > 5. There are experimenter computers out there now, so the further we go in > that direction instead of a stand-alone programmable > learning/experimenting/game machine similar to the original CoCo, the less > applicable it becomes. I mean it would just be of fleeting interest to CoCo > people if it's only partially CoCo3 compatible and requires a PC to work. > The only advantage such a machine would have is that the board could be > programmed then disconnected from the PC to "do its thing". So do PIC > controllers, BASIC Stamps, and several others though. If you're building a > retro computer do it all the way! > 6. Then there's this little beastie: http://www.multilabs.net/Retro.html. > It's very similar to a CoCo1. It has 64K (32K for ROM and graphics, but the > graphics memory isn't accessible, and 32K program memory), low res graphics > (CoCo1 had some better modes), etc. If nothing else, the interfacing devices > offered by this company may help. Their ezVGA module will only produce > 320x240 graphics though. They have PS/2 to serial keyboard and mouse > adapters, and even a serial VGA adapter. This might be all most > experimenters need, and the Retro is only $99. I'm thinking that a > CoCo3-like computer similar to this is what people would really like to see. > > > ----------------- > Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:42:24 -0500 > From: "Paul E. Jones" > > My son has a Lego Mindstorm NXT robot. While I am quite interested in it > -- > pretty cool with the Bluetooth interface and programmable microcontroller > -- > he is far less interested. The reason is that if he creates something, he > can't share his creations. He gets more enjoyment out of scripting on > video > games sites and updating his own web site. > > Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 21:07:06 -0600 > From: Carlos Santiago > > My view of the Coco family of computers has always been as a hobbyist. > Anyone that is interested in a Coco as their primary machine, will demand > many new features and applications that already exist in a PC or Mac. These > users will have a hard time because they will try to mould the Coco into > something that it is not. > > As for a Coco4.exe Steve Bjork is already working on this along with a new > version of Basic. These will satisfy the need for something that runs on > the PC, but it will not allow you to develop any new Coco specific > hardware. > > The Coco has alway been a computer for those interested in writing > programs and adding new and interesting hardware features. A hobbyist > computer. > > My interest is to rekindle that spirit. > > A new Coco4 will allow those who had great ideas about Coco software and > hardware to implement them. > I would like to start a list of people that are interested in the idea of > a Coco4 and also those of you that are capable of contributing. This would > be a project for the Coco community to provided those of you with the type > of machine you dream about. Some of the feedback I received was that it > would cost too much. Or that the design would be too complex. I have been a > hardware engineer since 1979 and have spent much time developing products > that are low cost and feature rich. > > > On thing that is clear is that the Coco4 may materialize in the near > future as software or hardware. If you would like a specific feature or > capability, the only way to obtain it is by being involved. I mean in the > real sense, not just to request a crazy feature to see if it can be done. > The start of all this will be a development document that will define the > boundaries of the project. Once this is complete and agreed upon, the > design work can start. > > > -- > Frank Swygert > Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) > For all AMC enthusiasts > http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html > (free download available!) > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 18:18:20 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 18:18:20 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCo f83 -- Questions on .bin file format and disk layout for non SSSD disks. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <495FF23C.9010001@gmail.com> Hi Brett, How is your F83 project coming? I got up early this week and was reading up on the history of Forth. Charles Moore was an ingenious programmer. A couple of years ago I was interested in writing my own version of Forth for the CoCo but got sidetracked. If there is something I can do to help please let me know. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Brett Heath wrote: > Hello all, > > Before begging for help here's an update on the status of f83 for the CoCo. > > In the process of researching CRC implementations it became clear that the > CRC was designed to detect relatively small differences between almost identical > data blocks and is therefore probably not reliable as a fingerprint to > distinguish > blocks that are completely different. In other words, FAT's are short enough and > probably similar enought that a CRC could probably be used to distinguish them > but the potential variability in the corresponding (and somewhat longer) > directory tracks is so large as to make CRC's unreliable at best and in general > worse than useless as an identification hash. > > So after translating the forth CRC code to 6809 assembler I set it aside and > took a break from slogging through the DOS emulation and spent some time working > on fun stuff. > > Fun stuff in this case includes: > Converting the kernel source from the Chromium assembler > to the Flex assembler. > Adapting WORDS and the VOCABULARY management to work with the > position independent dictionary. > Getting the Flex assembler to load (this was almost trivial). > Modifying the Multitasker for the CoCo (the DOS-CP/M version relies on > software restarts) > Rewriting the Debugger low-level (this was non-trivial). > > The Multitasker is untested but everything else is working, coolest > of all are the > debugger and the assembler. > > Which brings me back to the DOS stuff. > > The nice thing about using an assembler and metacompiler written in > forth for forth > is that I can generate any ouput format I care to implement. > > The not so nice thing is that it doesn't automatically know what output format > is appropriate for an executable .bin file that will load from Disk Basic. > > By examining the first few bytes in other .bin files and playing around with > the options on VCC2's import utilities I've come up with; > > 00 > > for the first five bytes, but this didn't seem to work and it's apparent > from the conversation in the Assembler thread that it's more complicated > than that. > > The Assembler thread gave me some more hints, but there are still some > murky spots. > > 1. Can a large (~16k) executable be put in a single segment .bin file? > 2. If not what are the size restrictions and format requirements for > each segment? > 3. If so, what's the format of the postamble (and preamble for that matter)? > 4. Is there someplace where this is documented so I don't have to > pester people > with questions? > 5. What is the largest executable that can be loaded and run from Basic? > (64k CoCo 2) > I would actually prefer to finish development without relying on the > disk system beyond > using it to test my file interface, but until I can get a serial > interface working on an > emulator I'm stuck with it. > > There are drivers available for either the bit-banger or an ACIA that > would be easy to > incorporate into f83 as a replacement for disk I/O but the bit-banger > in both VCC2 and > xmess are apparently only usable as printers. Is there ACIA emulation in xmess? > Can it be attached to a virtual or physical serial port? > > Yeah, I've asked this before but serial I/O from an emulator would > _really_ help a lot. > > > As to the other questions mentioned in the subject line. Playing > around with the fun > stuff had the side benefit of testing the file-read implementation. It > seems reliable but > the performance could be better, probably due to the rather mindless > logical record > to physical sector conversion calculation. In any case, before > rewriting that and > cleaning up the open-file management it would be nice to know something about > the layout of disk sizes other than the 35 track 18 sector/track default so f83 > can deal with them too. > > Specifically, where are the additional FAT and directory entries > stored on the 40 and > 80 track disks. What other disk sizes/formats are common in the CoCo world and > where might I find documantation on their layout? > > For my own purposes I'm targeting a CoCo tethered to another system > through a serial > port, but as long as I'm porting the thing I'd like to make it useful > for as many Coconuts > as possible, so the more disk formats it knows how to handle the better. > > > My Internet connection is a bit on the flakey side right now so if I > don't acknowledge > replies right away please bear with me (this is it's first day back up > since December 2). > > Brett K. Heath > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From mdelyea at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 18:20:19 2009 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:20:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] hardware Message-ID: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> I have pretty minimal hardware skills, but I did manage to piece together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an Atari monitor (surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and designing the circuit). I would like to see some projects with minimal soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering), and maybe using a 74ls series chip to do something like drive an LED display through the bit-banger or or using the joystick ports for feedback. Forget about the coco4 and FPGA and hard drives and such and remember where we came from. Think of something simple that we can all do. From Torsten at Dittel.info Sat Jan 3 18:59:52 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2009 00:59:52 +0100 Subject: [Coco] nice find? Message-ID: http://www.ambery.com/rgbcgatovgac.html I should order one to do some testing with a PAL CoCo3 with both 50Hz & 60Hz... From carlos.bragatto at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 19:02:00 2009 From: carlos.bragatto at gmail.com (Carlos Bragatto) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 22:02:00 -0200 Subject: [Coco] nice find? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <16bae8870901031602ga2229e7ic4f0f712d9832052@mail.gmail.com> Oh please do, I cannot stand buying small, old, beaten 13 inch CBM 1084S monitors for the price of a new 22" LCD. Carlos/Brasil On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 9:59 PM, Torsten Dittel wrote: > http://www.ambery.com/rgbcgatovgac.html > > I should order one to do some testing with a PAL CoCo3 with both 50Hz & > 60Hz... > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk Sat Jan 3 20:00:08 2009 From: jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk (James McKay) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 01:00:08 -0000 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090103005230.51E3720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: "Roger Taylor" wrote in message news:20090103005230.51E3720A13 at qs281.pair.com... > At 06:30 PM 1/2/2009, you wrote: >>Should see whether you can load a new game directly from a rather far away >>location on the internet. :) > > The disk mounted in less than a second, but it's garbled, probably due to > the fact that CoCoNet currently only reads the direct-sector based formats > with no header info, truncated portions, etc. I need to work on that this > weekend. > > A common 35-track direct virtual disk would be 161280 bytes in size > (157.5K). Hmm... that's what size it is. According to the MESS imgtools, it's a coco_jvc_rsdos type disk. Is there a specific type which would work? bye, James McKay. From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 3 20:46:43 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:46:43 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. In-Reply-To: References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090103005230.51E3720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090104014817.8F70920A15@qs281.pair.com> At 07:00 PM 1/3/2009, you wrote: >"Roger Taylor" wrote in >message news:20090103005230.51E3720A13 at qs281.pair.com... > > At 06:30 PM 1/2/2009, you wrote: > >>Should see whether you can load a new game directly from a rather far away > >>location on the internet. :) > > > > The disk mounted in less than a second, but it's garbled, probably due to > > the fact that CoCoNet currently only reads the direct-sector based formats > > with no header info, truncated portions, etc. I need to work on that this > > weekend. > > > > A common 35-track direct virtual disk would be 161280 bytes in size > > (157.5K). > >Hmm... that's what size it is. According to the MESS imgtools, it's a >coco_jvc_rsdos type disk. Is there a specific type which would work? > >bye, >James McKay. Ok, it mounted this time and plays. I think I made a typo in the last URL I typed from the CoCo 3. I'm in 2mhz/115200 bps mode so the game runs pretty fast which is nice. It kinda has that Intellivision game feel to it. Maybe I played the original back when I was a teen and I'm having a flashback. I see that the color palette changes on every other level. Is this CoCo 3 only? I also see a tank in level 3. What source code did you convert to 6809 assembler? I'm sure there's quite a few coders out there that would love to hear about this project more. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 3 21:25:07 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 20:25:07 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo from CoCoNet In-Reply-To: References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090103005230.51E3720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090104022556.95E3A20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 07:00 PM 1/3/2009, you wrote: >"Roger Taylor" wrote in >message news:20090103005230.51E3720A13 at qs281.pair.com... > > At 06:30 PM 1/2/2009, you wrote: > >>Should see whether you can load a new game directly from a rather far away > >>location on the internet. :) > > > > The disk mounted in less than a second, but it's garbled, probably due to > > the fact that CoCoNet currently only reads the direct-sector based formats > > with no header info, truncated portions, etc. I need to work on that this > > weekend. > > > > A common 35-track direct virtual disk would be 161280 bytes in size > > (157.5K). > >Hmm... that's what size it is. According to the MESS imgtools, it's a >coco_jvc_rsdos type disk. Is there a specific type which would work? P.S. to those scratching your head about how I used the virtual disk that James posted online: From the CoCo, I typed: DRIVE 0,"http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/dchs.dsk" then: DIR I immediately see: DEATHCHS BIN 2 B 6 LOADM "DEATHCHS" EXEC Game running! What if James deletes the online .dsk or the .bin file on the disk while I've got it mounted? No problem - CoCoNet takes a snapshot of web disks and we're just using the downloaded copy until we remount the same URL. Perhaps a DRIVE refresh command is in order which would grab a new copy of the web disk. PC virtual disks don't have this problem. CoCoNet reads/writes each sector to the actual .dsk file. In fact, you can modify the file on the PC while the CoCo is reading or writing to it. You can also think of a virtual disk on the PC, mounted by the CoCo, as a live 153K open memory block between the CoCo and PC. How? Thanks to the DSKI$ and DSKO$ commands in Disk BASIC, you can store anything to any part of the "disk" and use your PC to do the same, simultaneously. When the CoCo wants to access a block/sector or group of them, DSKI$/DSKO$ and the serial code will do the work. In fact, let's say you have a master program disk in DRIVE 0, and three work disks in DRIVES 1-3, all virtual disks so things run fast. That's 459K of stay-put memory for the CoCo. Again, it's all in how you want to look at things. As long as the server is up, the CoCo will power up to the same disks automatically. CoCoNet 1.0 is going through more testing and will get a few more nips and tucks before it's ready to release in any form. The last test I ran went for over 2 days at 57600 bps grabbing and printing the HTML source code from google's front page. The loop ran continuously without errors. I'll run the same test at 115200 bps for about a day. CoCoNet will most likely come with some online sample programs like a multiplayer CoCo game (or two) and possibly a live chat program. Some of these demos will require a helping PHP script (game/network server script) to run on coco3.com (or mirrors) to pass information between unique CoCos. CoCoNet CoCo's will be able to request a unique random address from an online server and call the script URL to communicate with other CoCo's privately. Again, functions like this will be built into Disk BASIC. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From bookworm at cavenet.com Sat Jan 3 21:37:48 2009 From: bookworm at cavenet.com (BookWorm) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 02:37:48 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] hardware References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > I have pretty minimal hardware skills, You should see mine... > but I did manage to piece > together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an > Atari monitor Are you refering to an EGA monitor? >(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so > I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and > designing the circuit). That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They don't require converting. > soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) That's what I do with a slodering iron too. > Forget about the coco4 I'm trying. > and FPGA Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. >and hard drives You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. From bookworm at cavenet.com Sat Jan 3 21:53:10 2009 From: bookworm at cavenet.com (BookWorm) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 02:53:10 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> <495E9157.3620.9FCB49@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: > 480Kbytes. Inside the FPGA this is easy to do. Are you putting the RAM *inside* the new GIME? That woud be perfect. Would the CoCo 4 you're talking about use a 68000 or some imaginary new chip? If it's a 68k, why not memory map it in the CoCo 3, and put it on a big fat hairy new RAM board? It could share 2 meg with the 6809, use your amazing new chip, or the original, and run OSk in a NitrOS-9 window. This way we could still have our real CoCo 3, and all that "advanced" stuff the 6809 is supposedly "too slow" for. From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 21:54:22 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:54:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] hardware References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> His atari model may have needed differing sync levels? or composite sync? or something? Jeric ________________________________ From: BookWorm To: coco at maltedmedia.com Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:37:48 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware > I have pretty minimal hardware skills, You should see mine... > but I did manage to piece > together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an > Atari monitor Are you refering to an EGA monitor? >(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so > I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and > designing the circuit). That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They don't require converting. > soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) That's what I do with a slodering iron too. > Forget about the coco4 I'm trying. > and FPGA Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. >and hard drives You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mdelyea at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 22:08:28 2009 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 22:08:28 -0500 Subject: [Coco] hardware In-Reply-To: <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80901031908s71ef0by21e5d8770a69ba0@mail.gmail.com> The particular Atari monitor I was using was a 1080. There is no specific info on the internet for the 1080. All references I found were for the 1084, which is supposed to be the same as the 1080, unless you got the other model with the 26 pin connector. My travails trying to get that monitor working, and my ultimate success can be found here. http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=1718&highlight=#1718 On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 9:54 PM, John Eric wrote: > His atari model may have needed differing sync levels? or composite sync? or something? Jeric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: BookWorm > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:37:48 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware > >> I have pretty minimal hardware skills, > > You should see mine... > >> but I did manage to piece >> together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an >> Atari monitor > > Are you refering to an EGA monitor? > >>(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so >> I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and >> designing the circuit). > > That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They > don't require converting. > >> soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) > > That's what I do with a slodering iron too. > >> Forget about the coco4 > > I'm trying. > >> and FPGA > > Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. > >>and hard drives > > You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 3 22:37:15 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 19:37:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] hardware References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1b52e6c80901031908s71ef0by21e5d8770a69ba0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <935442.89184.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> it's also a good idea to disable the unused gates in the 74ls02 by connecting the unused inputs (not the outputs) to either vcc or gnd. with a 74ls02, i use vcc. ________________________________ From: mike delyea To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 9:08:28 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware The particular Atari monitor I was using was a 1080. There is no specific info on the internet for the 1080. All references I found were for the 1084, which is supposed to be the same as the 1080, unless you got the other model with the 26 pin connector. My travails trying to get that monitor working, and my ultimate success can be found here. http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=1718&highlight=#1718 On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 9:54 PM, John Eric wrote: > His atari model may have needed differing sync levels? or composite sync? or something? Jeric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: BookWorm > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:37:48 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware > >> I have pretty minimal hardware skills, > > You should see mine... > >> but I did manage to piece >> together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an >> Atari monitor > > Are you refering to an EGA monitor? > >>(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so >> I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and >> designing the circuit). > > That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They > don't require converting. > >> soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) > > That's what I do with a slodering iron too. > >> Forget about the coco4 > > I'm trying. > >> and FPGA > > Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. > >>and hard drives > > You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mdelyea at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 23:00:31 2009 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 23:00:31 -0500 Subject: [Coco] hardware In-Reply-To: <935442.89184.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1b52e6c80901031908s71ef0by21e5d8770a69ba0@mail.gmail.com> <935442.89184.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80901032000m358aa62eqf649ba4eb387eef2@mail.gmail.com> Why is that a good idea? My circuit still works despite my lack of knowledge. Is this a "best practice" type of thing or a "look out, its going to blow" type of thing? Should I be worried? I know nothing about electronics, never took it in school and I don't know any theory. Whatever - I - who knows nothing - was still able to build a simple circuit. And basically, I enjoyed myself putting it together. I'd like more of those simple projects. If anybody is interested I could post pics on my web site. On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 10:37 PM, John Eric wrote: > it's also a good idea to disable the unused gates in the 74ls02 by connecting the unused inputs (not the outputs) to either vcc or gnd. with a 74ls02, i use vcc. > > > > > ________________________________ > From: mike delyea > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 9:08:28 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware > > The particular Atari monitor I was using was a 1080. There is no > specific info on the internet for the 1080. All references I found > were for the 1084, which is supposed to be the same as the 1080, > unless you got the other model with the 26 pin connector. My travails > trying to get that monitor working, and my ultimate success can be > found here. > > http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=1718&highlight=#1718 > > On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 9:54 PM, John Eric wrote: >> His atari model may have needed differing sync levels? or composite sync? or something? Jeric >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: BookWorm >> To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:37:48 PM >> Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware >> >>> I have pretty minimal hardware skills, >> >> You should see mine... >> >>> but I did manage to piece >>> together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an >>> Atari monitor >> >> Are you refering to an EGA monitor? >> >>>(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so >>> I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and >>> designing the circuit). >> >> That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They >> don't require converting. >> >>> soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) >> >> That's what I do with a slodering iron too. >> >>> Forget about the coco4 >> >> I'm trying. >> >>> and FPGA >> >> Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. >> >>>and hard drives >> >> You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jcewy at swbell.net Sat Jan 3 23:07:46 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2009 22:07:46 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts In-Reply-To: References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net> <495E9157.3620.9FCB49@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <49603612.5000907@swbell.net> BookWorm wrote: >> 480Kbytes. Inside the FPGA this is easy to do. >> > > Are you putting the RAM *inside* the new GIME? That woud be perfect. > > Would the CoCo 4 you're talking about use a 68000 or some imaginary new chip? > If it's a 68k, why not memory map it in the CoCo 3, and put it on a big fat > hairy new RAM board? It could share 2 meg with the 6809, use your amazing new > chip, or the original, and run OSk in a NitrOS-9 window. This way we could > still have our real CoCo 3, and all that "advanced" stuff the 6809 is > supposedly "too slow" for. > > A 6809 core running at an effective clock rate of about 21MHz would probably give an 8MHz 68000 system (Atari, Amiga, original Macintosh come to mind) a run for its money. And if you had a 16-bit data path to memory the 68K wouldn't even get points for bus width. I've got a Digilent Spartan 3 1000K board on the way, so I'm going to try out Gary Becker's FPGA CoCo 3 soon. I'll put up a blog detailing my experiences. I really want to run some programs that take a lot of time on the CoCo and see what they feel like at approx 21 MHz. Particularly things like decoding GIF files, and Sockmaster's HiColor display. The latter might be a challenge because the timing will be completely off at the higher clock rate, and I'm not sure what the VGA timing will do to it as well. Oh, and then there's the fact that the CPU09 doesn't use the same instruction timing as a real 6809. But I could certainly see how long it takes to process the image, and with a little work, adapt Sock's program to the CPU09. More to come when I get my development board... JCE > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From georgeramsower at gmail.com Sat Jan 3 23:30:32 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 22:30:32 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com><491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002601c96e25$2eb72690$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Eric" >i can't find my fdc schematic so i'm sitting here with an ohmeter >re-reverse engineering the thing. may have it done in a few days and i'll >send it to you. -JE > If it's a Tandy controller, I may have it. Which one do you have? George From jet.pack at ymail.com Sun Jan 4 03:26:26 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 00:26:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives References: <735753.40559.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com><491692.62093.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><495F793F.2080802@gmail.com> <603165.8365.qm@web111209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <002601c96e25$2eb72690$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> Message-ID: <152342.71314.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> it's actually one i and a friend made last year. ________________________________ From: George Ramsower To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 10:30:32 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Eric" > i can't find my fdc schematic so i'm sitting here with an ohmeter re-reverse engineering the thing. may have it done in a few days and i'll send it to you. -JE > If it's a Tandy controller, I may have it. Which one do you have? George -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Sun Jan 4 11:03:08 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 11:03:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port Message-ID: All, Would anyone be interested in playing with a Linux build of the Microware C compiler? Starting with the source code that came into Boisy's possession, I massaged it to build and nominally run on my Ubuntu Hardy system. It works for trivial programs, but it would be nice to have someone torture it a bit. Please drop me private e-mail and I'll send you a tarball. It's in a very crude form at the moment and uses a Bash shell script as the compiler driver, so promise not to laugh! Steve -- From jet.pack at ymail.com Sun Jan 4 12:43:19 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 09:43:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] hardware References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1b52e6c80901031908s71ef0by21e5d8770a69ba0@mail.gmail.com> <935442.89184.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1b52e6c80901032000m358aa62eqf649ba4eb387eef2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <495419.92078.qm@web111215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> just good design practice - keeps the unused gates from randomly switching states and drawing excess current. probably not an issue with your sync generator. The video cable Marty Goodman used to make used the 74ls02 to generate the sync and was connected to the joystick port to get the 5v, in which case the unused gates would most assuredly diminish the joystick resolution if they were to draw too much current. jeric p.s. also good design practice to include a bypass or decoupling capacitor (.1uf) across vcc and gnd of the chip :) ________________________________ From: mike delyea To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 10:00:31 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware Why is that a good idea? My circuit still works despite my lack of knowledge. Is this a "best practice" type of thing or a "look out, its going to blow" type of thing? Should I be worried? I know nothing about electronics, never took it in school and I don't know any theory. Whatever - I - who knows nothing - was still able to build a simple circuit. And basically, I enjoyed myself putting it together. I'd like more of those simple projects. If anybody is interested I could post pics on my web site. On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 10:37 PM, John Eric wrote: > it's also a good idea to disable the unused gates in the 74ls02 by connecting the unused inputs (not the outputs) to either vcc or gnd. with a 74ls02, i use vcc. > > > > > ________________________________ > From: mike delyea > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 9:08:28 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware > > The particular Atari monitor I was using was a 1080. There is no > specific info on the internet for the 1080. All references I found > were for the 1084, which is supposed to be the same as the 1080, > unless you got the other model with the 26 pin connector. My travails > trying to get that monitor working, and my ultimate success can be > found here. > > http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=1718&highlight=#1718 > > On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 9:54 PM, John Eric wrote: >> His atari model may have needed differing sync levels? or composite sync? or something? Jeric >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: BookWorm >> To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> Sent: Saturday, January 3, 2009 8:37:48 PM >> Subject: Re: [Coco] hardware >> >>> I have pretty minimal hardware skills, >> >> You should see mine... >> >>> but I did manage to piece >>> together a circuit to invert the coco video signal so I could drive an >>> Atari monitor >> >> Are you refering to an EGA monitor? >> >>>(surprisingly no one else on the list could help me - so >>> I ended up doing it all myself- figuring out the correct chip and >>> designing the circuit). >> >> That's because Atari monitors are already compatible with the CoCo 3. They >> don't require converting. >> >>> soldering (heh, i almost wrote slobbering) >> >> That's what I do with a slodering iron too. >> >>> Forget about the coco4 >> >> I'm trying. >> >>> and FPGA >> >> Actualy, I like James's FPGA GIME upgrade. I hope I can order one soon. >> >>>and hard drives >> >> You don't have a hard drive? Cloud 9 sells SCSI and IDE controllers. >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From lamune at doki-doki.net Sat Jan 3 02:10:38 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 23:10:38 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Regarding disk drives In-Reply-To: <349624.56761.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <876040.49429.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <349624.56761.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D915@fenestra.lamunet.local> > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of John Eric > Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 11:04 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Regarding disk drives > > okay, thanks. I was thinking that the twist in the ibm cable meant that > both drives had to be set as drive 1 and the twist in the cable allowed > them to be accessed as 0 (a) and 1 (b). I guess I would be better > served simply to make new cables from scratch. Thanks -Jeric > Yes and no. The twist is wrong for a CoCo controller. IBM uses two distinct motor enable signals, which is why the twist covers so many conductors. If you twist the 3 conductors that are D0, D1, and the ground between them then setting the two drives to DS1 should work as expected. From jdaggett at gate.net Sun Jan 4 16:09:16 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2009 16:09:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts In-Reply-To: References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net>, Message-ID: <4960DF2C.30047.AC2F1@jdaggett.gate.net> On 4 Jan 2009 at 2:53, BookWorm wrote: > Are you putting the RAM *inside* the new GIME? That woud be perfect. > No. RAM is external. The FPGA in mind does not have enough internal ram for the video section. > Would the CoCo 4 you're talking about use a 68000 or some imaginary > new chip? If it's a 68k, why not memory map it in the CoCo 3, and put > it on a big fat hairy new RAM board? It could share 2 meg with the > 6809, use your amazing new chip, or the original, and run OSk in a > NitrOS-9 window. This way we could still have our real CoCo 3, and all > that "advanced" stuff the 6809 is supposedly "too slow" for. |=============== My first pass will use a 6809 software compatilbe core that is developed by John Kent. It is fully functional and the latest release has cleared most of the bugs. The rest is the same as the GIME chip with enhanced video section. What will happen is the whole CC3 will fit into one FPGA, 6809/GIME/PIA chips/serial ports/ mouse and keyboard ports. Future pass is to switch to a functional 6309 core. From there do enhancements. My vision is to run the 6309 core in a FPGA at a equivalent speed of 35MHz minimum. 25MHz is doable. james From jdaggett at gate.net Sun Jan 4 16:18:07 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2009 16:18:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Coco4 thoughts In-Reply-To: <49603612.5000907@swbell.net> References: <495E94C8.80606@att.net>, , <49603612.5000907@swbell.net> Message-ID: <4960E13F.27797.12DE42@jdaggett.gate.net> On 3 Jan 2009 at 22:07, Joel Ewy wrote: > BookWorm wrote: > >> 480Kbytes. Inside the FPGA this is easy to do. > >> > > > > Are you putting the RAM *inside* the new GIME? That woud be perfect. > > > > Would the CoCo 4 you're talking about use a 68000 or some imaginary > > new chip? If it's a 68k, why not memory map it in the CoCo 3, and > > put it on a big fat hairy new RAM board? It could share 2 meg with > > the 6809, use your amazing new chip, or the original, and run OSk in > > a NitrOS-9 window. This way we could still have our real CoCo 3, and > > all that "advanced" stuff the 6809 is supposedly "too slow" for. > > > > > A 6809 core running at an effective clock rate of about 21MHz would > probably give an 8MHz 68000 system (Atari, Amiga, original Macintosh > come to mind) a run for its money. And if you had a 16-bit data path > to memory the 68K wouldn't even get points for bus width. > > I've got a Digilent Spartan 3 1000K board on the way, so I'm going to > try out Gary Becker's FPGA CoCo 3 soon. I'll put up a blog detailing > my experiences. > > I really want to run some programs that take a lot of time on the CoCo > and see what they feel like at approx 21 MHz. Particularly things > like decoding GIF files, and Sockmaster's HiColor display. The latter > might be a challenge because the timing will be completely off at the > higher clock rate, and I'm not sure what the VGA timing will do to it > as well. Oh, and then there's the fact that the CPU09 doesn't use the > same instruction timing as a real 6809. But I could certainly see how > long it takes to process the image, and with a little work, adapt > Sock's program to the CPU09. > > More to come when I get my development board... > Joel John's CPU09 is fillu spftware compatible. There should be no instruction changes. Yes it is true that some instructions do work with less cycle time. So critical timing routines will be way off at 21 MHz. The Spartan 3 Starter board is a nice one. I plan to migrate to the Nexys 2 board. There I do not have to modify the board for 256 color for the VGA. It also has more RAM although it is PSDRAM. james From keeper63 at cox.net Sun Jan 4 18:40:10 2009 From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2009 16:40:10 -0700 Subject: [Coco] CoCoNet and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> Roger, I know I have hinted about this in the past, but I never saw any interest or response, either from you or others. You haven't given much (any?) info on what the "server" side of things is on this future CoCoNet product. You haven't mentioned what it is, what platform it runs on (Windows, I assume?), nor how it works. You also haven't mentioned if the comm protocol used will be documented and available to others? I don't expect it in the initial release of the product, but support and ability to use the server on other platforms would be nice. If you aren't willing or able to do so, then without the comm protocol's documentation, you would become a "single source" for the back-end server, and should ($DEITY forbid) something happen to you, or should Windows change in a significant fashion and you are unable to port the code... Well - suffice to say owners of the system might find themselves in a bind... I would really love to purchase CoCoNet when it becomes available, but I am not willing to set up (and spend a lot of money on) a dedicated Windows box for the privilege, especially considering that it would see limited use anyhow. I already have a nice, new dual-screen Ubuntu box ready, though - and the CoCo could easily sit right "next door" to it on my desk (where it used to be until recently when I redid my office). If I knew that the specs for the protocol were going to be published (and/or included) with the hardware, it would go a long way toward getting me to decide to purchase one when it became available (and who knows, maybe I would spend some time hacking up a server in Perl or something for the *nix crowd!)... -- Andrew L. Ayers, Glendale, Arizona From jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk Sun Jan 4 22:12:16 2009 From: jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk (James McKay) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 03:12:16 -0000 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. References: <20090102011020.091B920A13@qs281.pair.com><20090103005230.51E3720A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090104014817.8F70920A15@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: "Roger Taylor" wrote in message news:20090104014817.8F70920A15 at qs281.pair.com... I'm glad that it worked! > I see that the color palette changes on every other level. Is this CoCo 3 > only? I also see a tank in level 3. It's just using the old CoCo multicolor palettes, hence why I've changed the "night stage" to an "arctic" one... A bit of artistic licence! :) The levels swap between the helicopter and tank in the background for your bonus point opportunity. > What source code did you convert to 6809 assembler? I'm sure there's > quite a few coders out there that would love to hear about this project > more. The reverse engineered Z80 version which can be run on the Spectrum or Amstrad CPC (with some macro changes) is located here (a couple of download links in this forum post): http://www.cpczone.net/boards/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1736&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=Deathchase&start=45#p13962 It was made by Richard Wilson (aka Executioner), who is the author of the Amstrad CPC emulator "WinAPE". It compiles in WinAPE's own assembler, which is built into the emulator and can assemble during emulation (very handy). I'll be releasing the 6809 source upon completion and I might try a CoCo 3 version using a 4 bpp mode... For those considering their own ports, the tree engine is completely char-aligned and would probably go quite nicely in a tile-based machine. The sprites are also char-aligned, so the only problem there is getting them to draw in front of or behind the trees. Assuming a cartridge based system and excluding the bitmap/vram, it might run in under 2K of RAM (I haven't checked 100%, but I think it should definitely run in 4K). bye, James McKay. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 4 23:26:47 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:26:47 -0600 Subject: [Coco] CoCoNet and Linux In-Reply-To: <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> References: <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> Message-ID: <20090105042707.4781F20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 05:40 PM 1/4/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > >I know I have hinted about this in the past, but I never saw any >interest or response, either from you or others. > >You haven't given much (any?) info on what the "server" side of >things is on this future CoCoNet product. You haven't mentioned what >it is, what platform it runs on (Windows, I assume?), nor how it >works. You also haven't mentioned if the comm protocol used will be >documented and available to others? First of all, Boisy Pitre of Cloud-9 sells a product called DriveWire. CoCoNet also has virtual drives which means I have to sell at a similar price to give people a fair choice. It's not good business for me to give mine away for free, or the detailed specs. My sales will be more in the CoCo-PC cables and the ROM Pak. There'll be people who want the LOADM'able patch whether to burn an EPROM or not, and people who will make their own cables and so forth, so this leaves the server app truly the only part of the product that stays in my control. I'm sure everyone can understand. The CoCo side is a patch to Disk BASIC 1.1. The server side is a small app that runs under Windows. If I were to release any technical specs or protocol info this early, there wouldn't be a need to complete this product because another coder could jump in and give their version before I get mine out. Yes, a Linux server could be written and I might very well do that in short time or work with another Linux coder to help whip one up quicker. >I don't expect it in the initial release of the product, but support >and ability to use the server on other platforms would be nice. If >you aren't willing or able to do so, then without the comm >protocol's documentation, you would become a "single source" for the >back-end server, and should ($DEITY forbid) something happen to you, >or should Windows change in a significant fashion and you are unable >to port the code... > >Well - suffice to say owners of the system might find themselves in a bind... I carry a small 1gig USB drive in a leather case on my keychain. >I would really love to purchase CoCoNet when it becomes available, >but I am not willing to set up (and spend a lot of money on) a >dedicated Windows box for the privilege, especially considering that >it would see limited use anyhow. I already have a nice, new >dual-screen Ubuntu box ready, though - and the CoCo could easily sit >right "next door" to it on my desk (where it used to be until >recently when I redid my office). If I knew that the specs for the >protocol were going to be published (and/or included) with the >hardware, it would go a long way toward getting me to decide to >purchase one when it became available (and who knows, maybe I would >spend some time hacking up a server in Perl or something for the >*nix crowd!)... Yes, any platform that has a serial port up to 115200 bps can run a server on it for CoCoNet. One needs to be written. Windows comes first, then Linux. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From georgeramsower at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 00:04:50 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 23:04:50 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. References: Message-ID: <005f01c96ef3$23c32670$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "James McKay" > Hi! I have released a demo version of the "Spectrum classic" 3D > Deathchase for the CoCo 1/2 & Dragon. This demo requires 32K of RAM and > is available in CAS, WAV or DSK format. > > http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/deathchase.htm > > Happy new year! What is the difference between a CAS file and a WAV file? The WAV I understand. I suspect the CAS is for an emulator? George From zmerch-coco at 30below.com Mon Jan 5 00:08:34 2009 From: zmerch-coco at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 00:08:34 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCoNet and Linux In-Reply-To: <20090105042707.4781F20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20090104233703.013e7288@mail.30below.com> [[ Before I start, let me say that I do like to play Devil's Advocate - maybe I should have been a lawyer or a politician, but unfortunately, I have this thing called "honesty" I try to adhere to... ;-) That said, I'm not critical or anything, just giving another point of view here. This is your product, your business, and obviously, your decision. ]] Rumor has it that Roger Taylor may have mentioned these words: >At 05:40 PM 1/4/2009, you wrote: >>Roger, >> >>I know I have hinted about this in the past, but I never saw any interest >>or response, either from you or others. >> >>You haven't given much (any?) info on what the "server" side of things is >>on this future CoCoNet product. You haven't mentioned what it is, what >>platform it runs on (Windows, I assume?), nor how it works. You also >>haven't mentioned if the comm protocol used will be documented and >>available to others? > >First of all, Boisy Pitre of Cloud-9 sells a product called >DriveWire. CoCoNet also has virtual drives which means I have to sell at >a similar price to give people a fair choice. It's not good business for >me to give mine away for free, or the detailed specs. But Cloud-9 does give away 2 things: They have a freebie minimal Linux drivewire server under the "good luck, hope it works for you, if it doesn't write your own" mindset, a mindset I subscribe to as well. More importantly, the communication protocol is wide open; so if someone else did choose to write a compatible server application, they're perfectly free to do so. I would love to write a Linux app in Python to do just that, but I don't have enough round-tuits built up for anything of that nature. Cloud-9 still gets the DriveWire sale as it's the CoCo side that really has the "magic" - a Drivewire server application without DriveWire on the CoCo would be a "less than optimal" situation. ;-) >My sales will be more in the CoCo-PC cables and the ROM Pak. There'll be >people who want the LOADM'able patch whether to burn an EPROM or not, and >people who will make their own cables and so forth, so this leaves the >server app truly the only part of the product that stays in my >control. I'm sure everyone can understand. Why not charge for the LOADM'able patch? Again, I'm not nagging, just asking (what I think is) a valid question for the discussion. >The CoCo side is a patch to Disk BASIC 1.1. The server side is a small >app that runs under Windows. If I were to release any technical specs or >protocol info this early, there wouldn't be a need to complete this >product because another coder could jump in and give their version before >I get mine out. Yes, a Linux server could be written and I might very >well do that in short time or work with another Linux coder to help whip >one up quicker. Now, to play the "other side of the fence" - Instead of branching the code solely for Linux, if you have access to a machine running a recent Linux distro (say, Ubuntu) - test your winders .exe under WINE on that linux. At least with Ubuntu, WINE is just an 'apt-get install' away if you like the command line, or just search for 'wine' in Synaptic if you're a GUI fan. If you're app runs "near flawless" just add that to your advertising scheme; "no warranties, but give it a try, it's at least been tested somewhat. If something dies, email me at xxx at yyy.zzz and let me know, I'll see if I can fix it." If enough people test & use it under WINE on different platforms and it does seem quite stable, then offer to add that as a "compatibility platform" for the future. If enough people are running it under WINE at that point, you can then see if it would behoove you to continue to test future code bases under WINE. =-=-=-= Lastly, there's always the options like: 1) Provide a known-good Linux programmer the comm protocol under Non-Disclosure Agreement, and if [s]he releases it, LART him/her legally, or 2) Have a "Hobby License" for the protocol of say... $250, that way you get a certain amount of profit from that sale, and if that person is successful in making a Linux server [s]he gets the profits from the sale of that server software. Put it in the Hobby License Contract that they can't make a Winders version. Those are just some (prolly bad) ideas I had whilst I sit here listening to some old Falco... >I carry a small 1gig USB drive in a leather case on my keychain. "Small" is right - I bought a 2G Cruzer Micro just over 3 years ago... dang near $100! Now... ah... under $10. Now the 32G sticks are about $50; and Santa darned near put one of those in my stocking... ;-) Again, take what I say with less than a grain of salt - I'm just rambling on tonite. ;-) Laterz! Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch at 30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From mechacoco at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 01:22:43 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 23:22:43 -0700 Subject: [Coco] 3D Deathchase demo. In-Reply-To: <005f01c96ef3$23c32670$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> References: <005f01c96ef3$23c32670$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901042222i11d3b48bu39f927c94699c4b2@mail.gmail.com> On 1/4/09, George Ramsower wrote: > > What is the difference between a CAS file and a WAV file? > > The WAV I understand. I suspect the CAS is for an emulator? > > George > --- Unlike WAV, CAS is not an audio format, but rather just a dump of the encoded bits from a tape file. CAS files are thus much smaller than the corresponding WAV and much easier for an emulator to deal with. Darren From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 07:42:42 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 07:42:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Another *WOW* auction at Ebay Message-ID: <5631e580901050442v3e75bb21w5b170e240dade80a@mail.gmail.com> Perhaps I should start a blog or something to POKE some common sense attention on these kind of Ebay postings: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400015657580 Not to take away the right anyone has into making some $$$, but whenever an auction includes the words WOW and/or RARE in the headline, there is something of a giveaway at the clueless nature of the noted auction... you could get a eee PC for the asking price on this pair of CoCo products - maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were to be the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at something like this. -=[ Rogelio ]=- From alsplace at pobox.com Mon Jan 5 08:19:15 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 07:19:15 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <5631e580901050442v3e75bb21w5b170e240dade80a@mail.gmail.com> References: <5631e580901050442v3e75bb21w5b170e240dade80a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it > were to be > the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at > something > like this. Black CoCo 3, did you say? -- A From davehazelton at comcast.net Mon Jan 5 08:46:25 2009 From: davehazelton at comcast.net (David Hazelton) Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 08:46:25 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCoNet and Linux In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20090104233703.013e7288@mail.30below.com> References: <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> <496148DA.4000406@cox.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20090104233703.013e7288@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <49620F31.1090200@comcast.net> Another way...possibly Ubuntu also has Sun xVM Virtualbox, Which if you have a copy of Windows you can run it in a virtual machine. The latest version is pretty slick, I've run a "Ghost" server under it on a Ubuntu server, where WINE just couldn't handle the multicasting Virtualbox worked fine. Playing with it on the otherside Ubuntu Desktop on Windows XP at home, I can use my USB Epson printer /Scanner which impresses me....I'm so easy :-) It allows mapping Com ports to actual Com Ports, I was playing with it last night to see if I could fax something (Testing the Serial modem connected to COM1) It used 16450 emulation I believe I read in the Docs. ~ David Hazelton Roger Merchberger wrote: > > Now, to play the "other side of the fence" - Instead of branching the > code solely for Linux, if you have access to a machine running a > recent Linux distro (say, Ubuntu) - test your winders .exe under WINE > on that linux. At least with Ubuntu, WINE is just an 'apt-get install' > away if you like the command line, or just search for 'wine' in > Synaptic if you're a GUI fan. If you're app runs "near flawless" just > add that to your advertising scheme; "no warranties, but give it a > try, it's at least been tested somewhat. If something dies, email me > at xxx at yyy.zzz and let me know, I'll see if I can fix it." If enough > people test & use it under WINE on different platforms and it does > seem quite stable, then offer to add that as a "compatibility > platform" for the future. If enough people are running it under WINE > at that point, you can then see if it would behoove you to continue to > test future code bases under WINE. > From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 09:16:22 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 09:16:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay Message-ID: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:19 AM, Allen Huffman wrote: > On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > >> maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were to >> be >> the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at >> something >> like this. >> > > Black CoCo 3, did you say? > > -- A > Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded case. That discussion dates to a few years ago while Marty Goodman was still an active CoCoist. It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The case would not be a problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black keycaps could be a challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process to repaint the caps and lettering was embarked upon. Maybe I'll try that. Have the can of black paint for the case already :-) -=[ R ]=- From alsplace at pobox.com Mon Jan 5 09:35:04 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:35:04 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> References: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I wonder if this is legit, or spawn from a black CoCo 3 my friend Bob Rutherford brought to an Atlanta CoCoFest... I think I mentioned this in my CoCoFest Chronicles... I'll have to see. Sent from my iPhone Follow me on Twitter - http://twitter.com/allenhuffman On Jan 5, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:19 AM, Allen Huffman > wrote: > >> On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: >> >>> maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it >>> were to >>> be >>> the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at >>> something >>> like this. >>> >> >> Black CoCo 3, did you say? >> >> -- A >> > > Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded > case. > That discussion dates to a few years ago while Marty Goodman was > still an > active CoCoist. > > It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The case would > not be a > problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black keycaps > could be a > challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process to > repaint the > caps and lettering was embarked upon. > > Maybe I'll try that. Have the can of black paint for the case > already :-) > > > > -=[ R ]=- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 10:58:43 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 10:58:43 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: References: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5631e580901050758t757fe308y12b70f61f3dae4ea@mail.gmail.com> Well, my brain cells have been exposed to high intensity AM RF fields for quite a while now so some memories are in a playfully constant fuzzy state. But something's abuzz in there about Marty having seen or commented about a black CoCo 3 prototype... Any findings will be welcomed Allen -=[ R ]=- On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 9:35 AM, Allen Huffman wrote: > I wonder if this is legit, or spawn from a black CoCo 3 my friend Bob > Rutherford brought to an Atlanta CoCoFest... I think I mentioned this in my > CoCoFest Chronicles... I'll have to see. > > Sent from my iPhone > Follow me on Twitter - http://twitter.com/allenhuffman > > > On Jan 5, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > > On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:19 AM, Allen Huffman wrote: >> >> On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: >>> >>> maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were >>>> to >>>> be >>>> the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at >>>> something >>>> like this. >>>> >>>> >>> Black CoCo 3, did you say? >>> >>> -- A >>> >>> >> Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded case. >> That discussion dates to a few years ago while Marty Goodman was still an >> active CoCoist. >> >> It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The case would not be a >> problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black keycaps could be >> a >> challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process to repaint the >> caps and lettering was embarked upon. >> >> Maybe I'll try that. Have the can of black paint for the case already :-) >> > From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 11:05:08 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 11:05:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer Message-ID: <5631e580901050805n78f17293j9cd55b6e4c32ebdb@mail.gmail.com> Been searching the web for replacement ribbon cartridges for this printer. While it prints on thermal paper with no problems., I'd like to try it with thee ribbon cart on plain paper. Haven't found any cross reference as to who actually made the printer engine that Radio Shack used for the TRP-100 (will try prying inside the hardware this evening), sometimes that would yield better results at getting an OEM part than trying under the RS banner (or their catalog number for that matter). Any hints will be appreciatted -=[ Rogelio ]=- From nutz4coco at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 11:32:59 2009 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:32:59 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Looking for CoCo enthusiasts in Washington State. Message-ID: <889830d00901050832v6bbb2ea3g17aa58960a80158f@mail.gmail.com> If you live in Washington State, please drop me a line in private. -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ From brjeremy at juno.com Mon Jan 5 12:38:59 2009 From: brjeremy at juno.com (brjeremy at juno.com) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 17:38:59 GMT Subject: [Coco] Another *WOW* auction at Ebay Message-ID: <20090105.113859.13550.0@webmail04.dca.untd.com> On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it > were to be > the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at > something > like this. I never heard that there was a Black Prototype CoCo3. I have the three Prototype / Pre-production CoCo3's which were used in the development of OS-9 Level 2. One has a very different pre-production GIME chip. Another they back panel (where the jacks are) is a drilled out piece of plastic with typewriter labels. They had made the final molds. With all best wishes, Brother Jeremy, CSJW ____________________________________________________________ Click to compare life insurance rates. Great rates, quick and easy. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/PnY6rw2PVUNgQuUD3ItxMlTN9Mh9uezhnLNlwbFGdJY2aQKRmBhEt/ From theother_bob at yahoo.com Mon Jan 5 13:08:04 2009 From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (theother_bob) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 10:08:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay Message-ID: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:19 AM, Allen Huffman wrote: > On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > >> maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were to >> be >> the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at >> something >> like this. >> > > Black CoCo 3, did you say? > > -- A > Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded case. That discussion dates to a few years ago while Marty Goodman was still an active CoCoist. It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The case would not be a problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black keycaps could be a challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process to repaint the caps and lettering was embarked upon. Maybe I'll try that. Have the can of black paint for the case already :-) -=[ R ]=- Well I do have a CoCo3 keyboard that was made with black instead of grey plastic. Keys are the usual white though, but it's still somewhat of a novelty. I put it in my CC3 Portable, along with a black cartridge door to match. Bob From mechacoco at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 13:59:11 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 11:59:11 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901051059v403f36e7tb76f75b8a01d331f@mail.gmail.com> On 1/5/09, theother_bob wrote: > > Well I do have a CoCo3 keyboard that was made with black instead of grey > plastic. > Keys are the usual white though, but it's still somewhat of a novelty. > I put it in my CC3 Portable, along with a black cartridge door to match. > > Bob > --- That CoCo 3 keyboard (with the black bezel) was sold in Radio Shack stores as a generic hobbyist part and was not advertised as CoCo compatible. Many astute CoCo 1 and 2 users realized that it would work quite nicely as an upgrade for their machines. Darren From neilsmorr at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 14:07:50 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 11:07:50 -0800 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer References: <5631e580901050805n78f17293j9cd55b6e4c32ebdb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9B79156CE9054800837433875F6FB3F7@NewBaby> Yes. All of the refills, both the cartridge and the refill rolls, say Made in Japan. No other hints as to maker however. Have you looked for a repair manual? Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rogelio Perea" > Been searching the web for replacement ribbon cartridges for this printer. > While it prints on thermal paper with no problems., I'd like to try it > with > thee ribbon cart on plain paper. > > Haven't found any cross reference as to who actually made the printer > engine > that Radio Shack used for the TRP-100 (will try prying inside the hardware > this evening), sometimes that would yield better results at getting an OEM > part than trying under the RS banner (or their catalog number for that > matter). From jlhickle at yahoo.com Mon Jan 5 14:18:15 2009 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 11:18:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <645210.43071.qm@web36602.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The > case would not be a > problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black > keycaps could be a > challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process > to repaint the > caps and lettering was embarked upon. > If you had a printer that could print white (or if you were really good with a pen), you could paint the keys black and put black overlays on the keytops. http://www.datacal.com/user-definable-overlays.htm Might be easier to paint keys gray and use black print on gray overlays. From sklammer at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 15:51:38 2009 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 15:51:38 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <645210.43071.qm@web36602.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <645210.43071.qm@web36602.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3925f0b0901051251odcc1d5djf78bee7bab0adaa0@mail.gmail.com> Another option might be to use "rub-on" letters like Letraset, they are available in white and a variety of colours; then a thin coat/dip/spray of clear varnish(?) A close look at most new keyboards, especially laptops, and that is what it looks like they're using... :) 2009/1/5 Jim Hickle > > > > > > > > It'd be neat to custom mod a CoCo to such a color. The > > case would not be a > > problem at all but the keyboard: white lettering on black > > keycaps could be a > > challenge to get... unless some rather painstaking process > > to repaint the > > caps and lettering was embarked upon. > > > > If you had a printer that could print white (or if you were really good > with a pen), you could paint the keys black and put black overlays on the > keytops. http://www.datacal.com/user-definable-overlays.htm > > Might be easier to paint keys gray and use black print on gray overlays. > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jet.pack at ymail.com Mon Jan 5 16:12:26 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 13:12:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay References: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5d802cd0901051059v403f36e7tb76f75b8a01d331f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <269754.92677.qm@web111212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> was that the keyboard intended for the never released deluxe color computer? ________________________________ From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Monday, January 5, 2009 12:59:11 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay On 1/5/09, theother_bob wrote: > > Well I do have a CoCo3 keyboard that was made with black instead of grey > plastic. > Keys are the usual white though, but it's still somewhat of a novelty. > I put it in my CC3 Portable, along with a black cartridge door to match. > > Bob > --- That CoCo 3 keyboard (with the black bezel) was sold in Radio Shack stores as a generic hobbyist part and was not advertised as CoCo compatible. Many astute CoCo 1 and 2 users realized that it would work quite nicely as an upgrade for their machines. Darren -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From alsplace at pobox.com Mon Jan 5 16:20:49 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 15:20:49 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <269754.92677.qm@web111212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <320184.74058.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5d802cd0901051059v403f36e7tb76f75b8a01d331f@mail.gmail.com> <269754.92677.qm@web111212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Jan 5, 2009, at 3:12 PM, John Eric wrote: > was that the keyboard intended for the never released deluxe color > computer? That seems to have been the understanding at the time. > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Darren A > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Monday, January 5, 2009 12:59:11 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at > Ebay > > On 1/5/09, theother_bob wrote: >> >> Well I do have a CoCo3 keyboard that was made with black instead of >> grey >> plastic. >> Keys are the usual white though, but it's still somewhat of a >> novelty. >> I put it in my CC3 Portable, along with a black cartridge door to >> match. >> >> Bob >> > --- > > That CoCo 3 keyboard (with the black bezel) was sold in Radio Shack > stores as a generic hobbyist part and was not advertised as CoCo > compatible. Many astute CoCo 1 and 2 users realized that it would > work quite nicely as an upgrade for their machines. > > Darren > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From Torsten at Dittel.info Mon Jan 5 17:24:06 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 23:24:06 +0100 Subject: [Coco] New "commercial" CoCo3 RGB to VGA Converter? Message-ID: This time with a descriptive subject line, I hope to get some additional comments on this one: http://www.ambery.com/rgbcgatovgac.html offers a: 15Khz RGB (CGA YUV Component Video YCbCr) to VGA Converter Scaler for 92US$. From the website above: "The video displays for the older RGB sources are quite hard to get nowadays. If users want the benefit of using LCD flat panel display for their legacy RGB source, this converter provides the right solution for converting the 15Khz RGB type signals to modern VGA interface signals. Glitch-free conversion with high resolution output display of sharp frames and fine pixels. This RGB to VGA converter scaler unit upgrades the older 15Khz RGB video signals from sources like arcade game boards to high-resolution VGA with progressive scan output for use with TFT monitor, LCD panel, projector or HDTV set with VGA input. -- Fit with both 4:3 And 16:9 Wide Screen VESA/VGA Displays This RGB to VGA converter is featured the only product in the market that supports true 16:9 output with native wide screen resolution at 1366x768 pixels for LCD TV or LCD/TFT monitor size larger than 17" or 1024x768 pixels output for standard 4:3 CRT monitor VESA displays. The unit converts the signals of a RGB source in a format that can be shown on both: a traditional CRT with VGA connector as well as on a flatscreen LCD monitor. It digitizes the incoming video signals and up converts them with perfect image output quality. -- Advanced 3D Motion Adaptive De-interlacing With the motion adaptive de-interlacing technology, this unit easily converts the interlaced RGB signals into progressive ones (scanned every line). Users shall find pictures much less flickering with more graphical presentation. This unit also adopts a variety of technologies including automatic 3:2/2:2 file mode detection and non-linear scaling to enhance the picture quality for sharp and clear output. -- 480i/576i Component Video to VGA Converter This RGB converter also supports 480i or 576i YUV or component video YCbCr signals from RGB sources like DVD players, satellite set top boxes, media players and all major video game consoles including: * Gamecube at 480i/576i mode * Xbox and Xbox 360 at 480i/576i mode * PlayStation 2 PS2 at 480i/576i mode * Nintendo Wii at 480i/576i mode The interlaced component RGB signals will be converted into progressive scan type VGA or RGBHV signals for high resolution presentation and scaled up to 1024x768 pixels or 1366x768 pixels to fit with all sizes of VGA monitors, LCD flat panels or LCD TV displays with VGA inputs. -- 15Khz RGB CGA to VGA Converter All the legacy RGB devices with analog outputs at 15Khz horizontal plus 50/60Hz vertical frequency range can be up converted nicely at high resolution on CRT/LCD/TFT monitor, projector or LCD TV via VGA connection. like the CGA from arcade video games can also be displayed The CGA outputs from those arcade game board or the older Amiga computer can now be displayed using a PC VGA monitor or TFT LCD monitor. All new design for low picture noise and detects wider range in game board timing. This converter supports all major RGB outputs from the following gaming machine PCBs and all other legacy computer video sources: * Amiga * Atari computer * ICB CM99 * Subsino * CYE * IGS * Jolly Joker * Witch Game * Cuty Line * Dyna X * Psikyo * Amatic * Bigigo -- Features * Enhances analog RGB signals to high VGA resolutions for display on any computer CRT monitor, LCD/TFT flat display panel or projector. * The only product in the market that supports true 16:9 output with native wide screen resolution at 1366x768 pixels for LCD TV or LCD/TFT monitor size larger than 17". * Play arcade video games at high resolution on CRT/LCD/TFT monitor, projector, LCD TV or HDTV via VGA connection. * Supports all RGB signals with 15Khz(H)+ 50/60hz(V) type input or YCbCr component video at 480i/576i inputs. * Supports RGB inputs from all major game consoles including Gamecube, PlayStation 2, Nintendo Wii, Xbox and Xbox 360. * Supports legacy computer devices like Amiga, Atari and so on. * Supports 16-bit and 24-bit color depth. * All new design for low picture noise and detects wider range in game board timing. * Enhance standard definition video at 480i/576i resolution from DVD player, DVR, satellite receiver or video game consoles to progressive scan high VGA resolution for display. * Auto detection of RGB inputs including RGsB (sync on G), RGBS, RGBH/V and RGBH+V composite sync with sync level above 2 vpp, 75 Ohm. * 2 selectable Input selections: CGA and RGB Component video input. * 3 selectable VGA output resolutions: 640x480 pixels, 1024x768 pixels and 1366x768 pixels. * Automatic 50/60 Hz scan rate conversion to ensure sharp and glitch-free picture display on the monitor or projector. * Automatic 3:2/2:2 file mode detection. * Supports both standard 4:3 and 16:9 widescreen VGA & VESA displays. * Supports sustaining contrastive modification. * Glitch-free conversion with high resolution output display of sharp frames and fine pixels. -- Specifications * Input RGB Connectors: o D-sub 15-pin VGA female x 1 o 3 RCA male x 1, through D-sub 15-pin to 3 RCA adapter cable (included) * Input RGB Signals: o RGB: 0.7 Vp-p 75 ohm o H sync/ V sync: 2 Vp-p 75 ohm o YCbCr: 1 Vp-p(Y), 0.7 Vp-p 75 ohm(CbCr) * Input Timings: o 480i: Horizontal 15KHz + Vertical 60Hz/Interlace o 576i: Horizontal 15KHz + Vertical 50Hz/Interlace o Analog CGA: Hori 15KHz + Vert 60Hz/Non-interlace * Input RGB Formats: o RGsB(Sync on G) o RGBS o RGBH/V o RGBH+V with sync level above 2 Vpp o YCbCr/YUV * VGA Output Connector: o D-sub 15-pin VGA female x 1 * VGA Output Signals and Timings: o VGA 640x480 pixels @ 60Hz o XGA 1024x768 pixels @ 60Hz o WXGA 1366x768 pixels @ 60Hz (wide-screen mode use) * Power Supply: o Input: 110V-240V AC o Output: 5V DC 1 A, center positive -- Package * 15Khz RGB to VGA scaler * Power supply * User manual * D-sub 15-pin VGA to 3 RCA adapter cable for component video input Or you may customize your own adapter cable for your RGB devices. The following diagram shows the corresponding pin-out assignment from 15Khz H/60Hz V RGB output to the 15-pin VGA input of our model AV-1 converter. [...]" From snhirsch at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 18:14:37 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 18:14:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] New "commercial" CoCo3 RGB to VGA Converter? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 5 Jan 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: > This time with a descriptive subject line, I hope to get some additional > comments on this one: > > http://www.ambery.com/rgbcgatovgac.html > > offers a: > > 15Khz RGB (CGA YUV Component Video YCbCr) to VGA Converter Scaler > > for 92US$. From the website above: (snip) There was discussion of this product on one of the Amiga boards. Opinions were mixed, but the Amiga produces a variety of video modes and perhaps some were just troublesome for scan conversion. I have never used the Ambery unit, but my other low-cost RGB converter (Wei-Ya ACV-011) does a great job on the CoCo. So, it's possible that this guy is workable. FYI: The only thing I've ever seen that handles Amiga interlaced modes properly is the Highway (aka Cyp) Model 100 - a considerably more expensive unit (>$200). Steve -- From operator at coco3.com Mon Jan 5 22:01:55 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:01:55 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com > References: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090106030221.C4DCA20A14@qs281.pair.com> At 08:16 AM 1/5/2009, you wrote: >On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:19 AM, Allen Huffman wrote: > > > On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > > > >> maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were to > >> be > >> the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at > >> something > >> like this. > >> > > > > Black CoCo 3, did you say? > > > > -- A > > > >Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded case. >That discussion dates to a few years ago while Marty Goodman was still an >active CoCoist. Somebody grab that sucker and see if it has the hidden 256 color mode?? But, jeez, $450 ? Maybe a gamble. :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From neilsmorr at gmail.com Mon Jan 5 21:56:37 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 18:56:37 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] FREE 50GB Online Storage - for software or magazines? Message-ID: http://www.adrive.com/ FREE 50GB Online Storage Cloud Storage Upload & Store Files Access Files Anywhere Share Files Edit Documents Online Remote File Transfer ADrive Backup Client Neil -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/png Size: 305 bytes Desc: not available Url : From alsplace at pobox.com Mon Jan 5 22:03:04 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 21:03:04 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> References: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <90F688B6-769C-45A4-A0AD-8F8F880DF09F@pobox.com> On Jan 5, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded > case. Well, interestingly enough, the story I "told" at the booth -- which some folks took with a grain of salt, and others seemed to believe -- was something like this: "You know tho Radio Shack's stereo equipment used to all be silver? Then they slowly moved them all to black? Same thing was going on with the computers." Plausible. Marty was at some of the CoCoFests -- wonder if he knew something "for real" or he was at one of the ones we had the Black CoCo at? -- A From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jan 5 22:22:17 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 22:22:17 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Black CoCo 3 - WAS--> Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <90F688B6-769C-45A4-A0AD-8F8F880DF09F@pobox.com> References: <5631e580901050616y234350a9pcc7cb6c260a93513@mail.gmail.com>, <90F688B6-769C-45A4-A0AD-8F8F880DF09F@pobox.com> Message-ID: <49628819.30191.C5851F@jdaggett.gate.net> On 5 Jan 2009 at 21:03, Allen Huffman wrote: > On Jan 5, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Rogelio Perea wrote: > > Yup... supposedly there was a prototype CoCo 3 within a black molded > > case. > > Well, interestingly enough, the story I "told" at the booth -- which > some folks took with a grain of salt, and others seemed to believe -- > was something like this: > > "You know tho Radio Shack's stereo equipment used to all be silver? > Then they slowly moved them all to black? Same thing was going on with > the computers." > > Plausible. > ++++++++++++++++++ Quite plausible. If the case is Lexan or a Polycarbonate plastic changing from white to black is just changign the dye color. There would be no extra charge for that. Polycarbonates are naturally clear. So it would be an extremely easy move to change colors. james From os9dude at gmail.com Tue Jan 6 06:33:43 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 06:33:43 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer In-Reply-To: <9B79156CE9054800837433875F6FB3F7@NewBaby> References: <5631e580901050805n78f17293j9cd55b6e4c32ebdb@mail.gmail.com> <9B79156CE9054800837433875F6FB3F7@NewBaby> Message-ID: <5631e580901060333q4404a12dg4913f4d0b9635ed@mail.gmail.com> Found the User Manual at http://www.classiccmp.org/cini/systems.htm - Radio Shack's support website had nothing on teh TRP-100 nor the ribbon cartridge. The User Manual does not provide any reference onto the make of either the printer or the ribbon cart. Will try to snoop out some lead from the hardware itself this evening. -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Neil Morrison wrote: > Yes. All of the refills, both the cartridge and the refill rolls, say Made > in Japan. No other hints as to maker however. Have you looked for a repair > manual? > > Neil > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rogelio Perea" > > > Been searching the web for replacement ribbon cartridges for this printer. >> While it prints on thermal paper with no problems., I'd like to try it >> with >> thee ribbon cart on plain paper. >> >> Haven't found any cross reference as to who actually made the printer >> engine >> that Radio Shack used for the TRP-100 (will try prying inside the hardware >> this evening), sometimes that would yield better results at getting an OEM >> part than trying under the RS banner (or their catalog number for that >> matter). > > From sklammer at gmail.com Tue Jan 6 13:22:55 2009 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 13:22:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer In-Reply-To: <5631e580901060333q4404a12dg4913f4d0b9635ed@mail.gmail.com> References: <5631e580901050805n78f17293j9cd55b6e4c32ebdb@mail.gmail.com> <9B79156CE9054800837433875F6FB3F7@NewBaby> <5631e580901060333q4404a12dg4913f4d0b9635ed@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3925f0b0901061022h152e0445o891a012774539811@mail.gmail.com> Suggestion (may be more work than it is worth), pickup one of the ribbon reels used in thermal fax machines and cut a strip to wind into an existing cartridge... 2009/1/6 Rogelio Perea > Found the User Manual at http://www.classiccmp.org/cini/systems.htm - > Radio > Shack's support website had nothing on teh TRP-100 nor the ribbon > cartridge. > The User Manual does not provide any reference onto the make of either the > printer or the ribbon cart. > > Will try to snoop out some lead from the hardware itself this evening. > > > > -=[ Rogelio ]=- > > > > On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Neil Morrison wrote: > > > Yes. All of the refills, both the cartridge and the refill rolls, say > Made > > in Japan. No other hints as to maker however. Have you looked for a > repair > > manual? > > > > Neil > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rogelio Perea" > > > > > > Been searching the web for replacement ribbon cartridges for this > printer. > >> While it prints on thermal paper with no problems., I'd like to try it > >> with > >> thee ribbon cart on plain paper. > >> > >> Haven't found any cross reference as to who actually made the printer > >> engine > >> that Radio Shack used for the TRP-100 (will try prying inside the > hardware > >> this evening), sometimes that would yield better results at getting an > OEM > >> part than trying under the RS banner (or their catalog number for that > >> matter). > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From nutz4coco at gmail.com Tue Jan 6 17:12:21 2009 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 14:12:21 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Looking for input for my retro-computing blog. Message-ID: <889830d00901061412t2a7e77c0j2ef7a3bd912d0c0e@mail.gmail.com> Hi everyone, I am running the 8-Bit Retrocomputing group on Linkedin and I am managing a blog for the group. I am trying to gather links for the blog's link lists, but I could use some help. If you have time, swing by the blog and leave some suggestions in the comments if you want: http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/ Cheers, -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ http://urbanspelunkers.blogspot.com/ From exwn8jef at gmail.com Tue Jan 6 23:15:06 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2009 23:15:06 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazine Index In-Reply-To: <889830d00901061412t2a7e77c0j2ef7a3bd912d0c0e@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00901061412t2a7e77c0j2ef7a3bd912d0c0e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49642C4A.3020704@gmail.com> Does anyone have a compiled index to Rainbow Magazine? Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com From keeper63 at cox.net Wed Jan 7 00:10:52 2009 From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew) Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2009 22:10:52 -0700 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4964395C.5090807@cox.net> I picked up one of these a long while back at a local Goodwill. It came with a ribbon. I popped in some batteries, hooked it up to my CoCo 3 and it worked perfectly. I never found a source for ribbons - it is unlikely that you can find them anywhere today. I did find some other thermal ribbons (at Goodwill as well) that seemed the right width - I figured I might try to wind them on the original cartridge if/when it stops working. I doubt that will be anytime soon, as I only got the printer because it "looked lonely" and needed a home. :) Thank you for posting the site for the manual, Rogelio - I wasn't able to find a manual, and I wanted to try my hand at using it for graphics or something retro in that vein. This will help greatly, if I ever get around to it. Also - that site pointed to another site the same guy runs, for the Altair32 emulator! I own an Altair 8800 that at some point I need to do a complete restoration on (it has about a 1/2 inch of dirt collected in it, but I managed to get a ton of peripheral cards - unfortunately, it is missing its top cover, and the original company doesn't make that case anymore - so I plan on having a custom cover made when the time comes) - and that site had all the manuals and tons of other info that will make my job much easier (not that it is going to be easy by far). To many to-do's on my list... -- Andrew L. Ayers, Glendale, Arizona > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 06:33:43 -0500 > From: "Rogelio Perea" > Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Message-ID: > <5631e580901060333q4404a12dg4913f4d0b9635ed at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Found the User Manual at http://www.classiccmp.org/cini/systems.htm - Radio > Shack's support website had nothing on teh TRP-100 nor the ribbon cartridge. > The User Manual does not provide any reference onto the make of either the > printer or the ribbon cart. > > Will try to snoop out some lead from the hardware itself this evening. > > > > -=[ Rogelio ]=- > > > > On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Neil Morrison wrote: > >> Yes. All of the refills, both the cartridge and the refill rolls, say Made >> in Japan. No other hints as to maker however. Have you looked for a repair >> manual? >> >> Neil From dml_68 at yahoo.com Wed Jan 7 11:32:03 2009 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 08:32:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazine Index In-Reply-To: <49642C4A.3020704@gmail.com> Message-ID: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I have an 11 year index printed out but no scanner currently to get it from print to data. N8WQ wrote: Does anyone have a compiled index to Rainbow Magazine? Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** From exwn8jef at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 12:04:27 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 12:04:27 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazine Index In-Reply-To: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4964E09B.2060609@gmail.com> I have a scanner. If you could mail me a copy I could scan it and send it back to you. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Derek wrote: > I have an 11 year index printed out but no scanner currently to get it from print to data. > > > > > > N8WQ wrote: Does anyone have a compiled index to Rainbow Magazine? > > Alan Jones > > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 13:06:22 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 13:06:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Wed Jan 7 14:23:32 2009 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 17:23:32 -0200 Subject: [Coco] New programs for new CoCo possibilities In-Reply-To: References: <4952F10A.3080107@adinet.com.uy> Message-ID: <49650134.4010603@adinet.com.uy> James McKay wrote: > "Diego Barizo" wrote in > message news:4952F10A.3080107 at adinet.com.uy... > > > I'm working on a little game conversion, but as it's not an original title, > I doubt it can be entered into any competition. > http://www.indigobanquet.adsl24.co.uk/coco/deathchase/deathchase.htm > > bye, > James McKay. > Actually, that's OK. Clones and ports might not be 100% new, but they are new when it comes to the CoCo, and that's the goal. I did get some programs (thanks Jim and Fedor), and that might might get the Asimov awards to have a 2009 edition. All are available for download at http://yaccs.info/AA/aa2008_1.html Diego PS I remember playing that game in my friend's speccy. Wasn't there a very similar one with a title related to "Return of the Jedi"? From neilsmorr at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 15:22:50 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 12:22:50 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazine Index References: <889830d00901061412t2a7e77c0j2ef7a3bd912d0c0e@mail.gmail.com> <49642C4A.3020704@gmail.com> Message-ID: See http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/database Tables > Rainbow This is just the issues, not the contents. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" exwn8jef at gmail.com > Does anyone have a compiled index to Rainbow Magazine? > > Alan Jones From exwn8jef at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 17:49:11 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 17:49:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazine Index In-Reply-To: References: <889830d00901061412t2a7e77c0j2ef7a3bd912d0c0e@mail.gmail.com> <49642C4A.3020704@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49653167.2060502@gmail.com> Ok, thanks for pointing that out to me Neil. I have a box of Rainbow magazines that I can start going through myself if I don't hear from anyone. I can compile a partial index from what I have in stock. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Neil Morrison wrote: > See http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/database > > Tables > Rainbow > > This is just the issues, not the contents. > > Neil > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" exwn8jef at gmail.com > >> Does anyone have a compiled index to Rainbow Magazine? >> >> Alan Jones > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From neilsmorr at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 20:19:33 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 01:19:33 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] For sale or for free Message-ID: Under Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications on the website you will find two special applications to help you buy, sell or give away your Coco items. Try it out! Neil From exwn8jef at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 20:31:01 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 20:31:01 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] For sale or for free In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49655755.3050507@gmail.com> Hi Neil, Can you add a "Wanted" category? Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Neil Morrison wrote: > > Under Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications on the website you will find > two special applications to help you buy, sell or give away your Coco > items. Try it out! > > Neil > > From bookworm at cavenet.com Wed Jan 7 20:49:40 2009 From: bookworm at cavenet.com (Bookworm) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 01:49:40 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] hardware References: <1b52e6c80901031520pa2bfb8cn8662b51de37a1318@mail.gmail.com> <170280.5063.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1b52e6c80901031908s71ef0by21e5d8770a69ba0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=1718&highlight=#1718 I thought so. Amiga is made by Commodore, not Atari. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 21:26:57 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 02:26:57 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] For sale or for free In-Reply-To: <49655755.3050507@gmail.com> Message-ID: That's built in to both sections. Offered Wanted Taken Received Neil --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, N8WQ wrote: > > Hi Neil, > Can you add a "Wanted" category? > > Alan Jones From shadow at shadowgard.com Wed Jan 7 22:19:55 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 19:19:55 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] For sale or for free In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4965005B.28688.4822ED3@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 8 Jan 2009 at 1:19, Neil Morrison wrote: > Under Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications on the website you will find > two special applications to help you buy, sell or give away your Coco > items. Try it out! What's the url where this is? -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From sklammer at gmail.com Wed Jan 7 22:39:04 2009 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 22:39:04 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [COCO] MESS emulator updated to 0.129 (based upon MAME 0.129) Message-ID: <3925f0b0901071939s4d9ac250m8b4c0c147c1cdb18@mail.gmail.com> There are numerous other updates as well; but I've listed below the Coco specific ones... You may find the download links and read the full 'What's New' at http://www.mess.org/download.php - [COCO] Fixed Dragon Alpha, via MAME update, the NMI enable/disable allowing disks to boot again. [Phill Harvey-Smith] - [COCO] Minor cartridge loading code cleanups. [Nathan Woods] From brucewcalkins at charter.net Thu Jan 8 00:04:05 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 00:04:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] M$ XP & CoCo Emulators References: <3925f0b0901071939s4d9ac250m8b4c0c147c1cdb18@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6A30704C29A449A4A17AB9037C1F96CD@speedy> What works for emulating the CoCo of M$'s XP? I just got a neat little NetBook, so I can take it with me. From tjseagrove at writeme.com Thu Jan 8 00:14:08 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 00:14:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] M$ XP & CoCo Emulators In-Reply-To: <6A30704C29A449A4A17AB9037C1F96CD@speedy> References: <3925f0b0901071939s4d9ac250m8b4c0c147c1cdb18@mail.gmail.com> <6A30704C29A449A4A17AB9037C1F96CD@speedy> Message-ID: <001501c9714f$efbdacb0$cf390610$@com> I use VCC... http://vcc6809.bravehost.com/ Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 12:04 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] M$ XP & CoCo Emulators What works for emulating the CoCo of M$'s XP? I just got a neat little NetBook, so I can take it with me. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.4/1880 - Release Date: 1/7/2009 8:49 AM From petrander at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 02:19:46 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 08:19:46 +0100 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> Message-ID: I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! Cheers, Fedor On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: > Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 > Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? > > Alan Jones > > -- > N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > http://n8wq.blogspot.com > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 07:01:15 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 07:01:15 -0500 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> Hi Fedor, Thanks. I started to learn Forth a few years ago, but then put it on the back burner. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the > moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! > > Cheers, > Fedor > > > On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: > >> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 >> Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From petrander at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 07:37:52 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 13:37:52 +0100 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) Message-ID: Hi all, While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video equipment with a composite video input: http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf How cool is that!? It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if people are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the schematics in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included a CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and it worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, however, something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen and no sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every now and then when I try it, it works again. The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at least. I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That too once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand the schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected to what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more for anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected from the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. Cheers, Fedor From brucewcalkins at charter.net Thu Jan 8 08:49:07 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 08:49:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: Message-ID: <1A31B07D42C54D81888A06B13BE55070@speedy> > Hi all, > > While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from > Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I > discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for > the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video > equipment with a composite video input: > > http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf > > How cool is that!? > > It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if people > are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the schematics > in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! Yes I would like to see the english version of that. > Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included a > CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and > it > worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, > however, > something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen and > no > sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every > now > and then when I try it, it works again. This sounds like a loose connection, perhaps the power supply line. > > Cheers, > > Fedor Thanks, Bruce W. From petrander at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 09:18:07 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 15:18:07 +0100 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Alan, It is the darnest thing, but I cannot seem to find it among the manuals that I do have. I do believe I spotted it somewhere, but perhaps I was confusing it with Fortran77 of which I do have a manual. Maybe it is somewhere not directly accessible, but that may take a long while to come to the surface. I am sorry I cannot help you with this at the moment. Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/8 N8WQ > Hi Fedor, > Thanks. I started to learn Forth a few years ago, but then put it on the > back burner. > > Alan Jones > > -- > N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > http://n8wq.blogspot.com > > > > Fedor Steeman wrote: > >> I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the >> moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! >> >> Cheers, >> Fedor >> >> >> On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: >> >> >>> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 >>> Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? >>> >>> Alan Jones >>> >>> -- >>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 10:01:42 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 10:01:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> Hi Fedor, That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc board would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call "manhattan style" construction. Or we could translate the project to "through hole" components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. LOL The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. Alan Jones http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi all, > > While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from > Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I > discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for > the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video > equipment with a composite video input: > > http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf > > How cool is that!? > > It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if people > are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the schematics > in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! > > Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included a > CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and it > worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, however, > something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen and no > sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every now > and then when I try it, it works again. > > The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at least. > I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the > RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That too > once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand the > schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected to > what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more for > anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected from > the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. > > Cheers, > > Fedor > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 10:02:44 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 10:02:44 -0500 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49661594.8000602@gmail.com> No problem Fedor. I realize that there are not many copies floating around. LOL Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi Alan, > > It is the darnest thing, but I cannot seem to find it among the manuals that > I do have. I do believe I spotted it somewhere, but perhaps I was confusing > it with Fortran77 of which I do have a manual. > > Maybe it is somewhere not directly accessible, but that may take a long > while to come to the surface. I am sorry I cannot help you with this at the > moment. > > Cheers, > > Fedor > > 2009/1/8 N8WQ > > >> Hi Fedor, >> Thanks. I started to learn Forth a few years ago, but then put it on the >> back burner. >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> Fedor Steeman wrote: >> >> >>> I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the >>> moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Fedor >>> >>> >>> On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 >>>> Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? >>>> >>>> Alan Jones >>>> >>>> -- >>>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk Thu Jan 8 10:06:17 2009 From: jmckay at jmk1.freeserve.co.uk (James McKay) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 15:06:17 -0000 Subject: [Coco] New programs for new CoCo possibilities References: <4952F10A.3080107@adinet.com.uy> <49650134.4010603@adinet.com.uy> Message-ID: "Diego Barizo" wrote in message news:49650134.4010603 at adinet.com.uy... > Actually, that's OK. Clones and ports might not be 100% new, but they are > new when it comes to the CoCo, and that's the goal. > I did get some programs (thanks Jim and Fedor), and that might might get > the Asimov awards to have a 2009 edition. > All are available for download at http://yaccs.info/AA/aa2008_1.html > > PS I remember playing that game in my friend's speccy. Wasn't there a very > similar one with a title related to "Return of the Jedi"? I've seen screenshots of a similar looking game called Return of the Jeti (or Jet-I) on the Dragon, but I've not managed to get my hands on it to play it. From georgeramsower at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 10:23:36 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 09:23:36 -0600 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" > Hi Fedor, > That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc board > would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call > "manhattan style" construction. Or we could translate the project to > "through hole" components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. > LOL > The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. > > Alan Jones He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he built only has about three or four parts on it. Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the video that goes into the modulator. Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an installation guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no schematic of the actual ckt. George > > > > Fedor Steeman wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from >> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >> equipment with a composite video input: >> >> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >> >> How cool is that!? >> >> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >> people >> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >> schematics >> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >> >> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included >> a >> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and >> it >> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >> however, >> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen and >> no >> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every >> now >> and then when I try it, it works again. >> >> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >> least. >> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That >> too >> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand >> the >> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected >> to >> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more >> for >> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected from >> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Fedor >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 11:16:55 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 11:16:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> Message-ID: <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> Hi George, The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any surface mount components. LOL The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and one potentiometer. If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com George Ramsower wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" > >> Hi Fedor, >> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc >> board would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's >> call "manhattan style" construction. Or we could translate the >> project to "through hole" components. It would be nice to see the >> schematic though. LOL >> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >> >> Alan Jones > > He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he > built only has about three or four parts on it. > Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the > video that goes into the modulator. > Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an > installation guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no > schematic of the actual ckt. > > George >> >> >> >> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited >>> from >>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >>> equipment with a composite video input: >>> >>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>> >>> How cool is that!? >>> >>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>> people >>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>> schematics >>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>> >>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually >>> included a >>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it >>> and it >>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>> however, >>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black >>> screen and no >>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because >>> every now >>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>> >>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >>> least. >>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. >>> That too >>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me >>> understand the >>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be >>> connected to >>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few >>> more for >>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected >>> from >>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Fedor >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From tjseagrove at writeme.com Thu Jan 8 11:34:11 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 11:34:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: <49661594.8000602@gmail.com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> <49661594.8000602@gmail.com> Message-ID: <005201c971ae$f009c4b0$d01d4e10$@com> There is FORTH docs here... (Thanks Fedor!! :) ) http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of N8WQ Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 10:03 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 No problem Fedor. I realize that there are not many copies floating around. LOL Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi Alan, > > It is the darnest thing, but I cannot seem to find it among the manuals that > I do have. I do believe I spotted it somewhere, but perhaps I was confusing > it with Fortran77 of which I do have a manual. > > Maybe it is somewhere not directly accessible, but that may take a long > while to come to the surface. I am sorry I cannot help you with this at the > moment. > > Cheers, > > Fedor > > 2009/1/8 N8WQ > > >> Hi Fedor, >> Thanks. I started to learn Forth a few years ago, but then put it on the >> back burner. >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> Fedor Steeman wrote: >> >> >>> I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the >>> moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Fedor >>> >>> >>> On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 >>>> Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? >>>> >>>> Alan Jones >>>> >>>> -- >>>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.4/1880 - Release Date: 1/8/2009 8:13 AM From tjseagrove at writeme.com Thu Jan 8 11:45:10 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 11:45:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 In-Reply-To: <005201c971ae$f009c4b0$d01d4e10$@com> References: <775041.12641.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4964EF1E.6010408@gmail.com> <4965EB0B.9000706@gmail.com> <49661594.8000602@gmail.com> <005201c971ae$f009c4b0$d01d4e10$@com> Message-ID: <005e01c971b0$788b55f0$69a201d0$@com> Uh, never mind, my duh!! That is FLEX not FORTH. Well, they both had an "F" in it....... -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Tom Seagrove Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 11:34 AM To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' Subject: Re: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 There is FORTH docs here... (Thanks Fedor!! :) ) http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of N8WQ Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 10:03 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] COLORFORTH 1.1 No problem Fedor. I realize that there are not many copies floating around. LOL Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi Alan, > > It is the darnest thing, but I cannot seem to find it among the manuals that > I do have. I do believe I spotted it somewhere, but perhaps I was confusing > it with Fortran77 of which I do have a manual. > > Maybe it is somewhere not directly accessible, but that may take a long > while to come to the surface. I am sorry I cannot help you with this at the > moment. > > Cheers, > > Fedor > > 2009/1/8 N8WQ > > >> Hi Fedor, >> Thanks. I started to learn Forth a few years ago, but then put it on the >> back burner. >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> Fedor Steeman wrote: >> >> >>> I should have it in the pile of manuals I am scanning in at the >>> moment. I will try to find it and move it up the stack for you! >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Fedor >>> >>> >>> On 07/01/2009, N8WQ wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Does anyone know where I can get the documentation for COLORFORTH 1.1 >>>> Copyright 1981 TJZ & RJT ? >>>> >>>> Alan Jones >>>> >>>> -- >>>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.4/1880 - Release Date: 1/8/2009 8:13 AM -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.4/1880 - Release Date: 1/8/2009 8:13 AM From petrander at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 12:58:07 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 18:58:07 +0100 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, Well, there is definitely a little board to be added, but I do not know the technical jargon for this technique. Of the modified CoCo2 I possess that has this videomod, I added a range of pictures to my gallery on coco3.comfor the interested to peek at: http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1483 Cheers, Fedor PS: Nobody interested in the SCART connector? :-( 2009/1/8 N8WQ > Hi George, > The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any > surface mount components. LOL > The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and one > potentiometer. > If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." > He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. > > Alan Jones > > -- > N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > http://n8wq.blogspot.com > > > > George Ramsower wrote: > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" >> >> Hi Fedor, >>> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc board >>> would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call "manhattan >>> style" construction. Or we could translate the project to "through hole" >>> components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. LOL >>> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >>> >>> Alan Jones >>> >> >> He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he >> built only has about three or four parts on it. >> Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the video >> that goes into the modulator. >> Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an installation >> guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no schematic of the >> actual ckt. >> >> George >> >>> >>> >>> >>> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from >>>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >>>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >>>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >>>> equipment with a composite video input: >>>> >>>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>>> >>>> How cool is that!? >>>> >>>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>>> people >>>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>>> schematics >>>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>>> >>>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included >>>> a >>>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and >>>> it >>>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>>> however, >>>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen >>>> and no >>>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every >>>> now >>>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>>> >>>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >>>> least. >>>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >>>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That >>>> too >>>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand >>>> the >>>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected >>>> to >>>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more >>>> for >>>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected >>>> from >>>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Fedor >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From exwn8jef at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 13:27:15 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 13:27:15 -0500 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49664583.3020601@gmail.com> Hi Fedor, Your board is clearly a "through hole" project. I can see the 4 transistors, variable cap and potentiometer on the circuit board. That looks like a nice project for the CoCo. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi all, > Well, there is definitely a little board to be added, but I do not know the > technical jargon for this technique. Of the modified CoCo2 I possess that > has this videomod, I added a range of pictures to my gallery on > coco3.comfor the interested to peek at: > > http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1483 > > > Cheers, > Fedor > > PS: Nobody interested in the SCART connector? :-( > > 2009/1/8 N8WQ > > >> Hi George, >> The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any >> surface mount components. LOL >> The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and one >> potentiometer. >> If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." >> He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> George Ramsower wrote: >> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" >>> >>> Hi Fedor, >>> >>>> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc board >>>> would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call "manhattan >>>> style" construction. Or we could translate the project to "through hole" >>>> components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. LOL >>>> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >>>> >>>> Alan Jones >>>> >>>> >>> He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he >>> built only has about three or four parts on it. >>> Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the video >>> that goes into the modulator. >>> Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an installation >>> guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no schematic of the >>> actual ckt. >>> >>> George >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from >>>>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >>>>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >>>>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >>>>> equipment with a composite video input: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>>>> >>>>> How cool is that!? >>>>> >>>>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>>>> people >>>>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>>>> schematics >>>>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>>>> >>>>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included >>>>> a >>>>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and >>>>> it >>>>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>>>> however, >>>>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen >>>>> and no >>>>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every >>>>> now >>>>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>>>> >>>>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >>>>> least. >>>>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >>>>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That >>>>> too >>>>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand >>>>> the >>>>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected >>>>> to >>>>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more >>>>> for >>>>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected >>>>> from >>>>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Fedor >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From georgeramsower at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 19:45:52 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 18:45:52 -0600 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com><002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001001c971f3$a0823810$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> I should have looked more closely. Yup, your right. ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" > Hi George, > The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any > surface mount components. LOL > The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and one > potentiometer. > If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." > He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. > > Alan Jones > > -- > N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > http://n8wq.blogspot.com > > > > George Ramsower wrote: >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" >> >>> Hi Fedor, >>> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc >>> board would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's >>> call "manhattan style" construction. Or we could translate the >>> project to "through hole" components. It would be nice to see the >>> schematic though. LOL >>> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >>> >>> Alan Jones >> >> He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he >> built only has about three or four parts on it. >> Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the >> video that goes into the modulator. >> Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an >> installation guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no >> schematic of the actual ckt. >> >> George >>> >>> >>> >>> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited >>>> from >>>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >>>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >>>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >>>> equipment with a composite video input: >>>> >>>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>>> >>>> How cool is that!? >>>> >>>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>>> people >>>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>>> schematics >>>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>>> >>>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually >>>> included a >>>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it >>>> and it >>>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>>> however, >>>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black >>>> screen and no >>>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because >>>> every now >>>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>>> >>>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >>>> least. >>>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >>>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. >>>> That too >>>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me >>>> understand the >>>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be >>>> connected to >>>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few >>>> more for >>>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected >>>> from >>>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Fedor >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From georgeramsower at gmail.com Thu Jan 8 20:09:47 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 19:09:47 -0600 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> <49664583.3020601@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001b01c971f6$f79c29f0$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> http://sunpal7.mit.edu/6.111/mc6847/6847.pdf Here is the data sheet on the 6847. On the bottom of pp. 12 there is a sample ckt for connecting the MC1372 to a composite monitor. It only uses two transistors It's been many years since I connected a coco to a TV bypassing the RF circuitry. I'm pretty certain pin 12 was where I picked up the video. From there, I think I had one transistor to invert the signal and then injected in the video detection point on the B&W TV set. I do remember seeing pixels for the first time. The image was perfectly sharp. George ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 12:27 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) > Hi Fedor, > Your board is clearly a "through hole" project. > I can see the 4 transistors, variable cap and potentiometer on the circuit > board. > That looks like a nice project for the CoCo. > > Alan Jones > > -- > N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > http://n8wq.blogspot.com > > > > Fedor Steeman wrote: >> Hi all, >> Well, there is definitely a little board to be added, but I do not know >> the >> technical jargon for this technique. Of the modified CoCo2 I possess that >> has this videomod, I added a range of pictures to my gallery on >> coco3.comfor the interested to peek at: >> >> http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1483 >> >> >> Cheers, >> Fedor >> >> PS: Nobody interested in the SCART connector? :-( >> >> 2009/1/8 N8WQ >> >> >>> Hi George, >>> The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any >>> surface mount components. LOL >>> The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and one >>> potentiometer. >>> If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." >>> He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. >>> >>> Alan Jones >>> >>> -- >>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>> >>> >>> >>> George Ramsower wrote: >>> >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" >>>> >>>> Hi Fedor, >>>> >>>>> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc board >>>>> would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call >>>>> "manhattan >>>>> style" construction. Or we could translate the project to "through >>>>> hole" >>>>> components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. LOL >>>>> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >>>>> >>>>> Alan Jones >>>>> >>>>> >>>> He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The ckt he >>>> built only has about three or four parts on it. >>>> Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify the >>>> video >>>> that goes into the modulator. >>>> Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an >>>> installation >>>> guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no schematic of >>>> the >>>> actual ckt. >>>> >>>> George >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>> >>>>>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited >>>>>> from >>>>>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I >>>>>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for >>>>>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video >>>>>> equipment with a composite video input: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> How cool is that!? >>>>>> >>>>>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>>>>> people >>>>>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>>>>> schematics >>>>>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>>>>> >>>>>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually >>>>>> included >>>>>> a >>>>>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it >>>>>> and >>>>>> it >>>>>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>>>>> however, >>>>>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen >>>>>> and no >>>>>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because >>>>>> every >>>>>> now >>>>>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>>>>> >>>>>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at >>>>>> least. >>>>>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the >>>>>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. >>>>>> That >>>>>> too >>>>>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me >>>>>> understand >>>>>> the >>>>>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be >>>>>> connected >>>>>> to >>>>>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few >>>>>> more >>>>>> for >>>>>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected >>>>>> from >>>>>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> >>>>>> Fedor >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tonypodraza at juno.com Thu Jan 8 20:40:07 2009 From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 01:40:07 GMT Subject: [Coco] 18th Annual "Last" Chicago CoCoFEST! Message-ID: <20090108.194007.5248.0@webmail20.vgs.untd.com> Fellow CoCoists; Tonight's meeting of the Glenside Color Computer Club, Inc will be folding and stuffing the Applications for an Exhibit for the 18th Annual "Last" Chicago CoCoFEST! into envelopes. If you would like to receive a digital copy of the application, please contact me at tonypodraza at juno.com or tonypodraza at gmail.com and I will forward a copy of same. In the meantime, we will be sending out approximately 40 snailmail copies, tomorrow to former exhibitors. The dates for the FEST! are March 28th and 29, 2009. See you there! Tony Podraza By the Way, the website had to be moved due to the abrupt shut-down of AOL's Hometown. Here's the new URL: http://ncmedals.com/glenside/index.html ____________________________________________________________ Click to get Medical Insurance options that meet your needs. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/PnY6rw2PZXdLqK5v3EheSqrW7acSDD3aRuzvaiCHJi84NAb9SSKvn/ From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 8 21:11:16 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 20:11:16 -0600 Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay Message-ID: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> http://cgi.ebay.com/SVD-Floppy-Emulator-Heathkit-TRS-80-Apple-II-TI99-4A_W0QQitemZ270325488979QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item270325488979&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A15|39%3A1|240%3A1318 Someone claims to have taken the PCB layout for the SVD and had their own boards made and is selling them on Ebay. It sure is a lot of gadgetry to do what both DriveWire and CoCoNet will do from just software and a serial cable. :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 8 21:42:36 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 20:42:36 -0600 Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay In-Reply-To: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090109024253.49D4E20A14@qs281.pair.com> At 08:11 PM 1/8/2009, you wrote: >http://cgi.ebay.com/SVD-Floppy-Emulator-Heathkit-TRS-80-Apple-II-TI99-4A_W0QQitemZ270325488979QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item270325488979&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A15|39%3A1|240%3A1318 > >Someone claims to have taken the PCB layout for the SVD and had >their own boards made and is selling them on Ebay. >It sure is a lot of gadgetry to do what both DriveWire and CoCoNet >will do from just software and a serial cable. :) >-- >Roger Taylor Subclause: some disk software having custom low-level floppy routines will need a controller. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 8 21:45:58 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 18:45:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay References: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <66639.5752.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Yes, I had noticed this guys auctions and almost considered buying one, but I got to thinking that the SVD circuitry could be modified so as to see some sort of flash card as a floppy, and so that's what I have been thinking of emailing the svd designer to ask if he has considered. I know we can use CF cards as hard drives with Mark M's Interface, but I think it would be neat to have a CF that looked to a floppy controller as if it were a floppy drive. Then plain old unmodified disk basic could handle it. ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: cocolist for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 8:11:16 PM Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay http://cgi.ebay.com/SVD-Floppy-Emulator-Heathkit-TRS-80-Apple-II-TI99-4A_W0QQitemZ270325488979QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item270325488979&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A15|39%3A1|240%3A1318 Someone claims to have taken the PCB layout for the SVD and had their own boards made and is selling them on Ebay. It sure is a lot of gadgetry to do what both DriveWire and CoCoNet will do from just software and a serial cable. :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 8 21:51:39 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 18:51:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer References: <5631e580901050805n78f17293j9cd55b6e4c32ebdb@mail.gmail.com> <9B79156CE9054800837433875F6FB3F7@NewBaby> <5631e580901060333q4404a12dg4913f4d0b9635ed@mail.gmail.com> <3925f0b0901061022h152e0445o891a012774539811@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <339333.22566.qm@web111204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I've just been using plain old thermal fax paper with mine - 99 cents for three rolls at a local junk store - of couse the ribbon would probably let me use plain paper... ________________________________ From: Shain Klammer To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Tuesday, January 6, 2009 12:22:55 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer Suggestion (may be more work than it is worth), pickup one of the ribbon reels used in thermal fax machines and cut a strip to wind into an existing cartridge... 2009/1/6 Rogelio Perea > Found the User Manual at http://www.classiccmp.org/cini/systems.htm - > Radio > Shack's support website had nothing on teh TRP-100 nor the ribbon > cartridge. > The User Manual does not provide any reference onto the make of either the > printer or the ribbon cart. > > Will try to snoop out some lead from the hardware itself this evening. > > > > -=[ Rogelio ]=- > > > > On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Neil Morrison wrote: > > > Yes. All of the refills, both the cartridge and the refill rolls, say > Made > > in Japan. No other hints as to maker however. Have you looked for a > repair > > manual? > > > > Neil > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rogelio Perea" > > > > > > Been searching the web for replacement ribbon cartridges for this > printer. > >> While it prints on thermal paper with no problems., I'd like to try it > >> with > >> thee ribbon cart on plain paper. > >> > >> Haven't found any cross reference as to who actually made the printer > >> engine > >> that Radio Shack used for the TRP-100 (will try prying inside the > hardware > >> this evening), sometimes that would yield better results at getting an > OEM > >> part than trying under the RS banner (or their catalog number for that > >> matter). > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 8 21:53:19 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 21:53:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay In-Reply-To: <66639.5752.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> <66639.5752.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200901082153.19574.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 08 January 2009, John Eric wrote: >Yes, I had noticed this guys auctions and almost considered buying one, but > I got to thinking that the SVD circuitry could be modified so as to see > some sort of flash card as a floppy, and so that's what I have been > thinking of emailing the svd designer to ask if he has considered. I know > we can use CF cards as hard drives with Mark M's Interface, but I think it > would be neat to have a CF that looked to a floppy controller as if it were > a floppy drive. Then plain old unmodified disk basic could handle it. > Have you considered that the smallest CF card one can buy today (256 megs) will hold about 300 720k dsdd floppy images? One would have to have some sort of a selector switch on it to select the image to be accessed. OTOH, it would seem to be a somewhat smaller solution to storing a few hundred floppies -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) IBM: It may be slow, but it's hard to use. From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 8 22:03:45 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 19:03:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] SVD on Ebay References: <20090109021133.E0A9220A13@qs281.pair.com> <66639.5752.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <200901082153.19574.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <485069.69298.qm@web111212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> yeah - i just thought it would be cool - if we had some sort of solid state floppy with removeable storage, one in the pc/mac - one in the coco - error free images - of course coconet looks good too :) ________________________________ From: Gene Heskett To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 8:53:19 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] SVD on Ebay On Thursday 08 January 2009, John Eric wrote: >Yes, I had noticed this guys auctions and almost considered buying one, but > I got to thinking that the SVD circuitry could be modified so as to see > some sort of flash card as a floppy, and so that's what I have been > thinking of emailing the svd designer to ask if he has considered. I know > we can use CF cards as hard drives with Mark M's Interface, but I think it > would be neat to have a CF that looked to a floppy controller as if it were > a floppy drive. Then plain old unmodified disk basic could handle it. > Have you considered that the smallest CF card one can buy today (256 megs) will hold about 300 720k dsdd floppy images? One would have to have some sort of a selector switch on it to select the image to be accessed. OTOH, it would seem to be a somewhat smaller solution to storing a few hundred floppies -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) IBM: It may be slow, but it's hard to use. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From wdg3rd at comcast.net Fri Jan 9 00:09:51 2009 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 05:09:51 +0000 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer Message-ID: <010920090509.1827.4966DC1F0007609F0000072322073007930B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> From: John Eric > I've just been using plain old thermal fax paper with mine - 99 cents for three > rolls at a local junk store - of couse the ribbon would probably let me use > plain paper... Any printouts you make on thermal paper, if you want to preserve them, remember to make copies with a regular plain-paper copier at your earliest convenience. Yes, it means you may have to have to cut it into short strips that you have to keep together with paper clips, in the case of output from the TRP-100. But thermal printouts are transient. I lost three months work due to leaving a roll of TI-700 output in my car. In August in Las Vegas. The background became the foreground darkness. Stuff that would have advanced AI by 20 years (well, looking at recent progress in AI, maybe 40). That was back in 1979, but thermal paper technology has not advanced much since then. (Nor has AI, though Real Stupidity has made great gains, judging by the last several decades of US, European, Asian and every else politics and economics). Nah, I'm just fooling. I'd managed a great (at the time) fusion of two of the best bits from David Ahl's "BASIC Computer Games", Eliza and Animals (translated to HP-2000A BASIC [crappy string functions, great array functions], since that's what I had to work with before I got my first TRS-80, a couple of years before the Color Computer). I should try it again (probably in Python, since that's what I'm learning now, though I'm not dropping the Bourne shell & descendants). Didn't even bother remembering it during the several years without disk storage, and got busy for a while after anyway. In fact, mention of thermal paper is what dragged it out of long-term storage covered with long-dead brain cells. But do back up thermal to plain paper if you want your data to last. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 00:44:29 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 21:44:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer References: <010920090509.1827.4966DC1F0007609F0000072322073007930B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <595509.39024.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I think you may be confusing the TP10 with the TRP-100. The TP10 was meant to accompany the MC10 and the combo, I believe was the TRS answer to the Sinclair ZX81 (TS-1000) and the ZX-Printer (TS-2040). It used approx 4" wide paper. It also worked with the regular CoCo. It had a design flaw in that the graphics characters were the inverse of what would be displayed on the CoCo and MC-10. The TRP-100 is a full 8x10-ish printer that could print on thermal paper or use a thermal ribbon to print on plain paper (although, sometimes the print wouldn't stick just right to some papers.) However, the main thing you mentioned is in fact the bane of thermal printing - I folded a piece of thermal paper and put it in my jacket pocket - my body heat darkened the paper to a darker color than the print, so... for all intents and purposes, it was erased. sigh.. but it's still the cheapest method I've found to use for debugging ASM listings. BTW - anyone still sell DMP-105 ribbons? JEric ________________________________ From: "wdg3rd at comcast.net" To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 11:09:51 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer From: John Eric > I've just been using plain old thermal fax paper with mine - 99 cents for three > rolls at a local junk store - of couse the ribbon would probably let me use > plain paper... Any printouts you make on thermal paper, if you want to preserve them, remember to make copies with a regular plain-paper copier at your earliest convenience. Yes, it means you may have to have to cut it into short strips that you have to keep together with paper clips, in the case of output from the TRP-100. But thermal printouts are transient. I lost three months work due to leaving a roll of TI-700 output in my car. In August in Las Vegas. The background became the foreground darkness. Stuff that would have advanced AI by 20 years (well, looking at recent progress in AI, maybe 40). That was back in 1979, but thermal paper technology has not advanced much since then. (Nor has AI, though Real Stupidity has made great gains, judging by the last several decades of US, European, Asian and every else politics and economics). Nah, I'm just fooling. I'd managed a great (at the time) fusion of two of the best bits from David Ahl's "BASIC Computer Games", Eliza and Animals (translated to HP-2000A BASIC [crappy string functions, great array functions], since that's what I had to work with before I got my first TRS-80, a couple of years before the Color Computer). I should try it again (probably in Python, since that's what I'm learning now, though I'm not dropping the Bourne shell & descendants). Didn't even bother remembering it during the several years without disk storage, and got busy for a while after anyway. In fact, mention of thermal paper is what dragged it out of long-term storage covered with long-dead brain cells. But do back up thermal to plain paper if you want your data to last. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Fri Jan 9 03:11:30 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 08:11:30 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] pdf magazines Message-ID: dones anyone know if any us rainbow magazines have been scanned to pdf??? how about us hot coco magazines?? or 80 micro magazines??? i have a ton of these and many are complete years and im toying with putting them on ebay so some one can buy them and scan away. i dont have the time for it unfortunately for a bit of a preview, have alook here http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=834 thanks From wdg3rd at comcast.net Fri Jan 9 05:48:39 2009 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 10:48:39 +0000 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer Message-ID: <010920091048.10391.49672B87000A1A800000289722135285730B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Apparently, Computer Friends in Oregon still sells the MacInker. Whether they still have an adapter that works with the DMP-100 ribbon may require a phone call. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: John Eric > I think you may be confusing the TP10 with the TRP-100. The TP10 was meant to > accompany the MC10 and the combo, I believe was the TRS answer to the Sinclair > ZX81 (TS-1000) and the ZX-Printer (TS-2040). It used approx 4" wide paper. It > also worked with the regular CoCo. It had a design flaw in that the graphics > characters were the inverse of what would be displayed on the CoCo and MC-10. > The TRP-100 is a full 8x10-ish printer that could print on thermal paper or use > a thermal ribbon to print on plain paper (although, sometimes the print wouldn't > stick just right to some papers.) However, the main thing you mentioned is in > fact the bane of thermal printing - I folded a piece of thermal paper and put it > in my jacket pocket - my body heat darkened the paper to a darker color than the > print, so... for all intents and purposes, it was erased. sigh.. but it's still > the cheapest method I've found to use for debugging ASM listings. BTW - anyone > still sell DMP-105 > ribbons? JEric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: "wdg3rd at comcast.net" > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 11:09:51 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer > > From: John Eric > > I've just been using plain old thermal fax paper with mine - 99 cents for > three > > rolls at a local junk store - of couse the ribbon would probably let me use > > plain paper... > > Any printouts you make on thermal paper, if you want to preserve them, remember > to make copies with a regular plain-paper copier at your earliest convenience. > Yes, it means you may have to have to cut it into short strips that you have to > keep together with paper clips, in the case of output from the TRP-100. But > thermal printouts are transient. I lost three months work due to leaving a roll > of TI-700 output in my car. In August in Las Vegas. The background became the > foreground darkness. Stuff that would have advanced AI by 20 years (well, > looking at recent progress in AI, maybe 40). That was back in 1979, but thermal > paper technology has not advanced much since then. (Nor has AI, though Real > Stupidity has made great gains, judging by the last several decades of US, > European, Asian and every else politics and economics). > > Nah, I'm just fooling. I'd managed a great (at the time) fusion of two of the > best bits from David Ahl's "BASIC Computer Games", Eliza and Animals (translated > to HP-2000A BASIC [crappy string functions, great array functions], since that's > what I had to work with before I got my first TRS-80, a couple of years before > the Color Computer). I should try it again (probably in Python, since that's > what I'm learning now, though I'm not dropping the Bourne shell & descendants). > Didn't even bother remembering it during the several years without disk storage, > and got busy for a while after anyway. In fact, mention of thermal paper is > what dragged it out of long-term storage covered with long-dead brain cells. > But do back up thermal to plain paper if you want your data to last. > -- > Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net > > I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I > was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on > autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". > Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 07:51:52 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 07:51:52 -0500 Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: <001b01c971f6$f79c29f0$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> References: <49661556.1050102@gmail.com> <002a01c971a5$14530f20$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> <496626F7.4080905@gmail.com> <49664583.3020601@gmail.com> <001b01c971f6$f79c29f0$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> Message-ID: <49674868.2020805@gmail.com> Hi George, Thanks for sharing that document. I will try that composite circuit and see how it works. It looks like the same circuit I built back in the mid 80's on a CoCo 2. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com George Ramsower wrote: > http://sunpal7.mit.edu/6.111/mc6847/6847.pdf > Here is the data sheet on the 6847. On the bottom of pp. 12 there is a > sample ckt for connecting the MC1372 to a composite monitor. It only > uses two transistors > It's been many years since I connected a coco to a TV bypassing the RF > circuitry. I'm pretty certain pin 12 was where I picked up the video. > From there, I think I had one transistor to invert the signal and then > injected in the video detection point on the B&W TV set. I do remember > seeing pixels for the first time. The image was perfectly sharp. > > George > ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 12:27 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) > > >> Hi Fedor, >> Your board is clearly a "through hole" project. >> I can see the 4 transistors, variable cap and potentiometer on the >> circuit board. >> That looks like a nice project for the CoCo. >> >> Alan Jones >> >> -- >> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >> >> >> >> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> Well, there is definitely a little board to be added, but I do not >>> know the >>> technical jargon for this technique. Of the modified CoCo2 I possess >>> that >>> has this videomod, I added a range of pictures to my gallery on >>> coco3.comfor the interested to peek at: >>> >>> http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1483 >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Fedor >>> >>> PS: Nobody interested in the SCART connector? :-( >>> >>> 2009/1/8 N8WQ >>> >>> >>>> Hi George, >>>> The last time I looked the Color Computer (1, 2, or 3) didn't have any >>>> surface mount components. LOL >>>> The circuit has 22 parts, which includes one variable capacitor and >>>> one >>>> potentiometer. >>>> If you look on page one you can read "SMD technick." >>>> He clearly shows the circuit raised on top of the rf video modulator. >>>> >>>> Alan Jones >>>> >>>> -- >>>> N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio >>>> http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home >>>> http://n8wq.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> George Ramsower wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "N8WQ" >>>>> >>>>> Hi Fedor, >>>>> >>>>>> That looks like a SMT (surface mount) component layout. A SMT pc >>>>>> board >>>>>> would have to be made or you could use what us home brewer's call >>>>>> "manhattan >>>>>> style" construction. Or we could translate the project to >>>>>> "through hole" >>>>>> components. It would be nice to see the schematic though. LOL >>>>>> The BSR14 is a NPN general purpose amplifier. >>>>>> >>>>>> Alan Jones >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> He's showing where on the RF modulator to make connections. The >>>>> ckt he >>>>> built only has about three or four parts on it. >>>>> Usually this mod only require a transistor to invert and amplify >>>>> the video >>>>> that goes into the modulator. >>>>> Although I can't read what he's said, it looks to me to be an >>>>> installation >>>>> guide for the little ckt. This is probably why there's no >>>>> schematic of the >>>>> actual ckt. >>>>> >>>>> George >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Fedor Steeman wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I >>>>>>> inherited from >>>>>>> Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional >>>>>>> coordinator, I >>>>>>> discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer >>>>>>> mod for >>>>>>> the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or >>>>>>> video >>>>>>> equipment with a composite video input: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> How cool is that!? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if >>>>>>> people >>>>>>> are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the >>>>>>> schematics >>>>>>> in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually >>>>>>> included >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first >>>>>>> discovered it and >>>>>>> it >>>>>>> worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, >>>>>>> however, >>>>>>> something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black >>>>>>> screen >>>>>>> and no >>>>>>> sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, >>>>>>> because every >>>>>>> now >>>>>>> and then when I try it, it works again. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( >>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in >>>>>>> Europe at >>>>>>> least. >>>>>>> I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook >>>>>>> up the >>>>>>> RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart >>>>>>> input. That >>>>>>> too >>>>>>> once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me >>>>>>> understand >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be >>>>>>> connected >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a >>>>>>> few more >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be >>>>>>> connected >>>>>>> from >>>>>>> the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Fedor >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Coco mailing list >>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Coco mailing list >>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From petrander at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 12:59:15 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 18:59:15 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! Message-ID: Hi all, For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" and two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number jumpers. Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set up with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on the appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning for no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what I am doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly appreciated. I still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. Cheers, Fedor From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 13:25:00 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 13:25:00 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901091325.00887.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: >Hi all, > >For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" and >two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and >different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number jumpers. > >Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the >(loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set up >with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on the >appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, >whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning for >no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. >Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. > >Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have >something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what I am >doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly appreciated. I >still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. > >Cheers, >Fedor 1. If you have accidentally used an pc style twisted cable this time it could be a possible explanation. Sometimes removing the connector from the cable and crimping it back on 1/4" away is needed. In any event, give the cable an end to end continuity test while flexing the connectors a bit. Its rare, but I have seen broken conductors. Also look at the cutoff ends of the cable where they are cut flush with the side of the connector body of the two end connectors to make sure there are no inter-wire shorts because a dull cutter was used and the wires 'smeared' as they were cut. I have one cable, about 7 feet long, that I made up several years ago, which has both a set of fully populated edge connectors crimped onto it, and also has the standard IDC header connectors crimped on adjacent to the card edge connectors so I can plug any drive in anyplace. On the 5.25" drives its usually pretty simple to tell them what drive they are, but with the 3.5" drives one often has to grab a meter and trace of the pcb, cutting and bridging traces to make them something other than the default drive 1. But it can be done. Be sure and mark the drive with its drive number in that case. Good luck. >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Play Rogue, visit exotic locations, meet strange creatures and kill them. From mechacoco at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 13:35:07 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 11:35:07 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5d802cd0901091035y2709d9f6t46f32a8aabfa6367@mail.gmail.com> On 1/9/09, Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi all, > > For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" and > two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and > different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number jumpers. > > Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the > (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set up > with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on the > appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, > whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning for > no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. > Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. > > Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have > something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what I am > doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly appreciated. I > still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. > > Cheers, > Fedor ---- Does the cable have any connectors with "pulled teeth"? If so, these will determine the allowed drive number for each position. Termination could also be a problem. Only the last drive on the cable (farthest from the CoCo) should have terminating resistors. Most 5.25 inch drives have a way to enable/disable termination, but very few 3.5 inch drives do. The usual choice is to disable termination on the 5..25 inch drive and put the 3.5 inch drive in the last position on the cable. Of course there is also the possibility that either the cable or the controller is faulty. Darren From brucewcalkins at charter.net Fri Jan 9 13:35:50 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 13:35:50 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! References: Message-ID: A connector on your cable is on backwards or plugged in to the drive or controller backwards. Bruce W. > Hi all, > > For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" and > two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and > different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number > jumpers. > > Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the > (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set up > with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on > the > appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, > whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning for > no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. > Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. > > Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have > something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what I > am > doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly appreciated. > I > still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. > > Cheers, > Fedor From neilsmorr at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 13:39:07 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 10:39:07 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Google Book Archives Message-ID: <65436580A4144473A6B5005159E9EE22@NewBaby> See this link for a full rundown: http://books.google.com/googlebooks/agreement/ The Future of Google Book Search Our groundbreaking agreement with authors and publishers. Three years ago, the Authors Guild, the Association of American Publishers and a handful of authors and publishers filed a class action lawsuit against Google Book Search. Today we're delighted to announce that we've settled that lawsuit and will be working closely with these industry partners to bring even more of the world's books online. Together we'll accomplish far more than any of us could have individually, to the enduring benefit of authors, publishers, researchers and readers alike. It will take some time for this agreement to be approved and finalized by the Court. Right now, you can search over the full text of some seven million books through Google Book Search. The Library Project We've partnered with renowned libraries around the world to include their collections in Book Search. For Library Project books that are still in copyright, our results are like a card catalog; we show you info about the book and, generally, a few snippets of text showing your search term in context. For Library Project books that are out of copyright, however, you can read and download the entire book. This agreement will allow us to make many of these out-of-print books available for preview, reading and purchase in the U.S.. Helping to ensure the ongoing accessibility of out-of-print books is one of the primary reasons we began this project in the first place, and we couldn't be happier that we and our author, library and publishing partners will now be able to protect mankind's cultural history in this manner. Three types of books This agreement helps define how our users may access different categories of books on Google Book Search. 1.. In-copyright and in-print books In-print books are books that publishers are still actively selling, the ones you see at most bookstores. This agreement expands the online marketplace for in-print books by letting authors and publishers turn on the "preview" and "purchase" models that make their titles more easily available through Book Search. 2.. In-copyright but out-of-print books Out-of-print books aren?t actively being published or sold, so the only way to procure one is to track it down in a library or used bookstore. When this agreement is approved, every out-of-print book that we digitize will become available online for preview and purchase, unless its author or publisher chooses to "turn off" that title. We believe it will be a tremendous boon to the publishing industry to enable authors and publishers to earn money from volumes they might have thought were gone forever from the marketplace. 3.. Out-of-copyright books This agreement doesn't affect how we display out-of-copyright books; we will continue to allow Book Search users to read, download and print these titles, just as we do today. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 14:17:05 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 14:17:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: >A connector on your cable is on backwards or plugged in to the drive or >controller backwards. > >Bruce W. > Ah yes, and the most obvious problem given the description. But I have faith in my fellow man, and had falsely assumed that was done correctly so I jumped to other miss-configured hardware issues. My bad. Thanks Bruce, for the reminder about the glaringly obvious. And I have egg on my face. Again... >> Hi all, >> >> For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" and >> two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and >> different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number >> jumpers. >> >> Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the >> (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set up >> with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on >> the >> appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, >> whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning for >> no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. >> Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. >> >> Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have >> something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what I >> am >> doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly appreciated. >> I >> still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. >> >> Cheers, >> Fedor > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) There are new messages. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 14:20:14 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 14:20:14 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Google Book Archives In-Reply-To: <65436580A4144473A6B5005159E9EE22@NewBaby> References: <65436580A4144473A6B5005159E9EE22@NewBaby> Message-ID: <200901091420.15035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, Neil Morrison wrote: >See this link for a full rundown: > >http://books.google.com/googlebooks/agreement/ > >The Future of Google Book Search >Our groundbreaking agreement with authors and publishers. > > >Three years ago, the Authors Guild, the Association of American Publishers > and a handful of authors and publishers filed a class action lawsuit > against Google Book Search. > >Today we're delighted to announce that we've settled that lawsuit and will > be working closely with these industry partners to bring even more of the > world's books online. Together we'll accomplish far more than any of us > could have individually, to the enduring benefit of authors, publishers, > researchers and readers alike. > >It will take some time for this agreement to be approved and finalized by > the Court. > >Right now, you can search over the full text of some seven million books > through Google Book Search. > >The Library Project >We've partnered with renowned libraries around the world to include their > collections in Book Search. For Library Project books that are still in > copyright, our results are like a card catalog; we show you info about the > book and, generally, a few snippets of text showing your search term in > context. > >For Library Project books that are out of copyright, however, you can read > and download the entire book. > >This agreement will allow us to make many of these out-of-print books > available for preview, reading and purchase in the U.S.. Helping to ensure > the ongoing accessibility of out-of-print books is one of the primary > reasons we began this project in the first place, and we couldn't be > happier that we and our author, library and publishing partners will now be > able to protect mankind's cultural history in this manner. > >Three types of books >This agreement helps define how our users may access different categories of > books on Google Book Search. > > 1.. In-copyright and in-print books > In-print books are books that publishers are still actively selling, the > ones you see at most bookstores. This agreement expands the online > marketplace for in-print books by letting authors and publishers turn on > the "preview" and "purchase" models that make their titles more easily > available through Book Search. > > 2.. In-copyright but out-of-print books > Out-of-print books aren?t actively being published or sold, so the only > way to procure one is to track it down in a library or used bookstore. When > this agreement is approved, every out-of-print book that we digitize will > become available online for preview and purchase, unless its author or > publisher chooses to "turn off" that title. We believe it will be a > tremendous boon to the publishing industry to enable authors and publishers > to earn money from volumes they might have thought were gone forever from > the marketplace. > > 3.. Out-of-copyright books > This agreement doesn't affect how we display out-of-copyright books; we > will continue to allow Book Search users to read, download and print these > titles, just as we do today. This needs to be accepted by the courts asap. If not yesterday. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Alexander Hamilton started the U.S. Treasury with nothing - and that was the closest our country has ever been to being even. -- The Best of Will Rogers From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 16:13:16 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 13:13:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 Message-ID: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Recently, I acquired a CoCo 3 that had been killed by it's previous owner. An apparent attempt at repairing the CoCo 3 by replacing I.C.'s at random resulted in the destruction of many PCB traces. The actual problem with the CoCo 3 was relatively simple and I'll point that out in a moment, but first, I had to reconstruct the damaged circuit traces.After a few hours with the CoCo 3 Schematic, a notebook and an Ohmeter, I had ascertained all traces that needed to be reconstructed. I began by desoldering every I.C. left on the board that didn't have sockets and replaced them with sockets and plugged those I.C.'s back in (a step that wasn't needed, but I wanted to socket all the chips to make future repairs and experiments simpler.) Next, I took my notes and some kynar wire-wrap wire and repaired all of the damaged traces as noted with the help of the Ohmeter, and I then placed sockets where those I.C.'s went and plugged them back in, except for the CPU which I replaced with a 63B09E. Since this board has the 1986 G.I.M.E., I went ahead and replaced the capacitor C64 with a quality WIMA 220pf capacitor, although this probably wasn't necessary. I then plugged the Performance Peripherals 512K Memory Board Back in, hooked everything up and turned it on. It didn't work, of course, because the original problem that caused the previous owner to destroy the board in the first place must still exist. What was that problem? Well, quite simply, the GIME only needed re-seating in it's socket - I took it out, cleaned the pins and socket contacts plugged it back in and voila - working CoCo 3 512k fully socketed chipset :) I did notice that with the 512K upgrade, the CoCo 3 gets HOT. In an attempt to alleviate this, I replaced all of the logic I.C.'s with 74HC parts, except for the 74LS245 which I replaced with a 74HCT245. I will probably replace the 245 with an F245 later. So now, I have a CMOS CPU, High Speed CMOS logic, so why not replace the PIA's? Well, I replaced the 68B21 with a W65C21 CMOS PIA, but I left the custom keyboard PIA in there, because even though it functions like a 68b21/65c21, it is an Open-Collector Device, with internal pull-ups, for the purpose of making the keyboard more reliable (the membrane in a CoCo 3 keyboard tends to increase in resistance as it is used and this PIA counters that). Eventually I will replace this PIA with a 65c21, some open collector buffers w/pull-up resistors on a small board that plugs into the socket, just as a test. I'm just having fun - the CoCo is my new Hobby - all my friends are playing Guild Wars, I'd rather be soldering :) My next project will be a 512k upgrade card that intercepts the GIME 256 cycle refresh and converts it to a 512 cycle refresh so that I can use the 256Kx4 DRAM chips in my junk box to make a cooler running 512k upgrade. A small CPLD and 4 RAM chips will make up the complete board. So, this brings to mind, a question: Where is a good free webpage that I can set up to bring these projects to you all? Many Thanks - JEric From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 16:33:13 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 16:33:13 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, John Eric wrote: >Recently, I acquired a CoCo 3 that had been killed by it's previous owner. > An apparent attempt at repairing the CoCo 3 by replacing I.C.'s at random > resulted in the destruction of many PCB traces. The actual problem with the > CoCo 3 was relatively simple and I'll point that out in a moment, but > first, I had to reconstruct the damaged circuit traces.After a few hours > with the CoCo 3 Schematic, a notebook and an Ohmeter, I had ascertained all > traces that needed to be reconstructed. I began by desoldering every I.C. > left on the board that didn't have sockets and replaced them with sockets > and plugged those I.C.'s back in (a step that wasn't needed, but I wanted > to socket all the chips to make future repairs and experiments simpler.) > Next, I took my notes and some kynar wire-wrap wire and repaired all of the > damaged traces as noted with the help of the Ohmeter, and I then placed > sockets where those I.C.'s went and plugged them back in, except for the > CPU which I replaced with a 63B09E. Since this board has the 1986 G.I.M.E., > I went ahead and replaced the capacitor C64 with a quality WIMA 220pf > capacitor, although this probably wasn't necessary. I then plugged the > Performance Peripherals 512K Memory Board Back in, hooked everything up and > turned it on. It didn't work, of course, because the original problem that > caused the previous owner to destroy the board in the first place must > still exist. What was that problem? Well, quite simply, the GIME only > needed re-seating in it's socket - I took it out, cleaned the pins and > socket contacts plugged it back in and voila - working CoCo 3 512k fully > socketed chipset :) > >I did notice that with the 512K upgrade, the CoCo 3 gets HOT. 95% of that heat comes from the transformer and the pass transistor, the one on the big u-channel heat sink. So I excised all that stuff and stuck a 4 pin trailer connector out the back panel and hooked it up to an AT style pc psu. With a 63C09 in the cpu socket, and a disto 2 meg memory kit with cmos dimms in it sitting in the memory socket, I can lay a photo thermometer on the grill above the memory, throw a furniture blanket over that and walk away for a couple of days. When I do check, the thermometer is up maybe 2 degrees F over room. I doubt my coco is using more than 2 watts now. >In an attempt > to alleviate this, I replaced all of the logic I.C.'s with 74HC parts, > except for the 74LS245 which I replaced with a 74HCT245. I will probably > replace the 245 with an F245 later. So now, I have a CMOS CPU, High Speed > CMOS logic, so why not replace the PIA's? Well, I replaced the 68B21 with a > W65C21 CMOS PIA, but I left the custom keyboard PIA in there, because even > though it functions like a 68b21/65c21, it is an Open-Collector Device, > with internal pull-ups, for the purpose of making the keyboard more > reliable (the membrane in a CoCo 3 keyboard tends to increase in resistance > as it is used and this PIA counters that). Eventually I will replace this > PIA with a 65c21, some open collector buffers w/pull-up resistors on a > small board that plugs into the socket, just as a test. I'm just having fun > - the CoCo is my new Hobby - all my friends are playing Guild Wars, I'd > rather be soldering :) > >My next project will be a 512k upgrade card that intercepts the GIME 256 > cycle refresh and converts it to a 512 cycle refresh so that I can use the > 256Kx4 DRAM chips in my junk box to make a cooler running 512k upgrade. A > small CPLD and 4 RAM chips will make up the complete board. So, this brings > to mind, a question: Where is a good free webpage that I can set up to > bring these projects to you all? > >Many Thanks - JEric > Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and set up my own web server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they claim they aren't doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river in Egypt. You can see what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars at My uplink is slow, so it won't load like slashdot, but it works. Probably better than me, but I keep plugging along since the alternative is worse. :) -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievement." -- Richard J. Daley From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jan 9 17:08:42 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 17:08:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>, <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> On 9 Jan 2009 at 16:33, Gene Heskett wrote: > Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and set up my > own web server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they claim > they aren't doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river in > Egypt. You can see what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars > at |=============== They can't block port 80 on TCP/IP. That is the main HTTP port for all web browsers. If they blocked that most web pages would not load. Also it would be nice to have a static IP address or a service that does an DNS remaps to your continual changing IP address. james From tlindner at macmess.org Fri Jan 9 17:48:47 2009 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 22:48:47 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: pdf magazines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stinger30au" wrote: > > dones anyone know if any us rainbow magazines have been scanned to > pdf??? There is another group here on Yahoo that contains what you want: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RainbowArchive/ From RJRTTY at aol.com Fri Jan 9 18:04:07 2009 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 18:04:07 EST Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 Message-ID: In a message dated 1/9/2009 4:13:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jet.pack at ymail.com writes: >Recently, I acquired a CoCo 3 that had been killed by it's previous owner. An apparent attempt at repairing >the CoCo 3 by replacing I.C.'s at random resulted in the destruction of many PCB traces. The actual >problem >with the CoCo 3 was relatively simple and I'll point that out in a moment, but first, I had to reconstruct the >damaged circuit traces.After a few hours with the CoCo 3 Schematic, a notebook and an Ohmeter, I had >ascertained all traces that needed to be reconstructed. I began by desoldering every I.C. left on the board >that didn't have sockets and replaced them with sockets and plugged those I.C.'s back in (a step that >wasn't >needed, but I wanted to socket all the chips to make future repairs and experiments simpler.) Next, I took >my notes and some kynar wire-wrap wire and repaired all of the damaged traces as noted with the help of >the Ohmeter, and I then placed sockets where those I.C.'s went and plugged them back in, except for the >CPU >which I replaced with a 63B09E. Since this board has the 1986 G.I.M.E., I went ahead and replaced the >capacitor C64 with a quality WIMA 220pf capacitor, although this probably wasn't necessary. I then >plugged >the Performance Peripherals 512K Memory Board Back in, hooked everything up and turned it on. It didn't >work, of course, because the original problem that caused the previous owner to destroy the board in the >first >place must still exist. What was that problem? Well, quite simply, the GIME only needed re-seating in it's >socket - I took it out, cleaned the pins and socket contacts plugged it back in and voila - working CoCo 3 >512k fully socketed chipset :) Nice job. What people don't take into account is that the integrity of the bond between the traces or pads is lowered each time the soldering or desoldering iron is applied. You can't just continuously stress the traces and pads like that in an endless "fishing" expedition looking for a problem. Sooner or later they will lose their grip and come off. In situations like this you should install a socket whenever you have to replace a chip and keep heat stresses on the pads and traces to a minimum. And of course you should eliminate the simple and easily tested potential causes of the problem first before moving to the complex ones... If you are not a technician by trade you should think of being one..... Roy **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 18:17:28 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 15:17:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 References: Message-ID: <724648.86160.qm@web111211.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Actually, I just work in a grocery store :) My father taught me everything I know about electronics. He and my uncle had CoCo's and that's the only computer I knew growing up, and recently their CoCo stuff was given to me. I acquired this CoCo 3 from a person in canada recently (actually, I think it was about a year ago), and I finally decided to see what the guy was talking about when he sent it to me - about damaging traces. It took a bit, but she's back in action. -Jeric ________________________________ From: "RJRTTY at aol.com" To: coco at maltedmedia.com Sent: Friday, January 9, 2009 5:04:07 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In a message dated 1/9/2009 4:13:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jet.pack at ymail.com writes: >Recently, I acquired a CoCo 3 that had been killed by it's previous owner. An apparent attempt at repairing >the CoCo 3 by replacing I.C.'s at random resulted in the destruction of many PCB traces. The actual >problem >with the CoCo 3 was relatively simple and I'll point that out in a moment, but first, I had to reconstruct the >damaged circuit traces.After a few hours with the CoCo 3 Schematic, a notebook and an Ohmeter, I had >ascertained all traces that needed to be reconstructed. I began by desoldering every I.C. left on the board >that didn't have sockets and replaced them with sockets and plugged those I.C.'s back in (a step that >wasn't >needed, but I wanted to socket all the chips to make future repairs and experiments simpler.) Next, I took >my notes and some kynar wire-wrap wire and repaired all of the damaged traces as noted with the help of >the Ohmeter, and I then placed sockets where those I.C.'s went and plugged them back in, except for the >CPU >which I replaced with a 63B09E. Since this board has the 1986 G.I.M.E., I went ahead and replaced the >capacitor C64 with a quality WIMA 220pf capacitor, although this probably wasn't necessary. I then >plugged >the Performance Peripherals 512K Memory Board Back in, hooked everything up and turned it on. It didn't >work, of course, because the original problem that caused the previous owner to destroy the board in the >first >place must still exist. What was that problem? Well, quite simply, the GIME only needed re-seating in it's >socket - I took it out, cleaned the pins and socket contacts plugged it back in and voila - working CoCo 3 >512k fully socketed chipset :) Nice job. What people don't take into account is that the integrity of the bond between the traces or pads is lowered each time the soldering or desoldering iron is applied. You can't just continuously stress the traces and pads like that in an endless "fishing" expedition looking for a problem. Sooner or later they will lose their grip and come off. In situations like this you should install a socket whenever you have to replace a chip and keep heat stresses on the pads and traces to a minimum. And of course you should eliminate the simple and easily tested potential causes of the problem first before moving to the complex ones... If you are not a technician by trade you should think of being one..... Roy **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Fri Jan 9 18:49:51 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:49:51 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>, <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <4967E29F.1050204@aurigae.demon.co.uk> jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > On 9 Jan 2009 at 16:33, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and set up my >> own web server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they claim >> they aren't doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river in >> Egypt. You can see what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars >> at > |=============== > > They can't block port 80 on TCP/IP. That is the main HTTP port for all web > browsers. If they blocked that most web pages would not load. Well, some ISPs block inbound port 80 connections that is from the internet to port 80 on your machine, which is what you need to run a web server. When you access web servers on the internet that is an outbound connection and so is let through, most firewalls can be configured to do the same. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 18:54:20 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 18:54:20 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <200901091854.20427.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >On 9 Jan 2009 at 16:33, Gene Heskett wrote: >> Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and set up my >> own web server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they claim >> they aren't doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river in >> Egypt. You can see what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars >> at >> >|=============== > >They can't block port 80 on TCP/IP. That is the main HTTP port for all web >browsers. If they blocked that most web pages would not load. Also it would >be nice to have a static IP address or a service that does an DNS remaps >to your continual changing IP address. They block access requests to port 80 coming my way only. Everything else works a treat. So I have a NAT rule in my router that forwards port 85 to port 80 at this boxes address. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) A businessman is a hybrid of a dancer and a calculator. -- Paul Valery From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 9 18:57:36 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 18:57:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <4967E29F.1050204@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4967849A.18097.33098D@jdaggett.gate.net> <4967E29F.1050204@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <200901091857.36844.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 09 January 2009, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: >jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >> On 9 Jan 2009 at 16:33, Gene Heskett wrote: >>> Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and set up my >>> own web server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they claim >>> they aren't doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river in >>> Egypt. You can see what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars >>> at >>> >> |=============== >> >> They can't block port 80 on TCP/IP. That is the main HTTP port for all web >> browsers. If they blocked that most web pages would not load. > >Well, some ISPs block inbound port 80 connections that is from the >internet to port 80 on your machine, which is what you need to run a web >server. When you access web servers on the internet that is an outbound >connection and so is let through, most firewalls can be configured to do >the same. > >Cheers. > >Phill. They do that to force the user to use a web page on their servers which gives them the opportunity to load it up with their *&^$* commercials and popups. I don't waste my upload bandwidth on such. I may not be a talented web designer, but what I see here is what you get. Which is how it should be. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) A businessman is a hybrid of a dancer and a calculator. -- Paul Valery From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Fri Jan 9 19:34:01 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 19:34:01 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4967ECF9.6090300@worldnet.att.net> John Eric wrote: >snip> > I did notice that with the 512K upgrade, the CoCo 3 gets HOT. In > an attempt to alleviate this, I replaced all .... One of the things I did with a Coco3 was install a fan inside the case below the keyboard. I cut a hole in the bottom the size of a box fan, glued mosquito screening over the hole, and attached a small box fan. The fan along with a small regulated power supply draws power from the Coco3. The air flow is in at the bottom and out at the top. Somewhat noisy over a dead silent Coco3 but it does keep it cool. From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 20:53:05 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 20:53:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] What does this go with? In-Reply-To: <49678DAA.23198.E841448@shadow.shadowgard.com> References: <49678DAA.23198.E841448@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: <4967FF81.7050308@gmail.com> It has been a long time, but I think that is a Turtle Logo template. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com shadow at shadowgard.com wrote: > > While going thru my CoCo stuff to get ready to sell stuff on ebay, I > found this keyboard template. > > Anybody know what it goes with? > > -- > Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) > shadow at shadowgard dot com > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > The following section of this message contains a file attachment > prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. > If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, > you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. > If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. > > ---- File information ----------- > File: template.jpg > Date: 9 Jan 2009, 17:47 > Size: 64025 bytes. > Type: JPEG-image > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > From blackwolfe at charter.net Fri Jan 9 21:13:46 2009 From: blackwolfe at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 21:13:46 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] What does this go with? References: <49678DAA.23198.E841448@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: <5EF8E1F3E44C400BA552EEABE223745A@speedy> Color Logo. Bruce W. > While going thru my CoCo stuff to get ready to sell stuff on ebay, I > found this keyboard template. > > Anybody know what it goes with? > > > -- > Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 21:41:27 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 18:41:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] A Website For My Projects + A Neat CoCoNET Idea Message-ID: <819454.30755.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I currently can't host the site from my home computer (my neighbor is 13 and plays guild wars, through my wireless connection - his family doesn't have dsl which makes playing the game impossible, so I set the little fella' up through my wireless. This leaves little bandwidth for me to host a site.) A bit of searching, and I found "The Other Bob's website" and the provider seems tolerable - the ad can be "minimized" off the right side of the screen. So, I think I will use that service to host my site. When I get home from work in the morning, I am going to begin setting up the site. The first thing I plan to post are pics of the CoCo 3 that I have just revived from the dead (see previous post). Next, I am going to add the 1986 GIME Fix to this CoCo 3 and pictures of that. It is interesting that the 1986 GIME apparently does not properly gate the E clock and S2 select signals. This apparently caused data bus contention when the ROMs were read and caused "sparklies" and the B.L.O.B. (boot list order bug in OS-9). During research, I found two suggested fixes. The first and easiest was to replace capacitor c64 with a 220pf cap (it is originally 150pf). I've already performed this fix, but honestly, I don't see it preventing the contention when the ROMs are accessed. The actual guaranteed to work fix is to properly gate the E Clock with the S2 line using a NOR gate. In the CoCo 1, the E Clock was gated with the S2 line and used as the G2a enable of the 74LS138. This is generally how it is fixed on the CoCo 3. However, In the CoCo 2, things were done a bit differently. In addition to gating E and S2 to give G2b (yes, G2b in the 26-3026 and 26-3027 CoCo 2's), the R/W* line was gated with the S2 line and used as the G2a enable of the 74LS138. So, I pondered, what would happen if I used this gating scheme in the CoCo 3 to enable the 74LS138? Well, I tested it and strangely enough, the CoCo 3 powers up straight into the CTR-ALT-RESET Three Musketeers screen and stays there. So this is useless. No - wait - using this circuit and making the R/W*S2 able to be turned on or off (say, using a locking keyswitch), the CoCo 3 can have a security key (once common in AT PC cases), plus the GIME Fix, and this would mean only two gates wasted in the 74LS02. I know, a keyswitch could be connected in such a way as to keep reset* low and that would do just as well for a security keyswitch, but c'mon - the three mugateers look cooler than a blank screen :). If only there were a way so that the other two NOR gates could be put to use... Oh wait, there may be - use them to increase the joystick resolution to 8 bits. Can this be done? I haven't tested it yet in a CoCo 3, but I have tested such a scheme in the CoCo 1 with it's "discrete" dac and it works, so theoretically I should be able to get it to work in the 3, assuming the 64 collector DAC chip works the way the discrete DAC does in the CoCo 1. Hopefully my fellow CoCo users won't get tired of my long posts, but I have so many ideas for things to build and it's so much fun. I have just finished a design on paper for a cartridge that will facilitate the use of CoCoNET with any Disk Controller. It wasn't just CoCoNET that prompted me to design this. I realize that many of you are serious collectors and may not wish to open up a cartridge thereby destroying or damaging it's label. So, what this cartridge does is: *Contains two 2764/27128 compatible 28-pin sockets for ROMs in the CTS* range. Jumpers allow both ROM sockets to be active at the same time - BUT the only reason you would do this would be to put a ROM in one socket and a SmartWatch chip in the other. Either or Both sockets may be enabled as mentioned. Jumpers allow a 27128 to be accessed as either the full 16k or as two 8k, which means you could burn two different DOS BASICs into a 27128 and switch between them, thus allowing the pack to hold either 4 8K DOS'es or two 16k, or 2 8k+1 16k. If using a ROM in this cartridge, you would use the disable jumper (mentioned next) to disable the ROM in the disk controller that would be plugged into this cartridge. *A Jumper to allow disabling the ROM of any cartridge plugged into this board. For example, a recent discussion here on the list involved a gentleman not wanting to open his deluxe rs-232 pack to remove the ROM. With this board, you just plug the pack into this board set the disable jumper and plug it into your multi-pack - as far as the CoCo is then concerned, the pack has no ROM. *A Jumper to disable Cartridge Autostart. Handy for saving carts to tape, etc. *A few more features may be added before I am done, but I have created a PCB layout for the present design and all of this will be posted on the website I am putting together over the next couple of days. This project will allow disk controllers to use a 28-pin rom with CoCoNET without having to open their controller :) Finally, I am researching the possibility of a similar cart to above, but intended for the Speech Sound Pack. Basically, If I am successful, you would plug the speech sound pak into the cartridge and that into the CoCo. Whenever the CoCo is running at .89Mhz, the cart feeds the E and Q clocks straight to the Speech Cart, but when the CoCo is running at 1.78Mhz, the cart feeds a divided by two version of the E and Q clocks to the Speech Cart. Similar to what "The Other Bob" did, but no modification to the speech cart required. I have ordered parts to implement this and see if it works. If it fails, I will try modifying my clock speed switching circuit to function like the one here: http://www.6502.org/mini-projects/clock-switching/clock-switching.html and see if that helps. Thanks for tolerating my rant and if you guys (and gals) have any ideas for projects - throw them my way and I'll see what I can come up with. Thanks - JEric. From alsplace at pobox.com Fri Jan 9 21:44:48 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 20:44:48 -0600 Subject: [Coco] A Website For My Projects + A Neat CoCoNET Idea In-Reply-To: <819454.30755.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <819454.30755.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <54141FA2-0863-4545-8EBF-A954B22F9C80@pobox.com> JEric, contact me if you need hosting. I'd be glad to donate some server space for CoCo projects (ad free!). -- Allen On Jan 9, 2009, at 8:41 PM, John Eric wrote: > I currently can't host the site from my home computer (my neighbor > is 13 and plays guild wars, through my wireless connection - his > family doesn't have dsl which makes playing the game impossible, so > I set the little fella' up through my wireless. This leaves little > bandwidth for me to host a site.) A bit of searching, and I found > "The Other Bob's website" and the provider seems tolerable - the ad > can be "minimized" off the right side of the screen. So, I think I > will use that service to host my site. From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 22:02:32 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 19:02:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer References: <010920091048.10391.49672B87000A1A800000289722135285730B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <230614.19022.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Thank You. I have actually been refilling them but the fabric eventually wears and I still have a few unopened dmp-105 ribbons. It would be nice to find a new supply though. I love my DMP-105 Jeric ________________________________ From: "wdg3rd at comcast.net" To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 9, 2009 4:48:39 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer Apparently, Computer Friends in Oregon still sells the MacInker. Whether they still have an adapter that works with the DMP-100 ribbon may require a phone call. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: John Eric > I think you may be confusing the TP10 with the TRP-100. The TP10 was meant to > accompany the MC10 and the combo, I believe was the TRS answer to the Sinclair > ZX81 (TS-1000) and the ZX-Printer (TS-2040). It used approx 4" wide paper. It > also worked with the regular CoCo. It had a design flaw in that the graphics > characters were the inverse of what would be displayed on the CoCo and MC-10. > The TRP-100 is a full 8x10-ish printer that could print on thermal paper or use > a thermal ribbon to print on plain paper (although, sometimes the print wouldn't > stick just right to some papers.) However, the main thing you mentioned is in > fact the bane of thermal printing - I folded a piece of thermal paper and put it > in my jacket pocket - my body heat darkened the paper to a darker color than the > print, so... for all intents and purposes, it was erased. sigh.. but it's still > the cheapest method I've found to use for debugging ASM listings. BTW - anyone > still sell DMP-105 > ribbons? JEric > > > > > ________________________________ > From: "wdg3rd at comcast.net" > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 11:09:51 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer > > From: John Eric > > I've just been using plain old thermal fax paper with mine - 99 cents for > three > > rolls at a local junk store - of couse the ribbon would probably let me use > > plain paper... > > Any printouts you make on thermal paper, if you want to preserve them, remember > to make copies with a regular plain-paper copier at your earliest convenience. > Yes, it means you may have to have to cut it into short strips that you have to > keep together with paper clips, in the case of output from the TRP-100. But > thermal printouts are transient. I lost three months work due to leaving a roll > of TI-700 output in my car. In August in Las Vegas. The background became the > foreground darkness. Stuff that would have advanced AI by 20 years (well, > looking at recent progress in AI, maybe 40). That was back in 1979, but thermal > paper technology has not advanced much since then. (Nor has AI, though Real > Stupidity has made great gains, judging by the last several decades of US, > European, Asian and every else politics and economics). > > Nah, I'm just fooling. I'd managed a great (at the time) fusion of two of the > best bits from David Ahl's "BASIC Computer Games", Eliza and Animals (translated > to HP-2000A BASIC [crappy string functions, great array functions], since that's > what I had to work with before I got my first TRS-80, a couple of years before > the Color Computer). I should try it again (probably in Python, since that's > what I'm learning now, though I'm not dropping the Bourne shell & descendants). > Didn't even bother remembering it during the several years without disk storage, > and got busy for a while after anyway. In fact, mention of thermal paper is > what dragged it out of long-term storage covered with long-dead brain cells. > But do back up thermal to plain paper if you want your data to last. > -- > Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net > > I thought about being diplomatic and polite. Honest, I really did. But while I > was thinking about it, I accidentally bumped the button that puts my mouth on > autopilot, because it said, "That's a load of crap, Captain, and you know it". > Jim Butcher, _Small Favor_ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 9 22:31:00 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 21:31:00 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request Message-ID: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> Until I post my cocotape.exe program online, anybody wanting a copy of 1.0 can reply and I'll e-mail you a copy. CoCoTape is the easiest but slowest method for transferring files from your PC to your CoCo over a cassette cable. Plug your cassette cable black plug into the Speaker Out jack of your laptop or PC. Type CLOAD or CLOADM on the CoCo, type: cocotape somefile -options on the PC, and the file will CLOAD into the CoCo. Your PC's sound has to be adjusted right, usually around 50% volume and with special effects off. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 9 23:16:50 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 20:16:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick Message-ID: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Does anyone have a schematic for the CoCo Max 3 hi-res joystick interface? thanks - jeric From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 9 23:29:55 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:29:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> Hi Roger. That sounds like a cool program. Please send me a copy and thanks!. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home http://n8wq.blogspot.com Roger Taylor wrote: > Until I post my cocotape.exe program online, anybody wanting a copy of > 1.0 can reply and I'll e-mail you a copy. > > CoCoTape is the easiest but slowest method for transferring files from > your PC to your CoCo over a cassette cable. Plug your cassette cable > black plug into the Speaker Out jack of your laptop or PC. Type CLOAD > or CLOADM on the CoCo, type: cocotape somefile -options on the PC, > and the file will CLOAD into the CoCo. > > Your PC's sound has to be adjusted right, usually around 50% volume > and with special effects off. From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 00:02:41 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:02:41 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this works with the gmail server. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: cocotape.zip Type: application/zip Size: 8730 bytes Desc: not available Url : -------------- next part -------------- -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 00:03:33 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:03:33 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090110050354.1ED7A20A15@qs281.pair.com> At 10:29 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: >Hi Roger. That sounds like a cool program. Please send me a copy and thanks!. > >Alan Jones > >-- I e-mailed it but gmail bounced it. I zipped the program on the 2nd try. Let us know how it works for you. Thanks -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 00:06:11 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 21:06:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <302166.13841.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> i received both mailings - i guess the other guys email bounced his back. man you are a genius. My dad talks about your projector being the best coco program he ever saw :) ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 9, 2009 11:02:41 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this works with the gmail server.-- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 01:06:11 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:06:11 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090110060632.68F6E20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 11:02 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: >CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this >works with the gmail server. > > >-- >Roger Taylor Oops. I'm tired and I hit reply by mistake and posted CoCoTape to the list. Oh well. I guess I'll get feedback on how well it works as well as why I shouldn't post attachments to the list. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jan 10 02:02:52 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 02:02:52 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick In-Reply-To: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00d501c972f1$74cd34a0$5e679de0$@com> I remember there was a mod in The Rainbow to convert a Tandy Hi-res interface so you could toggle between the 2. If you can find that, you should get your answers. Think is appeared in 1988 at some point. Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of John Eric Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 11:17 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick Does anyone have a schematic for the CoCo Max 3 hi-res joystick interface? thanks - jeric -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.5/1882 - Release Date: 1/9/2009 8:38 AM From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 02:15:47 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 01:15:47 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <302166.13841.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <302166.13841.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090110071622.F141C20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 11:06 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: >i received both mailings - i guess the other guys email bounced his >back. man you are a genius. My dad talks about your projector being >the best coco program he ever saw :) Tell him Thanks. :) When I fire up my Projector-3 program, I actually see 3 or 4 years of pain that has come and gone. Let me explain. There's actually a soul in P-3 made up of everything I'm about to mention, probably for the first time ever. It took me a Long time to write Projector-3. I slept very little during this time. Some of my allnighters resulted in passing out at 5am and having nightmares being caught in a code loop not being able to escape. You might not believe it, but I'd run or write routines in my head during my sleep. I'd go through the code in my head trying to debug it, and wake up with the solution. Most of P-3 was written during my wild days when I was around 25. I had moved to Magnolia AR to take up a Coca-Cola route. The city was kinda small and I experienced the New Guy in Town life that went on for years. Many whores and even hard-to-get ladies found me out and I went through my you-know-what peak, becoming the alpha-male in the circle of friends that hung around me. I went from a computer "nerd" (as they used to call anybody with a computer) with lots of good lifetime buddies to a low-profile computer programmer with the ability to get you-know-what'd as often as I liked, so I had this pulling effect between fun and my other fun which was programming. So, P-3 was mostly written during my years of so-called town fame and I attribute the quality of the program to every woman that broke my heart. To get my mind off of "her" I'd block it all out and fire up EDTASM and spend the next weeks coding heavily on a determined program that would be completed no matter what. And so it was. As for the program itself, P-3 actually started as "The Projector", not having dither capabilities and having less formats. P-3 went on to decode and encode more formats making it a graphics interchange system + viewer. P-3 is very close to an operating system with all of it's core routines and common hooks to call them from external programs that the shell can load. The system recognizes programs you place on the disk ending with .EC* for the filename, with * being the letter you hit while holding down the ALT key. This is how Mirror, Negative, and other functions work. Robert Gault has written at least two codecs for P-3. Using the global.asm include file, your codec or subprogram knows about the system calls to use if you want to. As I explained back in the 90's, P-3 would live on because you can expand it with drop-in codecs. These are *.fmt files containing decode, encode, and view routines, all able to call P-3 system routines to take the pain out of the work. That's why these drivers are so small. You basically decode the picture on your own and send the color stream to P-3's shell. P-3 renderings the image automatically and displays it. P-3 can encode a picture file by sending the screen's colors to the right codec, chosen by the extension you type for the Save Filename. P-3 can also display text files and play music but due to the lack of assembly programmers, the system might not ever see it's full potential. The CCASM source code is available as a Rainbow IDE project! You can click GO and build the massive P-3 floppy disk in about 15 seconds. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From shadow at shadowgard.com Sat Jan 10 03:34:01 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:34:01 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] What does this go with? In-Reply-To: <5EF8E1F3E44C400BA552EEABE223745A@speedy> References: <49678DAA.23198.E841448@shadow.shadowgard.com>, <5EF8E1F3E44C400BA552EEABE223745A@speedy> Message-ID: <4967ECF9.3044.FF9CFB3@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 9 Jan 2009 at 21:13, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > Color Logo. Great! O suspected that but wasn't sure. Now I can put it with the program pak (which didn't sell on ebay) -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From petrander at gmail.com Sat Jan 10 03:39:35 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:39:35 +0100 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: Hi Roger, That sounds like a neat program. I want one too! If my gmail bounces it back you can try sending it to fedor at steeman.dk or fsteeman at dds.nl Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/10 Roger Taylor > Until I post my cocotape.exe program online, anybody wanting a copy of 1.0 > can reply and I'll e-mail you a copy. > > CoCoTape is the easiest but slowest method for transferring files from your > PC to your CoCo over a cassette cable. Plug your cassette cable black plug > into the Speaker Out jack of your laptop or PC. Type CLOAD or CLOADM on the > CoCo, type: cocotape somefile -options on the PC, and the file will CLOAD > into the CoCo. > > Your PC's sound has to be adjusted right, usually around 50% volume and > with special effects off. > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From petrander at gmail.com Sat Jan 10 03:42:37 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:42:37 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Thanks guys! I do believe I have the connector connected to the 5.25" drive because there is no other way to do it, because of the little plastic "septum" that I don't know the name of. But I will double-check, try another cable and perhaps try some of the other suggestions. I might even try to get my hands on a new cable from Cloud-9 or something. Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/9 Gene Heskett > On Friday 09 January 2009, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > >A connector on your cable is on backwards or plugged in to the drive or > >controller backwards. > > > >Bruce W. > > > Ah yes, and the most obvious problem given the description. But I have > faith > in my fellow man, and had falsely assumed that was done correctly so I > jumped > to other miss-configured hardware issues. My bad. Thanks Bruce, for the > reminder about the glaringly obvious. And I have egg on my face. Again... > > >> Hi all, > >> > >> For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" > and > >> two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and > >> different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number > >> jumpers. > >> > >> Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of the > >> (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive set > up > >> with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers on > >> the > >> appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, > >> whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning > for > >> no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO ERROR. > >> Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works fine. > >> > >> Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have > >> something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what > I > >> am > >> doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly > appreciated. > >> I > >> still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Fedor > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > There are new messages. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From brucewcalkins at charter.net Sat Jan 10 07:34:36 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:34:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <421591C87E784855AF5A8C44D52B539C@speedy> Never mind, I have the one off the list. Thanks, I try to make time to test it soon. Bruce W. Yes, I would like a copy. Thanks Bruce W. > Until I post my cocotape.exe program online, anybody wanting a copy > of 1.0 can reply and I'll e-mail you a copy. > -- > Roger Taylor From blackwolfe at charter.net Sat Jan 10 07:49:57 2009 From: blackwolfe at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:49:57 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] What does this go with? References: <49678DAA.23198.E841448@shadow.shadowgard.com>, <5EF8E1F3E44C400BA552EEABE223745A@speedy> <4967ECF9.3044.FF9CFB3@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: Yup, that was the only thing I missed being able to use when I built my first "real" keyboard for my first CoCo. Bruce W. >> Color Logo. > > > Great! O suspected that but wasn't sure. Now I can put it with the > program pak (which didn't sell on ebay) > > > -- > Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) > shadow at shadowgard dot com From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 07:51:51 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 04:51:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick References: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <00d501c972f1$74cd34a0$5e679de0$@com> Message-ID: <489576.99288.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Thanks. I'm just researching different things for projects. I'm sure my initial enthusiasm for making stuff for the coco will wear down, so I'm going to make all I can as fast as I can :) Jeric ________________________________ From: Tom Seagrove To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 1:02:52 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick I remember there was a mod in The Rainbow to convert a Tandy Hi-res interface so you could toggle between the 2. If you can find that, you should get your answers. Think is appeared in 1988 at some point. Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of John Eric Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 11:17 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick Does anyone have a schematic for the CoCo Max 3 hi-res joystick interface? thanks - jeric -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.5/1882 - Release Date: 1/9/2009 8:38 AM -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 09:30:42 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 06:30:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Classic Computer Magazine Archive Message-ID: <711026.86946.qm@web111208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I just found this: http://www.atarimagazines.com/ although it presumes to be atari, I see TRS-80 Whiz Kids comic on the start page and so there may be more TRS-80 stuff there - perhaps they will ad coco specific stuff at some point - some creative computing is in there too. -Jeric From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 09:49:48 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 06:49:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090110060632.68F6E20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <118739.23570.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> If you didn't make mistakes, you wouldn't be human. :) ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 12:06:11 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request At 11:02 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: >CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this >works with the gmail server. > > >-- >Roger Taylor Oops. I'm tired and I hit reply by mistake and posted CoCoTape to the list. Oh well. I guess I'll get feedback on how well it works as well as why I shouldn't post attachments to the list. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 10:01:35 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:01:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <302166.13841.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090110071622.F141C20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <36616.51795.qm@web111203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> WOW! My Dad never told me it could do all of that! I am going to look into your Rainbow IDE. In fact I am going to sign up for an account on your site. I am going to look for your software there and purchase what I can, to show my support. Also, Allen Huffman is providing me with server space for my projects - if you want, you can republish anything I write. As soon as Allen gets me set up I'll send you the info if you wanna keep up with what I'm doing. I am certainly interested in your CoCoNET, even more so now that I see it's potential. I may try to design a decent disk controller that can be manufactured as cheap as possible, as you mentioned finding those to be a problem. I have finished (on paper only) a design for an 8 pack multi-pak, which is based extensively on the schematic of the 26-3124 - hopefully I can get a prototype up and running by mid-march (I am going to fund it with my tax return, as it seems to be a sought after item - not looking to make any money - it's just a hobby). Anyway, if I can ever be of assistance, just let me know - J. Eric ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 1:15:47 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request At 11:06 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: > i received both mailings - i guess the other guys email bounced his back. man you are a genius. My dad talks about your projector being the best coco program he ever saw :) Tell him Thanks. :) When I fire up my Projector-3 program, I actually see 3 or 4 years of pain that has come and gone. Let me explain. There's actually a soul in P-3 made up of everything I'm about to mention, probably for the first time ever. It took me a Long time to write Projector-3. I slept very little during this time. Some of my allnighters resulted in passing out at 5am and having nightmares being caught in a code loop not being able to escape. You might not believe it, but I'd run or write routines in my head during my sleep. I'd go through the code in my head trying to debug it, and wake up with the solution. Most of P-3 was written during my wild days when I was around 25. I had moved to Magnolia AR to take up a Coca-Cola route. The city was kinda small and I experienced the New Guy in Town life that went on for years. Many whores and even hard-to-get ladies found me out and I went through my you-know-what peak, becoming the alpha-male in the circle of friends that hung around me. I went from a computer "nerd" (as they used to call anybody with a computer) with lots of good lifetime buddies to a low-profile computer programmer with the ability to get you-know-what'd as often as I liked, so I had this pulling effect between fun and my other fun which was programming. So, P-3 was mostly written during my years of so-called town fame and I attribute the quality of the program to every woman that broke my heart. To get my mind off of "her" I'd block it all out and fire up EDTASM and spend the next weeks coding heavily on a determined program that would be completed no matter what. And so it was. As for the program itself, P-3 actually started as "The Projector", not having dither capabilities and having less formats. P-3 went on to decode and encode more formats making it a graphics interchange system + viewer. P-3 is very close to an operating system with all of it's core routines and common hooks to call them from external programs that the shell can load. The system recognizes programs you place on the disk ending with .EC* for the filename, with * being the letter you hit while holding down the ALT key. This is how Mirror, Negative, and other functions work. Robert Gault has written at least two codecs for P-3. Using the global.asm include file, your codec or subprogram knows about the system calls to use if you want to. As I explained back in the 90's, P-3 would live on because you can expand it with drop-in codecs. These are *.fmt files containing decode, encode, and view routines, all able to call P-3 system routines to take the pain out of the work. That's why these drivers are so small. You basically decode the picture on your own and send the color stream to P-3's shell. P-3 renderings the image automatically and displays it. P-3 can encode a picture file by sending the screen's colors to the right codec, chosen by the extension you type for the Save Filename. P-3 can also display text files and play music but due to the lack of assembly programmers, the system might not ever see it's full potential. The CCASM source code is available as a Rainbow IDE project! You can click GO and build the massive P-3 floppy disk in about 15 seconds. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 10:04:47 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:04:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <302166.13841.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <20090110071622.F141C20A13@qs281.pair.com> <36616.51795.qm@web111203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <664602.24710.qm@web111211.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> bummer - this was supposed to go to Roger and not the list as I didn't want to mention yet what I was designing, in case it didn't work. I guess you aren't the only one who makes mistakes when he is tired... JERIC ________________________________ From: John Eric To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 9:01:35 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request WOW! My Dad never told me it could do all of that! I am going to look into your Rainbow IDE. In fact I am going to sign up for an account on your site. I am going to look for your software there and purchase what I can, to show my support. Also, Allen Huffman is providing me with server space for my projects - if you want, you can republish anything I write. As soon as Allen gets me set up I'll send you the info if you wanna keep up with what I'm doing. I am certainly interested in your CoCoNET, even more so now that I see it's potential. I may try to design a decent disk controller that can be manufactured as cheap as possible, as you mentioned finding those to be a problem. I have finished (on paper only) a design for an 8 pack multi-pak, which is based extensively on the schematic of the 26-3124 - hopefully I can get a prototype up and running by mid-march (I am going to fund it with my tax return, as it seems to be a sought after item - not looking to make any money - it's just a hobby). Anyway, if I can ever be of assistance, just let me know - J. Eric ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 1:15:47 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request At 11:06 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: > i received both mailings - i guess the other guys email bounced his back. man you are a genius. My dad talks about your projector being the best coco program he ever saw :) Tell him Thanks. :) When I fire up my Projector-3 program, I actually see 3 or 4 years of pain that has come and gone. Let me explain. There's actually a soul in P-3 made up of everything I'm about to mention, probably for the first time ever. It took me a Long time to write Projector-3. I slept very little during this time. Some of my allnighters resulted in passing out at 5am and having nightmares being caught in a code loop not being able to escape. You might not believe it, but I'd run or write routines in my head during my sleep. I'd go through the code in my head trying to debug it, and wake up with the solution. Most of P-3 was written during my wild days when I was around 25. I had moved to Magnolia AR to take up a Coca-Cola route. The city was kinda small and I experienced the New Guy in Town life that went on for years. Many whores and even hard-to-get ladies found me out and I went through my you-know-what peak, becoming the alpha-male in the circle of friends that hung around me. I went from a computer "nerd" (as they used to call anybody with a computer) with lots of good lifetime buddies to a low-profile computer programmer with the ability to get you-know-what'd as often as I liked, so I had this pulling effect between fun and my other fun which was programming. So, P-3 was mostly written during my years of so-called town fame and I attribute the quality of the program to every woman that broke my heart. To get my mind off of "her" I'd block it all out and fire up EDTASM and spend the next weeks coding heavily on a determined program that would be completed no matter what. And so it was. As for the program itself, P-3 actually started as "The Projector", not having dither capabilities and having less formats. P-3 went on to decode and encode more formats making it a graphics interchange system + viewer. P-3 is very close to an operating system with all of it's core routines and common hooks to call them from external programs that the shell can load. The system recognizes programs you place on the disk ending with .EC* for the filename, with * being the letter you hit while holding down the ALT key. This is how Mirror, Negative, and other functions work. Robert Gault has written at least two codecs for P-3. Using the global.asm include file, your codec or subprogram knows about the system calls to use if you want to. As I explained back in the 90's, P-3 would live on because you can expand it with drop-in codecs. These are *.fmt files containing decode, encode, and view routines, all able to call P-3 system routines to take the pain out of the work. That's why these drivers are so small. You basically decode the picture on your own and send the color stream to P-3's shell. P-3 renderings the image automatically and displays it. P-3 can encode a picture file by sending the screen's colors to the right codec, chosen by the extension you type for the Save Filename. P-3 can also display text files and play music but due to the lack of assembly programmers, the system might not ever see it's full potential. The CCASM source code is available as a Rainbow IDE project! You can click GO and build the massive P-3 floppy disk in about 15 seconds. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 10 10:45:19 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 10:45:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 10 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: >Thanks guys! I do believe I have the connector connected to the 5.25" drive >because there is no other way to do it, because of the little plastic >"septum" that I don't know the name of. But I will double-check, try another >cable and perhaps try some of the other suggestions. I might even try to get >my hands on a new cable from Cloud-9 or something. > >Cheers, >Fedor Turn it over at the controller then, it has no 'key'. However, looking down on the top of the controller, with the drive cable on the right end, there is a marker on the cable connector indicating pin one. It should be on the top back edge as its plugged into the controller, or is on my Disto 4n1 anyway. >2009/1/9 Gene Heskett > >> On Friday 09 January 2009, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: >> >A connector on your cable is on backwards or plugged in to the drive or >> >controller backwards. >> > >> >Bruce W. >> >> Ah yes, and the most obvious problem given the description. But I have >> faith >> in my fellow man, and had falsely assumed that was done correctly so I >> jumped >> to other miss-configured hardware issues. My bad. Thanks Bruce, for the >> reminder about the glaringly obvious. And I have egg on my face. Again... >> >> >> Hi all, >> >> >> >> For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" >> >> and >> >> >> two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations and >> >> different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number >> >> jumpers. >> >> >> >> Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of >> >> the (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" drive >> >> set >> >> up >> >> >> with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers >> >> on the >> >> appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. However, >> >> whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on turning >> >> for >> >> >> no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO >> >> ERROR. Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive works >> >> fine. >> >> >> >> Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have >> >> something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea what >> >> I >> >> >> am >> >> doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly >> >> appreciated. >> >> >> I >> >> still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Fedor >> > >> >-- >> >Coco mailing list >> >Coco at maltedmedia.com >> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> -- >> Cheers, Gene >> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: >> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." >> -Ed Howdershelt (Author) >> There are new messages. >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) It is better to kiss an avocado than to get in a fight with an aardvark. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sat Jan 10 11:06:14 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:06:14 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4968C776.6080204@worldnet.att.net> Roger Taylor wrote: > CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this works > with the gmail server. > > Roger when I enter cocotape on my WinXP system there is one line of the "useage" [should be usage :) ] message that looks suspect. > -cloadm, -csavem, -ml, -bin, -binary The leading > is part of the output. Is that a bug or an active indicator of some default setting? From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sat Jan 10 11:13:16 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:13:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick In-Reply-To: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4968C91C.7060008@worldnet.att.net> John Eric wrote: > Does anyone have a schematic for the CoCo Max 3 hi-res joystick interface? > thanks - jeric > You can get information at my web page http://home.att.net/~robert.gault/Coco/FAQ/Hresjoy.htm or in one of the CocoNutz newsletters at Coco3.com. vol. 3, issue 1, Feb 2007 From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sat Jan 10 04:11:59 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:11:59 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] coco-link pdf convert ready for download Message-ID: here is december 1989 coco-link http://rapidshare.de/files/41315061/coco-link.december.1989.pdf.html have permission from Ros Remin to reproduce the reproduce the magazines in to pdf format, and they are dedicated to Fred Remin as he is no longer with us stay tuned i will keep scanning/uploading/posting the links From cappy2112 at gmail.com Sat Jan 10 12:17:34 2009 From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:17:34 -0800 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request Message-ID: <8249c4ac0901100917r9302011j688cba22b1185529@mail.gmail.com> Gmail.com rejects exe and ZIP attachments. Just rename them to .XEX and PIZ respectively, but let the recipients know. Message: 13 Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:02:41 -0600 From: Roger Taylor Subject: Re: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Message-ID: <20090110050303.17D5220A13 at qs281.pair.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this works with the gmail server. From rcrislip at neo.rr.com Sat Jan 10 12:45:38 2009 From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (richec) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 12:45:38 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090110060632.68F6E20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090110060632.68F6E20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901101245.38863.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> On Saturday 10 January 2009 01:06:11 Roger Taylor wrote: > At 11:02 PM 1/9/2009, you wrote: > >CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this > >works with the gmail server. > > > > > >-- > >Roger Taylor > > Oops. I'm tired and I hit reply by mistake and posted CoCoTape to > the list. Oh well. I guess I'll get feedback on how well it works > as well as why I shouldn't post attachments to the list. Hehehe... It downloaded just fine 8-). From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 14:05:15 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:05:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick References: <498137.93964.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4968C91C.7060008@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <731528.66941.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Thanks - that was what I needed. Much appreciation. -jeric ________________________________ From: Robert Gault To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 10:13:16 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] CoCoMAX 3 Hi-Res Joystick John Eric wrote: > Does anyone have a schematic for the CoCo Max 3 hi-res joystick interface? > thanks - jeric > You can get information at my web page http://home.att.net/~robert.gault/Coco/FAQ/Hresjoy.htm or in one of the CocoNutz newsletters at Coco3.com. vol. 3, issue 1, Feb 2007 -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jdaggett at gate.net Sat Jan 10 14:21:40 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 14:21:40 -0500 Subject: [Coco] A Website For My Projects + A Neat CoCoNET Idea In-Reply-To: <819454.30755.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <819454.30755.qm@web111202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4968AEF4.2206.1686A9@jdaggett.gate.net> On 9 Jan 2009 at 18:41, John Eric wrote: > During research, I found two suggested > fixes. The first and easiest was to replace capacitor c64 with a 220pf > cap (it is originally 150pf). I've already performed this fix, but > honestly, I don't see it preventing the contention when the ROMs are > accessed. |========== C64 serves two purposes. First is to establish a cutoff frequency in which to prevent a mode jump in the crystal. A 28MHz crystal is generally a 3rd overtone crystal and some cuts can jump and osscilate on the 5th overtone. The inductor and C64 prevent that. Secondly the series combination of C64 and L1 in paralell with C60 form a net capacitance that is in series with TC1. The resulting capacitance is the load capacitance for the crystal that sets the frequency. Changing C64 can allow an increase in the range of frequency adjustments for TC1. The chances of mode jump are minimal but are possible. Yes instability of the oscillator can cause "sparkles". Also you have to remember that the timing constraints for RAM access for the GIME and the CPU are very tight. In the CC3 the CPU rate is 1/16th or 1/8th that of the crystal. So to effect the RAM access timing by pulling the oscillator has to take the divisor in context. james From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sat Jan 10 06:26:05 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:26:05 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] october 1989 coco-link magazine Message-ID: get it while you can http://rapidshare.de/files/41315711/coco-link.october.1989.pdf.html From jet.pack at ymail.com Sat Jan 10 14:49:08 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:49:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: Message-ID: <109216.74811.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Fedor, Your post got me to thinking about monitor adapters for the CoCo. Looking at the 6847 data sheet, it appears that the 0a and 0b (theta a and theta b) signals of the VDG are R-Y (theta a), and B-Y (theta b), along with Y (Luminance). These are the signals normally mixed by the MC1372 to generate the composite video. The CoCo's 1 and 2 all have a 1372 either on the motherboard, or later, within the RF Modulator itself. You could tap the composite video from the MC1372 thru a buffer and an amp (two transistors) and achieve full color direct composite video, or you could make an adapter that included it's own MC1372. If you did this, then you could use a switch that allowed the reversing of the diode across pins 13 and 14, the effect of which should provide inverse video (inverse video can also be obtained by inverting the signal entering pin 32 of the VDG.) However, even more interesting than all of that is that since we have luminance, r-y and b-y, we should be able to create an RGB monitor adapter for the CoCo 1 and 2. Let me explain, If we feed those three signals into properly configured high speed operational amplifiers we can generate the Red and Blue signals for an RGB monitor, then by mixing and buffering the Red and Blue signals in proper proportion, we can generate the Green signal. We would then end up with an RGB color signal, with Sync On Green. Sync could be seperated if the rgb monitor in question does not support sync on green. In theory, this sounds achievable - four high speed op-amps (single, dual or quad packaging should all work), about 7 caps and a handful of resistors. Okay, time for me to place another parts order because I REALLY want to try this. If I can calculate the outputs correctly so that they don't exceed .7 volts, I should be able to bring my CoCo 2 up on my CM-8 monitor. I need to determine which op-amps to use - they need to have a relatively high bandwidth and a high slew rate, and should operate off a single 5v supply (since that's all a CoCo 2 has). I'll keep you posted as to whether this pans out or not. -JEric ________________________________ From: Fedor Steeman To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, January 8, 2009 6:37:52 AM Subject: [Coco] *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) Hi all, While going through the huge lot of copied CoCo Manuals I inherited from Michel Collette, a former Dutch CoCo-society regional coordinator, I discovered the following schematics for making a video buffer mod for the CoCo2, enabling a CoCo2 to be coupled up any television or video equipment with a composite video input: http://www.steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/VideoMod_(KoenVaartjes).pdf How cool is that!? It is all in Dutch, written by someone called Koen Vaartjes, but if people are interested I could translate, clean it up, perhaps redo the schematics in a graphics editor and put it up on a webpage! Some of the equipment i inherited from Michel Collette actually included a CoCo2 with this video mod. I tried it out when I first discovered it and it worked flawlessly then. After having transported the CoCo one time, however, something went wrong, because after that all I got was a black screen and no sound. I believe there must be a loose contact somewhere, because every now and then when I try it, it works again. The final page looks like a schematic of a scart cable ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scart) that is widely used in Europe at least. I do also have a modified SCART cable that can be used to hook up the RGB-output of a CoCo 3 to a normal television with a scart input. That too once worked, but not anymore. Maybe if someone could help me understand the schematic, and figure out what wires of a RGB-cable should be connected to what pin of the scart, I could try to fix the cable or make a few more for anyone interested... This would mean that a CoCo3 could be connected from the RGB output directly to a television with scart input. Cheers, Fedor -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sat Jan 10 16:07:54 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 13:07:54 -0800 Subject: [Coco] TRP-100 Thermal Printer References: <010920091048.10391.49672B87000A1A800000289722135285730B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> <230614.19022.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: If you can source other printer ribbons (same width of course) you should be able to cut a piece out of it and heat weld it together as a refill. Easier to do without the ink of course. http://www.aaatoner.com/ http://www.mrinkman.com/ http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/213846090/Dot_matrix_printer_ribbon_6_35mm_TK665_H_D.html is a maker - the specs are of interest here. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Eric" > Thank You. I have actually been refilling them but the fabric eventually > wears and I still have a few unopened dmp-105 ribbons. It would be nice to > find a new supply though. I love my DMP-105 Jeric From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 19:08:14 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 18:08:14 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <4968C776.6080204@worldnet.att.net> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <4968C776.6080204@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090111000842.32F8420A13@qs281.pair.com> At 10:06 AM 1/10/2009, you wrote: >Roger Taylor wrote: >>CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this >>works with the gmail server. > >Roger when I enter cocotape on my WinXP system there is one line of >the "useage" [should be usage :) ] message that looks suspect. > > > -cloadm, -csavem, -ml, -bin, -binary > >The leading > is part of the output. Is that a bug or an active >indicator of some default setting? It's an Indicator of the default option. Does the program work on your system? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sat Jan 10 20:01:22 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 01:01:22 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] coco-link august 1989 Message-ID: http://rapidshare.de/files/41320884/coco-link.august.1989.pdf.html download it while you can From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sat Jan 10 20:20:54 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 20:20:54 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available by request In-Reply-To: <20090111000842.32F8420A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <49682443.3040603@gmail.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <4968C776.6080204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111000842.32F8420A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49694976.10403@worldnet.att.net> Roger Taylor wrote: > At 10:06 AM 1/10/2009, you wrote: >> Roger Taylor wrote: >>> CoCoTape e-mail #1 failed. I zipped the program to see if this works >>> with the gmail server. >> >> Roger when I enter cocotape on my WinXP system there is one line of >> the "useage" [should be usage :) ] message that looks suspect. >> >> > -cloadm, -csavem, -ml, -bin, -binary >> >> The leading > is part of the output. Is that a bug or an active >> indicator of some default setting? > > > > It's an Indicator of the default option. Does the program work on your > system? > > > I've not tried it yet. Will test it shortly and report results. From yahoogroups at aquaporin4.com Sat Jan 10 20:39:44 2009 From: yahoogroups at aquaporin4.com (Charles Richmond) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 19:39:44 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] coco-link august 1989 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <09DA6A19-6849-414E-88A0-245F13E76B05@aquaporin4.com> On Jan 10, 2009, at 7:01 PM, stinger30au wrote: > http://rapidshare.de/files/41320884/coco-link.august.1989.pdf.html > > download it while you can > If you scan the magazine in 400 dpi black & white, and *not* gray scale, then compress with CCITT 4 compression, you can get a *smaller* .pdf file. These files are *huge*. -- +----------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | +----------------------------------------------------------------+ From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sat Jan 10 22:23:06 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 03:23:06 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] more coco-link magazines Message-ID: http://rapidshare.de/files/41321239/coco-link.june.1989.pdf.html From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 10 22:40:13 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 21:40:13 -0600 Subject: [Coco] cocotape.exe available at CoCo3.com In-Reply-To: <200901101245.38863.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> References: <20090110033124.CFDCB20A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090110050303.17D5220A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090110060632.68F6E20A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901101245.38863.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <20090111034041.7836B20A14@qs281.pair.com> To everyone and those who wrote me privately asking for the CoCoTape command for Windows, here is the download link: http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownload&cid=14 I haven't heard anyone report how the program works for them. Any news? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Sat Jan 10 23:37:53 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 20:37:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <939805.55378.qm@web111201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <246447.61679.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I use http://www.zymic.com/ for FREE webhosting, PHP enabled, and supposed to be MySQL enabled (just don't expect the built in PHP mail functions to work). They give you a format such as http://babic.zxq.net for your website, and no ads. They just don't want you to use it for a file repository or illegal useage. I don't think it would be a problem for your use. -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Fri, 1/9/09, John Eric wrote: > From: John Eric > Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Friday, January 9, 2009, 3:13 PM > My next project will be a 512k upgrade card that intercepts > the GIME 256 cycle refresh and converts it to a 512 cycle > refresh so that I can use the 256Kx4 DRAM chips in my junk > box to make a cooler running 512k upgrade. A small CPLD and > 4 RAM chips will make up the complete board. So, this brings > to mind, a question: Where is a good free webpage that I can > set up to bring these projects to you all? > > Many Thanks - JEric From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Sat Jan 10 23:41:48 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 20:41:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 In-Reply-To: <200901091633.13453.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <331291.30514.qm@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> This requires either a Static IP, or a DNS service that works with dynamic IP addresses. And, as you already noted, you are at the mercy of your ISP as to upload/download speeds. -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Fri, 1/9/09, Gene Heskett wrote: > From: Gene Heskett > Subject: Re: [Coco] Resurrecting a dead CoCo 3 > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Friday, January 9, 2009, 3:33 PM > Depending on your present box, you could do like I have and > set up my own web > server on port 85, blocking vz's port 80 blockage they > claim they aren't > doing. Sure they don't. Yup, denial ain't a river > in Egypt. You can see > what tries to keep this old fart out of the bars at > > > > My uplink is slow, so it won't load like slashdot, but > it works. Probably > better than me, but I keep plugging along since the > alternative is worse. :) > > -- > Cheers, Gene From charles.shrader at gmail.com Sat Jan 10 23:10:59 2009 From: charles.shrader at gmail.com (Charles Shrader) Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 23:10:59 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] more coco-link magazines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <617B08B8EA1B4FC09B07FDB9B68D42DC@CHUCK03> How long do these typically stay up? Chuck -----Original Message----- From: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com [mailto:ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of stinger30au Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 10:23 PM To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com Subject: [Color Computer] more coco-link magazines http://rapidshare. de/files/41321239/coco-link.june.1989.pdf.html From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sun Jan 11 00:59:41 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 05:59:41 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: coco-link august 1989 In-Reply-To: <09DA6A19-6849-414E-88A0-245F13E76B05@aquaporin4.com> Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Charles Richmond wrote: > > On Jan 10, 2009, at 7:01 PM, stinger30au wrote: > > > http://rapidshare.de/files/41320884/coco-link.august.1989.pdf.html > > > > download it while you can > > > If you scan the magazine in 400 dpi black & white, and *not* > gray scale, then compress with CCITT 4 compression, you can get > a *smaller* .pdf file. These files are *huge*. > > > -- > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > thanks for the tip... i have started to scan the stuff in line art and the pages that are colour im doing in colour mode... have brought the size down to about 160 meg... i have already done 7 mags, but from here on in thats how i will do them, thats for the tips From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sun Jan 11 01:06:40 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 06:06:40 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] more coco-link magazines pdf Message-ID: http://rapidshare.de/files/41321504/coco-link.june.1989.pdf.html From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sun Jan 11 01:25:27 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 06:25:27 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: coco-link august 1989 In-Reply-To: <09DA6A19-6849-414E-88A0-245F13E76B05@aquaporin4.com> Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Charles Richmond wrote: > > On Jan 10, 2009, at 7:01 PM, stinger30au wrote: > > > http://rapidshare.de/files/41320884/coco-link.august.1989.pdf.html > > > > download it while you can > > > If you scan the magazine in 400 dpi black & white, and *not* > gray scale, then compress with CCITT 4 compression, you can get > a *smaller* .pdf file. These files are *huge*. > > > -- > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > you will be pleased to know i have finished scanning oct/nov 1991 with the front and rear pages in colour just like the original and with lineart scanning have brought the size of the book right back to just 64 meg thanks for the tip... on wards with the scanning From Torsten at Dittel.info Sun Jan 11 04:28:44 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 10:28:44 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: <109216.74811.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <109216.74811.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I've got several RGB CoCo 1, 1a, 2, 2b and MC-10 with RGB output in my collection. These were made for France (Europe) only. They even produce the correct control voltages to select RGB via SCART. The place and space on the main PCB, where the HF modualtor would normally reside, has been used for the corresponding circuits. However, these are all 50Hz PAL models (not NTSC) and have a french keyboard layout (not QWERTY). Some pictures of the CoCo 2B board and RGB video sections: http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl1.jpg http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl2.jpg http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail1.jpg http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail2.jpg MC-10: http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0002.JPG http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0003.JPG http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0004.JPG Regards, Torsten From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Jan 11 08:26:33 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 08:26:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CocoTape Message-ID: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> Roger, Here is a test of the cocotape.exe version inadvertently posted to Maltedmedia. I used a short ml program of 639 bytes, multiple origins ($DF6, $FA50, $FB47, $FED0), and an execution address of $FC4F. Cocotape was tried with both default parameters, -data, and -d -g. The results were not what I expected. cocotape swread.bin -data or cocotape swread.bin COCOTAPE - TRS-80 Color Computer Cassette File Audio Generator (1.0) Converts a PC-stored file into a CoCo-Tape-File audio stream Copyright (C) 2009 by Roger Taylor All Rights Reserved - CoCo3.com single-segment contiguous binary Load address: $0DF6 EXEC address $FAF6 Streaming the audio now... Only the header came through the audio system. ======== cocotape swread.bin -b -g COCOTAPE - TRS-80 Color Computer Cassette File Audio Generator (1.0) Converts a PC-stored file into a CoCo-Tape-File audio stream Copyright (C) 2009 by Roger Taylor All Rights Reserved - CoCo3.com multi-segment binary program Streaming the audio now... This time the audio sounded normal for a multi-segment file. ========== cocotape swread.bin -o=swread.wav -g COCOTAPE - TRS-80 Color Computer Cassette File Audio Generator (1.0) Converts a PC-stored file into a CoCo-Tape-File audio stream Copyright (C) 2009 by Roger Taylor All Rights Reserved - CoCo3.com Creating WAVE file for multi-segment binary program The wav file was created and no audio was generated. ================ COCOTAPE - TRS-80 Color Computer Cassette File Audio Generator (1.0) Converts a PC-stored file into a CoCo-Tape-File audio stream Copyright (C) 2009 by Roger Taylor All Rights Reserved - CoCo3.com useage: cocotape SourceFile -option1 -option2 SourceFile = ASCII BASIC, token BASIC, binary, data, text, etc. file formats: -a (ASCII data) -b (Binary data) -g (force Gapped blocks, and multi-segment Machine Language) -c (force Contiguous blocks) -2 (produce a double-speed audio stream) -csave (Tokenized BASIC program) -csavea (ASCII BASIC program) > -cloadm, -csavem, -ml, -bin, -binary (Machine Language) {use -g for multi-origin files} -data (General data) {automatically invokes -b -g} -text (General data) {automatically invokes -a -g} -o=WaveFile (save the audio stream to a PC .wav file) -f (do not play the audio stream) {default if WaveFile is specified} -p (play the audio stream) {default if WaveFile is not specified} Based on the above -data should generate multi-segmented files but it is not. There is no indication that -g should automatically generate binary files, although that does seem sensible. ========== Now the punch line. The audio file was played into a Coco3 via the cassette port. What did I get, an ad from coco3.com! By golly ... It works!! It works!! .. By golly What a let down :) Aside from advertising priorities, this really is not a test of the program as the intended file was not sent. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 11 09:42:37 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 08:42:37 -0600 Subject: [Coco] CocoTape In-Reply-To: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> At 07:26 AM 1/11/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > >Here is a test of the cocotape.exe version inadvertently posted to >Maltedmedia. > >I used a short ml program of 639 bytes, multiple origins ($DF6, >$FA50, $FB47, $FED0), and an execution address of $FC4F. Cocotape >was tried with both default parameters, -data, and -d -g. The >results were not what I expected. > >cocotape swread.bin -data >or >cocotape swread.bin ?????? Robert, there is no advertising in the CoCoTape program, no more so than someone putting a sticker label on their product that tells where it was obtained. ALL files transferred report the same filename to the CoCo and I picked COCO3 COM instead of FILE EXT. CoCoTape isn't designed to replace a motor controlled tape deck, and no attempt will be made to translate a misc.-length PC filename into an 8.3 tape filename format. There's no need to. Just type CLOAD or CLOADM on the CoCo and the file will load. Now, on the test message you got, I see now that the MakeGappedBinary() routine in the source code clearly still has the test mode invoked. I apologize. You won't be able to transfer gapped binary files in CoCoTape 1.0. I see nothing that even comes close to an ad in this test message. It simply says By Golly It Works. As far as your bug report, I see no bugs in the -options, just a little confusing mis-wordage in the text. A machine language program is not a -data file. -data is for data like it says, as a file used by OPEN, not CLOADM. -data should not generate a CLOADM'able file -g alone should not generate a CLOADM'able file. I should have said, "add -g for...." -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sun Jan 11 04:41:33 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 09:41:33 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] coco-link magazine updating Message-ID: to save me a lot of stuffing round and cross posting stuff just bookmark this page http://coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3900#3900 im editing the post here everytime i upload a new book first 7 are 200 meg, from then on its about 64 meg i may even go back and re-do the first 7 at a later date From stinger30au at yahoo.com.au Sun Jan 11 04:11:15 2009 From: stinger30au at yahoo.com.au (stinger30au) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 09:11:15 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] feb 1990 coco-link Message-ID: http://rapidshare.de/files/41321961/coco-link.feburary.1990.pdf.html From Torsten at Dittel.info Sun Jan 11 15:51:04 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 21:51:04 +0100 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... Message-ID: ... and of course especially the new-born and your family. I read about an earthquake over there in San Jos?, CR. Best regards, Torsten From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Jan 11 20:44:05 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:44:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CocoTape In-Reply-To: <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> Roger Taylor wrote: > At 07:26 AM 1/11/2009, you wrote: >> Roger, >> >> Here is a test of the cocotape.exe version inadvertently posted to >> Maltedmedia. >> >> I used a short ml program of 639 bytes, multiple origins ($DF6, $FA50, >> $FB47, $FED0), and an execution address of $FC4F. Cocotape was tried >> with both default parameters, -data, and -d -g. The results were not >> what I expected. >> >> cocotape swread.bin -data >> or >> cocotape swread.bin > > > ?????? Robert, there is no advertising in the CoCoTape program, no more > so than someone putting a sticker label on their product that tells > where it was obtained. ALL files transferred report the same filename > to the CoCo and I picked COCO3 COM instead of FILE EXT. > CoCoTape isn't designed to replace a motor controlled tape deck, and no > attempt will be made to translate a misc.-length PC filename into an 8.3 > tape filename format. There's no need to. Just type CLOAD or CLOADM on > the CoCo and the file will load. > > Now, on the test message you got, I see now that the MakeGappedBinary() > routine in the source code clearly still has the test mode invoked. I > apologize. You won't be able to transfer gapped binary files in > CoCoTape 1.0. I see nothing that even comes close to an ad in this test > message. It simply says By Golly It Works. > > As far as your bug report, I see no bugs in the -options, just a little > confusing mis-wordage in the text. > A machine language program is not a -data file. -data is for data like > it says, as a file used by OPEN, not CLOADM. > -data should not generate a CLOADM'able file > -g alone should not generate a CLOADM'able file. I should have said, > "add -g for...." > > OK, I may have worded the report badly. I did expect to test transferring a file from a PC to a Coco. Instead of the chosen file, I got the file name COCO3.COM and the "by golly" message. That much worked but it does not constitute a complete test of a file transfer from my point of view. Are you saying I should run a test with a contiguous file because that would transfer, or would I just get the "by golly" message? From dml_68 at yahoo.com Sun Jan 11 21:57:58 2009 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:57:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCo Archives New files update Message-ID: <813443.8237.qm@web30206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Here are the newest files added to my coco archive TRS-80 Computing Newsletters Thanks to Grandpa John! Trivia fever Thanks to Dentman 42 (He indicated he will also be getting me the documentation soon) 10 Year Rainbow Magazine Index in .DSK format (I forget where I got these but thanks to who ever did this! The link to snag these is on the coco3 forum here: http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3912#3912 ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 11 22:25:56 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 21:25:56 -0600 Subject: [Coco] CocoTape In-Reply-To: <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090112032633.59B1120A1A@qs281.pair.com> At 07:44 PM 1/11/2009, you wrote: >OK, I may have worded the report badly. I did expect to test >transferring a file from a PC to a Coco. Instead of the chosen file, >I got the file name COCO3.COM and the "by golly" message. Ah. Well, the filename, not being important for the purpose of CoCoTape, had to be set to something. Alan Jones had a glitch at first trying to transfer an ASCII BASIC listing but it turned out he was omitting the "-" character in -csavea. Now it works. You just happen to go right for the only goofed routine I know of that I somehow (and I apologize) forgot to remove the test routines from. You've yet to report any part of the program that's actually working. I do appreciate the bug reports and the negative feedback because it lets me know what I need to do, but I was hoping by now to hear someone say that they transferred a file ok and was either amazi-fied, or not. :) >That much worked but it does not constitute a complete test of a >file transfer from my point of view. Are you saying I should run a >test with a contiguous file because that would transfer, or would I >just get the "by golly" message? The test message is only in the MakeGappedBinary() routine which is separate from the MakeContiguousBinary() routine. There shouldn't be any other mode that sends a By Golly message to the CoCo's VDG screen. I've loaded probably 60 games into my CoCo 2 already using CoCoTape, and played them. I've typed many sample BASIC listings using Rainbow or notepad, and CLOAD'ed those and they ran. The CoCo (stuck back in the early 80's) thinks it's a real tape file, only it's almost pure digital so there's little chance you'll see the ?IO ERROR from a poor signal unless your CoCo cable is shot or the PC sound is adjusted terrible. I even added extra delay between gaps to allow the CoCo to choke on incoming ASCII BASIC lines that take the tokenizer a bit of time to compress. No motor control is possible so hopefully this will work 100% of the time. I'll get 1.1 done shortly, and thanks for the reports. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From lamune at doki-doki.net Sun Jan 11 23:50:52 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:50:52 -0800 Subject: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) In-Reply-To: References: <109216.74811.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D92E@fenestra.lamunet.local> Interesting. I wonder how one derives the RGB signals from the luma, phase A and phase B signals that the 6847 spits out. > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Torsten Dittel > Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:29 AM > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Subject: Re: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! > (VideoMod for CoCo2) > > I've got several RGB CoCo 1, 1a, 2, 2b and MC-10 with RGB output in my > collection. These were made for France (Europe) only. They even produce > the correct control voltages to select RGB via SCART. The place and > space on the main PCB, where the HF modualtor would normally reside, > has > been used for the corresponding circuits. However, these are all 50Hz > PAL models (not NTSC) and have a french keyboard layout (not QWERTY). > > Some pictures of the CoCo 2B board and RGB video sections: > > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl1.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl2.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail1.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail2.jpg > > MC-10: > > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0002.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0003.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0004.JPG > > Regards, Torsten > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jan 12 09:50:05 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 09:50:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CocoTape In-Reply-To: <20090112032633.59B1120A1A@qs281.pair.com> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> <20090112032633.59B1120A1A@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> Tried another test but have no good way to evaluate the results. cocotape filename -b -o=test.wav COCOTAPE - TRS-80 Color Computer Cassette File Audio Generator (1.0) Converts a PC-stored file into a CoCo-Tape-File audio stream Copyright (C) 2009 by Roger Taylor All Rights Reserved - CoCo3.com Creating WAVE file for tokenized BASIC program That was not what I had in mind. I was trying to create a single segment binary data file, not a tokenized Basic program. How would that be done? As a general question, can cocotape be used to transfer large files to a Coco hard drive? That could only be done under OS-9 on the common Coco hard drive systems but there is no tape driver for OS-9. From vchester at setec-cr.com Mon Jan 12 10:56:21 2009 From: vchester at setec-cr.com (Chester A Patterson) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 09:56:21 -0600 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> 6.2 Richter Quite a scare. I was at my desk in the office, 3rd floor. Very solid building. Shook like crazy. At home a 1L unopened bottle of Chivas crashed to the floor. Fortunately that was the only casualty. We are accostomed to shakes. But not quakes. Thankyou for your concern! Kind regards, /Chester A Patterson San Jose, Costa Rica -----Original Message----- From: Torsten Dittel [mailto:Torsten at Dittel.info] Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 2:51 PM To: coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... ... and of course especially the new-born and your family. I read about an earthquake over there in San Jos?, CR. Best regards, Torsten From neilsmorr at gmail.com Mon Jan 12 12:54:59 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 17:54:59 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Replacement floppy drives and disks Message-ID: Floppy drives (LINK) is a google search which brings up a variety of hits. Oddly(?) the 360 K versions sell for 10 times the price of the 1.2 Mb versions right now! Neil From Rich.Ries at Honeywell.com Mon Jan 12 13:52:34 2009 From: Rich.Ries at Honeywell.com (Ries, Rich (NY80)) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 13:52:34 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy Drive Setup Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CC9A@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> I've had problems similar to Fedor Steeman. Could someone post which "teeth" should be pulled for which drive? Thanks, --Rich From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 12 14:08:05 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 14:08:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy Drive Setup Help In-Reply-To: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CC9A@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> References: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CC9A@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> Message-ID: <200901121408.05568.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 12 January 2009, Ries, Rich (NY80) wrote: >I've had problems similar to Fedor Steeman. Could someone post which >"teeth" should be pulled for which drive? > >Thanks, >--Rich > Normally one doesn't 'pull' the teeth. You find another spare connector and salvage the teeth out of it to fill up the existing connectors (you'll have to remove then from the cable to do that, then put them back on) and then use the jumpers on the drive to make it the drive number it is supposed to be. There are terminating resistor packs that look somewhat like an IC too, and only the last drive on the cable should have those installed. Done the full connector way, the drives can be on the cable in any order as long as the termination pack is only on the drive connected to the connector at the end of the cable. If one has access to a parts catalog, like DigiKey's, new connectors can also be had, as can 34 wire ribbon cable. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) October 12, the Discovery. It was wonderful to find America, but it would have been more wonderful to miss it. -- Mark Twain, "Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar" From Torsten at Dittel.info Mon Jan 12 14:34:46 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 20:34:46 +0100 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> References: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> Message-ID: Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 Regards, Torsten From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 12 16:09:22 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 16:09:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: References: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> Message-ID: <200901121609.22681.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 12 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: >Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: > >http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 > That does look like a decent shake. I'm glad you are ok, Chester. Any damage to your residence? >Regards, >Torsten > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The things that interest people most are usually none of their business. From boisy at tee-boy.com Mon Jan 12 12:26:39 2009 From: boisy at tee-boy.com (Boisy Pitre) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 12:26:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> References: <0A9B63EA8B906947A409C6F0295CA07E012B9886@setec-server.SETEC.COM> Message-ID: <8832BBC2-1F00-4ACD-9CC0-A2ED67C0EC27@tee-boy.com> Oh no, not the Chivas! :) Good whiskey. And glad to hear you're ok. Regards, Boisy G. Pitre -- Tee-Boy Mobile: 337.781.3570 Email: boisy at tee-boy.com Web: http://www.tee-boy.com On Jan 12, 2009, at 10:56 AM, Chester A Patterson wrote: > 6.2 Richter > Quite a scare. > I was at my desk in the office, 3rd floor. Very solid building. > Shook like crazy. > At home a 1L unopened bottle of Chivas crashed to the floor. > Fortunately that was the only casualty. > We are accostomed to shakes. But not quakes. > Thankyou for your concern! > > Kind regards, > > /Chester A Patterson > San Jose, Costa Rica > > -----Original Message----- > From: Torsten Dittel [mailto:Torsten at Dittel.info] > Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 2:51 PM > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... > > ... and of course especially the new-born and your family. I read > about an earthquake over there in San Jos?, CR. > > Best regards, > Torsten > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From petrander at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 04:14:32 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 10:14:32 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Hi, I have been ill hence my late reply... > Turn it over at the controller then, it has no 'key'. However, looking down > on the top of the controller, with the drive cable on the right end, there is > a marker on the cable connector indicating pin one. It should be on the top > back edge as its plugged into the controller, or is on my Disto 4n1 anyway. It is the same story at the controller side. There too there a plastic 'septum' (key?) preventing turing the cable over. But I will take another look and try another cable. If necessary I can try to get a new one somewhere (any tips?)... Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/10 Gene Heskett > On Saturday 10 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: > >Thanks guys! I do believe I have the connector connected to the 5.25" > drive > >because there is no other way to do it, because of the little plastic > >"septum" that I don't know the name of. But I will double-check, try > another > >cable and perhaps try some of the other suggestions. I might even try to > get > >my hands on a new cable from Cloud-9 or something. > > > >Cheers, > >Fedor > > Turn it over at the controller then, it has no 'key'. However, looking > down > on the top of the controller, with the drive cable on the right end, there > is > a marker on the cable connector indicating pin one. It should be on the > top > back edge as its plugged into the controller, or is on my Disto 4n1 anyway. > > >2009/1/9 Gene Heskett > > > >> On Friday 09 January 2009, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > >> >A connector on your cable is on backwards or plugged in to the drive or > >> >controller backwards. > >> > > >> >Bruce W. > >> > >> Ah yes, and the most obvious problem given the description. But I have > >> faith > >> in my fellow man, and had falsely assumed that was done correctly so I > >> jumped > >> to other miss-configured hardware issues. My bad. Thanks Bruce, for > the > >> reminder about the glaringly obvious. And I have egg on my face. > Again... > >> > >> >> Hi all, > >> >> > >> >> For some time now, I have possessed several floppy drives, most 5.25" > >> > >> and > >> > >> >> two 3.5". I have been setting these up in different configurations > and > >> >> different cases from time to time, taking head of the drive number > >> >> jumpers. > >> >> > >> >> Lately I have been trying set them up again, but I cannot get any of > >> >> the (loose) 5.25" drives to work anymore! I try to have one 3.5" > drive > >> >> set > >> > >> up > >> > >> >> with one 5.25" drive with the latter being drive 1. I set the jumpers > >> >> on the > >> >> appropriate locations and connect the cable like I used to do. > However, > >> >> whenever there is a floppy in the 5.25" drive it just keeps on > turning > >> > >> for > >> > >> >> no apparant reason. Whenever I try a DIR or a DSKINI I get an ?IO > >> >> ERROR. Switching the drive numbers has no effect. The 3.5" drive > works > >> >> fine. > >> >> > >> >> Since this occurs for every 5.25" drive I try I suspect this may have > >> >> something to do with the cable or jumper setup, but I have no idea > what > >> > >> I > >> > >> >> am > >> >> doing wrong. Does anyone have some tips? It would be greatly > >> > >> appreciated. > >> > >> >> I > >> >> still have hundreds of old floppies I would like to save somehow. > >> >> > >> >> Cheers, > >> >> Fedor > >> > > >> >-- > >> >Coco mailing list > >> >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >> > >> -- > >> Cheers, Gene > >> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > >> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > >> -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > >> There are new messages. > >> > >> -- > >> Coco mailing list > >> Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > It is better to kiss an avocado than to get in a fight with an aardvark. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jan 13 05:40:17 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 05:40:17 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901130540.17734.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: >Hi, > >I have been ill hence my late reply... Sorry to hear that. :( > >> Turn it over at the controller then, it has no 'key'. However, looking > >down > >> on the top of the controller, with the drive cable on the right end, there > >is > >> a marker on the cable connector indicating pin one. It should be on the > >top > >> back edge as its plugged into the controller, or is on my Disto 4n1 > >anyway. > >It is the same story at the controller side. There too there a plastic >'septum' (key?) preventing turing the cable over. But I will take another >look and try another cable. If necessary I can try to get a new one >somewhere (any tips?)... Are you sure that is a coco controller and cable? I think I have had at least one of every controller made, and have never seen a keyed connector on the controller end of the cable. And the symptoms described exactly fit one of the connectors being plugged in upside down. That does no harm that I have observed, but it does enable all the drive access leds, and of course doesn't work. Take some closeup pix, and if you have a pc, post them on 'http://pastebin.ca' and send the list the link(s) pastebin.ca shows you. Show it plugged in, and unplugged so we can see the mating faces of the connectors. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Captain Penny's Law: You can fool all of the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you Can't Fool Mom. From exwn8jef at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 06:33:49 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:33:49 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> <20090112032633.59B1120A1A@qs281.pair.com> <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> Gang, I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > From snhirsch at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 07:08:22 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 07:08:22 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <20090111144310.E3F6820A13@qs281.pair.com> <496AA065.3000703@worldnet.att.net> <20090112032633.59B1120A1A@qs281.pair.com> <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, N8WQ wrote: > Gang, > I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. > http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >From Cloud-9 Mark, no less! -- From mechacoco at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 11:22:21 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 09:22:21 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: References: <200901091417.05120.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901130822i44b2f27en743148a48ee8635a@mail.gmail.com> On 1/13/09, Fedor Steeman wrote: > > It is the same story at the controller side. There too there a plastic > 'septum' (key?) preventing turing the cable over. But I will take another > look and try another cable. If necessary I can try to get a new one > somewhere (any tips?)... > > Cheers, > Fedor > --- As long as the 'septum' (key) in every connector are all on the same side of the cable then everything should be okay. Darren From mechacoco at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 11:28:01 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 09:28:01 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: <200901130540.17734.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901101045.20014.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901130540.17734.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901130828m3c1fbbcdudea1604f60424430@mail.gmail.com> On 1/13/09, Gene Heskett wrote: > > Are you sure that is a coco controller and cable? I think I have had at > least > one of every controller made, and have never seen a keyed connector on the > controller end of the cable. I just looked at my 26-3029, FD-501 and FD-502. They all have the key slot on the controller board. I no longer have any of the original cables supplied by Radio Shack so I can't say if the cable connectors were keyed or not. Darren From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Tue Jan 13 12:16:52 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:16:52 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1110007301.4217191231867012081.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Steven, Yep, that is one of the rooms full of stuff that I have CoCo related. I will be placing more items up in the near future I hope. Some rare, others not so rare. Not going out of business, just lots of CoCo stuff. Mark Cloud-9 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Hirsch" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 6:08:22 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, N8WQ wrote: > Gang, > I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. > http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >From Cloud-9 Mark, no less! -- -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From vchester at setec-cr.com Tue Jan 13 12:59:20 2009 From: vchester at setec-cr.com (Chester Patterson) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:59:20 -0600 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: <200901121609.22681.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Those folks got off easy! It felt a lot worse than it looks in that video. No damage on the home front. We build for this kind of thing. Thicker glass, lots or steel rod (vertical & horizontal), building blocks (walls) filled with concrete, flexible junctions on all water, gas and electric ducting, the works. We had another one this morning 01:08AM 4.2 I slept through that one. My wife and daughter (13) jumped up and openned all the doors. Looks like it may be a lively 2009! My ramshackle stack of Coco hardware did not fall off the top shelf in the closet. The Chivas will be missed. Have to pop the cork on the Nicaraguan rum then! /Chester -----Original Message----- From: Gene Heskett [mailto:gene.heskett at verizon.net] Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 3:09 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... On Monday 12 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: >Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: > >http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 > That does look like a decent shake. I'm glad you are ok, Chester. Any damage to your residence? >Regards, >Torsten From ed_s_429 at yahoo.com Tue Jan 13 14:07:39 2009 From: ed_s_429 at yahoo.com (Ed Siler) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:07:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff Message-ID: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I've started digging out my CoCo collection & it's kind of daunting - there's a LOT!! Have some time on my hands due to a layoff - need the space, need some cash, now's the time! ? Everything was packed tight & sealed years ago, I'd kind of forgotten how much was in that closet. So far, at least 5 CoCo's ranging from a D-board to?CC3's. A Dragon 64. An MC10. TP10's, DMP110 printers, floppy drives, multipaks, yada yada. Memory chips, extra ECB chips, more. Boxes of books & software ranging from kiddy stuff to OS9 L2. Mags. And so on. Almost everything is pristine, most hardware's in original boxes. All worked at the time. ?? I put a bunch of pics in an album on the group site - hope that's OK? http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/photos/album/600773952/pic/list ? That's far from all of it, I haven't even looked at the floppies to see what they are. More paks, more books, hardware, etc. Cassettes, cassette drive, modem, mouse, joysticks, cables,?who knows what else. ? I'll probably start listing these things on eBay within the next week or so, unless there's a better option. (suggestions?) ?Just thought I'd post some pics & see if there's?interest! ? Ed St Louis, MO From neilsmorr at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 14:20:27 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 19:20:27 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: You can post them here on this web site Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications : For Sale Just send an email that you've listed them on it. Neil --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Ed Siler wrote: > I've started digging out my CoCo collection & it's kind of daunting - there's a LOT!! Have some time on my hands due to a layoff - need the space, need some cash, now's the time! > I'll probably start listing these things on eBay within the next week or so, unless there's a better option. (suggestions?) ?Just thought I'd post some pics & see if there's?interest! > ? > Ed > St Louis, MO From jet.pack at ymail.com Tue Jan 13 14:53:17 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:53:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCo 1 & 2 Monitor Adapters Message-ID: <837160.60305.qm@web111210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Haven't had a lot of time to work on the hobby the past couple of days, but it seems that a color composite monitor adapter can be had with three components. An NPN Darlington, 30 Ohm or so resistor and a .1uF capacitor. I haven't tested this yet (I have ordered some BC517's and MPSA14's - either should work) and will test it when I get them, but connect the collector to +5v, the capacitor from the collector to ground, one end of the 30 ohm resistor to the emitter with the other end of the resistor being the composite output (referenced to ground) and input the video signal into the base. The video signal should be taken from pin 12 of the MC1372 (which is most likely going to be located inside the RF Modulator :) That should give a decent quality composite color video signal, HOWEVER wait until I get the parts and test it - I don't want anyone to smoke their CoCo :) - of course the darlington could be replaced with two NPN general purpose transistors in the darlington configuration. I will test them both and post the results as soon as the parts arrive. -Jeric From jet.pack at ymail.com Tue Jan 13 14:55:34 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:55:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Printed Circuit Board Manufacturers Message-ID: <500164.77682.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Are there any "cheap" pcb makers that take Eagle generated schematics? I wanted to use PCB123, but I don't know if I can submit eagle files? I guess I should go to their site and check the FAQ's... Thanks Jeric From sklammer at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 15:56:40 2009 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 15:56:40 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3925f0b0901131256i521a6af6m69d2a8ef0fa839f5@mail.gmail.com> I'm also in a layoff position and it's been tough; however, may I suggest that like your photo link, you give people a "first crack" at buying some of your stock before listing on eBay? sk 2009/1/13 Neil Morrison > You can post them here on this web site > > Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications : For Sale > > Just send an email that you've listed them on it. > > Neil > > --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Ed Siler wrote: > > > I've started digging out my CoCo collection & it's kind of > daunting - there's a LOT!! Have some time on my hands due to a > layoff - need the space, need some cash, now's the time! > > > I'll probably start listing these things on eBay within the next > week or so, unless there's a better option. (suggestions?) Just > thought I'd post some pics & see if there's interest! > > > > Ed > > St Louis, MO > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jan 13 17:00:53 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:00:53 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0901130828m3c1fbbcdudea1604f60424430@mail.gmail.com> References: <200901130540.17734.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <5d802cd0901130828m3c1fbbcdudea1604f60424430@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901131700.53977.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Darren A wrote: >On 1/13/09, Gene Heskett wrote: >> Are you sure that is a coco controller and cable? I think I have had at >> least >> one of every controller made, and have never seen a keyed connector on the >> controller end of the cable. > >I just looked at my 26-3029, FD-501 and FD-502. They all have the key >slot on the controller board. I no longer have any of the original >cables supplied by Radio Shack so I can't say if the cable connectors >were keyed or not. > Which prompted me to go play rat terrier in the basement for about 10 minutes. A 26-3022 does have the slot, Tony's 4n1 has the slot, 2 J&M's don't, and I wasn't able to find either the HDI or the short pack from the EDISK I built. And like you, no original cables so I can't further declaim. All of mine are keyless. And I sit corrected. My apologies. But that does take us back to one of the drives is plugged in upside down doesn't it? This can be done hot if a clip lead to ground is connected to everything, otherwise plug it all into a power strip and use that as a power switch, not by using the strips switch, but by unplugging it. Unplug the interface cable from all drives but one. Test to see if the drive led comes on and stays on when powered up, if so, turn it over at that drive & test again. If not (and it should not stay on), move the cable to the next drive using the next connector. Repeat. If all drives turn on the led and probably run the motor regardless of the connector up or down, the controller is probably toast. Frankly, I'm amazed at how dependable this stuff has been in the face of the poorest AC power connections ever foisted off on the consumer, with no static grounding thru a 3rd pin power plug in 90% of whats out in the wild. This is just one of the many reasons all the power supply parts have been removed from mine and it is all running on an old AT style supply, with the std 3 wire power cable used for everything. That poor, shoulda been sick bird even then, power cabling was probably the controlling factor in the loss of 3 drive controllers in the 13 years one of them spent at the tv station playing like it was an EDISK, using the factory power cords and getting slapped around seriously by mother nature, who just loved to use that 255 foot tower 50 feet away for target practice. That stuff took several blow all the audio da's all to hell hits on my watch cuz many of the output lines, being as much as 200 feet long to reach the newsroom, made great antennas for the EMP generated by a good lightning strike. In retrospect, 200% predictable. :) >Darren > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Knowledge is power -- knowledge shared is power lost. -- Aleister Crowley From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jan 13 17:03:55 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:03:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >Gang, >I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQ >ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=6 >6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 > >Alan Jones Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) In Hollywood, all marriages are happy. It's trying to live together afterwards that causes the problems. -- Shelley Winters From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jan 13 17:05:37 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:05:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901131705.37035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: >Those folks got off easy! It felt a lot worse than it looks in that video. >No damage on the home front. We build for this kind of thing. >Thicker glass, lots or steel rod (vertical & horizontal), building blocks >(walls) filled with concrete, flexible junctions on all water, gas and >electric ducting, the works. > >We had another one this morning 01:08AM 4.2 I slept through that one. My >wife and daughter (13) jumped up and openned all the doors. > >Looks like it may be a lively 2009! > >My ramshackle stack of Coco hardware did not fall off the top shelf in the >closet. >The Chivas will be missed. Have to pop the cork on the Nicaraguan rum then! > That's terrible, what a comedown. :) >/Chester >-----Original Message----- >From: Gene Heskett [mailto:gene.heskett at verizon.net] >Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 3:09 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... > >On Monday 12 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: >>Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: >> >>http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 > >That does look like a decent shake. I'm glad you are ok, Chester. >Any damage to your residence? > >>Regards, >>Torsten > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Nothing makes one so vain as being told that one is a sinner. Conscience makes egotists of us all. -- Oscar Wilde From badfrog at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 17:06:08 2009 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 16:06:08 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <9efa17da0901131406q3a4f2823t6cbcebfecde81634@mail.gmail.com> Yes, it is. It's an excellent RS-232 pack replacement. Sold mine for about $70 back in September. On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >>Gang, >>I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >>http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQ >>ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=6 >>6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >> >>Alan Jones > > Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > In Hollywood, all marriages are happy. It's trying to live together > afterwards that causes the problems. > -- Shelley Winters > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jcewy at swbell.net Tue Jan 13 17:26:12 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 16:26:12 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <4969F389.10204@worldnet.att.net> <496B589D.5030908@worldnet.att.net> <496C7C1D.2040805@gmail.com> <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <496D1504.3060102@swbell.net> Gene Heskett wrote: > On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: > >> Gang, >> I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQ >> ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=6 >> 6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >> >> Alan Jones >> > > Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. > > > Yup. They were made in Wichita, KS. I believe some of the people involved were members of the Wichita Area Color Computer Club, which I attended back in the day. JCE From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Tue Jan 13 17:46:59 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:46:59 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901131703.55040.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <909962087.4324051231886819253.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Gene, Gene, Gene, You haven't lived till you had a TelePak. I contacted Bren last summer. We met a long time ago, actually doesn't seem that long ago! Yes it is a CoCo Pak. Mark Cloud-9 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Heskett" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 4:03:55 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >Gang, >I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQQ >ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=6 >6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 > >Alan Jones Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) In Hollywood, all marriages are happy. It's trying to live together afterwards that causes the problems. -- Shelley Winters -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jan 13 18:01:35 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 18:01:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <909962087.4324051231886819253.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <909962087.4324051231886819253.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <200901131801.35975.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Mark Marlette wrote: >Gene, Gene, Gene, > >You haven't lived till you had a TelePak. > >I contacted Bren last summer. We met a long time ago, actually doesn't seem > that long ago! > >Yes it is a CoCo Pak. > Does it work in a cc3? Mmmm, that's probably moot anyway as most would run it in an MPI anyway, solving the 12 volt problem. Can it do more than the deluxe 232 packs default 9600? And what would one use for a driver in that case with recent Nitros9? >Mark >Cloud-9 > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gene Heskett" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 4:03:55 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central >Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak > >On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >>Gang, >>I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >>http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQ >>Q >> ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms >>=6 6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >> >>Alan Jones > >Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Dumb terminal From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Tue Jan 13 18:06:06 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 23:06:06 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901131801.35975.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <425994472.4328361231887966778.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Gene, 6551 with the MAX232 chip for the level translation. CC3, no problem. Not sure about speed, I am sure it will fly. I have been 16550 for a long time. This is just an extra. Naming convention changed in the last NitrOS-9. Should be 6551 something. Should be REALLY obvious what the module is. Not in front of my NOS machine now. Happy New Year! Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Heskett" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 5:01:35 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Mark Marlette wrote: >Gene, Gene, Gene, > >You haven't lived till you had a TelePak. > >I contacted Bren last summer. We met a long time ago, actually doesn't seem > that long ago! > >Yes it is a CoCo Pak. > Does it work in a cc3? Mmmm, that's probably moot anyway as most would run it in an MPI anyway, solving the 12 volt problem. Can it do more than the deluxe 232 packs default 9600? And what would one use for a driver in that case with recent Nitros9? >Mark >Cloud-9 > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gene Heskett" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 4:03:55 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central >Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak > >On Tuesday 13 January 2009, N8WQ wrote: >>Gang, >>I just saw this on ebay in case anyone is interested. >>http://cgi.ebay.com/Telepak-RS232-Pack_W0QQitemZ280301707215QQcmdZViewItemQ >>Q >> ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280301707215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms >>=6 6%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 >> >>Alan Jones > >Is that a coco item? The pix aren't good enough to tell. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Dumb terminal -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From shadow at shadowgard.com Tue Jan 13 18:31:12 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 15:31:12 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com>, Message-ID: <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 13 Jan 2009 at 19:20, Neil Morrison wrote: > You can post them here on this web site > > Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications : For Sale This is the second time you've said something like this. But without an actual URL, it's not a lot of use. -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From devries.bob at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 18:54:44 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 09:54:44 +1000 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM Message-ID: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been corrupted. :( A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using an EPROM programmer is what I'd need. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ From brucewcalkins at charter.net Tue Jan 13 19:08:05 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 19:08:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: > Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that > fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. > > I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been > corrupted. :( > > A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is > not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data > lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using an > EPROM programmer is what I'd need. > > -- > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia I'm sure others would like that file too. Bruce W. From jdaggett at gate.net Tue Jan 13 19:09:58 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 19:09:58 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Printed Circuit Board Manufacturers In-Reply-To: <500164.77682.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <500164.77682.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <496CE706.28742.AC77EA@jdaggett.gate.net> On 13 Jan 2009 at 11:55, John Eric wrote: > Are there any "cheap" pcb makers that take Eagle generated schematics? > I wanted to use PCB123, but I don't know if I can submit eagle files? > I guess I should go to their site and check the FAQ's... Thanks Jeric > Try the eagleUSA webpage for fab houses. PCB123(ExpressPCB) i don't think will take Eagle format files. They use their own proprietary software as well as PCBexpress. There is PCBex.com that will take gerber274 and excellon drill files. They may take the eagle file itself. If you are doing a two layer board there is BatchPCB. They claim two layer boards with soldermask and silkscreen for $2.5 per square inch plus setup and shipping. I am close to sending them a board file soon as a test. They will do single boards for you. james From ed_s_429 at yahoo.com Tue Jan 13 19:33:10 2009 From: ed_s_429 at yahoo.com (Ed Siler) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 16:33:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Accessing "for sale" page (was Huge bunch of CoCo stuff) In-Reply-To: <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: <145324.73219.qm@web53707.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Leonard, To see what Neil means, go to the group homepage: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ ? Look to the left menu & scroll down to "Applications" - click on it & you'll see. Ed --- On Tue, 1/13/09, shadow at shadowgard.com wrote: From: shadow at shadowgard.com Subject: Re: [Color Computer] Re: Huge bunch of CoCo stuff To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 5:31 PM On 13 Jan 2009 at 19:20, Neil Morrison wrote: > You can post them here on this web site > > Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications : For Sale This is the second time you've said something like this. But without an actual URL, it's not a lot of use. -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From devries.bob at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 19:43:44 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:43:44 +1000 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? Anyone know? -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce W. Calkins" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 10:08 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM >> Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that >> fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. >> >> I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been >> corrupted. :( >> >> A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is >> not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data >> lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using >> an EPROM programmer is what I'd need. >> >> -- >> Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia > > > I'm sure others would like that file too. > > Bruce W. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From neilsmorr at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 19:36:01 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 16:36:01 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com>, <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> I assumed you'd know this list has a site : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ a.. Home Home Page a.. Messages Message Archive a.. Files a.. Photos a.. Links a.. Database a.. Polls a.. Calendar a.. Applications This is where you can buy, sell or give away stuff. You can do a lot more than just send and receive messages by email! Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: shadow at shadowgard.com On 13 Jan 2009 at 19:20, Neil Morrison wrote: > You can post them here on this web site > > Groups Labs (Beta) : Applications : For Sale This is the second time you've said something like this. But without an actual URL, it's not a lot of use. -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com . From skwirl42 at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 20:44:47 2009 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 21:44:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30901131744k36e59ec5lfaad0050ebb66399@mail.gmail.com> On 1/13/09, Neil Morrison wrote: > I assumed you'd know this list has a site : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ But since the list there is tied into the maltedmedia list, some people who use the maltedmedia entry point don't know about the yahoo group. -- James Dessart From skwirl42 at gmail.com Tue Jan 13 20:44:47 2009 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 21:44:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30901131744k36e59ec5lfaad0050ebb66399@mail.gmail.com> On 1/13/09, Neil Morrison wrote: > I assumed you'd know this list has a site : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ But since the list there is tied into the maltedmedia list, some people who use the maltedmedia entry point don't know about the yahoo group. -- James Dessart From shadow at shadowgard.com Tue Jan 13 21:24:37 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 18:24:37 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Accessing "for sale" page (was Huge bunch of CoCo stuff) In-Reply-To: <145324.73219.qm@web53707.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com>, <145324.73219.qm@web53707.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <496CDC65.10446.23541BEE@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 13 Jan 2009 at 16:33, Ed Siler wrote: > To see what Neil means, go to the group homepage: > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ > ? > Look to the left menu & scroll down to "Applications" - click on it & > you'll see. Some of us get the posts via email to *avoid* having to go to Yahoo! :-) -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From shadow at shadowgard.com Tue Jan 13 21:24:37 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 18:24:37 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo stuff on ebay Message-ID: <496CDC65.4320.23541C9A@shadow.shadowgard.com> I've unearthed more TRS-80 stuff that I'm putting up on eBay. A CGP-220 printer, a couple of old gray Cocos (one works, the other is going along as spare parts). A Dragon 64 (ok, it's not Tandy, but it's a clone). CoCo multi-pak interface (the white one), the Light & Appliance controller for the CoCO (the later one that uses a Program pak) A speech-sound pak for the coco. Deluxe RS-232 pak for the coco TP-10 printer for the CoCo or MC-10 and *three* PTC-64 printer controllers. I'm also relisting some Program Paks for the CoCo: Color Logo Color Scripsit Gomoku/Renju Handyman -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From RJRTTY at aol.com Tue Jan 13 21:29:06 2009 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 21:29:06 EST Subject: [Coco] CoCo 1 & 2 Monitor Adapters Message-ID: In a message dated 1/13/2009 2:53:44 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jet.pack at ymail.com writes: >HOWEVER wait until I get the parts and test it - I >don't want anyone to smoke their CoCo :) - of >course the darlington could be replaced with two >NPN general purpose transistors in >the darlington configuration. I will test them both >and post the results as soon as the parts arrive. -Jeric I use the two NPN transistors in the darlington configuration and it does work well. Roy **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) From briang0671 at sbcglobal.net Tue Jan 13 22:03:04 2009 From: briang0671 at sbcglobal.net (Brian Goers) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 21:03:04 -0600 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> Bob Devries wrote: > I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has > distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that > includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? > > Anyone know? > > -- > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. But it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony Podraza if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the distribution rights to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as soon as I can. Later Brian -- Brian Goers Glenside Vice-President of Special Events IDE Boards are available. The 18th Annual ?LAST? Chicago CoCoFEST! Will be held March 28 & 29 2009 Holiday Inn & Suites Elgin. The website had to be moved due to the abrupt shut-down of AOL's Hometown. Here's the new URL: http://ncmedals.com/glenside/index.html From tonym at compusource.net Tue Jan 13 22:55:11 2009 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:55:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <1231905311.11918.1.camel@d610> On Tue, 2009-01-13 at 21:03 -0600, Brian Goers wrote: > Bob Devries wrote: > > I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has > > distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that > > includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? > > > > Anyone know? > > > > -- > > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia > I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. But > it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. > I will ask Tony Podraza if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have > the distribution rights to the G&B software. > I'll let everyone know as soon as I can. > Later > Brian > Give me a little while to look. I could swear someone sent it to me via email in the past 6 months. Gotta swap hard drives - on my Dell Latitude, by day I run windows at work, and Ultimate Edition linux on a 2nd hard disk for home. Tony From tonym at compusource.net Tue Jan 13 23:15:24 2009 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 04:15:24 GMT Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM Message-ID: <200901132315789.SM05912@[208.76.35.239]> Bob, Does that mean the .BIN file you sent me of v3.0 of the XT-ROM is no good? You emailed it to me on September 30, 2008. Tony -----Original Message----- From: Bob Devries devries.bob at gmail.com Sent 1/13/2009 7:43:44 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? Anyone know? -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce W. Calkins" brucewcalkins at charter.net To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" coco at maltedmedia.com Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 10:08 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been corrupted. :( A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using an EPROM programmer is what I'd need. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia I'm sure others would like that file too. Bruce W. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Tue Jan 13 23:48:00 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 20:48:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCo 1 & 2 Monitor Adapters References: Message-ID: <176612.50044.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> cool :-) I was looking to do that first, then use an lm1881 to extract vertical sync (or two one shots to get vertical sync from FS* of the vdg), the vdg outputs the horizontal sync*, then using fast comparators or op-amps as comparators to get rgb from the difference signals (does this sound like it will work?) -jeric ________________________________ From: "RJRTTY at aol.com" To: coco at maltedmedia.com Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 8:29:06 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] CoCo 1 & 2 Monitor Adapters In a message dated 1/13/2009 2:53:44 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jet.pack at ymail.com writes: >HOWEVER wait until I get the parts and test it - I >don't want anyone to smoke their CoCo :) - of >course the darlington could be replaced with two >NPN general purpose transistors in >the darlington configuration. I will test them both >and post the results as soon as the parts arrive. -Jeric I use the two NPN transistors in the darlington configuration and it does work well. Roy **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From rcrislip at neo.rr.com Tue Jan 13 23:56:08 2009 From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (richec) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 23:56:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <1110007301.4217191231867012081.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <1110007301.4217191231867012081.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <200901132356.08157.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> Hi Mark, What the difference betweet that and Tandy's RS232 Pak? TIA From petrander at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 05:25:47 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:25:47 +0100 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: <200901131705.37035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901131705.37035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: A few weeks ago we had the worst earthquake in Denmark in over a century! It measured 4 on the Richter scale... :-) I believe the only reported casualties were a housecat and a tortoise. A group of people immediately designed and started selling t-shirts with the text "Copenhagen Earthquake Survivor '08": http://www.riisjensen.dk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=279:jordskaelvs-overlever&catid=1:humor&Itemid=15#content Also, some disgruntled people who slept through the earthquake started a facebook group called "Group for earthquakes when we are awake!" ( http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=39892733471) I was actually awake myself at that time, eating breakfast. I never experienced an earthquake before and it took me a few minutes to conclude that it was just that! I remember being bent over my cereals half awake and suddenly the chair, table and floor felt like jelly pudding. A looked around to see whether I was dreaming, but noticed that the christmas tree decorations were still dangling after the shake, so it was real enough! Pretty cool... Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/13 Gene Heskett > On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: > >Those folks got off easy! It felt a lot worse than it looks in that video. > >No damage on the home front. We build for this kind of thing. > >Thicker glass, lots or steel rod (vertical & horizontal), building blocks > >(walls) filled with concrete, flexible junctions on all water, gas and > >electric ducting, the works. > > > >We had another one this morning 01:08AM 4.2 I slept through that one. My > >wife and daughter (13) jumped up and openned all the doors. > > > >Looks like it may be a lively 2009! > > > >My ramshackle stack of Coco hardware did not fall off the top shelf in the > >closet. > >The Chivas will be missed. Have to pop the cork on the Nicaraguan rum > then! > > > That's terrible, what a comedown. :) > > >/Chester > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Gene Heskett [mailto:gene.heskett at verizon.net] > >Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 3:09 PM > >Subject: Re: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... > > > >On Monday 12 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: > >>Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: > >> > >>http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 > > > >That does look like a decent shake. I'm glad you are ok, Chester. > >Any damage to your residence? > > > >>Regards, > >>Torsten > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > Nothing makes one so vain as being told that one is a sinner. > Conscience makes egotists of us all. > -- Oscar Wilde > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From petrander at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 05:29:42 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:29:42 +0100 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30901131744k36e59ec5lfaad0050ebb66399@mail.gmail.com> References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <496CB3C0.12030.22B4C400@shadow.shadowgard.com> <3050390D5C9D4535A811434C70C332D0@NewBaby> <4c56cbd30901131744k36e59ec5lfaad0050ebb66399@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Cool! There is a Yahoo group! Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/14 James Dessart > On 1/13/09, Neil Morrison wrote: > > I assumed you'd know this list has a site : > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/ > > But since the list there is tied into the maltedmedia list, some > people who use the maltedmedia entry point don't know about the yahoo > group. > > -- > James Dessart > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 07:02:43 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 07:02:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <200901132315789.SM05912@[208.76.35.239]> References: <200901132315789.SM05912@[208.76.35.239]> Message-ID: On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, tonym wrote: > Bob, > > Does that mean the .BIN file you sent me of v3.0 of the XT-ROM is no good? > You emailed it to me on September 30, 2008. I think that's the implication, since I received a copy at about the same time and was unable to get it working. -- From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 07:05:04 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 07:05:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Brian Goers wrote: >> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has >> distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that includes >> the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? > I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. But > it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony Podraza > if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the distribution rights > to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as soon as I can. To my knowledge, the ROM contains nothing specific to the drive. It "dumbly" attempts to read the track that contains the OS-9 bootloader, looking for it at the same offset as it would occupy on a floppy (Track 19?). Any unit-specific information is patched into the OS. -- From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Wed Jan 14 08:50:52 2009 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 07:50:52 -0600 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> <007e01c975e1$29ce5810$0701a8c0@master> <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <07C74F30-DC44-4E4E-BA91-6E1781120D57@sasktel.net> The XT ROM does not have anything hard coded into it concerning the drive; it uses sector 0 like other OS-9 drives. The only exception is if you want two different boots - if you are going to use the 2nd boot then it used either track 128 or 129 (can't remember) for the alternate boot track. Sent from my iPhone L. Curtis Boyle On Jan 14, 2009, at 6:05 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Brian Goers wrote: > >>> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who >>> has distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if >>> that includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? > >> I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. >> But it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony >> Podraza if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the >> distribution rights to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as >> soon as I can. > > To my knowledge, the ROM contains nothing specific to the drive. It > "dumbly" attempts to read the track that contains the OS-9 > bootloader, looking for it at the same offset as it would occupy on > a floppy (Track 19?). Any unit-specific information is patched into > the OS. > > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From farna at att.net Wed Jan 14 10:08:42 2009 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:08:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! Message-ID: <496DFFFA.7050605@att.net> I recall a little about 5.25" floppies though I haven't messed with one (or a physical CoCo) in years! But I built all my floppy systems from scratch. If the cable is plugged onto the drive upside down the drive light will come on and the motor will run continuously. So it should be obvious if that's the problem. Even if you think it's not, flip the connector over. Try both drives on the same connector first, one at a time. It doesn't matter which connector is on a drive, it will still work. If the connectors have all teeth the drive will work as jumpered, if missing teeth it will work as the position in the cable -- first connector is drive 0, second one drive 1. Just issue a "dir" command for the cable position if missing teeth. Both drives need to be tested for both positions though. Some drives have termination resistor one one drive, some use a "distributed termination" with a smaller termination resistor on each. If you have an older drive in the D0 position look for a termination resistor. It will be an in-line pin item with 5-6 legs, either in a socket or with a jumper nearby. You may need to remove it from the first drive, and install/activate on the second. I seem to recall some floppies being set up this way, though it's most common on a SCSI buss. ---------- Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:00:53 -0500 From: Gene Heskett >I just looked at my 26-3029, FD-501 and FD-502. They all have the key >slot on the controller board. I no longer have any of the original >cables supplied by Radio Shack so I can't say if the cable connectors >were keyed or not. > Which prompted me to go play rat terrier in the basement for about 10 minutes. A 26-3022 does have the slot, Tony's 4n1 has the slot, 2 J&M's don't, and I wasn't able to find either the HDI or the short pack from the EDISK I built. And like you, no original cables so I can't further declaim. All of mine are keyless. And I sit corrected. My apologies. But that does take us back to one of the drives is plugged in upside down doesn't it? -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From brucewcalkins at charter.net Wed Jan 14 10:42:26 2009 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:42:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Floppy drive setup HELP! References: <496DFFFA.7050605@att.net> Message-ID: <4A7415F9D33C4E7BBF111306708ABFD5@speedy> >> I just looked at my 26-3029, FD-501 and FD-502. They all have the key >> slot on the controller board. I no longer have any of the original cables >> supplied by Radio Shack so I can't say if the cable connectors were keyed >> or not. The symptoms are of a reversed connection. So, like Frank suggested, a little gum shoe detective work is in order. This is whay I have grown to hate building Win-Tel systems from old parts. It offen takes a day to find one simple defective part. Bruce W. From vchester at setec-cr.com Wed Jan 14 10:49:30 2009 From: vchester at setec-cr.com (Chester Patterson) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 09:49:30 -0600 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <07C74F30-DC44-4E4E-BA91-6E1781120D57@sasktel.net> Message-ID: <402B480218EB4FB4A7ECBDDD10FF2531@chester> B&B rigs (of which I configured and sold several during my stint at Howard Medical) do not require a PROM installed in the controller (we used the DTC-5150 controller, several others were possible) The drive parameters (cylinders, tracks, etc) are set by the jumpers on the controller. The only PROM sold for the B&B rig was optional, it was the AutoBoot PROM. If purchased, it was installed instead of the BIOS PROM supplied standard with the controller. It first does a RAM test thereby allowing the hard disk to come up to speed. Then it checks track 128 for the OS9 bootstrap module (modified to access the hard disk) and boots OS9 from the hard disk. If you hold down the ALT key during the RAM test then the PROM looks instead for the bootstrap module on track 129. This allows you to have two separate OS9Boot on a single drive. I used this feature to boot into either OS9 command line prompt or OS9 Multivue. To use the HD from RS-DOS, B&B suggested the HYPER I/O DOS package. I never used this package. I believe the nearly complete docs are available on-line somewhere. Or I can send a zip file to whomsoever needs it. I have a very complete set of docs. /Chester Costa Rica -----Original Message----- From: L. Curtis Boyle [mailto:curtisboyle at sasktel.net] Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 7:51 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM The XT ROM does not have anything hard coded into it concerning the drive; it uses sector 0 like other OS-9 drives. The only exception is if you want two different boots - if you are going to use the 2nd boot then it used either track 128 or 129 (can't remember) for the alternate boot track. Sent from my iPhone L. Curtis Boyle On Jan 14, 2009, at 6:05 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Brian Goers wrote: > >>> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who >>> has distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if >>> that includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? > >> I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. >> But it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony >> Podraza if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the >> distribution rights to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as >> soon as I can. > > To my knowledge, the ROM contains nothing specific to the drive. It > "dumbly" attempts to read the track that contains the OS-9 > bootloader, looking for it at the same offset as it would occupy on > a floppy (Track 19?). Any unit-specific information is patched into > the OS. > > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Wed Jan 14 11:19:45 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:19:45 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901132356.08157.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <2089928980.4510371231949985076.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Rich, Smaller pack, ROM pack size. Uses newer technology on the driver receivers but does use the same ACIA chip. I haven't looked at a RS232 pack in a while, have many at home....Can't remember if it has gold card edge or not. Regards, Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "richec" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 10:56:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak Hi Mark, What the difference betweet that and Tandy's RS232 Pak? TIA -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Wed Jan 14 11:23:24 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:23:24 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <2089928980.4510371231949985076.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> I should expand. There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that creates the RSR232 rail voltages. What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. Mark Cloud-9 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Marlette" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 10:19:45 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak Rich, Smaller pack, ROM pack size. Uses newer technology on the driver receivers but does use the same ACIA chip. I haven't looked at a RS232 pack in a while, have many at home....Can't remember if it has gold card edge or not. Regards, Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "richec" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 10:56:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak Hi Mark, What the difference betweet that and Tandy's RS232 Pak? TIA -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From leonard23 at verizon.net Wed Jan 14 12:16:25 2009 From: leonard23 at verizon.net (Leonard Miller) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 12:16:25 -0500 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <006c01c9766b$d7f1b510$87d51f30$@net> Me too! Leonard -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 07:08 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM > Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that > fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. > > I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been > corrupted. :( > > A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is > not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data > lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using an > EPROM programmer is what I'd need. > > -- > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia I'm sure others would like that file too. Bruce W. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jan 14 13:21:09 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:21:09 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <2089928980.4510371231949985076.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <2089928980.4510371231949985076.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <200901141321.09314.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 14 January 2009, Mark Marlette wrote: >Rich, > >Smaller pack, ROM pack size. Uses newer technology on the driver receivers > but does use the same ACIA chip. > So the same old driver should work, and the same 9600 baud limit still applies. Some of that I think is driver, not the acia, cuz I had this ones piggyback chipset modified to be a midi port for a while, it ran great at 31,250 baud doing midi. I was driving two cheap keyboards at the same time, with different voices in ultimuse-III, one through it, and one through the bitbanger. It would have been much more useful to me if it could have received midi too, but sadly I was never able to get a single keypress back through it. :( If I could have made that work, you would have seen a lot of .ume files from my wife's playing made available way back then. >I haven't looked at a RS232 pack in a while, have many at home....Can't > remember if it has gold card edge or not. Mine doesn't. Never been a problem though thanks to the more aggressive bite in the connectors of my older mpi. >Regards, > >Mark > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "richec" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 10:56:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central >Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak > >Hi Mark, > >What the difference betweet that and Tandy's RS232 Pak? > >TIA > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) He who laughs, lasts. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jan 14 13:26:03 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:26:03 -0500 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: References: <006701c975da$5307f300$0701a8c0@master> <496D55E8.6050909@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <200901141326.03331.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 14 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Brian Goers wrote: >>> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who has >>> distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if that includes >>> the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? >> >> I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. But >> it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony Podraza >> if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the distribution rights >> to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as soon as I can. > >To my knowledge, the ROM contains nothing specific to the drive. It >"dumbly" attempts to read the track that contains the OS-9 bootloader, >looking for it at the same offset as it would occupy on a floppy (Track >19?). Any unit-specific information is patched into the OS. Not quite correct, it looked, not on track 34 like a floppy, but on track 128 or 129, supposedly keyboard selectable at boot time. Unforch the rest of the docs weren't, and I was never able to actually make it work for me when I had one. So mine always was a floppy boot. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Davis' Law of Traffic Density: The density of rush-hour traffic is directly proportional to 1.5 times the amount of extra time you allow to arrive on time. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jan 14 13:32:35 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:32:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <402B480218EB4FB4A7ECBDDD10FF2531@chester> References: <402B480218EB4FB4A7ECBDDD10FF2531@chester> Message-ID: <200901141332.35778.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 14 January 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: >B&B rigs (of which I configured and sold several during my stint at Howard >Medical) do not require a PROM installed in the controller (we used the >DTC-5150 controller, several others were possible) The drive parameters >(cylinders, tracks, etc) are set by the jumpers on the controller. The only >PROM sold for the B&B rig was optional, it was the AutoBoot PROM. If >purchased, it was installed instead of the BIOS PROM supplied standard with >the controller. It first does a RAM test thereby allowing the hard disk to >come up to speed. Then it checks track 128 for the OS9 bootstrap module >(modified to access the hard disk) and boots OS9 from the hard disk. If you >hold down the ALT key during the RAM test then the PROM looks instead for >the bootstrap module on track 129. This allows you to have two separate >OS9Boot on a single drive. I used this feature to boot into either OS9 >command line prompt or OS9 Multivue. >To use the HD from RS-DOS, B&B suggested the HYPER I/O DOS package. I never >used this package. >I believe the nearly complete docs are available on-line somewhere. Or I can >send a zip file to whomsoever needs it. I have a very complete set of docs. > Humm, between these two messages I might be able to cobble up a 2nd coco3 hard drive system again. I have one of the later B&B's in the gold pack, (& a couple of old, squeaky 10 meg tandon drives,) which unlike the original black one, was never a problem child when I booted from a floppy. If its not too much trouble, send it along to me also Chester, at gene.heskett at gmail.com Thanks. >/Chester >Costa Rica > >-----Original Message----- >From: L. Curtis Boyle [mailto:curtisboyle at sasktel.net] >Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 7:51 AM >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts >Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM > > >The XT ROM does not have anything hard coded into it concerning the >drive; it uses sector 0 like other OS-9 drives. The only exception is >if you want two different boots - if you are going to use the 2nd boot >then it used either track 128 or 129 (can't remember) for the >alternate boot track. > >Sent from my iPhone >L. Curtis Boyle > >On Jan 14, 2009, at 6:05 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Brian Goers wrote: >>>> I was under the impression that there's a group (Glenside?) who >>>> has distribution rights to Burke & Burke software. I wonder if >>>> that includes the various versions of the B&B XT-ROM EPROM? >>> >>> I may be wrong but I thought the ROM had the hard drive parameters. >>> But it's been a long time since I had a B&B system. I will ask Tony >>> Podraza if he has the information. We (Glenside) do have the >>> distribution rights to the G&B software. I'll let everyone know as >>> soon as I can. >> >> To my knowledge, the ROM contains nothing specific to the drive. It >> "dumbly" attempts to read the track that contains the OS-9 >> bootloader, looking for it at the same offset as it would occupy on >> a floppy (Track 19?). Any unit-specific information is patched into >> the OS. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man -- who has no gills. -- Ambrose Bierce From tonym at compusource.net Wed Jan 14 16:56:10 2009 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:56:10 GMT Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM Message-ID: <200901141656781.SM02652@[208.76.35.239]> Me Three! I have (2) B&B setups, one still boxed up, one was used... Tony -----Original Message----- From: Leonard Miller leonard23 at verizon.net Sent 1/14/2009 12:16:25 PM To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM Me too! Leonard -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 07:08 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM Does anyone here own a Burke & Burke XT-ROM? That's the 2764 EPROM that fits on the hard disk controller card, which will make it auto-boot. I have a B&B setup here, but it seems that the ROM has somehow been corrupted. :( A .BIN file would be great, but watch out! A dump from within the Coco is not useful, since Chris Burke inverted some of the address and/or data lines between the coco and the PC controller card. So a file read using an EPROM programmer is what I'd need. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia I'm sure others would like that file too. Bruce W. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco ?????????? From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 18:26:14 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 18:26:14 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: <402B480218EB4FB4A7ECBDDD10FF2531@chester> References: <402B480218EB4FB4A7ECBDDD10FF2531@chester> Message-ID: On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: > B&B rigs (of which I configured and sold several during my stint at Howard > Medical) do not require a PROM installed in the controller (we used the > DTC-5150 controller, several others were possible) The drive parameters > (cylinders, tracks, etc) are set by the jumpers on the controller. The only > PROM sold for the B&B rig was optional, it was the AutoBoot PROM. If > purchased, it was installed instead of the BIOS PROM supplied standard with > the controller. It first does a RAM test thereby allowing the hard disk to > come up to speed. Then it checks track 128 for the OS9 bootstrap module > (modified to access the hard disk) and boots OS9 from the hard disk. If you > hold down the ALT key during the RAM test then the PROM looks instead for > the bootstrap module on track 129. This allows you to have two separate > OS9Boot on a single drive. I used this feature to boot into either OS9 > command line prompt or OS9 Multivue. Ok, so if the controller's slot in the MultiPak is selected at reset, the ROM code gets control immediately? -- From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Thu Jan 15 22:07:51 2009 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:07:51 -0600 Subject: [Coco] COCO Fest Message-ID: <496FFA07.6050705@sbcglobal.net> Planning to attend this year. Need date and Hotel. Hotel phone number helpful too. John Donaldson -- From georgeramsower at gmail.com Wed Jan 14 22:15:00 2009 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:15:00 -0600 Subject: [Coco] COCO Fest References: <496FFA07.6050705@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <001e01c976bf$743066d0$6401a8c0@OLDGEORGE> Just let me know what rooms are free and which bus to jump on and I can make it. DOH! I wish I could make just ONE CocoFest so I could meet all the folks. Dangit! 'been wishin' for YEARS! Then, if I could get my company to pay for my time off, I could afford it. Send donations to: "Let George do it" or "Oh, lonesome me" Hehe Laugh here, end of joke George... Not George Jones From briang0671 at sbcglobal.net Wed Jan 14 22:47:20 2009 From: briang0671 at sbcglobal.net (Brian Goers) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:47:20 -0600 Subject: [Coco] COCO Fest In-Reply-To: <496FFA07.6050705@sbcglobal.net> References: <496FFA07.6050705@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <496EB1C8.6060409@sbcglobal.net> John Donaldson wrote: > Planning to attend this year. Need date and Hotel. Hotel phone number > helpful too. > > John Donaldson > The Glenside site at :(http://ncmedals.com/glenside/). Near the top screen, look under the group picture. Ask for a double room and split the cost with someone. Two beds are available Later Brian Goers -- Brian Goers Glenside Vice-President of Special Events IDE Boards are available. The 18th Annual ?LAST? Chicago CoCoFEST! Will be held March 28 & 29 2009 Holiday Inn & Suites Elgin. The website had to be moved due to the abrupt shut-down of AOL's Hometown. Here's the new URL: http://ncmedals.com/glenside/index.html From neilsmorr at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 01:03:42 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 06:03:42 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page (was Huge bunch of CoCo stuff) In-Reply-To: <496CDC65.10446.23541BEE@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: But if you want the extra features you need to go to the web page. Neil --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, shadow at ... wrote: > Some of us get the posts via email to *avoid* having to go to Yahoo! > :-) > -- > Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) > shadow at shadowgard dot com > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 15 10:10:39 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 10:10:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BColor_Computer=5D_Accessing_=22for_sale?= =?iso-8859-1?q?=22_page_=28was_Huge=09bunch_of_CoCo_stuff=29?= In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 15 January 2009, Neil Morrison wrote: >But if you want the extra features you need to go to the web page. > >Neil Users using text based email agents using the pop3 protocol consider that stuff to be a useless waste of bandwidth & just another way for yahoo to shove a commercial down our throats to the point of choking us. Yahoo's TOS has just about wore me out, and I'm ready to unsub from any list that comes through their servers regardless of the interest I may have in the list itself. Dennis runs a nice clean list, and I thank him for that, but sadly that cannot be said of yahoo, ever. >--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, shadow at ... wrote: >> Some of us get the posts via email to *avoid* having to go to Yahoo! >> >> :-) >> >> -- >> Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) >> shadow at shadowgard dot com > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The discerning person is always at a disadvantage. From vchester at setec-cr.com Thu Jan 15 10:59:55 2009 From: vchester at setec-cr.com (Chester Patterson) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 09:59:55 -0600 Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That is correct. The BnB rig is set up to run from slot 3 of the MPI, with the floppy controller in slot 4. The MPI switch set to slot 3 so that the BnB ROM is what runs on power on/reset. The BnB ROM software allows for a keypress during its RAM check to switch control to slot 4 via software and run the ROM in the floppy controller. BnB recommended the HYPER I/O software package (another DOS but with the hard disk access routines) which one burned to EPROM and put in the floppy or hard disk controller. I never used it myself, allways having run OS9. HYPER I/O was quite pricey at the time, even with my employee discount! I used to plug the BnB controller directly into the Coco slot and boot up OS9 like that. No MPI or floppies but it made for quick testing for problems. /Chester -----Original Message----- From: Steven Hirsch [mailto:snhirsch at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 5:26 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] B&B XTROM On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: > B&B rigs (of which I configured and sold several during my stint at Howard > Medical) do not require a PROM installed in the controller (we used the > DTC-5150 controller, several others were possible) The drive parameters > (cylinders, tracks, etc) are set by the jumpers on the controller. The only > PROM sold for the B&B rig was optional, it was the AutoBoot PROM. If > purchased, it was installed instead of the BIOS PROM supplied standard with > the controller. It first does a RAM test thereby allowing the hard disk to > come up to speed. Then it checks track 128 for the OS9 bootstrap module > (modified to access the hard disk) and boots OS9 from the hard disk. If you > hold down the ALT key during the RAM test then the PROM looks instead for > the bootstrap module on track 129. This allows you to have two separate > OS9Boot on a single drive. I used this feature to boot into either OS9 > command line prompt or OS9 Multivue. Ok, so if the controller's slot in the MultiPak is selected at reset, the ROM code gets control immediately? From paulh96636 at aol.com Thu Jan 15 11:09:03 2009 From: paulh96636 at aol.com (paulh96636 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 11:09:03 -0500 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: References: <200901131705.37035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <8CB4542B59F6040-998-53@WEBMAIL-MY17.sysops.aol.com> Back in the '60s I was living in Las Vegas, about 80 miles from the Nevada Nuclear test site.? A scheduled underground 1 megaton test was announced and residents were warned that some shockwaves would reach town. I had a ground level apartment, and was not in a high rise hotel where the effects would be more noticeable, but did see two hanging lamps begin to sway like a pendulum (about a 1 foot arc) when the expected shockwave arrived.? I don't recall any report about the Richter reading.?? -ph -----Original Message----- From: Fedor Steeman To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 5:25 am Subject: Re: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... A few weeks ago we had the worst earthquake in Denmark in over a century! It measured 4 on the Richter scale... :-) I believe the only reported casualties were a housecat and a tortoise. A group of people immediately designed and started selling t-shirts with the text "Copenhagen Earthquake Survivor '08": http://www.riisjensen.dk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=279:jordskaelvs-overlever&catid=1:humor&Itemid=15#content Also, some disgruntled people who slept through the earthquake started a facebook group called "Group for earthquakes when we are awake!" ( http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=39892733471) I was actually awake myself at that time, eating breakfast. I never experienced an earthquake before and it took me a few minutes to conclude that it was just that! I remember being bent over my cereals half awake and suddenly the chair, table and floor felt like jelly pudding. A looked around to see whether I was dreaming, but noticed that the christmas tree decorations were still dangling after the shake, so it was real enough! Pretty cool... Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/13 Gene Heskett > On Tuesday 13 January 2009, Chester Patterson wrote: > >Those folks got off easy! It felt a lot worse than it looks in that video. > >No damage on the home front. We build for this kind of thing. > >Thicker glass, lots or steel rod (vertical & horizontal), building blocks > >(walls) filled with concrete, flexible junctions on all water, gas and > >electric ducting, the works. > > > >We had another one this morning 01:08AM 4.2 I slept through that one. My > >wife and daughter (13) jumped up and openned all the doors. > > > >Looks like it may be a lively 2009! > > > >My ramshackle stack of Coco hardware did not fall off the top shelf in the > >closet. > >The Chivas will be missed. Have to pop the cork on the Nicaraguan rum > then! > > > That's terrible, what a comedown. :) > > >/Chester > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Gene Heskett [mailto:gene.heskett at verizon.net] > >Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 3:09 PM > >Subject: Re: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... > > > >On Monday 12 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: > >>Good to here you're fine. Sounds scary, like that one: > >> > >>http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=28f_1231628033 > > > >That does look like a decent shake. I'm glad you are ok, Chester. > >Any damage to your residence? > > > >>Regards, > >>Torsten > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > Nothing makes one so vain as being told that one is a sinner. > Conscience makes egotists of us all. > -- Oscar Wilde > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From petrander at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 11:44:01 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:44:01 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi guys, I have been getting closer to the aforementioned "quest" to connect a CoCo 5,25" floppy drive to a pc. I have now selected a drive that apparantly can be switched between 40 or 80 tracks BTW, so now comes the next question: How to connect a modern IDE cable connecter to this old drive? I have no experience with the "crimping" that I have read about, but it seems tricky. What is needed for this? I suppose I need to clip off the original IDE connector and then "crimp" and older one on to it. Would I need to twist any wires? Or are there any adapters available? Thanks for any input. Cheers, Fedor 2008/10/5 Darren A > On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: > > > > The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for > > (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... > > > > If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the > CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. > Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. > > Go to and use the links there > to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These > will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. > > Darren > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 12:50:57 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:50:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 15 Jan 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: > How to connect a modern IDE cable connecter to this old drive? I have no > experience with the "crimping" that I have read about, but it seems tricky. > What is needed for this? I suppose I need to clip off the original IDE > connector and then "crimp" and older one on to it. Would I need to twist any > wires? Or are there any adapters available? Did you by any chance mean to say 'IDC', as in Insulation Displacement Connector? IDE (parallel ATA) connectors are 40 pins and will not help you much. Assuming you have the correct 34-pin IDC header, attaching it requires a little care, but is not too difficult. - If you are attaching it to the end of the cable, ensure that it's been cut cleanly with a _sharp_ pair of scissors and at a right angle to the run of the cable. Dull cutters leave little "hairs" of the stranded conductors sticking out and something barely visible can hose the works. I usuall lay a little carpenter's square along the side of the cable and mark a right angle with a fine-tipped pen. Use that as a cutting guide. - In any case, the header will have a backing piece that may or may not be captive to the body of the connector. Locate it carefully on the cable at the point of your choice (end or in-line) and, again, ensure it's at a right-angle and not slanted. - Push down on the back with your thumbs to "set" the insulation-piercing pins against the cable. - Use a conventional bench-vise to slowly clamp the back down on the connector. Check carefully as you insert it into the vise jaws to ensure you haven't knocked it out of square. - When the backing plate touches the connector on the sides, you are done. Sounds more difficult than it is, believe me. If you want a _real_ treat, try this with a 0.05" connector like the ones used for LVD SCSI :-). Steve -- From neilsmorr at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 13:07:20 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 10:07:20 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page References: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> I have next to no trouble with Yahoo and it's free. The real problem with Dennis' list is that there's way too much traffic for a mail list It needs to be on a web site with the threads separated out. That way you don't have to read it all or skip most of it. Life is too short. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Heskett" > Users using text based email agents using the pop3 protocol consider that > stuff to be a useless waste of bandwidth & just another way for yahoo to > shove a commercial down our throats to the point of choking us. Yahoo's > TOS > has just about wore me out, and I'm ready to unsub from any list that > comes > through their servers regardless of the interest I may have in the list > itself. Dennis runs a nice clean list, and I thank him for that, but > sadly > that cannot be said of yahoo, ever. From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 13:47:30 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:47:30 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page In-Reply-To: <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> References: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> Message-ID: On Thu, 15 Jan 2009, Neil Morrison wrote: > I have next to no trouble with Yahoo and it's free. > > The real problem with Dennis' list is that there's way too much traffic for > a mail list > > It needs to be on a web site with the threads separated out. > > That way you don't have to read it all or skip most of it. Life is too > short. You may want to use a threaded mail reader. I have no problems at all sorting through things. On Linux / Unix, try Thunderbird (I'm enough of a throwback that I use pine). I'm with Gene on the subject of Yahoo. Their approach to mailing lists is wretched and I see no compelling reason to migrate this list. -- From linville at tuxdriver.com Thu Jan 15 13:47:49 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:47:49 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page In-Reply-To: <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> References: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> Message-ID: <20090115184748.GB3241@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 10:07:20AM -0800, Neil Morrison wrote: > I have next to no trouble with Yahoo and it's free. > > The real problem with Dennis' list is that there's way too much traffic for > a mail list > > It needs to be on a web site with the threads separated out. > > That way you don't have to read it all or skip most of it. Life is too > short. Wow...well, you are welcome to your opinion. :-) FWIW, I probably get more email on various Linux-related lists over one weekend than I got on this list all last year...and FWIW, I think more activity here would be better, not worse. Also, you should investigate a new mail reader -- I have no problem viewing separate threads on this list. John -- John W. Linville Someday the world will need a hero, and you linville at tuxdriver.com might be all we have. Be ready. From linville at tuxdriver.com Thu Jan 15 13:47:49 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:47:49 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page In-Reply-To: <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> References: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> Message-ID: <20090115184748.GB3241@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 10:07:20AM -0800, Neil Morrison wrote: > I have next to no trouble with Yahoo and it's free. > > The real problem with Dennis' list is that there's way too much traffic for > a mail list > > It needs to be on a web site with the threads separated out. > > That way you don't have to read it all or skip most of it. Life is too > short. Wow...well, you are welcome to your opinion. :-) FWIW, I probably get more email on various Linux-related lists over one weekend than I got on this list all last year...and FWIW, I think more activity here would be better, not worse. Also, you should investigate a new mail reader -- I have no problem viewing separate threads on this list. John -- John W. Linville Someday the world will need a hero, and you linville at tuxdriver.com might be all we have. Be ready. From badfrog at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 14:38:01 2009 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:38:01 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Accessing "for sale" page In-Reply-To: <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> References: <200901151010.39071.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <8BB16C5EC4B74E97976F7BE54F30B80A@NewBaby> Message-ID: <9efa17da0901151138k4c7010edha89b4ef2e162a389@mail.gmail.com> If you use Gmail, it automatically consolidates threads with the same subject quite nicely. On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Neil Morrison wrote: > I have next to no trouble with Yahoo and it's free. > > The real problem with Dennis' list is that there's way too much traffic for > a mail list > > It needs to be on a web site with the threads separated out. > > That way you don't have to read it all or skip most of it. Life is too > short. > > Neil > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gene Heskett" > >> Users using text based email agents using the pop3 protocol consider that >> stuff to be a useless waste of bandwidth & just another way for yahoo to >> shove a commercial down our throats to the point of choking us. Yahoo's >> TOS >> has just about wore me out, and I'm ready to unsub from any list that >> comes >> through their servers regardless of the interest I may have in the list >> itself. Dennis runs a nice clean list, and I thank him for that, but >> sadly >> that cannot be said of yahoo, ever. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Fri Jan 16 20:27:31 2009 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:27:31 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> Fedor, Why are trying to use the IDE cabel to access a 5.25 floppy. Almost all motherboards have a Floppy controller and port. Just use a floppy cable and hook it up to the 5.25 floppy. I have a 486 machine with both a 3" and a 5.25 hooked that way. John Donaldson Fedor Steeman wrote: >Hi guys, > >I have been getting closer to the aforementioned "quest" to connect a CoCo >5,25" floppy drive to a pc. I have now selected a drive that apparantly can >be switched between 40 or 80 tracks BTW, so now comes the next question: > >How to connect a modern IDE cable connecter to this old drive? I have no >experience with the "crimping" that I have read about, but it seems tricky. >What is needed for this? I suppose I need to clip off the original IDE >connector and then "crimp" and older one on to it. Would I need to twist any >wires? Or are there any adapters available? > >Thanks for any input. > >Cheers, >Fedor > >2008/10/5 Darren A > > > >>On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: >> >> >>>The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for >>>(earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... >>> >>> >>> >>If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the >>CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. >>Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. >> >>Go to and use the links there >>to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These >>will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. >> >>Darren >> >>-- >>Coco mailing list >>Coco at maltedmedia.com >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Thu Jan 15 20:41:10 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 01:41:10 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <496FE5B6.50805@aurigae.demon.co.uk> John Donaldson wrote: > Fedor, > Why are trying to use the IDE cabel to access a 5.25 floppy. Almost all > motherboards have a Floppy controller and port. Just use a floppy cable > and hook it up to the 5.25 floppy. I think he probably means IDC connector, or alternalty IDE-like connector, after all most PCs use a female 34way IDC for the floppy which is similar to the 40way used for the IDE. As opposed to the female edge type connector that the CoCo and Dragon disk controler boards use. > I have a 486 machine with both a 3" > and a 5.25 hooked that way. Ohh do you mean a 3" drive, as in the ones used by a whole bunch of Amstrad (and Sinclair) machines ? Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Fri Jan 16 21:30:38 2009 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 20:30:38 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <496FE5B6.50805@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> <496FE5B6.50805@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <497142CE.8010008@sbcglobal.net> This is my COCO Emulator system. I t has a 5.25 40ATrack drive and a standard 3" PC drive. John Donaldson Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > John Donaldson wrote: > >> Fedor, >> Why are trying to use the IDE cabel to access a 5.25 floppy. Almost >> all motherboards have a Floppy controller and port. Just use a floppy >> cable and hook it up to the 5.25 floppy. > > > I think he probably means IDC connector, or alternalty IDE-like > connector, after all most PCs use a female 34way IDC for the floppy > which is similar to the 40way used for the IDE. As opposed to the > female edge type connector that the CoCo and Dragon disk controler > boards use. > >> I have a 486 machine with both a 3" >> and a 5.25 hooked that way. > > > Ohh do you mean a 3" drive, as in the ones used by a whole bunch of > Amstrad (and Sinclair) machines ? > > Cheers. > > Phill. > -- From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Thu Jan 15 21:49:44 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 02:49:44 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <497142CE.8010008@sbcglobal.net> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> <496FE5B6.50805@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <497142CE.8010008@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <496FF5C8.2070506@aurigae.demon.co.uk> John Donaldson wrote: > This is my COCO Emulator system. I t has a 5.25 40ATrack drive and a > standard 3" PC drive. Ahh so you actually meant a 3.5" drive then, completely different beast from a 3" :) Cheers. Phill. From devries.bob at gmail.com Thu Jan 15 21:52:49 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:52:49 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net><496FE5B6.50805@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <497142CE.8010008@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <002a01c97785$86d34c00$0701a8c0@master> John, I'm sure you mean standard 3.5" PC drive? 3" drives were made for some odd-ball computers (I beg pardon from those who loved them), like Amstrad. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Donaldson" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Saturday, January 17, 2009 12:30 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC > This is my COCO Emulator system. I t has a 5.25 40ATrack drive and a > standard 3" PC drive. > > John Donaldson > > Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > >> John Donaldson wrote: >> >>> Fedor, >>> Why are trying to use the IDE cabel to access a 5.25 floppy. Almost all >>> motherboards have a Floppy controller and port. Just use a floppy cable >>> and hook it up to the 5.25 floppy. >> >> >> I think he probably means IDC connector, or alternalty IDE-like >> connector, after all most PCs use a female 34way IDC for the floppy which >> is similar to the 40way used for the IDE. As opposed to the female edge >> type connector that the CoCo and Dragon disk controler boards use. >> >>> I have a 486 machine with both a 3" and a >>> 5.25 hooked that way. >> >> >> Ohh do you mean a 3" drive, as in the ones used by a whole bunch of >> Amstrad (and Sinclair) machines ? >> >> Cheers. >> >> Phill. >> > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 15 21:57:07 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:57:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 15 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: >Hi guys, > >I have been getting closer to the aforementioned "quest" to connect a CoCo >5,25" floppy drive to a pc. I have now selected a drive that apparantly can >be switched between 40 or 80 tracks BTW, so now comes the next question: Be aware that this is a double edged sword Fedor. The heads on that drive are not wide enough to fully erase old info when over-writing in the 40 tpi mode, and generally there is a 100% chance of trashing the disk. >How to connect a modern IDE cable connecter to this old drive? You don't, it is two entirely different interfaces. Floppies use a 34 wire cable, IDE use either a 40 wire cable or an 80 wire cable, only partially cross compatible. >I have no >experience with the "crimping" that I have read about, but it seems tricky. >What is needed for this? I suppose I need to clip off the original IDE >connector and then "crimp" and older one on to it. Would I need to twist any >wires? Or are there any adapters available? Crimping cane be done with a small vice, or a pair of vice-grips, even a flat surface and a house hold 16<->24 ounce hammer will work. > >Thanks for any input. > >Cheers, >Fedor > >2008/10/5 Darren A > >> On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: >> > The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for >> > (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... >> >> If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the >> CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. >> Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. >> >> Go to and use the links there >> to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These >> will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. >> >> Darren >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "Hey Ivan, check your six." -- Sidewinder missile jacket patch, showing a Sidewinder driving up the tail of a Russian Su-27 From operator at coco3.com Thu Jan 15 23:10:18 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 22:10:18 -0600 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout Message-ID: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> I'm looking for someone who can help finsish designing the schematic and board layout for a mini RS-232 pak based on the rather simple schematics for the CoCoPro! RS-232 Pak. As some know, this is nothing more than the schematics for the DC Modek Pak but with the phone modem circuitry removed. It's just a 6551 and ROM mapped to the expansion port pins. My version has an EPROM instead of the ROM. There's 4 chips and the board fits in a standard game pak case. The board is already designed to fit any game pak and also a new case I'm looking at. So, the mini RS-232 pak layout has to fit on this board. I've already got the chips layed out similar to the DC Modem Pak's format but I'm having trouble with the trace routing. Maybe that's because I'm not an expert at such. The software needed is free, called ExpressSCH and ExpressPCB. If you can use ExpressSCH/ExpressPCB and are good with design and the 6551, please submit a quote for what you think it's worth for you to finish laying out this board and test all the connections "on paper", etc. 6551, 2764/27128 EPROM, 74LS04, 74LS133.. that's about it. I'll work with you to help get this done so I can send off for 4 sample boards as quick as possible. Give me an idea of what you'll need or not need. I've got the base layout files, and about 75% of the schematic is drawn and some of the net connections are defined which helps ExpressPCB reveal what pins need to be connected with traces, etc. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From wdg3rd at comcast.net Thu Jan 15 23:32:38 2009 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 04:32:38 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <2091618902.2459631232080156725.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <2132288475.2459981232080358400.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> From: "Gene Heskett" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 9:57:07 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC > Crimping cane be done with a small vice, or a pair of vice-grips, even a flat > surface and a house hold 16<->24 ounce hammer will work. I generally use either a pair of channel lock pliers or an eight ounce hammer. About the only thing that hammer is good for (as the man said, you can be gentle with a big hammer, you can't be forceful with a small one) except for hammering a bunch of finishing nails into a piece of soft pine to jerry-rig a patch panel for the old copper phone lines in the house (which is _glued_ to a stud in the basement -- I wanted to put the nails in the stud, but the house was built over a century and a quarter ago, that wood is seriously seasoned and laughs at nails). -- Ward Griffiths Damn, this is my first message from Comcast's new Webmail interface -- the bastards jettisoned my .sig. Well, it was about time for a new one anyway, I'll take care of it tomorrow. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 16 01:21:21 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 01:21:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <2132288475.2459981232080358400.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> References: <2132288475.2459981232080358400.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <200901160121.21587.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 15 January 2009, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >From: "Gene Heskett" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 9:57:07 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >Subject: Re: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC > >> Crimping cane be done with a small vice, or a pair of vice-grips, even a >> flat surface and a house hold 16<->24 ounce hammer will work. > >I generally use either a pair of channel lock pliers or an eight ounce > hammer. About the only thing that hammer is good for (as the man said, you > can be gentle with a big hammer, you can't be forceful with a small one) > except for hammering a bunch of finishing nails into a piece of soft pine > to jerry-rig a patch panel for the old copper phone lines in the house > (which is _glued_ to a stud in the basement -- I wanted to put the nails in > the stud, but the house was built over a century and a quarter ago, that > wood is seriously seasoned and laughs at nails). Been there, done that. Went to nail an old board up for a brace for the garage door opener I was installing, and my BIG Bostitch 28 degree framing nailer, with 110 psi and 2" CC nails in it, folded those nails up like I was trying to drive them into an 250 pound anvil. I got another board... -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I can't drive 55. From tigers2roar at yahoo.com.au Fri Jan 16 06:02:54 2009 From: tigers2roar at yahoo.com.au (brian palmer) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 03:02:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] B&B XTROM Message-ID: <847343.91913.qm@web36504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> G'Day Bob. I can help you with a Xt Rom chip I have 1, If you can wait until next week I will send you my Eprom chip and you can dump the contents and use it or make some more from the contents. laters Briza Stay connected to the people that matter most with a smarter inbox. Take a look http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/smarterinbox From tjseagrove at writeme.com Fri Jan 16 06:40:49 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 06:40:49 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Another *WOW* auction at Ebay In-Reply-To: <5631e580901050442v3e75bb21w5b170e240dade80a@mail.gmail.com> References: <5631e580901050442v3e75bb21w5b170e240dade80a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <005f01c977cf$47e70d70$d7b52850$@com> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400015657580&_trksid=e110 02.m204&_trkparms=algo%3DSI%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D10&ssPageName=ADME :B:EOIBUAA:US:1348 And the auction finishes with a Best Offer of $190. I offered $60 since the working condition was unknown. Hope the buyer gets working items for those "rare" items... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Rogelio Perea Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 7:43 AM To: coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: [Coco] Another *WOW* auction at Ebay Perhaps I should start a blog or something to POKE some common sense attention on these kind of Ebay postings: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400015657580 Not to take away the right anyone has into making some $$$, but whenever an auction includes the words WOW and/or RARE in the headline, there is something of a giveaway at the clueless nature of the noted auction... you could get a eee PC for the asking price on this pair of CoCo products - maybe a collector in dire need of them would pay the price. If it were to be the prototype Black CoCo 3 I would take more than a second look at something like this. -=[ Rogelio ]=- -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date: 1/3/2009 2:14 PM From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jan 16 06:47:12 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 06:47:12 -0500 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49702D70.9653.12B379@jdaggett.gate.net> Roger I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be a simple and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of theboard. I already have a template for a mini Coco plug in board in ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x 3.8 inch. It has the fingers for plugging into the MPI. james On 15 Jan 2009 at 22:10, Roger Taylor wrote: > I'm looking for someone who can help finsish designing the schematic > and board layout for a mini RS-232 pak based on the rather simple > schematics for the CoCoPro! RS-232 Pak. As some know, this is nothing > more than the schematics for the DC Modek Pak but with the phone modem > circuitry removed. It's just a 6551 and ROM mapped to the expansion > port pins. My version has an EPROM instead of the ROM. There's 4 > chips and the board fits in a standard game pak case. The board is > already designed to fit any game pak and also a new case I'm looking > at. So, the mini RS-232 pak layout has to fit on this board. I've > already got the chips layed out similar to the DC Modem Pak's format > but I'm having trouble with the trace routing. Maybe that's because > I'm not an expert at such. > > The software needed is free, called ExpressSCH and ExpressPCB. If you > can use ExpressSCH/ExpressPCB and are good with design and the 6551, > please submit a quote for what you think it's worth for you to finish > laying out this board and test all the connections "on paper", etc. > 6551, 2764/27128 EPROM, 74LS04, 74LS133.. that's about it. I'll work > with you to help get this done so I can send off for 4 sample boards > as quick as possible. Give me an idea of what you'll need or not > need. > > I've got the base layout files, and about 75% of the schematic is > drawn and some of the net connections are defined which helps > ExpressPCB reveal what pins need to be connected with traces, etc. -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Jan 16 08:03:23 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 08:03:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port Message-ID: All, I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? Steve -- From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 16 09:16:33 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 09:16:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901160916.33470.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 16 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >All, > >I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that >contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > >Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > >Steve And I need to find my round tuit and look at it. But I've been battling with this box, turns out a new bios was not a well trained puppy, sprays Oops's all over the place. That, and a bug in the ethernet stuff that can turn off all your motherboards ports, until a full, pull all the cables for at least a minute powerdown is done. Kewl it isn't. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Spirtle, n.: The fine stream from a grapefruit that always lands right in your eye. -- Sniglets, "Rich Hall & Friends" From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Jan 16 09:29:26 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 09:29:26 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <200901160916.33470.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901160916.33470.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Friday 16 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that >> contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. >> >> Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > And I need to find my round tuit and look at it. But I've been battling with > this box, turns out a new bios was not a well trained puppy, sprays Oops's > all over the place. That, and a bug in the ethernet stuff that can turn off > all your motherboards ports, until a full, pull all the cables for at least a > minute powerdown is done. Kewl it isn't. In my best Jean-Claude VanDamm imitation: "Oooch! That's got to hurt." -- From jcewy at swbell.net Fri Jan 16 10:23:22 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 09:23:22 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4970A66A.3070202@swbell.net> Steven Hirsch wrote: > All, > > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > Steve > > Sorry, Steven. I've been busy trying to save people from the messes M'Soft made. This morning I'll see if I can still dig up the sources to my pix2tga and vef2tga utils, and maybe this weekend after I tear open the dishwasher I can see if they'll compile. JCE From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 16 12:36:27 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 11:36:27 -0600 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <49702D70.9653.12B379@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> <49702D70.9653.12B379@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <20090116173714.9CF1320A15@qs281.pair.com> At 05:47 AM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >Roger > >I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be a simple >and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of theboard. I already >have a template for a mini Coco plug in board in ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x >3.8 inch. It has the fingers for plugging into the MPI. > > >james The board size I have will fit in any short black game pak case if ever there should be a short supply of the cases I'm working on obtaining which are almost the same. The board already has the mounting holes exactly where they need to be based on trial and error from making paper cutouts of the printed board and comparing to existing cases and game pak boards. It's a match. I can take a look at your design, though. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jan 16 13:54:41 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 13:54:41 -0500 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <20090116173714.9CF1320A15@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com>, <49702D70.9653.12B379@jdaggett.gate.net>, <20090116173714.9CF1320A15@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <497091A1.28854.85E65@jdaggett.gate.net> Roger What I have is patterned off the short Floppy disk drive controler board(FD501/502). It can be reduced with ease. I want to eventually get that pattern over to Eagle. See attachment james On 16 Jan 2009 at 11:36, Roger Taylor wrote: > At 05:47 AM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > >Roger > > > >I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be a > >simple and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of > >theboard. I already have a template for a mini Coco plug in board in > >ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x 3.8 inch. It has the fingers for plugging > >into the MPI. > > > > > >james > > > The board size I have will fit in any short black game pak case if > ever there should be a short supply of the cases I'm working on > obtaining which are almost the same. The board already has the > mounting holes exactly where they need to be based on trial and error > from making paper cutouts of the printed board and comparing to > existing cases and game pak boards. It's a match. I can take a look > at your design, though. > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -------------- next part -------------- The following section of this message contains a file attachment prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. ---- File information ----------- File: coco cart short.pcb Date: 16 Jan 2009, 13:52 Size: 1678 bytes. Type: Unknown -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: coco cart short.pcb Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1678 bytes Desc: not available Url : From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 16 14:31:11 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 13:31:11 -0600 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <497091A1.28854.85E65@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> <49702D70.9653.12B379@jdaggett.gate.net> <20090116173714.9CF1320A15@qs281.pair.com> <497091A1.28854.85E65@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <20090116193120.969E620A16@qs281.pair.com> It looks nice but you didn't allow for the diamter of the router bit used by ExpressPCB to cut the board. If cut along your board perimeter it would leave the edge connector width too short and there would be alignment problems. I just downloaded DipTrace 1.50 and it looks nice but I don't see a way to import or export to ExpressPCB schematics or layouts, and the board service appears to be a forwarding service by the DipTrace website to the company of your choice, but I could have read the site instructions wrong. Probably not a wise choice for my projects. At 12:54 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >Roger > >What I have is patterned off the short Floppy disk drive controler >board(FD501/502). It can be reduced with ease. I want to eventually get >that pattern over to Eagle. > >See attachment > >james > >On 16 Jan 2009 at 11:36, Roger Taylor wrote: > > > At 05:47 AM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > > >Roger > > > > > >I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be a > > >simple and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of > > >theboard. I already have a template for a mini Coco plug in board in > > >ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x 3.8 inch. It has the fingers for plugging > > >into the MPI. > > > > > > > > >james > > > > > > The board size I have will fit in any short black game pak case if > > ever there should be a short supply of the cases I'm working on > > obtaining which are almost the same. The board already has the > > mounting holes exactly where they need to be based on trial and error > > from making paper cutouts of the printed board and comparing to > > existing cases and game pak boards. It's a match. I can take a look > > at your design, though. > > > > -- > > Roger Taylor > > > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > >The following section of this message contains a file attachment >prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. >If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, >you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. >If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. > > ---- File information ----------- > File: coco cart short.pcb > Date: 16 Jan 2009, 13:52 > Size: 1678 bytes. > Type: Unknown > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 16 16:36:01 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:36:01 -0500 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <20090116193120.969E620A16@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com> <497091A1.28854.85E65@jdaggett.gate.net> <20090116193120.969E620A16@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901161636.01240.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 16 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >It looks nice but you didn't allow for the diamter of the router bit >used by ExpressPCB to cut the board. If cut along your board >perimeter it would leave the edge connector width too short and there >would be alignment problems. That is a function of the tool table in the milling machines driver software. If it knows the cutting tools diameter, it cuts precisely to the mark. >I just downloaded DipTrace 1.50 and it looks nice but I don't see a >way to import or export to ExpressPCB schematics or layouts, and the >board service appears to be a forwarding service by the DipTrace >website to the company of your choice, but I could have read the site >instructions wrong. Probably not a wise choice for my projects. > >At 12:54 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >>Roger >> >>What I have is patterned off the short Floppy disk drive controler >>board(FD501/502). It can be reduced with ease. I want to eventually get >>that pattern over to Eagle. >> >>See attachment >> >>james >> >>On 16 Jan 2009 at 11:36, Roger Taylor wrote: >> > At 05:47 AM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >> > >Roger >> > > >> > >I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be a >> > >simple and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of >> > >theboard. I already have a template for a mini Coco plug in board in >> > >ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x 3.8 inch. It has the fingers for plugging >> > >into the MPI. >> > > >> > > >> > >james >> > >> > The board size I have will fit in any short black game pak case if >> > ever there should be a short supply of the cases I'm working on >> > obtaining which are almost the same. The board already has the >> > mounting holes exactly where they need to be based on trial and error >> > from making paper cutouts of the printed board and comparing to >> > existing cases and game pak boards. It's a match. I can take a look >> > at your design, though. >> > >> > -- >> > Roger Taylor >> > >> > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >>The following section of this message contains a file attachment >>prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. >>If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, >>you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. >>If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. >> >> ---- File information ----------- >> File: coco cart short.pcb >> Date: 16 Jan 2009, 13:52 >> Size: 1678 bytes. >> Type: Unknown >> >> >> >>-- >>Coco mailing list >>Coco at maltedmedia.com >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) When you don't know what you are doing, do it neatly. From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 16 17:41:41 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 17:41:41 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Videotex ROM Pak In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49710D25.9010402@gmail.com> CoCo Gang, Today I found my Videotex ROM Pak in a box of old software. The label fell off but I am certain that this is the software. I put some scotch tape on one of the pins to keep it from auto starting several years ago. What is the address I need to execute to get this software to start? Also does anyone have a scan of the user manual for this rom pak? I am using this as a quick and dirty dumb terminal for packet radio use. Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home Steven Hirsch wrote: > All, > > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > Steve > > From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jan 16 19:11:59 2009 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:11:59 -0500 Subject: [Coco] need a mini 6551 RS-232 pak layout In-Reply-To: <20090116193120.969E620A16@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090116041045.EE45120A15@qs281.pair.com>, <497091A1.28854.85E65@jdaggett.gate.net>, <20090116193120.969E620A16@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4970DBFF.21472.3BEED5@jdaggett.gate.net> Roger You can't export ExpressPCB to other programs. ExpressPCB is proprietory software and can only be used to generate boards through that company. Same holds for PCB123. Using these software packages limit you to that specific vendor. It is a trade off for not having to purchase layout software. You end up paying for the software by increase board costs. LArge scale production PCBs can be done for as little as $0.25 a square inch for two sided. The problem is a decent layput program is going to cost in the neighborhood of $1000. If you do onesee twosee boards one or two times a year then programs like ExpressPCB are acceptable. If you want to do a board under 12 square inches and two layer then I recommend the freeware version of Eagle and then use a board house like PCBex or BatchPCB. With this approach you get soldermask and silkscreening for less per board than with ExpressPCB. james On 16 Jan 2009 at 13:31, Roger Taylor wrote: > It looks nice but you didn't allow for the diamter of the router bit > used by ExpressPCB to cut the board. If cut along your board > perimeter it would leave the edge connector width too short and there > would be alignment problems. > > I just downloaded DipTrace 1.50 and it looks nice but I don't see a > way to import or export to ExpressPCB schematics or layouts, and the > board service appears to be a forwarding service by the DipTrace > website to the company of your choice, but I could have read the site > instructions wrong. Probably not a wise choice for my projects. > > > > > At 12:54 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > >Roger > > > >What I have is patterned off the short Floppy disk drive controler > >board(FD501/502). It can be reduced with ease. I want to eventually > >get that pattern over to Eagle. > > > >See attachment > > > >james > > > >On 16 Jan 2009 at 11:36, Roger Taylor wrote: > > > > > At 05:47 AM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > > > >Roger > > > > > > > >I am familiar with both programs as well as Eagle. That would be > > > >a simple and easy task to do. Do you have any concept of size of > > > >theboard. I already have a template for a mini Coco plug in board > > > >in ExpressPCB that is 2.5 x 3.8 inch. It has the fingers for > > > >plugging into the MPI. > > > > > > > > > > > >james > > > > > > > > > The board size I have will fit in any short black game pak case if > > > ever there should be a short supply of the cases I'm working on > > > obtaining which are almost the same. The board already has the > > > mounting holes exactly where they need to be based on trial and > > > error from making paper cutouts of the printed board and comparing > > > to existing cases and game pak boards. It's a match. I can take > > > a look at your design, though. > > > > > > -- > > > Roger Taylor > > > > > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Coco mailing list > > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > >The following section of this message contains a file attachment > >prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. If > >you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, you > >should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. If you > >cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. > > > > ---- File information ----------- > > File: coco cart short.pcb > > Date: 16 Jan 2009, 13:52 > > Size: 1678 bytes. > > Type: Unknown > > > > > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From os9dude at gmail.com Fri Jan 16 20:15:46 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 20:15:46 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Videotex ROM Pak In-Reply-To: <49710D25.9010402@gmail.com> References: <49710D25.9010402@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5631e580901161715u292e9159w87e7924d138df82b@mail.gmail.com> As far as the running the software goes: EXEC&HC000 if pak is installed in a CoCo 1 or 2 EXEC&HE010 if pak is installed in a CoCo 3 Perhaps someone else can provide a link or directions to the software's documentation. -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 5:41 PM, N8WQ wrote: > CoCo Gang, > Today I found my Videotex ROM Pak in a box of old software. The label fell > off but I am certain that this is the software. I put some scotch tape on > one of the pins to keep it from auto starting several years ago. What is the > address I need to execute to get this software to start? Also does anyone > have a scan of the user manual for this rom pak? I am using this as a quick > and dirty dumb terminal for packet radio use. > From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 16 22:02:26 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 21:02:26 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 bitrates Message-ID: <20090117030232.C255F20A15@qs281.pair.com> The 6551 ACIA should be able to run at 115200 bps by setting the baud rate to 0000 which means (external crystal / 16). Has anyone confirmed this? I used to talk to my external modems from the CoCo with this setting but there was no way to actually clock the datarate to prove the speed. The modems I think were auto baud detecting, meaning whatever the rate I was sending at, the modem would switch to it when it received the AT character sequence. I could be wrong. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From rcrislip at neo.rr.com Fri Jan 16 23:31:32 2009 From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (richec) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 23:31:32 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> Hi Mark, Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak uses a newer hardware technology and can be used without the services of an MPI. Other than that they both do about the same thing... correct? > I should expand. > > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that creates > the RSR232 rail voltages. > > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to work > in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > > Mark > Cloud-9 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Marlette" > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 10:19:45 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central > Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak > > Rich, > > Smaller pack, ROM pack size. Uses newer technology on the driver receivers > but does use the same ACIA chip. > > I haven't looked at a RS232 pack in a while, have many at home....Can't > remember if it has gold card edge or not. > > Regards, > > Mark > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "richec" > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 10:56:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central > Subject: Re: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak > > Hi Mark, > > What the difference betweet that and Tandy's RS232 Pak? > > TIA > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 17 00:32:45 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 23:32:45 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <20090117053309.935B020A18@qs281.pair.com> At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >Hi Mark, > >Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak uses a >newer hardware technology and can be used without the services of an MPI. >Other than that they both do about the same thing... correct? > > > > I should expand. > > > > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that creates > > the RSR232 rail voltages. > > > > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to work > > in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > > I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any CoCo unless you're using an MPI. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 17 04:53:33 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 04:53:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <20090117053309.935B020A18@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> <20090117053309.935B020A18@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >>Hi Mark, >> >>Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak uses a >>newer hardware technology and can be used without the services of an MPI. >>Other than that they both do about the same thing... correct? >> >> > I should expand. >> > >> > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that >> > creates the RSR232 rail voltages. >> > >> > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to >> > work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > >I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 >without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably >can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any >CoCo unless you're using an MPI. It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it works, but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do well. I have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply hiccuped. The one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so it works in an MPI only now. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Audacity, and again, audacity, and always audacity. -- G.J. Danton From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Jan 17 06:29:59 2009 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 11:29:59 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Videotex ROM Pak In-Reply-To: <1859443292.2752331232189094370.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <1172378329.2753481232191799959.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> From: "N8WQ" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 5:41:41 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [Coco] Videotex ROM Pak > CoCo Gang, > Today I found my Videotex ROM Pak in a box of old software. The label > fell off but I am certain that this is the software. I put some scotch > tape on one of the pins to keep it from auto starting several years ago. > What is the address I need to execute to get this software to start? > Also does anyone have a scan of the user manual for this rom pak? I am > using this as a quick and dirty dumb terminal for packet radio use. > Alan Jones 300 bps, more or less a VT-52 with a small screen, the CompuServe graphics are pretty much a dead issue. I don't recall any special start address, I assume it's the same as any other early (as in -- it came out the same month as the first Coco) autostart ROMpak. Peel off the tape, plug it in, turn it on. The ROM contains no known viruses and if there are any unknown to me, I doubt the modern script-kiddies who are younger than that ROMpak would know them either. Besides, modem war-dialing is a lost art since war-driving to troll for unsecured wireless routers was invented. (And war-dialing was never as useful as that lousy movie implied). Never used them much for CompuServe except to demo to customers, but it was the terminal software I used the time I set up a multi-user OS-9 (Level One) system in my classromm in my RSCC. The manual listed commands that implied the possibility, and I'd been having fun with Xenix for quite a while, so I decided to see if things worked. Rigged a null-modem bit-banger cable, and by damn, they did, except for the dropped characters if you typed on the "terminal" while the "host" was accessing its floppy drive, this being before the RS-232 Pak was shipped. A two-station time-sharing system for just under $1,072 including California and Los Angeles sales tax assuming you already owned two TV sets (based on sale prices at the time, and I can't recall how many cents over $1,071, it's been over a quarter of a century). A fun proof-of-concept, but I don't recall any sales resulting.. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net From mark at cloud9tech.com Sat Jan 17 09:51:35 2009 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 08:51:35 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> <20090117053309.935B020A18@qs281.pair.com> <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.2.20090117085007.02f90c38@cloud9tech.com> Gene, That has been my experience as well. If others have had it working with out the MPI then they are luckier than I. Mark At 1/17/2009 03:53 AM, you wrote: >On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: > >At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > >>Hi Mark, > >> > >>Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak uses a > >>newer hardware technology and can be used without the services of an MPI. > >>Other than that they both do about the same thing... correct? > >> > >> > I should expand. > >> > > >> > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that > >> > creates the RSR232 rail voltages. > >> > > >> > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to > >> > work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > > > >I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 > >without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably > >can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any > >CoCo unless you're using an MPI. > >It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it works, >but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do well. I >have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply hiccuped. The >one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so it works in an >MPI only now. > >-- >Cheers, Gene >"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." >-Ed Howdershelt (Author) >Audacity, and again, audacity, and always audacity. > -- G.J. Danton > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.8/1898 - Release Date: >1/16/2009 3:09 PM From exwn8jef at gmail.com Sat Jan 17 10:51:34 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 10:51:34 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4971FE86.2090604@gmail.com> Hi Steve, Today I started to configure the compiler on my distribution of Linux, which is Slax 6.0.9 on a 8gig thumb drive native install. I copied \dd to \root for now I put \cc in \ when I run this command nothing happens: \cc\test\# cc hello.c however when I run cc alone it says "no input file" Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home Steven Hirsch wrote: > All, > > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > Steve > > From snhirsch at gmail.com Sat Jan 17 12:08:59 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 12:08:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4971FE86.2090604@gmail.com> References: <4971FE86.2090604@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 17 Jan 2009, N8WQ wrote: > Hi Steve, > Today I started to configure the compiler on my distribution of Linux, which > is Slax 6.0.9 on a 8gig thumb drive native install. > I copied \dd to \root > for now I put \cc in \ > > when I run this command nothing happens: > \cc\test\# cc hello.c > > however when I run cc alone it says "no input file" I'm not sure I understand all the backslashes - that's a DOS / Windows thing. Do you mean '/cc/test'? It's possible that you do not have the current working directory on your path and are picking up the system compiler. Try: $ cd /cc/test $ ./cc hello.c -- From snhirsch at gmail.com Sat Jan 17 12:09:49 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 12:09:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Huge bunch of CoCo stuff In-Reply-To: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <238993.95731.qm@web53706.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 13 Jan 2009, Ed Siler wrote: > > > > > > I've started digging out my CoCo collection & it's kind of daunting - > there's a LOT!! Have some time on my hands due to a layoff - need the > space, need some cash, now's the time! ? Everything was packed tight & > sealed years ago, I'd kind of forgotten how much was in that closet. So > far, at least 5 CoCo's ranging from a D-board to?CC3's. A Dragon 64. An > MC10. TP10's, DMP110 printers, floppy drives, multipaks, yada yada. > Memory chips, extra ECB chips, more. Boxes of books & software ranging > from kiddy stuff to OS9 L2. Mags. And so on. Almost everything is > pristine, most hardware's in original boxes. All worked at the time. ?? > I put a bunch of pics in an album on the group site - hope that's OK? > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/photos/album/600773952/pic/list > ? That's far from all of it, I haven't even looked at the floppies to > see what they are. More paks, more books, hardware, etc. Cassettes, > cassette drive, modem, mouse, joysticks, cables,?who knows what else. ? > I'll probably start listing these things on eBay within the next week or > so, unless there's a better option. (suggestions?) ?Just thought I'd > post some pics & see if there's?interest! ? Ed St Louis, MO I sent you a note expressing interest and making an offer on some of it. Did you not receive it? -- From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 17 12:22:45 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 11:22:45 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901162331.32316.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> <20090117053309.935B020A18@qs281.pair.com> <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090117172255.6D31F20A1C@qs281.pair.com> At 03:53 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: > >At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > >>Hi Mark, > >> > >>Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak uses a > >>newer hardware technology and can be used without the services of an MPI. > >>Other than that they both do about the same thing... correct? > >> > >> > I should expand. > >> > > >> > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that > >> > creates the RSR232 rail voltages. > >> > > >> > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device to > >> > work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > > > >I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 > >without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably > >can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any > >CoCo unless you're using an MPI. > >It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it works, >but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do well. I >have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply hiccuped. The >one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so it works in an >MPI only now. Why would the RS-232 pak need 12 volts? The chips need 5v and are few, plus the DC Modem Pak has more circuitry with the phone modem portion so does it work on a CoCo 3? The reason I'm asking this is because we're working on a simple RS-232 pak the size of a game pak and I see nothing in it that should draw too much current from the CoCo. My hacked DC Modem pak works well on my CoCo 3 and someone added the signal level converter ICs. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 17 12:49:41 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 12:49:41 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <20090117172255.6D31F20A1C@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117172255.6D31F20A1C@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >At 03:53 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >>On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >> >At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >> >>Hi Mark, >> >> >> >>Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak >> >> uses a newer hardware technology and can be used without the services >> >> of an MPI. Other than that they both do about the same thing... >> >> correct? >> >> >> >> > I should expand. >> >> > >> >> > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that >> >> > creates the RSR232 rail voltages. >> >> > >> >> > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device >> >> > to work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. >> > >> >I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 >> >without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably >> >can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any >> >CoCo unless you're using an MPI. >> >>It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it >> works, but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do >> well. I have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply >> hiccuped. The one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so >> it works in an MPI only now. > >Why would the RS-232 pak need 12 volts? The chips need 5v and are >few, plus the DC Modem Pak has more circuitry with the phone modem >portion so does it work on a CoCo 3? Because the signaling standards for RS-232 call for plus and minus 12 volts to be the swing level. Therefore, they used a set of 1488-1489 level translator chips between the 6551 acia (or any other uart for that matter) and the output connector. >The reason I'm asking this is >because we're working on a simple RS-232 pak the size of a game pak >and I see nothing in it that should draw too much current from the >CoCo. My hacked DC Modem pak works well on my CoCo 3 and someone >added the signal level converter ICs. And works without the plus and minus 12 volts when plugged into a coco3 directly? That has to be an extremely well balanced circuit, it should not normally. Not to mention that since you don't have a disk system then, writing a driver for it in basic would be quite a coding exercise. So does mine, I made one of them out of a modem pack too, but it only works in an MPI because those level translator chips need its plus and minus 12 volts, which the coco 3 does not supply, and which the older coco's only supplied very marginally, around +-9 volts IIRC. That is enough to make it work 99.9% of the time, but leaves precious little over drive for noise margins and poor or long cabling. For all new designs, investigate the MAX-232 line of chips for that function, which contain their own charge pump level translators that are probably 500% more efficient than the Aztec mini-switcher in the RS-232 Deluxe pack ever thought of being. That puppy ran HOT! Or did in the 2 I have. Neither have survived the ravages of age and 24/7 uptimes at the Heskett ranchette. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The lunatic, the lover, and the poet, Are of imagination all compact... -- Wm. Shakespeare, "A Midsummer Night's Dream" From t.fadden at cox.net Sat Jan 17 13:06:48 2009 From: t.fadden at cox.net (Tim Fadden) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 11:06:48 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117172255.6D31F20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <49721E38.8030706@cox.net> Actually 12v is the median voltage. The maximum is 25v and the minimum is 3v. Depending on cable lingths, quality, etc, 5v will work just fine. All-be-it it's at the low end of the specs. Good right-up here: http://www.camiresearch.com/Data_Com_Basics/RS232_standard.html#anchor1181130 Also found this one here: http://www.omega.com/TechRef/pdf/RS-232.pdf TRANSMITTED SIGNAL VOLTAGE LEVELS: Binary 0: +5 to +15 Vdc (called a ?space? or ?on?) Binary 1: -5 to -15 Vdc (called a ?mark? or ?off?) RECEIVED SIGNAL VOLTAGE LEVELS: Binary 0: +3 to +13 Vdc Binary 1: -3 to -13 Vdc Google is smart, use it! ha ha ha Too bad you have to weed out so much advertising to get to the good stuff! Hasn't always been that way. Cheers! Tim etc, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: > >> At 03:53 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >> >>> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >>> >>>> At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak >>>>> uses a newer hardware technology and can be used without the services >>>>> of an MPI. Other than that they both do about the same thing... >>>>> correct? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I should expand. >>>>>> >>>>>> There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that >>>>>> creates the RSR232 rail voltages. >>>>>> >>>>>> What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device >>>>>> to work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. >>>>>> >>>> I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 >>>> without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably >>>> can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any >>>> CoCo unless you're using an MPI. >>>> >>> It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it >>> works, but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do >>> well. I have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply >>> hiccuped. The one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so >>> it works in an MPI only now. >>> >> Why would the RS-232 pak need 12 volts? The chips need 5v and are >> few, plus the DC Modem Pak has more circuitry with the phone modem >> portion so does it work on a CoCo 3? >> > > Because the signaling standards for RS-232 call for plus and minus 12 volts to > be the swing level. Therefore, they used a set of 1488-1489 level translator > chips between the 6551 acia (or any other uart for that matter) and the > output connector. > > >> The reason I'm asking this is >> because we're working on a simple RS-232 pak the size of a game pak >> and I see nothing in it that should draw too much current from the >> CoCo. My hacked DC Modem pak works well on my CoCo 3 and someone >> added the signal level converter ICs. >> > > And works without the plus and minus 12 volts when plugged into a coco3 > directly? That has to be an extremely well balanced circuit, it should not > normally. Not to mention that since you don't have a disk system then, > writing a driver for it in basic would be quite a coding exercise. > > So does mine, I made one of them out of a modem pack too, but it only works in > an MPI because those level translator chips need its plus and minus 12 volts, > which the coco 3 does not supply, and which the older coco's only supplied > very marginally, around +-9 volts IIRC. That is enough to make it work 99.9% > of the time, but leaves precious little over drive for noise margins and poor > or long cabling. > > For all new designs, investigate the MAX-232 line of chips for that function, > which contain their own charge pump level translators that are probably 500% > more efficient than the Aztec mini-switcher in the RS-232 Deluxe pack ever > thought of being. That puppy ran HOT! Or did in the 2 I have. Neither have > survived the ravages of age and 24/7 uptimes at the Heskett ranchette. > > From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 17 13:00:15 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 12:00:15 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901170453.33395.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117172255.6D31F20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090117184427.6012420A18@qs281.pair.com> At 11:49 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: > >At 03:53 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: > >>On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: > >> >At 10:31 PM 1/16/2009, you wrote: > >> >>Hi Mark, > >> >> > >> >>Thanks for the explanation. So if I understand correctly, the TelPak > >> >> uses a newer hardware technology and can be used without the services > >> >> of an MPI. Other than that they both do about the same thing... > >> >> correct? > >> >> > >> >> > I should expand. > >> >> > > >> >> > There is a MAX chip in the TelePak that has acharge pump in it that > >> >> > creates the RSR232 rail voltages. > >> >> > > >> >> > What this means is that you DO NOT need a multi-pak for this device > >> >> > to work in a CoCo3 as the Tandy pack does. > >> > > >> >I've never known the Deluxe RS-232 Pak to not work in a CoCo 3 > >> >without an MPI. There's a ROM in the pak which means you probably > >> >can't use it at the same time a floppy controller is plugged into Any > >> >CoCo unless you're using an MPI. > >> > >>It works if that teeny little Aztec 5 volt to +-12 volt switcher in it > >> works, but the draw on the 5 volt line is more than the cc3 supply can do > >> well. I have seen several cc3s with blown fuses because that supply > >> hiccuped. The one in mine let out all the smoke and died a decade ago, so > >> it works in an MPI only now. > > > >Why would the RS-232 pak need 12 volts? The chips need 5v and are > >few, plus the DC Modem Pak has more circuitry with the phone modem > >portion so does it work on a CoCo 3? > >Because the signaling standards for RS-232 call for plus and minus >12 volts to >be the swing level. Therefore, they used a set of 1488-1489 level translator >chips between the 6551 acia (or any other uart for that matter) and the >output connector. > > >The reason I'm asking this is > >because we're working on a simple RS-232 pak the size of a game pak > >and I see nothing in it that should draw too much current from the > >CoCo. My hacked DC Modem pak works well on my CoCo 3 and someone > >added the signal level converter ICs. > >And works without the plus and minus 12 volts when plugged into a coco3 >directly? That has to be an extremely well balanced circuit, it should not >normally. Not to mention that since you don't have a disk system then, >writing a driver for it in basic would be quite a coding exercise. > >So does mine, I made one of them out of a modem pack too, but it >only works in >an MPI because those level translator chips need its plus and minus 12 volts, >which the coco 3 does not supply, and which the older coco's only supplied >very marginally, around +-9 volts IIRC. That is enough to make it work 99.9% >of the time, but leaves precious little over drive for noise margins and poor >or long cabling. > >For all new designs, investigate the MAX-232 line of chips for that function, >which contain their own charge pump level translators that are probably 500% >more efficient than the Aztec mini-switcher in the RS-232 Deluxe pack ever >thought of being. That puppy ran HOT! Or did in the 2 I have. Neither have >survived the ravages of age and 24/7 uptimes at the Heskett ranchette. My hacked DC Modem Pak has a 1488 and 1489 and it has worked flawlessly from any CoCo 3 I've owned. Odd. Without the 1488/1489 chips - just a 6551, 27xx EPROM, 7404 and 74133 should run from a 5v supply from the CoCo slot. The CoCoNet pak will eventually send signals out over a 3.3v RS-232 bluetooth module. I see no problem with it working with any CoCo 2 or 3 without an MPI. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 17 14:03:19 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 14:03:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <20090117184427.6012420A18@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117184427.6012420A18@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >At 11:49 AM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >>On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: [...] >>For all new designs, investigate the MAX-232 line of chips for that >> function, which contain their own charge pump level translators that are >> probably 500% more efficient than the Aztec mini-switcher in the RS-232 >> Deluxe pack ever thought of being. That puppy ran HOT! Or did in the 2 I >> have. Neither have survived the ravages of age and 24/7 uptimes at the >> Heskett ranchette. > >My hacked DC Modem Pak has a 1488 and 1489 and it has worked >flawlessly from any CoCo 3 I've owned. Odd. And it will continue to work, until it has to face a genuine RS-232 interface in a 1974 printer. :) A ttl level signal will not drive my old Xerox 1650-ro, no response. The coco's bit banger can though. >Without the 1488/1489 chips - just a 6551, 27xx EPROM, 7404 and 74133 >should run from a 5v supply from the CoCo slot. The CoCoNet pak will >eventually send signals out over a 3.3v RS-232 bluetooth module. I I think RS-232 is a good protocol myself, and I see no reason to not use it at straight TTL logic levels with short runs of good shielded cabling. Or to your bluetooth module on the same board, it makes absolutely perfect sense. But we shouldn't call it a legit RS-232, its not. If we don't tell the chips they aren't supposed to work, they usually will. :) I once needed a really fast 3/8 decoder for a cmos circuit that had about 28 volts on it, so I used the 15 volt rated CD4xxx chip that was available. I got sub 100ns rise and fall times out of it, at ntsc video speeds, with only a 10F temp rise. It ran for several years that way, putting adjustable color and brightness outlines around the characters in an old 3m character generator at KRCR in Redding CA. >see no problem with it working with any CoCo 2 or 3 without an MPI. But where do you get a driver for it in a diskless scenario? Or is the teletext rom still enabled? I had forgotten that thing even exists... -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Solutions are obvious if one only has the optical power to observe them over the horizon. -- K.A. Arsdall From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 17 14:24:43 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 13:24:43 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171249.41781.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117184427.6012420A18@qs281.pair.com> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> While we're on the subject, has anyone pushed a regular 1mhz-rated 6551 to ~1.78mhz (2mhz CoCo) with problems? >And it will continue to work, until it has to face a genuine RS-232 interface >in a 1974 printer. :) Heheheh. I bet that printer dims the lights when the carriage returns. >I think RS-232 is a good protocol myself, and I see no reason to not >use it at >straight TTL logic levels with short runs of good shielded cabling. Or to >your bluetooth module on the same board, it makes absolutely perfect sense. >But we shouldn't call it a legit RS-232, its not. Good enough. Just a serial pak or bluetooth pak. >But where do you get a driver for it in a diskless scenario? Or is the >teletext rom still enabled? I had forgotten that thing even exists... My DC Modem Pak doesn't auto-start the ROM's software. A few POKEs from BASIC can make the pak send test data to my PC, or I have cocotape.exe for loading simple comm programs from the PC as cassette audio. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 17 14:57:21 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 14:57:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Roger Taylor wrote: >While we're on the subject, has anyone pushed a regular 1mhz-rated >6551 to ~1.78mhz (2mhz CoCo) with problems? > >>And it will continue to work, until it has to face a genuine RS-232 >> interface in a 1974 printer. :) > >Heheheh. I bet that printer dims the lights when the carriage returns. No, but since a return can be as much as 18" and the head weighs about a pound, it can seriously shake the stand its on to kindling in 20 minutes if its not had the screw in every nail hole treatment, along with some Tightbond-III glue. >>I think RS-232 is a good protocol myself, and I see no reason to not >>use it at >>straight TTL logic levels with short runs of good shielded cabling. Or to >>your bluetooth module on the same board, it makes absolutely perfect sense. >>But we shouldn't call it a legit RS-232, its not. > >Good enough. Just a serial pak or bluetooth pak. > >>But where do you get a driver for it in a diskless scenario? Or is the >>teletext rom still enabled? I had forgotten that thing even exists... > >My DC Modem Pak doesn't auto-start the ROM's software. A few POKEs >from BASIC can make the pak send test data to my PC, or I have >cocotape.exe for loading simple comm programs from the PC as cassette audio. I had forgotten that. I should get that, but the pc it would have to work against runs linux. The only windows around here is a 20Gb XP install on my lappy, kept only for testing purposes if I have to take it to CC or someplace for service. It no longer autoboots XP although it is in the boot menu. As CC has announced to close the other 500+ stores (bankrupt) my extended warranty is probably toast, and I will probably blow that partition away the next time I update the linux on it. I wonder if wine can run your pc stuff? OTOH, I have a 1GB drive on the coco, so all I really need is a working comm link to it. Cabling is already there. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober. -- William Butler Yeats From petrander at gmail.com Sat Jan 17 14:58:47 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 20:58:47 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <49713403.9070206@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: Sorry for the confusion, guys. Of course I meant the 34 pin floppy connector on a PC, which is not IDE. I just need to put a male connector on the ribbon cable instead of the standard female. Understanding from Steven Hirsch, this is quite doable. Thanks for the help! Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/17 John Donaldson > Fedor, > Why are trying to use the IDE cabel to access a 5.25 floppy. Almost all > motherboards have a Floppy controller and port. Just use a floppy cable and > hook it up to the 5.25 floppy. I have a 486 machine with both a 3" and a > 5.25 hooked that way. > > John Donaldson > > > > Fedor Steeman wrote: > > Hi guys, >> >> I have been getting closer to the aforementioned "quest" to connect a CoCo >> 5,25" floppy drive to a pc. I have now selected a drive that apparantly >> can >> be switched between 40 or 80 tracks BTW, so now comes the next question: >> >> How to connect a modern IDE cable connecter to this old drive? I have no >> experience with the "crimping" that I have read about, but it seems >> tricky. >> What is needed for this? I suppose I need to clip off the original IDE >> connector and then "crimp" and older one on to it. Would I need to twist >> any >> wires? Or are there any adapters available? >> >> Thanks for any input. >> >> Cheers, >> Fedor >> >> 2008/10/5 Darren A >> >> >> >>> On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: >>> >>> >>>> The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for >>>> (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the >>> CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. >>> Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. >>> >>> Go to and use the links there >>> to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These >>> will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. >>> >>> Darren >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From petrander at gmail.com Sat Jan 17 15:01:32 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 21:01:32 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Hi Gene, 2009/1/16 Gene Heskett > Be aware that this is a double edged sword Fedor. The heads on that drive > are > not wide enough to fully erase old info when over-writing in the 40 tpi > mode, > and generally there is a 100% chance of trashing the disk. > > Hmmm.... Are you saying I had better use a 80 track drive? Or just proceed with caution? I have plenty of dispensible ol' diskettes to test with... Regards, Fedor From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 17 15:19:39 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 15:19:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 17 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: >Hi Gene, > >2009/1/16 Gene Heskett > >> Be aware that this is a double edged sword Fedor. The heads on that drive >> are >> not wide enough to fully erase old info when over-writing in the 40 tpi >> mode, >> and generally there is a 100% chance of trashing the disk. > >Hmmm.... Are you saying I had better use a 80 track drive? Or just proceed >with caution? I have plenty of dispensible ol' diskettes to test with... It is an 80 track drive, but the drivers will if the os9 descriptors are set correctly, double step the drive so as to stay in the center of the wider 40 track drives recorded track. It is NOT safe to write to a 40 track formatted disk with that drive, so the caution is to treat 40 track disks as inviolately read only. They will be trashed by a write in an 80 track drive when next they are read in a 40 track drive because the read will get both the old and new data. Very confusing. Not also that this (48 tpi vs 96 tpi) situation only exists in the 5.25" drives, the 3.5" drives are uniformly 135 tracks per inch, and formatting a 35 or 40 track format just doesn't use all the disk as they can usually reach 83 to 85 tracks if you want to play with the descriptors in os9. The coco will not know the difference, relying entirely (in os9) on the data in Logical Sector Number Zero (LSN0) to ascertain what sort of a disk it has in the drive. Basic of course is pretty much hard coded as issued, and that disk format isn't file structure compatible with os9. That is also 2 different problems. -- Cheers Fedor, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Of course I use Microsoft. Setting up a stable Unix network is no challenge. -- From a Slashdot.org post From operator at coco3.com Sat Jan 17 15:27:03 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 14:27:03 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Telepak RS232 Pak In-Reply-To: <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090117202742.0262C20A16@qs281.pair.com> At 01:57 PM 1/17/2009, you wrote: >I wonder if wine can run your pc stuff? OTOH, I have a 1GB drive on >the coco, >so all I really need is a working comm link to it. Cabling is already there. I've run Rainbow IDE and Portal-9 under Wine but only tested for a short time, so I don't make any bug-free claims. CoCoTape calls a Windows API routine to play the internally-generated WAVE file. CoCoTape should in theory work under Linux to at least create the .wav file but I'd still need to compile the program under Linux or supply the source to an HLA assembler/compiler user among us, but since the source is similar to other compiler syntax, porting should be fairly simple. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From Torsten at Dittel.info Sat Jan 17 16:14:23 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 22:14:23 +0100 Subject: [Coco] to Chester: Hope you're fine... In-Reply-To: <8CB4542B59F6040-998-53@WEBMAIL-MY17.sysops.aol.com> References: <200901131705.37035.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <8CB4542B59F6040-998-53@WEBMAIL-MY17.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: paulh96636 at aol.com schrieb: > I don't recall any report about the Richter reading.?? I would have rather worried about the Becquerel reading. Guess you didn't have a radiation dosimeter close... Torsten From bcarter at theshop.net Sun Jan 18 02:50:20 2009 From: bcarter at theshop.net (Ben) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 01:50:20 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 68, Issue 27 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Roger and all, yes I can confirm that the 6551 does run clock/16 on the 0000 rate setting. Had mine running that way for years with a 14.4k modem for improved compressed throughput (modified clock /2 to get 57600). The modem response codes and actual throughput did confirm this rate. > The 6551 ACIA should be able to run at 115200 bps by setting the baud > rate to 0000 which means (external crystal / 16). Has anyone > confirmed this? From petrander at gmail.com Sun Jan 18 05:03:01 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 11:03:01 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Thanks Gene, but I don't think it will be a problem. My sole intent was to read disks with this drive using Omniflop, not to write anything on them. Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/17 Gene Heskett > On Saturday 17 January 2009, Fedor Steeman wrote: > >Hi Gene, > > > >2009/1/16 Gene Heskett > > > >> Be aware that this is a double edged sword Fedor. The heads on that > drive > >> are > >> not wide enough to fully erase old info when over-writing in the 40 tpi > >> mode, > >> and generally there is a 100% chance of trashing the disk. > > > >Hmmm.... Are you saying I had better use a 80 track drive? Or just proceed > >with caution? I have plenty of dispensible ol' diskettes to test with... > > It is an 80 track drive, but the drivers will if the os9 descriptors are > set > correctly, double step the drive so as to stay in the center of the wider > 40 > track drives recorded track. It is NOT safe to write to a 40 track > formatted > disk with that drive, so the caution is to treat 40 track disks as > inviolately read only. They will be trashed by a write in an 80 track > drive > when next they are read in a 40 track drive because the read will get both > the old and new data. Very confusing. > > Not also that this (48 tpi vs 96 tpi) situation only exists in the 5.25" > drives, the 3.5" drives are uniformly 135 tracks per inch, and formatting a > 35 or 40 track format just doesn't use all the disk as they can usually > reach > 83 to 85 tracks if you want to play with the descriptors in os9. The coco > will not know the difference, relying entirely (in os9) on the data in > Logical Sector Number Zero (LSN0) to ascertain what sort of a disk it has > in > the drive. Basic of course is pretty much hard coded as issued, and that > disk format isn't file structure compatible with os9. > > That is also 2 different problems. > > -- > Cheers Fedor, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > Of course I use Microsoft. Setting up a stable Unix network is no > challenge. > > -- From a Slashdot.org post > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Jan 18 09:53:02 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 09:53:02 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> Fedor Steeman wrote: > Thanks Gene, but I don't think it will be a problem. My sole intent was to > read disks with this drive using Omniflop, not to write anything on them. > > Cheers, > Fedor > Both omniflop.sys and fdrawcmd.sys can have problems reading disks formatted on a Coco. It is not the sector data or overall structure that is the problem but the low level format. If there are problems, it always works better with a disk formatted on the PC with either of the above and then filled with data on the Coco. That means COPY, BACKUP, SAVE, WRITE, format L, and any of the OS-9 write commands work fine. DSKINI or format (physical) can make the disk unreadable on the PC; not always but often enough to be avoided. From Torsten at Dittel.info Sun Jan 18 10:06:17 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:06:17 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: Robert Gault schrieb: > Both omniflop.sys and fdrawcmd.sys can have problems reading disks > formatted on a Coco. It is not the sector data or overall structure that > is the problem but the low level format. Actually the PC floppy controller is "sleeping" for a period of time after the index hole passes by. The track header of a CoCo formatted disk is quite short, so the floppy controller sometimes misses the sector header of sector 0. I could improve my results of reading CoCo formatted disks with a CoCo drive connected to the PC by playing around with the drive's speed while repeatedly reading sector 0 (in theory just slowing it down, although I darkly remember, I couldn't really proove that). Regards, Torsten From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 12:02:58 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 11:02:58 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 68, Issue 27 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090118170313.0D5BA20A19@qs281.pair.com> At 01:50 AM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Hi Roger and all, yes I can confirm that the 6551 does run clock/16 >on the 0000 rate setting. Had mine running that way for years with >a 14.4k modem for improved compressed throughput (modified clock /2 >to get 57600). The modem response codes and actual throughput did >confirm this rate. Years ago I made the claim that I was using the 115200 bps setting in the RS-232 Pack and had it connected to many of my dial-up modems. The modems have chips that mimick some of the older UARTs or even use those chips and would talk at 115200 bps. My own unreleased ANSI/VT-100/VT-52 16-color graphical terminal program called NetMate was used for years to call into BBSes and transfer files. Ultimaterm has to be set to (I think) the 450 baud or 50 baud (can't recall which one), which actually sets the 6551 to the 0000 bitrate (external clock / 16). So, Ultimaterm can talk at 115200 bps through: CoCoPro! RS-232 Pak, Tandy Deluxe RS-232 Pack, and a custom hacked DC Modem Pak, or any cartridge using a 6551. Some have used a twice as fast crystal to get 230.4k, and as you said, 57600 bps by using a /2 crystal. Makes sense. But what if no crystal is used? I keep reading the 6551 has an internal baud rate generator. This certainly doesn't mean an internal clock for all modes except 0000 ? Certainly not. :) >>The 6551 ACIA should be able to run at 115200 bps by setting the baud >>rate to 0000 which means (external crystal / 16). Has anyone >>confirmed this? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 12:31:22 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 11:31:22 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> Has anyone noticed on Sock's website he mentions that doubling the 6551 crystal value to 3.6864 mhz can be done but setting the 6551 to the ExternalClock/16 mode would yield 115200 bps, then he says: " this *almost* works! " Why wouldn't it work? We've proven that the CoCo can send and receive through the BITBANGER port at 115.2 bps, and believe it or not - 230.4 kbps. Maybe Sock means that IRQ can't be triggered that fast and the CoCo keep up? Why not? The 6551's IRQ goes to the CART signal which is tied to FIRQ. A circular buffer in the FIRQ service routine could do a quick FIFO store to a buffer and it should work? If not, the crystal should probably be dropped to 1.8432 / 2 to yield a 57600 bps mode which should work. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Sun Jan 18 14:27:50 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 11:27:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> IIRC, the PC Floppy controller is "sleeping" because when they designed it, they designed the supporting structure to reset the FDC chip every time the sector 0 sync hole came along. The CoCo didn't do that. Because of this there is an unused gap between the sync and chip "reset" recovery before it can write or read to the disk. It's in that gap, where the CoCo writes because it isn't clobbered over the head every sync to reset, that the PCs have a difficult time reading or writing to a CoCo disk that was formatted on a CoCo. Formatting a CoCo disk on the PC eliminates the unreadable time frame, as far as the PC is concerned, and the CoCo could care less that that gap exists. -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Sun, 1/18/09, Torsten Dittel wrote: > From: Torsten Dittel > Subject: Re: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Sunday, January 18, 2009, 9:06 AM > Robert Gault schrieb: > > Both omniflop.sys and fdrawcmd.sys can have problems > reading disks formatted on a Coco. It is not the sector data > or overall structure that is the problem but the low level > format. > > Actually the PC floppy controller is "sleeping" > for a period of time after the index hole passes by. The > track header of a CoCo formatted disk is quite short, so the > floppy controller sometimes misses the sector header of > sector 0. I could improve my results of reading CoCo > formatted disks with a CoCo drive connected to the PC by > playing around with the drive's speed while repeatedly > reading sector 0 (in theory just slowing it down, although I > darkly remember, I couldn't really proove that). > > Regards, > Torsten > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From petrander at gmail.com Sun Jan 18 15:05:15 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:05:15 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: Thanks, Robert. That sounds like some interesting and important information for my little endeavour. Right now I stand with a huge library of hundreds of diskettes that I would like to store on my hard disk as virtual floppies and then make available through the internet. Until now I would backup these (5.25" floppies) to 3.25" floppies using the CoCo and then would read them in on the PC. Of course, that is a bit tedious for so many disks. So it seemed to me I would save a lot of time if I could leave out the CoCo out of the equation and read the floppies in directly on my PC instead. The drive I wanted to use to this end was previously used to read and write these same disks. Are you saying that I can save the trouble and keep on doing the backing up on the CoCo, because success is far from guaranteed with doing it directly on the PC? Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/18 Robert Gault > Fedor Steeman wrote: > >> Thanks Gene, but I don't think it will be a problem. My sole intent was to >> read disks with this drive using Omniflop, not to write anything on them. >> >> Cheers, >> Fedor >> >> > Both omniflop.sys and fdrawcmd.sys can have problems reading disks > formatted on a Coco. It is not the sector data or overall structure that is > the problem but the low level format. > > If there are problems, it always works better with a disk formatted on the > PC with either of the above and then filled with data on the Coco. That > means COPY, BACKUP, SAVE, WRITE, format L, and any of the OS-9 write > commands work fine. DSKINI or format (physical) can make the disk unreadable > on the PC; not always but often enough to be avoided. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jan 18 16:10:59 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:10:59 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 18 January 2009, Bill Barnes wrote: >IIRC, the PC Floppy controller is "sleeping" because when they designed it, > they designed the supporting structure to reset the FDC chip every time the > sector 0 sync hole came along. The CoCo didn't do that. Because of this > there is an unused gap between the sync and chip "reset" recovery before it > can write or read to the disk. It's in that gap, where the CoCo writes > because it isn't clobbered over the head every sync to reset, that the PCs > have a difficult time reading or writing to a CoCo disk that was formatted > on a CoCo. Formatting a CoCo disk on the PC eliminates the unreadable time > frame, as far as the PC is concerned, and the CoCo could care less that > that gap exists. > I had heard there was a gap timing problem occasionally, and it has bothered the coco. But this is the first time I've read a cogent explanation of it. Thank you. FWIW Bill, I find that when I am doing nitros9 disk images here in this linux box, Fedora 8, generic kernel local build, that I must first format the disk on the coco in order for it to work correctly, otherwise dd gets a tummy ache a few sectors into the write and dumps out. If anyone knows the secret of properly formatting a coco disk on linux, I would appreciate a hand. Software to use, command line to use, etc, please. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) You cannot propel yourself forward by patting yourself on the back. From 6809er at bjork-huffman.net Sun Jan 18 16:11:28 2009 From: 6809er at bjork-huffman.net (Steve) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 13:11:28 -0800 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps (Roger's CoCo Net) In-Reply-To: <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> To Roger and all... Like most chips, 6551 was designed to work with a 1.8 MHz crystal but sometimes a production run of a chip can be clocked little faster. But looking over specs for the 6551, pushing the chip to double speed is a bit of a hit and miss. The place where you get into real problems is reading the data at those speed. With only 15 clocks cycles to do the following... Test for new data Read the data Decide that to do with it. And then decide to loop for more data. As you can see, that's a lot of work do in only 15 clock cycles and if you are not there in time to read the next byte then it's lost forever. That's why IBM's PC (back in the early days) swaped out the single byte UART for a 16 byte (or more) FIFO buffer UART chip. While code still needs to be overall fast enough to read the data, it can take a break to handle some overhead in the decision code. (Or an interrupt or two.) On a side note: This need for quick timing loop is why Tandy used the Halt and Load design for the Floppy Disk Controller. The timing was too tight to have the CPU test for a byte being ready so they just halted the CPU till till the byte was there. (It was up to the interrupt to end the reading loop.) Not the best design. But it was cheap and worked. One advantage you have with CoCo Net Roger, you can design the data transfer protocol so you don't to take too long in the read loop. Roger's CoCo Net is one those "tight bits of code" that redefines what you can with a CoCo. The Internet has changed just everything in our lifes and now the CoCo can be part of it. Great going Roger. My hat was off to you for the RAINBOW IDE, now I got to find that hat again for CoCo Net. Steve (Zaxxon) Bjork At 09:31 AM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Has anyone noticed on Sock's website he mentions that doubling the >6551 crystal value to 3.6864 mhz can be done but setting the 6551 to >the ExternalClock/16 mode would yield 115200 bps, then he says: " >this *almost* works! " Why wouldn't it work? > >We've proven that the CoCo can send and receive through the >BITBANGER port at 115.2 bps, and believe it or not - 230.4 kbps. > >Maybe Sock means that IRQ can't be triggered that fast and the CoCo >keep up? Why not? The 6551's IRQ goes to the CART signal which is >tied to FIRQ. A circular buffer in the FIRQ service routine could >do a quick FIFO store to a buffer and it should work? If not, the >crystal should probably be dropped to 1.8432 / 2 to yield a 57600 >bps mode which should work. >-- >Roger Taylor From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 16:51:52 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 15:51:52 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps (Roger's CoCo Net) In-Reply-To: <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090118215209.12DD120A19@qs281.pair.com> At 03:11 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >To Roger and all... >Like most chips, 6551 was designed to work with a 1.8 MHz crystal >but sometimes a production run of a chip can be clocked little >faster. But looking over specs for the 6551, pushing the chip to >double speed is a bit of a hit and miss. > >The place where you get into real problems is reading the data at >those speed. With only 15 clocks cycles to do the following... > >Test for new data >Read the data >Decide that to do with it. >And then decide to loop for more data. > >As you can see, that's a lot of work do in only 15 clock cycles and >if you are not there in time to read the next byte then it's lost forever. The third step can probably be left out. >One advantage you have with CoCo Net Roger, you can design the data >transfer protocol so you don't to take too long in the read loop. Yes, the 57600 bps (115200 if 2mhz) bitbanger routines are done and work well. Since CoCoNet transfers predefined block sizes, a manual loop could coded tight that reads the 6551 data quickly. I think it can be done. Existing 6551-based terminal programs would probably barf if IRQ/FIRQ handles the receiving at 115200 bps. I suppose 57600 bps by using a 1/2 speed crystal would give about 30 CPU cycles to read and store using an interrupt service routine? FIRQ takes up how many cycles by itself? Hmm. 57600 bps might not even be possible from existing CoCo comm programs. >Roger's CoCo Net is one those "tight bits of code" that redefines >what you can with a CoCo. The Internet has changed just everything >in our lifes and now the CoCo can be part of it. Imagine requesting a URL from a BASIC program, a URL with appended variables, to a PHP script (oops! I meant Perl :) ). This gives the CoCo interactive capabilities. We could post game coordinates and other data to a multi-player server script which sends back our response as a file containing everybody's current information, etc. HTTP PUT is not possible at this time, but a LOT can be "uploaded" or "put" to a web server by just appending variables to the URL, and having the "page" or script on the server process the appended stuff. It'll work like a charm. It has in my tests. The simplicity of the CoCoNet system is almost silly. It's a ROM Pak and a cable. Without the ROM Pak, a CoCo 3 user could LOADM the patch right in and not even type EXEC and it's ready. A 64k CoCo 2 user would have to be in all-RAM mode to do the same. So, a ROM Pak was the simplest way to get CoCoNet running, and so it is, acting as a virtual floppy controller and web access pak in one. What could be even better? WIRELESS for the same. The Bluetooth Pak is on the table. Fairly basic design. Plug the little black pak in and BASIC/CoCoNet connects wireless to a PC using a cheap Bluetooth dongle. It might sound complicated to some reading, but it's not. Imagine booting into BASIC, seeing the cursor, typing DIR and the disk is actually located on a WEB SERVER somewhere. Things like that are possible even from the bitbanger CoCoNet. >Great going Roger. My hat was off to you for the RAINBOW IDE, now I >got to find that hat again for CoCo Net. > >Steve (Zaxxon) Bjork Well, Steve, guess who was my programmer idol growing up? Every time I'd go into Radio Shack and drool over the demo games running or on the shelf, I saw "Steve Bjork" on all the cool stuff. My hat's off to you as well. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From Torsten at Dittel.info Sun Jan 18 17:51:47 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:51:47 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: Gene Heskett schrieb: > [...] this is the first time I've read a cogent explanation of it. I once found that explanation here: http://www.moria.de/~michael/floppy/floppy.pdf On page 10 it reads: "[...] The NEC 765 controller goes to sleep for about 1.8ms after the index hole is sensed and expects still to read gap 1 when it wakes up. It works fine for floppies formatted using the 765, because it will always generate the format as specified above. The WD 1797 controller, though, does not have a command to format a track, but writes a given pattern to the track when formatting it. If the pattern has a too short post index gap, for example because it is a format which tries to maximise the usable disk space, the 765 controller will fail to read the first sector. To make things yet more complicated, the 765A controller only sleeps for 0.6ms, which means it is less sensitive to shorter post index gaps. [...]" Regards, Torsten From snhirsch at gmail.com Sun Jan 18 18:11:34 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:11:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 18 Jan 2009, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 18 January 2009, Bill Barnes wrote: >> IIRC, the PC Floppy controller is "sleeping" because when they designed it, >> they designed the supporting structure to reset the FDC chip every time the >> sector 0 sync hole came along. The CoCo didn't do that. Because of this >> there is an unused gap between the sync and chip "reset" recovery before it >> can write or read to the disk. It's in that gap, where the CoCo writes >> because it isn't clobbered over the head every sync to reset, that the PCs >> have a difficult time reading or writing to a CoCo disk that was formatted >> on a CoCo. Formatting a CoCo disk on the PC eliminates the unreadable time >> frame, as far as the PC is concerned, and the CoCo could care less that >> that gap exists. >> > I had heard there was a gap timing problem occasionally, and it has bothered > the coco. But this is the first time I've read a cogent explanation of it. > Thank you. I'll add to that. It's something I've noticed when moving disks back and forth. Once it's been formatted on a CoCo, my Linux box chokes on it. Other way around works fine. > FWIW Bill, I find that when I am doing nitros9 disk images here in this linux > box, Fedora 8, generic kernel local build, that I must first format the disk > on the coco in order for it to work correctly, otherwise dd gets a tummy ache > a few sectors into the write and dumps out. If anyone knows the secret of > properly formatting a coco disk on linux, I would appreciate a hand. > Software to use, command line to use, etc, please. Exactly the opposite from my experience. I _can_ tell you that the disk parms are incorrect on many systems. Here's what I had to do on a Xubuntu 7.04 box: Install 'fdutils' Check the media descriptor in /etc/mediaprm. On my box, COCO360 and COCO720 used an extraneous 'zero-based' flag. This is certainly incorrect for 5.25" diskettes (haven't tried the 3.5 yet). Run the 'floppymeter' utility with a scratch diskette and let it calibrate for any variance in drive speed (creates a control file called /etc/driveprm. Format diskettes by: - Insert diskette in drive $ setfdprm /dev/fd0 COCO360 $ superformat /dev/fd0 COCO360 Copy image: $ dd if= of=/dev/fd0 bs=256 Adjust names to suit your system. The important issue to always execute setfdprm with the target disk in the drive. Steve -- From lamune at doki-doki.net Sun Jan 18 18:20:22 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 15:20:22 -0800 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net><200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com><200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> Roger, If you were to take the 1.8432MHz clock and feed it right into the 6551's TxC and RxC (clock) pins and set the chip to external clock mode, you'd get 115,200 bps out of it. It's guaranteed up to 125k bps, meaning the fastest clock it can accept on those pins would be 2MHz. I'd guess the internal crystal oscillator isn't capable of reliably operating at 3.68MHz- but it may be possible to feed it with an external can oscillator. The guts of the thing are indeed capable of 115,200. > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:31 AM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > > > Has anyone noticed on Sock's website he mentions that doubling the > 6551 crystal value to 3.6864 mhz can be done but setting the 6551 to > the ExternalClock/16 mode would yield 115200 bps, then he says: " > this *almost* works! " Why wouldn't it work? > > We've proven that the CoCo can send and receive through the BITBANGER > port at 115.2 bps, and believe it or not - 230.4 kbps. > > Maybe Sock means that IRQ can't be triggered that fast and the CoCo > keep up? Why not? The 6551's IRQ goes to the CART signal which is > tied to FIRQ. A circular buffer in the FIRQ service routine could do > a quick FIFO store to a buffer and it should work? If not, the > crystal should probably be dropped to 1.8432 / 2 to yield a 57600 > bps mode which should work. > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Sun Jan 18 18:49:50 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:49:50 +0000 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps (Roger's CoCo Net) In-Reply-To: <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4973C01E.6050201@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Steve wrote: > To Roger and all... [Snip!] > On a side note: This need for quick timing loop is why Tandy used the > Halt and Load design for the Floppy Disk Controller. The timing was too > tight to have the CPU test for a byte being ready so they just halted > the CPU till till the byte was there. (It was up to the interrupt to > end the reading loop.) Not the best design. But it was cheap and worked. It is doable, but it does require some 6809 tricks to do it, the Dragon Floppy controler did it by setting DP to $FF so that it could address the WD2797 with a 1 byte address as opposed to 2, e.g. LDA $40 instead of LDA $FF40 etc which saved a read cycle, and then used an FIRQ/SYNC loop to process the data, with NMI to break out of the loop when done. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 18:49:36 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 17:49:36 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.lo cal> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> At 05:20 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > >If you were to take the 1.8432MHz clock and feed it right into the >6551's TxC and RxC (clock) pins and set the chip to external clock mode, >you'd get 115,200 bps out of it. With the 1.8432 mhz crystal connected at XTAL1 and XTAL2 where it's supposed to be, setting the baud rate to 0000 achieves the same thing, or am I missing something? Are you saying the E signal could be sent to TxC and RxC to achieve 57600 bps and 115200 bps based on whether the CoCo is at normal or double speed? Also, if the 6551 has an internal crystal oscillator, why is the 1.8432 crystal needed? I keep seeing questions like this being asked about the 6551 and how to get faster or tweaked bitrates from it, mainly from old Apple and Commodore folks. >It's guaranteed up to 125k bps, meaning the fastest clock it can accept >on those pins would be 2MHz. > >I'd guess the internal crystal oscillator isn't capable of reliably >operating at 3.68MHz- but it may be possible to feed it with an external >can oscillator. The guts of the thing are indeed capable of 115,200. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:31 AM > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > > > > > > > Has anyone noticed on Sock's website he mentions that doubling the > > 6551 crystal value to 3.6864 mhz can be done but setting the 6551 to > > the ExternalClock/16 mode would yield 115200 bps, then he says: " > > this *almost* works! " Why wouldn't it work? > > > > We've proven that the CoCo can send and receive through the BITBANGER > > port at 115.2 bps, and believe it or not - 230.4 kbps. > > > > Maybe Sock means that IRQ can't be triggered that fast and the CoCo > > keep up? Why not? The 6551's IRQ goes to the CART signal which is > > tied to FIRQ. A circular buffer in the FIRQ service routine could do > > a quick FIFO store to a buffer and it should work? If not, the > > crystal should probably be dropped to 1.8432 / 2 to yield a 57600 > > bps mode which should work. > > -- > > Roger Taylor > > > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 19:34:40 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:34:40 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com> At 05:49 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >At 05:20 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >>Roger, >> >>If you were to take the 1.8432MHz clock and feed it right into the >>6551's TxC and RxC (clock) pins and set the chip to external clock mode, >>you'd get 115,200 bps out of it. > >With the 1.8432 mhz crystal connected at XTAL1 and XTAL2 where it's >supposed to be, setting the baud rate to 0000 achieves the same >thing, or am I missing something? > >Are you saying the E signal could be sent to TxC and RxC to achieve >57600 bps and 115200 bps based on whether the CoCo is at normal or >double speed? Scratch that last question. E wouldn't be 1.8432 mhz either way. I guess TxC/RxC has a different function than XTAL1/XTAL2. I don't know. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 19:43:01 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:43:01 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps (Roger's CoCo Net) In-Reply-To: <4973C01E.6050201@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090118211141.CD89720A13@qs281.pair.com> <4973C01E.6050201@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <20090119004411.AC37B20A16@qs281.pair.com> At 05:49 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Steve wrote: >>To Roger and all... >[Snip!] >>On a side note: This need for quick timing loop is why Tandy used >>the Halt and Load design for the Floppy Disk Controller. The >>timing was too tight to have the CPU test for a byte being ready so >>they just halted the CPU till till the byte was there. (It was up >>to the interrupt to end the reading loop.) Not the best >>design. But it was cheap and worked. > >It is doable, but it does require some 6809 tricks to do it, the >Dragon Floppy controler did it by setting DP to $FF so that it could >address the WD2797 with a 1 byte address as opposed to 2, e.g. LDA >$40 instead of LDA $FF40 etc which saved a read cycle, and then used >an FIRQ/SYNC loop to process the data, with NMI to break out of the >loop when done. Most stuff is doable given enough thought. Maybe the 6551 IRQ triggering the CoCo's FIRQ routine could save the current PCR, save the current Data In byte, jump back into the mainline code at a Read Buffer routine that disables FIRQ temporarily, reads a chunk of data manually using very tight code and by checking the 6551 status bits until no data is there, enabling FIRQ and returning to PCR where FIRQ first interrupted. The fact that no data is present when the manual reader stops might mean there is time for another FIRQ to happen again without missing data. Things like this would have to be tested extensively using all sorts of high level protocols like XMODEM-CRC, Y-MODEM, etc. to see how things behave at 115200 bps. A long continuous stream of incoming data could be a problem, but who knows. This is why the RTS/CTS signals should be utilized. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From lamune at doki-doki.net Sun Jan 18 21:35:45 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:35:45 -0800 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net><200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com><200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local><20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.local> The TxC and RxC pins (5 & 12) are independent of the crystal oscillator and internal baud rate generator. The way to accomplish my original design would be to use an external 1.8432MHz oscillator and feed it to TxC, RxC, and the XTAL1 pin. It's a pretty simple mod. Actually I may just have to try this one out myself and see if it works like the datasheet says it should. > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 4:35 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > At 05:49 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: > >At 05:20 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: > >>Roger, > >> > >>If you were to take the 1.8432MHz clock and feed it right into the > >>6551's TxC and RxC (clock) pins and set the chip to external clock > mode, > >>you'd get 115,200 bps out of it. > > > >With the 1.8432 mhz crystal connected at XTAL1 and XTAL2 where it's > >supposed to be, setting the baud rate to 0000 achieves the same > >thing, or am I missing something? > > > >Are you saying the E signal could be sent to TxC and RxC to achieve > >57600 bps and 115200 bps based on whether the CoCo is at normal or > >double speed? > > Scratch that last question. E wouldn't be 1.8432 mhz either way. I > guess TxC/RxC has a different function than XTAL1/XTAL2. I don't know. > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 21:40:56 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 20:40:56 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.lo cal> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <20090119024114.685F620A15@qs281.pair.com> At 08:35 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >The TxC and RxC pins (5 & 12) are independent of the crystal oscillator >and internal baud rate generator. > >The way to accomplish my original design would be to use an external >1.8432MHz oscillator and feed it to TxC, RxC, and the XTAL1 pin. It's a >pretty simple mod. Actually I may just have to try this one out myself >and see if it works like the datasheet says it should. The datasheet says that either TxC or RxC should be left unconnected, can't recall which one. I already closed the PDF and have a mess of a desktop right now. I am not sure what the difference is in a Crystal Oscillator, an Oscillator, or a Crystal in these hacks/descriptions since people slang the terms around so much. Jameco clearly sells both Crystals and Oscillators both in 1.8432 mhz and 3.6864 mhz. Whether a cyrstal actually oscillates or an oscillator behaves like a crystal, I ordered the "crystals" which look identical to the "oscillators". :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From lamune at doki-doki.net Sun Jan 18 22:31:54 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:31:54 -0800 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <20090119024114.685F620A15@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net><200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com><200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local><20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com><20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090119024114.685F620A15@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D955@fenestra.lamunet.local> Roger- a crystal is a passive device that needs a circuit in order to generate a signal. An oscillator (in the Jameco sense) is a device that contains said circuit and crystal in one package. > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 6:41 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > At 08:35 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: > >The TxC and RxC pins (5 & 12) are independent of the crystal > oscillator > >and internal baud rate generator. > > > >The way to accomplish my original design would be to use an external > >1.8432MHz oscillator and feed it to TxC, RxC, and the XTAL1 pin. It's > a > >pretty simple mod. Actually I may just have to try this one out myself > >and see if it works like the datasheet says it should. > > > > The datasheet says that either TxC or RxC should be left unconnected, > can't recall which one. I already closed the PDF and have a mess of > a desktop right now. > I am not sure what the difference is in a Crystal Oscillator, an > Oscillator, or a Crystal in these hacks/descriptions since people > slang the terms around so much. Jameco clearly sells both Crystals > and Oscillators both in 1.8432 mhz and 3.6864 mhz. Whether a cyrstal > actually oscillates or an oscillator behaves like a crystal, I > ordered the "crystals" which look identical to the "oscillators". :) > > > > > > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 18 22:47:17 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:47:17 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D955@fenestra.lamunet.lo cal> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com> <20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090119024114.685F620A15@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D955@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <20090119034737.DD7A220A13@qs281.pair.com> At 09:31 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Roger- a crystal is a passive device that needs a circuit in order to >generate a signal. An oscillator (in the Jameco sense) is a device that >contains said circuit and crystal in one package. Some people are calling a crystal an oscillator even when they know the difference. Google up some 6551 hack topics and try to follow their garbage. Jameco shows a 2-lead "oscillator" that looks just like the crystal package. Using only 2 connections, one going to RxC, the other would need to go to 5V, ground? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Jan 18 22:59:54 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 22:59:54 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <200901152157.07519.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901171519.39570.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <4973424E.2040500@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <4973FABA.6000203@worldnet.att.net> Fedor Steeman wrote: > Thanks, Robert. That sounds like some interesting and important information > for my little endeavour. > > Right now I stand with a huge library of hundreds of diskettes that I would > like to store on my hard disk as virtual floppies and then make available > through the internet. Until now I would backup these (5.25" floppies) to > 3.25" floppies using the CoCo and then would read them in on the PC. Of > course, that is a bit tedious for so many disks. So it seemed to me I would > save a lot of time if I could leave out the CoCo out of the equation and > read the floppies in directly on my PC instead. The drive I wanted to use to > this end was previously used to read and write these same disks. > > Are you saying that I can save the trouble and keep on doing the backing up > on the CoCo, because success is far from guaranteed with doing it directly > on the PC? > > Cheers, > Fedor > If you are lucky, you can hook the 5.25" drive to the PC and read the disks directly. That will require your PC can work with your 5.25" drive and, as others have explained better, the disks were formatted such that the PC can read them. See Bill Barnes message replying to Torsten's replying to mine. Let's say you are lucky. Then the best bet for a neat storage of your disks is to use the VCC emulator, which can read real floppies, attached to a .vhd hard drive image holding as many multiples of 256 Basic disks as you desire. You can just BACKUP the real floppy to an RGBDOS .vhd drive #. If you are not lucky, you will need to use an intermediate transfer from the Coco to the PC. It could be a 3.5" disk (formatted on the PC as a Coco disk) to transfer data or a null modem connection using Ultimaterm and a PC terminal program. If you are not lucky it will be a lot of work to transfer the files, unless you can make use of Roger's future CocoNet or perhaps DriveWire from Cloud-9. As regards the .vhd hard disk image, RGBDOS permits changing the Disk Basic offset values stored in the "ROM" on the fly. That means you can easily access Mx256 drive #s where M depends on how large you make the .vhd image. Of course you can just have more than one .vhd image. The only restriction is the offset value must fit in three bytes. The largest offset is thus $FFFFFF bytes. This technique is also useful with a real Coco3 hard drive system from Cloud-9. Use a large IDE drive and you can do the same thing with HDBDOS just by POKEing new offset values into the correct DOS locations. From operator at coco3.com Mon Jan 19 00:29:20 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:29:20 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.lo cal> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com> <200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <20090119052939.035B320A13@qs281.pair.com> At 05:20 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > >If you were to take the 1.8432MHz clock and feed it right into the >6551's TxC and RxC (clock) pins and set the chip to external clock mode, >you'd get 115,200 bps out of it. And how would you do that? I see a crystal but no oscillator or "clock". ;) And why does the 0000 mode (external clock mode?) also appear to yield 115200 bps when using the 1.8432 mhz crystal attached to the XTL pins? >It's guaranteed up to 125k bps, meaning the fastest clock it can accept >on those pins would be 2MHz. >I'd guess the internal crystal oscillator isn't capable of reliably >operating at 3.68MHz- but it may be possible to feed it with an external >can oscillator. The guts of the thing are indeed capable of 115,200. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:31 AM > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > > > > > > > Has anyone noticed on Sock's website he mentions that doubling the > > 6551 crystal value to 3.6864 mhz can be done but setting the 6551 to > > the ExternalClock/16 mode would yield 115200 bps, then he says: " > > this *almost* works! " Why wouldn't it work? > > > > We've proven that the CoCo can send and receive through the BITBANGER > > port at 115.2 bps, and believe it or not - 230.4 kbps. > > > > Maybe Sock means that IRQ can't be triggered that fast and the CoCo > > keep up? Why not? The 6551's IRQ goes to the CART signal which is > > tied to FIRQ. A circular buffer in the FIRQ service routine could do > > a quick FIFO store to a buffer and it should work? If not, the > > crystal should probably be dropped to 1.8432 / 2 to yield a 57600 > > bps mode which should work. > > -- > > Roger Taylor > > > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 19 00:30:08 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 00:30:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901190030.08308.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 18 January 2009, Torsten Dittel wrote: >Gene Heskett schrieb: >> [...] this is the first time I've read a cogent explanation of it. > >I once found that explanation here: > >http://www.moria.de/~michael/floppy/floppy.pdf > >On page 10 it reads: > >"[...] The NEC 765 controller goes to sleep for about 1.8ms after the >index hole is sensed and expects still to read gap 1 when it wakes up. >It works fine for floppies formatted using the 765, because it will >always generate the format as specified above. The WD 1797 controller, >though, does not have a command to format a track, but writes a given >pattern to the track when formatting it. If the pattern has a too short >post index gap, for example because it is a format which tries to >maximise the usable disk space, the 765 controller will fail to read the >first sector. To make things yet more complicated, the 765A controller >only sleeps for 0.6ms, which means it is less sensitive to shorter post >index gaps. [...]" > >Regards, >Torsten > Neat, thanks. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) BARBARA STANWYCK makes me nervous!! From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 19 00:51:33 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 00:51:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901190051.33670.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 18 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >On Sun, 18 Jan 2009, Gene Heskett wrote: >> On Sunday 18 January 2009, Bill Barnes wrote: >>> IIRC, the PC Floppy controller is "sleeping" because when they designed >>> it, they designed the supporting structure to reset the FDC chip every >>> time the sector 0 sync hole came along. The CoCo didn't do that. Because >>> of this there is an unused gap between the sync and chip "reset" recovery >>> before it can write or read to the disk. It's in that gap, where the CoCo >>> writes because it isn't clobbered over the head every sync to reset, that >>> the PCs have a difficult time reading or writing to a CoCo disk that was >>> formatted on a CoCo. Formatting a CoCo disk on the PC eliminates the >>> unreadable time frame, as far as the PC is concerned, and the CoCo could >>> care less that that gap exists. >> >> I had heard there was a gap timing problem occasionally, and it has >> bothered the coco. But this is the first time I've read a cogent >> explanation of it. Thank you. > >I'll add to that. It's something I've noticed when moving disks back and >forth. Once it's been formatted on a CoCo, my Linux box chokes on it. >Other way around works fine. And as you'll note, my experience has been the opposite. What I think is wrong is that the linux formatter doesn't like sector 0's, on any track. But that's just what I call a SWAG too. I have not put a scope on it and compared them in that manner. >> FWIW Bill, I find that when I am doing nitros9 disk images here in this >> linux box, Fedora 8, generic kernel local build, that I must first format >> the disk on the coco in order for it to work correctly, otherwise dd gets >> a tummy ache a few sectors into the write and dumps out. If anyone knows >> the secret of properly formatting a coco disk on linux, I would appreciate >> a hand. Software to use, command line to use, etc, please. > >Exactly the opposite from my experience. I _can_ tell you that the disk >parms are incorrect on many systems. Here's what I had to do on a Xubuntu >7.04 box: > >Install 'fdutils' And what version does that install? 5.4 works mostly here, 5.5 has something wrong in its mediaprm parser from what I can get it to spit out. It also ships with a broken mediaprm file, and an error in that file causes it to skip all entries below it. >Check the media descriptor in /etc/mediaprm. On my box, COCO360 and >COCO720 used an extraneous 'zero-based' flag. This is certainly incorrect >for 5.25" diskettes (haven't tried the 3.5 yet). That is another problem, that is not incorrect, but the parser thinks it is,, the coco (1793 family fdc's) are in fact a base zero sector numbering system, one of the very few, and only by beating a 765 based fdc about the brow forcefully, can you get it to accept 'track zero sector zero' numbering for write functions. > >Run the 'floppymeter' utility with a scratch diskette and let it calibrate >for any variance in drive speed (creates a control file called >/etc/driveprm. IIRC I tried that a couple of years ago, and it couldn't find the drive or some such sillyness. It is not installed, and: [root at coyote etc]# yum install fdutils livna | 2.1 kB 00:00 fedora | 2.1 kB 00:00 rpmfusion-free-updates | 2.7 kB 00:00 rpmfusion-nonfree-updates | 2.7 kB 00:00 rpmfusion-free | 951 B 00:00 updates-newkey | 2.3 kB 00:00 fedora-source | 2.1 kB 00:00 rpmfusion-nonfree | 951 B 00:00 updates-newkey-source | 2.1 kB 00:00 Setting up Install Process Parsing package install arguments No package fdutils available. Nothing to do The repos have been cleaned out, this is an F8 system. EOL for F8 support was a week ago. :( It may be on a dvd, I haven't looked. Busy putting out other fires, like verizon's dns servers became inaccessible to anything but a ping about 7Pm & I've been battling with the typical morons in tech support on a Sunday since. They are incapable of groking that my OS of choice has absolutely zip to do with their failed dns setup. Finally a friend called and he got me setup to use the opendns servers. And they are 10x faster than vz's have ever been. I won't convert back. >Format diskettes by: > >- Insert diskette in drive > >$ setfdprm /dev/fd0 COCO360 > >$ superformat /dev/fd0 COCO360 > >Copy image: > >$ dd if= of=/dev/fd0 bs=256 > >Adjust names to suit your system. The important issue to always execute >setfdprm with the target disk in the drive. Yes, cuz all those config changes are nulled when the drive says the disk is gone. >Steve -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) There are running jobs. Why don't you go chase them? From lamune at doki-doki.net Mon Jan 19 00:54:30 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:54:30 -0800 Subject: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps In-Reply-To: <20090119034737.DD7A220A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <1803226163.4511551231950204380.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net><200901171403.20025.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090117192453.D870720A13@qs281.pair.com><200901171457.21583.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20090118173138.7221B20A13@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D953@fenestra.lamunet.local><20090118234953.CBBB020A13@qs281.pair.com><20090119003458.0A48C20A15@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D954@fenestra.lamunet.local><20090119024114.685F620A15@qs281.pair.com><4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D955@fenestra.lamunet.local> <20090119034737.DD7A220A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D956@fenestra.lamunet.local> If it only has 2 terminals, it's gotta be a crystal. The typical metal can oscillators you're going to see, like this: 1- buy one of these: http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1 &storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&productId=27879& 2- remove the 1.8432MHz crystal from the RS232 pack 3- Piggyback the oscillator power and ground on top of some other 14 pin TTL in the pack 4- fly a wire jumper from the oscillator output to TxC,RxC, and XTAL1 on the 6551 5- see what happens. I'm probably going to try this, just because I want to see what happens. As to why setting the divider to 0000 seems to have the same effect- I don't know. According to the datasheet it shouldn't. Also yes, I'm aware that there are a lot of people using terms interchangeably- much to the confusion of others! > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Roger Taylor > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 7:47 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] 6551 at 115200 bps > > At 09:31 PM 1/18/2009, you wrote: > >Roger- a crystal is a passive device that needs a circuit in order to > >generate a signal. An oscillator (in the Jameco sense) is a device > that > >contains said circuit and crystal in one package. > > Some people are calling a crystal an oscillator even when they know > the difference. Google up some 6551 hack topics and try to follow > their garbage. > > Jameco shows a 2-lead "oscillator" that looks just like the crystal > package. Using only 2 connections, one going to RxC, the other would > need to go to 5V, ground? > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Mon Jan 19 07:24:53 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 07:24:53 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <200901190051.33670.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901190051.33670.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 19 Jan 2009, Gene Heskett wrote: >> I'll add to that. It's something I've noticed when moving disks back and >> forth. Once it's been formatted on a CoCo, my Linux box chokes on it. >> Other way around works fine. > > And as you'll note, my experience has been the opposite. What I think is > wrong is that the linux formatter doesn't like sector 0's, on any track. But > that's just what I call a SWAG too. I have not put a scope on it and > compared them in that manner. Are you quite sure that the CoCo writes a sector id of 0? >>> FWIW Bill, I find that when I am doing nitros9 disk images here in this >>> linux box, Fedora 8, generic kernel local build, that I must first format >>> the disk on the coco in order for it to work correctly, otherwise dd gets >>> a tummy ache a few sectors into the write and dumps out. If anyone knows >>> the secret of properly formatting a coco disk on linux, I would appreciate >>> a hand. Software to use, command line to use, etc, please. >> >> Exactly the opposite from my experience. I _can_ tell you that the disk >> parms are incorrect on many systems. Here's what I had to do on a Xubuntu >> 7.04 box: >> >> Install 'fdutils' > > And what version does that install? 5.4 works mostly here, 5.5 has something > wrong in its mediaprm parser from what I can get it to spit out. It also > ships with a broken mediaprm file, and an error in that file causes it to > skip all entries below it. I don't use Fedora, so I cannot comment one way or the other. On a Ubuntu box, 'apt-get install fdutils' gets me a working copy. >> Check the media descriptor in /etc/mediaprm. On my box, COCO360 and >> COCO720 used an extraneous 'zero-based' flag. This is certainly incorrect >> for 5.25" diskettes (haven't tried the 3.5 yet). > > That is another problem, that is not incorrect, but the parser thinks it is,, > the coco (1793 family fdc's) are in fact a base zero sector numbering system, > one of the very few, and only by beating a 765 based fdc about the brow > forcefully, can you get it to accept 'track zero sector zero' numbering for > write functions. That comment puzzles me a bit. In all my experience with FDC chips (and I had considerable exposure to this back in the day), the sector (and track) ids were purely a software notion. I wrote code to build a complete image of the track in memory (complete with gap bytes and magic values per spec sheet) and used a chip intrinsic (write-track) to blast that on to the media. The software then modifed the track id, stepped the heads (or switched sides) and proceeded. I have heard that the NEC 765 chips have problems with SD diskettes, but that's the only incompatibility I've personally encountered besides the start-of-track timing already mentioned in this thread. Are you claiming that the hardware itself has a fixation for zero origined sector numbers? I just don't recall ever running into that. Also, how would you explain the fact that 360k DSDD diskettes generated with 'dd' read correctly on the CoCo and appear uncorrupted? This doesn't seem to support a zero-based sectoring scheme. But, I have not specifically dug into it and perhaps you are correct. Stranger things have happened. > The repos have been cleaned out, this is an F8 system. EOL for F8 support was > a week ago. :( ~ If it were me, I would look for a new distro. I've had my fill of RPM based package systems. What a PITA. After SuSE jumped into bed with the evil empire of Redmond a few years ago I switched to Ubuntu and never looked back. > It may be on a dvd, I haven't looked. Busy putting out other fires, like > verizon's dns servers became inaccessible to anything but a ping about 7Pm & > I've been battling with the typical morons in tech support on a Sunday since. > They are incapable of groking that my OS of choice has absolutely zip to do > with their failed dns setup. Finally a friend called and he got me setup to > use the opendns servers. And they are 10x faster than vz's have ever been. > I won't convert back. Been there. Have the T-Shirt! I had to do the same thing with Comcast. You must keep in mind that their technical support people are measured on the number of issues they close rather than how many folks actually receive help with problems. Mentioning Linux gives them all the excuse they need to blow you off and dismiss the case. Fortunately we are one of the 2% of cities in the US with municipal fiber-to-the-premises. I now get IP TV + 5Mbs symmetrical internet service for about 2/3 the price of Comcast, so they and their support morons are a fading memory. Burlington Telecom, while not "Linux friendly" will at least listen to polite reasoning and take action. >> Adjust names to suit your system. The important issue to always execute >> setfdprm with the target disk in the drive. > > Yes, cuz all those config changes are nulled when the drive says the disk is > gone. We've got to get you a working copy of fdutils. Have you tried building from source? Steve -- From mechacoco at gmail.com Mon Jan 19 12:19:12 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 10:19:12 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901181610.59773.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <200901190051.33670.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901190919s4901bdc6qc0ee061dc0a5265@mail.gmail.com> On 1/19/09, Steven Hirsch wrote: > > Are you quite sure that the CoCo writes a sector id of 0? > The standard CoCo formats (OS-9 RBF and Disk Basic) do NOT use a sector number of 0. The sector numbers in the ID fields are numbered 1 to 18, even on the second side of a double-sided OS-9 disk. Darren From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 19 13:13:05 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:13:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <383113.85979.qm@web31101.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200901190051.33670.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200901191313.05419.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 19 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >On Mon, 19 Jan 2009, Gene Heskett wrote: >>> I'll add to that. It's something I've noticed when moving disks back and >>> forth. Once it's been formatted on a CoCo, my Linux box chokes on it. >>> Other way around works fine. >> >> And as you'll note, my experience has been the opposite. What I think is >> wrong is that the linux formatter doesn't like sector 0's, on any track. >> But that's just what I call a SWAG too. I have not put a scope on it and >> compared them in that manner. > >Are you quite sure that the CoCo writes a sector id of 0? Having walked around a little in the floppy drivers code a decade ago, and played with the docs on the chip using pokes, it would appear to. Or my aging wet ram is playing up. IIRC the last, or 18th sector of a track is not $12, but $11. Std base zero numbering. >>>> FWIW Bill, I find that when I am doing nitros9 disk images here in this >>>> linux box, Fedora 8, generic kernel local build, that I must first >>>> format the disk on the coco in order for it to work correctly, otherwise >>>> dd gets a tummy ache a few sectors into the write and dumps out. If >>>> anyone knows the secret of properly formatting a coco disk on linux, I >>>> would appreciate a hand. Software to use, command line to use, etc, >>>> please. >>> >>> Exactly the opposite from my experience. I _can_ tell you that the disk >>> parms are incorrect on many systems. Here's what I had to do on a >>> Xubuntu 7.04 box: >>> >>> Install 'fdutils' >> >> And what version does that install? 5.4 works mostly here, 5.5 has >> something wrong in its mediaprm parser from what I can get it to spit out. >> It also ships with a broken mediaprm file, and an error in that file >> causes it to skip all entries below it. > >I don't use Fedora, so I cannot comment one way or the other. On a Ubuntu >box, 'apt-get install fdutils' gets me a working copy. > >>> Check the media descriptor in /etc/mediaprm. On my box, COCO360 and >>> COCO720 used an extraneous 'zero-based' flag. This is certainly >>> incorrect for 5.25" diskettes (haven't tried the 3.5 yet). >> >> That is another problem, that is not incorrect, but the parser thinks it >> is,, the coco (1793 family fdc's) are in fact a base zero sector numbering >> system, one of the very few, and only by beating a 765 based fdc about the >> brow forcefully, can you get it to accept 'track zero sector zero' >> numbering for write functions. > >That comment puzzles me a bit. In all my experience with FDC chips (and I >had considerable exposure to this back in the day), the sector (and track) >ids were purely a software notion. I wrote code to build a complete image >of the track in memory (complete with gap bytes and magic values per spec >sheet) and used a chip intrinsic (write-track) to blast that on to the >media. The software then modifed the track id, stepped the heads (or >switched sides) and proceeded. Which is as I understand it, exactly how the coco os9's format command works, and it fails if there is insufficient memory to hold this track image. >I have heard that the NEC 765 chips have >problems with SD diskettes, but that's the only incompatibility I've >personally encountered besides the start-of-track timing already mentioned >in this thread. > >Are you claiming that the hardware itself has a fixation for zero origined >sector numbers? I just don't recall ever running into that. Some 'pc' fdc's appear to act like it. The 'SuperIO' chipsets seem more amenable to the concept. >Also, how would you explain the fact that 360k DSDD diskettes generated >with 'dd' read correctly on the CoCo and appear uncorrupted? This doesn't >seem to support a zero-based sectoring scheme. But, I have not >specifically dug into it and perhaps you are correct. Stranger things >have happened. And will continue to happen. I could be full of it, but thats what I can recall from some experimentation's with the original disk basic, which is pretty well documented. 15+ years ago though. >> The repos have been cleaned out, this is an F8 system. EOL for F8 support >> was a week ago. :( > >~ >If it were me, I would look for a new distro. I've had my fill of RPM >based package systems. What a PITA. After SuSE jumped into bed with the >evil empire of Redmond a few years ago I switched to Ubuntu and never >looked back. 2 of my 3 boxes here are ubuntu now, and I'm beginning to get the feel for 8.04 LTS on a spare box, so I expect that will be the next step. I don't think that will stop me from using a bleeding kernel like I do now, presently 2.6.28 final, locally built of course. >> It may be on a dvd, I haven't looked. Busy putting out other fires, like >> verizon's dns servers became inaccessible to anything but a ping about 7Pm >> & I've been battling with the typical morons in tech support on a Sunday >> since. They are incapable of groking that my OS of choice has absolutely >> zip to do with their failed dns setup. Finally a friend called and he got >> me setup to use the opendns servers. And they are 10x faster than vz's >> have ever been. I won't convert back. > >Been there. Have the T-Shirt! Does it fit? :) >I had to do the same thing with Comcast. >You must keep in mind that their technical support people are measured on >the number of issues they close rather than how many folks actually >receive help with problems. Mentioning Linux gives them all the excuse >they need to blow you off and dismiss the case. > >Fortunately we are one of the 2% of cities in the US with municipal >fiber-to-the-premises. I now get IP TV + 5Mbs symmetrical internet >service for about 2/3 the price of Comcast, so they and their support >morons are a fading memory. Burlington Telecom, while not "Linux >friendly" will at least listen to polite reasoning and take action. So will vz, once you escalate it about 3 to 4 levels. But that is a genuine, full priced, Pain In The Ass. >>> Adjust names to suit your system. The important issue to always execute >>> setfdprm with the target disk in the drive. >> >> Yes, cuz all those config changes are nulled when the drive says the disk >> is gone. > >We've got to get you a working copy of fdutils. Have you tried building >from source? Once, that made 5.4 work back about Fedora 2, which has been moldering in its grave for about 4 years now. More recently, I've been using minicom over a 232 cable to the deluxe 232 pack, and it has rzsz support, so for smaller transfers I've been doing that. But I may have had an emp blow something cuz it hasn't worked recently, rather like minicom lost its configuration or ??? That, and other things getting in the way like bios problems on this @#*&^$% ASUS motherboard I paid $285 for. ASUS used to be considered the gold std, but not anymore. Waaay down the list I keep. >Steve -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Fortune's current rates: Answers .10 Long answers .25 Answers requiring thought .50 Correct answers $1.00 Dumb looks are still free. From linville at tuxdriver.com Mon Jan 19 19:53:56 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:53:56 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 08:03:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? Sorry for the delay -- sometimes life intervenes. I've been without a good coco emulation/development environment for some time due to never quite completing a move between laptops. It is possible that my lack of a seasoned environment explains my lack of success in running the 'hello' program from cc/test. I am running Fedora 10 on an X86_64, with sdlmess-0128-1.fc10.x86_64 from rhe RPMFusion repository. I downloaded the current coco3/6809 nitros-9 images from sourceforge (linked from nitros9.org), and renamed the disk image to end in .os9 to ensure MESS uses the proper geometry. MESS seems to work fine through the nitros9 boot. I used cc/test/cc to build hello from hello.c without any errors. I then used 'os9 format' to build a disk image and 'os9 copy' to copy hello to it. I then mounted the new disk image as disk #1 in MESS. 'dir /d1' in MESS shows the hello binary and AFAICT ident seems to think it is a valid binary. This is where the brain fart seems to have begun. '/d1/hello' gives Error #215. 'chd /d1' followed by 'chx /d1' followed by 'hello' also gives Error #215. What have I forgotten or done wrong? Hopefully I can be more helpful once I overcome this stumbling block. :-) Thanks, John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jan 19 20:08:21 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:08:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <49752405.3030808@worldnet.att.net> John W. Linville wrote: > On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 08:03:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >> I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that >> contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. >> >> Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > Sorry for the delay -- sometimes life intervenes. > > I've been without a good coco emulation/development environment > for some time due to never quite completing a move between laptops. > It is possible that my lack of a seasoned environment explains my > lack of success in running the 'hello' program from cc/test. > > I am running Fedora 10 on an X86_64, with sdlmess-0128-1.fc10.x86_64 > from rhe RPMFusion repository. I downloaded the current coco3/6809 > nitros-9 images from sourceforge (linked from nitros9.org), and renamed > the disk image to end in .os9 to ensure MESS uses the proper geometry. > MESS seems to work fine through the nitros9 boot. > > I used cc/test/cc to build hello from hello.c without any errors. > I then used 'os9 format' to build a disk image and 'os9 copy' to copy > hello to it. I then mounted the new disk image as disk #1 in MESS. > 'dir /d1' in MESS shows the hello binary and AFAICT ident seems to > think it is a valid binary. > > This is where the brain fart seems to have begun. '/d1/hello' gives > Error #215. 'chd /d1' followed by 'chx /d1' followed by 'hello' > also gives Error #215. What have I forgotten or done wrong? > > Hopefully I can be more helpful once I overcome this stumbling > block. :-) > > Thanks, > > John You need more than Ident to determine that a program will run. You need to run Attr and determine if either e or pe is set to indicate the file is indeed executable. The bad pathname is what happens when you try to run a file not labeled as executable. Clearly this is silly as the path is valid but the attributes are not. The reported error should be 214 "no permission" so there is a bug somewhere in OS-9. From snhirsch at gmail.com Mon Jan 19 20:12:48 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:12:48 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 19 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > I used cc/test/cc to build hello from hello.c without any errors. > I then used 'os9 format' to build a disk image and 'os9 copy' to copy > hello to it. I then mounted the new disk image as disk #1 in MESS. > 'dir /d1' in MESS shows the hello binary and AFAICT ident seems to > think it is a valid binary. > > This is where the brain fart seems to have begun. '/d1/hello' gives > Error #215. 'chd /d1' followed by 'chx /d1' followed by 'hello' > also gives Error #215. What have I forgotten or done wrong? > > Hopefully I can be more helpful once I overcome this stumbling > block. :-) You probably forgot to set the file attributes to executable? Don't feel bad, I did exactly the same thing :-(. Steve -- From linville at tuxdriver.com Mon Jan 19 20:30:14 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: <20090120005355.GA3525@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <20090120013011.GA4689@tuxdriver.com> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 08:12:48PM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Mon, 19 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > >> I used cc/test/cc to build hello from hello.c without any errors. >> I then used 'os9 format' to build a disk image and 'os9 copy' to copy >> hello to it. I then mounted the new disk image as disk #1 in MESS. >> 'dir /d1' in MESS shows the hello binary and AFAICT ident seems to >> think it is a valid binary. >> >> This is where the brain fart seems to have begun. '/d1/hello' gives >> Error #215. 'chd /d1' followed by 'chx /d1' followed by 'hello' >> also gives Error #215. What have I forgotten or done wrong? >> >> Hopefully I can be more helpful once I overcome this stumbling >> block. :-) > > You probably forgot to set the file attributes to executable? Don't feel > bad, I did exactly the same thing :-(. Ah, that was it -- you and Robert were right. At least I'm in good company. :-) So, did we ever track-down the source to ANSIFront? Being able to use ANSI sources would probably be helpful and more comfortable for many of us. An alternative might be to add 'cproto -t' to the driver script. Anyway, just a thought... :-) John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 19 20:39:09 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:39:09 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090120013011.GA4689@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090120013011.GA4689@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <200901192039.09209.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 19 January 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 08:12:48PM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> On Mon, 19 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >>> I used cc/test/cc to build hello from hello.c without any errors. >>> I then used 'os9 format' to build a disk image and 'os9 copy' to copy >>> hello to it. I then mounted the new disk image as disk #1 in MESS. >>> 'dir /d1' in MESS shows the hello binary and AFAICT ident seems to >>> think it is a valid binary. >>> >>> This is where the brain fart seems to have begun. '/d1/hello' gives >>> Error #215. 'chd /d1' followed by 'chx /d1' followed by 'hello' >>> also gives Error #215. What have I forgotten or done wrong? >>> >>> Hopefully I can be more helpful once I overcome this stumbling >>> block. :-) >> >> You probably forgot to set the file attributes to executable? Don't feel >> bad, I did exactly the same thing :-(. > >Ah, that was it -- you and Robert were right. At least I'm in good >company. :-) > >So, did we ever track-down the source to ANSIFront? I think that is Eddie Kuhns who did that. Worse comes to worse, dis the one we have. ansifront-0.12 is the newest I'm aware of. >Being able >to use ANSI sources would probably be helpful and more comfortable >for many of us. An alternative might be to add 'cproto -t' to the >driver script. Anyway, just a thought... :-) > >John -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Television -- the longest amateur night in history. -- Robert Carson From operator at coco3.com Mon Jan 19 22:39:03 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 21:39:03 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks Message-ID: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> I've got a little question. What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before jumping into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, but if the CPU itself is responsible by using the upper hardware vectors to jump directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance to start, then if the ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see the code ever getting past the first instruction, which in some cases is a NOP. Any ideas? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jan 19 22:57:17 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 22:57:17 -0500 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49754B9D.3090906@worldnet.att.net> Roger Taylor wrote: > I've got a little question. > > What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from > continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? > > If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before jumping > into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, but if the CPU > itself is responsible by using the upper hardware vectors to jump > directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance to start, then if the > ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see > the code ever getting past the first instruction, which in some cases is > a NOP. > > Any ideas? It's the PIA at $FF23 that controls whether the CPU responds to the CART line. Basic turns this on, the ROM pak triggers the interrupt, the interrupt vectors to $A0F6 which vectors to $A02A where the PIA's are reset (turning off the CART I assume), initialization exits at $A108 and jumps to the ROM pak. A ROM pak is not likely to turn on the CART line interrupt, which as you say, would cause a loop. From lost at l-w.ca Mon Jan 19 22:57:20 2009 From: lost at l-w.ca (William Astle) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:57:20 -0700 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49754BA0.2040002@l-w.ca> Roger Taylor wrote: > I've got a little question. > > What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from > continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? > > If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before jumping > into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, but if the CPU > itself is responsible by using the upper hardware vectors to jump > directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance to start, then if the > ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see > the code ever getting past the first instruction, which in some cases is > a NOP. > > Any ideas? When the CPU starts the FIRQ service, it automatically disables both IRQ and FIRQ (implicit ORCC #$50). The FIRQ routine in BASIC is at $A0F6 where it checks for a PIA cartridge interrupt and if it isn't, it returns. If it is, it vectors to the basic initialization code with the reset vector set to $A108. Then basic does its usualy initialization of the PIAs and vectors to $A108 which clears the restart flag (to force a cold start on reset) and jumps to the pack. At no point along there does the code re-enable interrupts which means when the pack gets control at $C000, interrupts are disabled. This allows the pack to do whatever initialization it needs, probably including disabling the PIA cartridge interrupt, before re-enabling interrupts. Additionally, interrupts are not enabled by the basic ROM until it sets up the vectors in low RAM ($10C...). Thus, the entire process is under the control of the basic ROM. -- William Astle lost at l-w.ca From operator at coco3.com Tue Jan 20 15:59:58 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 14:59:58 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <49754B9D.3090906@worldnet.att.net> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <49754B9D.3090906@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090120210028.7820320A16@qs281.pair.com> At 09:57 PM 1/19/2009, you wrote: >Roger Taylor wrote: >>I've got a little question. >>What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from >>continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? >>If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before >>jumping into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, >>but if the CPU itself is responsible by using the upper hardware >>vectors to jump directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance >>to start, then if the ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask >>IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see the code ever getting past the first >>instruction, which in some cases is a NOP. >>Any ideas? > >It's the PIA at $FF23 that controls whether the CPU responds to the >CART line. Basic turns this on, the ROM pak triggers the interrupt, >the interrupt vectors to $A0F6 I'm aware how to configure the interrupts using the PIAs or GIME. My question was whether or not BASIC does the jump to the game pak code or if the CPU does it. I'm trying to think of a way connect Q to CART to make an auto-starting pak, but also use a few logic gates or maybe a transistor to block the Q-to-CART connection once something in the pak is On and Ready, such as the 6551 ACIA which also uses CART. So, once the CPU interrupts are enabled back by the pak ROM software, Q will be filtered from entering CART and only the 6551's interrupt pin will affect CART. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Tue Jan 20 16:48:49 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:48:49 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <548829068.1218911232487865044.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Roger, I can tell you are a software guy. :) >From your question of : My question was whether or not BASIC does the jump to the game pak code or if the CPU does it. The CPU does EVERYTHING it is told. BASIC doesn't do the jump. It tells the CPU what to do. Maybe I am over thinking your problem or you meant to say BASIC or GAME PAK code. ??? The CPU vectors contain address to jump to be executed, etc.... As far as the logic goes, easy. Map a register in your logic and keep track of what ever you would like to. Have the hardware respond based upon what ever you would like it to do as designed. Regards, Mark Cloud-9 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2009 2:59:58 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] auto-starting game paks At 09:57 PM 1/19/2009, you wrote: >Roger Taylor wrote: >>I've got a little question. >>What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from >>continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? >>If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before >>jumping into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, >>but if the CPU itself is responsible by using the upper hardware >>vectors to jump directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance >>to start, then if the ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask >>IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see the code ever getting past the first >>instruction, which in some cases is a NOP. >>Any ideas? > >It's the PIA at $FF23 that controls whether the CPU responds to the >CART line. Basic turns this on, the ROM pak triggers the interrupt, >the interrupt vectors to $A0F6 I'm aware how to configure the interrupts using the PIAs or GIME. My question was whether or not BASIC does the jump to the game pak code or if the CPU does it. I'm trying to think of a way connect Q to CART to make an auto-starting pak, but also use a few logic gates or maybe a transistor to block the Q-to-CART connection once something in the pak is On and Ready, such as the 6551 ACIA which also uses CART. So, once the CPU interrupts are enabled back by the pak ROM software, Q will be filtered from entering CART and only the 6551's interrupt pin will affect CART. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cocomalt at 6809.org.uk Tue Jan 20 17:16:33 2009 From: cocomalt at 6809.org.uk (Ciaran Anscomb) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 22:16:33 +0000 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <20090120210028.7820320A16@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <49754B9D.3090906@worldnet.att.net> <20090120210028.7820320A16@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <9137.1232489793@torch.6809.org.uk> Roger Taylor wrote: > At 09:57 PM 1/19/2009, you wrote: > >Roger Taylor wrote: > >>I've got a little question. > >>What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from > >>continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? > >>If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before > >>jumping into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, > >>but if the CPU itself is responsible by using the upper hardware > >>vectors to jump directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance > >>to start, then if the ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask > >>IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see the code ever getting past the first > >>instruction, which in some cases is a NOP. > >>Any ideas? > > > >It's the PIA at $FF23 that controls whether the CPU responds to the > >CART line. Basic turns this on, the ROM pak triggers the interrupt, > >the interrupt vectors to $A0F6 > > I'm aware how to configure the interrupts using the PIAs or GIME. My > question was whether or not BASIC does the jump to the game pak code > or if the CPU does it. BASIC does it. The vector the CPU gets is to the hook in low RAM. But it wouldn't cycle continually anyway, as when the CPU gets an FIRQ, it masks further interrupts in CC itself. ..ciaran -- Ciaran Anscomb, Perl/C Hacker From operator at coco3.com Tue Jan 20 17:29:53 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:29:53 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.r och.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <548829068.1218911232487865044.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <20090120223024.4CD9020A15@qs281.pair.com> At 03:48 PM 1/20/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > > > >I can tell you are a software guy. :) Nuttin' but the best! :) >The CPU does EVERYTHING it is told. BASIC doesn't do the jump. It >tells the CPU what to do. Thanks for clearing that one up, Mark. Sheesh! :) Yes, you are being funny. >Maybe I am over thinking your problem or you meant to say BASIC or >GAME PAK code. ??? The CPU vectors contain address to jump to be >executed, etc.... You're a hardware guy. Fair enough. Are you telling me it is not possible for the CPU to be told the first address to start running code from? That's what it sounded like you said. Certainly the CPU can be forced to jump to $C000 if something on the motherboard wanted to do that, no? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Tue Jan 20 17:32:26 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:32:26 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <9137.1232489793@torch.6809.org.uk> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <49754B9D.3090906@worldnet.att.net> <20090120210028.7820320A16@qs281.pair.com> <9137.1232489793@torch.6809.org.uk> Message-ID: <20090120223258.9C30C20A15@qs281.pair.com> At 04:16 PM 1/20/2009, you wrote: >BASIC does it. The vector the CPU gets is to the hook in low RAM. >But it wouldn't cycle continually anyway, as when the CPU gets an FIRQ, >it masks further interrupts in CC itself. Continuously, meaning the second the FIRQ service code is through, it gets called again because the interrupt signal is still active, pending, not clear <-- intentionally overworded for obvious reasons :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Tue Jan 20 18:21:14 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 23:21:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <1328162716.1239601232492828973.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <804131130.1242571232493674719.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Roger, Sorry about the humor. Hard to tell when you are asking a serious question, joking or just answering your own questions?????. You can control the CPU to have it do what ever you want it to do, via software and or hardware. CPU to be told the first address to start running code from? Yes Certainly the CPU can be forced to jump to $C000 if something on the motherboard wanted to do that, no? Yes, ROMs. Color Basic and Extended Color Basic. Regards, Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2009 4:29:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: Re: [Coco] auto-starting game paks At 03:48 PM 1/20/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > > > >I can tell you are a software guy. :) Nuttin' but the best! :) >The CPU does EVERYTHING it is told. BASIC doesn't do the jump. It >tells the CPU what to do. Thanks for clearing that one up, Mark. Sheesh! :) Yes, you are being funny. >Maybe I am over thinking your problem or you meant to say BASIC or >GAME PAK code. ??? The CPU vectors contain address to jump to be >executed, etc.... You're a hardware guy. Fair enough. Are you telling me it is not possible for the CPU to be told the first address to start running code from? That's what it sounded like you said. Certainly the CPU can be forced to jump to $C000 if something on the motherboard wanted to do that, no? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Tue Jan 20 18:28:49 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 23:28:49 +0000 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <49765E31.7060001@aurigae.demon.co.uk> > I'm trying to think of a way connect Q to CART to make an > auto-starting pak, but also use a few logic gates or maybe a > transistor to block the Q-to-CART connection once something in the > pak is On and Ready, such as the 6551 ACIA which also uses CART. So, > once the CPU interrupts are enabled back by the pak ROM software, Q > will be filtered from entering CART and only the 6551's interrupt > pin will affect CART. The other way to do it, is to have your ROM code have DK as the first characters and the actual code start at $C002, as this is what the Dos carts for both the CoCo and the Dragon do. Though after they have done their initialisation they do jump back to the Basic rom for it to continue it's initialisation, but a look at the relevent DOS rom disassembilies should reveal where you need to jump to. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From Torsten at Dittel.info Tue Jan 20 19:04:14 2009 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 01:04:14 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Raw reading floppies... Message-ID: Just found that to be interesting: http://www.oldskool.org/disk2fdi/index_html http://disk2fdi.joguin.com/D2FCABLE.htm Could be used for raw reading copy protected floppies. Maybe someone could program a tool for creating CoCo Emulator Disks from this Amiga Emulator FDI format: http://www.oldskool.org/disk2fdi/files/FDISPEC.pdf Regards, Torsten From linville at tuxdriver.com Tue Jan 20 21:04:08 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:04:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 08:03:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? So I went looking for some old K&R sources that I could play with and reasonably expect to test on a (emulated) coco. I decided to try some utilities from an old version of Minix (1.1). The 'wc' utility seemed like a reasonable candidate. I'll attach the slightly modified sources I got to work along with the diff from the original Minix sources. Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much to overflow the character count... :-( Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From linville at tuxdriver.com Tue Jan 20 21:15:08 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:15:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <20090121021508.GC3094@tuxdriver.com> Doh...forgot the attachments... On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 09:04:08PM -0500, John W. Linville wrote: > On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 08:03:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > > > I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that > > contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. > > > > Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > So I went looking for some old K&R sources that I could play with and > reasonably expect to test on a (emulated) coco. I decided to try some > utilities from an old version of Minix (1.1). The 'wc' utility seemed > like a reasonable candidate. I'll attach the slightly modified sources > I got to work along with the diff from the original Minix sources. > > Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", > implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual > syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, > but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. > > The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing > them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much > to overflow the character count... :-( > > Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 > version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it > without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, > changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. > > Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) > > John > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. -------------- next part -------------- /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ #include #define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c == '\r') std_err(str) char *str; { fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); } /* * * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] * * Flags: * l - count lines. * w - count words. * c - count characters. * * Flags l, w, and c are default. * Words are delimited by any non-alphabetic character. * * Released into the PUBLIC-DOMAIN 02/10/86 * * If you find this program to be of use to you, a donation of * whatever you think it is worth will be cheerfully accepted. * * Written by: David L. Messer * P.O. Box 19130, Mpls, MN, 55119 * Program (heavily) modified by Andy Tanenbaum */ int lflag; /* Count lines */ int wflag; /* Count words */ int cflag; /* Count characters */ int lcount; /* Count of lines */ int wcount; /* Count of words */ int ccount; /* Count of characters */ int ltotal; /* Total count of lines */ int wtotal; /* Total count of words */ int ctotal; /* Total count of characters */ main(argc, argv) int argc; char *argv[]; { int k; char *cp; int tflag, files; int i; /* Get flags. */ files = argc - 1; k = 1; cp = argv[1]; if (*cp++ == '-') { files--; k++; /* points to first file */ while (*cp != 0) { switch (*cp) { case 'l': lflag++; break; case 'w': wflag++; break; case 'c': cflag++; break; default: usage(); } cp++; } } /* If no flags are set, treat as wc -lwc. */ if(!lflag && !wflag && !cflag) { lflag = 1; wflag = 1; cflag = 1; } /* Process files. */ tflag = files >= 2; /* set if # files > 1 */ /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ if (k >= argc) { count(); if(lflag) printf(" %6d", lcount); if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wcount); if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ccount); printf(" \n"); fflush(stdout); exit(0); } /* There is an explicit list of files. Loop on files. */ while (k < argc) { fclose(stdin); if (fopen(argv[k], "r") == NULL) { std_err("wc: cannot open "); std_err(argv[k]); std_err("\n"); k++; continue; } else { /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ count(); if(lflag) printf(" %6d", lcount); if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wcount); if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ccount); printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); } k++; } if(tflag) { if(lflag) printf(" %6d", ltotal); if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wtotal); if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ctotal); printf(" total\n"); } fflush(stdout); exit(0); } count() { register int c; register int word = 0; lcount = 0; wcount = 0; ccount = 0; while((c = getc(stdin)) > 0) { ccount++; if(isspace(c)) { if(word) wcount++; word = 0; } else { word = 1; } if (c == '\n' || c == '\f') lcount++; } ltotal += lcount; wtotal += wcount; ctotal += ccount; } usage() { std_err("Usage: wc [-lwc] [name ...]\n"); exit(1); } -------------- next part -------------- --- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 +++ wc.c 2009-01-20 20:50:19.000000000 -0500 @@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ -#include "stdio.h" -#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) +#include +#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c == '\r') +std_err(str) +char *str; +{ + fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); +} + /* * * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] @@ -31,13 +37,13 @@ int lflag; /* Count lines */ int wflag; /* Count words */ int cflag; /* Count characters */ -long lcount; /* Count of lines */ -long wcount; /* Count of words */ -long ccount; /* Count of characters */ - -long ltotal; /* Total count of lines */ -long wtotal; /* Total count of words */ -long ctotal; /* Total count of characters */ +int lcount; /* Count of lines */ +int wcount; /* Count of words */ +int ccount; /* Count of characters */ + +int ltotal; /* Total count of lines */ +int wtotal; /* Total count of words */ +int ctotal; /* Total count of characters */ main(argc, argv) int argc; @@ -79,9 +85,9 @@ char *argv[]; /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ if (k >= argc) { count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ccount); printf(" \n"); fflush(stdout); exit(0); @@ -99,18 +105,18 @@ char *argv[]; } else { /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ccount); printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); } k++; } if(tflag) { - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", ltotal); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", wtotal); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", ctotal); printf(" total\n"); } @@ -125,7 +131,7 @@ count() lcount = 0; wcount = 0; - ccount = 0L; + ccount = 0; while((c = getc(stdin)) > 0) { ccount++; From operator at coco3.com Tue Jan 20 21:24:17 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 20:24:17 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <804131130.1242571232493674719.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.ro ch.ny.frontiernet.net> References: <1328162716.1239601232492828973.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <804131130.1242571232493674719.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <20090121022449.6E6F720A14@qs281.pair.com> At 05:21 PM 1/20/2009, you wrote: >Roger, > >Sorry about the humor. Hard to tell when you are asking a serious >question, joking or just answering your own questions?????. I know, and sometimes I'm in a hurry and after I hit the Send button I realize that it sounded like a newbie came in and asked, What's a CoCo? :) >You can control the CPU to have it do what ever you want it to do, >via software and or hardware. I've never known the CoCo to jump-by-hardware to $C000 if CART is active the instant the CoCo comes on, so I had to ask. >CPU to be told the first address to start running code from? Yes Ah ha. I wonder if *some* vintie computers actually decide where to jump based on whether a cart is plugged in. Seems logical to me. It would probably cure the problem of an auto-starting pak continously executing the first instruction if the interrupts-to-CPU aren't configured correctly from the cartridge software. >Certainly the CPU can be forced to jump to $C000 if something on the >motherboard wanted to do that, no? > >Yes, ROMs. Color Basic and Extended Color Basic. It's not that important, but I was trying to figure out a way to auto-start a 6551-based cartridge that quickly after starting uses the same CART signal for another purpose. Ah, the ideas. When do they end. :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From operator at coco3.com Tue Jan 20 21:31:50 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 20:31:50 -0600 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <49765E31.7060001@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1097669603.1219881232488129009.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <49765E31.7060001@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <20090121023221.E335320A14@qs281.pair.com> At 05:28 PM 1/20/2009, you wrote: >>I'm trying to think of a way connect Q to CART to make an >>auto-starting pak, but also use a few logic gates or maybe a >>transistor to block the Q-to-CART connection once something in the >>pak is On and Ready, such as the 6551 ACIA which also uses CART. So, >> once the CPU interrupts are enabled back by the pak ROM software, Q >> will be filtered from entering CART and only the 6551's interrupt >>pin will affect CART. > >The other way to do it, is to have your ROM code have DK as the first I've already done that for an embedded application put in an EPROM Pak. It works brilliantly, but there's no way to toggle this type of auto-start. It always happens, or at least when ECB is on the motherboard. I was trying to use a jumper and some kind of hardware control on the cartridge to let the user decide how to use the pak. Auto-starting RS-232 packs with custom ROMs for embedded solutions would be very nice, but probably used by very few. >characters and the actual code start at $C002, as this is what the >Dos carts for both the CoCo and the Dragon do. Though after they >have done their initialisation they do jump back to the Basic rom >for it to continue it's initialisation, but a look at the relevent >DOS rom disassembilies should reveal where you need to jump to. As you said, "DK" as the first two characters just causes BASIC to software-auto-start the ROM. But, then you take control and don't have to hand it back over to BASIC like Disk BASIC does. The CoCo 3 will also patch part of your ROM near the top, and we discussed this earlier on how we should move our code out of those areas. It really works nice. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Tue Jan 20 23:08:00 2009 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:08:00 +1100 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <20090121022449.6E6F720A14@qs281.pair.com> References: <1328162716.1239601232492828973.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <804131130.1242571232493674719.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> <20090121022449.6E6F720A14@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <49769FA0.6050902@iinet.net.au> Roger Taylor wrote: > I've never known the CoCo to jump-by-hardware to $C000 if CART is active > the instant the CoCo comes on, so I had to ask. Not sure if you quite understand this, so please forgive if I'm telling you how to suck eggs... The hardware doesn't have any _direct_ control over the CPU flow of execution, in that it cannot directly affect the execution address. Each CPU will power-up (or exit reset) and fetch from a fixed location - some CPUs immediately begin executing code from a fixed location, others fetch a "reset vector" which determines the address from which it will start to execute code. Once a CPU is running (and interrupts are enabled), external hardware may generate an interrupt on the CPUs interrupt line(s). Different CPUs behave differently, but in general an interrupt causes the CPU to complete the current instruction and then (like at power-on) either branch to a fixed address or fetch a vector from a fixed address before branching to that vector. And generally, an interrupt will also automatically internally disable same- and lower-priority interrupts. In the case of auto-starting paks on the Coco, the CART# line is (generally) connected to the Q line. This is merely "convenient" as it provides an eternal falling-edge on the CART# line. As others have explained, in general once an auto-start pack has initialised, it won't re-enable the CART# interrupt otherwise a perpetual re-boot will occur, as you yourself have deduced. > It's not that important, but I was trying to figure out a way to > auto-start a 6551-based cartridge that quickly after starting uses the > same CART signal for another purpose. As the Coco uses CART# to auto-start, and you want to re-use the signal as a peripheral interrupt, you need to - as you have also correctly deduced - add logic to your cart to disconnect the Q line after initialisation. One problem is that your "hardware" needs to know _when_ to disconnect the Q line, as it will toggle many many times before the interrupt is finally serviced and vectored to auto-start the pak. One option would be to have a software-accessible register (flip-flop/latch) that is used to gate the Q signal input to CART#. Your rom-pak initialisation routine would hit this register. Another option is not to use Q at all, but some on-board method of oscillating CART# on start-up that is similarly software-controlled. Hope this makes things a little clearer? Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 07:05:23 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 07:05:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >> I sent the compiler sources and binaries to about six people that >> contacted me directly, but have heard nothing, nada, zilch, zip.. >> >> Has anyone tried using it for anything? Any comments or observations? > > So I went looking for some old K&R sources that I could play with and > reasonably expect to test on a (emulated) coco. I decided to try some > utilities from an old version of Minix (1.1). The 'wc' utility seemed > like a reasonable candidate. I'll attach the slightly modified sources > I got to work along with the diff from the original Minix sources. > > Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", > implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual > syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, > but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. > > The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing > them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much > to overflow the character count... :-( > > Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 > version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it > without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, > changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. > > Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) Thanks, John. The feedback is appreciated. I'm going to gather input and hopefully work on a more refined release for the near future. Steve -- From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 18:53:08 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:53:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 07:05:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >> Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", >> implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual >> syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, >> but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. >> >> The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing >> them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much >> to overflow the character count... :-( >> >> Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 >> version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it >> without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, >> changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. So it turns-out that leaving the vars declared as long and simply casting them to int in the printf arguments yields the same results as simply declaring them as int in the first place. To me this suggests that the basic code generation for the long type is working. Perhaps there is some different conversion format needed for the Microware printf to handle long? >> Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) > > Thanks, John. The feedback is appreciated. I'm going to gather input > and hopefully work on a more refined release for the near future. Sounds great. I'd love to hear about your future plans. John P.S. New diff from the original Minix sources inlined below... --- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 +++ wc.c 2009-01-21 18:47:27.000000000 -0500 @@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ -#include "stdio.h" -#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) +#include +#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c == '\r') +std_err(str) +char *str; +{ + fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); +} + /* * * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] @@ -79,9 +85,9 @@ char *argv[]; /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ if (k >= argc) { count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); printf(" \n"); fflush(stdout); exit(0); @@ -99,18 +105,18 @@ char *argv[]; } else { /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); } k++; } if(tflag) { - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ltotal); + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wtotal); + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ctotal); printf(" total\n"); } -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From devries.bob at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 18:58:04 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 09:58:04 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port References: <20090121020408.GB3094@tuxdriver.com> <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct library routine: pffinit(); /* for floats */ pflinit(); /* for longs */ -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "John W. Linville" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 07:05:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > >>> Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", >>> implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual >>> syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, >>> but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. >>> >>> The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing >>> them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much >>> to overflow the character count... :-( >>> >>> Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 >>> version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it >>> without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, >>> changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. > > So it turns-out that leaving the vars declared as long and simply > casting them to int in the printf arguments yields the same results > as simply declaring them as int in the first place. To me this > suggests that the basic code generation for the long type is working. > Perhaps there is some different conversion format needed for the > Microware printf to handle long? > >>> Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) >> >> Thanks, John. The feedback is appreciated. I'm going to gather input >> and hopefully work on a more refined release for the near future. > > Sounds great. I'd love to hear about your future plans. > > John > > P.S. New diff from the original Minix sources inlined below... > > --- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 > +++ wc.c 2009-01-21 18:47:27.000000000 -0500 > @@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ > /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ > > -#include "stdio.h" > -#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) > +#include > +#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') > #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c > == '\r') > > +std_err(str) > +char *str; > +{ > + fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); > +} > + > /* > * > * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] > @@ -79,9 +85,9 @@ char *argv[]; > /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ > if (k >= argc) { > count(); > - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); > - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); > - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); > + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); > + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); > + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); > printf(" \n"); > fflush(stdout); > exit(0); > @@ -99,18 +105,18 @@ char *argv[]; > } else { > /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ > count(); > - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); > - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); > - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); > + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); > + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); > + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); > printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); > } > k++; > } > > if(tflag) { > - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); > - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); > - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); > + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ltotal); > + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wtotal); > + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ctotal); > printf(" total\n"); > } > > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Wed Jan 21 19:04:50 2009 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 11:04:50 +1100 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4970A66A.3070202@swbell.net> References: <4970A66A.3070202@swbell.net> Message-ID: <4977B822.3040501@iinet.net.au> Joel Ewy wrote: > This morning I'll see if I can still dig up the sources to > my pix2tga and vef2tga utils, and maybe this weekend after I tear open > the dishwasher I can see if they'll compile. Your dishwasher has a compiler??? Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 19:33:35 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 19:33:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 09:58:04AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print > longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the > beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct library > routine: > > pffinit(); /* for floats */ > pflinit(); /* for longs */ Ah, now we are on to something... :-) Unfortunately, adding pflinit() results in a link error: Preprocess.. Compile.. Optimize.. Asm.. Link.. Unresolved references: L02ad pflinit_c in ./lib/clib.l linker fatal: unresolved references Which is probably due to this line in clib/mw-std/pflinit.a: L0279 blt L02ad Which is a branch to a label that does not exist. Bad library disassembly? I should dig-up an original clib.l and see if that works better -- anyone have one they can send to me so I don't have to dig through a pile of floppies? :-) John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From devries.bob at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 19:47:38 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 10:47:38 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com><006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> Sent by private email, John. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "John W. Linville" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:33 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 09:58:04AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print >> longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the >> beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct library >> routine: >> >> pffinit(); /* for floats */ >> pflinit(); /* for longs */ > > Ah, now we are on to something... :-) Unfortunately, adding pflinit() > results in a link error: > > Preprocess.. > Compile.. > Optimize.. > Asm.. > Link.. > Unresolved references: > L02ad pflinit_c in ./lib/clib.l > linker fatal: unresolved references > > Which is probably due to this line in clib/mw-std/pflinit.a: > > L0279 blt L02ad > > Which is a branch to a label that does not exist. Bad library > disassembly? I should dig-up an original clib.l and see if that works > better -- anyone have one they can send to me so I don't have to dig > through a pile of floppies? :-) > > John > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 20:20:37 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:20:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > Sent by private email, John. Well, thanks -- that resolved the linking problem. OTOH, the long variables still got printed as zeroes. :-( John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From devries.bob at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 20:28:12 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 11:28:12 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com><007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <009201c97c30$b3047ce0$0701a8c0@master> John, do you have access to the C compiler manual? I'm assuming you have put the pflinit(); at the beginning of main() (although I believe it can be anywhere provided it's ahead of the first printf() that tries to print a long. The usual format to print longs is: pflinit(); long x=65000; printf("long number %ld", x); (Sorry if you already know all this.... :) ) -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "John W. Linville" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 11:20 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> Sent by private email, John. > > Well, thanks -- that resolved the linking problem. OTOH, the long > variables still got printed as zeroes. :-( > > John > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 20:37:28 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:37:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 21 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 09:58:04AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print >> longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the >> beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct library >> routine: >> >> pffinit(); /* for floats */ >> pflinit(); /* for longs */ > > Ah, now we are on to something... :-) Unfortunately, adding pflinit() > results in a link error: John, Do you need a PDF of the C Compiler docs? -- From lost at l-w.ca Wed Jan 21 20:37:51 2009 From: lost at l-w.ca (William Astle) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:37:51 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> John W. Linville wrote: > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> Sent by private email, John. > > Well, thanks -- that resolved the linking problem. OTOH, the long > variables still got printed as zeroes. :-( > > John Correct me if I'm wrong, but how does this theory work: Assumption: long is twice as many bits as int and big-endian byte order, both of which should be valid here. Pretend we have a "long" value of 16. That would get onto the stack as the following string of bytes: 00, 00, 00, 10. Now printf() is looking for an integer so it only grabs 16 bits from the stack which gets the bytes: 00 00 Magically, our "long" value turns into a 0. The theory is that the format string being used is only cuing printf() to look for an int value but a long int is on the stack. I'm not overly familiar with the microware C compiler and the C library involved but usually "%ld" is used for long ints rather than "%D", is it not? -- William Astle From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jan 21 20:48:42 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:48:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <200901212048.42860.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 21 January 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 07:05:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >>> Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", >>> implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual >>> syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, >>> but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. >>> >>> The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing >>> them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much >>> to overflow the character count... :-( >>> >>> Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 >>> version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it >>> without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, >>> changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. > >So it turns-out that leaving the vars declared as long and simply >casting them to int in the printf arguments yields the same results >as simply declaring them as int in the first place. To me this >suggests that the basic code generation for the long type is working. >Perhaps there is some different conversion format needed for the >Microware printf to handle long? AFAIK, it follows the original K&R exactly for (f)printf() functions. >>> Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) >> >> Thanks, John. The feedback is appreciated. I'm going to gather input >> and hopefully work on a more refined release for the near future. > >Sounds great. I'd love to hear about your future plans. > >John > >P.S. New diff from the original Minix sources inlined below... > >--- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 >+++ wc.c 2009-01-21 18:47:27.000000000 -0500 >@@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ > /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ > >-#include "stdio.h" >-#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) >+#include >+#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') > #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c == > '\r') > >+std_err(str) >+char *str; >+{ >+ fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); >+} >+ > /* > * > * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] >@@ -79,9 +85,9 @@ char *argv[]; > /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ > if (k >= argc) { > count(); >- if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); >- if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); >- if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); >+ if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); >+ if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); >+ if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); > printf(" \n"); > fflush(stdout); > exit(0); >@@ -99,18 +105,18 @@ char *argv[]; > } else { > /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ > count(); >- if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); >- if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); >- if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); >+ if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); >+ if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); >+ if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); > printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); > } > k++; > } > > if(tflag) { >- if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); >- if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); >- if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); >+ if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ltotal); >+ if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wtotal); >+ if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ctotal); > printf(" total\n"); > } -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Department chairmen never die, they just lose their faculties. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jan 21 20:49:41 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:49:41 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <200901212049.41687.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 21 January 2009, Bob Devries wrote: >According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print longs >or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the beginning of the >code, to let the linker know to use the correct library routine: > > pffinit(); /* for floats */ > pflinit(); /* for longs */ > Thank you Bob, I had forgotten that detail. >-- >Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia > >Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me >the capacity to be his spokesman, >so that I know how to help the weary. > >website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl >my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John W. Linville" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:53 AM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > >> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 07:05:23AM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >>>> Some of the changes are simple, such as changing "%6D" to "%6d", >>>> implementing a utility function ("sig_err"), and fixing an actual >>>> syntax error. That was enough to get the program basically running, >>>> but it was producing 0 counts for lines, words, and characters. >>>> >>>> The original sources had those count vars defined as long. Changing >>>> them to int yielded correct results, except that it doesn't take much >>>> to overflow the character count... :-( >>>> >>>> Did this compiler have problems with long in the original OS-9/6809 >>>> version? It is bad enough to not handle long, but to compile it >>>> without complaint and simply not work seems rather wrong. FWIW, >>>> changing to 'long int' didn't change anything. >> >> So it turns-out that leaving the vars declared as long and simply >> casting them to int in the printf arguments yields the same results >> as simply declaring them as int in the first place. To me this >> suggests that the basic code generation for the long type is working. >> Perhaps there is some different conversion format needed for the >> Microware printf to handle long? >> >>>> Still, it _is_ cool to compile for OS-9 on my Linux box... :-) >>> >>> Thanks, John. The feedback is appreciated. I'm going to gather input >>> and hopefully work on a more refined release for the near future. >> >> Sounds great. I'd love to hear about your future plans. >> >> John >> >> P.S. New diff from the original Minix sources inlined below... >> >> --- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 >> +++ wc.c 2009-01-21 18:47:27.000000000 -0500 >> @@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ >> /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ >> >> -#include "stdio.h" >> -#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) >> +#include >> +#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') >> #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c >> == '\r') >> >> +std_err(str) >> +char *str; >> +{ >> + fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); >> +} >> + >> /* >> * >> * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] >> @@ -79,9 +85,9 @@ char *argv[]; >> /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ >> if (k >= argc) { >> count(); >> - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); >> - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); >> - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); >> + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); >> + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); >> + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); >> printf(" \n"); >> fflush(stdout); >> exit(0); >> @@ -99,18 +105,18 @@ char *argv[]; >> } else { >> /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ >> count(); >> - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); >> - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); >> - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); >> + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)lcount); >> + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wcount); >> + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ccount); >> printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); >> } >> k++; >> } >> >> if(tflag) { >> - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); >> - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); >> - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); >> + if(lflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ltotal); >> + if(wflag) printf(" %6d", (int)wtotal); >> + if(cflag) printf(" %6d", (int)ctotal); >> printf(" total\n"); >> } >> >> -- >> John W. Linville Linux should be at the core >> linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Department chairmen never die, they just lose their faculties. From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 21:59:08 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 21:59:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <009201c97c30$b3047ce0$0701a8c0@master> References: <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> <009201c97c30$b3047ce0$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <20090122025908.GE6802@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:28:12AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > John, > do you have access to the C compiler manual? > > I'm assuming you have put the pflinit(); at the beginning of main() > (although I believe it can be anywhere provided it's ahead of the first > printf() that tries to print a long. > > The usual format to print longs is: > pflinit(); > > long x=65000; > > printf("long number %ld", x); > > (Sorry if you already know all this.... :) ) Well, I had tried "%ld" previously, but that was before you informed me about pflinit(). By then I had already switched it back to "%d". :-( Changing it (back) to "%ld" in combination with calling pflinit works! Hooray! John P.S. Sometimes retro-computing can be a little _too_ retro... :-) -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 22:11:39 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:11:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> Message-ID: <20090122031139.GF6802@tuxdriver.com> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 06:37:51PM -0700, William Astle wrote: > John W. Linville wrote: > > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > >> Sent by private email, John. > > > > Well, thanks -- that resolved the linking problem. OTOH, the long > > variables still got printed as zeroes. :-( > > > > John > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but how does this theory work: > > Assumption: long is twice as many bits as int and big-endian byte order, > both of which should be valid here. > > Pretend we have a "long" value of 16. That would get onto the stack as > the following string of bytes: 00, 00, 00, 10. > > Now printf() is looking for an integer so it only grabs 16 bits from the > stack which gets the bytes: 00 00 > > Magically, our "long" value turns into a 0. Yes. FWIW it was not so much a question of the mechanics of why the longs look like zeroes, but of why it wasn't interpreting the longs as, well, longs. :-) > The theory is that the format string being used is only cuing printf() > to look for an int value but a long int is on the stack. > > I'm not overly familiar with the microware C compiler and the C library > involved but usually "%ld" is used for long ints rather than "%D", is it > not? The "%D" was from the orginal Minix sources. The diffs I've shown change "%6D" to "%6d". I think integral types get promoted to int in most compilers, and on nearly all the compilers I've used in the past 15+ years have int that is the same size as long. So "%d" and "%ld" are the same on those compilers, hence my overlooking the need to change that. :-) As indicated in the other post, the combination of pflinit() and the use of "%ld" seems to be working. :-) John P.S. Below is the current diff from the original Minix sources... --- minix/commands/wc.c 1987-01-02 04:16:15.000000000 -0500 +++ wc.c 2009-01-21 21:55:34.000000000 -0500 @@ -1,9 +1,15 @@ /* wc - count lines, words and characters Author: David Messer */ -#include "stdio.h" -#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9) +#include +#define isdigit(c) (c >= '0' && c <= '9') #define isspace(c) (c == ' ' || c == '\t' || c == '\n' || c == '\f' || c == '\r') +std_err(str) +char *str; +{ + fprintf(stderr, "%s", str); +} + /* * * Usage: wc [-lwc] [names] @@ -48,6 +54,9 @@ char *argv[]; int tflag, files; int i; + /* Library initialization for printing long type. */ + pflinit(); + /* Get flags. */ files = argc - 1; k = 1; @@ -79,9 +88,9 @@ char *argv[]; /* Check to see if input comes from std input. */ if (k >= argc) { count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6ld", lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6ld", wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6ld", ccount); printf(" \n"); fflush(stdout); exit(0); @@ -99,18 +108,18 @@ char *argv[]; } else { /* Next file has been opened as std input. */ count(); - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", lcount); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wcount); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ccount); + if(lflag) printf(" %6ld", lcount); + if(wflag) printf(" %6ld", wcount); + if(cflag) printf(" %6ld", ccount); printf(" %s\n", argv[k]); } k++; } if(tflag) { - if(lflag) printf(" %6D", ltotal); - if(wflag) printf(" %6D", wtotal); - if(cflag) printf(" %6D", ctotal); + if(lflag) printf(" %6ld", ltotal); + if(wflag) printf(" %6ld", wtotal); + if(cflag) printf(" %6ld", ctotal); printf(" total\n"); } -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From linville at tuxdriver.com Wed Jan 21 22:12:21 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:12:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com> <006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master> <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <20090122031221.GG6802@tuxdriver.com> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 08:37:28PM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Wed, 21 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > >> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 09:58:04AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >>> According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print >>> longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the >>> beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct library >>> routine: >>> >>> pffinit(); /* for floats */ >>> pflinit(); /* for longs */ >> >> Ah, now we are on to something... :-) Unfortunately, adding pflinit() >> results in a link error: > > John, > > Do you need a PDF of the C Compiler docs? I've got a tattered original bound version somewhere, but a PDF wouldn't hurt. :-) John -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From devries.bob at gmail.com Wed Jan 21 22:19:54 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 13:19:54 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port References: <20090121235308.GA9170@tuxdriver.com><006101c97c24$1ca43440$0701a8c0@master><20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <20090122031221.GG6802@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <00c901c97c40$4dc495d0$0701a8c0@master> Complete Microware C compiler package including PDF docs is here: http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/OS9/OS9_C_Compiler.zip -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "John W. Linville" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 08:37:28PM -0500, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> On Wed, 21 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 09:58:04AM +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >>>> According to the documentation, if you want to use printf() to print >>>> longs or floats, the following needs to be added somewhere at the >>>> beginning of the code, to let the linker know to use the correct >>>> library >>>> routine: >>>> >>>> pffinit(); /* for floats */ >>>> pflinit(); /* for longs */ >>> >>> Ah, now we are on to something... :-) Unfortunately, adding pflinit() >>> results in a link error: >> >> John, >> >> Do you need a PDF of the C Compiler docs? > > I've got a tattered original bound version somewhere, but a PDF > wouldn't hurt. :-) > > John > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Jan 22 07:13:21 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 07:13:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <20090122031139.GF6802@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> <20090122031139.GF6802@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 21 Jan 2009, John W. Linville wrote: > I think integral types get promoted to int in most compilers, and on > nearly all the compilers I've used in the past 15+ years have int > that is the same size as long. So "%d" and "%ld" are the same on > those compilers, hence my overlooking the need to change that. :-) > > As indicated in the other post, the combination of pflinit() and the > use of "%ld" seems to be working. :-) Keep those hits rolling! I also have a reported success in compiling a vi clone, but the binary is 63.5K long. I think we can refer to that exercise as "academic" :-). Steve -- From skwirl42 at gmail.com Thu Jan 22 08:26:19 2009 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 09:26:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: References: <20090122003335.GB9170@tuxdriver.com> <007d01c97c2b$089aa400$0701a8c0@master> <20090122012036.GC6802@tuxdriver.com> <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> <20090122031139.GF6802@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30901220526k35d04d65ie85339aeeede449d@mail.gmail.com> On 1/22/09, Steven Hirsch wrote: > Keep those hits rolling! I also have a reported success in compiling a vi > clone, but the binary is 63.5K long. I think we can refer to that exercise > as "academic" :-). Imagine trying to build emacs... eek... -- James Dessart From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com Thu Jan 22 09:20:48 2009 From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 06:20:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4977CDEF.50609@l-w.ca> Message-ID: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hmmm, I thought it was this way: printf("long int: %l",longint); I do know that using "%d" deals with an int though, never seen it referenced as "%ld" As far as length.... compiler specific. only guarantees is long is not smaller than an int, and int is not shorter than a short. I forget the OS-9 C (CoCo) lengths, and don't feel like chasing down my manual. -Later! ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Wed, 1/21/09, William Astle wrote: > From: William Astle > Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Wednesday, January 21, 2009, 7:37 PM > John W. Linville wrote: > > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but how does this theory work: > > Assumption: long is twice as many bits as int and > big-endian byte order, > both of which should be valid here. > > Pretend we have a "long" value of 16. That would > get onto the stack as > the following string of bytes: 00, 00, 00, 10. > > Now printf() is looking for an integer so it only grabs 16 > bits from the > stack which gets the bytes: 00 00 > > Magically, our "long" value turns into a 0. > > The theory is that the format string being used is only > cuing printf() > to look for an int value but a long int is on the stack. > > I'm not overly familiar with the microware C compiler > and the C library > involved but usually "%ld" is used for long ints > rather than "%D", is it > not? > > -- > William Astle From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Jan 22 10:27:01 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 10:27:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 22 Jan 2009, Bill Barnes wrote: > Hmmm, I thought it was this way: printf("long int: %l",longint); I do > know that using "%d" deals with an int though, never seen it referenced > as "%ld" I can only speak from experience with ANSI C compilers and modern libraries, but I've never seen a case where '%l' was legal syntax for printf substitutions. '%d' represents integer and '%ld' represents long int. > As far as length.... compiler specific. only guarantees is long is not > smaller than an int, and int is not shorter than a short. I forget the > OS-9 C (CoCo) lengths, and don't feel like chasing down my manual. Very true. The absolute sizes of these things is totally dependent on the compiler and/or compilation mode. Steve -- From devries.bob at gmail.com Thu Jan 22 15:37:00 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 06:37:00 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port References: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002c01c97cd1$2f74c280$0701a8c0@master> Bill, >From the Microware C Compiler manual: quote: An optional character "l" indicates that the following "d","x", or "o" is the specification of a long integer argument /quote Also, from the manual, CHAR is 1 byte, INT is 2 bytes, UNSIGNED is 2 bytes, LONG is 4 bytes, FLOAT is 4 bytes and DOUBLE is 8 bytes. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Barnes" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 12:20 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port Hmmm, I thought it was this way: printf("long int: %l",longint); I do know that using "%d" deals with an int though, never seen it referenced as "%ld" As far as length.... compiler specific. only guarantees is long is not smaller than an int, and int is not shorter than a short. I forget the OS-9 C (CoCo) lengths, and don't feel like chasing down my manual. -Later! -WB- -- BABIC Computer Consulting. --- On Wed, 1/21/09, William Astle wrote: > From: William Astle > Subject: Re: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Wednesday, January 21, 2009, 7:37 PM > John W. Linville wrote: > > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:47:38AM +1000, Bob Devries > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but how does this theory work: > > Assumption: long is twice as many bits as int and > big-endian byte order, > both of which should be valid here. > > Pretend we have a "long" value of 16. That would > get onto the stack as > the following string of bytes: 00, 00, 00, 10. > > Now printf() is looking for an integer so it only grabs 16 > bits from the > stack which gets the bytes: 00 00 > > Magically, our "long" value turns into a 0. > > The theory is that the format string being used is only > cuing printf() > to look for an int value but a long int is on the stack. > > I'm not overly familiar with the microware C compiler > and the C library > involved but usually "%ld" is used for long ints > rather than "%D", is it > not? > > -- > William Astle -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 22 16:16:01 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 13:16:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <46775.77666.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Roger, the simplest answer to your question is: The 6809 interrupts are (obviously) NMI*, FIRQ*, IRQ*, RESET* (yes, that's an interrupt), SWI1, SWI2, and SWI3. The reason that the Q clock will not continuously trigger the interrupt is that all of the above interrupts, except SWI2 and SWI3, will AUTOMATICALLY (when triggered) set the I flag during their respective interrupt sequences, thereby disabling interrupts before the interrupt service routine even begins execution. Interrupts must then be re-enabled, if needed. -Jeric ________________________________ From: Roger Taylor To: cocolist for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 9:39:03 PM Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks I've got a little question. What keeps an auto-starting ROM Pak (Q signal tied to CART) from continuously looping to $C000 instead of running the ROM code? If BASIC is responsible for resetting the FIRQ behavior before jumping into the ROM, I can understand how this would work right, but if the CPU itself is responsible by using the upper hardware vectors to jump directly to $C000 before BASIC even gets a chance to start, then if the ROM code doesn't start with ORCC #80 (mask IRQ/FIRQ), then I can't see the code ever getting past the first instruction, which in some cases is a NOP. Any ideas? -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 22 17:05:56 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 14:05:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) References: <109216.74811.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D92E@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <828189.88463.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> the 6847 outputs difference signals (theta a and b). luminance and r-y, through properly weighted comparator will give red, likewise, using the same "resistor" weighting of a second comparator with lumina and b-y will give blue. Then, red and blue into another comparator, which then feeds another comparator with it's output along with lumina gives green. i've finished the design on paper and when i get the parts in to test it I will post either:failure or success, or something in between :) -jeric ________________________________ From: Mike Pepe To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 10:50:52 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! (VideoMod for CoCo2) Interesting. I wonder how one derives the RGB signals from the luma, phase A and phase B signals that the 6847 spits out. > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Torsten Dittel > Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:29 AM > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Subject: Re: [Coco] Monitor Adapters was >Re: *COOL* Look what I found! > (VideoMod for CoCo2) > > I've got several RGB CoCo 1, 1a, 2, 2b and MC-10 with RGB output in my > collection. These were made for France (Europe) only. They even produce > the correct control voltages to select RGB via SCART. The place and > space on the main PCB, where the HF modualtor would normally reside, > has > been used for the corresponding circuits. However, these are all 50Hz > PAL models (not NTSC) and have a french keyboard layout (not QWERTY). > > Some pictures of the CoCo 2B board and RGB video sections: > > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl1.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_compl2.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail1.jpg > http://dittel.org/CoCo/pcb_detail2.jpg > > MC-10: > > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0002.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0003.JPG > http://dittel.org/MC-10/PICT0004.JPG > > Regards, Torsten > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mechacoco at gmail.com Thu Jan 22 17:23:35 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 15:23:35 -0700 Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks In-Reply-To: <46775.77666.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <46775.77666.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901221423i6e51f477o9cd7d06f1ba82e6a@mail.gmail.com> On 1/22/09, John Eric wrote: > Roger, the simplest answer to your question is: The 6809 interrupts are > (obviously) NMI*, FIRQ*, IRQ*, RESET* (yes, that's an interrupt), SWI1, > SWI2, and SWI3. The reason that the Q clock will not continuously trigger > the interrupt is that all of the above interrupts, except SWI2 and SWI3, > will AUTOMATICALLY (when triggered) set the I flag during their respective > interrupt sequences, thereby disabling interrupts before the interrupt > service routine even begins execution. Interrupts must then be re-enabled, > if needed. -Jeric -- That is correct. However, the auto-start feature requires the generation of an FIRQ* interrupt so it is the 'F' flag, not 'I' that must be set to mask further triggering of this particular interrupt. All of the mentioned interrupt types set the 'F' flag except for IRQ*, SWI2 and SWI3. Since an FIRQ* sets the 'F' flag, no recursion will occur. The FIRQ service routine in BASIC will turn off the CART interrupt source in the PIA before transferring control to the cartridge ROM. This means the code can clear the 'F' flag without causing a restart. Darren From jet.pack at ymail.com Thu Jan 22 17:44:09 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 14:44:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] auto-starting game paks References: <20090120033928.86AAB20A1C@qs281.pair.com> <46775.77666.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <5d802cd0901221423i6e51f477o9cd7d06f1ba82e6a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <534980.31468.qm@web111210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Thanks for the correction Darren. After I sent that, I wondered if perhaps I should have mentioned how the non-maskable interrupt works... :) Jeric ________________________________ From: Darren A To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 4:23:35 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] auto-starting game paks On 1/22/09, John Eric wrote: > Roger, the simplest answer to your question is: The 6809 interrupts are > (obviously) NMI*, FIRQ*, IRQ*, RESET* (yes, that's an interrupt), SWI1, > SWI2, and SWI3. The reason that the Q clock will not continuously trigger > the interrupt is that all of the above interrupts, except SWI2 and SWI3, > will AUTOMATICALLY (when triggered) set the I flag during their respective > interrupt sequences, thereby disabling interrupts before the interrupt > service routine even begins execution. Interrupts must then be re-enabled, > if needed. -Jeric -- That is correct. However, the auto-start feature requires the generation of an FIRQ* interrupt so it is the 'F' flag, not 'I' that must be set to mask further triggering of this particular interrupt. All of the mentioned interrupt types set the 'F' flag except for IRQ*, SWI2 and SWI3. Since an FIRQ* sets the 'F' flag, no recursion will occur. The FIRQ service routine in BASIC will turn off the CART interrupt source in the PIA before transferring control to the cartridge ROM. This means the code can clear the 'F' flag without causing a restart. Darren -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jcewy at swbell.net Fri Jan 23 09:29:56 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 08:29:56 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4977B822.3040501@iinet.net.au> References: <4970A66A.3070202@swbell.net> <4977B822.3040501@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <4979D464.4060801@swbell.net> Mark McDougall wrote: > Joel Ewy wrote: > >> This morning I'll see if I can still dig up the sources to >> my pix2tga and vef2tga utils, and maybe this weekend after I tear open >> the dishwasher I can see if they'll compile. > > Your dishwasher has a compiler??? > > Regards, > No, actually the dishwasher has an interpreter with a bad memory leak. I tried to fix the leak by replacing the broken gasket with RTV, but to no avail. Still, I now know where it is leaking and what to replace. And spending that time working on the dishwasher meant that there was no time left to play with the C compiler, which was the only reason I mentioned the dishwasher. JCE From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jan 23 11:20:18 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 11:20:18 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Microware C Compiler port In-Reply-To: <4979D464.4060801@swbell.net> References: <4977B822.3040501@iinet.net.au> <4979D464.4060801@swbell.net> Message-ID: <200901231120.18494.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 23 January 2009, Joel Ewy wrote: >Mark McDougall wrote: >> Joel Ewy wrote: >>> This morning I'll see if I can still dig up the sources to >>> my pix2tga and vef2tga utils, and maybe this weekend after I tear open >>> the dishwasher I can see if they'll compile. >> >> Your dishwasher has a compiler??? >> >> Regards, > >No, actually the dishwasher has an interpreter with a bad memory leak. >I tried to fix the leak by replacing the broken gasket with RTV, but to >no avail. Still, I now know where it is leaking and what to replace. >And spending that time working on the dishwasher meant that there was no >time left to play with the C compiler, which was the only reason I >mentioned the dishwasher. > >JCE > Chuckle. Been there, done that. Still fiddling with it if I hadn't just thrown money at it. The pump had eaten too many broken glasses anyway. :) -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Whistler's Law: You never know who is right, but you always know who is in charge. From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 23 17:49:10 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 17:49:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 disk image In-Reply-To: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <497A4966.8090404@gmail.com> Can some one send me a good OS-9 boot disk image for use with VCC emulator? Thanks. I want to be able to test out my C compiled programs. Please send to ojones at insight dot rr dot com thanks! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 23 21:15:42 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 18:15:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] OS-9 disk image References: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <497A4966.8090404@gmail.com> Message-ID: <269291.24614.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> the address @insight.rr.com keeps bouncing back invalid? ________________________________ From: N8WQ To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 4:49:10 PM Subject: [Coco] OS-9 disk image Can some one send me a good OS-9 boot disk image for use with VCC emulator? Thanks. I want to be able to test out my C compiled programs. Please send to ojones at insight dot rr dot com thanks! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From exwn8jef at gmail.com Fri Jan 23 21:42:20 2009 From: exwn8jef at gmail.com (N8WQ) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 21:42:20 -0500 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 disk image In-Reply-To: <269291.24614.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <168184.75477.qm@web31103.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <497A4966.8090404@gmail.com> <269291.24614.qm@web111207.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <497A800C.3070403@gmail.com> Sorry John, I left off one character "1" ojones1 at insight dot rr dot com Thanks for your help! Alan Jones -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home John Eric wrote: > the address @insight.rr.com > > keeps bouncing back invalid? > > > ________________________________ > From: N8WQ > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 4:49:10 PM > Subject: [Coco] OS-9 disk image > > Can some one send me a good OS-9 boot disk image for use with VCC emulator? > Thanks. I want to be able to test out my C compiled programs. > Please send to ojones at insight dot rr dot com > thanks! > > Alan Jones > > -- N8WQ - Canal Winchester, Ohio > http://exwn8jef.googlepages.com/home > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 23 21:56:05 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 18:56:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] chromassette & silverware Message-ID: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> my uncle said there used to be a cassette magazine called either chromassette or silverware (maybe both) and that some were actually available thru local radio shack in the day - anybody know where i can find cassette images of any of these? I so badly want to get hold of the two "collections" he once had - one was adventures, the other just games including poker, etc, but my uncle can't exactly remember the names. Jeric From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 23 21:58:25 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 18:58:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] InfoPatch from Sub-Etha Message-ID: <861494.48631.qm@web111216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Does anyone have the InfoPatch program from Sub-Etha Software that patches the infocom games such as hitchikers guide to the galaxy for 80-columns? Allen doesn't have easy access to the sub-etha stuff (yep, I asked - went to the source first), so if anyone has an extra copy they would sell, I would be greatful. Jeric From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 23 23:29:10 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 22:29:10 -0600 Subject: [Coco] first CoCoNet prototype Message-ID: <20090124042928.E82E820A15@qs281.pair.com> The first bitbanger CoCoNet Pak has been assembled out of 4 prototype copies. It looks like the final product will and is VERY nice (and simple). These initial boards were expensive to have made because that's how the PCB companies like to do it for small test runs. I'm looking for 2 beta testers who would like to trade their time playing around with the system in exchange for a free pak board (the case will come later) and a new HQ 5-foot bitbanger cable with DB-9 connector for the PC. Windows is required at this point for the PC. Testers need to own an arrangement of hardware or else it would defeat the purpose of being a tester. At least one USB to Serial RS-232 adaptor is suggested but the more the better, and a standard DB-9 COM port on the PC, a CoCo 1, 2, and 3, and Multi-Pak Interface which is not required but I want to see if the pak can be selected and whether your unselected floppy controller can still be active. A floppy controller is not required if someone wants to go all-virtual. If you own all of that or more and want to do stuff like CoCo-to-CoCo communication through the internet, multi-player games, web disks, and other wild ideas contact me for more details. The second you turn on your CoCo, drive 0 will be mounted with a PC virtual disk, and drive 1 will be mounted with a web disk. The web disk is semi-live which means you get a snapshot of the latest build of the CoCoNet sample disk stored on a web server. As I make changes to demos, you just turn on your CoCo and you get them RIGHT THEN. Isn't that amazing? I also plan to make the CoCoNet Pak auto-patch itself over the internet the second the CoCo is turned on to keep from having to burn a new EPROM every time I update the client code in the pak. If the patch can't be fetched after so much time has passed, the CoCo would still boot normally and use the EPROM code as usual. Since a CoCo 3 stays in all-RAM mode, this will work great. Any other CoCo 1 or 2 would have to have 64K of RAM to be able to auto-update itself on each power-up. The client code would automatically detect this and know what to do, and it will be very quick. CoCoNet is transparent to BASIC. The only snag is something any DriveWire user probably already knows... any game or app that has it's own low-level DSKCON routine (one that does not call on the one in Disk BASIC) will not be able to access a virtual disk. Drives can switch between physical and virtual disks. Internet files are fetched and stored onto the currently mounted virtual disk. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jcewy at swbell.net Sat Jan 24 17:17:17 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 16:17:17 -0600 Subject: [Coco] chromassette & silverware In-Reply-To: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <497B936D.20205@swbell.net> John Eric wrote: > my uncle said there used to be a cassette magazine called either chromassette or silverware (maybe both) and that some were actually available thru local radio shack in the day - anybody know where i can find cassette images of any of these? I so badly want to get hold of the two "collections" he once had - one was adventures, the other just games including poker, etc, but my uncle can't exactly remember the names. Jeric > > > I kind of thought the Chromasette stuff was out there somewhere, but I can't find it either. I do have a collection of Chromasette tapes I got recently from a thrift store, but I haven't imaged them yet. I have scanned a couple of the documentation pages for Bob Devries. I'm pretty sure he has scans of most of the documentation sheets, but I'm not sure what he has in terms of tapes or tape image files. If nobody else has made image files of these tapes, I might be convinced to make archive copies. JCE > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sat Jan 24 21:29:57 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 18:29:57 -0800 Subject: [Coco] chromassette & silverware References: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <497B936D.20205@swbell.net> Message-ID: Haven't heard of Silverware but I do have several Chromasette tapes. No docs though. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joel Ewy" > I kind of thought the Chromasette stuff was out there somewhere, but I > can't find it either. I do have a collection of Chromasette tapes I got > recently from a thrift store, but I haven't imaged them yet. I have > scanned a couple of the documentation pages for Bob Devries. I'm pretty > sure he has scans of most of the documentation sheets, but I'm not sure > what he has in terms of tapes or tape image files. > > If nobody else has made image files of these tapes, I might be convinced > to make archive copies. > > JCE From smostrom7 at comcast.net Sun Jan 25 12:07:55 2009 From: smostrom7 at comcast.net (Steve Ostrom) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 11:07:55 -0600 Subject: [Coco] chromassette & silverware In-Reply-To: References: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><497B936D.20205@swbell.net> Message-ID: I'm not positive, but I recall that Silverware was the cassette put out by the same company but for the other early Radio Shack computers. I do have most or all of the Chromasette magazine tapes, and these are all saved to my Cloud-9 hard drive system. Unfortunately I don't have a lot of time right now to play with my Coco. It will take some effort to image all of these tapes, but hopefully by this summer, "life" will ease up a bit. -- Steve -- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil Morrison" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] chromassette & silverware > Haven't heard of Silverware but I do have several Chromasette tapes. No > docs though. > > Neil > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joel Ewy" > >> I kind of thought the Chromasette stuff was out there somewhere, but I >> can't find it either. I do have a collection of Chromasette tapes I got >> recently from a thrift store, but I haven't imaged them yet. I have >> scanned a couple of the documentation pages for Bob Devries. I'm pretty >> sure he has scans of most of the documentation sheets, but I'm not sure >> what he has in terms of tapes or tape image files. >> >> If nobody else has made image files of these tapes, I might be convinced >> to make archive copies. >> >> JCE > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jet.pack at ymail.com Sun Jan 25 13:39:21 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 10:39:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] chromassette & silverware References: <698795.29347.qm@web111213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <497B936D.20205@swbell.net> Message-ID: <827632.67142.qm@web111210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> i've been looking and searching, the best answer i could get is that silverware was a "best of" type collection, of at least two different collections, of chromassette that rs in the USA had in their stores in late 80's. my uncle said they should be in all the stuff he gave me but i can't find them sadly, it would have been nice to have imaged them and uploaded them somewhere... je ________________________________ From: Neil Morrison To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 8:29:57 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] chromassette & silverware Haven't heard of Silverware but I do have several Chromasette tapes. No docs though. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joel Ewy" > I kind of thought the Chromasette stuff was out there somewhere, but I > can't find it either. I do have a collection of Chromasette tapes I got > recently from a thrift store, but I haven't imaged them yet. I have > scanned a couple of the documentation pages for Bob Devries. I'm pretty > sure he has scans of most of the documentation sheets, but I'm not sure > what he has in terms of tapes or tape image files. > > If nobody else has made image files of these tapes, I might be convinced > to make archive copies. > > JCE -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From ed.orbea at gmail.com Sun Jan 25 20:11:42 2009 From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 17:11:42 -0800 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness Message-ID: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look at this: http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 It is for a Timex Sinclair 1000 computer system. It is tested and in good working condition. It comes with an original Box,owners manual, printer, printer owners manual, 16k expansion memory module, over 50 cassette tape software programs, cords, 20 Timex Sinclair 1000 and ZX81 Books. Television and Cassette Recorder are not included in Auction. Now get this, the starting bid is $5.000.00. That's right, 5 thousand dollars! The auction closes in 35 minutes, and I wonder if the seller has any idea as to why nobody has bin Ed Orbea From os9dude at gmail.com Sun Jan 25 20:41:29 2009 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 20:41:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5631e580901251741q4fb80f30w1063d1439ad8bf21@mail.gmail.com> I needed the laugh :-) The comments left by other Ebay users are something to read. -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Ed Orbea wrote: > If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look at > this: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50< > http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 > > > > It is for a Timex Sinclair 1000 computer system. It is tested and in good > working condition. It comes with an original Box,owners manual, printer, > printer owners manual, 16k expansion memory module, over 50 cassette tape > software programs, cords, 20 Timex Sinclair 1000 and ZX81 Books. Television > and Cassette Recorder are not included in Auction. > > Now get this, the starting bid is $5.000.00. That's right, 5 thousand > dollars! > The auction closes in 35 minutes, and I wonder if the seller has any idea > as to why nobody has bin > > Ed Orbea > > From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sun Jan 25 20:51:30 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 20:51:30 -0500 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <5631e580901251741q4fb80f30w1063d1439ad8bf21@mail.gmail.com> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <5631e580901251741q4fb80f30w1063d1439ad8bf21@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <005101c97f58$9c502f00$d4f08d00$@com> But you should see his other auction which is just for one piece of software!!!! http://cgi.ebay.com/Microsoft-TK-MAN-for-Timex-Sinclair-1000-ZX81-TK-83-85_W 0QQitemZ330303372062QQcmdZViewItemQQptZVideo_Games_Games?hash=item3303033720 62&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C24 0%3A1318 -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Rogelio Perea Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2009 8:41 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] More ebay madness I needed the laugh :-) The comments left by other Ebay users are something to read. -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Ed Orbea wrote: > If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look at > this: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W 0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096 562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C2 40%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50< > http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W 0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096 562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C2 40%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 > > > > It is for a Timex Sinclair 1000 computer system. It is tested and in good > working condition. It comes with an original Box,owners manual, printer, > printer owners manual, 16k expansion memory module, over 50 cassette tape > software programs, cords, 20 Timex Sinclair 1000 and ZX81 Books. Television > and Cassette Recorder are not included in Auction. > > Now get this, the starting bid is $5.000.00. That's right, 5 thousand > dollars! > The auction closes in 35 minutes, and I wonder if the seller has any idea > as to why nobody has bin > > Ed Orbea > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.13/1912 - Release Date: 1/24/2009 8:40 PM From skwirl42 at gmail.com Sun Jan 25 20:58:53 2009 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 21:58:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <005101c97f58$9c502f00$d4f08d00$@com> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <5631e580901251741q4fb80f30w1063d1439ad8bf21@mail.gmail.com> <005101c97f58$9c502f00$d4f08d00$@com> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30901251758v1399c6a7g3be46a8cdd8e75d7@mail.gmail.com> Yet somehow he has had 134 auctions all with positive feedback... oh, it appears he was a buyer in those auctions... from what I saw it was mostly blank media. Guess he's gotta pay for his blank media habit somehow. what I also find amusing is that he puts his telephone number in there... I wonder how many crank calls he gets... -- James Dessart From operator at coco3.com Sun Jan 25 21:14:02 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 20:14:02 -0600 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090126021415.9EA8C20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 07:11 PM 1/25/2009, you wrote: >If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a >look at this: >http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 > > >It is for a Timex Sinclair 1000 computer system. It is tested and >in good working condition. It comes with an original Box,owners >manual, printer, printer owners manual, 16k expansion memory module, >over 50 cassette tape software programs, cords, 20 Timex Sinclair >1000 and ZX81 Books. Television and Cassette Recorder are not >included in Auction. > >Now get this, the starting bid is $5.000.00. That's right, 5 thousand dollars! >The auction closes in 35 minutes, and I wonder if the seller has any >idea as to why nobody has bin Because there's a sucker born every minute, and what better place to find them than on ebay, the most crooked web site on the entire internet populated by the most crooked people on the planet? We need another auction/store site not conrolled by a monopoly company who supports crooked users in order to stay in business and make billions in profit each year. Just my $5.00 tip which goes directly to ebay/PayPal fees. :) -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jan 25 21:28:15 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 21:28:15 -0500 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 25 January 2009, Ed Orbea wrote: >If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look >at this: >http://cgi.ebay.com/Timex-Sinclair-1000-Computer-printer-50-tapes-20-books_W >0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item330301096 >562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C2 >40%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 > _W0QQitemZ330301096562QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3303010 >96562&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7 >C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50> > >It is for a Timex Sinclair 1000 computer system. It is tested and in >good working condition. It comes with an original Box,owners manual, >printer, printer owners manual, 16k expansion memory module, over 50 >cassette tape software programs, cords, 20 Timex Sinclair 1000 and ZX81 >Books. Television and Cassette Recorder are not included in Auction. > >Now get this, the starting bid is $5.000.00. That's right, 5 thousand >dollars! >The auction closes in 35 minutes, and I wonder if the seller has any >idea as to why nobody has bin > >Ed Orbea > Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and gave it to my kids. They had a blast with it, but sadly all turned out to be windows users to this day. Something in the water maybe? Dunno, but it makes me sad. As for bidding on it, I *might* start at 50 cents. But then I'd recall it has a z80 brain & withdraw the bid. Having written about 30k of code for its z80 cpu without an assembler to hide the architectures brokenness, the best I can say about the z80, and zilogs support of it, is that both were at the time, badly dain bramaged. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) You can't break eggs without making an omelet. From jlhickle at yahoo.com Mon Jan 26 09:58:49 2009 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 06:58:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <20090126021415.9EA8C20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <234293.63897.qm@web37304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- On Sun, 1/25/09, Roger Taylor wrote: We need another auction/store site > not conrolled by a monopoly company who supports crooked > users in order to stay in business and make billions in > profit each year. Just my $5.00 tip which goes directly to > ebay/PayPal fees. :) > Amen. From badfrog at gmail.com Mon Jan 26 10:39:18 2009 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 09:39:18 -0600 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <234293.63897.qm@web37304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20090126021415.9EA8C20A13@qs281.pair.com> <234293.63897.qm@web37304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9efa17da0901260739n5a4577f1m6af25695a24665fa@mail.gmail.com> There are a couple up-and-coming auction sites for classic videogames, the CoCo might fit in with that. The one I can recall right now is: http://www.chasethechuckwagon.com/ (In reference to a rare Atari game of the same name) On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 8:58 AM, Jim Hickle wrote: > > > > --- On Sun, 1/25/09, Roger Taylor wrote: > > > We need another auction/store site >> not conrolled by a monopoly company who supports crooked >> users in order to stay in business and make billions in >> profit each year. Just my $5.00 tip which goes directly to >> ebay/PayPal fees. :) >> > > Amen. > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jet.pack at ymail.com Mon Jan 26 12:37:29 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 09:37:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness References: <20090126021415.9EA8C20A13@qs281.pair.com> <234293.63897.qm@web37304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <9efa17da0901260739n5a4577f1m6af25695a24665fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <123133.19429.qm@web111203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> there is also a free online store at ecrater.com - i found that site while looking to help a friend that lost $7,000 to stores online. I'm not saying stores online took the money, they didn't - they just sold a service at ungodly prices and my friend never even made a sale. i tried to get her to get a refund (there was a grace period) and go with a free service like ecrater. same type of services, basically, jut no chance of losing money invested... she didn't listen to me, so i can't blame stores online... btw - the chuckwagon site looks cool ________________________________ From: Sean To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Monday, January 26, 2009 9:39:18 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] More ebay madness There are a couple up-and-coming auction sites for classic videogames, the CoCo might fit in with that. The one I can recall right now is: http://www.chasethechuckwagon.com/ (In reference to a rare Atari game of the same name) On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 8:58 AM, Jim Hickle wrote: > > > > --- On Sun, 1/25/09, Roger Taylor wrote: > > > We need another auction/store site >> not conrolled by a monopoly company who supports crooked >> users in order to stay in business and make billions in >> profit each year. Just my $5.00 tip which goes directly to >> ebay/PayPal fees. :) >> > > Amen. > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From Rich.Ries at Honeywell.com Mon Jan 26 14:10:20 2009 From: Rich.Ries at Honeywell.com (Ries, Rich (NY80)) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 14:10:20 -0500 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CCAE@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> From: Gene Heskett Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and gave it to my kids. They had a blast with it, but sadly all turned out to be windows users to this day. Something in the water maybe? Dunno, but it makes me sad. Sorry, it was probably NOT the water. Remember, the TS-1000 had "windows": the listing window, the edit window, and the run window! I'm kinda fond of the Z-80, 'cause writing some assembler for it at work got me moved from Electronics Technician to Software Engineer! --Rich From jet.pack at ymail.com Mon Jan 26 14:51:11 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 11:51:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] NEW PROGRAM BOOT FOR GHANA BWANA, PITFALL II, DESERT RIDER, & ONE ON ONE Message-ID: <49890.69144.qm@web111211.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> This is Steve Bjorks Original Fix for these programs. I keyed it in and made a disk image, which I have placed here: http://www.gimechip.com/NEW%20PROGRAM%20BOOT%20FOR%20GHANA%20BWANA,%20PITFALL%20II,%20DESERT%20RIDER,%20ONE%20ON%20ONE.html or just go to http://gimechip.com and you'll find it From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 26 15:50:07 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 15:50:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CCAE@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> References: <5AE7680A1972BC48AF472EE23543615F0104CCAE@DE08EV808.global.ds.honeywell.com> Message-ID: <200901261550.07814.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 26 January 2009, Ries, Rich (NY80) wrote: >From: Gene Heskett > > >Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding >its keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on >it by putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k >rampack, and gave it to my kids. They had a blast with it, but sadly >all turned out to be windows users to this day. Something in the water >maybe? Dunno, but it >makes me sad. > > >Sorry, it was probably NOT the water. Remember, the TS-1000 had >"windows": the listing window, the edit window, and the run window! > >I'm kinda fond of the Z-80, 'cause writing some assembler for it at work >got me moved from Electronics Technician to Software Engineer! > That is another chuckle, but, IMO, you'd have to be a software engineer to understand the z80 and its warts well enough to write working code for it. Whether you had the title or not. And I suspect in some cases they pass out fancy titles in lieu of raises. Looks good on the business card. :-) Treat that as the passing grade on the final test. :) In my case I was also building the hardware to interface to an FM transmitter and control virtually all aspects of its performance, including the air conditioner required to hold the finals air environment to about 65F. Early Sparta 600 tx, bipolar output transistors which would go into a thermal runaway and destroy themselves if it got up to 80F inside the cabinet. It sat on a pedestal about a foot high with the window air conditioner feeding directly into the bottom of the cabinet. I also ran the studio end of it on a ups of sorts, the supply output about 80 volts, which kept a half farad capacitor charged, and the controller ran on the output of a switching regulator I designed and built connected to that, including winding the transformer. That would run the controller for about 2x what it normally took to get the standby generator started and up to speed when the commercial power took a dump. Nobody told me I wasn't supposed to be able to do that, so I did. But, that was also more than 25 years ago, and I now know better. :) But I have a history of doing things I'm not supposed to be able to do. I can't work for any telco for instance, no high school diploma, 8th grade only. But its been a long, interesting ride, picking up a 1st phone ticket early on, a C.E.T. a bit later, a degree from the University of Hard Knocks, and even a G.E.D a few years ago just to complete the circle. Yeah, I'm an old fart, but there are several of us on this list, so I figure I'm in pretty good company. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana. From jcewy at swbell.net Mon Jan 26 16:42:45 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 15:42:45 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [OT]T/S 1K [Was:] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <497E2E55.5050604@swbell.net> Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 25 January 2009, Ed Orbea wrote: > >> If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look >> at this: >> ... >> > Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its > keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by > putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and gave > it to my kids. I still have a T/S 1K that has an aftermarket "real" keyboard and case, along with a box of tapes. About twice a decade I hook it up and remember all that is so great about the CoCo. > They had a blast with it, but sadly all turned out to be > windows users to this day. Something in the water maybe? Dunno, but it > makes me sad. > > Well, maybe you should have given them a CoCo! :) > As for bidding on it, I *might* start at 50 cents. But then I'd recall it has > a z80 brain & withdraw the bid. Having written about 30k of code for its z80 > cpu without an assembler to hide the architectures brokenness, the best I can > say about the z80, and zilogs support of it, is that both were at the time, > badly dain bramaged. > > I've always thought that M'Soft's one true great contribution to computing was ROM BASICs for the old 8-bitters. And with a CPU like the 8080/Z80 a BASIC interpreter is a welcome thing... JCE From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jan 26 17:17:25 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 17:17:25 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [OT]T/S 1K [Was:] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <497E2E55.5050604@swbell.net> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <497E2E55.5050604@swbell.net> Message-ID: <200901261717.25939.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 26 January 2009, Joel Ewy wrote: >Gene Heskett wrote: >> On Sunday 25 January 2009, Ed Orbea wrote: >>> If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look >>> at this: >>> ... >> >> Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its >> keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by >> putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and >> gave it to my kids. > >I still have a T/S 1K that has an aftermarket "real" keyboard and case, >along with a box of tapes. About twice a decade I hook it up and >remember all that is so great about the CoCo. Chuckle, yes, a truly excellent reminder. I do the same occasionally, like about once per decade, with a TI99/4a. >> They had a blast with it, but sadly all turned out to be >> windows users to this day. Something in the water maybe? Dunno, but it >> makes me sad. > >Well, maybe you should have given them a CoCo! :) This was 4 years or more before the coco was first sold, Joel. 1978 IIRC. I didn't see my first one till 1984. >> As for bidding on it, I *might* start at 50 cents. But then I'd recall it >> has a z80 brain & withdraw the bid. Having written about 30k of code for >> its z80 cpu without an assembler to hide the architectures brokenness, the >> best I can say about the z80, and zilogs support of it, is that both were >> at the time, badly dain bramaged. > >I've always thought that M'Soft's one true great contribution to >computing was ROM BASICs for the old 8-bitters. And with a CPU like the >8080/Z80 a BASIC interpreter is a welcome thing... For that beast, most assuredly, Joel. It needed ALL the help it could get. As for their basic's in roms, I have to agree, but they did those back when they were still hungry and memory was 10 bucks a kilobyte, or more. The moose got screwed occasionally, but for the most part they followed the rules and the code was fairly clean and concise. >JCE > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Your boss climbed the corporate ladder, wrong by wrong. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Mon Jan 26 19:25:38 2009 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 00:25:38 +0000 Subject: [Coco] [OT]T/S 1K / ZX81 [Was:] More ebay madness In-Reply-To: <200901261717.25939.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <497E2E55.5050604@swbell.net> <200901261717.25939.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <497E5482.6070307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Gene Heskett wrote: > On Monday 26 January 2009, Joel Ewy wrote: >> Gene Heskett wrote: >>> On Sunday 25 January 2009, Ed Orbea wrote: >>>> If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look >>>> at this: >>>> ... >>> Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its >>> keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by >>> putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and >>> gave it to my kids. >> I still have a T/S 1K that has an aftermarket "real" keyboard and case, >> along with a box of tapes. About twice a decade I hook it up and >> remember all that is so great about the CoCo. Whilst I mostly agree, I do have a couple of the UK Sinclair ZX81s which are the same machine, which Timex produced under license. It should also be rememberd that the goal of the ZX81, and Sinclair's other machines was to produce a computer as cheaply as possible, to make them available to the masses. For example the ZX80, the predesssor of the ZX81/TS1000, basically the same machine, but implemented soly with LS, whereas the ZX81 has a ULA to replace the LS, was the first computer available in the UK for under ?100. So it was aiming for the lower end of the market which it was very successful at, I believe more than 1,000,000 ZX81s where sold in the UK, and they where cirtainly cheaper than the CoCo (or even the Dragon) at the time near the end of it's availability you could pick up a ZX81+16K RAM pack for ?45, and for a lot of people in the UK (me included) this was their introduction to computing, and yes I do still have it :) A fairer comparison would probably be with the MC-10, though even that was priced a little too high for the UK market but in terms of specifications was probably closer to the ZX81, than the CoCo. Still $5000 is a little on the steap side, My Wife bought me a couple of the ZX81 kits, a couple of years back, which including shipping from the US, only came to just over ?100, mind the exchange rate was better back then :) Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From alsplace at pobox.com Mon Jan 26 22:00:43 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 21:00:43 -0600 Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x Message-ID: The CoCo Wiki has been updated to the current version of MediaWiki software, which means stuff may be broken. I'd also like to update the domain name -- what do you think? cocowiki or cocopedia? -- Allen From petrander at gmail.com Tue Jan 27 02:23:34 2009 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 08:23:34 +0100 Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Gosh! I like both names... Uuuuuhm.... I think cocopedia sounds coolest... Getting a bit tired of hearing "wiki" all the time... Cheers, Fedor 2009/1/27 Allen Huffman > The CoCo Wiki has been updated to the current version of MediaWiki > software, which means stuff may be broken. > > I'd also like to update the domain name -- what do you think? cocowiki or > cocopedia? > > -- Allen > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Tue Jan 27 03:28:39 2009 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 19:28:39 +1100 Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <497EC5B7.10606@iinet.net.au> Fedor Steeman wrote: > Uuuuuhm.... I think cocopedia sounds coolest... Almost sounds like a pr0n name... ;) Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From jlhickle at yahoo.com Tue Jan 27 08:02:21 2009 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 05:02:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <247085.79463.qm@web37303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Cocopedia. "Wiki-" reminds me of the site that said that elephants are multiplying like rabbits. --- On Mon, 1/26/09, Allen Huffman wrote: > > I'd also like to update the domain name -- what do you > think? cocowiki or cocopedia? > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tjseagrove at writeme.com Tue Jan 27 10:55:03 2009 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 10:55:03 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005d01c98097$9dec0ec0$d9c42c40$@com> Use both and have one pointing to the host site... -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Allen Huffman Sent: Monday, January 26, 2009 10:01 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] CoCo Wiki updated to 1.13.x The CoCo Wiki has been updated to the current version of MediaWiki software, which means stuff may be broken. I'd also like to update the domain name -- what do you think? cocowiki or cocopedia? -- Allen -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.13/1916 - Release Date: 1/26/2009 7:08 AM From mervc at eol.ca Wed Jan 28 21:49:53 2009 From: mervc at eol.ca (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2009 21:49:53 -0500 Subject: [Coco] RiBBS search goes on In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901282149.53775.mervc@eol.ca> On September 30, 2008, Ron Bihler wrote: > I am coming up with some new names, > Kevin Darling > Bruce Isted > Guy Louck > Charles West > > They all had helped me with RiBBS and continued with Charles West. Does > anyone have contact with them? I think Guy had created a de compiler for > Basic09. > My documentation indicates Charles West released Ver 2.10 in 1993, his last. The last person to work on Ribbs [Ver 2.11 in '95 ] was a Canuck in London, Ont. We spent much time discussing improvements both on his BBS, the Fidonet Ribbs Echo and personal phone calls. I believe that we were the last two users of Ribbs in 1995. I was working on upgrading the Doc's for Ver 2.11, when it was decided to drop the project. By then the Internet had pretty well replaced BBS's. For the record, his name was Erik Jan Tromp. We occasionally chatted until about the end of 1996. Somewhere I believe I have a note when I shut down the Toronto Coco Club BBS, probably '96 and after Erik closed his BBS. Charles credits Wes Gale, Bill Nobel and Norman Rheaume for programming help with 2.10 and others like Warren Hrach for his assistance. Bob Devries was very active in Ribbs too I do believe but maybe just on the Fidonet OS-9 Echo. Since Bob is still with us, his memory should help. At that time this system had 2 x 100 MB MFM [?] drives, one a dup of the other, 4 floppies, [ 2x 3.5 and 2 x 5.25 ]. The drives are all in a PC Desktop case sitting beside me here. Some day it will all get hooked up again out of curiosity. Cheers -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Debian Sid Linux Desktop KDE 3.5.10 KMail 1.9.9 From cocomongrel at googlemail.com Thu Jan 29 11:18:19 2009 From: cocomongrel at googlemail.com (CoCo Mongrel) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 10:18:19 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Array Storage in DECB Message-ID: Hi CoCo folks! I'm re-writing an old CoCo 3 game written in DECB. I'm trying to make the code more modern, generalized, and easier to port to BASIC09, and possibly more modern BASICs. I'm going to try out the URBANE BASIC preprocessor for this first version. The original code was filled with two character variable names that didn't mean much, and I've spent a lot of time figuring out what each variable does and assigning it a more meaningful name that is URBANE-legal. Now I'm trying to optimize and rewrite the original game logic. I've got a couple of one-dimentioned arrays, now called human_handval(5) and cmp_handval(5). I could make more generalized subroutines if I could pack those arrays into a single multidimensional array and do something like this: handval(curplyr,i) My question is what that does for memory use. I'm fairly sure I can eliminate quite a bit of redundant program code by not needing separate subroutines for the human player and the computer player. Intuitively, I would guess that a multidimensional array shouldn't take any more storage space in RAM than two single dimensional arrays, and perhaps slightly less. But I bet somebody on this list has more than an intuitive guess on this matter. cocomongrel From mechacoco at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 13:22:17 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 11:22:17 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Array Storage in DECB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5d802cd0901291022m2e847c24oc1345c649a0b9aa3@mail.gmail.com> On 1/29/09, CoCo Mongrel wrote: > Hi CoCo folks! > > < snip > > > I've got a couple of one-dimentioned arrays, now called human_handval(5) and > cmp_handval(5). I could make more generalized subroutines if I could pack > those arrays into a single multidimensional array and do something like > this: > > handval(curplyr,i) > > My question is what that does for memory use. I'm fairly sure I can > eliminate quite a bit of redundant program code by not needing separate > subroutines for the human player and the computer player. Intuitively, I > would guess that a multidimensional array shouldn't take any more storage > space in RAM than two single dimensional arrays, and perhaps slightly less. > But I bet somebody on this list has more than an intuitive guess on this > matter. >From "Color Basic Unravelled": Each element in an array requires 5 bytes of storage and the format of the 5-byte block is the same as simple variables. Arrays are stored in the array table and each array is preceded by a header block of 5+2*N bytes where N = number of dimensions in the array. The first two bytes contain the name of the array, the next two bytes contain the total length of array items and header block, the fifth byte contains the number of dimensions and, finally, 2 bytes per each dimension contain the length of the dimension. So, converting two single dimensioned arrays into one multi-dimensioned array will actually reduce storage size by 5 bytes! Darren From seanruss at netzero.net Thu Jan 29 02:53:06 2009 From: seanruss at netzero.net (seanrussoct08) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 07:53:06 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" wrote: > > Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? > > Neil > That www.startty.com looks very interesting! do you think it would work with a coco? I have 2 sitting around and I only really use one at a time. That would be a really neat use for the other one! From seanruss at netzero.net Thu Jan 29 02:59:01 2009 From: seanruss at netzero.net (seanrussoct08) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 07:59:01 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: <2F6A2E580DFB4F70A54991D2898F9D9C@GATOR> Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "chargeron" wrote: I remember seeing a quote somewhere that in the haydays of the coco there were 2,000,000 coco users out there. It would have to be a very small fraction of that, but that still should be a lot! Especially seeing how much coco accessories sell for on Ebay. > > Does anyone have an estimate of how many Color Computers there are in use right now in the world? From linville at tuxdriver.com Thu Jan 29 15:12:54 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:12:54 -0500 Subject: [Coco] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the background) Message-ID: <20090129201119.GA27857@tuxdriver.com> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WCTn4FljUQ&eurl=http://hotair.com/archives/2009/01/29/comedy-gold-1981-news-report-explores-magical-journalistic-breakthrough/ -- John W. Linville Someday the world will need a hero, and you linville at tuxdriver.com might be all we have. Be ready. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 29 15:23:38 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:23:38 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901291523.39028.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 29 January 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: >--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" > >wrote: >> Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? >> >> Neil > > That www.startty.com looks very interesting! do you think it would >work with a coco? I have 2 sitting around and I only really use one >at a time. That would be a really neat use for the other one! In my case, I don't see any technical problems that cannot be overcome. As far as the serial<->ethernet adaptor is concerned, this linux box should be able to emulate that given a bit of programming skill (that I'm not sure I possess FWTW) to write a linkage between the ethernet port and the serial port I'm currently running a minicom session on, and which is connected to a "shell -i=/t2 &" on the coco3 in the basement. I have also had the serial port be a USB port here, with an FDTI usb-serial adaptor, which also worked well. This might require some NAT activity here, to separate the coco's traffic from normal traffic, and in fact might be all that is needed if I had iptables running on this box, which I don't. But that is fixable too. This would be a zero cost alternative, always attractive. I have also considered looking into the WizNet-100 devices, it looks as if an ethernet connection could be added to the coco if I/O space can be found for it, but I have NDI how many register addresses that less then $30 device would need, the investigation has only gone so far as to read the adv's in Circuit Cellar. They actually have one version that is a db9 serial port on one end, and the ethernets rj-45 on the other. A tcp stack is claimed to be in the device according to the adv's. That I might be able to plug directly into my switch if a spare port could be found, all 8 are busy ATM. The disadvantage of using this box as the serial<->ethernet convertor is the probably 200 watt power drain as this box now has a 2.2GHz quad core AMD Phenom cpu, 4GB of ram and 320+400+500, 1.22 terrabytes of drives in it, compared to the 15 watts my coco3 draws from the powerline to run everything but a touch screen vga monitor from an old ATX psu. The hard drive is the warmest item in it & that isn't much as the exhaust fan of the psu blows almost directly on the bottom of it & there is no heat detectable in that air flow. So that isn't very 'green'. :-( OTOH, this one runs 24/7, so, make it do something useful when its not fetching the mail or whatever I'm piddling with. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Bringing computers into the home won't change either one, but may revitalize the corner saloon. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 29 15:24:53 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:24:53 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901291524.53281.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 29 January 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: >--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "chargeron" wrote: > >I remember seeing a quote somewhere that in the haydays of the coco >there were 2,000,000 coco users out there. It would have to be a very >small fraction of that, but that still should be a lot! Especially >seeing how much coco accessories sell for on Ebay. Slight correction, how much they don't sell for. :) >> Does anyone have an estimate of how many Color Computers there are > >in use right now in the world? -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Anything is good if it's made of chocolate. From mdelyea at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 15:34:48 2009 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:34:48 -0500 Subject: [Coco] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the background) In-Reply-To: <20090129201119.GA27857@tuxdriver.com> References: <20090129201119.GA27857@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80901291234g24710c06pfeb9bd9e990698bd@mail.gmail.com> Pretty cool - that looks like 300 BAUD the guy is receiving at. I used to have a Modem II and I remember watching the characters crawl across the screen like that. On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 3:12 PM, John W. Linville wrote: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WCTn4FljUQ&eurl=http://hotair.com/archives/2009/01/29/comedy-gold-1981-news-report-explores-magical-journalistic-breakthrough/ > -- > John W. Linville Someday the world will need a hero, and you > linville at tuxdriver.com might be all we have. Be ready. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jcewy at swbell.net Thu Jan 29 16:28:21 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:28:21 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49821F75.8040205@swbell.net> seanrussoct08 wrote: > --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "chargeron" wrote: > > I remember seeing a quote somewhere that in the haydays of the coco > there were 2,000,000 coco users out there. It would have to be a very > small fraction of that, but that still should be a lot! Especially > seeing how much coco accessories sell for on Ebay. > > I've seen estimates that 2,000,000 CoCos of all models might have been sold over the entire run of the machine. But even if that estimate is based on anything like reality, that doesn't mean that there were ever 2,000,000 CoCos in use at any given time. I started with a 4K CoCo, upgraded it to 64K ECB, bought a friend's CoCo2 when my original chicklet keyboard got flaky, got a CoCo3 as soon as it came out, then bought both a TC-9 and an MM/1. I didn't use the CoCo or CoCo 2 very much when I got the CoCo 3, so can those count as CoCos simultaneously in use? And who can say how many CoCo 2s were purchased as Christmas presents without disk drives, printers, or maybe even so much as a game pak and a pair of joysticks? They were plugged into a TV, turned on, puzzled over for a couple hours, and packed away in a closet for twelve years before going to the Salvation Army and being re-sold for $2.50 to the next person who had not a clue as to what to do with it. But I will say that my boy Henry loves CoCo games. His favorites include Polaris, Rampage, and The Glove. So count my CoCos as in use! JCE > >> Does anyone have an estimate of how many Color Computers there are >> > in use right now in the world? > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From swancity at internode.on.net Thu Jan 29 16:28:57 2009 From: swancity at internode.on.net (Gerry van den Berk) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 06:28:57 +0900 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: Coco on the 'net References: Message-ID: <014401c98258$983da700$6401a8c0@nonee919662542> seanrussoct08 wrote: > --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" > wrote: >> >> Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? >> >> Neil >> > > > That www.startty.com looks very interesting! do you think it would > work with a coco? I have 2 sitting around and I only really use one > at a time. That would be a really neat use for the other one! > > Using startty should be easy since it works fine on my Commodore computers. All you need is a null-modem serial cable to a PC running a program called BBSserver and a terminal program on the CoCo/MC-10 and they are available. This site is C= -centric but the program will work just as well for any other system. http://home.ica.net/~leifb/bbs/ From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Thu Jan 29 17:52:56 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 17:52:56 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Array Storage in DECB In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0901291022m2e847c24oc1345c649a0b9aa3@mail.gmail.com> References: <5d802cd0901291022m2e847c24oc1345c649a0b9aa3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49823348.4030902@worldnet.att.net> Darren A wrote: > On 1/29/09, CoCo Mongrel wrote: >> Hi CoCo folks! >> >> < snip > >> >> I've got a couple of one-dimentioned arrays, now called human_handval(5) and >> cmp_handval(5). I could make more generalized subroutines if I could pack >> those arrays into a single multidimensional array and do something like >> this: >> >> handval(curplyr,i) >> >> My question is what that does for memory use. I'm fairly sure I can >> eliminate quite a bit of redundant program code by not needing separate >> subroutines for the human player and the computer player. Intuitively, I >> would guess that a multidimensional array shouldn't take any more storage >> space in RAM than two single dimensional arrays, and perhaps slightly less. >> But I bet somebody on this list has more than an intuitive guess on this >> matter. > >>From "Color Basic Unravelled": > > Each element in an array requires 5 bytes of storage and the format of > the 5-byte block is the same as simple variables. Arrays are stored in > the array table and each array is preceded by a header block of 5+2*N > bytes where N = number of dimensions in the array. The first two bytes > contain the name of the array, the next two bytes contain the total > length of array items and header block, the fifth byte contains the > number of dimensions and, finally, 2 bytes per each dimension contain > the length of the dimension. > > So, converting two single dimensioned arrays into one > multi-dimensioned array will actually reduce storage size by 5 bytes! > > Darren > Which indicates that ROM Basic arrays use more bytes than the actual data if the data consists of numbers 0-255; ie. the values are Reals. Put another way, if you do the work with an access routine, you can use any size block of memory divided into rows and columns where each byte is a data point. The arrays get much larger if they are string arrays. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Thu Jan 29 18:05:24 2009 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 10:05:24 +1100 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49823634.1090200@iinet.net.au> >> Does anyone have an estimate of how many Color Computers there are > in use right now in the world? I would suspect you'd get a reasonably accurate figure by taking the number of people on this mailing list/group and add, say, 50%?!? One statistic I'd be very interested in is the ratio, per computer, of machines sold versus the number of machines/users still in use/active today. Perhaps it is my biased/skewed view on things, but it's interesting for example that the TRS-80 Model I/III/4 and Coco machines have a relatively small user base with not a whole lot happening on the development scene, whereas the Apple II has a much larger active user base with some pretty high-end development (hardware with production runs in the hundreds!) And the TRS-80 out-sold the Apple for quite a few years. However, neither the TRS-80s or the Apples receive much "mainstream" retro coverage (aka, Retro Gamer magazine, a UK-based publication). I don't think the TRS-80 Model I/III/4 has even rated a single mention in 50+ issues, Dragon (Coco) games rate an occasional mention in passing, and IIRC they did a grand total of 1 article on the Apple II series. Conversely, machines like the Sinclair ZX80/1 & Spectrum, and the Amstrad CPC machines have (AFAIK) very little going on, yet receive copious - almost exclusive - retro coverage in the above-mentioned magazine. The C64 of course is no mystery at all, with plenty of coverage, a large current user-base, and plenty of development happening. Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 20:18:19 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:18:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? Message-ID: Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: eBay auction 310119084347 I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't find a mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? Steve -- From flexser at fiu.edu Thu Jan 29 20:22:51 2009 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Art Flexser) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:22:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yes, it's a floppy controller, capable of accommodating either a 24-pin or a 28-pin EPROM. Art On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: > Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: > > eBay auction 310119084347 > > I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't find a > mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? > > Steve > > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From alsplace at pobox.com Thu Jan 29 20:29:29 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 19:29:29 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5D68A8B1-CFA1-430C-840A-CAADA1189BD2@pobox.com> Floppy. I visited them once! Sent from my iPhone Follow me on Twitter - http://twitter.com/allenhuffman On Jan 29, 2009, at 7:18 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: > > eBay auction 310119084347 > > I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't > find a mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? > > Steve > > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mechacoco at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 20:51:09 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 18:51:09 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5d802cd0901291751s591d1442s5d236a0734eecaf0@mail.gmail.com> On 1/29/09, Art Flexser wrote: > Yes, it's a floppy controller, capable of accommodating either a 24-pin or a > 28-pin EPROM. Close examination of the photo reveals that both ROM sockets are 24 pin. This doesn't look like other HDS floppy controllers I have seen. The board doesn't have a solder mask. The FDC chip is a Fujitsu MB8877A. Some kind of prototype maybe (possibly even High Density)? Darren -------- > On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >> Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: >> >> eBay auction 310119084347 >> >> I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't find a >> mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? >> >> Steve From flexser at fiu.edu Thu Jan 29 21:12:00 2009 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Art Flexser) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 21:12:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0901291751s591d1442s5d236a0734eecaf0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: No, the HDS definitely has one 24-pin and one 28-pin socket; the 28-pin one can be jumpered, if desired, to accept a 24-pin ROM. Perhaps you are counting pins on the chip that is plugged into it, rather than the socket itself. Art On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Darren A wrote: > On 1/29/09, Art Flexser wrote: > > Yes, it's a floppy controller, capable of accommodating either a 24-pin or a > > 28-pin EPROM. > > > Close examination of the photo reveals that both ROM sockets are 24 pin. > > This doesn't look like other HDS floppy controllers I have seen. The > board doesn't have a solder mask. The FDC chip is a Fujitsu MB8877A. > Some kind of prototype maybe (possibly even High Density)? > > > Darren > > > -------- > > > > On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: > > > >> Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: > >> > >> eBay auction 310119084347 > >> > >> I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't find a > >> mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? > >> > >> Steve > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From tonym at compusource.net Thu Jan 29 21:18:37 2009 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 21:18:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1233281917.18748.3.camel@d610> On Thu, 2009-01-29 at 21:12 -0500, Art Flexser wrote: > No, the HDS definitely has one 24-pin and one 28-pin socket; the 28-pin one can > be jumpered, if desired, to accept a 24-pin ROM. > > Perhaps you are counting pins on the chip that is plugged into it, rather than > the socket itself. > > Art > > On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Darren A wrote: > > > On 1/29/09, Art Flexser wrote: > > > Yes, it's a floppy controller, capable of accommodating either a 24-pin or a > > > 28-pin EPROM. > > > > > > Close examination of the photo reveals that both ROM sockets are 24 pin. > > > > This doesn't look like other HDS floppy controllers I have seen. The > > board doesn't have a solder mask. The FDC chip is a Fujitsu MB8877A. > > Some kind of prototype maybe (possibly even High Density)? > > If you look at eBay item 220339682755, you will see an HDS I sold a few weeks ago. It is the one with the 24-pin and 28-pin sockets. Was there maybe an early unit with 2 24-pin sockets? The one on the OP's posted eBay listing DEFINITELY has 2 24-pin sockets. Whatever the version, it definitely is *NOT* a HDD controller - '8877A is a FDC chip, as others have mentioned. Tony From skwirl42 at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 21:20:09 2009 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:20:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: <49821F75.8040205@swbell.net> References: <49821F75.8040205@swbell.net> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30901291820v66cbe6a0h61579accf9cf6221@mail.gmail.com> On 1/29/09, Joel Ewy wrote: > But I will say that my boy Henry loves CoCo games. His favorites > include Polaris, Rampage, and The Glove. So count my CoCos as in use! There was Rampage for the CoCo?! Oh my... here I was, a young lad, wishing I could have been playing Rampage all year, instead of just when I visited my grandparents on their C64, when I could have been playing it at home! -- James Dessart From alsplace at pobox.com Thu Jan 29 21:20:30 2009 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:20:30 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: <1233281917.18748.3.camel@d610> References: <1233281917.18748.3.camel@d610> Message-ID: A friend of mine bought a Hard Drive Specialists floppy controller and drive setup back in the day (88?) and the drive controller was defective, so we just drove down to Houston (2 hours from Lufkin where we lived) and they checked it out and gave us another one. I don't recall the details about the model she had, though. It was funny -- they were clearly not primarily a CoCo house. They said one of the main reasons they did the CoCo stuff was to go to the Rainbowfests because they were so much fun (or something to that effect). Anyone know who ran it? Are they still around somewhere? -- Allen From mechacoco at gmail.com Thu Jan 29 21:41:28 2009 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 19:41:28 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: References: <5d802cd0901291751s591d1442s5d236a0734eecaf0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0901291841v6b9ac78ev6e36ab76c85cf945@mail.gmail.com> On 1/29/09, Art Flexser wrote: > No, the HDS definitely has one 24-pin and one 28-pin socket; the 28-pin one > can > be jumpered, if desired, to accept a 24-pin ROM. > > Perhaps you are counting pins on the chip that is plugged into it, rather > than > the socket itself. > No. The photo is clear enough. The socket is no larger than the chip that is plugged into it. Darren From jcewy at swbell.net Thu Jan 29 21:51:06 2009 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:51:06 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [Color Computer Questions] In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30901291820v66cbe6a0h61579accf9cf6221@mail.gmail.com> References: <49821F75.8040205@swbell.net> <4c56cbd30901291820v66cbe6a0h61579accf9cf6221@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49826B1A.4070806@swbell.net> James Dessart wrote: > On 1/29/09, Joel Ewy wrote: > > >> But I will say that my boy Henry loves CoCo games. His favorites >> include Polaris, Rampage, and The Glove. So count my CoCos as in use! >> > > There was Rampage for the CoCo?! Oh my... here I was, a young lad, > wishing I could have been playing Rampage all year, instead of just > when I visited my grandparents on their C64, when I could have been > playing it at home! > > You bet there was! I didn't get it until the local Rad Shak was closing out on CoCo stuff in the early '90s. I was in college by that time. Steve Bjork did it. Here's what Curtis Boyle says about it: http://nitros9.lcurtisboyle.com/rampage.html Henry especially likes it when somebody eats the dynamite or a switched on TV and gets what we call "the hot mouth". Lotsa fun. JCE From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jan 29 22:39:32 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:39:32 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901292239.32380.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 29 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >Hard Drive Specialist disk controller: > >eBay auction 310119084347 > >I seem to recall that this is actually a floppy controller. Can't find a >mention of it in Google. Anyone know for sure? > >Steve Yes, its a floppy controller, and likely has a fujitsu 8877 fdc chip in it. a cmos chip IIRC, than can do HD disks just fine if modified clocks are used. I had one once & let somebody con me out of it. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Police up your spare rounds and frags. Don't leave nothin' for the dinks. - Willem Dafoe in "Platoon" From lost at l-w.ca Fri Jan 30 00:01:26 2009 From: lost at l-w.ca (William Astle) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:01:26 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Announcing LWTOOLS Message-ID: <498289A6.7040802@l-w.ca> As several people on the coco3.com chat room know, I have been tinkering away at an assembler and linker for the 6x09 CPUs. Of course, we already have enough assemblers for ten CoCo communities, but, hey, I'm not trying to make money on this one. I inflict this on the world in case anyone finds it useful. A brief overview of some of the features is as follows: - macros - local symbols - raw and LOADM style binaries - assembly to object files which can be linked later - documentation (yes, that is a feature. :) ) LWTOOLS is known to compile and run on Linux systems. It is distributed in source form from my web site. It is licensed under the GNU GPL. The direct link to the LWTOOLS site is: http://lost.l-w.ca/coco/lwtools/ No doubt there are bugs and unfortunate features. Feedback is welcome. So are bugfixes. -- William Astle From flexser at fiu.edu Fri Jan 30 00:08:46 2009 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Art Flexser) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 00:08:46 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] Is this really a hard disk controller? In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0901291841v6b9ac78ev6e36ab76c85cf945@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Probably an earlier version of the HDS than the one I've seen, then. Art On Thu, 29 Jan 2009, Darren A wrote: > On 1/29/09, Art Flexser wrote: > > No, the HDS definitely has one 24-pin and one 28-pin socket; the 28-pin one > > can > > be jumpered, if desired, to accept a 24-pin ROM. > > > > Perhaps you are counting pins on the chip that is plugged into it, rather > > than > > the socket itself. > > > > > No. The photo is clear enough. The socket is no larger than the chip > that is plugged into it. > > Darren > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com Fri Jan 30 00:32:50 2009 From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 05:32:50 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the ba Message-ID: Very cool. I'm pretty sure it's actually one of Tandy's early data terminals based on the CoCo hardware like AgNet used. You can see the LED in the RAM button at the start of the interview with David Cole. One of the neatest things about it is that was the ground floor for what we have on the world wide web today, and the CoCo was there. From linville at tuxdriver.com Fri Jan 30 09:31:04 2009 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 09:31:04 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Announcing LWTOOLS In-Reply-To: <498289A6.7040802@l-w.ca> References: <498289A6.7040802@l-w.ca> Message-ID: <20090130143104.GD3485@tuxdriver.com> On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 10:01:26PM -0700, William Astle wrote: > As several people on the coco3.com chat room know, I have been tinkering > away at an assembler and linker for the 6x09 CPUs. Of course, we already > have enough assemblers for ten CoCo communities, but, hey, I'm not > trying to make money on this one. > > I inflict this on the world in case anyone finds it useful. > > A brief overview of some of the features is as follows: > > - macros > - local symbols > - raw and LOADM style binaries > - assembly to object files which can be linked later > - documentation (yes, that is a feature. :) ) > > LWTOOLS is known to compile and run on Linux systems. It is distributed > in source form from my web site. It is licensed under the GNU GPL. The > direct link to the LWTOOLS site is: > > http://lost.l-w.ca/coco/lwtools/ > > No doubt there are bugs and unfortunate features. Feedback is welcome. > So are bugfixes. Hey, cool! That looks pretty thorough. It is good to see some more tools work in the community. Maybe we should have some tools talks at the fest? John -- John W. Linville Someday the world will need a hero, and you linville at tuxdriver.com might be all we have. Be ready. From mmarlette at frontiernet.net Fri Jan 30 09:51:50 2009 From: mmarlette at frontiernet.net (Mark Marlette) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 14:51:50 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] Announcing LWTOOLS In-Reply-To: <498289A6.7040802@l-w.ca> Message-ID: <269368534.3782711233327110758.JavaMail.root@cl04-host03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net> William, I have not tried out your tool set, but......being a tool guy..... Can you ever have too many? :) Keep em coming!!!! Regards, Mark Cloud-9 ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Astle" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 11:01:26 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central Subject: [Coco] Announcing LWTOOLS As several people on the coco3.com chat room know, I have been tinkering away at an assembler and linker for the 6x09 CPUs. Of course, we already have enough assemblers for ten CoCo communities, but, hey, I'm not trying to make money on this one. I inflict this on the world in case anyone finds it useful. A brief overview of some of the features is as follows: - macros - local symbols - raw and LOADM style binaries - assembly to object files which can be linked later - documentation (yes, that is a feature. :) ) LWTOOLS is known to compile and run on Linux systems. It is distributed in source form from my web site. It is licensed under the GNU GPL. The direct link to the LWTOOLS site is: http://lost.l-w.ca/coco/lwtools/ No doubt there are bugs and unfortunate features. Feedback is welcome. So are bugfixes. -- William Astle -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From shadow at shadowgard.com Fri Jan 30 14:28:54 2009 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 11:28:54 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the ba In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4982E476.25913.4FDC19C2@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 30 Jan 2009 at 5:32, James Diffendaffer wrote: > Very cool. I'm pretty sure it's actually one of Tandy's early data > terminals based on the CoCo hardware like AgNet used. You can see the > LED in the RAM button at the start of the interview with David Cole. I missed the link. But that sounds like the old Vidtex terminal. I used to have one (complete with the fake leather carrying case. Don't recall what happened to it. -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From seanruss at netzero.net Fri Jan 30 14:29:57 2009 From: seanruss at netzero.net (seanrussoct08) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 19:29:57 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 5 1/4" Floppy Drive Message-ID: Hi to all Coco users! I am dusting off my old coco's and have a question. I apologize if this is the millionth floppy question on here. I called the local used computer store and the man said they have a large bucket of 5 1/4" floppy drives they sell for $5.00 ea. But he doesn't know if they are 360K or what. My question is, will any 5 1/4" floppy drive work for transferring files from a PC to a Coco? I should mention that i have a FD502 stock single sided low density floppy in the coco. Should I get 2 and put one in the PC & one in the coco? By the way I have a coco2 64K and a coco 3 128K. I don't have OS-9 yet, i would like to download NitrOS-9, and other programs. Any help would be appreciated. From seanruss at netzero.net Fri Jan 30 14:36:17 2009 From: seanruss at netzero.net (seanrussoct08) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 19:36:17 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question Message-ID: Hi all coco-ers! I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if yes, how do you? 2nd, if i buy the hardware from cloud9 to convert this to a coco3 capable multi-pak, will it never work on my coco2 again? Thanks, From jet.pack at ymail.com Fri Jan 30 11:57:36 2009 From: jet.pack at ymail.com (John Eric) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 08:57:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Coco] [OT]T/S 1K / ZX81 [Was:] More ebay madness References: <497D0DCE.30203@gmail.com> <200901252128.15289.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <497E2E55.5050604@swbell.net> <200901261717.25939.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <497E5482.6070307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <847674.78152.qm@web111214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> i have a ts-1000. i love playing with the lil' thing. it has a z80, ula, rom and a ram (2Kx8) - i think the zx81 had two 1Kx4 rams. still, i think it's neat, but i love playing with coco's lots more :) ________________________________ From: Phill Harvey-Smith To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Monday, January 26, 2009 6:25:38 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] [OT]T/S 1K / ZX81 [Was:] More ebay madness Gene Heskett wrote: > On Monday 26 January 2009, Joel Ewy wrote: >> Gene Heskett wrote: >>> On Sunday 25 January 2009, Ed Orbea wrote: >>>> If you thought that some of the CoCo prices are laughable, take a look >>>> at this: >>>> ... >>> Tee tee. $5k? Boggle... Having once owned one of those, and finding its >>> keyboard was a 30 minute wonder, I put a TI99/4a surplus keyboard on it by >>> putting the whole thing in a bigger box, along with the 16k rampack, and >>> gave it to my kids. >> I still have a T/S 1K that has an aftermarket "real" keyboard and case, >> along with a box of tapes. About twice a decade I hook it up and >> remember all that is so great about the CoCo. Whilst I mostly agree, I do have a couple of the UK Sinclair ZX81s which are the same machine, which Timex produced under license. It should also be rememberd that the goal of the ZX81, and Sinclair's other machines was to produce a computer as cheaply as possible, to make them available to the masses. For example the ZX80, the predesssor of the ZX81/TS1000, basically the same machine, but implemented soly with LS, whereas the ZX81 has a ULA to replace the LS, was the first computer available in the UK for under ?100. So it was aiming for the lower end of the market which it was very successful at, I believe more than 1,000,000 ZX81s where sold in the UK, and they where cirtainly cheaper than the CoCo (or even the Dragon) at the time near the end of it's availability you could pick up a ZX81+16K RAM pack for ?45, and for a lot of people in the UK (me included) this was their introduction to computing, and yes I do still have it :) A fairer comparison would probably be with the MC-10, though even that was priced a little too high for the UK market but in terms of specifications was probably closer to the ZX81, than the CoCo. Still $5000 is a little on the steap side, My Wife bought me a couple of the ZX81 kits, a couple of years back, which including shipping from the US, only came to just over ?100, mind the exchange rate was better back then :) Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Jan 30 17:04:57 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:04:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 30 Jan 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: > I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off > of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. > > I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use > one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but > i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if > yes, how do you? Well, to be precise the computer will only ever access one device at a time. But, what I believe you're asking is whether you can have more than one cartridge plugged in and have the software get to the one that's appropriate :-). The answer would be "yes", at least for OS-9. For example, I have a Tandy floppy controller in slot 4, an HDisk IDE controller in slot 3 and a Burke&Burke MFM hard disk interface in slot 2. The computer is booted with the switch on slot 4 for the floppy and start from there. Once OS-9 (actually, NitrOS9) is up, any or all of them can be gotten to. Others on the list run the serial interface in slot 1 or 2 and use that for data transfer or a remote terminal. > 2nd, if i buy the hardware from cloud9 to convert this to a coco3 > capable multi-pak, will it never work on my coco2 again? Mark will have to give you the definitive answer on that, I'm afraid. -- From mdelyea at gmail.com Fri Jan 30 17:26:07 2009 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:26:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 5 1/4" Floppy Drive In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1b52e6c80901301426q7a04386bpaa3d086fb47f1899@mail.gmail.com> No, I don't think 5.25" 1.2 mb drives are suitable for the coco, you need 360k drives. You can substitute 3.5" 720k and sometimes 3.5" 1.44mb drives. I have an older Compaq 3.5" 1.44mb drive being used as drive 1 under DECB and NitrOS-9 and have had zero problems with it. On Fri, Jan 30, 2009 at 2:29 PM, seanrussoct08 wrote: > Hi to all Coco users! > > I am dusting off my old coco's and have a question. I apologize if > this is the millionth floppy question on here. I called the local > used computer store and the man said they have a large bucket of 5 > 1/4" floppy drives they sell for $5.00 ea. But he doesn't know if > they are 360K or what. > > My question is, will any 5 1/4" floppy drive work for transferring > files from a PC to a Coco? I should mention that i have a FD502 stock > single sided low density floppy in the coco. Should I get 2 and put > one in the PC & one in the coco? By the way I have a coco2 64K and a > coco 3 128K. I don't have OS-9 yet, i would like to download > NitrOS-9, and other programs. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Fri Jan 30 17:55:10 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:55:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4983854E.5040301@worldnet.att.net> seanrussoct08 wrote: > Hi all coco-ers! > > I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off > of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. > > I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use > one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but > i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if > yes, how do you? > > 2nd, if i buy the hardware from cloud9 to convert this to a coco3 > capable multi-pak, will it never work on my coco2 again? > > Thanks, > Upgrading the multi-pak for Coco3 use will in no way cause a problem with Coco1 or Coco2 use. These upgrades are completely safe regards backwards compatibility. My guess is that when you bought the unit you did not receive the user's manual. Because if you had read the manual, you would see that not only can you select the active slot by using the switch on the unit but also by POKEing a value to 65407 aka &HFF7F. The manual states to use the following values: Selected slot Value 1 $00 2 $11 3 $22 4 $33 A more detailed explanation that supplied by the manual follows. The slots are actually numbered with base-0 notation; 0-3. The nominal value used is the slot value for both the msn and lsn nibbled of the byte, thus $00, $11, $22, $33. Actually there are two functions being controlled by the value. The msn selects ROM available to the Coco at $C000-$DFFF, while the lsn selects the I/O device responding to $FF40-$FF5F. It is not necessary to use the same value for both msn and lsn. So if you had a device (ex. RealTimeClock) in slot 1 and your disk controller in slot 4, you could POKE &HFF7F,&H30 and retain the Disk ROM in slot 4 while doing I/O through slot 1. This also means you could read a ROM in an auto-starting pak without starting the pak. Select the slot of the ROM pak using the msn while keeping the lsn at the default 3. Doing the above is a bit more complex. You would want to use a short ml program and be sure to clear the CART interrupt before returning to Basic. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Fri Jan 30 18:05:42 2009 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 15:05:42 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question References: <4983854E.5040301@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <05F5C6DB07CB400AB8EBE968B1D0A465@NewBaby> There's a manual on http://coco_docs.tripod.com/id51.htm Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Gault" > Upgrading the multi-pak for Coco3 use will in no way cause a problem with > Coco1 or Coco2 use. These upgrades are completely safe regards backwards > compatibility. > > My guess is that when you bought the unit you did not receive the user's > manual. Because if you had read the manual, you would see that not only > can you select the active slot by using the switch on the unit but also by > POKEing a value to 65407 aka &HFF7F. > The manual states to use the following values: > Selected slot Value > 1 $00 > 2 $11 > 3 $22 > 4 $33 > A more detailed explanation that supplied by the manual follows. The slots > are actually numbered with base-0 notation; 0-3. The nominal value used is > the slot value for both the msn and lsn nibbled of the byte, thus $00, > $11, $22, $33. > Actually there are two functions being controlled by the value. The msn > selects ROM available to the Coco at $C000-$DFFF, while the lsn selects > the I/O device responding to $FF40-$FF5F. > It is not necessary to use the same value for both msn and lsn. So if you > had a device (ex. RealTimeClock) in slot 1 and your disk controller in > slot 4, you could POKE &HFF7F,&H30 and retain the Disk ROM in slot 4 while > doing I/O through slot 1. > This also means you could read a ROM in an auto-starting pak without > starting the pak. Select the slot of the ROM pak using the msn while > keeping the lsn at the default 3. > > Doing the above is a bit more complex. You would want to use a short ml > program and be sure to clear the CART interrupt before returning to Basic. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Jan 30 18:16:17 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 18:16:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: <4983854E.5040301@worldnet.att.net> References: <4983854E.5040301@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 30 Jan 2009, Robert Gault wrote: > My guess is that when you bought the unit you did not receive the user's > manual. Because if you had read the manual, you would see that not only can > you select the active slot by using the switch on the unit but also by > POKEing a value to 65407 aka &HFF7F. > The manual states to use the following values: > Selected slot Value > 1 $00 > 2 $11 > 3 $22 > 4 $33 > A more detailed explanation that supplied by the manual follows. The slots > are actually numbered with base-0 notation; 0-3. The nominal value used is > the slot value for both the msn and lsn nibbled of the byte, thus $00, $11, > $22, $33. > Actually there are two functions being controlled by the value. The msn > selects ROM available to the Coco at $C000-$DFFF, while the lsn selects the > I/O device responding to $FF40-$FF5F. > It is not necessary to use the same value for both msn and lsn. So if you had > a device (ex. RealTimeClock) in slot 1 and your disk controller in slot 4, > you could POKE &HFF7F,&H30 and retain the Disk ROM in slot 4 while doing I/O > through slot 1. > This also means you could read a ROM in an auto-starting pak without starting > the pak. Select the slot of the ROM pak using the msn while keeping the lsn > at the default 3. > > Doing the above is a bit more complex. You would want to use a short ml > program and be sure to clear the CART interrupt before returning to Basic. Thanks, Robert, for the all-time most coherent explanation of the MP programming model! I have read a number of others (won't point fingers) that dance a complete circle around the specifics and leave me scratching my head. This one is getting saved, printed and stuck in the reference binder :-). Steve -- From devries.bob at gmail.com Fri Jan 30 18:33:28 2009 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 09:33:28 +1000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question References: <4983854E.5040301@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <005901c98333$2a6b0fc0$0701a8c0@master> Robert Gault said: > Upgrading the multi-pak for Coco3 use will in no way cause a problem with > Coco1 or Coco2 use. These upgrades are completely safe regards backwards > compatibility. Actually, that is not quite true. Yes, the modicication will not adversly affect the coco 1 or 2, but there is at least one PAK which will not work with that mod in place. I refer to the original CocoMax joystick controller cartridge. It's address range is right in the address range that is excluded by the modification for the Multi-Pak. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Gault" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:55 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question > seanrussoct08 wrote: >> Hi all coco-ers! >> >> I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off >> of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. I had a friend several >> years ago tell me that he thought you could use >> one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but >> i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if >> yes, how do you? >> >> 2nd, if i buy the hardware from cloud9 to convert this to a coco3 >> capable multi-pak, will it never work on my coco2 again? >> >> Thanks, >> > > Upgrading the multi-pak for Coco3 use will in no way cause a problem with > Coco1 or Coco2 use. These upgrades are completely safe regards backwards > compatibility. > > My guess is that when you bought the unit you did not receive the user's > manual. Because if you had read the manual, you would see that not only > can you select the active slot by using the switch on the unit but also by > POKEing a value to 65407 aka &HFF7F. > The manual states to use the following values: > Selected slot Value > 1 $00 > 2 $11 > 3 $22 > 4 $33 > A more detailed explanation that supplied by the manual follows. The slots > are actually numbered with base-0 notation; 0-3. The nominal value used is > the slot value for both the msn and lsn nibbled of the byte, thus $00, > $11, $22, $33. > Actually there are two functions being controlled by the value. The msn > selects ROM available to the Coco at $C000-$DFFF, while the lsn selects > the I/O device responding to $FF40-$FF5F. > It is not necessary to use the same value for both msn and lsn. So if you > had a device (ex. RealTimeClock) in slot 1 and your disk controller in > slot 4, you could POKE &HFF7F,&H30 and retain the Disk ROM in slot 4 while > doing I/O through slot 1. > This also means you could read a ROM in an auto-starting pak without > starting the pak. Select the slot of the ROM pak using the msn while > keeping the lsn at the default 3. > > Doing the above is a bit more complex. You would want to use a short ml > program and be sure to clear the CART interrupt before returning to Basic. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Fri Jan 30 20:45:22 2009 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 19:45:22 -0600 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090131014603.76C1B20A13@qs281.pair.com> At 04:04 PM 1/30/2009, you wrote: >On Fri, 30 Jan 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: > >>I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off >>of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. >> >>I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use >>one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but >>i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if >>yes, how do you? > >Well, to be precise the computer will only ever access one device at >a time. But, what I believe you're asking is whether you can have >more than one cartridge plugged in and have the software get to the >one that's appropriate :-). The answer would be "yes", at least for >OS-9. For example, I have a Tandy floppy controller in slot 4, an >HDisk IDE controller in slot 3 and a Burke&Burke MFM hard disk >interface in slot 2. The computer is booted with the switch on slot >4 for the floppy and start from there. Once OS-9 (actually, >NitrOS9) is up, any or all of them can be gotten to. Now what if you switched the MPI to the slot you had a ROM Pak in containing a disk operating system, but the floppy controller is in another slot. Would the disk operating system be able to use the controller as usual. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From srussell077 at comcast.net Fri Jan 30 18:57:31 2009 From: srussell077 at comcast.net (Sean Russell) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 23:57:31 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: <05F5C6DB07CB400AB8EBE968B1D0A465@NewBaby> Message-ID: --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" wrote: > > There's a manual on http://coco_docs.tripod.com/id51.htm > > Neil Thanks, you are correct, the multi-pak did not come with a manual. I've never seen one before. Thanks though, this will help. From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com Fri Jan 30 21:44:35 2009 From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 02:44:35 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the ba In-Reply-To: <4982E476.25913.4FDC19C2@shadow.shadowgard.com> Message-ID: I was replying to the CoCo mailing list. --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, shadow at ... wrote: > > On 30 Jan 2009 at 5:32, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > > Very cool. I'm pretty sure it's actually one of Tandy's early data > > terminals based on the CoCo hardware like AgNet used. You can see the > > LED in the RAM button at the start of the interview with David Cole. > > I missed the link. But that sounds like the old Vidtex terminal. I > used to have one (complete with the fake leather carrying case. > > Don't recall what happened to it. > > > -- > Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) > shadow at shadowgard dot com > From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Fri Jan 30 22:25:50 2009 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 22:25:50 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: <20090131014603.76C1B20A13@qs281.pair.com> References: <20090131014603.76C1B20A13@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4983C4BE.60705@worldnet.att.net> Roger Taylor wrote: > At 04:04 PM 1/30/2009, you wrote: >> On Fri, 30 Jan 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: >> >>> I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off >>> of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. >>> >>> I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use >>> one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but >>> i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if >>> yes, how do you? >> >> Well, to be precise the computer will only ever access one device at a >> time. But, what I believe you're asking is whether you can have more >> than one cartridge plugged in and have the software get to the one >> that's appropriate :-). The answer would be "yes", at least for >> OS-9. For example, I have a Tandy floppy controller in slot 4, an >> HDisk IDE controller in slot 3 and a Burke&Burke MFM hard disk >> interface in slot 2. The computer is booted with the switch on slot 4 >> for the floppy and start from there. Once OS-9 (actually, NitrOS9) is >> up, any or all of them can be gotten to. > > Now what if you switched the MPI to the slot you had a ROM Pak in > containing a disk operating system, but the floppy controller is in > another slot. Would the disk operating system be able to use the > controller as usual. > > > You should be able to have two "halt" controllers in an MPI with different ROMs and use the hardware from one and the software from the other. You won't be able to have one "non-halt" and the other "halt" as the code won't match. Two "non-halt" controllers, using the same hardware, also ought to work. I don't know of any Disk Basic ROMs that do anything to the MPI slot. OS-9 is a different animal however. Some poorly written code may assume the default MPI slot is 3 and return the $FF7F value to $33 after servicing a call. Correctly written code will read the $FF7F value, save it, and restore it on Exit. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 31 00:15:18 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 00:15:18 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901310015.18881.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 30 January 2009, seanrussoct08 wrote: >Hi all coco-ers! > >I have a quick question. I have a multi-pak 26-3124 that i bought off >of Ebay a few years ago and haven't used it much. > >I had a friend several years ago tell me that he thought you could use >one of these multi-paks to access more than one device at a time, but >i didn't think you could. Could someone settle this for me? and if >yes, how do you? > >2nd, if i buy the hardware from cloud9 to convert this to a coco3 >capable multi-pak, will it never work on my coco2 again? > >Thanks, Sure, no problem. The fix, fixes an erronious ghosted response from the poor address decoding the original did, and which clashed with the gime chip register addresses. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Any program which runs right is obsolete. From lamune at doki-doki.net Sat Jan 31 00:26:03 2009 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:26:03 -0800 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Multi-Pak Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D982@fenestra.lamunet.local> It's a little more complicated than that. Let's see if I can add to what everyone already has said. There is a cartridge I/O select line and a cartridge ROM select line at the CoCo port. There is a register in the multi-pak (and the front panel switch) that determine which slot gets those two signals. The I/O space is from $FF40 to $FF5F. If you have a cart that uses I/O space that's not in that range, for instance, the RS232 pak, it doesn't matter what slot is selected or not- that device will function, because it doesn't care about the cart I/O select line from the CoCo The multi-pak is designed such that it feeds all the unused "I/O" space- probably from $FF40 to $FFBF. This is the reason there is a CoCo 3 update for the pak, because it will respond to the I/O space that the GIME addresses are mapped to and cause unpredictable behavior. As I think Phill pointed out, the CoCo Max pak lives at $FF90 and won't work with a modified MPI- nor will it function on a CoCo3 for that matter. -Mike From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Jan 31 10:48:19 2009 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:48:19 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] YouTube - 1981 primitive Internet report on KRON (CoCo pictured in the ba In-Reply-To: <263140590.483381233416395044.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <374584353.486051233416899008.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> ----- "James Diffendaffer" wrote: > --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, shadow at ... wrote: > > > > On 30 Jan 2009 at 5:32, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > > > > Very cool. I'm pretty sure it's actually one of Tandy's early data > > > terminals based on the CoCo hardware like AgNet used. You can see > the > > > LED in the RAM button at the start of the interview with David > Cole. > > > > I missed the link. But that sounds like the old Vidtex terminal. I > > used to have one (complete with the fake leather carrying case. > > > > Don't recall what happened to it. > > > From: "James Diffendaffer" > I was replying to the CoCo mailing list. So was Shadow. The Vidtex terminal looked exactly like a Color Computer One, except for an LED where the RAM button should be. It booted into the same program you would if a Vidtex cartridge was plugged into a CoCo. There was a phone jack where the CoCo's serial DIN would be (same case cutout) so I assume a circuit related to the Modem-1 was inside, but I never took one apart or saw one taken apart by one of the techs I worked with. The Vidtex terminal was announced the same day as the Color Computer, the TRS-80 Model 3 and the Pocket Computer One. It was not a very popular product, and I don't recall any sold out of any RSCC I worked in. (Eventually they vanished from the stockrooms -- there must be a secret landfill, probably under that new football stadiom between Fort Worth and Dallas). The AgNet terminal was a Vidtex terminal with a different label. Never saw one in person (Los Angeles was no longer an agricultural powerhouse by the 1980s, in fact the orange groves of my early childhood had been mostly developed into housing before I first left in 1970). (Yeah, I left LA at 15 for New Hampshire, then went back to LA in 1981 -- been stuck in New Jersey 17 years now, and want to go back to New Hampshire, I'll probably never set foot in California again unless that warrant catches up with me, but I'm pretty sure they gave up). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net (page has stale links and resume is not up to date as I'm employed at a dead end job with a health plan and if I quit for a short-lived high-pay consulting gig, La Esposa will make me homeless before the first check arrives) From snhirsch at gmail.com Sat Jan 31 11:38:52 2009 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 11:38:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 15 Nov 2008, J.P. Samson wrote: >>> On Nov 15, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>>> This morning I finally got motivated and built an adapter to run RGB >>>> video from my CoCo 3 into the Wei-Ya ACV-011 RGB-->VGA converter. I'm >>>> pleased to report that it works quite well! >>> >>> Any plans to do a write-up on how you put this together, Steven? How's >>> the quality? Have you ever used Roy's converter to be able to compare >>> results? >> >> There's not a whole lot to write up... It's just a matter of building a >> cable with a 10-pin ribbon cable header on one end. If you are not sharing >> the converter with other classic machines, you just splice the other end to >> the header supplied with the converter board. The signals are just 1:1, >> connect Gnd, R, G, B, H-sync and V-sync and you're good to go. The pinout >> for the bottom of the CoCo 3 is widely available. > > Nice and easy, that's for sure. I'd guess that Roy's converter does a better > job, since it is specifically designed for the CoCo 3 and includes a filter > to absorb some of the vertical banding that is an artifact of the computer's > RGB output. Roy's adapter has difficulty clearly resolving some color > combinations, though, making such text hard to read. A quick followup on the subject: I built an RLC low-pass filter based on Roy's design (thanks for the schematic, Roy!) and gave it a try. Results in my situation were not very good. It did not eliminate visible banding (which was very slight to begin with), but did throw away enough in-band video signal to blur the text display noticably. Disclaimer: This is not to be taken as a comment on the performance Roy's converter box (which I have never used)! The input impedance of the Wei-Ya RGB board may vary from his design and that can have a sizable effect on the filter characteristics. I know that many folks are happy with Roy's converter and I'll take it on faith that it does a fine job. I just picked up another SCART cable, so the next thing to try will be running the CoCo into my Highway 100 converter. Steve -- From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 31 14:12:26 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 14:12:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901311412.26080.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 31 January 2009, Steven Hirsch wrote: >On Sat, 15 Nov 2008, J.P. Samson wrote: >>>> On Nov 15, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>>>> This morning I finally got motivated and built an adapter to run RGB >>>>> video from my CoCo 3 into the Wei-Ya ACV-011 RGB-->VGA converter. I'm >>>>> pleased to report that it works quite well! >>>> >>>> Any plans to do a write-up on how you put this together, Steven? How's >>>> the quality? Have you ever used Roy's converter to be able to compare >>>> results? >>> >>> There's not a whole lot to write up... It's just a matter of building a >>> cable with a 10-pin ribbon cable header on one end. If you are not >>> sharing the converter with other classic machines, you just splice the >>> other end to the header supplied with the converter board. The signals >>> are just 1:1, connect Gnd, R, G, B, H-sync and V-sync and you're good to >>> go. The pinout for the bottom of the CoCo 3 is widely available. >> >> Nice and easy, that's for sure. I'd guess that Roy's converter does a >> better job, since it is specifically designed for the CoCo 3 and includes >> a filter to absorb some of the vertical banding that is an artifact of the >> computer's RGB output. Roy's adapter has difficulty clearly resolving >> some color combinations, though, making such text hard to read. > >A quick followup on the subject: I built an RLC low-pass filter based on >Roy's design (thanks for the schematic, Roy!) and gave it a try. Results >in my situation were not very good. It did not eliminate visible banding >(which was very slight to begin with), but did throw away enough in-band >video signal to blur the text display noticably. > >Disclaimer: > >This is not to be taken as a comment on the performance Roy's converter >box (which I have never used)! The input impedance of the Wei-Ya RGB >board may vary from his design and that can have a sizable effect on the >filter characteristics. I know that many folks are happy with Roy's >converter and I'll take it on faith that it does a fine job. > >I just picked up another SCART cable, so the next thing to try will be >running the CoCo into my Highway 100 converter. > >Steve I did some checks on that myself, Steve because the blue in particular is not a usable text screen color here, never has been. I have traced the rolled off response all the way back through the gime's own rgb output pins, and nothing is lost in the cc3's rgb buffering, nor in Roy's converter. The conclusion I came to was that my gime was just plain slow. Blue text on a black background never reaches more than 5% of white, and the reversed situation of blue text coming down from white is also only about 5% amplitude due to very very slow rise and fall times compared to the 'dot clock' itself, with the overall amplitude being nstc gain trimmed by the time the gime outputs it. That alone restricts the voltage swing of the blue signal to under 100 millivolts right there. Roy's converter doesn't throw a thing away that the gime doesn't do to a far worse degree. If it were possible to bypass the gime's 2 bit output d/a's easily, I'd do it in a heart beat. But I'm not sure how one would go about capturing the memory read intended to feed the d/a's and do that. All in the latch decoding and timing I expect, and an 8 bit data latch with 4, 2 resistor groups of 2+2r could handle the rest, at a far more usable bandwidth delivered to the monitor. Roy, might that be the next project? 2, maybe 3 all cmos chips I'd think. Cutting it into the coco3's circuitry, once the thing is ready as a kit, would be a bit scary for the soldering iron challenged, but again, not impossible. I'll be a guinea pig any day as I have a spare cc3 and I know which end of the soldering iron gets hot. Hint, hint. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) New Hampshire law forbids you to tap your feet, nod your head, or in any way keep time to the music in a tavern, restaurant, or cafe. From RJRTTY at aol.com Sat Jan 31 18:37:43 2009 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 18:37:43 EST Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story Message-ID: In a message dated 1/31/2009 11:39:08 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, snhirsch at gmail.com writes: >A quick followup on the subject: I built an RLC low-pass filter based on >Roy's design (thanks for the schematic, Roy!) and gave it a try. Results >in my situation were not very good. It did not eliminate visible banding >(which was very slight to begin with), but did throw away enough in-band >video signal to blur the text display noticably. Don't give up on the filter.... Try less capacitance since this is the easiest to change and will have the most effect. By your description I would go from 470 pf to about 100 to 200 pf. Roy **************From Wall Street to Main Street and everywhere in between, stay up-to-date with the latest news. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023) From RJRTTY at aol.com Sat Jan 31 18:37:40 2009 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 18:37:40 EST Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story Message-ID: In a message dated 1/31/2009 2:12:56 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gene.heskett at verizon.net writes: >Blue text on a black background never reaches more than 5% of white, and the >reversed situation of blue text coming down from white is also only about 5% >amplitude due to very very slow rise and fall times compared to the 'dot >clock' itself, with the overall amplitude being nstc gain trimmed by the time >the gime outputs it. That alone restricts the voltage swing of the blue >signal to under 100 millivolts right there. Roy's converter doesn't throw a >thing away that the gime doesn't do to a far worse degree. If it were >possible to bypass the gime's 2 bit output d/a's easily, I'd do it in a heart >beat. But I'm not sure how one would go about capturing the memory read >intended to feed the d/a's and do that. All in the latch decoding and timing >I expect, and an 8 bit data latch with 4, 2 resistor groups of 2+2r could >handle the rest, at a far more usable bandwidth delivered to the monitor. >Roy, might that be the next project? 2, maybe 3 all cmos chips I'd think. >Cutting it into the coco3's circuitry, once the thing is ready as a kit, >would be a bit scary for the soldering iron challenged, but again, not >impossible. I'll be a guinea pig any day as I have a spare cc3 and I know >which end of the soldering iron gets hot. Hint, hint. The blue channel has always been a problem with my converter. The red channel has the same problem but to a much lesser extent for some reason. All I can think of is that these signals are out of sink with the dot clock and the old monitors covered it up very well. I have NDI how to bypass the gime. Like you say Gene it would be a "scary" soldering job on the motherboard. I might do it someday on one of my spare coco3's just to see what a perfect output would look like......stray tuned. Roy **************From Wall Street to Main Street and everywhere in between, stay up-to-date with the latest news. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023) From RJRTTY at aol.com Sat Jan 31 19:48:13 2009 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 19:48:13 EST Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story Message-ID: In a message dated 1/31/2009 6:38:09 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, RJRTTY at aol.com writes: >I have NDI how to bypass the gime. Like you say Gene it would be a >"scary" soldering job on the motherboard. I might do it someday on >one of my spare coco3's just to see what a perfect output would look >like......stray tuned. >Roy Now that I think about it I could eliminate the AL875 and hook the AL250 directly to the traces that feed the Gime and I COULD put it on a board the plugs into the Gime socket and that contained another socket to plug the Gime into. Sorta like the lower-case video board that was produced for the coco1. Hmmmmmm.........let me think about this for awhile and get back to you all at a later date...... Roy **************From Wall Street to Main Street and everywhere in between, stay up-to-date with the latest news. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023) From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jan 31 22:42:31 2009 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 22:42:31 -0500 Subject: [Coco] RGB --> VGA for CoCo: A success story In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200901312242.31851.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 31 January 2009, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 1/31/2009 6:38:09 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > >RJRTTY at aol.com writes: >>I have NDI how to bypass the gime. Like you say Gene it would be a >>"scary" soldering job on the motherboard. I might do it someday on >>one of my spare coco3's just to see what a perfect output would look >>like......stray tuned. >> >>Roy > >Now that I think about it I could eliminate the AL875 and >hook the AL250 directly to the traces that feed the >Gime and I COULD put it on a board the plugs >into the Gime socket and that contained another >socket to plug the Gime into. Sorta like the lower-case >video board that was produced for the coco1. In my case, IIRC the 2 meg memory kit sits on that area, so there is at most 1/4" of height to play with. That should be enough though. >Hmmmmmm.........let me think about this for awhile >and get back to you all at a later date...... With careful attention, Roy, thanks. >Roy > >**************From Wall Street to Main Street and everywhere in between, > stay up-to-date with the latest news. > (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023) > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "BTW, does Jesus know you flame?" -- Diane Holt, dianeh at binky.UUCP, to Ed Carp