From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com Wed Oct 1 00:11:53 2008 From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 04:11:53 -0000 Subject: [Coco] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BColor_Computer=5D__pagetable=2Ecom_=BB_B?= =?iso-8859-1?q?log_Archive_=BB_Bill_Gates=92_Personal_Easter_Eggs_?= =?iso-8859-1?q?in_8_Bit?= Message-ID: > John W. Linville wrote: > >> Yes, it mentions the CoCo and the MC-10! > > > >> http://www.pagetable.com/?p=43 > > > Wow, that is a cool find! > > Makes me wonder how optimized the CoCo basic actually was, or if it was > just ported over from the existing codebase. The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte tokens but not all do. From operator at coco3.com Wed Oct 1 00:53:36 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 23:53:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow IDE 2.0 in progress Message-ID: <20081001045343.15FEC20A33@qs281.pair.com> Hello folks, Just a note that I've picked back up on the development of Rainbow IDE 2.0 after many months of restructuring the source code and repairing a bad design. Tonight it's assembling some test files ok. The left sidebar list boxes for choosing assembler modes has been simplified even more but allows more options, which helps the coder focus more on the source code instead of tweaking the IDE constantly. A single drop-down listbox contains all of the assembler or compiler's modes, object file choices, switches/options, etc. For instance, you can choose to have a listing sent to the readout window, symbols listing, verbose mode, quiet mode, error reporting, debugging mode, or whatever else the command line options allow. Once those options or programmed into the IDE once you just pull the listbox down and click on the option to turn on or off. It will toggle and display a dot or checkmark next to the ones that are on. Very simple. You setup the assembler once when you add it to the system and if you want to customize things later you just click on the [C] button and bring up the configuration dialog box where you can change how the options work, etc. Support for M.E.S.S. and imgtool.exe will be improved greatly to allow for those disturbing -switch changes that seem to keep happening that can otherwise cripple the IDE from using those tools. In Rainbow IDE 2.0, you can choose things like -flop or -flop# (flop0, flop1), etc. to be used in case you use an older or newer version of imgtool.exe. The M.E.S.S. switches can be tweaked as well from a dialog box, letting us keep up with any crippling changes that could possibly be made in the future. I've got a lot of work to do in the logic needed to make the ridiculously-simple scheme I plan to us for doing compiles/assembles/links in of almost any assortment of source files using any compilers, assemblers, or linkers you want as long as they are compatible, ofcourse. That is, for a good build to be made, any team of tools need to support the others. You get the choice to blend these tools how you want for all source files in your projects. 2 compilers and 5 separate assemblers could easily be used to complete that special project you might want to work on. One click of the Go button would build everything just as you expect it to do and even easier than how Rainbow 1.x does it. I still need to locate some kind of 32-bit C compiler or PASCAL compiler that CCASM or one of the other Rainbow 1.x supported assemblers can handle so I can start working on some productive compile/assemble sessions. From theother_bob at yahoo.com Wed Oct 1 08:13:52 2008 From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (theother_bob) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 05:13:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] D(S)ECB Question Message-ID: <691921.46797.qm@web81506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Another issue I had when experimenting with the same problem is that MERGE is extrememly slow loading, due to the ascii format. A file that normally takes about 15-20 seconds to load can take well over a minute as ascii. I would suggest?one of the following:?Make a Random Access data file that would allow you to read in whichever subroutine you want, loading it into a variable. Then use VARPTR to locate your code. Alternatively you could use the sole unused memory block in a 128K CC3 as a RAMDISK. It takes a POKE or two to change a memory block. I swapped the existing?HGET buffer block with the unused block, which effectively doubles the amount of graphics you can have stored, but you're?not relegated to use it for that purpose. You could use this space to store ML code or other?data?just as easily. Either way you would create a separate program to?create the data file(s). Color FOG has working examples of these techniques. The Installation program creates random access data files from DATA statements. Then the main program(s) read the data file to populate string variables instead of using Basic memory to declare variables. Bob www.geocities.com\theother_bob ----- Original Message ---- From: Arthur Flexser To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 11:08:29 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] D(S)ECB Question P.S.? Another consideration with using the MERGE command is that all of your various subprograms would need to be in ASCII format, which takes up a lot more disk space than standard format.? That may well negate the disk storage advantage you'd get from having only one copy of the main program on the disk, in addition to slowing down the loading of subprograms. Art On Mon, 29 Sep 2008, CoCo Mongrel wrote: > Hi CoCo Folk > > I'm working on a rework of an old game in BASIC for the CoCo 3.? I know you > can chain-load one program from another.? What I'd like to do is have a > program that displays a splash screen, preloads some graphics into memory, > takes some input from the player, and then loads up the main program.? But > here's the catch.? I want it to load the main program and one of several > alternate versions of some subroutines, stored separately on disk.? The > different subroutines are different game strategies for the AI opponent. > I'm concerned about running out of BASIC program space if I include all the > alternate subroutines.? I guess I could have separate copies of the program > with each alternate subroutine, but that's too clunky and I need to conserve > disk space as well.? The subs don't have to be loaded by the setup program. > It could just poke a value somewhere and let the main program check that > value and load the appropriate subroutine itself after it gets loaded and > run.? But the point is that I need to be able to load the subroutine without > clearing out the existing main program. > > I seem to have a fuzzy recollection that you can do something like this if > you save one or both programs as ASCII instead of tokenized, or am I making > that up?? Can BASIC be patched so it doesn't clear everything else out? > Needless to say the line numbers of the subroutines would be chosen so that > they don't conflict with the main program. > > cocomongrel > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cocoarch at lomont.org Wed Oct 1 08:26:35 2008 From: cocoarch at lomont.org (Chris Lomont) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:26:35 -0400 Subject: [Coco] 6809 vs 6309 - 6309s for sale In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0809101305x525e68dbhae84a927f825e399@mail.gmail.com> References: <8249c4ac0809101305x525e68dbhae84a927f825e399@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48E36C7B.5000805@lomont.org> Tony Cappellini wrote: > Are there any people using 6309's inside their physical (not virtual) > Coco's? > > Has anyone here tried replacing a 6809 with a 6309 in a device OTHER than a > COCO ? > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > I still have a batch of 6309s for sale (technically HD63C09EPs) which work fine in the CoCo. They're $20 each, which is a lot cheaper than Cloud-9s $31. see http://www.lomont.org/Software/Misc/CoCo/index.php Chris Lomont From mark at cloud9tech.com Wed Oct 1 08:42:28 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:42:28 -0500 Subject: [Coco] 6809 vs 6309 - 6309s for sale In-Reply-To: <48E36C7B.5000805@lomont.org> References: <8249c4ac0809101305x525e68dbhae84a927f825e399@mail.gmail.com> <48E36C7B.5000805@lomont.org> Message-ID: <20081001074228.3hj49l3izkkosoo8@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chris, Actually most purchase the Pro-Tector+ which then takes the uP down to $27, then they buy a spare which then lowers the price down to $24. Anyone that is installing a HD63x09EP, I highly recommend doing what Tandy should have done, buffer the uP. The Pro-Tector+ is a cheap insurance policy with a one time return. So is it a deal? Regards, Mark Cloud-9 Quoting Chris Lomont : > Tony Cappellini wrote: >> Are there any people using 6309's inside their physical (not virtual) >> Coco's? >> >> Has anyone here tried replacing a 6809 with a 6309 in a device OTHER than a >> COCO ? >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > I still have a batch of 6309s for sale (technically HD63C09EPs) which > work fine in the CoCo. They're $20 each, which is a lot cheaper than > Cloud-9s $31. > > see http://www.lomont.org/Software/Misc/CoCo/index.php > > Chris Lomont > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mechacoco at gmail.com Wed Oct 1 10:25:59 2008 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 08:25:59 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow IDE 2.0 in progress In-Reply-To: <48E01BA8.10504@worldnet.att.net> References: <20081001045343.15FEC20A33@qs281.pair.com> <48E01BA8.10504@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <5d802cd0810010725g712c6725gb9d9da0710817670@mail.gmail.com> On 9/28/08, Robert Gault wrote: > Roger Taylor wrote: >> >> I still need to locate some kind of 32-bit C compiler or PASCAL compiler >> that CCASM or one of the other Rainbow 1.x supported assemblers can >> handle so I can start working on some productive compile/assemble >> sessions. >> > > Is there anything in the GNU package that you could use? > http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/ > Much has already been done with that:: From farna at att.net Wed Oct 1 10:38:59 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 10:38:59 -0400 Subject: [Coco] pagetable.com ? Blog Archive ? Bill Gates? Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit BASIC Message-ID: <48E38B83.30708@att.net> Bill Gates optimize code? CoCo BASIC is as optimized as Windows!! -------------- Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 15:21:44 -0700 From: Mike Pepe Wow, that is a cool find! Makes me wonder how optimized the CoCo basic actually was, or if it was just ported over from the existing codebase. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From leonard23 at verizon.net Wed Oct 1 11:00:45 2008 From: leonard23 at verizon.net (Leonard Miller) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 11:00:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HDISK In-Reply-To: <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> References: <1222293575.9706.17.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <16787F63-1EA8-431F-9BFC-04910A58E2EF@tee-boy.com> <1222345156.22665.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <85570F6F-10BB-472C-BDFD-0892FA4343A2@tee-boy.com> <1222347132.22665.33.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222349225.22665.51.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E0EAB8.5000603@concentric.net> <1222700971.17445.22.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <01e201c9224a$b995db20$2cc19160$@com> <1222706006.17445.41.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <022201c92286$20b9cf60$622d6e20$@com> <1222732933.17445.79.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E1A739.5010302@gmail.com> <1222817839.17445.91.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <002601c923d6$7b975aa0$72c60fe0$@net> Do I have this correct, that I can purchase HDISK from you, then install the boot rom in my B&B controller to boot directly from an ide drive? You now have my undivided attention! Do you have a site with more information like what kind of cables I need? I'm excited again! Leonard -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Youse Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 07:38 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] HDISK On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 19:37 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > The HDISK is the one that's ready to go now, and it can be yours (with a > boot ROM, meaning you can boot OS-9 right off the hard disk) for the > amazing price of $69 + shipping/handling! What a steal! It's $59 > without the ROM (2764-compatible, feel free to supply your own, the ROM > code will be free for your use). I can even supply the IDE drives and > cables, external enclosures, with NitrOS-9 installed and bootable, for > an additional fee. > > Crazy Eddie's... it's iiiinnnsaaaaannne. > > Drop me a line off-list if you're serious about getting one. > > C. Sorry guys, I forgot to include the meta-tags. C. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From keeper63 at cox.net Wed Oct 1 11:23:15 2008 From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:23:15 -0700 Subject: [Coco] 6809 vs 6309 - 6309s for sale (Mark Marlette) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48E395E3.5000504@cox.net> Mark, I bought a 6309 off of you a long while back, but didn't buy the ProTector. I still haven't installed it, I figured I would buy the ProTector once you had the SuperIDE finished. In the meantime, one of these days I will probably buy a DriveWire (if between now and then the SuperIDE doesn't make it out). -- Andrew L. Ayers, Glendale, Arizona From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Oct 1 12:44:24 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 12:44:24 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HDISK In-Reply-To: <002601c923d6$7b975aa0$72c60fe0$@net> References: <1222293575.9706.17.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <16787F63-1EA8-431F-9BFC-04910A58E2EF@tee-boy.com> <1222345156.22665.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <85570F6F-10BB-472C-BDFD-0892FA4343A2@tee-boy.com> <1222347132.22665.33.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222349225.22665.51.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E0EAB8.5000603@concentric.net> <1222700971.17445.22.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <01e201c9224a$b995db20$2cc19160$@com> <1222706006.17445.41.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <022201c92286$20b9cf60$622d6e20$@com> <1222732933.17445.79.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E1A739.5010302@gmail.com> <1222817839.17445.91.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <002601c923d6$7b975aa0$72c60fe0$@net> Message-ID: <7C7BF505-E815-47A1-9A4C-75AF96D87791@serialtechnologies.com> On Oct 1, 2008, at 11:00 AM, Leonard Miller wrote: > Do I have this correct, that I can purchase HDISK from you, then > install the > boot rom in my B&B controller to boot directly from an ide drive? > You now > have my undivided attention! Do you have a site with more > information like > what kind of cables I need? > > I'm excited again! > > Leonard > The site will be going up tonight -- I am compiling all the documentation and rounding off the edges. As to installing the boot ROM in your B&B controller - I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at - the ROM goes in the HDISK controller, and boots IDE drives attached to it. If you have a multi- pak and you want to use the B&B and the HDISK and boot off the the HDISK, just power on the multi-pak with the HDISK slot selected, it's that simple! :) C. From tlindner at macmess.org Wed Oct 1 15:34:15 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 12:34:15 -0700 Subject: [Coco] pagetable.com ? Blog Archive ? Bill Gates? Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit BASIC In-Reply-To: <48E38B83.30708@att.net> References: <48E38B83.30708@att.net> Message-ID: <5b0704c10810011234i3aaa8d95qd728b9e30d9e2bf@mail.gmail.com> I've been reading the past blog entries and am very impressed with all of content on that website. A lot on x86 assembly, but overall very interesting reading. -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org From coconut at pritchard.ca Wed Oct 1 16:59:22 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 15:59:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] HDISK In-Reply-To: <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> References: <1222293575.9706.17.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E0EAB8.5000603@concentric.net> <1222700971.17445.22.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <01e201c9224a$b995db20$2cc19160$@com> <1222706006.17445.41.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <022201c92286$20b9cf60$622d6e20$@com> <1222732933.17445.79.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E1A739.5010302@gmail.com> <1222817839.17445.91.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <1806abd60810011359s72d9ea0du3760b3460db61fe8@mail.gmail.com> How about trades? Like say a GMX 3-Port Intelligent Serial Card for an HDISK controller with ROM. =:vD Or something along those lines. Something I am toying with is maybe you making (me haking) a version of your SSP with one RS-232 DB9 or DB25 and replacing one set of the RS-232 line drivers and the other DB connector with a USB to UART chip and USB B Type connector, so that people with no serial ports can use the adapter to connect to a modern computer. For instance the USB to UART chips located at https://www.silabs.com/products/interface/usbtouart/Pages/default.aspx ( I just got a free sample of the CP2102 and the CP2103 chips via Fedex this week). The CP2102 chip cost is just $3.66 for 1+, $3.15 for 25+, $2.78 for 50+ and $2.57 for 100+. But I warn you it is a small QFN 5mm x 5mm ship with a .5mm pitch for the pins. Just a thought! On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 6:38 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 19:37 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > The HDISK is the one that's ready to go now, and it can be yours (with a > > boot ROM, meaning you can boot OS-9 right off the hard disk) for the > > amazing price of $69 + shipping/handling! What a steal! It's $59 > > without the ROM (2764-compatible, feel free to supply your own, the ROM > > code will be free for your use). I can even supply the IDE drives and > > cables, external enclosures, with NitrOS-9 installed and bootable, for > > an additional fee. > > > > Crazy Eddie's... it's iiiinnnsaaaaannne. > > > > Drop me a line off-list if you're serious about getting one. > > > > C. > > Sorry guys, I forgot to include the meta-tags. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From RJRTTY at aol.com Wed Oct 1 17:00:14 2008 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 17:00:14 EDT Subject: [Coco] pagetable.com ? Blog Archive ? Bill Gates? Personal Easter Eggs in... Message-ID: In a message dated 10/1/2008 10:37:25 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, farna at att.net writes: Bill Gates optimize code? CoCo BASIC is as optimized as Windows!! LOL! Don't be too upset. At least Coco basic doesn't require activation. I don't think.... :) Roy **************Looking for simple solutions to your real-life financial challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and information, tips and calculators. (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001) From brucewcalkins at charter.net Wed Oct 1 18:55:33 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 18:55:33 -0400 Subject: [Coco] pagetable.com ? Blog Archive ? Bill Gates? PersonalEaster Eggs in... References: Message-ID: <8558956B480B4B7389F0D000D189EF41@speedy> > LOL! Don't be too upset. At least Coco basic doesn't require > activation. > I don't think.... :) > > Roy Yes it does, you have to plug the computer in and turn it on. ;) Bruce W. From nickma at optusnet.com.au Wed Oct 1 20:16:53 2008 From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (nickma at optusnet.com.au) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 10:16:53 +1000 Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Prototype - Reverse Engineered Message-ID: <200810020016.m920Gr5V024990@mail04.syd.optusnet.com.au> An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available Url: From nutz4coco at gmail.com Wed Oct 1 20:57:34 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 17:57:34 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. Message-ID: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives over 1G. Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ From nutz4coco at gmail.com Wed Oct 1 20:59:51 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 17:59:51 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Older RAM. Message-ID: <889830d00810011759h7e2413f1s1ff5dbd55b392229@mail.gmail.com> A while back I offered up some older RAM and someone I believe from New Mexico wanted them, but I cannot find their email or remember their name. If that person still wants them, then please drop me a line. Thanks! -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ From mark at cloud9tech.com Wed Oct 1 22:21:39 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 21:21:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] 6809 vs 6309 - 6309s for sale (Mark Marlette) In-Reply-To: <48E395E3.5000504@cox.net> References: <48E395E3.5000504@cox.net> Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.2.20081001212026.029f8c58@cloud9tech.com> Andrew, The SuperIDE has been out since At 2004. Regards, Mark 10/1/2008 10:23 AM, you wrote: >Mark, > >I bought a 6309 off of you a long while back, but didn't buy the >ProTector. I still haven't installed it, I figured I would buy the >ProTector once you had the SuperIDE finished. In the meantime, one >of these days I will probably buy a DriveWire (if between now and >then the SuperIDE doesn't make it out). > >-- Andrew L. Ayers, Glendale, Arizona > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1702 - Release Date: >10/1/2008 9:05 AM From coconut at pritchard.ca Wed Oct 1 22:39:45 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 21:39:45 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <81094F38-D3D7-412A-80AB-E274654F8E00@pritchard.ca> The working ones! ;P Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies On 1-Oct-08, at 7:57 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives > over 1G. > > Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From leonard23 at verizon.net Wed Oct 1 22:43:51 2008 From: leonard23 at verizon.net (Leonard Miller) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:43:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HDISK In-Reply-To: <7C7BF505-E815-47A1-9A4C-75AF96D87791@serialtechnologies.com> References: <1222293575.9706.17.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <16787F63-1EA8-431F-9BFC-04910A58E2EF@tee-boy.com> <1222345156.22665.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <85570F6F-10BB-472C-BDFD-0892FA4343A2@tee-boy.com> <1222347132.22665.33.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222349225.22665.51.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E0EAB8.5000603@concentric.net> <1222700971.17445.22.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <01e201c9224a$b995db20$2cc19160$@com> <1222706006.17445.41.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <022201c92286$20b9cf60$622d6e20$@com> <1222732933.17445.79.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48E1A739.5010302@gmail.com> <1222817839.17445.91.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <1222817887.17445.92.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <002601c923d6$7b975aa0$72c60fe0$@net> <7C7BF505-E815-47A1-9A4C-75AF96D87791@serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <001a01c92438$b4954620$1dbfd260$@net> I'm sorry, I misunderstood. That's still a heck of deal for the money! Maybe I'll purchase one to use while I'm waiting for the Superboard. Is there an option for a real time clock? Leonard -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Youse Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2008 12:44 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] HDISK On Oct 1, 2008, at 11:00 AM, Leonard Miller wrote: > Do I have this correct, that I can purchase HDISK from you, then > install the > boot rom in my B&B controller to boot directly from an ide drive? > You now > have my undivided attention! Do you have a site with more > information like > what kind of cables I need? > > I'm excited again! > > Leonard > The site will be going up tonight -- I am compiling all the documentation and rounding off the edges. As to installing the boot ROM in your B&B controller - I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at - the ROM goes in the HDISK controller, and boots IDE drives attached to it. If you have a multi- pak and you want to use the B&B and the HDISK and boot off the the HDISK, just power on the multi-pak with the HDISK slot selected, it's that simple! :) C. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From badfrog at gmail.com Wed Oct 1 23:01:05 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 22:01:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810012001n61f14bf2y6a088f793780a0c5@mail.gmail.com> ..."Older" drives under 1G... I remember my first 1G IDE drive... In 1997... I think even drives under 100 gig are 'old' now! Bridging to my other hobby, related to secure data destruction: A .223 rifle bullet through a 3.5" hard drive looks REALLY cool if you get it through the platters and the case. Nice multiple eruptions of metal! On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 7:57 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives over 1G. > > Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From tlindner at macmess.org Thu Oct 2 00:20:43 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 21:20:43 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Recent changes to the CoCoMag Website Message-ID: <1io5gs9.z1no4u1cbd35jM%tlindner@macmess.org> (Quickly: I run the CoCoMag website . It is a distributed magazine digitization project. Where volunteers turn Color Computer Magazines scans into searchable text. Tasks are easy and quick. Make it you default web page! A task-a-day is all I ask.) There are some lingering issues I'd like to bring up with the community. The final product of this project discards some textual information. Like bold, italics and other formatting. Also hyphenation between green boxes are difficult to correct. Correctly formatting listings is difficult. Figures, illustrations, and photos are completely eliminated. I have always considered having the orginal scans near the final product to be a solution to these problems, but have come to the conclusion it is not. I've discussed this with Allen Huffman and he has agreed to allow me to push each issue into the coco25.com wiki when completed. The MediaWiki software has really good editing and mark-up tools to allow the correction of all of the above deficiencies. Comments? Also, here are some recent and not-so-recent changes to the software: * Pane slider when checking OCR text or listings. When you are checking text or listing OCR, you'll see a grey bar splitting the two sections. If you have Javascript turned on you can drag this bar left or right to change the size of the edit text form field. * Attach a name to the tasks you complete. Click the link on the main page to "Register" with the project. Here you can enter in a handle that will be associated with each completed task. There is a leader board on the main page which lists three days of completed tasks. * Image reprocessing In the "Report a problem" form, there is a new link to reprocess an image. There you can change the rotation, blur and denoise settings. I've had some problems with browser image cacheing. So you may have to refresh the web page to see the reprocessed image. -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Oct 2 01:24:39 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 01:24:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810012001n61f14bf2y6a088f793780a0c5@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> <9efa17da0810012001n61f14bf2y6a088f793780a0c5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1222925079.25825.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 22:01 -0500, Sean wrote: > ..."Older" drives under 1G... > I remember my first 1G IDE drive... In 1997... > I think even drives under 100 gig are 'old' now! > > Bridging to my other hobby, related to secure data destruction: A > .223 rifle bullet through a 3.5" hard drive looks REALLY cool if you > get it through the platters and the case. Nice multiple eruptions of > metal! *grins* When I was a teenager, I worked for Tandy during the 540MB barrier breach. Had to install special software that would load on start that would intercept BIOS calls on PCs to allow access to > 1024 cylinders... can't for the life of me remember what Western Digital shipped with ... C. From flexser at fiu.edu Thu Oct 2 03:05:35 2008 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 03:05:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BColor_Computer=5D__pagetable=2Ecom_=BB_B?= =?iso-8859-1?q?log_Archive_=BB_Bill_Gates=92_Personal_Easter_Eggs_in_8_Bi?= =?iso-8859-1?q?t?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All CoCo commands are tokenized to a single byte. (Functions, to distinguish them from commands, use two bytes.) This excludes commands like SAVEM, in which the "M" essentially acts as an argument to the SAVE command, which is efficient for saving ROM space and adds negligibly to execution time. Art On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. > That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. > They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two > bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte > tokens but not all do. > From jimcox at miba51.com Thu Oct 2 08:22:04 2008 From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 05:22:04 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810011757l7b84627dha01d338aa34efa1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6c92f46c0810020522p7e1f2860qdf0c201c0800d18a@mail.gmail.com> I guess that I was wrong about the SuperIDE. From what a few friends have told me Basic will only handle 128M comprised of virtual disks, while NitrOS will handle more. Anyone care to elaborate? -Jim Cox On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives over 1G. > > Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From coconut at pritchard.ca Thu Oct 2 09:38:38 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 08:38:38 -0500 Subject: [Coco] OT: GIMIX system related documentation update. In-Reply-To: <2A88C668-B916-43DF-9AAD-4D653ED171E8@pritchard.ca> References: <2A88C668-B916-43DF-9AAD-4D653ED171E8@pritchard.ca> Message-ID: <1806abd60810020638l63eaf223v84aa20f71ca53644@mail.gmail.com> It seems these documents are now available under CoCo and newly-received. Enjoy! On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 8:31 PM, Ryan Pritchard wrote: > Hi everyone, > > There is this site called maltedmedia.com. I wonder how long it will take > for the following files to get moved from the incoming folder to a more > permanent home? Or if they will even be accepted ;). > > 120MB total size for all files, a result of using Apple Preview to move and > add pages. When I use that application to compress the file it loses > clarity. So I just let it go at it's default setting. The original scans > were smaller, but that was using an IBM / Lexmark MFP Scanner. > > Anyway the list of files is smaller than my previous post because I took > the time to review the duplicates, keeping only one good copy. > > Scanned GIMIX GHOST related documentation: > ===================================== > 6800-6809 Mother Board - Baud Rate Generator - Power Supply > Information.pdf > BASIC09 Programming Language Reference Manual - REV H.pdf > CRC Generator Board for OS-9 GMX III - User's Manual - REV Preliminary.pdf > FLEX Programmer's Manual.pdf > FLEX User's Manual.pdf > GIMIX 64K Byte NMOS Static RAM Board for the SS-50 + SS-50C bus - REV A.pdf > GIMIX Serial IO Processor Firmware For OS-9 - Version Identification - REV > A.pdf > GIMIX Warranty.pdf > GMX 256K Byte Static RAM Board - User's Manual - REV B.pdf > GMX 6809 CPU III Microprocessor Board - User's Manual - partial copy but > has some annotatons.pdf > GMX 6809 CPU III Microprocessor Board - User's Manual.pdf > GMX DMA III - Double Density Floppy Disk Controller - User's Manual.pdf > GMX DMA SASI Interface Board - User's Manual - REV A.pdf > GMX Intelligent 3-Port RS-232 Serial IO Interface - User's Manual - REV > Preliminary.pdf > GMX Intelligent 3-Port RS-232 Serial IO Interface - Version II - User's > Manual.pdf > GMX Intelligent 3-Port Serial IO Firmware Ver. 2 - User's Manual - REV > B.pdf > GMX Intelligent 3-Port Serial Interface OS-9 Software Version 1.0.pdf > GMX Intelligent 4-Port RS-232 Serial IO Interface - User's Manual.pdf > GMX Intelligent 4-Port Serial IO Processor Firmware Ver.2 - User's > Manual.pdf > GMX Power Supply Information.pdf > GMX Two Port RS-232C Serial Interface Board - User's Manual.pdf > Motorola MC14411 Bit Rate Generator.pdf > O-FLEX - FLEX Operating System for OS-9 Level II - User's Manual.pdf > OS-9 Editor - Assembler - Debugger Manual.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Manual Addenda - Version 1.1 10-MAY-1983 - REV C.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Manual Addenda - Version 1.2 14-SEP-1983 - REV E.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Manual Addenda - Version 1.2 14-SEP-1983 - REV F.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Manual Addenda - Version 1.2 14-SEP-1983 - REV J.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Support ROM - User's Manual - REV B.pdf > OS-9 GMX III Support ROM - User's Manual - REV C.pdf > OS-9 OPERATING SYSTEM - System Programmer's Manual - REV H.pdf > OS-9 OPERATING SYSTEM - User's Manual - REV H.pdf > Reading and Writing Color Computer OS-9 Disks on GIMIX OS-9 Systems - REV > B.pdf > SS-50C Motherboard and Baud Rate Generator - User's Manual.pdf > Specification for model OMTI 20C-1 Intelligent Controller for 5.25 inch > Winchester Drives.pdf > System Configuration Information - REV C.pdf > System Configuration Information - REV D.pdf > TEAC FD-55D - Mini Flexible Disk Drive Specification.pdf > Universal 2-Port Parrallel Interface Board - User's Manual - REV A.pdf > VERTEX V100 Series OEM Maintenance Manual.pdf > > Regards, > > Ryan Pritchard > Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies > > > > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 10:13:23 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 09:13:23 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed Message-ID: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> Looking for some help with jumper settings..... I am in the process of setting up a Win98se box for running Coco emulator and Xching files. Works OK for transfer using 720K media with the built-in floppy, but I want 360K (5") also. So I added a Mitsubishi M4853 (not the dash 1). Neither DOS or Win see the drive! After beating my head against the wall for a bit, I found that DOS claims the drive is "Not Ready". (Win silently fails - OF COURSE). Hmmmmm. Jumper change needed! None of the many jumpers seem to have labels that relate to RDY, READY, on anything similar . Several hours of Google produced nothing of value So, I am asking the group if anyone has a listing of the jumper settings for this drive..? Or a URL to a page with the settings???? A URL to the manual for the drive??? Anything with the jumpers would be helpful. Really not wanting to trace the schematic of the PCB!! thank you, johnd From coconut at pritchard.ca Thu Oct 2 10:40:11 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:40:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> Did you make sure to add the drive in the BIOS settings? Have you searched Google (or other search site) for Mitsubishi M4853 jumper settings? On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 9:13 AM, LinuxRules wrote: > > Looking for some help with jumper settings..... > > I am in the process of setting up a Win98se box for running > Coco emulator and Xching files. Works OK for transfer > using 720K media with the built-in floppy, but I want > 360K (5") also. > > So I added a Mitsubishi M4853 (not the dash 1). Neither > DOS or Win see the drive! After beating my head against > the wall for a bit, I found that DOS claims the drive is > "Not Ready". (Win silently fails - OF COURSE). > Hmmmmm. Jumper change needed! > > None of the many jumpers seem to have labels that relate > to RDY, READY, on anything similar . Several hours > of Google produced nothing of value So, I am asking > the group if anyone has a listing of the jumper settings > for this drive..? Or a URL to a page with the settings???? > A URL to the manual for the drive??? Anything with > the jumpers would be helpful. > > Really not wanting to trace the schematic of the PCB!! > > thank you, > johnd > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From coconut at pritchard.ca Thu Oct 2 10:43:17 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1806abd60810020743m3db0f2dawba1ad6d13bdba9e2@mail.gmail.com> First hit for that search I recommended shows a site that makes reference to the drive, how big the manual is and there is an ordering page. I think it is $0.20/page for the photo copies. http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/s_drives.html On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 9:40 AM, Ryan Pritchard wrote: > Did you make sure to add the drive in the BIOS settings? Have you searched > Google (or other search site) for Mitsubishi M4853 jumper settings? > > > On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 9:13 AM, LinuxRules wrote: > >> >> Looking for some help with jumper settings..... >> >> I am in the process of setting up a Win98se box for running >> Coco emulator and Xching files. Works OK for transfer >> using 720K media with the built-in floppy, but I want >> 360K (5") also. >> >> So I added a Mitsubishi M4853 (not the dash 1). Neither >> DOS or Win see the drive! After beating my head against >> the wall for a bit, I found that DOS claims the drive is >> "Not Ready". (Win silently fails - OF COURSE). >> Hmmmmm. Jumper change needed! >> >> None of the many jumpers seem to have labels that relate >> to RDY, READY, on anything similar . Several hours >> of Google produced nothing of value So, I am asking >> the group if anyone has a listing of the jumper settings >> for this drive..? Or a URL to a page with the settings???? >> A URL to the manual for the drive??? Anything with >> the jumpers would be helpful. >> >> Really not wanting to trace the schematic of the PCB!! >> >> thank you, >> johnd >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > > -- > Regards, > > Ryan Pritchard > Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From rbihler at msn.com Thu Oct 2 10:48:56 2008 From: rbihler at msn.com (RON BIHLER) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 08:48:56 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: First thing that comes to mind, PC's use cable select (Twisted wires). Depending the connector changes the drive number. Second they also want the drive to be jumpered for D1 and not Drive D0. Good luck. Ron> Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:13:23 -0500> From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com> To: coco at maltedmedia.com> Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed> > > Looking for some help with jumper settings.....> > I am in the process of setting up a Win98se box for running> Coco emulator and Xching files. Works OK for transfer> using 720K media with the built-in floppy, but I want> 360K (5") also.> > So I added a Mitsubishi M4853 (not the dash 1). Neither> DOS or Win see the drive! After beating my head against> the wall for a bit, I found that DOS claims the drive is> "Not Ready". (Win silently fails - OF COURSE).> Hmmmmm. Jumper change needed!> > None of the many jumpers seem to have labels that relate> to RDY, READY, on anything similar . Several hours> of Google produced nothing of value So, I am asking> the group if anyone has a listing of the jumper settings> for this drive..? Or a URL to a page with the settings????> A URL to the manual for the drive??? Anything with> the jumpers would be helpful.> > Really not wanting to trace the schematic of the PCB!!> > thank you,> johnd> > > > --> Coco mailing list> Coco at maltedmedia.com> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From dml_68 at yahoo.com Thu Oct 2 11:20:35 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 08:20:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Armchair Arcade Chronicles the COCO Game Seventh Link Message-ID: <548344.21659.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Stu over at his web site Armchair Arcade has started his journey into the game Seventh Link for the coco 3. http://armchairarcade.com/neo/node/2004 ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 13:24:35 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:24:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48E503D3.1070907@austin.rr.com> Ryan Pritchard wrote: > Did you make sure to add the drive in the BIOS settings? Absolutely > Have you searched > Google (or other search site) for Mitsubishi M4853 jumper settings? > > As I said............ From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 13:26:45 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:26:45 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <1806abd60810020743m3db0f2dawba1ad6d13bdba9e2@mail.gmail.com> References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> <1806abd60810020740r2763b8e6r14b0d9efa8b1c0b6@mail.gmail.com> <1806abd60810020743m3db0f2dawba1ad6d13bdba9e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48E50455.3000605@austin.rr.com> Ryan Pritchard wrote: > First hit for that search I recommended shows a site that makes reference to > the drive, how big the manual is and there is an ordering page. I think it > is $0.20/page for the photo copies. > > http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/s_drives.html > > Thanks. If I find nothing else, I'll contact him and see if the jumpers setting are in one of his documents (there seem to be several). cheers, johnd From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 13:29:33 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:29:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: References: <48E4D703.6010605@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <48E504FD.8050609@austin.rr.com> RON BIHLER wrote: > First thing that comes to mind, PC's use cable select (Twisted wires). Depending the connector changes the drive number. > Second they also want the drive to be jumpered for D1 and not Drive D0. > > > Yep! First thing I checked. PC actually selects the drive correctly (watch the LED select lite) but prints "NOT READY" message. cheers, johnd From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 2 17:58:58 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:58:58 GMT Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed Message-ID: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> >-----Original Message----- >From: LinuxRules Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com >Sent 10/2/2008 1:29:33 PM >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com >Subject: Re: [Coco] Jumper settings needed > >RON BIHLER wrote: > First thing that comes to mind, PC's use cable select (Twisted wires). Depending the connector changes >the drive number. > Second they also want the drive to be jumpered for D1 and not Drive D0. > >Yep! First thing I checked. >PC actually selects the drive correctly (watch the LED select lite) but >prints "NOT READY" message. > I don't how much of a difference it makes, and maybe I have my models mixed up, and I can check when I get home, but I thought the M4853 was a DS/QD 80T 96TPI 720kb FDD? I believe the M4851 is the 360kb DS/DD 40T 48tpi The M4853 is what was used in the Tandy 2000's Wouldn't you have to set it up in the PC's BIOS as a 720kb FDD? It is the exact same geometry as a 3.5" 720KB floppy, and that is how I set it up in my PC for doing imaging Tony From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 2 18:39:31 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 22:39:31 GMT Subject: [Coco] CoCo2 Composite Video Out board Message-ID: <200810021839995.SM06732@[63.69.23.239]> Anyone have one of these available? I know I had one in a CoCo2 years ago... Tony From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 18:51:51 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 17:51:51 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com> tonym wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: LinuxRules Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com >> Sent 10/2/2008 1:29:33 PM >> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Jumper settings needed >> >> RON BIHLER wrote: >> First thing that comes to mind, PC's use cable select (Twisted wires). Depending the connector changes >the drive number. >> Second they also want the drive to be jumpered for D1 and not Drive D0. >> >> Yep! First thing I checked. >> PC actually selects the drive correctly (watch the LED select lite) but >> prints "NOT READY" message. >> >> > > I don't how much of a difference it makes, and maybe I have my models mixed up, and I can check when I get home, but I thought the M4853 was a DS/QD 80T 96TPI 720kb FDD? I believe the M4851 is the 360kb DS/DD 40T 48tpi > > The M4853 is what was used in the Tandy 2000's > > Wouldn't you have to set it up in the PC's BIOS as a 720kb FDD? It is the exact same geometry as a > 3.5" 720KB floppy, and that is how I set it up in my PC for doing imaging > > Tony Would the geometry setup cause it to select the drive, but see it as Not Ready? I was thinking that incorrect geometry setup would simply make it unreadable. When I setup Drive-A incorrectly in BIOS, that is what happens. I.E. It is still found to be "Ready", but the media cannot be read.......... Since last post, I found that Linux LiveCD also fails to mount the drive. Sure seems to be a hardware issue.....??.... Aging brain cells don't work well, but I seem to remember that back in the "Old Days", floppy drives could be jumpered to provide "Ready" based on things like Head Loaded, Drive Selected, and/or Motor On, etc. I am suspicious that something like that is going on.......... Wish I could remember more! cheers, johnd > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Oct 2 19:14:13 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 19:14:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks Message-ID: <1222989253.19533.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Does anyone know if these are supposed to work? I get all sorts of problems trying to use cobbler on my hard disk. It appears to build the OS9Boot file properly, but then craps out with a read error - I wonder if it's miscalculating and trying to read non-existent sectors. Also, is OS9Gen's default behavior to write a boot track, or does that only happen when the -t option is specified? Thanks, C. From devries.bob at gmail.com Thu Oct 2 19:52:57 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 09:52:57 +1000 Subject: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks References: <1222989253.19533.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <00b401c924ea$1145bce0$0701a8c0@master> To the best of my knowledge, the stock COBBLER is not supposed to be used on a hard disk. It is in fact hard coded to write the boot loader/kernel to track 34 of the floppy. Burke & Burke created a special programme for their hard disk adapter which created a kernel on track 128 of the hard disk, but I don't know of any others that allow this. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" To: Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 9:14 AM Subject: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks > Does anyone know if these are supposed to work? I get all sorts of > problems trying to use cobbler on my hard disk. It appears to build the > OS9Boot file properly, but then craps out with a read error - I wonder > if it's miscalculating and trying to read non-existent sectors. > > Also, is OS9Gen's default behavior to write a boot track, or does that > only happen when the -t option is specified? > > Thanks, > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 2 20:35:16 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 20:35:16 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 6:51 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Jumper settings needed > tonym wrote: >>> -----Original Message----- >> I don't how much of a difference it makes, and maybe I have my models >> mixed up, and I can check when I get home, but I thought the M4853 was a >> DS/QD 80T 96TPI 720kb FDD? I believe the M4851 is the 360kb DS/DD 40T >> 48tpi >> >> The M4853 is what was used in the Tandy 2000's >> >> Wouldn't you have to set it up in the PC's BIOS as a 720kb FDD? It is the >> exact same geometry as a >> 3.5" 720KB floppy, and that is how I set it up in my PC for doing imaging >> >> Tony > Would the geometry setup cause it to select the drive, but see it as Not > Ready? > I was thinking that incorrect geometry setup would simply make it > unreadable. > When I setup Drive-A incorrectly in BIOS, that is what happens. > I.E. It is still found to be "Ready", but the media cannot be > read.......... > > Since last post, I found that Linux LiveCD also fails to mount the drive. > Sure seems to be a hardware issue.....??.... > > Aging brain cells don't work well, but I seem to remember that back in > the "Old Days", floppy drives could be jumpered to provide "Ready" > based on things like Head Loaded, Drive Selected, and/or Motor On, > etc. I am suspicious that something like that is going on.......... > I have a Revision L and Revision U M4853 in front of me. I KNOW I used my Rev U in a PC, as it still has a diskette inside labelled "MS-DOS." On the jumper set near the FDC connector, DS1 is jumpered, and HM is jumpered. Going rear (nearest connector) to front (towards front of drive) using binary: 01000010 1 being jumpered. Mine also happens to have the term jumpers inserted, whic is about 1 inch away from edge, about 2 inches in from the FDC connector. Rev U and Rev L are VASTLY different on other jumpers, ie, not the jumper header where DS is selected. Tony From johnguin at hotmail.com Thu Oct 2 20:35:38 2008 From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:38 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Recent changes to the CoCoMag Website In-Reply-To: <1io5gs9.z1no4u1cbd35jM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1io5gs9.z1no4u1cbd35jM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: Hello Tim, Regarding the move to the coco25 wiki, I'm a little unclear after reading your message whether this is the final site to host the scanned magazines (this is what I assume), or if this only a location to move the editing tasks. Or is it both? Also, could you copy/move a few pages over there so we can compare the current behavior to the new? I have a hard time visualizing the change in behavior. I've used the current system enough to understand its limitations, but would like to see the new system "in action" to get a feel for how much better it is. I like to think I've gotten relatively efficient with the current process and want to see what the changes would be. Lastly, thanks for taking on this project and breaking the work into small, manageable tasks! John Guin -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of tim lindner Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2008 9:21 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] Recent changes to the CoCoMag Website (Quickly: I run the CoCoMag website . It is a distributed magazine digitization project. Where volunteers turn Color Computer Magazines scans into searchable text. Tasks are easy and quick. Make it you default web page! A task-a-day is all I ask.) There are some lingering issues I'd like to bring up with the community. The final product of this project discards some textual information. Like bold, italics and other formatting. Also hyphenation between green boxes are difficult to correct. Correctly formatting listings is difficult. Figures, illustrations, and photos are completely eliminated. I have always considered having the orginal scans near the final product to be a solution to these problems, but have come to the conclusion it is not. I've discussed this with Allen Huffman and he has agreed to allow me to push each issue into the coco25.com wiki when completed. The MediaWiki software has really good editing and mark-up tools to allow the correction of all of the above deficiencies. Comments? Also, here are some recent and not-so-recent changes to the software: * Pane slider when checking OCR text or listings. When you are checking text or listing OCR, you'll see a grey bar splitting the two sections. If you have Javascript turned on you can drag this bar left or right to change the size of the edit text form field. * Attach a name to the tasks you complete. Click the link on the main page to "Register" with the project. Here you can enter in a handle that will be associated with each completed task. There is a leader board on the main page which lists three days of completed tasks. * Image reprocessing In the "Report a problem" form, there is a new link to reprocess an image. There you can change the rotation, blur and denoise settings. I've had some problems with browser image cacheing. So you may have to refresh the web page to see the reprocessed image. -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From johnguin at hotmail.com Thu Oct 2 20:37:50 2008 From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:37:50 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Art, Is this tokenization to one byte the functionality that provides "shortcuts" like typing "?" for "PRINT" ? I've always wondered why that one command had such a shortcut. Just curious, John -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Arthur Flexser Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 12:06 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit All CoCo commands are tokenized to a single byte. (Functions, to distinguish them from commands, use two bytes.) This excludes commands like SAVEM, in which the "M" essentially acts as an argument to the SAVE command, which is efficient for saving ROM space and adds negligibly to execution time. Art On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. > That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. > They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two > bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte > tokens but not all do. > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Thu Oct 2 21:12:16 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:12:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed In-Reply-To: <001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com> <001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <48E57170.2050200@austin.rr.com> Tony wrote: > > > I have a Revision L and Revision U M4853 in front of me. > I KNOW I used my Rev U in a PC, as it still has a diskette inside > labelled "MS-DOS." > > On the jumper set near the FDC connector, DS1 is jumpered, and HM is > jumpered. > Going rear (nearest connector) to front (towards front of drive) using > binary: > 01000010 1 being jumpered. > > Mine also happens to have the term jumpers inserted, whic is about 1 > inch away from edge, > about 2 inches in from the FDC connector. > > Rev U and Rev L are VASTLY different on other jumpers, ie, not the > jumper header where DS is > selected. > > Tony > I appreciate all the help Tony! Checking my drive, it's a Rev C. Early one, I guess. It has 7 positions, not 8, for the option block near the connector. The good news is that there is one labeled HM, so I set the jumpers to HM - was DS - and DS1 - where it already was. The bad news is that produced no change. Arrggg.! Well, actually, it did make one change - the head started pounding up & down a dozen or so times as the PC tried to identify the drive. But, no change in the "Not Ready" problem. I also used your suggestion of setting BIOS to 720K, but that also produced no improvement. Guess I gonna have to order the manual(s) from "herb's stuff" web site. Unfortunately that seems to be a slow process as you have to Xchng email with him to select the right manual and get a quote, then send snailmail with a check and he mails the manuals. Most likely has to wait for check clearing also. Ah well, if you gotta, you gotta........ As a side note, my search for M4853 returned dozens of replys (no jumper data) and about 2 dozen claimed that it is a 360K drive. One claimed 400K (vote for 360!). One claimed 0.72Mb. One claimed 80trk, 720Kb. And one claimed 96tpi, 720Kb. Dern, now I don't know for sure ?WHAT? I have... Possibly the difference between M4853 and M4853-1 could perhaps be the track density....48tpi vs 96tpi?? Confusion reigns. cheers & thanks again, johnd From brucewcalkins at charter.net Thu Oct 2 21:36:52 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 21:36:52 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com><001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <48E57170.2050200@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: > As a side note, my search for M4853 returned dozens of replys > (no jumper data) and about 2 dozen claimed that it is a 360K > drive. One claimed 400K (vote for 360!). One claimed 0.72Mb. > One claimed 80trk, 720Kb. And one claimed 96tpi, 720Kb. > Dern, now I don't know for sure ?WHAT? I have... > Possibly the difference between M4853 and M4853-1 could > perhaps be the track density....48tpi vs 96tpi?? > > Confusion reigns. > > cheers & thanks again, > johnd >From TechRef, First Edition by Thomas J Glover and Millie M. Young (c) 1996; Under the Mitsubishi section of the floppy drive chapter; 4853 = 5.25", half height, 720kb, DSQD FWIW; 4851 = 5.25", Half height, 360kb, DSDD 4852 = 5.25", Full height, 720kb, DSQD 4854 = 5.25", Half height, 1.2Mb, DSQD Bruce W. From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 2 22:06:21 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 22:06:21 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com><001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <48E57170.2050200@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <002a01c924fc$a203db10$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Jumper settings needed > Tony wrote: >> >> >> I have a Revision L and Revision U M4853 in front of me. >> I KNOW I used my Rev U in a PC, as it still has a diskette inside >> labelled "MS-DOS." >> >> On the jumper set near the FDC connector, DS1 is jumpered, and HM is >> jumpered. >> Going rear (nearest connector) to front (towards front of drive) using >> binary: >> 01000010 1 being jumpered. >> >> Mine also happens to have the term jumpers inserted, whic is about 1 inch >> away from edge, >> about 2 inches in from the FDC connector. >> >> Rev U and Rev L are VASTLY different on other jumpers, ie, not the jumper >> header where DS is >> selected. >> >> Tony >> > I appreciate all the help Tony! > > Checking my drive, it's a Rev C. Early one, I guess. > It has 7 positions, not 8, for the option block near the connector. > The good news is that there is one labeled HM, so I set the jumpers > to HM - was DS - and DS1 - where it already was. > The bad news is that produced no change. Arrggg.! > Well, actually, it did make one change - the head started pounding > up & down a dozen or so times as the PC tried to identify the > drive. But, no change in the "Not Ready" problem. > > I also used your suggestion of setting BIOS to 720K, but > that also produced no improvement. > > Guess I gonna have to order the manual(s) from "herb's stuff" > web site. Unfortunately that seems to be a slow process as > you have to Xchng email with him to select the right manual > and get a quote, then send snailmail with a check and he mails > the manuals. Most likely has to wait for check clearing also. > > Ah well, if you gotta, you gotta........ > > As a side note, my search for M4853 returned dozens of replys > (no jumper data) and about 2 dozen claimed that it is a 360K > drive. One claimed 400K (vote for 360!). One claimed 0.72Mb. > One claimed 80trk, 720Kb. And one claimed 96tpi, 720Kb. > Dern, now I don't know for sure ?WHAT? I have... > Possibly the difference between M4853 and M4853-1 could > perhaps be the track density....48tpi vs 96tpi?? > > Confusion reigns. > There is no confusion - any old-school, long-time CoCo'er should be able to tell you that the M4853 is a 5.25" 720KB DS/QD 80-Track , 96tpi drive. The DS/DD 360KB drive is the M4851, as I have those, too, and transplanted a pair into a Morrow MD3 CP/M machine. Same funky mechanism. The M4853 drives were OEM in the Tandy 2000, which was just one of many reasons the machine failed, and us old-time cocoers ganked them for use as /D1 and /D2, to have a 360K and (2) 720K drives online. I have about 6 of these drives, and have used them on my PC (Acer P75 with a CompatiCard IV) to images disks for Altos 580 / Series 5, which is, you guessed it, DS/QD 5.25" 720kb media. Whoever is telling you the M4851 is 360kb or 400kb has no idea what they are talking about. For example, the Tandy 2000 faq mentions the Mitsubishi DS/QD 720kb floppies: http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757/t2kfaq.txt In sections 3, 4, 14 Check out the Tandy 2000 Service Bulletins to see if any info is in there: http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757/t2k_serv_bulletins.pdf And check out Rich Cini's comprehensive Tandy 2000 site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/systems.htm Tandy 2000 is at bottom, and he has PDF versions of the Tech Ref manual here: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/pdf/Tandy/Tandy%202000%20Technical%20Reference.pdf Which mentions the Mitsubish BY MODEL on page 183, section 7.3.1 Link to RadioShack, where the first paragraph describes the drives: http://support.radioshack.com/support_computer/doc1/1294.htm From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 2 22:27:03 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 22:27:03 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Jumper settings needed References: <200810021758479.SM01276@[63.69.23.239]> <48E55087.9020704@austin.rr.com><001301c924ef$ea58ed90$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <48E57170.2050200@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <002f01c924ff$85d63c00$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Jumper settings needed > Tony wrote: >> >> >> I have a Revision L and Revision U M4853 in front of me. >> I KNOW I used my Rev U in a PC, as it still has a diskette inside >> labelled "MS-DOS." >> >> On the jumper set near the FDC connector, DS1 is jumpered, and HM is >> jumpered. >> Going rear (nearest connector) to front (towards front of drive) using >> binary: >> 01000010 1 being jumpered. >> >> Mine also happens to have the term jumpers inserted, whic is about 1 >> inch away from edge, >> about 2 inches in from the FDC connector. >> >> Rev U and Rev L are VASTLY different on other jumpers, ie, not the >> jumper header where DS is >> selected. >> >> Tony >> > I appreciate all the help Tony! > > Checking my drive, it's a Rev C. Early one, I guess. > It has 7 positions, not 8, for the option block near the connector. > The good news is that there is one labeled HM, so I set the jumpers > to HM - was DS - and DS1 - where it already was. > The bad news is that produced no change. Arrggg.! > Well, actually, it did make one change - the head started pounding > up & down a dozen or so times as the PC tried to identify the > drive. But, no change in the "Not Ready" problem. > See if you can find a jumper labelled "2S" May not be in the bank with DS0 - might be elsewhere on that topboard. If you find it, reverse it's position and try again. Tony From neilsmorr at gmail.com Thu Oct 2 22:28:15 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 19:28:15 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > BillGates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit References: Message-ID: <58E1CBA11D74443A973E6A101653B619@NewBaby> No. The shortcuts are actually tokenized separately: CSAVE tokenizes to FE (say) PRINT tokenizes to D8 (say) ? also tokenizes to D8 (say) Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > Hello Art, > > Is this tokenization to one byte the functionality that provides > "shortcuts" > like typing "?" for "PRINT" ? I've always wondered why that one command > had > such a shortcut. > > Just curious, > John From tlindner at macmess.org Thu Oct 2 22:32:34 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 19:32:34 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Recent changes to the CoCoMag Website In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1io774y.81pzosfyxubgM%tlindner@macmess.org> John wrote: > Hello Tim, > > Regarding the move to the coco25 wiki, I'm a little unclear after reading > your message whether this is the final site to host the scanned magazines > (this is what I assume), or if this only a location to move the editing > tasks. Or is it both? It would be the final place for the magazines. > Also, could you copy/move a few pages over there so we can compare the > current behavior to the new? I have not written the software to do the transfer. But sign up for an account on the wiki and try to edit any existing page. You'll quickly get a feel for the editing and the markup system the wiki ofers. > I have a hard time visualizing the change in behavior. I've used the > current system enough to understand its limitations, but would like to see > the new system "in action" to get a feel for how much better it is. I > like to think I've gotten relatively efficient with the current process > and want to see what the changes would be. The primary additions the wiki offers is: Attributed changes. (Who made what change when.) Richer text. (Bold, itialic, etc.) Inline images (For figures and illustrations.) > Lastly, thanks for taking on this project and breaking the work into small, > manageable tasks! Thank-you! -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright From fredprov5 at usfamily.net Thu Oct 2 22:34:13 2008 From: fredprov5 at usfamily.net (Fred D. Provoncha) Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:34:13 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Coco] Armchair Arcade Chronicles the COCO Game Seventh Link In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48E584A5.30709@usfamily.net> > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 08:20:35 -0700 (PDT) > From: Derek > Subject: [Coco] Armchair Arcade Chronicles the COCO Game Seventh Link > To: CoCo List > Message-ID: <548344.21659.qm at web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Stu over at his web site Armchair Arcade has started his journey into the game Seventh Link for the coco 3. > > http://armchairarcade.com/neo/node/2004 > > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** Stu, if you're reading this, you said on your blog that you did not have the manual to the game Seventh Link. I HAVE THE MANUAL. I ALSO HAVE THE CHEAT BOOK for Seventh Link. Email me off-list if you want me to scan it in and send you a copy. Fred Provoncha Stansbury Park, UT fredprov5 at usfamily.net --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- From flexser at fiu.edu Thu Oct 2 22:45:37 2008 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 22:45:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit In-Reply-To: Message-ID: PRINT and '?' both get tokenized to the single-byte token for the print command (which is different from the Ascii code for '?'.) I'd guess PRINT got special treatment because of its frequent use in direct mode to print out the values of variables to aid in debugging. I'm pretty sure I recollect the question mark being used as a substitute for PRINT in various BASICs prior to the introduction of the CoCo. I'm less certain about the apostrophe substitute for REM predating the CoCo, though I suspect it does. Art On Thu, 2 Oct 2008, John wrote: > Hello Art, > > Is this tokenization to one byte the functionality that provides "shortcuts" > like typing "?" for "PRINT" ? I've always wondered why that one command had > such a shortcut. > > Just curious, > John > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Arthur Flexser > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 12:06 AM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill > Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit > > All CoCo commands are tokenized to a single byte. (Functions, to > distinguish > them from commands, use two bytes.) This excludes commands like SAVEM, in > which > the "M" essentially acts as an argument to the SAVE command, which is > efficient > for saving ROM space and adds negligibly to execution time. > > Art > > On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > > > The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. > > That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. > > They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two > > bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte > > tokens but not all do. > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From theother_bob at yahoo.com Thu Oct 2 23:03:39 2008 From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (theother_bob) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 20:03:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. Message-ID: <40119.1388.qm@web81508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Jim, ISTR that a 128MB drive yields a 255 drive HDB-DOS "partition" and leave enough for 20 or 30MB for (N)OS9. Cheers, Bob ----- Original Message ---- From: Jim Cox To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 7:22:04 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. I guess that I was wrong about the SuperIDE. From what a few friends have told me Basic will only handle 128M comprised of virtual disks, while NitrOS will handle more. Anyone care to elaborate? -Jim Cox On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives over 1G. > > Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From badfrog at gmail.com Fri Oct 3 00:22:16 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 23:22:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Armchair Arcade Chronicles the COCO Game Seventh Link In-Reply-To: <48E584A5.30709@usfamily.net> References: <48E584A5.30709@usfamily.net> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810022122i5b604128kbff0e5bc60bfd48d@mail.gmail.com> I already have copies scanned (from Mary Kramer). I can e-mail them if you would like. On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 9:34 PM, Fred D. Provoncha wrote: >> Message: 5 >> Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 08:20:35 -0700 (PDT) >> From: Derek >> Subject: [Coco] Armchair Arcade Chronicles the COCO Game Seventh Link >> To: CoCo List >> Message-ID: <548344.21659.qm at web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> >> Stu over at his web site Armchair Arcade has started his journey into the >> game Seventh Link for the coco 3. >> >> http://armchairarcade.com/neo/node/2004 >> >> >> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > Stu, if you're reading this, you said on your blog that you did not have the > manual to the game Seventh Link. > > I HAVE THE MANUAL. I ALSO HAVE THE CHEAT BOOK for Seventh Link. Email me > off-list if you want me to scan it in and send you a copy. > > Fred Provoncha > Stansbury Park, UT > fredprov5 at usfamily.net > > > > > > > > --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- > http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From sklammer at gmail.com Fri Oct 3 11:26:49 2008 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 11:26:49 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3925f0b0810030826i562b285ajeb0a93a38d6cec6@mail.gmail.com> Both the apostrophe and question mark proceed any micro... I'm fairly sure that EDUSystem 25 BASIC and OS/8 BASIC (on the PDP family of minis, circa late 60's to early 70's) had them. The Dartmouth College manual from Oct 64 (developed for a GE225) doesn't list any 'shortcuts'; but, is interesting that they slashed upper case ohs and not zeros... http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dartmouth/basic_oct64.pdf I'd hoped to find some site showing the early evolution of BASIC commands (like the shortcuts mentioned); but, haven't found any... it'd be interesting. sk 2008/10/2 Arthur Flexser > PRINT and '?' both get tokenized to the single-byte token for the print > command > (which is different from the Ascii code for '?'.) I'd guess PRINT got > special > treatment because of its frequent use in direct mode to print out the > values of > variables to aid in debugging. > > I'm pretty sure I recollect the question mark being used as a substitute > for > PRINT in various BASICs prior to the introduction of the CoCo. I'm less > certain > about the apostrophe substitute for REM predating the CoCo, though I > suspect it > does. > > Art > > On Thu, 2 Oct 2008, John wrote: > > > Hello Art, > > > > Is this tokenization to one byte the functionality that provides > "shortcuts" > > like typing "?" for "PRINT" ? I've always wondered why that one command > had > > such a shortcut. > > > > Just curious, > > John > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] > On > > Behalf Of Arthur Flexser > > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 12:06 AM > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill > > Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit > > > > All CoCo commands are tokenized to a single byte. (Functions, to > > distinguish > > them from commands, use two bytes.) This excludes commands like SAVEM, > in > > which > > the "M" essentially acts as an argument to the SAVE command, which is > > efficient > > for saving ROM space and adds negligibly to execution time. > > > > Art > > > > On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > > > > > The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. > > > That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. > > > They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two > > > bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte > > > tokens but not all do. > > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Fri Oct 3 15:26:30 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 14:26:30 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation Message-ID: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> This AM, I posted (continuing a thread) but did not see the post appear. I waited several hours - in case mail was busy - and reposted the same text. That one has not appeared either. And neither one has bounced...... ...Hmmmm..... So there seems to be a problem somewhere in the loop. Can you tell if you received my posting(s) today? I know that my email is going out to family members OK, but that may not be conclusive. Unfortunately. Hopefully, I can get a clue as to whether the problem is on my end, your end, or some where between........... thank you john dumas From coconut at pritchard.ca Fri Oct 3 15:35:24 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 14:35:24 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation In-Reply-To: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <1806abd60810031235g5f63baf6y6ffd155a556a963b@mail.gmail.com> Check your sent items, and make sure that you sent the e-mail from the account you registered for the list from. I have had this problem in the past, and still occasionally try to send to the list from one of my other e-mail accounts, then wonder why the post never shows up or gets a response. Everytime that happens, I have always found an e-mail address in the from field that is not the one I registered to the list with. I am of course presuming you use multiple e-mail accounts in one mail client. On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 2:26 PM, LinuxRules wrote: > This AM, I posted (continuing a thread) but did not see the post > appear. I waited several hours - in case mail was busy - and reposted > the same text. That one has not appeared either. > And neither one has bounced...... ...Hmmmm..... > > So there seems to be a problem somewhere in the loop. Can you > tell if you received my posting(s) today? I know that my email is > going out to family members OK, but that may not be conclusive. > Unfortunately. > > Hopefully, I can get a clue as to whether the problem is on my end, > your end, or some where between........... > > thank you > john dumas > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From SFischer1 at Mindspring.com Fri Oct 3 15:43:10 2008 From: SFischer1 at Mindspring.com (Stephen H. Fischer) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 12:43:10 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation In-Reply-To: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: Check "gmane.comp.hardware.tandy.coco" on "news.gmane.org". My posts appear almost immediately there after being sent. My posts back from the mailing list are put into "Suspect Spam" by Earthlink and thus do not appear in my Inbox until I move them. I have an inquiry with Earthlink about this currently open. Does your ISP also have a Spam filter? SHF ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" To: "COCO LIST" Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 12:26 PM Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation > This AM, I posted (continuing a thread) but did not see the post > appear. I waited several hours - in case mail was busy - and reposted > the same text. That one has not appeared either. > And neither one has bounced...... ...Hmmmm..... > > So there seems to be a problem somewhere in the loop. Can you > tell if you received my posting(s) today? I know that my email is > going out to family members OK, but that may not be conclusive. > Unfortunately. > > Hopefully, I can get a clue as to whether the problem is on my end, > your end, or some where between........... > > thank you > john dumas From coconut at pritchard.ca Fri Oct 3 15:56:19 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 14:56:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation In-Reply-To: References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <1806abd60810031256j4e961382y8deba9d70ce4e2e0@mail.gmail.com> Stephen has a good point about checking the the gmane archive of this list. You can also look here - http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/coco/. Also in regards to Stephen's mention about the Spam filtering, good idea. A some what related issues is I use Google Apps to host the e-mail for my domain, and even though I have the list set to send me even my submissions, I never see them come back. As far as I know Google Apps servers are detecting the duplicate and merely forgetting to at the Inbox label to them. Or maybe I did something wrong on the list account page. On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 2:43 PM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote: > Check "gmane.comp.hardware.tandy.coco" on "news.gmane.org". > > My posts appear almost immediately there after being sent. > > My posts back from the mailing list are put into "Suspect Spam" by > Earthlink and thus do not appear in my Inbox until I move them. > > I have an inquiry with Earthlink about this currently open. > > Does your ISP also have a Spam filter? > > SHF > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" > > To: "COCO LIST" > Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 12:26 PM > Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation > > > > This AM, I posted (continuing a thread) but did not see the post >> appear. I waited several hours - in case mail was busy - and reposted >> the same text. That one has not appeared either. >> And neither one has bounced...... ...Hmmmm..... >> >> So there seems to be a problem somewhere in the loop. Can you >> tell if you received my posting(s) today? I know that my email is >> going out to family members OK, but that may not be conclusive. >> Unfortunately. >> >> Hopefully, I can get a clue as to whether the problem is on my end, >> your end, or some where between........... >> >> thank you >> john dumas >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Fri Oct 3 15:34:26 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 14:34:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] OOPS!! Intended for list owner! Re: Question about List Operation In-Reply-To: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <48E673C2.40900@austin.rr.com> Sorry, a BrainFart! today. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Fri Oct 3 15:37:41 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 12:37:41 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <1823B51DC17B46A6B243B9AA526E53CF@NewBaby> It's the internet. I'm on Freecycle and sometimes I get a message that something has been taken before the message that it is available. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "LinuxRules" > This AM, I posted (continuing a thread) but did not see the post > appear. I waited several hours - in case mail was busy - and reposted > the same text. That one has not appeared either. > And neither one has bounced...... ...Hmmmm..... > > So there seems to be a problem somewhere in the loop. Can you > tell if you received my posting(s) today? I know that my email is > going out to family members OK, but that may not be conclusive. > Unfortunately. > > Hopefully, I can get a clue as to whether the problem is on my end, > your end, or some where between........... > > thank you > john dumas From SFischer1 at Mindspring.com Fri Oct 3 17:13:44 2008 From: SFischer1 at Mindspring.com (Stephen H. Fischer) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 14:13:44 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Newsgroup Tip Was: Question about List Operation In-Reply-To: <1823B51DC17B46A6B243B9AA526E53CF@NewBaby> References: <48E671E6.5010509@austin.rr.com> <1823B51DC17B46A6B243B9AA526E53CF@NewBaby> Message-ID: Hi, If you are using Windows and perhaps other OS's, clicking on the following or pasting it into your browser will add it to your news reader. News://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.hardware.tandy.coco I believe that Outlook Express and Windows Mail on Vista will prompt you to create an account if necessary. It has been a while time since I did this when I got my new Vista laptop months ago. I have a draft E-mail that is never sent with lines for all of the Newsgroups I am subscribed to currently and in the past. Clicking on them one by one allows me to add those I wish to look at without the huge penalty, that is for OE on my old laptop, that downloading the gigantic Earthlink list and suffering the huge slowdown on performance that occurs when the Folders file gets huge. Here is another only for Earthlink customers: news://news.west.earthlink.net/bit.listserv.coco Substitute your News server for Earthlink's one. Posting questions like the original one allows us all to learn. That's why I read Newsgroups. SHF From aaronljimenez at hotmail.com Fri Oct 3 20:09:17 2008 From: aaronljimenez at hotmail.com (Aaron Jimenez) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 20:09:17 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Good home wanted for Coco1 In-Reply-To: <8CAEC05D0E92437-14C4-1FD0@webmail-mf05.sysops.aol.com> References: <1inpms6.1a0zhng9xzbycM%tlindner@macmess.org> <8CAEC05D0E92437-14C4-1FD0@webmail-mf05.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I definately would want it! I'd like another for a serial connection experiment. I travel quite a bit, so I could possibly pick it up. Aaron ---------------------------------------- > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 22:38:52 -0400 > From: nuxie at aol.com > Subject: Re: [Coco] Good home wanted for Coco1 > > > If all else fails send it to me. I will take it. viva la coco!!!! > > Mary > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: tim lindner > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 9:46 am > Subject: Re: [Coco] Good home wanted for Coco1 > > > > > > > > > > > Matthew Reed wrote: > >> Someone just contacted me who wants to dispose of his CoCo1, which is in >> good condition. It was his first computer and he would like it to go to a >> good home. He wondered if I knew of anyone who might be interested. Does >> anyone here have any ideas? > > Always start with the location of the equipment. The closer someone is, > the more likely someone may want it. > > Otherwise, do what you're doing. Get the word out far and wide. > > -- > tim lindner > tlindner at macmess.org Bright > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > Yhttp://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco _________________________________________________________________ Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn ?10 hidden secrets? from Jamie. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008 From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Oct 3 19:50:25 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 19:50:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks In-Reply-To: <00b401c924ea$1145bce0$0701a8c0@master> References: <1222989253.19533.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <00b401c924ea$1145bce0$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <1223077825.3577.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Fri, 2008-10-03 at 09:52 +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > To the best of my knowledge, the stock COBBLER is not supposed to be used on > a hard disk. It is in fact hard coded to write the boot loader/kernel to > track 34 of the floppy. > > Burke & Burke created a special programme for their hard disk adapter which > created a kernel on track 128 of the hard disk, but I don't know of any > others that allow this. Alrighty, thanks Bob. I too have reserved a "special" area on the hard disk for the boot "track" which will require a similar specialized program to write the kernelp1/boot/rel there, so I'm not surprised. OS9Gen seems to do the right thing, though, w/r/t creating the boot file, but it seems to try to write the boot track as well, which is problematic. May have to add a flag to it to stop it. C. From devries.bob at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 02:39:21 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 16:39:21 +1000 Subject: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks References: <1222989253.19533.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org><00b401c924ea$1145bce0$0701a8c0@master> <1223077825.3577.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <008001c925ec$0e308460$0701a8c0@master> Chuck, OS9Gen is not supposed to write the kernel track *IF* it senses that there are files written to that track. However, I believe that the logic for this is tied up with floppy operation, and hence only knows about single or double sided, and not multiple platters such as in hard disk drives. Yeah, it would be useful to have an option to *not* write the kernel track, such as -nt (to add to the -t option already in the current version of OS9Gen, which will write a kernel track from a file). -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] cobbler and hard disks > On Fri, 2008-10-03 at 09:52 +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> To the best of my knowledge, the stock COBBLER is not supposed to be used >> on >> a hard disk. It is in fact hard coded to write the boot loader/kernel to >> track 34 of the floppy. >> >> Burke & Burke created a special programme for their hard disk adapter >> which >> created a kernel on track 128 of the hard disk, but I don't know of any >> others that allow this. > > Alrighty, thanks Bob. I too have reserved a "special" area on the hard > disk for the boot "track" which will require a similar specialized > program to write the kernelp1/boot/rel there, so I'm not surprised. > > OS9Gen seems to do the right thing, though, w/r/t creating the boot > file, but it seems to try to write the boot track as well, which is > problematic. May have to add a flag to it to stop it. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From deemcr at robinson-west.com Sat Oct 4 02:50:57 2008 From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson) Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 23:50:57 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check Message-ID: <1223103057.21446.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> I'm having trouble getting Rainbow check plus to work. I'm on a 512k coco3 with a drivewire rom pack. Has anyone else with my setup experienced problems with check? I copied check out of the September 1986 Rainbow. I've been typing in a game that I should be able to use check on. Do some of the lines need to be changed? 10 CLS:X=256*PEEK(35)+178 20 CLEAR 25,X-1 30 X=256*PEEK(35)+178 40 FOR Z=X TO X+77 50 READ Y:W=W+Y:PRINT Z,Y;W 60 POKE Z,Y:NEXT 70 IFW=7985THEN80ELSEPRINT"DATA ERROR":STOP 80 EXEC X:END ... The rest is on page 15 of the September 1986 Rainbow. From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Oct 4 02:58:51 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2008 06:58:51 +0000 Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Prototype - Reverse Engineered Message-ID: <100420080658.21582.48E7142B000B35DE0000544E22007613940B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: nickma at optusnet.com.au > It seems there is no shortage of talented people to take up the challenge to > decode the CoCo3 prototype. > > We've got people who are prepared to laboriously create a schematic diagram, > others who have the ability to reverse engineer the PAL chips and others who > have a deep understanding of the software link in accessing hardware. And we > will all be able to provide feedback and advice via this CoCoList and assist to > discover any new mysteries that could be hidden within the prototype. > > This could be one of the most important group projects to be undertaken on the > CoCo3. > > Bring-it-on! > > Nick Marentes Being subcompetent at digital hardware, this is my favorite spectator sport. (I find baseball, football [several variations], basketball and hockey severely boring. (I like to watch fencing [almost never broadcast, even during Olympics] and Women's Gymnastics [I would get arrested if I touched one, but it's fun to watch them exercise], Bring on the digital challenge. I'll keep watching and when I have cash to spare I'll buy results. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Oct 4 04:34:12 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2008 08:34:12 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. Message-ID: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Chuck Youse > On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 22:01 -0500, Sean wrote: > > ..."Older" drives under 1G... > > I remember my first 1G IDE drive... In 1997... > > I think even drives under 100 gig are 'old' now! > > > > Bridging to my other hobby, related to secure data destruction: A > > .223 rifle bullet through a 3.5" hard drive looks REALLY cool if you > > get it through the platters and the case. Nice multiple eruptions of > > metal! Prefer .45 (1911) for close up, and my Marlin (old-fashion lever gun) for range. (I've got one good eye, and I prefer iron sights, but my .308 has a good old Bushnell). Sean, that is also one of my own favorite avocations. But I've got little use for .223. OK for poodle-shooters. Works great on disks, no tactical function except when you have a political reason to lose troops (common during 'Nam, pandemic in Iraq). > *grins* When I was a teenager, I worked for Tandy during the 540MB > barrier breach. Had to install special software that would load on > start that would intercept BIOS calls on PCs to allow access to > 1024 > cylinders... can't for the life of me remember what Western Digital > shipped with ... That was long after I left Tandy (4/86). As I recall, when I left, the 35 Mb disks were just being introduced for the T6k (though they also worked fine with the 1/3/4 (couldn't use the whole thing at a time, limits to LDOS and LS-DOS), but you could build logical disks out to the edge and use them with different boot disks or tricky reassignments that didn't involve the first volume, and the Color Computer series' -- though that was before the official CoCo HD interface). And no OS-9 version, not even NitrOS-9, has ever approached LS-DOS for ease of configuring hard drives -- nor has had a comparable command shell -- and neither comes close to the Bourne shell, let alone its descendants, the Korn and BASH shells -- Due to product release schedules, I learned the Bourne shell, then the LDOS job control language, then the OS-9 L1 language and the many utilities attached to each. I love them all, LDOS/LS-DOS will always be my favorite single-user operating system, OS-9 et seq will always be my second favorite multi-user OS (I am and will always be a Unix geek, be it Xenix or Linux -- they coexist in my basement attached by null-modem cables, though the T6k is a bit [extremely] flaky lately and I'm not as good at hardware as I was backalong). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 03:25:22 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 03:25:22 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223103057.21446.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <1223103057.21446.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <48E325E2.8030402@worldnet.att.net> Michael C. Robinson wrote: > I'm having trouble getting Rainbow check plus to work. I'm on a 512k > coco3 with a drivewire rom pack. Has anyone else with my setup > experienced problems with check? I copied check out of the September > 1986 Rainbow. I've been typing in a game that I should be able to use > check on. Do some of the lines need to be changed? > > 10 CLS:X=256*PEEK(35)+178 > 20 CLEAR 25,X-1 > 30 X=256*PEEK(35)+178 > 40 FOR Z=X TO X+77 > 50 READ Y:W=W+Y:PRINT Z,Y;W > 60 POKE Z,Y:NEXT > 70 IFW=7985THEN80ELSEPRINT"DATA ERROR":STOP > 80 EXEC X:END > ... > > The rest is on page 15 of the September 1986 Rainbow. > > See also Rainbow, 1984, p.21 You have not said what your problem is, so it's hard to tell what went wrong. Here is the actual program that you typed in. ORG $7FB2 * MODIFY A BASIC RAM HOOK START LDA $16A CONSOLE IN MSB STA Blog Archive > Bill Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit Message-ID: <100420081328.10035.48E76F81000850C70000273322069997350B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Both shortcuts were available in Level 2 BASIC for the TRS-80 Model One several years before the Color Computer, and I suspect and assume in a number of other early Microsoft BASIC interpreters. (The only other device of that vintage I have is a TI 99/A, and I don't believe it used a Microsoft BASIC -- and I'm not going to check, as that machine belongs to La Esposa, its algebra program is what she says got her through the math requirement in nursing school umpty-ump years ago, and it holds a special place in her heart even though it hasn't been plugged in in over 20 years, so the electrolytics are all probably dry anyway and the house would burn down if I did). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Arthur Flexser > PRINT and '?' both get tokenized to the single-byte token for the print command > (which is different from the Ascii code for '?'.) I'd guess PRINT got special > treatment because of its frequent use in direct mode to print out the values of > variables to aid in debugging. > > I'm pretty sure I recollect the question mark being used as a substitute for > PRINT in various BASICs prior to the introduction of the CoCo. I'm less certain > about the apostrophe substitute for REM predating the CoCo, though I suspect it > does. > > Art > > On Thu, 2 Oct 2008, John wrote: > > > Hello Art, > > > > Is this tokenization to one byte the functionality that provides "shortcuts" > > like typing "?" for "PRINT" ? I've always wondered why that one command had > > such a shortcut. > > > > Just curious, > > John > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > > Behalf Of Arthur Flexser > > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 12:06 AM > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] pagetable.com > Blog Archive > Bill > > Gates' Personal Easter Eggs in 8 Bit > > > > All CoCo commands are tokenized to a single byte. (Functions, to > > distinguish > > them from commands, use two bytes.) This excludes commands like SAVEM, in > > which > > the "M" essentially acts as an argument to the SAVE command, which is > > efficient > > for saving ROM space and adds negligibly to execution time. > > > > Art > > > > On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, James Diffendaffer wrote: > > > > > > The Dragon's interpreter is faster than the CoCo's. > > > That alone should tell you the CoCo's Basic wasn't optimized well. > > > They didn't even bother to worry about what tokens were one or two > > > bytes. The most commonly used commands should have used single byte > > > tokens but not all do. > > > > > From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Oct 4 09:40:37 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2008 13:40:37 +0000 Subject: [Coco] Question about List Operation Message-ID: <100420081340.10574.48E77255000E3FD50000294E22058861720B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> I just subscribe to my local Freecycle list by digest (I could never handle the volume of crap otherwise) so it's a forgone conclusion that anything good is snapped up before I read about it (generally the following weekend when I have some time). But sometimes that taken/offered mismatch is there even in the digest from Yahoo. Weird. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Neil Morrison" > > It's the internet. > > I'm on Freecycle and sometimes I get a message that something has been taken > before the message that it is available. From nutz4coco at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 15:30:39 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 12:30:39 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <40119.1388.qm@web81508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <40119.1388.qm@web81508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <889830d00810041230k753b137ep7199fa0fc7da598@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Bob! It's nice to get a straight answer to this thread. -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 8:03 PM, theother_bob wrote: > Jim, > ISTR that a 128MB drive yields a 255 drive HDB-DOS "partition" and leave > enough for 20 or 30MB for (N)OS9. > > Cheers, > Bob > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Jim Cox > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 7:22:04 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. > > I guess that I was wrong about the SuperIDE. From what a few friends > have told me Basic will only handle 128M comprised of virtual disks, > while NitrOS will handle more. Anyone care to elaborate? > > -Jim Cox > > On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > > I have a plethora of older drives under 1G and a lot more drives over 1G. > > > > Which are more practical to use for the SuperIDE? > > > > -Jim Cox > > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From nutz4coco at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 15:33:52 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 12:33:52 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Free ISA SCSI cards Message-ID: <889830d00810041233w2c6d8a1fif436baad41f44d59@mail.gmail.com> This is an all or nothing deal. I have six ISA SCSI cards that I will never use, and are yours for the cost of shipping from Bellevue, WA. If you are interested, you MUST respond by October 10, otherwise they go to the recyclers on the 11th. I also have some older SCSI cases I will throw in too if you want them. -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ From nutz4coco at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 15:35:17 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 12:35:17 -0700 Subject: [Coco] CoConutz in New Mexico Message-ID: <889830d00810041235n414f5637m6f437b10ec1c53c8@mail.gmail.com> I am trying to find a CoConut in New Mexico that I promised a bunch of old RAM for. I have everything ready to ship out, I just need to hear from you if you still want them. -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ From nutz4coco at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 16:46:37 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 13:46:37 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Free ISA SCSI cards In-Reply-To: <889830d00810041233w2c6d8a1fif436baad41f44d59@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810041233w2c6d8a1fif436baad41f44d59@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <889830d00810041346i3b887890jfe29de9186d4ef8a@mail.gmail.com> The boards found a home (maybe two :-) -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 12:33 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > This is an all or nothing deal. I have six ISA SCSI cards that I will > never use, and are yours for the cost of shipping from Bellevue, WA. > > If you are interested, you MUST respond by October 10, otherwise they go to > the recyclers on the 11th. I also have some older SCSI cases I will throw > in too if you want them. > > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > From flexser at fiu.edu Sat Oct 4 17:26:17 2008 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 17:26:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E325E2.8030402@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: You say, "This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed." But the program copies the 3 bytes initially at $16A-16C before it changes them, and falls into these stored bytes at the end (CONT). So, shouldn't it work okay, even if the initial contents of $16A-16C are different under RGBDOS? Art On Wed, 1 Oct 2008, Robert Gault wrote: > Michael C. Robinson wrote: > > I'm having trouble getting Rainbow check plus to work. I'm on a 512k > > coco3 with a drivewire rom pack. Has anyone else with my setup > > experienced problems with check? I copied check out of the September > > 1986 Rainbow. I've been typing in a game that I should be able to use > > check on. Do some of the lines need to be changed? > > > > 10 CLS:X=256*PEEK(35)+178 > > 20 CLEAR 25,X-1 > > 30 X=256*PEEK(35)+178 > > 40 FOR Z=X TO X+77 > > 50 READ Y:W=W+Y:PRINT Z,Y;W > > 60 POKE Z,Y:NEXT > > 70 IFW=7985THEN80ELSEPRINT"DATA ERROR":STOP > > 80 EXEC X:END > > ... > > > > The rest is on page 15 of the September 1986 Rainbow. > > > > > See also Rainbow, 1984, p.21 > > You have not said what your problem is, so it's hard to tell what went > wrong. Here is the actual program that you typed in. > ORG $7FB2 > * MODIFY A BASIC RAM HOOK > START LDA $16A CONSOLE IN MSB > STA LDA #$7E JMP > STA $16A CONSOLE IN MSB > LDX $16B CONSOLE IN LSW > STX LEAX STX $16B CONSOLE IN LSW > RTS > CHKPLS CMPA #10 DOWN ARROW > BNE CONT BACK TO BASIC RAM HOOK > PSHS X,D > CLRA > * Get Pointer to beginning of Basic program in memory > LDX <$19 > C@ LDB ,X++ get POINTER content > BEQ A@ > ADDA ,X+ get one byte of Line > B@ ADDA ,X+ get one byte of Line > LDB ,X test for end of Line > BNE B@ > LEAX 1,X skip over marker > BRA C@ > A@ STA $2DE line input buffer +3 > LEAX STX <$A6 give new Pointer to Basic > LDA ,X get content of Pointer > ANDCC #%11111110 clear Carry > JSR $ADC6 tell Basic to process data > PULS D,X > CONT JMP $ADC6 > * This is a tokenized program line. > * translation: PRINT PEEK(734) > * 734=$2DE which contains checksum. > CHARAD FCB $87,$FF,$86,$28,$37,$33,$34,$29,0 > END START > > This program will work with disk systems even though it seems to have > been written for tape systems. However, it expects the hooks and other > low RAM system content to be intact. If drivewire or any DOS > modifications have made use of the above hard coded addresses, then > CheckPlus will fail. > > This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed. Probably > CheckPlus won't work with HDBDOS. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 07:24:53 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:24:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> Arthur Flexser wrote: > You say, "This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed." But the > program copies the 3 bytes initially at $16A-16C before it changes them, and > falls into these stored bytes at the end (CONT). So, shouldn't it work okay, > even if the initial contents of $16A-16C are different under RGBDOS? > > Art You would think so. Part of the problem is that RGBDOS (and I think HDBDOS) incorporate FlexKey, a Roger Schrag program, that permits line editing via the arrow keys. Since the down arrow is used by both FlexKey and CheckPlus, there is a conflict. Actually I've been trying to see how CheckPlus can be modified so that it will work with RGBDOS, but that will take some more studying. The most likely change would be to use a different key than the down arrow to activate the checksum. However, that has not yet worked. From deemcr at robinson-west.com Sat Oct 4 21:40:54 2008 From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson) Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2008 18:40:54 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 07:24 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Arthur Flexser wrote: > > You say, "This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed." But the > > program copies the 3 bytes initially at $16A-16C before it changes them, and > > falls into these stored bytes at the end (CONT). So, shouldn't it work okay, > > even if the initial contents of $16A-16C are different under RGBDOS? > > > > Art > > You would think so. Part of the problem is that RGBDOS (and I think > HDBDOS) incorporate FlexKey, a Roger Schrag program, that permits line > editing via the arrow keys. Since the down arrow is used by both FlexKey > and CheckPlus, there is a conflict. > > Actually I've been trying to see how CheckPlus can be modified so that > it will work with RGBDOS, but that will take some more studying. The > most likely change would be to use a different key than the down arrow > to activate the checksum. However, that has not yet worked. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco Well, I guess I'll have to buy a tape and transfer both thequest which I typed in out of another Rainbow and check. I get an FC error trying to run thequest off of my drivewire volume. I am not very impressed with drivewire if it's going to break everything. I may have made some typos, but I can't check because Rainbow check plus isn't working. From badfrog at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 22:09:34 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 21:09:34 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. In-Reply-To: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> References: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810041909v33a279fcm77a93172f5f784c2@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 3:34 AM, wrote: > > > > Prefer .45 (1911) for close up, and my Marlin (old-fashion lever gun) for range. (I've got one good eye, and I prefer iron sights, but my .308 has a good old Bushnell). > > Sean, that is also one of my own favorite avocations. But I've got little use for .223. OK for poodle-shooters. Works great on disks, no tactical function except when you have a political reason to lose troops (common during 'Nam, pandemic in Iraq). Going off topic a bit... .223 is very useful if you want an 'evil black rifle' that ticks off the gun-grabbers. They look so scary! Haven't tried my 1911 with the hard drive targets, I assumed it wouldn't penetrate much. I was actually at a machine-gun shoot today. Got to fire the full-auto gun they use in Stargate SG1! (FN P90) That and a Barrett .50 caliber. Those are awesome. From tonym at compusource.net Sat Oct 4 22:15:10 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 22:15:10 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. References: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> <9efa17da0810041909v33a279fcm77a93172f5f784c2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <011d01c92690$31e44780$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Sean" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 10:09 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. > > On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 3:34 AM, wrote: >> >> >> >> Prefer .45 (1911) for close up, and my Marlin (old-fashion lever gun) for >> range. (I've got one good eye, and I prefer iron sights, but my .308 has >> a good old Bushnell). >> >> Sean, that is also one of my own favorite avocations. But I've got >> little use for .223. OK for poodle-shooters. Works great on disks, no >> tactical function except when you have a political reason to lose troops >> (common during 'Nam, pandemic in Iraq). > > Going off topic a bit... .223 is very useful if you want an 'evil > black rifle' that ticks off the gun-grabbers. They look so scary! > > Haven't tried my 1911 with the hard drive targets, I assumed it > wouldn't penetrate much. > I'm quite happy with my Yugoslavian SKS 59/66, fires 7.62x39 AK ammo... Looks menacing enough, especially with the Bayonet flipped out! Tony From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Oct 4 22:39:16 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 22:39:16 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <008901c92693$8f93dcd0$aebb9670$@com> Can you run it from an emulator to check it? Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Michael C. Robinson Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 9:41 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Trouble with check On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 07:24 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Arthur Flexser wrote: > > You say, "This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed." But the > > program copies the 3 bytes initially at $16A-16C before it changes them, and > > falls into these stored bytes at the end (CONT). So, shouldn't it work okay, > > even if the initial contents of $16A-16C are different under RGBDOS? > > > > Art > > You would think so. Part of the problem is that RGBDOS (and I think > HDBDOS) incorporate FlexKey, a Roger Schrag program, that permits line > editing via the arrow keys. Since the down arrow is used by both FlexKey > and CheckPlus, there is a conflict. > > Actually I've been trying to see how CheckPlus can be modified so that > it will work with RGBDOS, but that will take some more studying. The > most likely change would be to use a different key than the down arrow > to activate the checksum. However, that has not yet worked. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco Well, I guess I'll have to buy a tape and transfer both thequest which I typed in out of another Rainbow and check. I get an FC error trying to run thequest off of my drivewire volume. I am not very impressed with drivewire if it's going to break everything. I may have made some typos, but I can't check because Rainbow check plus isn't working. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1704 - Release Date: 10/4/2008 11:35 AM From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sat Oct 4 22:40:57 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 19:40:57 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. References: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net><9efa17da0810041909v33a279fcm77a93172f5f784c2@mail.gmail.com> <011d01c92690$31e44780$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <18CFAFADF8204059BB6CCE670E03809D@NewBaby> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony" > I'm quite happy with my Yugoslavian SKS 59/66, fires 7.62x39 AK ammo... > > Looks menacing enough, especially with the Bayonet flipped out! > > Tony But can you type with it? Neil From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 09:53:03 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 09:53:03 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> Michael C. Robinson wrote: > > Well, I guess I'll have to buy a tape and transfer both thequest > which I typed in out of another Rainbow and check. I get an FC > error trying to run thequest off of my drivewire volume. I am > not very impressed with drivewire if it's going to break > everything. I may have made some typos, but I can't check > because Rainbow check plus isn't working. > To be fair about drivewire, is the program you typed for a tape or disk system? If tape, then it is not a fault of drivewire that the program does not work with a disk system. If the program gives an FC error, then why don't you post the line that gave the error and the value of all the variables in that line when the program quit? We should be able to track down the cause of the error. Also what is the Rainbow volume and page for the program? From tonym at compusource.net Sat Oct 4 23:17:24 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 23:17:24 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. References: <100420080834.13946.48E72A8400047B860000367A22092246270B9DCC090B99@comcast.net><9efa17da0810041909v33a279fcm77a93172f5f784c2@mail.gmail.com><011d01c92690$31e44780$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <18CFAFADF8204059BB6CCE670E03809D@NewBaby> Message-ID: <017b01c92698$e3a16720$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Neil Morrison" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 10:40 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Older drives smaller than 1G. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tony" > >> I'm quite happy with my Yugoslavian SKS 59/66, fires 7.62x39 AK ammo... >> >> Looks menacing enough, especially with the Bayonet flipped out! >> >> Tony > > But can you type with it? > > Neil > I could, but it would have to be very little - Stab-And-Peck is not a very proficient means of data entry. Tony From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 10:20:55 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 10:20:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <48E38747.10803@worldnet.att.net> Robert Gault wrote: > Arthur Flexser wrote: >> You say, "This program does not work with RGBDOS as $16A is changed." >> But the >> program copies the 3 bytes initially at $16A-16C before it changes >> them, and >> falls into these stored bytes at the end (CONT). So, shouldn't it >> work okay, >> even if the initial contents of $16A-16C are different under RGBDOS? >> >> Art > > You would think so. Part of the problem is that RGBDOS (and I think > HDBDOS) incorporate FlexKey, a Roger Schrag program, that permits line > editing via the arrow keys. Since the down arrow is used by both FlexKey > and CheckPlus, there is a conflict. > > Actually I've been trying to see how CheckPlus can be modified so that > it will work with RGBDOS, but that will take some more studying. The > most likely change would be to use a different key than the down arrow > to activate the checksum. However, that has not yet worked. > A correction of the routine name. It is FlexiKey by Colin Stearman that was incorporated into RGBDOS. From devries.bob at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 00:15:22 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 14:15:22 +1000 Subject: [Coco] extra memory for RunB Message-ID: <006301c926a1$111811b0$0701a8c0@master> Can someone remind me about allocating extra memory for a packed Basic09 programme? I know that when running a programme from within Basic09 you use the MEM command, but once a Basic09 source module is PACKed, it's run from the command line. How does one allocate extra memory then? Is it necessary to call the programme using RunB on the command line, like this: OS9: RunB module_name #32k or can I just use this: OS9: module_name #32k My memory(!) is rusty on this. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ From georgeramsower at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 01:19:50 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 00:19:50 -0500 Subject: [Coco] extra memory for RunB References: <006301c926a1$111811b0$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <002001c926a9$fe6c03b0$d4b1b1d8@house> OS9: module_name #32k <<<< that's the one to use. George ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Devries" To: Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 11:15 PM Subject: [Coco] extra memory for RunB > Can someone remind me about allocating extra memory for a packed Basic09 > programme? > > I know that when running a programme from within Basic09 you use the MEM > command, but once a Basic09 source module is PACKed, it's run from the > command line. How does one allocate extra memory then? > > Is it necessary to call the programme using RunB on the command line, like > this: > > OS9: RunB module_name #32k > > or can I just use this: > > OS9: module_name #32k > > My memory(!) is rusty on this. > > -- > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia From deemcr at robinson-west.com Sun Oct 5 01:28:41 2008 From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson) Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2008 22:28:41 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 09:53 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Michael C. Robinson wrote: > > > > Well, I guess I'll have to buy a tape and transfer both thequest > > which I typed in out of another Rainbow and check. I get an FC > > error trying to run thequest off of my drivewire volume. I am > > not very impressed with drivewire if it's going to break > > everything. I may have made some typos, but I can't check > > because Rainbow check plus isn't working. > > > > To be fair about drivewire, is the program you typed for a tape or disk > system? If tape, then it is not a fault of drivewire that the program > does not work with a disk system. > > If the program gives an FC error, then why don't you post the line that > gave the error and the value of all the variables in that line when the > program quit? We should be able to track down the cause of the error. > > Also what is the Rainbow volume and page for the program? > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk system way back. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 13:14:26 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 13:14:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> Michael C. Robinson wrote: FC error in line100 > > December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a > typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk > system way back. > > OK but you have not indicated the values of X and Y, the length of A$ [ie LEN(A$)], and the value of B$. These are variables in line 100. One of these is causing the FC function error. Printing A$ and B$ may be enough to determine the problem. You may not have enough DATA lines or one may be too short. X and Y can tell you which DATA line to check. A too short line should be easy to spot just by listing the program but you will have to have entered line 1370 without the leading spaces. If LEN(A$) I want to try to put a 5,25" floppy drive that normally is hooked up to a CoCo to my Windows PC, so I can salvage a huge library of hundreds of floppies. Is this entirely possible? Any tips/hints/suggestions? Thnx, Fedor From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sun Oct 5 13:02:43 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 17:02:43 +0000 Subject: [Coco] OT: Guns and such Message-ID: <100520081702.17926.48E8F333000A0EF00000460622007610640B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> This has been off-topic to the List for a while. I'll stop when Dennis says to stop. Google "Vermont carry". From: Sean > On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 3:34 AM, wrote: > > Prefer .45 (1911) for close up, and my Marlin (old-fashion lever gun) for > range. (I've got one good eye, and I prefer iron sights, but my .308 has a good > old Bushnell). I mistyped here (blame it on the beer). My Marlin lever-gun is an 1894CS, .38 and .357. The scoped .308 is a bolt action. > > Sean, that is also one of my own favorite avocations. But I've got little use > for .223. OK for poodle-shooters. Works great on disks, no tactical function > except when you have a political reason to lose troops (common during 'Nam, > pandemic in Iraq). > > Going off topic a bit... .223 is very useful if you want an 'evil > black rifle' that ticks off the gun-grabbers. They look so scary! And they work so poorly. Note that they are only issued to low-end troops, while the uppers in the Homeland Stupidity Department carry MP-5s (not that I care for 9mm either). Every smart troop in Nam grabbed an AK as soon as he found one (generally pried from still-warm dead hands).. > Haven't tried my 1911 with the hard drive targets, I assumed it > wouldn't penetrate much. Doesn't have to. Seriously breaks the heads and the platters they're next to. Take them off the clothesline, put them in the coals of the charcoal grill while you're finishing supper, the data will evaporate. > I was actually at a machine-gun shoot today. Got to fire the > full-auto gun they use in Stargate SG1! (FN P90) > That and a Barrett .50 caliber. Those are awesome. Haven't done full auto (or even selective fire) since Basic. Yeah, it's fun. Got a few shots through a Barrett clone several years ago. Sweet. (My only .50 Cal is a muzzle loader, as illegal as anything else I didn't ask Trenton for permission to own). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From tlindner at macmess.org Sun Oct 5 13:27:05 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 10:27:05 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! Message-ID: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Here is an image from an UnderColor article: Near the end of that image there is some seriously messed up typesetting. (No offense Dennis!) :) Here is what I came up with: 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:Y=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16*16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);:PRINT at T2, P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END Here are scan of the whole article for context: And here is a close up of the listing: Thanks for any help! -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Sun Oct 5 13:43:34 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 18:43:34 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48E8FCC6.6050209@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Fedor Steeman wrote: > I want to try to put a 5,25" floppy drive that normally is hooked up > to a CoCo to my Windows PC, so I can salvage a huge library of > hundreds of floppies. Dunno if it'll work, depends if your drive is jumpered (or jumperable), to have a Disk change signal on Pin 34, which is what IIRC PCs expect. Also depends on what the drive is (no tracks & sides), and how old the PC you are going to attach it to is. Unfortunatly a lot of the modern PCs only support one floppy drive now, and most don't know about 5.25" drives either :( > Is this entirely possible? Any tips/hints/suggestions? May be easier to scout ebay for a cheap PC 360K or 1.2M drive. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From operator at coco3.com Sun Oct 5 14:26:43 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 13:26:43 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <20081005182646.F295620A36@qs281.pair.com> I took Typing I and II in high school and also owned a few old manual typewriters before I bought my first CoCo 2. In fact, I typed many of my first BASIC programs on a manual typewriter that weighed probably 40 lbs. It was good practice. I couldn't "weight" to get my first computer. Anyway, the messed up typing you showed appears to be from an old typewriter that had the paper grip lever not fully engaged (or worn). The paper was allowed to shift slightly left and right over time which is why the letters seem to float upwards and downwards. I've seen it many times. At 12:27 PM 10/5/2008, you wrote: >Here is an image from an UnderColor article: > >c-4.cktct-art-2.jpg> > >Near the end of that image there is some seriously messed up typesetting. >(No offense Dennis!) :) > >Here is what I came up with: > >95 >CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:Y=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16*16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);:PRINT at T2, >P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END > >Here are scan of the whole article for context: > >ue=850108&pagescans&images=850108-010,850108-011,850108-012> > >And here is a close up of the listing: > >c-4.cktct-lst-1.jpg> > >Thanks for any help! > >-- >tim lindner >tlindner at macmess.org Bright > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 14:21:52 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 11:21:52 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC References: Message-ID: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> Kind of. I keep an old 386 with MS-DOS / Windows 3.1 for this and it works fine - almost. But anything over that may not work. Sometimes I have to format the floppy on the PC, copy the files to it on the Coco and then read it on the PC. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fedor Steeman" > I want to try to put a 5,25" floppy drive that normally is hooked up > to a CoCo to my Windows PC, so I can salvage a huge library of > hundreds of floppies. > > Is this entirely possible? Any tips/hints/suggestions? > > Thnx, > Fedor From petrander at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 15:00:27 2008 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 21:00:27 +0200 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> Message-ID: > Dunno if it'll work, depends if your drive is jumpered (or jumperable), to > have a Disk change signal on Pin 34, which is what IIRC PCs expect. > Also depends on what the drive is (no tracks & sides), and how old the PC > you are going to attach it to is. The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... > Kind of. I keep an old 386 with MS-DOS / Windows 3.1 for this and it works > fine - almost. But anything over that may not work. I have a 5-year old DELL, Pentium 4, with Windows XP, so that may be way too advanced... Or not? > Sometimes I have to format the floppy on the PC, copy the files to it on the > Coco and then read it on the PC. Well, my earlier set up involved a Coco with a 3.5" and a 5.25" drive, and then I would copy stuff over to the 3,5" drive. I was looking into a possibility that was less tedious, so if I could just pop in the diskettes directly into to the PC that would it lower the threshold for me a lot for this actitvity. Cheers, Fedor 2008/10/5 Neil Morrison : > > Kind of. I keep an old 386 with MS-DOS / Windows 3.1 for this and it works > fine - almost. But anything over that may not work. > > Sometimes I have to format the floppy on the PC, copy the files to it on the > Coco and then read it on the PC. > > Neil > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fedor Steeman" > > >> I want to try to put a 5,25" floppy drive that normally is hooked up >> to a CoCo to my Windows PC, so I can salvage a huge library of >> hundreds of floppies. >> >> Is this entirely possible? Any tips/hints/suggestions? >> >> Thnx, >> Fedor > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From mechacoco at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 15:10:39 2008 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 13:10:39 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> Message-ID: <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: > > The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for > (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... > If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. Go to and use the links there to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. Darren From snhirsch at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 15:29:16 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 15:29:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems Message-ID: I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact disk model it's intended to be used with). Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not responsive. 100% repeatable. Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It counts to 0EF and stops. Does anyone have an idea about this? Why on earth does it simply stop? I could see getting hung on a bad sector, but if that was happening the access light would stay on. Steve -- From tonym at compusource.net Sun Oct 5 15:32:34 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 15:32:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OT: Guns and such References: <100520081702.17926.48E8F333000A0EF00000460622007610640B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <000d01c92721$1e90cd20$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 1:02 PM Subject: [Coco] OT: Guns and such > This has been off-topic to the List for a while. I'll stop when Dennis > says to stop. Google "Vermont carry". > Although Florida is blessed with a concealed-carry permit, and extra perks, like overriding business/employers about having a locked firearm in your car's glovebox in company parking lot, it is nowhere NEAR what Vermont style carry is. I can venture to say this: If all 50 states had Vermont style carry, violent crime would drop by at least 50-70%. Tony From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 15:41:45 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 12:41:45 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> Message-ID: With some floppies made on the Coco, all sector 1's were unreadable -something to do with gaps. By formatting on the PC you could read/write them with a PC or Coco. I had to copy 2 or 3 hundred myself, but only 10 or 20 needed this fix. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fedor Steeman" >> Sometimes I have to format the floppy on the PC, copy the files to it on >> the >> Coco and then read it on the PC. > > Well, my earlier set up involved a Coco with a 3.5" and a 5.25" drive, > and then I would copy stuff over to the 3,5" drive. I was looking into > a possibility that was less tedious, so if I could just pop in the > diskettes directly into to the PC that would it lower the threshold > for me a lot for this actitvity. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 20:16:00 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:16:00 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> tim lindner wrote: > Here is an image from an UnderColor article: > > c-4.cktct-art-2.jpg> > > Near the end of that image there is some seriously messed up typesetting. > (No offense Dennis!) :) > > Here is what I came up with: > > 95 > CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:Y=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16*16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);:PRINT at T2, > P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END > > Here are scan of the whole article for context: > > ue=850108&pagescans&images=850108-010,850108-011,850108-012> > > And here is a close up of the listing: > > c-4.cktct-lst-1.jpg> > > Thanks for any help! > My guess is that it can't be 16*16. Two reasons, first you would just use 256. Second, when X=1 the strings would over-print. Likewise Y= anything does not seem likely. T would be a better choice as the strings are printed @T and @T2. It would help to see the DATA statements but without them, my best guess would be: 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);: PRINT at T2,P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END Translating $1m1 into ,2 is a stretch but that might be clarified by seeing the DATA statements. From jps.subscriptions at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 17:58:01 2008 From: jps.subscriptions at gmail.com (J.P. Samson) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 15:58:01 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: On Oct 1, 2008, at 6:16 PM, Robert Gault wrote: > It would help to see the DATA statements but without them, my best > guess would be: > > 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);: > PRINT at T2,P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END Why use (X-1)*16+16 when you could use the mathematically equivalent X*16. But who knows if the programmer bothered to optimize! -- JP From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 1 22:37:59 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:37:59 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> J.P. Samson wrote: > On Oct 1, 2008, at 6:16 PM, Robert Gault wrote: >> It would help to see the DATA statements but without them, my best >> guess would be: >> >> 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);: >> PRINT at T2,P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END > > Why use (X-1)*16+16 when you could use the mathematically equivalent > X*16. But who knows if the programmer bothered to optimize! > > -- JP > Tim asked to translate the scan. There is no way the scan could be X*16, so even though that would be better than my proposed translation, it is not relevant. However, the choice for the character between the two 16s is relevant and significant. So what do you think it is? From badfrog at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 18:53:11 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 17:53:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9efa17da0810051553y33fbc7fdh3c7b8be65f90b9ba@mail.gmail.com> Is this the drive I sent with the controller, or a different drive? On Sun, Oct 5, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to > setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact > disk model it's intended to be used with). > > Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just > stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not responsive. > 100% repeatable. > > Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It > counts to 0EF and stops. > > Does anyone have an idea about this? Why on earth does it simply stop? I > could see getting hung on a bad sector, but if that was happening the access > light would stay on. > > Steve > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 19:21:22 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 16:21:22 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <0317BFF64DC54F0691915DF4876A0491@NewBaby> 95CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:Y=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T2,P$(X,1);:PRINT at T2,P$(X+1>1);:NEXTX:END Close as I can get but the '>' I'm not sure of. Comma? They printed the listing with a printer that mangles the character set. Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "tim lindner" > Here is an image from an UnderColor article: > http://cocomag.dyndns.org/UnderColor/850108/large/850108-011.850108-003-toc-4.cktct-art-2.jpg > > Near the end of that image there is some seriously messed up typesetting. > (No offense Dennis!) :) From chawks at dls.net Sun Oct 5 19:36:18 2008 From: chawks at dls.net (Christopher Hawks) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 18:36:18 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> Robert Gault said the following on 10/01/2008 09:37 PM: > J.P. Samson wrote: >> On Oct 1, 2008, at 6:16 PM, Robert Gault wrote: >>> It would help to see the DATA statements but without them, my best >>> guess would be: >>> >>> 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);: >>> PRINT at T2,P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END >> >> Why use (X-1)*16+16 when you could use the mathematically equivalent >> X*16. But who knows if the programmer bothered to optimize! >> >> -- JP >> > > Tim asked to translate the scan. There is no way the scan could be X*16, > so even though that would be better than my proposed translation, it is > not relevant. > > However, the choice for the character between the two 16s is relevant > and significant. So what do you think it is? I think it IS + The article says it prints out 2 columns and on a 32x16 screen the code will do exactly that. In fact that's what I thought it would do from looking at the code before I read the article. The (x-1)*16 and (x-1)*16+16 makes that very obvious. BTW: has anyone else noticed that Robert Gault's replies are from 3 days ago?? -- Christopher R. Hawks HAWKSoft --------------------------------------------------------- If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you. From deemcr at robinson-west.com Sun Oct 5 19:48:30 2008 From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 16:48:30 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1223250510.27035.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 13:14 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Michael C. Robinson wrote: > FC error in line100 > > > > December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a > > typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk > > system way back. > > When I change line 100 to be 1 to 12 instead of 0 to 12, the program works. Check works from tape just fine, but it doesn't work from drivewire. It is a royal pain to transfer everything onto tape, surely there is a better solution. From nutz4coco at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 19:51:15 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 16:51:15 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Help! Was Re: CoConutz in New Mexico Message-ID: <889830d00810051651v359a23ebw42ee8cad088c3c3f@mail.gmail.com> I'm suffering from a major case of disorganization and I need some help. I am trying to remember the name of a CoConut in New Mexico who I promised some older RAM to. I don't think it's Sockmaster. Can someone please help me? -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 12:35 PM, Jim Cox wrote: > I am trying to find a CoConut in New Mexico that I promised a bunch of old > RAM for. I have everything ready to ship out, I just need to hear from you > if you still want them. > > -Jim Cox > http://miba51.blogspot.com/ > http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ > From jps.subscriptions at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 19:52:51 2008 From: jps.subscriptions at gmail.com (J.P. Samson) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 17:52:51 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> Message-ID: <2C879A39-C991-4DEB-ACFC-64CD3F8CD085@gmail.com> On Oct 5, 2008, at 5:36 PM, Christopher Hawks wrote: > Robert Gault said the following on 10/01/2008 09:37 PM: >> J.P. Samson wrote: >>> On Oct 1, 2008, at 6:16 PM, Robert Gault wrote: >>>> It would help to see the DATA statements but without them, my >>>> best guess would be: >>>> >>>> 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X, >>>> 1);: >>>> PRINT at T2,P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END >>> >>> Why use (X-1)*16+16 when you could use the mathematically >>> equivalent X*16. But who knows if the programmer bothered to >>> optimize! >>> >> Tim asked to translate the scan. There is no way the scan could be >> X*16, so even though that would be better than my proposed >> translation, it is not relevant. >> However, the choice for the character between the two 16s is >> relevant and significant. So what do you think it is? > > BTW: has anyone else noticed that Robert Gault's replies are from 3 > days ago?? Good grief. Just what time zone ARE you in, Robert! ;-) My BASIC is more than a little rusty, but here goes... 95 CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:T=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16+16:PRINT at T,P$(X, 1);:PRINT at T2,P$(X+1,1);:NEXTX:END -- JP From dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com Sun Oct 5 19:54:09 2008 From: dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:54:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decipher this code! In-Reply-To: <0317BFF64DC54F0691915DF4876A0491@NewBaby> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <0317BFF64DC54F0691915DF4876A0491@NewBaby> Message-ID: <200810052357.m95NvrLX018926@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net> At 07:21 PM 10/5/2008, you wrote: >They printed the listing with a printer that mangles the character set. The listings were usually printed with a Radio Shack daisywheel, and here it's correct. On the other hand, the article texts were done with a phototypesetter -- this was before most small computers were used for final publishing right to film. Articles were proofed from galleys. The Electric Pencil files (used for my articles, and done on a Model I) were fine, but this was apparently a different source (too long ago for me to remember) and translated incorrectly. Shades of early PC/Mac issues! Nobody caught it in proofing -- which is probably my fault, since I was doing most of the final proofing. In retrospect, I'm aghast. One of my points of pride in more than 800 articles and eight books, plus magazines and editing publications, has always been compulsive accuracy. Subject line above appropriately corrected. :) Dennis Buy my new book! "We Are All Mozart" From snhirsch at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 21:27:44 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 21:27:44 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810051553y33fbc7fdh3c7b8be65f90b9ba@mail.gmail.com> References: <9efa17da0810051553y33fbc7fdh3c7b8be65f90b9ba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Sean wrote: > Is this the drive I sent with the controller, or a different drive? Unfortunately the drive you shipped was toast. I could read the directory, but that's about it. I'm thinking maybe it wasn't parked before shipment? Not a big deal either way - I have plenty of old drives around. The ones I'm having problems with are an ST225 and ST251 out of my junk bin. Both of them hang at the same point during verify, but seem to be working fine if I simply format without verification. Not really sure what the heck is going on. > On Sun, Oct 5, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to >> setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact >> disk model it's intended to be used with). >> >> Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just >> stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not responsive. >> 100% repeatable. >> >> Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It >> counts to 0EF and stops. >> >> Does anyone have an idea about this? Why on earth does it simply stop? I >> could see getting hung on a bad sector, but if that was happening the access >> light would stay on. >> >> Steve >> >> >> -- >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- From badfrog at gmail.com Sun Oct 5 22:23:16 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 21:23:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: <9efa17da0810051553y33fbc7fdh3c7b8be65f90b9ba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810051923t612a0d5fs98aee27d11a5e078@mail.gmail.com> Nope, I definitely parked the heads. Just the issues of moving antique hard drives I guess. On Sun, Oct 5, 2008 at 8:27 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Sean wrote: > >> Is this the drive I sent with the controller, or a different drive? > > Unfortunately the drive you shipped was toast. I could read the directory, > but that's about it. I'm thinking maybe it wasn't parked before shipment? > Not a big deal either way - I have plenty of old drives around. > > The ones I'm having problems with are an ST225 and ST251 out of my junk bin. > Both of them hang at the same point during verify, but seem to be working > fine if I simply format without verification. > > Not really sure what the heck is going on. > > > >> On Sun, Oct 5, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>> >>> I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to >>> setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact >>> disk model it's intended to be used with). >>> >>> Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just >>> stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not >>> responsive. >>> 100% repeatable. >>> >>> Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It >>> counts to 0EF and stops. >>> >>> Does anyone have an idea about this? Why on earth does it simply stop? >>> I >>> could see getting hung on a bad sector, but if that was happening the >>> access >>> light would stay on. >>> >>> Steve >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From alxevans at concentric.net Sun Oct 5 23:19:14 2008 From: alxevans at concentric.net (Theodore (Alex) Evans) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 20:19:14 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Help! Was Re: CoConutz in New Mexico In-Reply-To: <889830d00810051651v359a23ebw42ee8cad088c3c3f@mail.gmail.com> References: <889830d00810051651v359a23ebw42ee8cad088c3c3f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48E983B2.6080108@concentric.net> Jim Cox wrote: > I'm suffering from a major case of disorganization and I need some help. I > am trying to remember the name of a CoConut in New Mexico who I promised > some older RAM to. I don't think it's Sockmaster. Can someone please help > me? Could you be looking for Willard Goosey? From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Oct 5 23:30:23 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:30:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> Message-ID: <48E9864F.7010007@worldnet.att.net> Christopher Hawks wrote: > BTW: has anyone else noticed that Robert Gault's replies are from 3 days > ago?? > > Thanks for noticing that. Somehow my PC clock got messed up. :( It should be correct now. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Oct 5 23:32:29 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:32:29 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <2C879A39-C991-4DEB-ACFC-64CD3F8CD085@gmail.com> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48E412C0.5000707@worldnet.att.net> <48E43407.80903@worldnet.att.net> <48E94F72.1090703@dls.net> <2C879A39-C991-4DEB-ACFC-64CD3F8CD085@gmail.com> Message-ID: <48E986CD.6070602@worldnet.att.net> J.P. Samson wrote: > Good grief. Just what time zone ARE you in, Robert! ;-) Spaced out?! Aren't computer wonderful? If the date continues to drift, I'll have to check the battery. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Oct 5 23:35:40 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:35:40 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OT: Guns and such In-Reply-To: <000d01c92721$1e90cd20$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <100520081702.17926.48E8F333000A0EF00000460622007610640B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> <000d01c92721$1e90cd20$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <200810052335.41010.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 05 October 2008, Tony wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 1:02 PM >Subject: [Coco] OT: Guns and such > >> This has been off-topic to the List for a while. I'll stop when Dennis >> says to stop. Google "Vermont carry". > >Although Florida is blessed with a concealed-carry permit, and extra perks, >like overriding business/employers >about having a locked firearm in your car's glovebox in company parking lot, >it is nowhere NEAR what Vermont >style carry is. > >I can venture to say this: > >If all 50 states had Vermont style carry, violent crime would drop by at >least 50-70%. > >Tony > I think your estimate could be low, Tony. An armed society is a polite society. > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "Never ascribe to malice that which is caused by greed and ignorance." -- Cal Keegan From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Oct 5 23:35:46 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:35:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223250510.27035.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> <1223250510.27035.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <48E98792.9010602@worldnet.att.net> Michael C. Robinson wrote: > On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 13:14 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: >> Michael C. Robinson wrote: >> FC error in line100 >>> December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a >>> typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk >>> system way back. >>> > When I change line 100 to be 1 to 12 instead of 0 to 12, the program > works. Check works from tape just fine, but it doesn't work from > drivewire. It is a royal pain to transfer everything onto tape, surely > there is a better solution. > I think I may have a version which will work with drivewire. I can't test it not having the software, but it does now work with RGBDOS. Mike, would you test it and let the list know the results? 10 REM CHECKPLUS 20 LI=80 30 FOR M=&H7FB2 TO &H7FF9 STEP10:SUM=0 40 FOR I=0TO9:READA$:VA=VAL("&H"+A$):SUM=SUM+VA:POKE M+I,VA:NEXT:READ CHK:IFSUM<>CHK THEN PRINT"ERROR IN LINE"LI:END 50 LI=LI+10:NEXT 52 EXEC&H7FB2:END:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE60 60 'SAVEM "CHKPLUS",&H7FB2,&H7FF9,&H7FB2:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE52 70 END 80 DATA B6, 1 , 6A, 86, 7E, B7, 1 , 6A, BE, 1 , 1030 90 DATA 6B, 30, 8C, 4 , BF, 1 , 6B, 39, 81, A , 794 100 DATA 26, 26, 34, 16, 4F, 9E, 19, E6, 81, 27, 810 110 DATA C , AB, 80, AB, 80, E6, 84, 26, FA, 30, 1308 120 DATA 1 , 20, F0, B7, 2 , DE, 30, 8C, E , 9F, 1041 130 DATA A6, A6, 84, 1C, FE, BD, AD, C6, 35, 16, 1381 140 DATA 7E, C5, BC, 87, FF, 86, 28, 37, 33, 34, 1233 150 DATA 29, 0 , 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 41 From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Oct 5 23:37:14 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:37:14 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Decypher this code! In-Reply-To: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1ioc1no.1ktjjv41y8q0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <200810052337.14141.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 05 October 2008, tim lindner wrote: Tim, please turn off the line wrap when posting such long link lines. Thanks. >Here is an image from an UnderColor article: > >c-4.cktct-art-2.jpg> > >Near the end of that image there is some seriously messed up typesetting. >(No offense Dennis!) :) > >Here is what I came up with: > >95 >CLS(0):FORX=1TO26STEP2:Y=(X-1)*16:T2=(X-1)*16*16:PRINT at T,P$(X,1);:PRINT at T2, >P$(X,2);:NEXTX:END > >Here are scan of the whole article for context: > >ue=850108&pagescans&images=850108-010,850108-011,850108-012> > >And here is a close up of the listing: > >c-4.cktct-lst-1.jpg> > >Thanks for any help! -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Kaylee: "So, when we made love last night..." Simon: "When we what???" Kaylee: "You really are such an easy mark!" --Episode #7, "Jaynestown" From nutz4coco at gmail.com Mon Oct 6 00:59:24 2008 From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox) Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 21:59:24 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Help! Was Re: CoConutz in New Mexico In-Reply-To: <48E983B2.6080108@concentric.net> References: <889830d00810051651v359a23ebw42ee8cad088c3c3f@mail.gmail.com> <48E983B2.6080108@concentric.net> Message-ID: <889830d00810052159n118c6a16mba61e413cbb9bd8d@mail.gmail.com> THANK YOU! Yes, that is the name. -Jim Cox http://miba51.blogspot.com/ http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/ On Sun, Oct 5, 2008 at 8:19 PM, Theodore (Alex) Evans < alxevans at concentric.net> wrote: > Jim Cox wrote: > >> I'm suffering from a major case of disorganization and I need some help. >> I >> am trying to remember the name of a CoConut in New Mexico who I promised >> some older RAM to. I don't think it's Sockmaster. Can someone please >> help >> me? >> > > Could you be looking for Willard Goosey? > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Oct 6 06:05:53 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 06:05:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1223287553.14915.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 15:29 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: > I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to > setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact > disk model it's intended to be used with). > > Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just > stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not > responsive. 100% repeatable. > > Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It > counts to 0EF and stops. Does your device descriptor have the right geometry in it? I'm thinking that the driver may be eating itself on geometry calcuations - e.g., both those drives have 17 sectors per track, and I don't think it's a coincidence that it's hanging on the [(17 * 7) + 1]th sector (I assume it blocks/unblocks the 512-byte sectors). That's the only thing that comes immediately to mind. C. From snhirsch at gmail.com Mon Oct 6 07:38:30 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 07:38:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: <1223287553.14915.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> References: <1223287553.14915.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >> I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to >> setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact >> disk model it's intended to be used with). >> >> Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just >> stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not >> responsive. 100% repeatable. >> >> Thinking the drive might be bad, I tried an ST251. Same exact thing! It >> counts to 0EF and stops. > > Does your device descriptor have the right geometry in it? I'm thinking > that the driver may be eating itself on geometry calcuations - e.g., > both those drives have 17 sectors per track, and I don't think it's a > coincidence that it's hanging on the [(17 * 7) + 1]th sector (I assume > it blocks/unblocks the 512-byte sectors). > > That's the only thing that comes immediately to mind. I'm sure it's something like that. I'm extremely suspect of the utility that generates the descriptors. But, if that's the case I'd expect it to return to the command prompt instead of hanging up. When I run dcheck on the drive it reports the expected size, so I'm hoping things are functional. Steve -- From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Oct 6 09:17:45 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 09:17:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: <1223287553.14915.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: On Oct 6, 2008, at 7:38 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> >> Does your device descriptor have the right geometry in it? I'm >> thinking >> that the driver may be eating itself on geometry calcuations - e.g., >> > I'm sure it's something like that. I'm extremely suspect of the > utility that generates the descriptors. But, if that's the case > I'd expect it to return to the command prompt instead of hanging up. > Hah, you'd think that, but OS-9 drivers come in varying qualities, and some don't handle error conditions very well. I'm guessing the drivers are in the NitrOS-9 tree, I'll take a look. > When I run dcheck on the drive it reports the expected size, so I'm > hoping things are functional. Given that dcheck will only read limited portions of the disk, don't be so sure :) C. From deemcr at robinson-west.com Mon Oct 6 19:13:36 2008 From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson) Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 16:13:36 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <48E98792.9010602@worldnet.att.net> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> <1223250510.27035.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E98792.9010602@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1223334816.6475.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 23:35 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Michael C. Robinson wrote: > > On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 13:14 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > >> Michael C. Robinson wrote: > >> FC error in line100 > >>> December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a > >>> typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk > >>> system way back. > >>> > > When I change line 100 to be 1 to 12 instead of 0 to 12, the program > > works. Check works from tape just fine, but it doesn't work from > > drivewire. It is a royal pain to transfer everything onto tape, surely > > there is a better solution. > > > > I think I may have a version which will work with drivewire. I can't > test it not having the software, but it does now work with RGBDOS. > > Mike, would you test it and let the list know the results? > > 10 REM CHECKPLUS > 20 LI=80 > 30 FOR M=&H7FB2 TO &H7FF9 STEP10:SUM=0 > 40 FOR I=0TO9:READA$:VA=VAL("&H"+A$):SUM=SUM+VA:POKE M+I,VA:NEXT:READ > CHK:IFSUM<>CHK THEN PRINT"ERROR IN LINE"LI:END > 50 LI=LI+10:NEXT > 52 EXEC&H7FB2:END:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE60 > 60 'SAVEM "CHKPLUS",&H7FB2,&H7FF9,&H7FB2:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE52 > 70 END > 80 DATA B6, 1 , 6A, 86, 7E, B7, 1 , 6A, BE, 1 , 1030 > 90 DATA 6B, 30, 8C, 4 , BF, 1 , 6B, 39, 81, A , 794 > 100 DATA 26, 26, 34, 16, 4F, 9E, 19, E6, 81, 27, 810 > 110 DATA C , AB, 80, AB, 80, E6, 84, 26, FA, 30, 1308 > 120 DATA 1 , 20, F0, B7, 2 , DE, 30, 8C, E , 9F, 1041 > 130 DATA A6, A6, 84, 1C, FE, BD, AD, C6, 35, 16, 1381 > 140 DATA 7E, C5, BC, 87, FF, 86, 28, 37, 33, 34, 1233 > 150 DATA 29, 0 , 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 41 Definitely need to use line 60 instead of 52. Everytime I load or save via drivewire, the program gets wiped out or messed up somehow. I can load the assembly language file and exec it no problem. Thank you for posting this. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Oct 6 20:08:06 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 20:08:06 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Suggestion if you are working on Under Color proofreading Message-ID: <48EAA866.3050702@worldnet.att.net> I should have thought of this some time ago because it seems obvious. However, since I did not, perhaps this will help others working on the Under Color proofreading. If you are using a flat panel display, change to native resolution before working on the project. The improvement in reading the scans is significant. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Oct 6 20:15:07 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 20:15:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Trouble with check In-Reply-To: <1223334816.6475.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> References: <48E35E05.9020201@worldnet.att.net> <1223170855.28866.2.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E380BF.9010607@worldnet.att.net> <1223184521.31129.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E3AFF2.1090705@worldnet.att.net> <1223250510.27035.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> <48E98792.9010602@worldnet.att.net> <1223334816.6475.1.camel@goose.robinson-west.com> Message-ID: <48EAAA0B.1060706@worldnet.att.net> Michael C. Robinson wrote: > On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 23:35 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: >> Michael C. Robinson wrote: >>> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 13:14 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: >>>> Michael C. Robinson wrote: >>>> FC error in line100 >>>>> December 1989 page 47. The program quits on line 100. It could be a >>>>> typo, but check doesn't work with drivewire. It did work with my disk >>>>> system way back. >>>>> >>> When I change line 100 to be 1 to 12 instead of 0 to 12, the program >>> works. Check works from tape just fine, but it doesn't work from >>> drivewire. It is a royal pain to transfer everything onto tape, surely >>> there is a better solution. >>> >> I think I may have a version which will work with drivewire. I can't >> test it not having the software, but it does now work with RGBDOS. >> >> Mike, would you test it and let the list know the results? >> >> 10 REM CHECKPLUS >> 20 LI=80 >> 30 FOR M=&H7FB2 TO &H7FF9 STEP10:SUM=0 >> 40 FOR I=0TO9:READA$:VA=VAL("&H"+A$):SUM=SUM+VA:POKE M+I,VA:NEXT:READ >> CHK:IFSUM<>CHK THEN PRINT"ERROR IN LINE"LI:END >> 50 LI=LI+10:NEXT >> 52 EXEC&H7FB2:END:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE60 >> 60 'SAVEM "CHKPLUS",&H7FB2,&H7FF9,&H7FB2:' ALTERNATIVE FOR LINE52 >> 70 END >> 80 DATA B6, 1 , 6A, 86, 7E, B7, 1 , 6A, BE, 1 , 1030 >> 90 DATA 6B, 30, 8C, 4 , BF, 1 , 6B, 39, 81, A , 794 >> 100 DATA 26, 26, 34, 16, 4F, 9E, 19, E6, 81, 27, 810 >> 110 DATA C , AB, 80, AB, 80, E6, 84, 26, FA, 30, 1308 >> 120 DATA 1 , 20, F0, B7, 2 , DE, 30, 8C, E , 9F, 1041 >> 130 DATA A6, A6, 84, 1C, FE, BD, AD, C6, 35, 16, 1381 >> 140 DATA 7E, C5, BC, 87, FF, 86, 28, 37, 33, 34, 1233 >> 150 DATA 29, 0 , 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 00, 41 > > Definitely need to use line 60 instead of 52. Everytime > I load or save via drivewire, the program gets wiped out > or messed up somehow. I can load the assembly language > file and exec it no problem. Thank you for posting this. > > Glad it works. What I did is hard code the contents of $16A assuming the presence of a modified DOS1.1; which I expected to be used by HDBDOS as that's what is used by RGBDOS. FlexiKey will not work after this program is installed, but you just need to cold restart to get it back. Also the above can't be used with DOS1.0 derivatives. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Oct 6 22:00:04 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 22:00:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MC-10 service manual? Message-ID: Anyone know where I can get this? PDF is best I guess.. c. From tonym at compusource.net Mon Oct 6 23:08:58 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 03:08:58 GMT Subject: [Coco] MC-10 service manual? Message-ID: <200810062308401.SM04548@[63.69.23.239]> http://www.old-computers.com/museum/docs/tandy_mc10_service-manual.zip I *KNEW* I had seen one SOMEWHERE?!?!? Tony -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Youse cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sent 10/6/2008 10:00:04 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: [Coco] MC-10 service manual? Anyone know where I can get this? PDF is best I guess.. c. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From petrander at gmail.com Tue Oct 7 04:11:33 2008 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 10:11:33 +0200 Subject: [Coco] Connect CoCo Floppy drive to Windows PC In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> References: <61EB3E81530F416B87881DCEF2DCCC81@NewBaby> <5d802cd0810051210jc5e58f7m5c82f15eb9d54aae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Awesome, you guys! I will give it a shot as soon as I can! Thnx, Fedor 2008/10/5 Darren A : > On 10/5/08, Fedor Steeman wrote: >> >> The drives are jumperable and they look like they could be used for >> (earlier) PCs as well, so I have my hopes up... >> > > If you can configure the drive to respond as Drive 1 (not 0) on the > CoCo, then it will likely work on the PC in that configuration. > Setting a jumper to enable READY may also be required. > > Go to and use the links there > to download the fdrawcmd.sys driver and the CoCoDisk utility. These > will allow you to access coco floppies on a Windows XP machine. > > Darren > > 2008/10/5 Neil Morrison : > > With some floppies made on the Coco, all sector 1's were unreadable > -something to do with gaps. By formatting on the PC you could read/write > them with a PC or Coco. I had to copy 2 or 3 hundred myself, but only 10 or > 20 needed this fix. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Oct 7 08:32:42 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 08:32:42 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MC-10 service manual? In-Reply-To: <200810062308401.SM04548@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200810062308401.SM04548@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <1223382762.29110.4.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Tue, 2008-10-07 at 03:08 +0000, tonym wrote: > http://www.old-computers.com/museum/docs/tandy_mc10_service-manual.zip > > I *KNEW* I had seen one SOMEWHERE?!?!? > > Tony Most excellent! C. From dml_68 at yahoo.com Tue Oct 7 10:35:08 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 07:35:08 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Tom Mix Software on Wikipedia Message-ID: <426686.96786.qm@web30203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Was poking around Wikipedia for something and saw that the Tom Mix Software entry was blank. Anyone who knows the history of the company and has a list of all the different games may want to fill in the blanks here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Mix_Software ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** From linville at tuxdriver.com Tue Oct 7 11:09:34 2008 From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 11:09:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> Interesting news... :-) http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From jcewy at swbell.net Tue Oct 7 11:37:37 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 10:37:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <48EB8241.1010301@swbell.net> John W. Linville wrote: > Interesting news... :-) > > http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > Looks like that's for AmigaOS 4, which is PPC only IIRC? So it probably won't work on my A1000 or A500. :) I wish you could get AmigaOS 4 to run on a PPC Mac. That hardware is falling out of the trees and rotting on the ground. But PPC upgrades for Amiga hardware, or Amiga One or Pegasos boards still cost money if you can even find them at all. I guess I'll have to run XRoar on Linux, not that that's any real hardship... Or plug in a real CoCo! JCE From tonym at compusource.net Tue Oct 7 12:02:28 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 16:02:28 GMT Subject: [Coco] Disto original diskettes imaged Message-ID: <200810071202653.SM09440@[63.69.23.239]> After receiving the Disto SCII from Sean, I have imaged the 3 disks that were included: 1) RTime ECB diskette (SET.BAS) 2) RTime OS9 Level 2 Disk 3) SC II OS9 Level 2 Disk Let me know if I need to upload it somewhere. Does maltedmedia have an upload folder? T From benbleau at gmail.com Tue Oct 7 13:16:45 2008 From: benbleau at gmail.com (Benoit Bleau) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:16:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto original diskettes imaged In-Reply-To: <200810071202653.SM09440@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200810071202653.SM09440@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <48EB997D.4020004@gmail.com> tonym wrote: > After receiving the Disto SCII from Sean, I have imaged the 3 disks that were included: > > 1) RTime ECB diskette (SET.BAS) > 2) RTime OS9 Level 2 Disk > 3) SC II OS9 Level 2 Disk > > Let me know if I need to upload it somewhere. > Does maltedmedia have an upload folder? > Nice, I too have a SCII controller, but no disks. I think that you can ftp to ftp.maltedmedia.com in the /incoming directory, and let Denis know about your transfers. Anyone has the utilities (os-9 and rs-dos) that came with the 2meg board? I'm missing these as well. -Benoit From devries.bob at gmail.com Tue Oct 7 16:35:13 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 06:35:13 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Disto original diskettes imaged References: <200810071202653.SM09440@[63.69.23.239]> <48EB997D.4020004@gmail.com> Message-ID: <004301c928bc$36181380$0701a8c0@master> I have a disk image of that. Contact me offlist and I'll email it to you. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Benoit Bleau" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 3:16 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto original diskettes imaged > tonym wrote: >> After receiving the Disto SCII from Sean, I have imaged the 3 disks that >> were included: >> >> 1) RTime ECB diskette (SET.BAS) >> 2) RTime OS9 Level 2 Disk >> 3) SC II OS9 Level 2 Disk >> >> Let me know if I need to upload it somewhere. >> Does maltedmedia have an upload folder? >> > Nice, I too have a SCII controller, but no disks. I think that you can ftp > to ftp.maltedmedia.com in the /incoming directory, and let Denis know > about your transfers. > > Anyone has the utilities (os-9 and rs-dos) that came with the 2meg board? > I'm missing these as well. > > -Benoit > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From t.fadden at cox.net Tue Oct 7 20:44:27 2008 From: t.fadden at cox.net (Tim Fadden) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 17:44:27 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. Message-ID: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. Tim fadden From tonym at compusource.net Tue Oct 7 20:57:07 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 00:57:07 GMT Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. Message-ID: <200810072057306.SM08888@[63.69.23.239]> Would that be me? I gave the M PROM I had to Roger... Tony -----Original Message----- From: Tim Fadden t.fadden at cox.net Sent 10/7/2008 8:44:27 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. Tim fadden -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From operator at coco3.com Tue Oct 7 21:31:35 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 20:31:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. In-Reply-To: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> Message-ID: <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super >II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. > >Tim fadden Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have a daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that since it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't know what else it has. The connector on the side of the daughterboard looks like an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp From tonym at compusource.net Tue Oct 7 21:50:59 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 01:50:59 GMT Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. Message-ID: <20081007215079.SM08888@[63.69.23.239]> >-----Original Message----- >From: Roger Taylor operator at coco3.com >Sent 10/7/2008 9:31:35 PM >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com >Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > >At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super >II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. > >Tim fadden > > > >Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have >a daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that >since it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't >know what else it has. The connector on the side of the >daughterboard looks like an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. > Roger - an RTime, has a clock, and that 17x2 header, which is a parallel. A 3-in-1, has the clock, the 17x2 header parallel, and then a 4x2 (I think) right behind the 17x2, which is a serial A 4-in-1 I haven't actually SEEN.... but I assume there's gotta be a SCSI connector somewhere... it's RTC/Ser/Par/SCSI As you all know, I've been whining here, coco3.com forums, vintage-computer, cctalk, and about everywhere else, looking for one :) Tony From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com Tue Oct 7 21:58:06 2008 From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 21:58:06 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. In-Reply-To: <20081007215079.SM08888@[63.69.23.239]> References: <20081007215079.SM08888@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <9m4oe4p9ftj95uku9gupdvb582siconnvq@4ax.com> On Wed, 08 Oct 2008 01:50:59 GMT, "tonym" had a flock of green cheek conures squawk out: >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Roger Taylor operator at coco3.com >>Sent 10/7/2008 9:31:35 PM >>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com >>Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. >> >>At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super >>II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >> >>Tim fadden >> >> >> >>Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have >>a daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that >>since it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't >>know what else it has. The connector on the side of the >>daughterboard looks like an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. >> > >Roger - >an RTime, has a clock, and that 17x2 header, which is a parallel. >A 3-in-1, has the clock, the 17x2 header parallel, and then a 4x2 (I think) right behind the 17x2, which is a serial >A 4-in-1 I haven't actually SEEN.... but I assume there's gotta be a SCSI connector somewhere... it's RTC/Ser/Par/SCSI > >As you all know, I've been whining here, coco3.com forums, vintage-computer, cctalk, and about everywhere else, >looking for one :) > > >Tony And don't forget the 2-in-1 has RS-232 and SCSI. I have one of those. -- Stephen From devries.bob at gmail.com Tue Oct 7 22:00:50 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:00:50 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <00bd01c928e9$bb041df0$0701a8c0@master> ok, Find pics of my 4-in-1 at: http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/PA080007.JPG http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/PA080008.JPG -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super >>II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >> >>Tim fadden > > > > Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have > a daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that > since it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't > know what else it has. The connector on the side of the > daughterboard looks like an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tonym at compusource.net Tue Oct 7 22:10:12 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 22:10:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. References: <20081007215079.SM08888@[63.69.23.239]> <9m4oe4p9ftj95uku9gupdvb582siconnvq@4ax.com> Message-ID: <000601c928eb$009e26c0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Stephen Castello" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 9:58 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > >>Roger - >>an RTime, has a clock, and that 17x2 header, which is a parallel. >>A 3-in-1, has the clock, the 17x2 header parallel, and then a 4x2 (I >>think) right behind the 17x2, which is a serial >>A 4-in-1 I haven't actually SEEN.... but I assume there's gotta be a SCSI >>connector somewhere... it's RTC/Ser/Par/SCSI >> >>As you all know, I've been whining here, coco3.com forums, >>vintage-computer, cctalk, and about everywhere else, >>looking for one :) >> >> > > And don't forget the 2-in-1 has RS-232 and SCSI. I have one of those. > -- > > Stephen That's one I didn't know about.... Dude made alot of options, didn't he? Tony From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Oct 7 22:23:26 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 22:23:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <200810072223.26312.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: >Interesting news... :-) > >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring myself to bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) If you can survive death, you can probably survive anything. From devries.bob at gmail.com Tue Oct 7 22:28:21 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:28:21 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <00f101c928ed$8d14f190$0701a8c0@master> And while I'm on a roll..... Here's my 3-in-1: http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_component_side.JPG http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_solder_side.JPG My 3-in-1 has had a battery transplant. At the time, I couldn't find any of the CR2032 batteries with solder tags, hence the somewhat nasty soldering job. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super II >>controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >> >>Tim fadden > > > > Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have a > daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that since > it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't know what else > it has. The connector on the side of the daughterboard looks like an IDE > header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. > > -- > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tonym at compusource.net Tue Oct 7 22:49:13 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 22:49:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net><20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> <00f101c928ed$8d14f190$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <003d01c928f0$72f216a0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> While the "rolling momentum" continues...here's a couple I have, well, one I have for now :) Disto RTime Clock+Parallel: http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1309.jpg http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1310.jpg Disto M PROM EPROM Burner: http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1311.jpg http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1312.jpg Tony ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Devries" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 10:28 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > And while I'm on a roll..... > > Here's my 3-in-1: > > http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_component_side.JPG > http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_solder_side.JPG > > My 3-in-1 has had a battery transplant. At the time, I couldn't find any > of the CR2032 batteries with solder tags, hence the somewhat nasty > soldering job. > > -- > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia > > Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me > the capacity to be his spokesman, > so that I know how to help the weary. > > website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl > my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Roger Taylor" > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 11:31 AM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > > >> At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>>Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super II >>>controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>>Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >>> >>>Tim fadden >> >> >> >> Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have a >> daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that since >> it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't know what >> else it has. The connector on the side of the daughterboard looks like >> an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. >> >> -- >> Roger Taylor >> >> http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Oct 7 23:09:14 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:09:14 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. In-Reply-To: <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200810072309.14318.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 07 October 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: >At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super >>II controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >> >>Tim fadden > >Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have >a daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that >since it has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't >know what else it has. The connector on the side of the >daughterboard looks like an IDE header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. Out of my scanner, & smunched some, its still half a megabyte, and my uplink is slow so give it time to load, then save as I'll probably kill it in a day or so. blow it up, I added some notes here and there. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) NEVER RESPOND TO CRITICAL PRESS. IT IS A GAME YOU CAN ONLY LOSE, AND IT MAKES US LOOK BAD. -- Bruce Perens From badfrog at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 01:23:04 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 00:23:04 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. In-Reply-To: <003d01c928f0$72f216a0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <48EC026B.7080801@cox.net> <20081008013146.4F2CC20A35@qs281.pair.com> <00f101c928ed$8d14f190$0701a8c0@master> <003d01c928f0$72f216a0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810072223o50d67028v6a2438a443a4ae45@mail.gmail.com> Some remote part of my brain is still going "why did you get rid of that???" But I'm glad it will actually be used... :) Sean On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 9:49 PM, Tony wrote: > While the "rolling momentum" continues...here's a couple I have, well, one I > have for now :) > > Disto RTime Clock+Parallel: > > http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1309.jpg > http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1310.jpg > > > Disto M PROM EPROM Burner: > > http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1311.jpg > http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l33/Sharkonwheels/CoCo%20Stuff/IMG_1312.jpg > > > Tony > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Devries" > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 10:28 PM > Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. > > >> And while I'm on a roll..... >> >> Here's my 3-in-1: >> >> >> http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_component_side.JPG >> http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/Disto_3_in_1_solder_side.JPG >> >> My 3-in-1 has had a battery transplant. At the time, I couldn't find any >> of the CR2032 batteries with solder tags, hence the somewhat nasty soldering >> job. >> >> -- >> Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia >> >> Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me >> the capacity to be his spokesman, >> so that I know how to help the weary. >> >> website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl >> my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" >> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 11:31 AM >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto super II 4in1 adapter. >> >> >>> At 07:44 PM 10/7/2008, you wrote: >>>> >>>> Some one was looking for the 4in1 daughter card for the Disto Super II >>>> controller. For the life of me I can't find who it was! >>>> Any way if you read this and still need one, give me a reply. >>>> >>>> Tim fadden >>> >>> >>> >>> Can someone take a good picture of a 4-in-1 and post the URL? I have a >>> daughterboard in my Super Controller (1?) and can only confirm that since it >>> has a battery that is has a real-time clock, but I don't know what else it >>> has. The connector on the side of the daughterboard looks like an IDE >>> header, 17 x 2 pins with 4 pins missing. >>> >>> -- >>> Roger Taylor >>> >>> http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From dml_68 at yahoo.com Wed Oct 8 14:28:59 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 11:28:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online Message-ID: <509277.31995.qm@web30204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Here is the latest in my ongoing archive project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the archives please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my previous archive updates on the coco3.com message forum http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** From cappy2112 at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 14:50:46 2008 From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 11:50:46 -0700 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <8249c4ac0810081150m14c2e31bge8342f7994944216@mail.gmail.com> You may want to try this one too. http://www.amigaforever.com/ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 11:09:34 -0400 From: "John W. Linville" Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga To: coco at maltedmedia.com Message-ID: <20081007150932.GA8272 at tuxdriver.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Interesting news... :-) http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html -- John W. Linville Linux should be at the core linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From cocomalt at 6809.org.uk Wed Oct 8 16:36:48 2008 From: cocomalt at 6809.org.uk (Ciaran Anscomb) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 21:36:48 +0100 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> Message-ID: <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> "John W. Linville" wrote: > Interesting news... :-) > > http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html Blimey, didn't realise anyone really still used AmigaOS. That's cool, just wish I could try it out ;) ..ciaran -- Ciaran Anscomb, Perl/C Hacker From mechacoco at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 16:56:00 2008 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 14:56:00 -0600 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> Message-ID: <5d802cd0810081356g323fb46et755430240ee40dc0@mail.gmail.com> On 10/8/08, Ciaran Anscomb wrote: > > Blimey, didn't realise anyone really still used AmigaOS. > ... Hee Hee... That's kinda funny coming from a member of a group who still use CoCos :-) Darren From georgeramsower at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 17:57:36 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 16:57:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time Message-ID: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. I was wondering if it's possible to issue a BO9 statement that could disable any non-critical interruptions in OS9 to give maximum CPU time to the routine inside a B09 program, such as when I'm stepping the motors in my Coco CNC machine. After the stepping is done, then I wish to issue a statement to put things back like they were. Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like those, but don't undstand them. Current progress in this project is that I can now engrave an aluminum plate with the name of the company I work for and the equipment number below the name. I need to get a photo of that onto my Coco site. http://coco.thetinbox.com Engraving can be done FAST with a dremmel. Speed would help. George From spam_proof at verizon.net Wed Oct 8 18:15:38 2008 From: spam_proof at verizon.net (Aaron Banerjee) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 18:15:38 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Show-and-tell project... Message-ID: <1576FDA1-04DB-4042-AAC4-BFF1016248E1@verizon.net> All: I'm working on an idea for my son's (2nd grade) school work. What I'd like to do is set up an "operational" BBS and show how computers used to talk to each other. I've got several cocos and 2 operational modems -- one of them even has the "high speed" light come on if it connects at 2400 baud... The other modem is a Modem IB (cradle switch). Out of curiosity, does anyone have a working acoustic modem? I had a Volksmodem years ago, but it is long gone. I have an old telephone that is of the right shape for an acoustic modem. If you have such a device that you could loan/sell, please contact me offline. Thanks. One more thing. I seem to have misplaced my copy of the all-ram BBS program. Again, suggestions for what would be the best demonstration would be greatly appreciated. By the way, my son likes some of the old coco games. We used to spend hours playing "Peanut Butter Panic". He still uses the coco when he wants to know when the next solar or lunar eclipse is... - Aaron From daveekelly1 at embarqmail.com Wed Oct 8 18:48:25 2008 From: daveekelly1 at embarqmail.com (Dave Kelly) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:48:25 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time In-Reply-To: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <48ED38B9.4080204@embarqmail.com> George Ramsower wrote: > I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. > Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like > those, but don't undstand Have you looked at priorities? I seem to remember setting it higher you could conceivably cause one application to bring your system to its knees. From tonym at compusource.net Wed Oct 8 19:17:43 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 23:17:43 GMT Subject: [Coco] Show-and-tell project... Message-ID: <200810081917219.SM09800@[63.69.23.239]> ALLRAM is here, but I think it isn't coco3 compatible, or needs a patch: http://www.bbsdocumentary.com/software/TANDY/RSDOS/ALLRAM/ I DO have some cups for a Tandy Model 100, if those will work in any way. Mebbe the 1B has the jack for the cups, or something.... Tony -----Original Message----- From: Aaron Banerjee spam_proof at verizon.net Sent 10/8/2008 6:15:38 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: [Coco] Show-and-tell project... All: I'm working on an idea for my son's (2nd grade) school work. What I'd like to do is set up an "operational" BBS and show how computers used to talk to each other. I've got several cocos and 2 operational modems -- one of them even has the "high speed" light come on if it connects at 2400 baud... The other modem is a Modem IB (cradle switch). Out of curiosity, does anyone have a working acoustic modem? I had a Volksmodem years ago, but it is long gone. I have an old telephone that is of the right shape for an acoustic modem. If you have such a device that you could loan/sell, please contact me offline. Thanks. One more thing. I seem to have misplaced my copy of the all-ram BBS program. Again, suggestions for what would be the best demonstration would be greatly appreciated. By the way, my son likes some of the old coco games. We used to spend hours playing "Peanut Butter Panic". He still uses the coco when he wants to know when the next solar or lunar eclipse is... - Aaron -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From alsplace at pobox.com Wed Oct 8 19:28:24 2008 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 18:28:24 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Show-and-tell project... In-Reply-To: <200810081917219.SM09800@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200810081917219.SM09800@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <639C227E-4803-43D0-B90A-A3BBC220CC19@pobox.com> On Oct 8, 2008, at 6:17 PM, tonym wrote: > ALLRAM is here, but I think it isn't coco3 compatible, or needs a > patch: > > http://www.bbsdocumentary.com/software/TANDY/RSDOS/ALLRAM/ > > I DO have some cups for a Tandy Model 100, if those will work in any > way. > Mebbe the 1B has the jack for the cups, or something.... No, no patch. It's just standard EXTENDED COLOR BASIC and it uses a dimensioned array of strings to hold the userfile and the messages, so as long as you can DIMA$(100) it runs. Nothing special about it. In fact, you have to find a compatible remote terminal driver to go with it to make it useful, and hopefully one that disables break key and such. -- Allen From snhirsch at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 20:54:51 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 20:54:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: > I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to > setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact disk > model it's intended to be used with). > > Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just > stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not responsive. > 100% repeatable. Problem solved! Thanks to Chester Patterson's kind help, this hangup was solved by doing OS9: tmode -pause before running format. It was stopping at the end of the screen (thus the neat boundary for where the numbering ended). Only the Howard Medical documentation (written by Chester) bothered to mention this. Not a word about it in the Burke and Burke manual. They must have been plagued with support calls from folks like me. I guess I "should have known" to turn off scroll pause. Steve -- From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Oct 8 21:04:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:04:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Oct 8, 2008, at 8:54 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> >> It counts up to 0EF and just stops. The drive access light goes >> out and the computer is not responsive. 100% repeatable. > > Problem solved! Thanks to Chester Patterson's kind help, this > hangup was solved by doing > > OS9: tmode -pause > > before running format. It was stopping at the end of the screen > (thus the neat boundary for where the numbering ended). > Wow, someone's got to explain that one to me. C. From sklammer at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 21:31:06 2008 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:31:06 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810081356g323fb46et755430240ee40dc0@mail.gmail.com> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> <5d802cd0810081356g323fb46et755430240ee40dc0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3925f0b0810081831m6c9c1d8ei8d9899aa9bb61fd1@mail.gmail.com> Most Coco users that I knew in the 'Great White North" migrated to the Amiga. sk 2008/10/8 Darren A > On 10/8/08, Ciaran Anscomb wrote: > > > > Blimey, didn't realise anyone really still used AmigaOS. > > ... > > Hee Hee... That's kinda funny coming from a member of a group who > still use CoCos :-) > > Darren > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From brucewcalkins at charter.net Wed Oct 8 21:35:53 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:35:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems References: Message-ID: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Hirsch" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 8:54 PM > On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >> I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to >> setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact >> disk model it's intended to be used with). >> >> Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just >> stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not >> responsive. 100% repeatable. > > Problem solved! Thanks to Chester Patterson's kind help, this hangup was > solved by doing > > OS9: tmode -pause > > before running format. It was stopping at the end of the screen (thus the > neat boundary for where the numbering ended). > > Only the Howard Medical documentation (written by Chester) bothered to > mention this. Not a word about it in the Burke and Burke manual. They > must have been plagued with support calls from folks like me. I guess I > "should have known" to turn off scroll pause. > > Steve Now that you mention it, I do remember running into that problem way back around 1993. Must be CRS catching up with me. Bruce W. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 8 21:38:08 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 21:38:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time In-Reply-To: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <48ED6080.9020003@worldnet.att.net> George Ramsower wrote: > I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. > > I was wondering if it's possible to issue a BO9 statement that could > disable any non-critical interruptions in OS9 to give maximum CPU time > to the routine inside a B09 program, such as when I'm stepping the > motors in my Coco CNC machine. After the stepping is done, then I wish > to issue a statement to put things back like they were. > > > Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like > those, but don't undstand them. > > Current progress in this project is that I can now engrave an aluminum > plate with the name of the company I work for and the equipment number > below the name. I need to get a photo of that onto my Coco site. > http://coco.thetinbox.com > > Engraving can be done FAST with a dremmel. Speed would help. > > George > As stated by Dave Kelly, about the only thing you can do is use syscall first to find the process ID of either runB or your specific Basic09 program and then use syscall to change the priority to 255 (highest). Saying this is simple but actually doing it may be confusing. That it can be done is demonstrated by the OS-9 program procs. That displays process IDs for running programs. You will need to use the two system calls Get ID and Set Priority, OS9 F$ID and OS9 D$SPrior. The first call from your Basic09 program with syscall OS9 F$ID will get the process ID. The second call with syscall OS9 F$SPrior should set your priority to 255 (highest). Whether this will achieve anything you'll have to test. Whether the method will be sufficient without changing the priority of runB or Basic09 is not known by me. From wdg3rd at comcast.net Wed Oct 8 21:44:19 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 01:44:19 +0000 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <100920080144.12510.48ED61F30005CF28000030DE22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> I just wish there was a .deb for the Linux port, rather than just a tarball, and preferably in one of the *buntu repositories (actually there might be one, this machine is only looking at the 64-bit repos, come to think of it). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "John W. Linville" > Interesting news... :-) > > http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > -- > John W. Linville Linux should be at the core > linville at tuxdriver.com of your literate lifestyle. From wdg3rd at comcast.net Wed Oct 8 21:46:25 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 01:46:25 +0000 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <100920080146.21074.48ED62710001B6B80000525222070009530B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> You have to do that anyway, to _legally_ get the ROM images. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Joel Ewy > John W. Linville wrote: > > Interesting news... :-) > > > > http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > > > Looks like that's for AmigaOS 4, which is PPC only IIRC? So it probably > won't work on my A1000 or A500. :) I wish you could get AmigaOS 4 to > run on a PPC Mac. That hardware is falling out of the trees and rotting > on the ground. But PPC upgrades for Amiga hardware, or Amiga One or > Pegasos boards still cost money if you can even find them at all. I > guess I'll have to run XRoar on Linux, not that that's any real > hardship... Or plug in a real CoCo! From wdg3rd at comcast.net Wed Oct 8 21:57:51 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 01:57:51 +0000 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <100920080157.2029.48ED651F0002E08B000007ED22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> From: Gene Heskett > On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: > >Interesting news... :-) > > > >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > > Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring myself to > bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) Silicon-based lifeforms rarely produce decay products objectionable to the nostrils of carbon-based lifeforms. Terry Pratchett assures me that the reverse is true. (There is sometimes a noxious aroma _during_ the demise, but careful use of a fire extinguisher drowns that out). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From badfrog at gmail.com Wed Oct 8 22:45:28 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:45:28 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9efa17da0810081945p45efcb26g7688a139c8c238fe@mail.gmail.com> Now that you mentioned the solution, I remember having to do that! Sorry that knowledge was long forgotten. :) On Wed, Oct 8, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >> I'm pulling what little hair I have left out of my head... I'm trying to >> setup a Seagate ST225 hard drive for use with this controller (the exact >> disk model it's intended to be used with). >> >> Everything goes well until physical verify. It counts up to 0EF and just >> stops. The drive access light goes out and the computer is not responsive. >> 100% repeatable. > > Problem solved! Thanks to Chester Patterson's kind help, this hangup was > solved by doing > > OS9: tmode -pause > > before running format. It was stopping at the end of the screen (thus the > neat boundary for where the numbering ended). > > Only the Howard Medical documentation (written by Chester) bothered to > mention this. Not a word about it in the Burke and Burke manual. They must > have been plagued with support calls from folks like me. I guess I "should > have known" to turn off scroll pause. > > Steve > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From alxevans at concentric.net Wed Oct 8 23:43:44 2008 From: alxevans at concentric.net (Theodore (Alex) Evans) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 20:43:44 -0700 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> Message-ID: <48ED7DF0.9000002@concentric.net> Ciaran Anscomb wrote: > "John W. Linville" wrote: >> Interesting news... :-) >> >> http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > > Blimey, didn't realise anyone really still used AmigaOS. That's cool, > just wish I could try it out ;) There are a few of us here. From cocomalt at 6809.org.uk Thu Oct 9 04:10:08 2008 From: cocomalt at 6809.org.uk (Ciaran Anscomb) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 09:10:08 +0100 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <100920080144.12510.48ED61F30005CF28000030DE22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> References: <100920080144.12510.48ED61F30005CF28000030DE22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <5526.1223539808@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: > I just wish there was a .deb for the Linux port, rather than just a tarball, > and preferably in one of the *buntu repositories (actually there might be one > , this machine is only looking at the 64-bit repos, come to think of it). I don't think anyone else built a Debian package, and I certainly hadn't. Until now - check out http://www.6809.org.uk/tmp/xroar/ Completely untested - I've built those by logging in from a Mac, but don't see any reason they wouldn't work. Can't vouch for Um Bongo, but sure it'll be fine. ..ciaran -- Ciaran Anscomb, Perl/C Hacker From georgeramsower at gmail.com Thu Oct 9 04:26:08 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 03:26:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time References: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> <48ED6080.9020003@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <000a01c929e8$aea3ed60$d4b1b1d8@house> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Gault" > George Ramsower wrote: >> I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. >> >> I was wondering if it's possible to issue a BO9 statement that could >> disable any non-critical interruptions in OS9 to give maximum CPU time to >> the routine inside a B09 program, such as when I'm stepping the motors in >> my Coco CNC machine. After the stepping is done, then I wish to issue a >> statement to put things back like they were. >> >> >> Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like >> those, but don't undstand them. >> >> Current progress in this project is that I can now engrave an aluminum >> plate with the name of the company I work for and the equipment number >> below the name. I need to get a photo of that onto my Coco site. >> http://coco.thetinbox.com >> >> Engraving can be done FAST with a dremmel. Speed would help. >> >> George >> > > As stated by Dave Kelly, about the only thing you can do is use syscall > first to find the process ID of either runB or your specific Basic09 > program and then use syscall to change the priority to 255 (highest). > > Saying this is simple but actually doing it may be confusing. That it can > be done is demonstrated by the OS-9 program procs. That displays process > IDs for running programs. > > You will need to use the two system calls Get ID and Set Priority, OS9 > F$ID and OS9 D$SPrior. The first call from your Basic09 program with > syscall OS9 F$ID will get the process ID. The second call with syscall OS9 > F$SPrior should set your priority to 255 (highest). > > Whether this will achieve anything you'll have to test. Whether the method > will be sufficient without changing the priority of runB or Basic09 is not > known by me. I was thinking more like disabling stuff like the keyboard scan or the system clock or something to do with the system in general. I'm not running any other tasks that would result in improvements in speed by changing the priorities. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. George From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Oct 9 06:14:23 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 06:14:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <48ED7DF0.9000002@concentric.net> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> <10207.1223498208@estronol.rd.bbc.co.uk> <48ED7DF0.9000002@concentric.net> Message-ID: <200810090614.24084.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 08 October 2008, Theodore (Alex) Evans wrote: >Ciaran Anscomb wrote: >> "John W. Linville" wrote: >>> Interesting news... :-) >>> >>> http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html >> >> Blimey, didn't realise anyone really still used AmigaOS. That's cool, >> just wish I could try it out ;) > >There are a few of us here. I did for several years, but when my 30GB drive died, and the replacement showed me that my carefully made by Diavolo-pro backups contained none of the stuff it would have taken to restore operation because amigados does not allow access to a file that is open by the os, that was just too much of the wheel to re-invent. So my A2k, with a PP&S 040 board, 64 megs of ram, a picasso-II video, and numerous (all slots were full) other accessories got carried to the basement where it still sits on the floor behind the coco3's desk. And I went on to linux. As a broadcast engineer, I'd had my fill of windows and its bugs and restrictions, so putting it on my home machine never entered my mind. But my coco3/6309 still runs. >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Magic is always the best solution -- especially reliable magic. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Oct 9 06:17:12 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 06:17:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <100920080157.2029.48ED651F0002E08B000007ED22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> References: <100920080157.2029.48ED651F0002E08B000007ED22007614380B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <200810090617.12653.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 08 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >From: Gene Heskett > >> On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: >> >Interesting news... :-) >> > >> >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html >> >> Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring >> myself to bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) > >Silicon-based lifeforms rarely produce decay products objectionable to the > nostrils of carbon-based lifeforms. Terry Pratchett assures me that the > reverse is true. (There is sometimes a noxious aroma _during_ the demise, > but careful use of a fire extinguisher drowns that out). Ah yes, Terry would have explored that quite well for our amusement. > -- >Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net > >"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a > guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him > down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe > Devil_ > >The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top > this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. > For us individuals, BOHICA. > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) 1 + 1 = 3, for large values of 1. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Oct 9 06:30:40 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 06:30:40 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time In-Reply-To: <000a01c929e8$aea3ed60$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> <48ED6080.9020003@worldnet.att.net> <000a01c929e8$aea3ed60$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <200810090630.40770.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 09 October 2008, George Ramsower wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Robert Gault" > >> George Ramsower wrote: >>> I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. >>> >>> I was wondering if it's possible to issue a BO9 statement that could >>> disable any non-critical interruptions in OS9 to give maximum CPU time to >>> the routine inside a B09 program, such as when I'm stepping the motors in >>> my Coco CNC machine. After the stepping is done, then I wish to issue a >>> statement to put things back like they were. >>> >>> >>> Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like >>> those, but don't undstand them. >>> >>> Current progress in this project is that I can now engrave an aluminum >>> plate with the name of the company I work for and the equipment number >>> below the name. I need to get a photo of that onto my Coco site. >>> http://coco.thetinbox.com >>> >>> Engraving can be done FAST with a dremmel. Speed would help. >>> >>> George >> >> As stated by Dave Kelly, about the only thing you can do is use syscall >> first to find the process ID of either runB or your specific Basic09 >> program and then use syscall to change the priority to 255 (highest). >> >> Saying this is simple but actually doing it may be confusing. That it can >> be done is demonstrated by the OS-9 program procs. That displays process >> IDs for running programs. >> >> You will need to use the two system calls Get ID and Set Priority, OS9 >> F$ID and OS9 D$SPrior. The first call from your Basic09 program with >> syscall OS9 F$ID will get the process ID. The second call with syscall OS9 >> F$SPrior should set your priority to 255 (highest). >> >> Whether this will achieve anything you'll have to test. Whether the method >> will be sufficient without changing the priority of runB or Basic09 is not >> known by me. > > I was thinking more like disabling stuff like the keyboard scan That I believe is IRQ driven, isn't done unless a key is pressed. > or the >system clock The system clock is the timer, and the machine is dead without it. I would guess that it also represents an upper speed limit, but a free-standing routine in machine code, an expansion of the tone generators several of us have made over the years might be able to be modified for use, possibly even driving in ratios, 2 axis's to move at angles? And probably fast enough to lose steps which would be a disaster. Look at the src code for the SS.tone system call for ideas. >or something to do with the system in general. > I'm not running any other tasks that would result in improvements in speed >by changing the priorities. > Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. > >George > > > > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) regex are more than some crappy posix thing they are an art form - Marc Zealey on #kernelnewbies From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Oct 9 07:39:05 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 07:39:05 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Burke & Burke controller problems In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810081945p45efcb26g7688a139c8c238fe@mail.gmail.com> References: <9efa17da0810081945p45efcb26g7688a139c8c238fe@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 8 Oct 2008, Sean wrote: > > Now that you mentioned the solution, I remember having to do that! > Sorry that knowledge was long forgotten. :) Not a problem. I'll chalk it up to an OS9 learning experience! Wonder how many other basic things "I should just know.." to do regarding base system setup . Would folks mind responding with their favorite OS9 "..do this every time.." sort of things? Steve -- From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Thu Oct 9 09:30:03 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:30:03 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Basic09/disabling processes/saving CPU time In-Reply-To: <48ED6080.9020003@worldnet.att.net> References: <001701c92990$e063b4f0$d4b1b1d8@house> <48ED6080.9020003@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:38:08 -0600, Robert Gault wrote: > George Ramsower wrote: >> I could use a little more CPU time in my CNC effort with a CC3. >> I was wondering if it's possible to issue a BO9 statement that could >> disable any non-critical interruptions in OS9 to give maximum CPU time >> to the routine inside a B09 program, such as when I'm stepping the >> motors in my Coco CNC machine. After the stepping is done, then I wish >> to issue a statement to put things back like they were. >> Please. This needs to be done in Basic 09. A SYSCALL is okay. I like >> those, but don't undstand them. >> Current progress in this project is that I can now engrave an aluminum >> plate with the name of the company I work for and the equipment number >> below the name. I need to get a photo of that onto my Coco site. >> http://coco.thetinbox.com >> Engraving can be done FAST with a dremmel. Speed would help. >> George >> > > As stated by Dave Kelly, about the only thing you can do is use syscall > first to find the process ID of either runB or your specific Basic09 > program and then use syscall to change the priority to 255 (highest). > > Saying this is simple but actually doing it may be confusing. That it > can be done is demonstrated by the OS-9 program procs. That displays > process IDs for running programs. > > You will need to use the two system calls Get ID and Set Priority, OS9 > F$ID and OS9 D$SPrior. The first call from your Basic09 program with > syscall OS9 F$ID will get the process ID. The second call with syscall > OS9 F$SPrior should set your priority to 255 (highest). > > Whether this will achieve anything you'll have to test. Whether the > method will be sufficient without changing the priority of runB or > Basic09 is not known by me. Runb/BASIC09 are the only process that will show up in procs, so the F$ID call will give you the process # for the entire Runb program (no matter how many modules in Basic09 you are running in the current program). If you have a copy of my PROC command, I actually go into the BASIC09/RUNB data area to get what the currently running module is, and list it on the screen in parenthesis. -- L. Curtis Boyle From wdg3rd at comcast.net Thu Oct 9 16:30:38 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 20:30:38 +0000 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <100920082030.17945.48EE69EE000C8E030000461922058861720B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> From: Gene Heskett > On Wednesday 08 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: > >From: Gene Heskett > > > >> On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: > >> >Interesting news... :-) > >> > > >> >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > >> > >> Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring > >> myself to bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) > > > >Silicon-based lifeforms rarely produce decay products objectionable to the > > nostrils of carbon-based lifeforms. Terry Pratchett assures me that the > > reverse is true. (There is sometimes a noxious aroma _during_ the demise, > > but careful use of a fire extinguisher drowns that out). > > Ah yes, Terry would have explored that quite well for our amusement. Indeed he has. Most explicitly in his novel _The Truth_. -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From rcrislip at neo.rr.com Thu Oct 9 17:40:43 2008 From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (richec) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 17:40:43 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <200810072223.26312.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20081007150932.GA8272@tuxdriver.com> <200810072223.26312.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <200810091740.43223.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> On Tuesday 07 October 2008 22:23:26 Gene Heskett wrote: > On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: > >Interesting news... :-) > > > >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html > > Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring myself > to bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) Sigh 8_( Mine began souring three years ago. I gave it to the Glenside CoCo club to be auctioned off so that we could continue to help finance future CoCoFests. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Oct 9 20:06:23 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 20:06:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <100920082030.17945.48EE69EE000C8E030000461922058861720B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> References: <100920082030.17945.48EE69EE000C8E030000461922058861720B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <200810092006.23246.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 09 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >From: Gene Heskett > >> On Wednesday 08 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >> >From: Gene Heskett >> > >> >> On Tuesday 07 October 2008, John W. Linville wrote: >> >> >Interesting news... :-) >> >> > >> >> >http://hirudov.com/amiga/XRoar.html >> >> >> >> Unforch, my miggy died nearly 10 years ago. But I can't quite bring >> >> myself to bury it, and its not stinking up the basement (yet) >> > >> >Silicon-based lifeforms rarely produce decay products objectionable to >> > the nostrils of carbon-based lifeforms. Terry Pratchett assures me that >> > the reverse is true. (There is sometimes a noxious aroma _during_ the >> > demise, but careful use of a fire extinguisher drowns that out). >> >> Ah yes, Terry would have explored that quite well for our amusement. > >Indeed he has. Most explicitly in his novel _The Truth_. Which I don't recall reading, but if I notice it the next time I'm in the bookstore (probably looking for a Sketchup 4 Dummies book), I'll try and remember it, sounds like a good read. Thanks Ward. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The ultimate game show will be the one where somebody gets killed at the end. -- Chuck Barris, creator of "The Gong Show" From snhirsch at gmail.com Thu Oct 9 21:22:15 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 21:22:15 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? Message-ID: Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot find a shred of concrete information on the subject. SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of documentation. Where to find this? Steve -- From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Oct 9 21:28:28 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 21:28:28 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Thu, 2008-10-09 at 21:22 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: > Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot find > a shred of concrete information on the subject. > > SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of documentation. > > Where to find this? Not quite sure what you mean by "installing NitrOS-9". There isn't much in the way of installation.. after all, it can run right out of ROM, no disk at all.. Maybe you can explain what you're trying to do? C. From tonym at compusource.net Thu Oct 9 21:48:56 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 21:48:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Chuck Youse" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 9:28 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? > > On Thu, 2008-10-09 at 21:22 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot find >> a shred of concrete information on the subject. >> >> SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of documentation. >> >> Where to find this? > > Not quite sure what you mean by "installing NitrOS-9". There isn't much > in the way of installation.. after all, it can run right out of ROM, no > disk at all.. > > Maybe you can explain what you're trying to do? > > Me thinks Steven is looking for a doc or walkthrough on setting up NitrOS9 on a hard disk. Specifically, how to get his Burke&Burke HD setup. Folders on HD, bootup files, devices/descriptors setup for booting NitrOS9 from the FDD and getting it to go as /dd on the hard disk, etc... Picture setting up a brand-new HDD setup on a CoCo3 with NitrOS9 - he needs instructions on setting the whole system up in HDD. Tony From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Thu Oct 9 23:15:23 2008 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 00:15:23 -0300 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <48EEC8CB.4080508@adinet.com.uy> If some one comes up with some kind of tutorial or "walk trough", I can always add it to www.nitros9.org. Also, any kind of tutorial, tip, how-to, screenshoot, software recommendation, etc is welcome. Diego Tony wrote: >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" >> >> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 9:28 PM >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? >> > >> On Thu, 2008-10-09 at 21:22 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>> Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot >>> find >>> a shred of concrete information on the subject. >>> >>> SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of >>> documentation. >>> >>> Where to find this? >> >> Not quite sure what you mean by "installing NitrOS-9". There isn't much >> in the way of installation.. after all, it can run right out of ROM, no >> disk at all.. >> >> Maybe you can explain what you're trying to do? >> >> > > Me thinks Steven is looking for a doc or walkthrough on setting up > NitrOS9 on a hard disk. > Specifically, how to get his Burke&Burke HD setup. Folders on HD, > bootup files, devices/descriptors > setup for booting NitrOS9 from the FDD and getting it to go as /dd on > the hard disk, etc... > > Picture setting up a brand-new HDD setup on a CoCo3 with NitrOS9 - he > needs instructions on > setting the whole system up in HDD. > > Tony > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Oct 9 22:27:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 22:27:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <3A95D2E1-B9A1-4A32-B84F-991D0FA52445@serialtechnologies.com> On Oct 9, 2008, at 9:48 PM, Tony wrote: > > Me thinks Steven is looking for a doc or walkthrough on setting up > NitrOS9 on a hard disk. > Specifically, how to get his Burke&Burke HD setup. Folders on HD, > bootup files, devices/descriptors > setup for booting NitrOS9 from the FDD and getting it to go as /dd > on the hard disk, etc... > > Picture setting up a brand-new HDD setup on a CoCo3 with NitrOS9 - > he needs instructions on > setting the whole system up in HDD. > Ah, that makes sense. Hmmm.. I'll see if maybe I whip something up for www.nitros9.org. C. From wdg3rd at comcast.net Thu Oct 9 22:50:24 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 02:50:24 +0000 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga Message-ID: <101020080250.3483.48EEC2F0000428D400000D9B22073000330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> From: Gene Heskett > On Thursday 09 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: > >From: Gene Heskett > >> Ah yes, Terry would have explored that quite well for our amusement. > > > >Indeed he has. Most explicitly in his novel _The Truth_. > > Which I don't recall reading, but if I notice it the next time I'm in the > bookstore (probably looking for a Sketchup 4 Dummies book), I'll try and > remember it, sounds like a good read. Thanks Ward. It involves the introduction of moveable type printing presses into Ankh-Morpork and the start of the first newspaper there. (We get a view of Mr. Vimes from the outside for a change). The specific bit involves the employment of trolls at the recycling center. Owned by Harry King, formerly known as Piss Harry but lately as King of the Golden River: "They didn't wonder what happened to the full buckets, but Harry King had learned something that can be the key to great riches: there is very little, however disgusting, that isn't used somewhere in some industry. There are people out there who _want_ large quantities of ammonia and saltpeter. If you can't sell it to the alchemists then the farmers probably want it. If even the farmers don't want it then there is nothing, _nothing_, however gross, that you can't sell to the tanners." and on the next page (150 in the US hardcover): "A small door within the large gates was opened by a troll. Harry was very forward-looking when it came to employing the nonhuman races, and had been among the first employers in the city to give a job to a troll. As far as organic substances were concerned, they had no sense of smell." For Terry's inspiration on Harry's background, this is the best link I've found: http://eastlondonhistory.com/toshers-and-mudlarks-on-the-thames/ -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Oct 10 07:38:24 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 07:38:24 -0400 Subject: [Coco] XRoar emulator for Amiga In-Reply-To: <101020080250.3483.48EEC2F0000428D400000D9B22073000330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> References: <101020080250.3483.48EEC2F0000428D400000D9B22073000330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <200810100738.24033.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 09 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >From: Gene Heskett > >> On Thursday 09 October 2008, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: >> >From: Gene Heskett >> > >> >> Ah yes, Terry would have explored that quite well for our amusement. >> > >> >Indeed he has. Most explicitly in his novel _The Truth_. >> >> Which I don't recall reading, but if I notice it the next time I'm in the >> bookstore (probably looking for a Sketchup 4 Dummies book), I'll try and >> remember it, sounds like a good read. Thanks Ward. > >It involves the introduction of moveable type printing presses into > Ankh-Morpork and the start of the first newspaper there. (We get a view of > Mr. Vimes from the outside for a change). The specific bit involves the > employment of trolls at the recycling center. Owned by Harry King, > formerly known as Piss Harry but lately as King of the Golden River: > >"They didn't wonder what happened to the full buckets, but Harry King had > learned something that can be the key to great riches: there is very > little, however disgusting, that isn't used somewhere in some industry. > There are people out there who _want_ large quantities of ammonia and > saltpeter. If you can't sell it to the alchemists then the farmers > probably want it. If even the farmers don't want it then there is nothing, > _nothing_, however gross, that you can't sell to the tanners." > >and on the next page (150 in the US hardcover): > >"A small door within the large gates was opened by a troll. Harry was very > forward-looking when it came to employing the nonhuman races, and had been > among the first employers in the city to give a job to a troll. As far as > organic substances were concerned, they had no sense of smell." > Sounds like a must read. Thanks. >For Terry's inspiration on Harry's background, this is the best link I've > found: > >http://eastlondonhistory.com/toshers-and-mudlarks-on-the-thames/ >-- >Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net > >"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a > guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him > down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe > Devil_ > >The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top > this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. > For us individuals, BOHICA. > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Old programmers never die, they just become managers. From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Oct 10 07:41:54 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 07:41:54 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Oct 2008, Tony wrote: >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" >> >> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 9:28 PM >> Subject: Re: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? >> > >> On Thu, 2008-10-09 at 21:22 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>> Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot find >>> a shred of concrete information on the subject. >>> >>> SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of documentation. >>> >>> Where to find this? >> >> Not quite sure what you mean by "installing NitrOS-9". There isn't much >> in the way of installation.. after all, it can run right out of ROM, no >> disk at all.. >> >> Maybe you can explain what you're trying to do? > Me thinks Steven is looking for a doc or walkthrough on setting up NitrOS9 on > a hard disk. > Specifically, how to get his Burke&Burke HD setup. Folders on HD, bootup > files, devices/descriptors > setup for booting NitrOS9 from the FDD and getting it to go as /dd on the > hard disk, etc... > > Picture setting up a brand-new HDD setup on a CoCo3 with NitrOS9 - he needs > instructions on > setting the whole system up in HDD. At this point, I'd settle for simply being able to boot it! I downloaded a SSDD (180kB) 40-track image, copied it to a "real" floppy from my SVD (disk simulator attached to floppy controller) and tried to boot it. It displays the startup screen, grinds away a bit and halts with the drive access LED on and the disk spinning. Never gets any further. I think I handled the obvious stuff properly: Before trying the transfer, I copied 'dmode' to my Tandy OS-9 system disk and configured both the SVD and target disk drive for 40-tracks. The backup worked perfectly and verified the correct number of sectors and the resulting disk reads perfectly. The drive mechanisms I'm using are generic 5-1/4" DSDD units that are certainly capable of 40-track operation. I suspect there's some advance configuration required that I "should just know to do..." (tm) :-). But it certainly won't run out of the box. Steve -- From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Oct 10 09:02:13 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:02:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Fri, 2008-10-10 at 07:41 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: > > At this point, I'd settle for simply being able to boot it! I downloaded > a SSDD (180kB) 40-track image, copied it to a "real" floppy from my SVD > (disk simulator attached to floppy controller) and tried to boot it. It > displays the startup screen, grinds away a bit and halts with the drive > access LED on and the disk spinning. Never gets any further. > Are you using a multi-pak? In the category of "things you should just know" is that you have to stick the disk controller in slot 4. The code makes that assumption.. So can I assume you can boot OS9 Level II, but not NitrOS-9? And where'd you get these 40 track SS bootable images? C. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Fri Oct 10 10:39:36 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 10:39:36 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> Message-ID: <48EF6928.3070503@worldnet.att.net> Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Thu, 9 Oct 2008, Tony wrote: > >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" >>> >>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >>> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 9:28 PM >>> Subject: Re: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? >>> >> >>> On Thu, 2008-10-09 at 21:22 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: >>>> Title says it. Lots of handwaving and partial explanations. Cannot >>>> find >>>> a shred of concrete information on the subject. >>>> >>>> SourceForge site seems to have almost nothing in terms of >>>> documentation. >>>> >>>> Where to find this? >>> >>> Not quite sure what you mean by "installing NitrOS-9". There isn't much >>> in the way of installation.. after all, it can run right out of ROM, no >>> disk at all.. >>> >>> Maybe you can explain what you're trying to do? > >> Me thinks Steven is looking for a doc or walkthrough on setting up >> NitrOS9 on a hard disk. >> Specifically, how to get his Burke&Burke HD setup. Folders on HD, >> bootup files, devices/descriptors >> setup for booting NitrOS9 from the FDD and getting it to go as /dd on >> the hard disk, etc... >> >> Picture setting up a brand-new HDD setup on a CoCo3 with NitrOS9 - he >> needs instructions on >> setting the whole system up in HDD. > > At this point, I'd settle for simply being able to boot it! I > downloaded a SSDD (180kB) 40-track image, copied it to a "real" floppy > from my SVD (disk simulator attached to floppy controller) and tried to > boot it. It displays the startup screen, grinds away a bit and halts > with the drive access LED on and the disk spinning. Never gets any > further. > > I think I handled the obvious stuff properly: Before trying the > transfer, I copied 'dmode' to my Tandy OS-9 system disk and configured > both the SVD and target disk drive for 40-tracks. The backup worked > perfectly and verified the correct number of sectors and the resulting > disk reads perfectly. The drive mechanisms I'm using are generic 5-1/4" > DSDD units that are certainly capable of 40-track operation. > > I suspect there's some advance configuration required that I "should > just know to do..." (tm) :-). But it certainly won't run out of the box. > > Steve > > Test the simplest route first. Make a real disk and see if it boots from your Coco. If that works, you know the image/disk is good and the problems relate to your SVD etc. From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Fri Oct 10 17:32:05 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 16:32:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online Message-ID: <20081010.163205.2424.1.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com> When I went to this link, I was "Access Denied" What now? JohnThe Tandy Color Computer SuperSite: Access Denied On Wed, 8 Oct 2008 11:28:59 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: > Here is the latest in my ongoing archive > project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing > issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the > archives > please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my > previous archive updates on the coco3.com message forum > > http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ____________________________________________________________ Click to become a master chef, own a restaurant and make millions. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m4pCeT7yxlFGRXKrBhBpj7D7vDuDWoKUkCJos0PNyDJXSTH/ From badfrog at gmail.com Fri Oct 10 18:42:44 2008 From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:42:44 -0500 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online In-Reply-To: <20081010.163205.2424.1.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20081010.163205.2424.1.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <9efa17da0810101542j351f2556x447415d70f31ec4f@mail.gmail.com> You have to register to access the forums on coco3.com. On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 4:32 PM, John T Chasteen wrote: > When I went to this link, I was "Access Denied" > > > What now? > > > > JohnThe Tandy Color Computer SuperSite: Access Denied > > > On Wed, 8 Oct 2008 11:28:59 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: >> Here is the latest in my ongoing archive >> project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing >> issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the >> archives >> please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my >> previous archive updates on the coco3.com message forum >> >> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 >> >> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > Click to become a master chef, own a restaurant and make millions. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m4pCeT7yxlFGRXKrBhBpj7D7vDuDWoKUkCJos0PNyDJXSTH/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From mechacoco at gmail.com Fri Oct 10 19:09:20 2008 From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:09:20 -0600 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810101542j351f2556x447415d70f31ec4f@mail.gmail.com> References: <20081010.163205.2424.1.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com> <9efa17da0810101542j351f2556x447415d70f31ec4f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5d802cd0810101609n20f7f811vbc84205d971674f6@mail.gmail.com> On 10/10/08, Sean wrote: > You have to register to access the forums on coco3.com. > You're right. That didn't use to be the case. I can understand having to register in order to post, but not being able to read the forums without registering seems unnecessarily restrictive. > On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 4:32 PM, John T Chasteen > wrote: >> When I went to this link, I was "Access Denied" >> >> >> What now? >> >> >> >> JohnThe Tandy Color Computer SuperSite: Access Denied >> >> Darren From snhirsch at gmail.com Fri Oct 10 20:23:52 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 20:23:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 10 Oct 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Fri, 2008-10-10 at 07:41 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >> >> At this point, I'd settle for simply being able to boot it! I downloaded >> a SSDD (180kB) 40-track image, copied it to a "real" floppy from my SVD >> (disk simulator attached to floppy controller) and tried to boot it. It >> displays the startup screen, grinds away a bit and halts with the drive >> access LED on and the disk spinning. Never gets any further. >> > > Are you using a multi-pak? In the category of "things you should just > know" is that you have to stick the disk controller in slot 4. The code > makes that assumption.. I did actually know this :-). > So can I assume you can boot OS9 Level II, but not NitrOS-9? > And where'd you get these 40 track SS bootable images? Yes, OS9 L2 boots fine. The nitros9 image I was using came from http://nitros9.lcurtisboyle.com/nitros9.html. Now that I know how to get them onto a physical disk, I'll try the images from sourceforge. Steve -- From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Oct 10 22:16:56 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 22:16:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online In-Reply-To: <509277.31995.qm@web30204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <509277.31995.qm@web30204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200810102216.57016.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Wednesday 08 October 2008, Derek wrote: >Here is the latest in my ongoing archive >project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing >issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the archives >please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my previous > archive updates on the coco3.com message forum > >http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 > >** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** Unforch, my firefox saved pw is invalid. ?? Can you send it privately, Derek? -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Everything you know is wrong! From wdg3rd at comcast.net Sat Oct 11 07:49:15 2008 From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 11:49:15 +0000 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online Message-ID: <101120081149.23415.48F092BB0004F7E700005B7722007374780B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> In my case, RapidShare says that I have reached my limit for a free user. And I can guarantee that La Esposa will not approve use of the credit card to get a real account. The dollar/Euro exchange rate is tanking anyway (it will eventually stabilize, since both are fiat currencies, backed only by faith in the governments that issue them and I have even less faith in governments than gods, and that started at zero). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Gene Heskett > On Wednesday 08 October 2008, Derek wrote: > >Here is the latest in my ongoing archive > >project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing > >issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the archives > >please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my previous > > archive updates on the coco3.com message forum > > > >http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 > > > >** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > Unforch, my firefox saved pw is invalid. ?? Can you send it privately, Derek? From dml_68 at yahoo.com Sat Oct 11 10:47:48 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 07:47:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online In-Reply-To: <101120081149.23415.48F092BB0004F7E700005B7722007374780B9DCC090B99@comcast.net> Message-ID: <352975.57612.qm@web30203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Rapidshare is $11 per month. Its the only option I have to keep my coco archive online for the long term as I have paid a year in advance for my rapidshare account. As of right now I have about 12 GB in coco archives online with Rapidshare with much more to come so for me it made sense to use that Rapidshare Space for something useful. I think the limit I can store is something like 250 GB. ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Sat, 10/11/08, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: From: wdg3rd at comcast.net Subject: Re: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Date: Saturday, October 11, 2008, 4:49 AM In my case, RapidShare says that I have reached my limit for a free user. And I can guarantee that La Esposa will not approve use of the credit card to get a real account. The dollar/Euro exchange rate is tanking anyway (it will eventually stabilize, since both are fiat currencies, backed only by faith in the governments that issue them and I have even less faith in governments than gods, and that started at zero). -- Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_ The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. For us individuals, BOHICA. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Gene Heskett > On Wednesday 08 October 2008, Derek wrote: > >Here is the latest in my ongoing archive > >project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing > >issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the archives > >please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my previous > > archive updates on the coco3.com message forum > > > >http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 > > > >** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > Unforch, my firefox saved pw is invalid. ?? Can you send it privately, Derek? -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From coconut at pritchard.ca Sat Oct 11 11:35:03 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 10:35:03 -0500 Subject: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online In-Reply-To: <352975.57612.qm@web30203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <352975.57612.qm@web30203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I use Netfirms Advantage for all of my websites, just one monthly fee, and the different sites all share the same space and bandwidth. Now maybe people have reasons for rapid share that I will leave for another discussion. Personally I think that for $10 per month 2 terabytes of data transfer per month is pretty good. I did not include my link to Netfirms that would give me some kick back if you sign up because well that would seem self serving ;). Some quick stats for the hosting accounts at Netfirms. NETFIRMS PLUS $4.95/mo on 1-Year Billing Diskspace 10 GB Monthly Bandwidth 500 GB NETFIRMS ADVANTAGE $9.95/mo on 1-Year Billing Diskspace 250 GB Monthly Bandwidth 2,000 GB Multi-Website Hosting Unlimited FREE Domain Names 2 FREE NETFIRMS BUSINESS $14.95/mo on 1-Year Billing Diskspace 300 GB Monthly Bandwidth 3,000 GB Multi-Website Hosting Unlimited FREE Domain Names 5 FREE Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies On 11-Oct-08, at 9:47 AM, Derek wrote: > Rapidshare is $11 per month. Its the only option I have to keep my > coco archive online for the long term as I have paid a year in > advance for my rapidshare account. > > As of right now I have about 12 GB in coco archives online with > Rapidshare with much more to come so for me it made sense to use > that Rapidshare Space for something useful. I think the limit I can > store is something like 250 GB. > > > > > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > > > > --- On Sat, 10/11/08, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote: > From: wdg3rd at comcast.net > Subject: Re: [Coco] 1985 Magazine Archive is now online > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Saturday, October 11, 2008, 4:49 AM > > In my case, RapidShare says that I have reached my limit for a free > user. And I > can guarantee that La Esposa will not approve use of the credit card > to get a > real account. The dollar/Euro exchange rate is tanking anyway (it > will > eventually stabilize, since both are fiat currencies, backed only by > faith in > the governments that issue them and I have even less faith in > governments than > gods, and that started at zero). > -- > Ward Griffiths wdg3rd at comcast.net > > "What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this: If > you see > a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to > slow him down, > then one into his brain to finish him off". Aaron Allston, _Sidhe > Devil_ > > The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be > the Top this > time. Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation. > For us > individuals, BOHICA. > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > From: Gene Heskett >> On Wednesday 08 October 2008, Derek wrote: >>> Here is the latest in my ongoing archive >>> project. Rainbow Magazines scans from 1985. If you have any missing >>> issues you want to scan and get to me so I can add them to the > archives >>> please send me an e-mail. I have posted the link to this and all my > previous >>> archive updates on the coco3.com message forum >>> >> >> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3402#3402 >>> >>> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> >> Unforch, my firefox saved pw is invalid. ?? Can you send it >> privately, > Derek? > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From coconut at pritchard.ca Sat Oct 11 13:13:02 2008 From: coconut at pritchard.ca (Ryan Pritchard) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 12:13:02 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Success at resurrecting a CoCo (26-3001) with a 26-3029 FDC. Message-ID: I would like to thank everyone out there who over the past almost 2 months, have provided insight and assistance with my quest to resurrect a CoCo 1. During my journey, I successfully upgraded the CoCo 1 from 16K to 64K. Confirmed that the 26-3029 FDC was working, and even managed to get 3 out of 4 of my spare 3.5" 1.44MB floppy drives working on the CoCo 1 with 720K diskettes. Not to mention the spare 5.25" 80 track 96tpi double/quad (depending on who you talk to) density drive that I had with my GIMIX equipment, that first confirmed the FDC was fully functional. Thanks to other discussions about how to create real floppy diskettes from the image files, I was able to boot NitrOS-9 after the first attempt at making a copy of the 3.5" boot diskette on a Pentium IV IBM NetVista workstation running Windows XP Professional of all things. The Fdrawcmd.sys and CoCoDisk combo worked marvelously. Regards, Ryan Pritchard Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies From snhirsch at gmail.com Sat Oct 11 16:27:57 2008 From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:27:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 10 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> So can I assume you can boot OS9 Level II, but not NitrOS-9? >> And where'd you get these 40 track SS bootable images? > > Yes, OS9 L2 boots fine. The nitros9 image I was using came from > http://nitros9.lcurtisboyle.com/nitros9.html. > > Now that I know how to get them onto a physical disk, I'll try the images > from sourceforge. After a bit of grief writing the images under Linux, I was able to boot a DSDD NitrOS-9 image :-). Next question: What environment is the NitrOS-9 source intended to be built under? The makefile calls an executable called simply 'os9' all over the place and references a cross-assembler called 'mamou' (?). Perhaps it's there somewhere, but I could not locate anything specific about the build tools. I need to setup for this since the B&B disk drivers are apparently only provided in source form. Steve -- From chawks at dls.net Sat Oct 11 17:21:10 2008 From: chawks at dls.net (Christopher Hawks) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:21:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <48F118C6.7030504@dls.net> Steven Hirsch said the following on 10/11/2008 03:27 PM: > On Fri, 10 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: > >>> So can I assume you can boot OS9 Level II, but not NitrOS-9? >>> And where'd you get these 40 track SS bootable images? >> >> Yes, OS9 L2 boots fine. The nitros9 image I was using came from >> http://nitros9.lcurtisboyle.com/nitros9.html. >> >> Now that I know how to get them onto a physical disk, I'll try the >> images from sourceforge. > > After a bit of grief writing the images under Linux, I was able to boot > a DSDD NitrOS-9 image :-). > > Next question: What environment is the NitrOS-9 source intended to be > built under? The makefile calls an executable called simply 'os9' all > over the place and references a cross-assembler called 'mamou' (?). > > Perhaps it's there somewhere, but I could not locate anything specific > about the build tools. > > I need to setup for this since the B&B disk drivers are apparently only > provided in source form. Steven: All the utilities you need are in toolshed, also available from sourceforge. Builds on Linux, Mac, and Windows. -- Christopher R. Hawks HAWKSoft --------------------------------------------------------- We use Linux for all our mission-critical applications. Having the source code means that we are not held hostage by anyone's support department. -- Russell Nelson, President of Crynwr Software From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Oct 11 17:26:42 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:26:42 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? In-Reply-To: References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <1223760402.6436.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> On Sat, 2008-10-11 at 16:27 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote: > On Fri, 10 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: > > >> So can I assume you can boot OS9 Level II, but not NitrOS-9? > >> And where'd you get these 40 track SS bootable images? > > > > Yes, OS9 L2 boots fine. The nitros9 image I was using came from > > http://nitros9.lcurtisboyle.com/nitros9.html. > > > > Now that I know how to get them onto a physical disk, I'll try the images > > from sourceforge. > > After a bit of grief writing the images under Linux, I was able to boot a > DSDD NitrOS-9 image :-). > > Next question: What environment is the NitrOS-9 source intended to be > built under? The makefile calls an executable called simply 'os9' all > over the place and references a cross-assembler called 'mamou' (?). > Toolshed. Check sourceforge. At some point I'd like to make NitrOS-9 buildable until NitrOS-9 again. The NitrOS-9 project proper has no plans for this. C. From operator at coco3.com Sat Oct 11 17:30:00 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:30:00 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCo BASIC tokenizer Message-ID: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> Does anyone know if there's a 32-bit 80x86 command-line tool for converting ASCII BASIC listings into tokenized format... for the CoCo 1,2,3 ? I know that decb.exe can do this, but not without putting the source file onto a virtual disk at the same time as far as I know. I need the target file to be written as a PC file. If there's such a tool available, we'll be able to add it to the Rainbow IDE 2.0 as another builder (like a compiler, assembler or linker), allowing us to type in or load existing ASCII BASIC programs (some not even for the CoCo) and convert them to CoCo binary BASIC format before the disk imagers even see the file (like decb.exe, imgtool.exe, os9.exe). Rainbow 1.x adapts to Boisy's decb.exe tool for tokenizing BASIC listings while they are copied onto the virtual disk, which is nice, but I'm trying to organize these functions better and leave file processing out of the disk imaging code. Rainbow IDE 2.0 is not released yet but today I compiled my Jeweled game to a virtual disk and it ran, and next will be the massive Projector-3 system built onto two virtual disks after which I'll know (if it runs), the IDE is functioning as intended for "assembly" purposes. Next I'll be working with compilers, as soon as tonight. It'll be an all-nighter so I've got the coffee pot and CoCo mug ready. To sum things up a little, I'm simplifying the build process even more making it terribly simple to build CoCo stuff if you've already been using Rainbow 1.x. There will be less options in the sidebar but more functions, by condensing the controls to deal with more automated functions. I want to support the VCC CoCo 3 emulator eventually but right now it can only launch as a command to mount a binary file but not a virtual disk. When VCC can be called as a command along with a virtual disk OR binary file, those frustrated with M.E.S.S. (or not) who want to experience an even quicker and better launch into their CoCo creations should be amazed to see this work seamlessly in the IDE just as it always has for the M.E.S.S. emulator. The trade I'd give for someone writing or coming up with a Windows 32-bit command-line utility for converting an ASCII BASIC CoCo file into a tokenized version is a free copy of the Rainbow IDE 2.0 when it's released. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp From tonym at compusource.net Sat Oct 11 17:50:18 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:50:18 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? References: <1223602108.6335.1.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <001201c92a7a$5c0f8ef0$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> <1223643733.6335.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com> <48F118C6.7030504@dls.net> Message-ID: <001f01c92beb$5a5ef010$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Christopher Hawks" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2008 5:21 PM >Subject: Re: [Coco] Howto for installing nitros9? > > Steven Hirsch said the following on 10/11/2008 03:27 PM: >> On Fri, 10 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote: >> >> Next question: What environment is the NitrOS-9 source intended to be >> built under? The makefile calls an executable called simply 'os9' all >> over the place and references a cross-assembler called 'mamou' (?). >> >> Perhaps it's there somewhere, but I could not locate anything specific >> about the build tools. >> >> I need to setup for this since the B&B disk drivers are apparently only >> provided in source form. > > Steven: > > All the utilities you need are in toolshed, also available from > sourceforge. Builds on Linux, Mac, and Windows. > Doesn't build under Windows, as downloaded - gives a bunch of errors before even starting. This is confirmed on the sourceforge site in postings between the developers. Some changes are required in the makefiles, or rules.mak - I back-burnered it for now... I, too, would like to see it self-hosted. Tony From tlindner at macmess.org Sat Oct 11 18:19:34 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 15:19:34 -0700 Subject: [Coco] CoCo BASIC tokenizer In-Reply-To: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> Roger Taylor wrote: > Does anyone know if there's a 32-bit 80x86 command-line tool for > converting ASCII BASIC listings into tokenized format... for the CoCo > 1,2,3 ? I know that decb.exe can do this, but not without putting > the source file onto a virtual disk at the same time as far as I > know. Did you try it? DECB works here in *nix land (Mac OS X) the way you want. g4:~ tlindner$ cat BASIC.TXT 10 PRINT "HELLO " 20 ? "WORLD" 30 GOTO 30 g4:~ tlindner$ decb copy -t BASIC.TXT BASIC.BAS g4:~ tlindner$ decb dump BASIC.BAS Addr 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F 0 2 4 6 8 A C E -------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---------------- 00000000 260d 000a 8720 2248 454c 4c4f 2022 0026 &.... "HELLO ".& 00000010 1b00 1487 2022 574f 524c 4422 0026 2500 .... "WORLD".&%. 00000020 1e81 a520 3330 0000 00 ..% 30... -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright From operator at coco3.com Sat Oct 11 18:30:08 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:30:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] CoCo BASIC tokenizer In-Reply-To: <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com> Actually, I never tried it because I assumed decb.exe could only copy to/from virtual disks and the local drive. I wasn't aware that the tool could do this. So, decb.exe is effectively a "compiler" as far as Rainbow is concerned. Any tool that can take a source file and turn it into any kind of object file, or translate any file from one into another, is called a Builder in Rainbow IDE 2.0. This helped me unify a lot of the code and do away with some bloated and duped code and arrays. I'll add decb.exe as a builder (with type=compiler) in a while and do some test builds of some ASCII BASIC game listings, etc. Thanks At 05:19 PM 10/11/2008, you wrote: >Roger Taylor wrote: > > > Does anyone know if there's a 32-bit 80x86 command-line tool for > > converting ASCII BASIC listings into tokenized format... for the CoCo > > 1,2,3 ? I know that decb.exe can do this, but not without putting > > the source file onto a virtual disk at the same time as far as I > > know. > >Did you try it? > >DECB works here in *nix land (Mac OS X) the way you want. > >g4:~ tlindner$ cat BASIC.TXT >10 PRINT "HELLO " >20 ? "WORLD" >30 GOTO 30 >g4:~ tlindner$ decb copy -t BASIC.TXT BASIC.BAS >g4:~ tlindner$ decb dump BASIC.BAS > > > Addr 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F 0 2 4 6 8 A C E >-------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---------------- >00000000 260d 000a 8720 2248 454c 4c4f 2022 0026 &.... "HELLO ".& >00000010 1b00 1487 2022 574f 524c 4422 0026 2500 .... "WORLD".&%. >00000020 1e81 a520 3330 0000 00 ..% 30... > >-- >tim lindner >tlindner at macmess.org Bright > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp From PaulH96636 at aol.com Sat Oct 11 18:41:56 2008 From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 18:41:56 EDT Subject: [Coco] Application to a Chicagofest video possibility? Message-ID: Going on today is Kona, Hawaii's Ironman event. It is being video'd on: www.konafriends.com by Joe Trent who is also the webmaster You might have a look at the site to determine if the video hdw applicable to Chicagofest. If live video is not being xmitted at the moment, usually previous captures are being shown. Requires PC with Java. If the video window seems to hang or get stuck for a while, press the pause button to the left of the local time clock, then press play. Someone said this action clears the cache buffer. -ph ************** New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination. Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out (http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002) From operator at coco3.com Sun Oct 12 16:26:00 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 15:26:00 -0500 Subject: [Coco] update on IDE In-Reply-To: <20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> <20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com> I'm very impressed at what I'm seeing today with Rainbow IDE 2.0. I just crunched the massive Projector-3 graphics system (CoCo 3 disk) in about 10 seconds, and that software is working fine from the virtual CoCo window. P-3 is one of the best test builds I have for proving that the IDE, the CCASM 6809/6309 cross assembler, and P-3 itself, along with imgtool.exe or decb.exe is working great. It's all seamless from the time you click Go until you see the nuclear green window pop up. The CoCo ROM Pak test builds and launches right into the ROM Pak, running. Great. At that point, you see it works, and it's EPROM-ready. I also built the big TASM test project which assembles about 20 different source code files for different CPUS (all supported by TASM), and they're assembling to their binary objects. Yea! TASM really sets off the IDE and lends support for most of the M.E.S.S. emulated systems you can launch into. Rainbow IDE is basically a vintage development system for almost all of the oldie computers and game units, which are a LOT. You can almost name a CPU and a system, and the chances are, Rainbow has built-in support for developing for those systems, with emulation. The new overhaul of the IDE innards is proving to be successful. I'm going to pick back up on the OS-9 Level Two RMA/Rlink support and for assembling onto blank or existing virtual OS-9 floppies. This is very cool to experience. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Oct 12 16:59:30 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 16:59:30 -0400 Subject: [Coco] update on IDE In-Reply-To: <20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> <20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com> <20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: > Roger Taylor > > http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp > > What kind of ignorant sludge is THAT blog? C. From tlindner at macmess.org Sun Oct 12 17:46:40 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 14:46:40 -0700 Subject: [Coco] cocomag: UnderColor completion Message-ID: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Yesterday all the tasks in digitizing UnderColor were completed. It took 36 day from start to finish. I'd like to thank everyone who piched in to help. As planned the data will eventually pushed on the CoCo wiki. I'm more than half way building the script to push the data over. At that point, anyone will be able to further clean up the articles. Some articles have their tables and firgures ommitted so any interested person and improve the article in that and other ways. The next magazine I am considering doing is: "The World of 68' Micros". I am open to suggestions on how the web app might be changed to better fit the digitization of that magazine. *** Some stats Under Color: 11 Issues. 28 pages per issue. 5 to 7 articles per issue. 4,442 tasks were created. 5,863 tasks were submitted. This means every task was worked 1.32 times. That is about what I expected. -- tim lindner tlindner at macmess.org Bright From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Oct 12 17:53:53 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 16:53:53 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Success at resurrecting a CoCo (26-3001) with a 26-3029 FDC. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48F271F1.4080104@swbell.net> Ryan Pritchard wrote: > I would like to thank everyone out there who over the past almost 2 > months, have provided insight and assistance with my quest to > resurrect a CoCo 1. > Glad to hear you got it working. JCE > During my journey, I successfully upgraded the CoCo 1 from 16K to > 64K. Confirmed that the 26-3029 FDC was working, and even managed to > get 3 out of 4 of my spare 3.5" 1.44MB floppy drives working on the > CoCo 1 with 720K diskettes. Not to mention the spare 5.25" 80 track > 96tpi double/quad (depending on who you talk to) density drive that I > had with my GIMIX equipment, that first confirmed the FDC was fully > functional. > > Thanks to other discussions about how to create real floppy diskettes > from the image files, I was able to boot NitrOS-9 after the first > attempt at making a copy of the 3.5" boot diskette on a Pentium IV IBM > NetVista workstation running Windows XP Professional of all things. > The Fdrawcmd.sys and CoCoDisk combo worked marvelously. > > Regards, > > Ryan Pritchard > Fun Extends All Basic Life Expectancies > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From operator at coco3.com Sun Oct 12 18:13:33 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:13:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] update on IDE In-Reply-To: References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com> <1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org> <20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com> <20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20081012221338.9334520A3B@qs281.pair.com> At 03:59 PM 10/12/2008, you wrote: >>Roger Taylor >> >>http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp >> > >What kind of ignorant sludge is THAT blog? I guess it's just people having a blast while the world as we know it winds to an end over the next 20+ days. -- Roger Taylor http://www.wordofthedayonline.com From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Oct 12 18:44:08 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:44:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocomag: UnderColor completion In-Reply-To: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <48F27DB8.1060700@swbell.net> tim lindner wrote: > Yesterday all the tasks in digitizing UnderColor were completed. It took > 36 day from start to finish. I'd like to thank everyone who piched in to > help. > > Wow Tim. This was a cool project and it was fun to be involved. I was vaguely aware of the existence of UnderColor but hadn't seen it until now. I could tell there were some interesting articles and I look forward to being able to read them in their entirety. Thanks for making this possible. JCE > > > As planned the data will eventually pushed on the CoCo wiki. I'm more > than half way building the script to push the data over. > > > > At that point, anyone will be able to further clean up the articles. > Some articles have their tables and firgures ommitted so any interested > person and improve the article in that and other ways. > > The next magazine I am considering doing is: "The World of 68' Micros". > I am open to suggestions on how the web app might be changed to better > fit the digitization of that magazine. > > *** Some stats > > Under Color: > > 11 Issues. > 28 pages per issue. > 5 to 7 articles per issue. > > 4,442 tasks were created. > 5,863 tasks were submitted. > > This means every task was worked 1.32 times. That is about what I > expected. > > From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Oct 12 18:45:16 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:45:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] cocomag: UnderColor completion In-Reply-To: <48F27DB8.1060700@swbell.net> References: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> <48F27DB8.1060700@swbell.net> Message-ID: <48F27DFC.9010306@swbell.net> Joel Ewy wrote: > tim lindner wrote: > >> Yesterday all the tasks in digitizing UnderColor were completed. It took >> 36 day from start to finish. I'd like to thank everyone who piched in to >> help. >> >> >> > Wow Tim. This was a cool project and it was fun to be involved. I was > vaguely aware of the existence of UnderColor but hadn't seen it until > now. I could tell there were some interesting articles and I look > forward to being able to read them in their entirety. Thanks for making > this possible. > > And I should add a big thanks to Dennis for the magazine and the permission to preserve it! JCE > JCE > >> >> >> As planned the data will eventually pushed on the CoCo wiki. I'm more >> than half way building the script to push the data over. >> >> >> >> At that point, anyone will be able to further clean up the articles. >> Some articles have their tables and firgures ommitted so any interested >> person and improve the article in that and other ways. >> >> The next magazine I am considering doing is: "The World of 68' Micros". >> I am open to suggestions on how the web app might be changed to better >> fit the digitization of that magazine. >> >> *** Some stats >> >> Under Color: >> >> 11 Issues. >> 28 pages per issue. >> 5 to 7 articles per issue. >> >> 4,442 tasks were created. >> 5,863 tasks were submitted. >> >> This means every task was worked 1.32 times. That is about what I >> expected. >> >> >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Oct 12 18:46:36 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 18:46:36 -0400 Subject: [Coco] cocomag: UnderColor completion In-Reply-To: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> References: <1iopcag.z3v4i81hmfs0yM%tlindner@macmess.org> Message-ID: <48F27E4C.4050805@worldnet.att.net> tim lindner wrote: > Yesterday all the tasks in digitizing UnderColor were completed. It took > 36 day from start to finish. I'd like to thank everyone who piched in to > help. > > > > As planned the data will eventually pushed on the CoCo wiki. I'm more > than half way building the script to push the data over. > > > > At that point, anyone will be able to further clean up the articles. > Some articles have their tables and firgures ommitted so any interested > person and improve the article in that and other ways. > > The next magazine I am considering doing is: "The World of 68' Micros". > I am open to suggestions on how the web app might be changed to better > fit the digitization of that magazine. > > *** Some stats > > Under Color: > > 11 Issues. > 28 pages per issue. > 5 to 7 articles per issue. > > 4,442 tasks were created. > 5,863 tasks were submitted. > > This means every task was worked 1.32 times. That is about what I > expected. > I spent a large amount of time formatting listings prior to proofreading. This was absolutely necessary with assembly source code. It would help immensely if tabs could be set and used rather than having to enter spaces. While the hand formatting seemed to stick for a second and third pass of proofreading, none of it is now present when looking at the accomplished tasks. Has it all been lost? There was some trouble with the OCR rendering of ' and ". Neither the Coco nor my browser used for proofreading can make use of opening and closing '" as for example Microsoft Word does. The OCR program mixed up opening, closing, and straight forms of the above. Since the end result probably will be cut and pasted into a Coco, I converted all opening, closing forms into straight. It would be nice not to need to do that. From tlindner at macmess.org Sun Oct 12 20:33:21 2008 From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner) Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:33:21 -0700 Subject: [Coco] cocomag: UnderColor completion In-Reply-To: <48F27E4C.4050805@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1iopjsv.1q7dxtsxzbj2aM%tlindner@macmess.org> Robert Gault wrote: > I spent a large amount of time formatting listings prior to > proofreading. This was absolutely necessary with assembly source code. > It would help immensely if tabs could be set and used rather than > having to enter spaces. > > While the hand formatting seemed to stick for a second and third pass of > proofreading, none of it is now present when looking at the accomplished > tasks. Has it all been lost? It has not been lost. But, by default, web browsers will render all horizontal spacing into a single space. I just made a change to the show_magazine script that uses the 
 tags to keep horiztonal
spacing visible, so you'll beable to see your spacing now.

> There was some trouble with the OCR rendering of ' and ". Neither the
> Coco nor my browser used for proofreading can make use of opening and
> closing '" as for example Microsoft Word does. The OCR program mixed up
> opening, closing, and straight forms of the above. Since the end result
> probably will be cut and pasted into a Coco, I converted all opening,
> closing forms into straight. It would be nice not to need to do that.

Good suggestion. I can eisaly change all quote variants into the dumb
kind during the ocr of listings.

I also have a list of OCR errors that kept appearing. Here is my current
list:

I-l=H
lt's =It's 
rep/ies =replies 
lt =It 
ln =In 
l've =I've 
you'lI =you'll 
ls = Is 
lf = If 
l'll = I'll 
FIS =RS 
FtS?=RS-
Multi?Pak=Multi-Pak
l-I=H
l-l=H
|-|=H
paraIlel = parallel 
l'm =I'm 
lf =If 
Ietter=letter

I plan to automate the substitution of these pairs.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org                                              Bright


From operator at coco3.com  Sun Oct 12 21:43:42 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 20:43:42 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Rainbow IDE 2.0 in progress
In-Reply-To: <48E01BA8.10504@worldnet.att.net>
References: <20081001045343.15FEC20A33@qs281.pair.com>
	<48E01BA8.10504@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <20081013014349.B321D20A36@qs281.pair.com>

At 07:04 PM 9/28/2008, you wrote:
>Roger Taylor wrote:
>>
>>I still need to locate some kind of 32-bit C compiler or PASCAL 
>>compiler that CCASM or one of the other Rainbow 1.x supported 
>>assemblers can handle so I can start working on some productive 
>>compile/assemble sessions.
>
>Is there anything in the GNU package that you could use?
>
>http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/


Somehow I missed replying to this.  As long as a 6809 compiler 
outputs decent 6809 assembler source, CCASM would probably crunch 
it.  If it chokes on a few psuedo ops , adding support won't be that hard.

It's the linker support in my Rainbow IDE that has gone unsupported 
so far because I haven't found a 32-bit Windows console 6809 cross 
compiler.  The language doesn't have to be C.  I'll add support for 
the first language I encounter that outputs decent 6809 
assembly.  Pascal, or even an unpopular compiler language is fine 
with me.  I'm sure any compiler language would be a first choice over 
assembly to some coders.

I am going to avoid using any kind of ancient "make" mechanism in 
favor of a more modern solution where dependent files are internally 
linked to their parents.  Eventually I'll have it where an assembly 
file can choose it's compiler parent from listboxes or whatever is 
quickest to just point to the file(s), or the final linked binary can 
choose it's components in a similar fashion.  The idea is to make it 
all a visual interface of click and choose components based on the 
output files of other source files.  It's a job, yes.  There's 
nothing I dislike more than having to break away from any IDE to 
manually edit a makefile.  Those days are coming to an end.  I'm 
amazed at the Microsoft Visual Studio IDE but haven't dug in enough 
to figure out how it deals with compiler->assembler->linker builds.

A Rainbow project can have any mix of source files calling on any 
compiler or assembler for each file, yet I've made it so simple to 
use that once those builders are configured (a slew of them are 
preconfigured and included in the IDE, btw!) you just choose your 
switches and options from listboxes for each file.  It's very cool.




-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From wallygrossman at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 12 21:41:09 2008
From: wallygrossman at hotmail.com (wallygrossman)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 01:41:09 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Elite Word for os9
Message-ID: 

I was going through some old stuff and found a copy of Elite Word for 
os9 level I.  It works on level one, but not on level II.  I have the 
manual for Elite Word level II, but don't have the disk.  Does anybody 
know where such disk is available?



From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 07:50:21 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 07:50:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] update on IDE
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com>
	<1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org>
	<20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com>
	<20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com>
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 12 Oct 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:

>> Roger Taylor
>> 
>> http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp
>> 
>> 
>
> What kind of ignorant sludge is THAT blog?

I agree.

If that URL was posted as a gesture of support for such ignorant, racist 
drivel please take it to an appropriate forum.



-- 


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 07:51:45 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 07:51:45 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] update on IDE
In-Reply-To: <20081012221338.9334520A3B@qs281.pair.com>
References: <20081011213019.9D7AF20A33@qs281.pair.com>
	<1ionjsj.7yeo0q1csoe6hM%tlindner@macmess.org>
	<20081011223028.23A6420A36@qs281.pair.com>
	<20081012202605.437FC20A33@qs281.pair.com>
	
	<20081012221338.9334520A3B@qs281.pair.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 12 Oct 2008, Roger Taylor wrote:

> At 03:59 PM 10/12/2008, you wrote:
>
>>> Roger Taylor
>>> 
>>> http://www.wordofthedayonline.com/random_thoughts_august_3_2007.asp
>>> 
>> 
>> What kind of ignorant sludge is THAT blog?
>
>
>
> I guess it's just people having a blast while the world as we know it winds 
> to an end over the next 20+ days.
>
> -- 
> Roger Taylor

Welcome to my kill-file, Roger!  And just when I was starting to like this 
place.


-- 


From proteanthread at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 13 07:39:00 2008
From: proteanthread at yahoo.com (Jeff Wood)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 04:39:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] My list of Yahoo Groups
Message-ID: <20081013113900.A9E2BED0004@web0.grouply.com>

Hi, 

You can see a list of my groups on Grouply at the link below. Maybe you'll find
some you want to join. 

Jeff 

Here's the link:
http://www.grouply.com/register.php?tmg=920020&vt=9794142  





====================
This message was posted by a fellow group member who uses Grouply instead of
email to access this group. Grouply blocks additional invitations from being
sent to this group by anyone for 30 days. Group owners can permanently block
future invitations. For more on how Grouply maintains privacy and protects you,
see http://blog.grouply.com/protect/ . 




From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 17:13:45 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 14:13:45 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Just a thought for a little peace in the CoCoNuts Community
Message-ID: <889830d00810131413q3bdda472x3fea1ed57ced72f9@mail.gmail.com>

Given that this list tends to have a lot of little brush fires, may I
suggest that until the US elections are over, we all try to refrain from any
political banter?

It's just a though guys and gals, but I would really hate to see this list
degrade any further, especially now that I have finally clear all the
superfluous junk out of my place and I am getting back with the CoCo.

Like I said, it's just a thought, and no, I am not trying to step on
anyone's freedom of speech.

Cheers,

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


From ed.orbea at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 17:45:05 2008
From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 14:45:05 -0700
Subject: [Coco] WasL Ramdisk under NitrOS9
Message-ID: <48F3C161.10501@gmail.com>

I am attempting to follow the directions/suggestions contained in the 
above referenced thread so as to update my current VHD to the current 
version of NitrOS9
I am using VCC 1.4 on a Windows XP (SP3) laptop
My VCC configuration has
Slot 4: FS502.dll
Slot 3: Harddrive.dll
Slot 2: Empty
Slot 1: Empty
Slot 4 is selected as active
NitrOS9.VHD is mounted in H0
A 6809 processor is being emulated as normal speed (no acceleration)
The FD controller is set for RGBDOS

When I execute a hard reboot, I get Robert Gault's default screen with 
the 5 options, but the cursor never dsiplays a OK prompt. Any input from 
the keyboard is ignored.

When I do not use RGBDOS and use a Boot VHD disk in drive d0, I can boot 
NitrOS9, and access /h0, thus my question.

WHan do I need to do/change/configure to allow VCC to "basically" boot 
NitrOS9 without a floppy drive using RBGDos and DOS253?

Thanks



From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 18:18:25 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 18:18:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Just a thought for a little peace in the CoCoNuts
 Community
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810131413q3bdda472x3fea1ed57ced72f9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <889830d00810131413q3bdda472x3fea1ed57ced72f9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 13 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:

> Given that this list tends to have a lot of little brush fires, may I
> suggest that until the US elections are over, we all try to refrain from any
> political banter?

It would be best to just keep it out of here completely - election or not.

> It's just a though guys and gals, but I would really hate to see this list
> degrade any further, especially now that I have finally clear all the
> superfluous junk out of my place and I am getting back with the CoCo.
>
> Like I said, it's just a thought, and no, I am not trying to step on
> anyone's freedom of speech.

I'm all for freedom of speech, so I would invite the original poster to 
take it to the appropriate forum and speak to his heart's content.  This 
is not, however, the appropriate forum.

Steve


-- 


From jimcox at miba51.com  Mon Oct 13 18:45:19 2008
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 15:45:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Just a thought for a little peace in the CoCoNuts
	Community
In-Reply-To: 
References: <889830d00810131413q3bdda472x3fea1ed57ced72f9@mail.gmail.com>
	
Message-ID: <6c92f46c0810131545p189d1931qf30f60d4687df2f1@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Steven,

I agree with you on all points.  I have been on this list from day
one, and these kind of discussions only hurt the community.

It doesn't matter whether I am in agreement or disagreement with the
person's view, politics just doesn't belong on this list.

The only exception to that is the political discussion as to why Tandy
stopped making the CoCo :-)

Cheer,

-Jim Cox
(Yes the last sentence was a poor attempt at a joke :)

On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 3:18 PM, Steven Hirsch  wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:
>
>> Given that this list tends to have a lot of little brush fires, may I
>> suggest that until the US elections are over, we all try to refrain from
>> any
>> political banter?
>
> It would be best to just keep it out of here completely - election or not.
>
>> It's just a though guys and gals, but I would really hate to see this list
>> degrade any further, especially now that I have finally clear all the
>> superfluous junk out of my place and I am getting back with the CoCo.
>>
>> Like I said, it's just a thought, and no, I am not trying to step on
>> anyone's freedom of speech.
>
> I'm all for freedom of speech, so I would invite the original poster to take
> it to the appropriate forum and speak to his heart's content.  This is not,
> however, the appropriate forum.
>
> Steve
>
>
> --
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From paulej at arid.us  Mon Oct 13 18:46:44 2008
From: paulej at arid.us (Paul E. Jones)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 18:46:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New law to limit copyright infringement penalties
Message-ID: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>

Folks,

 

I just found this today:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:s.2913:

 

This has apparently passed the Senate and is headed to the House.  Rainbow
might fall into a category that is subject to this law.

 

Paul

 



From tonym at compusource.net  Mon Oct 13 18:51:26 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 22:51:26 GMT
Subject: [Coco] LA craigslist free FD-500 + FDC
Message-ID: <200810131851891.SM09028@[63.69.23.239]>

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/zip/876896305.html

FD-500 + looks like a -3029 FDC

From tonym at compusource.net  Mon Oct 13 18:56:20 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 22:56:20 GMT
Subject: [Coco] LA craigslist free FD-500 + FDC
Message-ID: <200810131856563.SM09028@[63.69.23.239]>

btw, looks like same party has a grey MPI, also:

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/zip/876899426.html


Tony 


-----Original Message-----
From: tonym tonym at compusource.net
Sent 10/13/2008 6:51:26 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] LA craigslist free FD-500 + FDC

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/zip/876896305.html

FD-500 + looks like a -3029 FDC


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco


From badfrog at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 19:04:03 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 18:04:03 -0500
Subject: [Coco] LA craigslist free FD-500 + FDC
In-Reply-To: <200810131856563.SM09028@63.69.23.239>
References: <200810131856563.SM09028@63.69.23.239>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810131604r6018e3ccw9e3c7b65d24ae203@mail.gmail.com>

That guy doesn't know how much extra cash he's sitting on!  :)

On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 5:56 PM, tonym  wrote:
> btw, looks like same party has a grey MPI, also:
>
> http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/zip/876899426.html
>
>
> Tony
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tonym tonym at compusource.net
> Sent 10/13/2008 6:51:26 PM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
> Subject: [Coco] LA craigslist free FD-500 + FDC
>
> http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/zip/876896305.html
>
> FD-500 + looks like a -3029 FDC
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Oct 13 19:21:48 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 19:21:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] WasL Ramdisk under NitrOS9
In-Reply-To: <48F3C161.10501@gmail.com>
References: <48F3C161.10501@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48F3D80C.60801@worldnet.att.net>

Ed Orbea wrote:
> I am attempting to follow the directions/suggestions contained in the 
> above referenced thread so as to update my current VHD to the current 
> version of NitrOS9
> I am using VCC 1.4 on a Windows XP (SP3) laptop
> My VCC configuration has
> Slot 4: FS502.dll
> Slot 3: Harddrive.dll
> Slot 2: Empty
> Slot 1: Empty
> Slot 4 is selected as active
> NitrOS9.VHD is mounted in H0
> A 6809 processor is being emulated as normal speed (no acceleration)
> The FD controller is set for RGBDOS
> 
> When I execute a hard reboot, I get Robert Gault's default screen with 
> the 5 options, but the cursor never dsiplays a OK prompt. Any input from 
> the keyboard is ignored.
> 
> When I do not use RGBDOS and use a Boot VHD disk in drive d0, I can boot 
> NitrOS9, and access /h0, thus my question.
> 
> WHan do I need to do/change/configure to allow VCC to "basically" boot 
> NitrOS9 without a floppy drive using RBGDos and DOS253?
> 
> Thanks
> 

There is no OK because the AUTOEXEC.BAS program is waiting for you to 
make a selection. If none of the choices is what you want, just hit the 
BREAK key.

Once again I have to say that while I've given permission for my 
emulator version of RGBDOS to be used with VCC, any support for RGBDOS 
must be addressed to me not through VCC.
There is documentation about RGBDOS on my web site in the RGBDOS package.

Now regards VCC, the RGBDOS ROM is part of the harddrive.dll as well as 
an option for the FD502.dll. It can be accessed either by selecting the 
harddrive.dll slot or the FD502.dll slot+RGBDOS with the MPI control.
What you see on a cold boot, depends on the programs installed on the 
hard drive. If the hard drive is bare, you will not get a selection 
menu. If hard drive#0 contains AUTOEXEC.BAS, then that program will 
auto-run and the results will depend on the program.
The hard drive from the VCC site had contained an AUTOEXEC.BAS program 
and based on Ed's results it must still be there.

If you want VCC or any other RGBDOS / HDBDOS system to boot OS-9 / 
NitrOS-9 from a hard drive rather than a floppy, you must have installed 
on one of the hard drive Disk Basic drives a 35 track single sided OS-9 
boot disk. This boot disk must contain a boot module in the kernel aimed 
at hard drive use. Os9boot must contain a driver and descriptor for hard 
drive use.
The hard drive from the VCC site had such a boot disk installed on one 
of the drives in the region of 250-255; probably 253 or 254.
To boot from this drive, the LINK.BAS program must be run to place the 
correct information on LSN0 of the OS-9 portion of the hard drive. This 
had been done on the VCC supplied hard drive and probably is still set 
that way. That means you can just issue the command DOS# where # is the 
number of the boot disk, ex. DOS253

Ed, is one of the 5 options booting OS-9? If it is, then select it by 
pressing the number. If not, kill the program and try both DOS253 and 
DOS254, one of which probably will work.
For the future, create a custom boot disk and back it up to any drive# 
you wish. Then run LINK.BAS indicating which drive to use. Add that to 
the bootup menu.


From ed.orbea at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 20:26:24 2008
From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 17:26:24 -0700
Subject: [Coco]  WasL Ramdisk under NitrOS9
References: 48F3C161.10501@gmail.com
Message-ID: <48F3E730.9060005@gmail.com>

Robert:

A thousand thanks. The simple statement "press the break key" was the 
part I was missing. I was expecting that after I made a selection of 1 
to 4 I would be prompted to exit. but that was my mistake in assuming. 
Now that I understand what happens "behind the scenes" selecting option 
5 and following your instructions will achieve what I needed.

All is well now, of course I probably will have more questions, and I 
ask your patience, but for now...

Thanks!


From neilsmorr at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 21:32:49 2008
From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 18:32:49 -0700
Subject: [Coco] New law to limit copyright infringement penalties
References: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
Message-ID: <0876413A3D134AD48A2CB5FC4A1AAA6E@NewBaby>

Search for (Shawn Bentley Orphan Works Act of 2008)

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Paul E. Jones" 


> Folks,
> I just found this today:
>
> http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:s.2913:
>
> This has apparently passed the Senate and is headed to the House.  Rainbow
> might fall into a category that is subject to this law.
> Paul



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 13 21:59:23 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 21:59:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New law to limit copyright infringement penalties
In-Reply-To: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
References: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
Message-ID: <200810132159.23287.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 13 October 2008, Paul E. Jones wrote:
>Folks,
>
>
>
>I just found this today:
>
>http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:s.2913:
>
>
>
>This has apparently passed the Senate and is headed to the House.  Rainbow
>might fall into a category that is subject to this law.
>
It doesn't like my browser, can someone find a link that works?

Thanks.

>Paul
>
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Dungeons and Dragons is just a lot of Saxon Violence.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 13 22:07:58 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 22:07:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New law to limit copyright infringement penalties
In-Reply-To: <200810132159.23287.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
	<200810132159.23287.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1223950078.6436.49.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Mon, 2008-10-13 at 21:59 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> It doesn't like my browser, can someone find a link that works?
> 
> Thanks.

Hey Gene, be sure that colon on the end makes it into your browser bar.
My mail client seems to discard it, but if I tack it on manually the
link works.

C.




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Oct 13 22:36:44 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 22:36:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] WasL Ramdisk under NitrOS9
In-Reply-To: <48F3E730.9060005@gmail.com>
References: 48F3C161.10501@gmail.com <48F3E730.9060005@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48F405BC.1080404@worldnet.att.net>

Ed Orbea wrote:
> Robert:
> 
> A thousand thanks. The simple statement "press the break key" was the 
> part I was missing. I was expecting that after I made a selection of 1 
> to 4 I would be prompted to exit. but that was my mistake in assuming. 
> Now that I understand what happens "behind the scenes" selecting option 
> 5 and following your instructions will achieve what I needed.
> 
> All is well now, of course I probably will have more questions, and I 
> ask your patience, but for now...
> 
> Thanks!
> 

Ed,
I'm not sure what selections were supplied with the VCC hard drive but 
it should have been set up so that pressing a number key would start 
whatever that selection was. There ought not to be a need to press the 
BREAK key unless none of the selections were desirable.
I suggest you LIST the AUTOEXEC.BAS program on hard drive #0, see if 
that starts another AUTOEXEC.BAS on a higher drive number, and customize 
the final program to your needs.


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Tue Oct 14 07:35:45 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 07:35:45 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] New law to limit copyright infringement penalties
In-Reply-To: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
References: <025b01c92d85$90f7f7c0$b2e7e740$@us>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 13 Oct 2008, Paul E. Jones wrote:

> I just found this today:
>
> http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:s.2913:
>
> This has apparently passed the Senate and is headed to the House.  Rainbow
> might fall into a category that is subject to this law.

The sponsor of that bill, Pat Leahy, is our (Vermont) senior senator and, 
for the most part, one of the more clued-in members of that esteemed group 
with regard to digital rights issues.  Out of deference to a self-imposed 
moratorium on political discussion I will not mention his party 
affiliation :-).

Steve


-- 


From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Tue Oct 14 17:55:11 2008
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 07:55:11 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Looking for 1984 Motorola Product Manual
Message-ID: <48F5153F.3010406@optusnet.com.au>

I was wondering if anyone has a copy of an old Motorola Product manual 
from 1984.

What I am looking for is the users Manual for: "Raster Memory System  
Version 3.0 April 15, 1984"

This RMS chipset was the precursor to the GIME chip in the CoCo3. The 
GIME ended up being a scaled down version of this chipset (2 chips) 
being developed as the new CoCo3 chipset by Motorola.

It's a shame the CoCo3 didn't get it. It featured much of the things we 
have in the GIME (VERY similar actually) but it also included the 
ability to display 32 colours from 4096 total, 1 megabyte DRAM 
addressing and 8 hardware sprites with collision detection.

Some of the "oddities" that I have been investigating with the GIME are 
also there in the RMS chipset design so hopefully, if I can find the 
product manual, it may shed some answers.

To read more about the RMS chipset, go to my 256 color mode page at:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/nickma/ProjectArchive/256mode.html


and also, read the text from the June 1985 issue of "UnderColor" found here:

http://cocomag.dyndns.org/cgi-bin/show_magazine.pl?magazine=UnderColor&issue=850111&article=850111-003-toc-4.cktct


From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com  Tue Oct 14 20:11:36 2008
From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:11:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] cocoNuts E-Zine
Message-ID: <20081014.191136.2488.3.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>

Thanks Mary for the web site.
These magazines are really helpful

John

On Tue, 14 Oct 2008 08:26:46 EDT Nuxie at aol.com writes:
http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=CoCoNutz_Ezine Hope this helps
deary.
Have fun reading it all!!
 
Mary






New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination. Dining,
Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out! 
____________________________________________________________
Love Graphic Design? Find a school near you. Click Now.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oLKlUUWjWjBtID1L8eM4I5Z2HRHudfU2NBdiEs4PxBF1JMN/


From chawks at dls.net  Tue Oct 14 20:32:53 2008
From: chawks at dls.net (Christopher Hawks)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:32:53 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Not Political
Message-ID: <48F53A35.90106@dls.net>

Hopefully this isn't taken as political.

Aussie CocoNuts, _PLEASE_ tell me this guy is not a typical Australian politician

Tho he may be like our typical American politicians...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eD1FQE_PQVI

-- 
Christopher R. Hawks
HAWKSoft
---------------------------------------------------------
The only "intuitive" interface is the nipple.  After that, it's all learned.
	-- Bruce Ediger, bediger at teal.csn.org, on X interfaces


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Tue Oct 14 20:48:26 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 20:48:26 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] What is "c3" compiler?
Message-ID: 

I've managed to get toolshed built and installed on my Linux box and can 
rebuild just about the entirety of NitrOS-9.  However, there are a few 
third-party utilities that want a C compiler that's invoked as "c3".  I 
cannot find anything about such a thing in Google.  What is this and where 
is it available?

Steve


-- 


From tlindner at macmess.org  Tue Oct 14 21:47:02 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 18:47:02 -0700
Subject: [Coco] What is "c3" compiler?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <1iotd25.4if2s61s0bbhvM%tlindner@macmess.org>

Steven Hirsch  wrote:

> I've managed to get toolshed built and installed on my Linux box and can
> rebuild just about the entirety of NitrOS-9.  However, there are a few
> third-party utilities that want a C compiler that's invoked as "c3".  I
> cannot find anything about such a thing in Google. What is this 

It is Microware's 6809 C compiler ported to K&R C.

> and where is it available?

It's not and it is not being worked on.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org                                              Bright


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 14 21:49:46 2008
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 01:49:46 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: My list of Yahoo Groups
In-Reply-To: <20081013113900.A9E2BED0004@web0.grouply.com>
Message-ID: 

Other groups have followup posts to this saying this is a data miner.
People could steal your account and post spam to your groups under
your name.

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Jeff Wood  wrote:
>
> Hi, 
> 
> You can see a list of my groups on Grouply at the link below. Maybe
you'll find
> some you want to join. 
> 
> Jeff 
> 
> Here's the link:
> http://www.grouply.com/register.php?tmg=920020&vt=9794142  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ====================
> This message was posted by a fellow group member who uses Grouply
instead of
> email to access this group. Grouply blocks additional invitations
from being
> sent to this group by anyone for 30 days. Group owners can
permanently block
> future invitations. For more on how Grouply maintains privacy and
protects you,
> see http://blog.grouply.com/protect/ .
>




From os9dude at gmail.com  Tue Oct 14 23:56:17 2008
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 23:56:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Any MC-10 users in need of RAM?
Message-ID: <5631e580810142056t52b190adyfd20916471e1a6f6@mail.gmail.com>

I had heard of a financial crisis, and prime RAM prices... but this is a bit
extreme:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360097903534

Yet another clueless post at Ebay.



-=[ R ]=-


From mdelyea at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 03:12:12 2008
From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 03:12:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Any MC-10 users in need of RAM?
In-Reply-To: <5631e580810142056t52b190adyfd20916471e1a6f6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5631e580810142056t52b190adyfd20916471e1a6f6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1b52e6c80810150012p566f341emead9c8fa82432519@mail.gmail.com>

Is that more than the original price?

On Tue, Oct 14, 2008 at 11:56 PM, Rogelio Perea  wrote:
> I had heard of a financial crisis, and prime RAM prices... but this is a bit
> extreme:
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360097903534
>
> Yet another clueless post at Ebay.
>
>
>
> -=[ R ]=-
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From underserf at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 14 22:38:08 2008
From: underserf at yahoo.com (Mike Ortloff)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:38:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: My list of Yahoo Groups
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <993509.54900.qm@web56604.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

I disconnected my main email address and marked this guy as a spammer long ago. Don't even subscribe to Yahoo groups directly any more

=M0=

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, James Diffendaffer  wrote:










    
            Other groups have followup posts to this saying this is a data miner.

People could steal your account and post spam to your groups under

your name.



-
	
	 
	
	








	


	
	


      


From neilsmorr at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 03:23:11 2008
From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 07:23:11 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: My list of Yahoo Groups
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

No, it isn't spam or a data miner. It's this new thing Yahoo has done 
('Grouply') which is a PITA as far as I am concerned.

Neil

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James Diffendaffer" 
 wrote:
>
> Other groups have followup posts to this saying this is a data miner.
> People could steal your account and post spam to your groups under
> your name.




From tonym at compusource.net  Wed Oct 15 03:56:01 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 07:56:01 GMT
Subject: [Coco] Any MC-10 users in need of RAM?
Message-ID: <200810150356421.SM01600@[63.69.23.239]>

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Rogelio Perea os9dude at gmail.com
>Sent 10/14/2008 11:56:17 PM
>To: coco at maltedmedia.com coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: [Coco] Any MC-10 users in need of RAM?
>
>I had heard of a financial crisis, and prime RAM prices... but this is a bit
>extreme:
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360097903534
>
>Yet another clueless post at Ebay.
>

Clueless doesn't even BEGIN to cover it...

If he got no bids at $8 :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360096871033

How in the heeby-jeebies are ya gonna list it for FIDDY BUCKS?!?!?

Oh, and mysteriously, the shipping went up a buck...

Hmmm....


Tony

From os9dude at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 06:11:48 2008
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 06:11:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Any MC-10 users in need of RAM?
In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80810150012p566f341emead9c8fa82432519@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5631e580810142056t52b190adyfd20916471e1a6f6@mail.gmail.com>
	<1b52e6c80810150012p566f341emead9c8fa82432519@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5631e580810150311k67de2480t9d83281a20cded65@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, the original price at Radio Shack stores was US$49.99 - I got mine when
they were unloading the MC-10 from the catalog for less than half the
original list price or so.

The little RAM pack did quite good for the MC-10 as far as raising it's
'operational ceiling', the MC-10's built in 4k was good for very basic BASIC
programs... only 3,142 bytes available to the user once the system had did
it's start up homework, the 16 k pak allowed for 19,526 bytes of total user
available RAM to play with.

Curious nifty little machine :-)


-=[ R ]=-



On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 3:12 AM, mike delyea  wrote:

Is that more than the original price?
>
> On Tue, Oct 14, 2008 at 11:56 PM, Rogelio Perea  wrote:
> > I had heard of a financial crisis, and prime RAM prices... but this is a
> bit
> > extreme:
> >
> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360097903534
> >
> > Yet another clueless post at Ebay.
>
>


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 07:46:20 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 07:46:20 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Docs for Shell+ ?
Message-ID: 

Hi, All.

Two questions:

== One ==

I cannot seem to locate anything in terms of documentation for the 
enhanced shell_21 in NitrOS-9.  Is it a case of "read the source" or is 
there any text out there that describes its features and usage?

I hear rumor that it supports a real executable search path, for example.

== Two ==

I found mention on the net of something called "TOPS"; apparantly a 
project based in Germany to port common Unix tools to OS-9.  The ftp site 
in the US is long departed and I cannot find any mention of it using 
Google.

Can anyone recommend a location for (a) a decent editor (pre-built uemacs 
would be great) and (b) a 'cp' workalike that's not brain dead in 
requiring the target file name to be fully specified (understands that if 
the target path ends in a directory it should simply copy the source file 
there under the same name).

Steve


-- 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Oct 15 08:16:41 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 08:16:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Docs for Shell+ ?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <48F5DF29.8070101@worldnet.att.net>

Steven Hirsch wrote:
> Hi, All.
> 
> Two questions:
> 
> == One ==
> 
> I cannot seem to locate anything in terms of documentation for the 
> enhanced shell_21 in NitrOS-9.  Is it a case of "read the source" or is 
> there any text out there that describes its features and usage?
> 
> I hear rumor that it supports a real executable search path, for example.
> 
> == Two ==
> 
> I found mention on the net of something called "TOPS"; apparantly a 
> project based in Germany to port common Unix tools to OS-9.  The ftp 
> site in the US is long departed and I cannot find any mention of it 
> using Google.
> 
> Can anyone recommend a location for (a) a decent editor (pre-built 
> uemacs would be great) and (b) a 'cp' workalike that's not brain dead in 
> requiring the target file name to be fully specified (understands that 
> if the target path ends in a directory it should simply copy the source 
> file there under the same name).
> 
> Steve
> 
> 

There may be other locations for doc files but you can use this.
ftp://www.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/APPS/ShellPlus_2_1.lzh

Included in the archive is shellplus.doc which will be adequate for the 
current NitrOS-9 distribution. There may have been additions since this 
doc file was written.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Wed Oct 15 08:17:00 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 08:17:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Docs for Shell+ ?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1224073020.6436.65.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Wed, 2008-10-15 at 07:46 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:

> Can anyone recommend a location for (a) a decent editor (pre-built uemacs 
> would be great)

Take TSEDIT, get ipatch, apply patches to TSEDIT to get it to run under
Level II with aforementioned ipatch and voila!  You've got something
that's almost 'vi'.  Can't help you with uemacs, unfortunately.

C.




From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Oct 15 09:33:46 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 09:33:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Docs for Shell+ ?
In-Reply-To: <1224073020.6436.65.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<1224073020.6436.65.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200810150933.46945.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 15 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>On Wed, 2008-10-15 at 07:46 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
>> Can anyone recommend a location for (a) a decent editor (pre-built uemacs
>> would be great)
>
>Take TSEDIT, get ipatch, apply patches to TSEDIT to get it to run under
>Level II with aforementioned ipatch and voila!  You've got something
>that's almost 'vi'.  Can't help you with uemacs, unfortunately.
>
>C.
>
Its a great editor.  But for the newest nitros9, you will have to rename it, 
both in its directory entry, and internally (don't forget to verify it after 
editing it with ded!) because there are now 'vi.dd' device descriptors for 
that style of windows.  I took the easy way out and renamed mine to 'ed', but 
almost any 2 letter combo that doesn't clash with a device descriptor name 
will do.
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If imprinted foil seal under cap is broken or missing when purchased, do not 
use.


From jerico2day at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 11:54:49 2008
From: jerico2day at gmail.com (jerico2day)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 15:54:49 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: My list of Yahoo Groups
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

No, it's not affiliated with Yahoo in any way. Please check out the
following:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080209214049AAtha6M

I'd stay away from Grouply!

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" 
wrote:
>
> No, it isn't spam or a data miner. It's this new thing Yahoo has done 
> ('Grouply') which is a PITA as far as I am concerned.
> 
> Neil
> 
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James Diffendaffer" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > Other groups have followup posts to this saying this is a data miner.
> > People could steal your account and post spam to your groups under
> > your name.
>




From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 00:41:23 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 23:41:23 -0500
Subject: [Coco]  We are running out of time
Message-ID: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>

We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.

Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are 
junk messages.

Who has an accurate count?


George 



From dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com  Thu Oct 16 00:51:51 2008
From: dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 00:51:51 -0400
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <200810160452.m9G4qlLX023947@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net>

At 12:41 AM 10/16/2008, you wrote:
>Who has an accurate count?

5020.

Dennis
















From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au  Thu Oct 16 01:24:17 2008
From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:24:17 +1000
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <48F6D001.4060607@iinet.net.au>

George Ramsower wrote:

> We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.

I have 4744 messages in my "coco2008" folder. I also tend to delete OT posts.

Why do we need 5000?

Regards,

-- 
|              Mark McDougall                | "Electrical Engineers do it
|     |   with less resistance!"


From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 01:34:02 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 00:34:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
References: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<48F6D001.4060607@iinet.net.au>
Message-ID: <003601c92f50$ccca9f10$d4b1b1d8@house>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark McDougall"


> George Ramsower wrote:
>
>> We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.
>
> I have 4744 messages in my "coco2008" folder. I also tend to delete OT 
> posts.
>
> Why do we need 5000?
>

Monk it.

 Gotta be an even number!


Ever watched "Monk"?

Of course, he would not know what a Coco is. Too busy touching parking 
meters and counting things.

George 



From shadow at shadowgard.com  Thu Oct 16 01:55:59 2008
From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 22:55:59 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: My list of Yahoo Groups
In-Reply-To: 
References: , 
Message-ID: <48F674FF.16714.9DE110EB@shadow.shadowgard.com>

On 15 Oct 2008 at 7:23, Neil Morrison wrote:

> No, it isn't spam or a data miner. It's this new thing Yahoo has done 
> ('Grouply') which is a PITA as far as I am concerned.

It's *not* Yahoo. In fact it's against the Yahoo rules to join it. 


--
Leonard Erickson (aka shadow)
shadow at shadowgard dot com




From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au  Thu Oct 16 05:59:41 2008
From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 19:59:41 +1000
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: <003601c92f50$ccca9f10$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>	<48F6D001.4060607@iinet.net.au>
	<003601c92f50$ccca9f10$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <48F7108D.6020401@iinet.net.au>

George Ramsower wrote:

> Ever watched "Monk"?

No, though they did run it here down under a few years back. Not sure if 
it's still going on free-to-air - I haven't seen an ad for it for quite some 
time. Did wonder if it was any good, but there's already enough shows on my 
"to watch" list so I never got around to checking it out.

Regards,

-- 
|              Mark McDougall                | "Electrical Engineers do it
|     |   with less resistance!"


From os9dude at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 06:04:24 2008
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 06:04:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Monk and The Chiclets - - - Was -> We are running out of
	time
Message-ID: <5631e580810160304w514d64dew1c5efee0d0e8acfd@mail.gmail.com>

I have a feeling Monk would favor the CoCo chiclets keyboard over the later
versions... those little square pegs look more neatly organized in rows
against the black backplane...


-=[ R ]=-



On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 1:34 AM, George Ramsower
wrote:

Monk it.
>
> Gotta be an even number!
>
>
> Ever watched "Monk"?
>
> Of course, he would not know what a Coco is. Too busy touching parking
> meters and counting things.
>


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 07:25:12 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 07:25:12 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Docs for Shell+ ?
In-Reply-To: <48F5DF29.8070101@worldnet.att.net>
References: 
	<48F5DF29.8070101@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: 

On Wed, 15 Oct 2008, Robert Gault wrote:

>> I cannot seem to locate anything in terms of documentation for the enhanced 
>> shell_21 in NitrOS-9.  Is it a case of "read the source" or is there any 
>> text out there that describes its features and usage?
>> 
>> I hear rumor that it supports a real executable search path, for example.

> There may be other locations for doc files but you can use this.
> ftp://www.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/APPS/ShellPlus_2_1.lzh
>
> Included in the archive is shellplus.doc which will be adequate for the 
> current NitrOS-9 distribution. There may have been additions since this doc 
> file was written.

Excellent.  Thanks!  I had grabbed an iso image from that site which did 
not have anything relative to the shell, but forgot to check around in the 
other directories.  Quite a goldmine.

Steve


-- 


From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 16 09:15:52 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 06:15:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <479646.12696.qm@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Why is 5000 a significant number?



** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 

--- On Wed, 10/15/08, George Ramsower  wrote:
From: George Ramsower 
Subject: [Coco]  We are running out of time
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 9:41 PM

We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.

Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are 
junk messages.

Who has an accurate count?


George 


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



      


From badfrog at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 10:29:16 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 09:29:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: <479646.12696.qm@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <001a01c92f49$71b95820$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<479646.12696.qm@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810160729t1a45a82es1da763b097e557d@mail.gmail.com>

I'd say because it's a neat milestone for ancient computer discussion.

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Derek  wrote:
> Why is 5000 a significant number?
>
>
>
> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>
>
>
>
> --- On Wed, 10/15/08, George Ramsower  wrote:
> From: George Ramsower 
> Subject: [Coco]  We are running out of time
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 9:41 PM
>
> We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.
>
> Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are
> junk messages.
>
> Who has an accurate count?
>
>
> George
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From rob.coco at zaphod.tzo.com  Thu Oct 16 23:19:28 2008
From: rob.coco at zaphod.tzo.com (Rob Rosenbrock)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 23:19:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
Message-ID: 

Why not go for 6809 messages?

-----Original Message-----
From: "Sean" 
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Sent: 10/16/08 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] We are running out of time

I'd say because it's a neat milestone for ancient computer discussion.

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Derek  wrote:
> Why is 5000 a significant number?
>
>
>
> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>
>
>
>
> --- On Wed, 10/15/08, George Ramsower  wrote:
> From: George Ramsower 
> Subject: [Coco]  We are running out of time
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 9:41 PM
>
> We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.
>
> Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are
> junk messages.
>
> Who has an accurate count?
>
>
> George
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Thu Oct 16 23:26:43 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 23:26:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <200810162326.43495.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Thursday 16 October 2008, Rob Rosenbrock wrote:
>Why not go for 6809 messages?
>
That or 6309.  Anyway, here is one of my contributions. :)

>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Sean" 
>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
>Sent: 10/16/08 10:29 AM
>Subject: Re: [Coco] We are running out of time
>
>I'd say because it's a neat milestone for ancient computer discussion.
>
>On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Derek  wrote:
>> Why is 5000 a significant number?
>>
>>
>>
>> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On Wed, 10/15/08, George Ramsower  wrote:
>> From: George Ramsower 
>> Subject: [Coco]  We are running out of time
>> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
>> Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 9:41 PM
>>
>> We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.
>>
>> Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are
>> junk messages.
>>
>> Who has an accurate count?
>>
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Youth of today!  Join me in a mass rally for traditional mental
attitudes!


From tonym at compusource.net  Thu Oct 16 23:38:10 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 03:38:10 GMT
Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
Message-ID: <200810162338531.SM02872@[63.69.23.239]>

We must ALL contribute!
Here is MY contribution

/ Real Content / 

I'm still in need of a Disto 4-in-1 + scsi cable, so lemme know if ya got one, and what $$ or trade
you're looking for.

Tony

-----Original Message-----
From: Gene Heskett gene.heskett at verizon.net
Sent 10/16/2008 11:26:43 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] We are running out of time

On Thursday 16 October 2008, Rob Rosenbrock wrote:
Why not go for 6809 messages?

That or 6309. Anyway, here is one of my contributions. :)

-----Original Message-----
From: "Sean" badfrog at gmail.com
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" coco at maltedmedia.com
Sent: 10/16/08 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] We are running out of time

I'd say because it's a neat milestone for ancient computer discussion.

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Derek dml_68 at yahoo.com wrote:
 Why is 5000 a significant number?



 ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **




 --- On Wed, 10/15/08, George Ramsower georgeramsower at gmail.com wrote:
 From: George Ramsower georgeramsower at gmail.com
 Subject: [Coco] We are running out of time
 To: coco at maltedmedia.com
 Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 9:41 PM

 We need more traffic on this list to make 5000 messages for this year.

 Well, that's the figure I have after deleting some of the things that are
 junk messages.

 Who has an accurate count?


 George


 --
 Coco mailing list
 Coco at maltedmedia.com
 http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco





 --
 Coco mailing list
 Coco at maltedmedia.com
 http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Youth of today! Join me in a mass rally for traditional mental
attitudes!

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From bkheath at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 04:28:31 2008
From: bkheath at gmail.com (Brett Heath)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 01:28:31 -0700
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
Message-ID: 

Hello All

I've been away for a couple of years but some may remember that i
occasionally made noises about a port of Laxen & Perry's f83 to the CoCo.

A few weeks ago I noticed that I once again had the necessary tools
(and the time!) to
resurrect the project. After som debugging  the f83 kernel is running
on Jeff Vavasour's CoCo 2 emulator under dosemu at one of my linux
consoles.

I haven't torture tested all the components yet, but the interpreter,
compiler, and defining
words all work which in itself is a pretty thorough test of the rest
of the dictionary (The exception being some of the more obscure logic
and math ops).

I'm currently working on the Disk I/O, which is the last component of
a complete kernel that
can then load all the goodies included in the full f83 distribution
(Assembler, Block editor, Multitasker, Decompiler, Forth debugger,
Memory dump, etc...).

Which brings me to why I rejoined the list now. f83 was different from
most other small forth systems available at the time in that while it
used the forth standard 1k sequential blocks for disk I/O it kept them
in files managed by the local DOS rather than writing them directly to
a
directoryless disk as most of it's contemporaries did.

The unravelled books and various other documentation have given me
what I need to design
a low-level interface that will work. The problem is I have never
owned a floppy interface for my CoCo's (a I and a II). Don't get me
wrong, I have few qualms about using the emulator with a downloaded
copy of the disk rom for testing (Microsoft owes me dammit), but the
fact that I have no familiarity with BDOS means it's gonna be pure
reverse engineering. A bit of insight from people familiar with the
tools would undoubtedly improve the design.

So here's my initial question.

At first blush it looks like there's no simple way to get BDOS to take
care of translating from logical file position to track/granule/sector
from outside of Basic. Which means I'm gonna have to read and parse
the directory (and probably the FAT) to keep track of where things
are. If this is the case, there doesn't seem to be much point in going
through Basic at all beyond the simple functions provided by DSKCON,
since I'll have to maintain my own copies of most things anyway, and
it's a Bad Idea to have two unrelated pieces of software running at
the same time when they both think they're in charge of a particular
piece of storage space, particularly directory and FAT storage space.

Is this right or didi I miss something(s)

If the above is a fair assesment, then there are undoubtedly some
subtleties in the way BDOS
handles the directory that I will have to address if I want f83
generated files to be readable by
Basic (particularly the full f83 executable). Any well known gotchas
to tell me about before
I start reading modifying and writing directories and FAT's. I'ts all
gonna be on virtual copies of
virtual disks of course so everythings recoverable, but any hints
which come to mind would be appreciated.

For those who are interested, my development system is f83 running
under dosemu in a terminal. As configured now it compiles the source
into a disk file in .pak format which is then
loaded into Vavasour's CoCo 2 emulator running on a console session of
dosemu in the same dos directory (gad I Love Linux!) for testing.  The
kernel runs in a footprint of just under 12k plus disk and stack
buffers. The full f83 will have a footprint of around 24k.

This is a straight port of f83, but it has been modified to be
position independent and I've added
functions to the metacompiler which allow it to compile directly to
disk rather than to a memory image which must then be saved.

One last question, has anybody managed to get the Keil emulator
running under dosemu?

Brett K. Heath


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Fri Oct 17 08:27:17 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 08:27:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <20081017122716.GA17554@tuxdriver.com>

On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 01:28:31AM -0700, Brett Heath wrote:

> A few weeks ago I noticed that I once again had the necessary tools
> (and the time!) to
> resurrect the project. After som debugging  the f83 kernel is running
> on Jeff Vavasour's CoCo 2 emulator under dosemu at one of my linux
> consoles.

Wow, that sounds really cool!  Any idea when you will have something
to share with us?

-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Fri Oct 17 09:10:38 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 09:10:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Fri, 2008-10-17 at 01:28 -0700, Brett Heath wrote:
> Hello All
> 
> I've been away for a couple of years but some may remember that i
> occasionally made noises about a port of Laxen & Perry's f83 to the CoCo.
> 
> A few weeks ago I noticed that I once again had the necessary tools
> (and the time!) to
> resurrect the project. After som debugging  the f83 kernel is running
> on Jeff Vavasour's CoCo 2 emulator under dosemu at one of my linux
> consoles.
> 

Two words:

SUPER COOL

> At first blush it looks like there's no simple way to get BDOS to take
> care of translating from logical file position to track/granule/sector
> from outside of Basic. Which means I'm gonna have to read and parse
> the directory (and probably the FAT) to keep track of where things
> are. If this is the case, there doesn't seem to be much point in going
> through Basic at all beyond the simple functions provided by DSKCON,
> since I'll have to maintain my own copies of most things anyway, and
> it's a Bad Idea to have two unrelated pieces of software running at
> the same time when they both think they're in charge of a particular
> piece of storage space, particularly directory and FAT storage space.

I am not an expert on the Disk BASIC side of things, but I believe you
are correct; the only "documented" entry point is DSKCON, which does not
deal with FCBs.  You're probably best off just using DSKCON and writing
your own filesystem routines, either compatible with Disk Basic's format
or not!

I'd love to get my hands on the F83 when you're done with it!  Excellent
job!

C.




From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 09:39:06 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 08:39:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco]  Wcreate in OS-9 L2
Message-ID: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>

 When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
returns a CRC error.

 What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, so 
I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.

 Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the machine 
is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was curious as to 
what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating the windows.

George 



From tlindner at macmess.org  Fri Oct 17 10:49:02 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 07:49:02 -0700
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>

Chuck Youse  wrote:

> I am not an expert on the Disk BASIC side of things, but I believe you
> are correct; the only "documented" entry point is DSKCON, which does not
> deal with FCBs.  You're probably best off just using DSKCON and writing
> your own filesystem routines, either compatible with Disk Basic's format
> or not!

That's good advice, but with DSKCON comes a large portion of BASIC and
it's overhead. Whenever I imagine I'm in a position like Brett, I'm
always ripping DSKCON from the ROM and make it independant.

Brett K. Heath wrote:

> One last question, has anybody managed to get the Keil emulator
> running under dosemu?

May I suggest a native linux emulator like sdlmess or XRoar for your
CoCo 2 needs?

XRoar
http://www.6809.org.uk/dragon/xroar.shtml

sdlmess:
http://rbelmont.mameworld.info/?page_id=163

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org                                              Bright


From bear at bears.org  Fri Oct 17 11:21:48 2008
From: bear at bears.org (Gary)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 11:21:48 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] VCC for Linux?
In-Reply-To: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
References: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008, tim lindner wrote:

> May I suggest a native linux emulator like sdlmess or XRoar for your
> CoCo 2 needs?
>
> XRoar
> http://www.6809.org.uk/dragon/xroar.shtml
>
> sdlmess:
> http://rbelmont.mameworld.info/?page_id=163

Does anyone know if there are any plans to port VCC to one of the linux 
GUI frameworks?

Peace,
Gary

   *********    *****    **                  Gary Coulbourne
  *************************.*
****** *********** ** *******o           ---------------------
******* ********* **** ****`-            Systems Administrator
******* ********* *****                   http://www.bears.org
  ****** ********** ****                      bear at bears.org
## *****  ***** ##  ****                         KB3INA
### *****      ###   ****                ---------------------
#,,, ***,,,    ##,,,  **,,,


From brucewcalkins at charter.net  Fri Oct 17 12:36:14 2008
From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:36:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Ramsower"

> When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
> returns a CRC error.
>
> What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, 
> so I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.
>
> Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the machine 
> is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was curious as 
> to what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating the windows.
>
> George



There were a few disk controllers that could not perform at the 2 MHz speed 
on Level 2 OS-9.  I have one and it drove me nuts with CRC errors.  Once I 
understood that one controller could not do OS-9 Level 2 I had few CRC 
problems.

Bruce W.



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 17 12:44:50 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:44:50 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
In-Reply-To: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>

George Ramsower wrote:
> When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
> returns a CRC error.
> 
> What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, 
> so I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.
> 
> Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the 
> machine is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was 
> curious as to what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating 
> the windows.
> 
> George
> 

You should post the exact command sequence you are using.

In general, wcreate does not access a disk for anything. However, 
wcreate is not normally in memory so if you issue a wcreate command, 
wcreate must be loaded from a disk.
Try loading wcreate before issuing any wcreate commands and see if you 
still get disk activity.


From mdelyea at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 12:57:54 2008
From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:57:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC for Linux?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
	
Message-ID: <1b52e6c80810170957x2d43d1adpf13174f2a00082b2@mail.gmail.com>

Have you tried it under wine?  I haven't yet but also wonder if
anybody else has.

On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 11:21 AM, Gary  wrote:
> On Fri, 17 Oct 2008, tim lindner wrote:
>
>> May I suggest a native linux emulator like sdlmess or XRoar for your
>> CoCo 2 needs?
>>
>> XRoar
>> http://www.6809.org.uk/dragon/xroar.shtml
>>
>> sdlmess:
>> http://rbelmont.mameworld.info/?page_id=163
>
> Does anyone know if there are any plans to port VCC to one of the linux GUI
> frameworks?
>
> Peace,
> Gary
>
>  *********    *****    **                  Gary Coulbourne
>  *************************.*
> ****** *********** ** *******o           ---------------------
> ******* ********* **** ****`-            Systems Administrator
> ******* ********* *****                   http://www.bears.org
>  ****** ********** ****                      bear at bears.org
> ## *****  ***** ##  ****                         KB3INA
> ### *****      ###   ****                ---------------------
> #,,, ***,,,    ##,,,  **,,,
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From bear at bears.org  Fri Oct 17 13:32:12 2008
From: bear at bears.org (Gary)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:32:12 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] VCC for Linux?
In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80810170957x2d43d1adpf13174f2a00082b2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
	
	<1b52e6c80810170957x2d43d1adpf13174f2a00082b2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008, mike delyea wrote:

> Have you tried it under wine?  I haven't yet but also wonder if
> anybody else has.

No, I've not.  I was mainly wondering since Linux is my primary operating 
system and I very rarely boot into windows.  It's closed source, but I 
didn't know if there was some kind of private porting effort underway. 
If there ever is one, I would certainly be willing to put some time into 
helping.

Peace,
Gary

   *********    *****    **                  Gary Coulbourne
  *************************.*
****** *********** ** *******o           ---------------------
******* ********* **** ****`-            Systems Administrator
******* ********* *****                   http://www.bears.org
  ****** ********** ****                      bear at bears.org
## *****  ***** ##  ****                         KB3INA
### *****      ###   ****                ---------------------
#,,, ***,,,    ##,,,  **,,,


From mechacoco at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 13:52:33 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 11:52:33 -0600
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
References: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810171052lcdfa0buffb9e801cbce1904@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/17/08, tim lindner wrote:

> Chuck Youse wrote:
>
>> I am not an expert on the Disk BASIC side of things, but I believe you
>> are correct; the only "documented" entry point is DSKCON, which does not
>> deal with FCBs.  You're probably best off just using DSKCON and writing
>> your own filesystem routines, either compatible with Disk Basic's format
>> or not!
>
> That's good advice, but with DSKCON comes a large portion of BASIC and
> it's overhead. Whenever I imagine I'm in a position like Brett, I'm
> always ripping DSKCON from the ROM and make it independant.
>

That's a good way to make DriveWire users unhappy  :-)

In addition, when Chuck's new floppy controller is available, software
not running under NitrOS9 will need to call DSKCON in order to be
compatible.

Darren


From mechacoco at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 14:33:56 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:33:56 -0600
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
References: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810171133g11631079k457e2918a1f87bab@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/17/08, tim lindner wrote:

> ....
> .... with DSKCON comes a large portion of BASIC and
> it's overhead. Whenever I imagine I'm in a position like Brett, I'm
> always ripping DSKCON from the ROM and make it independant.
>

What "large portion of BASIC and it's overhead" are you referring to Tim?

The Tandy versions of DSKCON are almost completely self-contained.
Other than 2 calls to a short delay-loop subroutine in COLOR BASIC at
$A7D1, there is no reliance on any other BASIC routines.

Tandy's DSKCON does require use of the following RAM addresses:
008A - 008B:  Assumes these two bytes are always zero
00EA - 00F0:  The documented DSKCON parameter block
0109 - 010B:  NMI Vector (jumps to Disk Basic's service routine)
097E - 0986:  Variables  (TRKTBL,NMIFLG,DNMIVC,RDYTMR,DRGRAM)

Other implementations of DSKCON such as those used in RGBDOS / HDBDOS
and DriveWire may have different requirements that I am not aware of.

Darren


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 17 15:45:00 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:45:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] AR archive program source
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <948196.86300.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


Looking for the source code for the OS-9 AR archive program (Carl Krieder was the author I believe)... Was the source code ever released? (Want to port it to DOS/Windows)

-Later!  ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting.


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From tlindner at macmess.org  Fri Oct 17 16:10:00 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:10:00 -0700
Subject: [Coco] AR archive program source
In-Reply-To: <948196.86300.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: 
	<948196.86300.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5b0704c10810171310v3779c9b1p48696b2f20cb0a93@mail.gmail.com>

In Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 12:45 PM, Bill Barnes  wrote:
>
> Looking for the source code for the OS-9 AR archive program (Carl Krieder was the author I believe)... Was the source code ever released? (Want to port it to DOS/Windows)

There is an ar2 command in the toolshed package. It was written by
Carl Krieder. I'm not sure but I think it is compatiable with ar.

There is a Window/MSDOS binary already on the download page. But if
you can help produce binaries for the currrent versions of the other
tools we are more than glad to accept your help.



Rober Gault and I have been emailing back and forth trying to solve
building issues. But it is slow going. I'm a Mac/Unix guy and he has
been feeding me errors as they come up. He has been using the MINGW
tool set.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org


From tlindner at macmess.org  Fri Oct 17 16:21:19 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:21:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810171133g11631079k457e2918a1f87bab@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
	<5d802cd0810171133g11631079k457e2918a1f87bab@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5b0704c10810171321i47d7600bg51fa6281ec964467@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 11:33 AM, Darren A  wrote:
> On 10/17/08, tim lindner wrote:
>
>> ....
>> .... with DSKCON comes a large portion of BASIC and
>> it's overhead. Whenever I imagine I'm in a position like Brett, I'm
>> always ripping DSKCON from the ROM and make it independant.
>>
>
> What "large portion of BASIC and it's overhead" are you referring to Tim?
>
> The Tandy versions of DSKCON are almost completely self-contained.
> Other than 2 calls to a short delay-loop subroutine in COLOR BASIC at
> $A7D1, there is no reliance on any other BASIC routines.
>
> Tandy's DSKCON does require use of the following RAM addresses:
> 008A - 008B:  Assumes these two bytes are always zero
> 00EA - 00F0:  The documented DSKCON parameter block
> 0109 - 010B:  NMI Vector (jumps to Disk Basic's service routine)
> 097E - 0986:  Variables  (TRKTBL,NMIFLG,DNMIVC,RDYTMR,DRGRAM)

Sometimes I think I mouth-off like this just so smarter people than I
can put me in my place. :)

A version of DSKCON that is relocatable and doesn't use predefined
variable address would be nice.


-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org


From tlindner at macmess.org  Fri Oct 17 16:26:51 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:26:51 -0700
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810171052lcdfa0buffb9e801cbce1904@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
	<5d802cd0810171052lcdfa0buffb9e801cbce1904@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5b0704c10810171326v39810da1n853d20f73752e142@mail.gmail.com>

In Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 10:52 AM, Darren A  wrote:
> On 10/17/08, tim lindner wrote:
>
>> Chuck Youse wrote:
>>
>>> I am not an expert on the Disk BASIC side of things, but I believe you
>>> are correct; the only "documented" entry point is DSKCON, which does not
>>> deal with FCBs.  You're probably best off just using DSKCON and writing
>>> your own filesystem routines, either compatible with Disk Basic's format
>>> or not!
>>
>> That's good advice, but with DSKCON comes a large portion of BASIC and
>> it's overhead. Whenever I imagine I'm in a position like Brett, I'm
>> always ripping DSKCON from the ROM and make it independant.
>>
>
> That's a good way to make DriveWire users unhappy  :-)

I totally understand where you are coming from. But I also realize
that the modularity of Fourth should make adding DriveWire support
easy.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 17 20:00:33 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 20:00:33 -0400
Subject: [Coco] AR archive program source
In-Reply-To: <5b0704c10810171310v3779c9b1p48696b2f20cb0a93@mail.gmail.com>
References: 	<948196.86300.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<5b0704c10810171310v3779c9b1p48696b2f20cb0a93@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48F92721.3010003@worldnet.att.net>

tim lindner wrote:
> In Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 12:45 PM, Bill Barnes  wrote:
>> Looking for the source code for the OS-9 AR archive program (Carl Krieder was the author I believe)... Was the source code ever released? (Want to port it to DOS/Windows)
> 
> There is an ar2 command in the toolshed package. It was written by
> Carl Krieder. I'm not sure but I think it is compatiable with ar.
> 
> There is a Window/MSDOS binary already on the download page. But if
> you can help produce binaries for the currrent versions of the other
> tools we are more than glad to accept your help.
> 
> 
> 
> Rober Gault and I have been emailing back and forth trying to solve
> building issues. But it is slow going. I'm a Mac/Unix guy and he has
> been feeding me errors as they come up. He has been using the MINGW
> tool set.
> 

I second Tim in saying anyone interested in working on the NitrOS-9 or 
Toolshed programs would be welcomed.

You can find the source code for ar v1.3 and possibly earlier versions 
on RTSI at ftp://www.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/ARCHIVERS
I have source code for earlier versions if you don't see it above. Far 
as I know, all the ar.ar files included source code.

There already is at least one version of AR for Microsoft DOS. If you do 
a Google search for GNU AR, you will lots of hits.


From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 20:37:47 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 19:37:47 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>

From: "Robert Gault"
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2008 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2


> George Ramsower wrote:
>> When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
>> returns a CRC error.
>>
>> What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, 
>> so I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.
>>
>> Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the 
>> machine is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was 
>> curious as to what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating 
>> the windows.
>>
>> George
>>
>
> You should post the exact command sequence you are using.
>
> In general, wcreate does not access a disk for anything. However, wcreate 
> is not normally in memory so if you issue a wcreate command, wcreate must 
> be loaded from a disk.
> Try loading wcreate before issuing any wcreate commands and see if you 
> still get disk activity.

 I should have told how I was using it. It's in the startup file as follows:

echo Creating Windows
wcreate -z
/w1 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
/w2 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
/w3 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
/w4 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2

 The line to echo always works. I put that in to see if it got that far.
 It echos and then the disk acts like it loads wcreate, then begins 
seeking... slowly, then exits the startup file with no reports of errors.
 Usually, I just kill the one background task and type /d0/startup and it 
USUALLY works. When it doesn't, it reports the CRC error after the echo 
Creating Windows line.

 Since the startup file doesn't have a CRC, this means that the wcreate is 
giving the CRC error. Tonight, when I booted, the same thing happened. So I 
called the startup file as usual with:
/d0/startup
 And for the first time, I got an error 216. Did a dir and error 216 
resulted. However, I ran "cold" and the system did reset to RSBASIC. I 
figure maybe there's something not right in the structure of the FAT?  A 
reboot worked this time, but I still had to re-run the startup file

 The next step was to do a single disk backup using the same disk for source 
and destination. I won't know until I reboot tomorrow when the coco is 
TOTALLY cold if this helped.
  This annoyance began a few months ago and I expected the problem was the 
power supply and bad cap/s. When that wire on the Y-cable came loose a few 
weeks ago and we all brain worked over that one was when I began seriously 
trying to find a bad cap. BTW, this is my CNC coco machine.

  I still think it's the floppy drive. Won't know until I do the isolation 
trick or, if the backup cleaned it up.

 I'm using the Disto SC II no-halt controller.


George 



From bkheath at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 21:11:03 2008
From: bkheath at gmail.com (Brett Heath)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 18:11:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <20081017122716.GA17554@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<20081017122716.GA17554@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: 

On 10/17/08, John W. Linville  wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 01:28:31AM -0700, Brett Heath wrote:
>
>> A few weeks ago I noticed that I once again had the necessary tools
>> (and the time!) to
>> resurrect the project. After som debugging  the f83 kernel is running
>> on Jeff Vavasour's CoCo 2 emulator under dosemu at one of my linux
>> consoles.
>
> Wow, that sounds really cool!  Any idea when you will have something
> to share with us?

I'm willing to share everything now, as long as it's understood to be
pre-Alpha ;-)

Seriously, unless you're allready famiiiar with f83 (note
capitalization) or at least
with forth in general it's not going be very useful unless you want to
play with the
hacked up metacompiler/cross-assembler under MS-DOS or CP/M.

f83 was originally released with _complete_ source (One of the neatest things
about it was that you could modify the source and use it to build a new version
of itself, very Zen;-) and a license that in effect said, "do what you
want with it
but give us credit for our work"., I intend to continue the tradition.
If you want to get
familiar with f83 it's available on taygeta (the forth intererest
group archive) for
MS-DOS, CP/M, and CP/M-68k (and maybe one or two other platforms) and until I
get the disk I/O going you would need one of these to play around with my tools
and/or source files.

One thing to note. f83 is a particular implementation of the F83 (or Forth-83)
standard. Although it's old enough that nobody much cares anymore about that
particular distinction (F83 was superceded by ANSII-Standard Forth in the '90s)
it's useful to keep it in mind if you're going to poke around in the
Forth archives.

Anyway, if somewone is really interested in playing around with my toolkit just
tell me where to send/upload it:
  The kernel09 source is about 200k
  The cross assembler source (copied from Brad Rodriquez' CHROMIUM) is
     about 26k
  The modified metacompiler source is about 50k
  The source for the DSKIMAGE utility, which lets the compiler build on disk
    rather in memory, is about 26k (most of which isn't used, Idea shamelessly
    stolen from Brad).
  As I said the .pak file binary is just under 12k. It assumes 4k just
below 7F00
     for disk buffers that it doesn't use and another page or so just
below that for
     stack space and input buffers. The only I/O implemented so far is
char-in from
     the keyboard and char-out to the VDG using the the Basic ROM
calls. So far it's
     run happily anywhere in low memory I care to load it.

There are also som ad-hoc tools for MS-DOS f83 which use about 10k of source
(mainly a clock interface for the editor DateStamp function, a limited
ability to
navigate directories, and a 16 line command history). All of the source is in
f83 .blk files.

Brett K. Heath


From devries.bob at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 22:48:42 2008
From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 12:48:42 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house><48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>
	<000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <001401c930cc$0ba03480$02175e77@aceraspire>

Can you give the actual error number?

There's actually two possible CRC errors; a disk CRC error and a module CRC 
error. I'm not in the same location as my manuals right now (~6000 km nort 
of them....), so I can't tell you the relavant numbers.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Ramsower" 
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2008 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2


> From: "Robert Gault"
> Sent: Friday, October 17, 2008 11:44 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
>
>
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>> When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
>>> returns a CRC error.
>>>
>>> What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, 
>>> so I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.
>>>
>>> Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the 
>>> machine is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was 
>>> curious as to what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating 
>>> the windows.
>>>
>>> George
>>>
>>
>> You should post the exact command sequence you are using.
>>
>> In general, wcreate does not access a disk for anything. However, wcreate 
>> is not normally in memory so if you issue a wcreate command, wcreate must 
>> be loaded from a disk.
>> Try loading wcreate before issuing any wcreate commands and see if you 
>> still get disk activity.
>
> I should have told how I was using it. It's in the startup file as 
> follows:
>
> echo Creating Windows
> wcreate -z
> /w1 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w2 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w3 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w4 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
>
> The line to echo always works. I put that in to see if it got that far.
> It echos and then the disk acts like it loads wcreate, then begins 
> seeking... slowly, then exits the startup file with no reports of errors.
> Usually, I just kill the one background task and type /d0/startup and it 
> USUALLY works. When it doesn't, it reports the CRC error after the echo 
> Creating Windows line.
>
> Since the startup file doesn't have a CRC, this means that the wcreate is 
> giving the CRC error. Tonight, when I booted, the same thing happened. So 
> I called the startup file as usual with:
> /d0/startup
> And for the first time, I got an error 216. Did a dir and error 216 
> resulted. However, I ran "cold" and the system did reset to RSBASIC. I 
> figure maybe there's something not right in the structure of the FAT?  A 
> reboot worked this time, but I still had to re-run the startup file
>
> The next step was to do a single disk backup using the same disk for 
> source and destination. I won't know until I reboot tomorrow when the coco 
> is TOTALLY cold if this helped.
>  This annoyance began a few months ago and I expected the problem was the 
> power supply and bad cap/s. When that wire on the Y-cable came loose a few 
> weeks ago and we all brain worked over that one was when I began seriously 
> trying to find a bad cap. BTW, this is my CNC coco machine.
>
>  I still think it's the floppy drive. Won't know until I do the isolation 
> trick or, if the backup cleaned it up.
>
> I'm using the Disto SC II no-halt controller.
>
>
> George
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 17 23:25:10 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 23:25:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
In-Reply-To: <000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>	<48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>
	<000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <48F95716.7010704@worldnet.att.net>

George,
You still have not tried to find out whether wcreate in your CMDS 
directory is good or what happens if you try:
load wcreate
wcreate etc.

Wcreate may be damaged on the disk. Do an   ident cmds/wcreate   and see 
if the file is still OK. The original OS-9 LevelII wcreate will give:
Header for: WCreate
Module size: $02B2   #690
Module CRC:  $7DC36C (Good)
Hdr parity:  $98
Exec. off:   $014A   #330
Data Size:   $01EE   #494
Edition:     $03     #3
Ty/La At/Rv: $11 $81
Prog mod, 6809 obj, re-en, R/O



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 17 23:29:13 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 23:29:13 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
In-Reply-To: <000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house>	<48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>
	<000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <48F95809.4080100@worldnet.att.net>

PS
You probably should also use mdir to make sure that w1 through w4 are 
loaded in memory. Also try ident os9boot and make sure there are no 
problems.


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Sat Oct 18 01:18:12 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 22:18:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <41912.75201.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thanks bunches.... Found what I needed to examine the AR archives under DOS (Perhaps a conversion to a more Windows GUI is in order :D )

NOW to dowload the AR2 archives... as I now have the DOS interface version of AR 1.5 (precompiled) and the 1.3 source.

Not familiar with all that has taken place, but willing to put what I do know, and learn what I dont in helping somewhere.

-Later!
 -WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting.


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From devries.bob at gmail.com  Sat Oct 18 03:15:02 2008
From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 17:15:02 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
References: <001601c9305d$bab9f290$d4b1b1d8@house><48F8C102.1090907@worldnet.att.net>
	<000c01c930b9$beeb3b60$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <002801c930f1$422bad20$02175e77@aceraspire>

The two CRC error numbers are:

232 - Incorrect module CRC
243 - CRC Error

The second indicates a disk problem, while the first indicates a bad module 
in memory, or in a file such as OS9Boot.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Ramsower" 
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2008 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2


> From: "Robert Gault"
> Sent: Friday, October 17, 2008 11:44 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Wcreate in OS-9 L2
>
>
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>> When I run wcreate it accesses the disk for something that sometimes 
>>> returns a CRC error.
>>>
>>> What is wcreate doing with the disk. I figured it might be using grvdrv, 
>>> so I make a new copy of that in the cmds dir.
>>>
>>> Actually, I think it's the disk drive as this only occurs when the 
>>> machine is cold. I'll have to try another drive to find ouy, but I was 
>>> curious as to what wcreate is doing with the disk drive while creating 
>>> the windows.
>>>
>>> George
>>>
>>
>> You should post the exact command sequence you are using.
>>
>> In general, wcreate does not access a disk for anything. However, wcreate 
>> is not normally in memory so if you issue a wcreate command, wcreate must 
>> be loaded from a disk.
>> Try loading wcreate before issuing any wcreate commands and see if you 
>> still get disk activity.
>
> I should have told how I was using it. It's in the startup file as 
> follows:
>
> echo Creating Windows
> wcreate -z
> /w1 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w2 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w3 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
> /w4 -s=2 0 0 80 24 0 2 2
>
> The line to echo always works. I put that in to see if it got that far.
> It echos and then the disk acts like it loads wcreate, then begins 
> seeking... slowly, then exits the startup file with no reports of errors.
> Usually, I just kill the one background task and type /d0/startup and it 
> USUALLY works. When it doesn't, it reports the CRC error after the echo 
> Creating Windows line.
>
> Since the startup file doesn't have a CRC, this means that the wcreate is 
> giving the CRC error. Tonight, when I booted, the same thing happened. So 
> I called the startup file as usual with:
> /d0/startup
> And for the first time, I got an error 216. Did a dir and error 216 
> resulted. However, I ran "cold" and the system did reset to RSBASIC. I 
> figure maybe there's something not right in the structure of the FAT?  A 
> reboot worked this time, but I still had to re-run the startup file
>
> The next step was to do a single disk backup using the same disk for 
> source and destination. I won't know until I reboot tomorrow when the coco 
> is TOTALLY cold if this helped.
>  This annoyance began a few months ago and I expected the problem was the 
> power supply and bad cap/s. When that wire on the Y-cable came loose a few 
> weeks ago and we all brain worked over that one was when I began seriously 
> trying to find a bad cap. BTW, this is my CNC coco machine.
>
>  I still think it's the floppy drive. Won't know until I do the isolation 
> trick or, if the backup cleaned it up.
>
> I'm using the Disto SC II no-halt controller.
>
>
> George
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From os9dude at gmail.com  Sat Oct 18 15:08:32 2008
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 15:08:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] MC-10 Pak back on Ebay...
Message-ID: <5631e580810181208v329fce9av538448351eccd8e5@mail.gmail.com>

Seems no one fell for the $50.00 starting bid price...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360099019465

That's more in tune now :-)



-=[ R ]=-


From tonym at compusource.net  Sat Oct 18 15:45:49 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 19:45:49 GMT
Subject: [Coco] MC-10 Pak back on Ebay...
Message-ID: <200810181545468.SM02692@[63.69.23.239]>

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Rogelio Perea os9dude at gmail.com
>Sent 10/18/2008 3:08:32 PM
>To: coco at maltedmedia.com coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: [Coco] MC-10 Pak back on Ebay...
>
>Seems no one fell for the $50.00 starting bid price...
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360099019465
>
>That's more in tune now :-)
>

But that wasn't the first attempt...

FIRST it was listed at $8 starting bid, no bites....

Then all of a sudden, the $55 buy-it-now...

And now it's listed again.

Tell you the truth, seller has probably paid more in eBay fees than will be gotten from the sale!
After you factor in 3-4 eBay listings, minus FVF, and then minus PayPal fees, ain't much left...

Tony

From mdelyea at gmail.com  Sat Oct 18 17:00:50 2008
From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 17:00:50 -0400
Subject: [Coco] MC-10 Pak back on Ebay...
In-Reply-To: <200810181545468.SM02692@63.69.23.239>
References: <200810181545468.SM02692@63.69.23.239>
Message-ID: <1b52e6c80810181400t96c767em639904e23c20d218@mail.gmail.com>

Heh, back in the day I had an MC-10 running as a terminal off my
coco2.  I used a home made crossover serial cable and some kind of
terminal software on the MC-10 (can't remember what it was) and a BBS
software I got from either CCM or Rainbow.  My friends were amazed
that I could type on one computer and the output would display on the
other.

On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 3:45 PM, tonym  wrote:
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Rogelio Perea os9dude at gmail.com
>>Sent 10/18/2008 3:08:32 PM
>>To: coco at maltedmedia.com coco at maltedmedia.com
>>Subject: [Coco] MC-10 Pak back on Ebay...
>>
>>Seems no one fell for the $50.00 starting bid price...
>>
>>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360099019465
>>
>>That's more in tune now :-)
>>
>
> But that wasn't the first attempt...
>
> FIRST it was listed at $8 starting bid, no bites....
>
> Then all of a sudden, the $55 buy-it-now...
>
> And now it's listed again.
>
> Tell you the truth, seller has probably paid more in eBay fees than will be gotten from the sale!
> After you factor in 3-4 eBay listings, minus FVF, and then minus PayPal fees, ain't much left...
>
> Tony
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>


From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Sat Oct 18 23:17:41 2008
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 23:17:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
In-Reply-To: <41912.75201.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: 
	<41912.75201.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 22:18:12 -0700 (PDT), Bill Barnes
 had a flock of green cheek conures squawk
out:

>Thanks bunches.... Found what I needed to examine the AR archives under DOS (Perhaps a conversion to a more Windows GUI is in order :D )
>
>NOW to dowload the AR2 archives... as I now have the DOS interface version of AR 1.5 (precompiled) and the 1.3 source.
>
>Not familiar with all that has taken place, but willing to put what I do know, and learn what I dont in helping somewhere.
>

All that is needed to make AR MSDOS compatible is a couple of
functions to swap the hi/lo bytes of a 16bit integer in the right
places.

Stephen

-- 
Stephen

Let not your mind run on what you lack as much as on what you have already. - Aurelius, Marcus


From tonym at compusource.net  Sun Oct 19 00:42:23 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 04:42:23 GMT
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
Message-ID: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>

There's some stuff here:

http://www.math.purdue.edu/~wilker/misc/DEVEL/0055/

something named ARMSDOS.C, source for opening AR files under DOS.

Check the other folders, 0001 - 0081, especially if you're into CP/M.


Tony

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Castello zootzoot at cfl.rr.com
Sent 10/18/2008 11:17:41 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] AR source code

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 22:18:12 -0700 (PDT), Bill Barnes
da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com had a flock of green cheek conures squawk
out:

Thanks bunches.... Found what I needed to examine the AR archives under DOS (Perhaps a conversion to a more Windows GUI is in order :D )

NOW to dowload the AR2 archives... as I now have the DOS interface version of AR 1.5 (precompiled) and the 1.3 source.

Not familiar with all that has taken place, but willing to put what I do know, and learn what I dont in helping somewhere.


All that is needed to make AR MSDOS compatible is a couple of
functions to swap the hi/lo bytes of a 16bit integer in the right
places.

Stephen

-- 
Stephen

Let not your mind run on what you lack as much as on what you have already. - Aurelius, Marcus

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From snhirsch at gmail.com  Sun Oct 19 09:28:32 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 09:28:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
In-Reply-To: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>
References: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 19 Oct 2008, tonym wrote:

> There's some stuff here:
>
> http://www.math.purdue.edu/~wilker/misc/DEVEL/0055/
>
> something named ARMSDOS.C, source for opening AR files under DOS.
>
> Check the other folders, 0001 - 0081, especially if you're into CP/M.

I grabbed those yesterday and hope to make this build under Linux. 
Unfortunately, there are many hard-wired assumptions regarding storage 
size so it's going to be a bit tedious.

There is a pair of precompiled 'ar' binaries for Linux, but since they are 
built for an ancient version of libc only the statically linked one is 
useful.




> All that is needed to make AR MSDOS compatible is a couple of
> functions to swap the hi/lo bytes of a 16bit integer in the right
> places.
>

-- 


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Sun Oct 19 09:51:12 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 09:51:12 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 19 Oct 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote:

> On Sun, 19 Oct 2008, tonym wrote:
>
>> There's some stuff here:
>> 
>> http://www.math.purdue.edu/~wilker/misc/DEVEL/0055/
>> 
>> something named ARMSDOS.C, source for opening AR files under DOS.
>> 
>> Check the other folders, 0001 - 0081, especially if you're into CP/M.
>
> I grabbed those yesterday and hope to make this build under Linux. 
> Unfortunately, there are many hard-wired assumptions regarding storage size 
> so it's going to be a bit tedious.
>
> There is a pair of precompiled 'ar' binaries for Linux, but since they are 
> built for an ancient version of libc only the statically linked one is 
> useful.
>

  I feel stupid.  Turns out there's a proper set of sources in 
toolshed.  For some reason "ar2" didn't register the first time I looked 
at it.




>
>
>> All that is needed to make AR MSDOS compatible is a couple of
>> functions to swap the hi/lo bytes of a 16bit integer in the right
>> places.
>> 
>
> -- 
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

-- 


From jcewy at swbell.net  Sun Oct 19 12:37:04 2008
From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 11:37:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] AR source code
In-Reply-To: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>
References: <200810190042281.SM04092@[63.69.23.239]>
Message-ID: <48FB6230.7020103@swbell.net>

tonym wrote:
> There's some stuff here:
>
> http://www.math.purdue.edu/~wilker/misc/DEVEL/0055/
>
>   
> something named ARMSDOS.C, source for opening AR files under DOS.
>
> Check the other folders, 0001 - 0081, especially if you're into CP/M.
>
>   

Lots of interesting stuff in these other folders.  Of note for this list
is a file in http://www.math.purdue.edu/~wilker/misc/DEVEL/0057/ listing
the contents of the old Genie Color Computer file archives.  I
downloaded that one and I'll post it on the Wiki at coco25.com.  It
would be interesting to compare that with the Delphi archives...

JCE

> Tony
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Castello zootzoot at cfl.rr.com
> Sent 10/18/2008 11:17:41 PM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
> Subject: Re: [Coco] AR source code
>
> On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 22:18:12 -0700 (PDT), Bill Barnes
> da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com had a flock of green cheek conures squawk
> out:
>
> Thanks bunches.... Found what I needed to examine the AR archives under DOS (Perhaps a conversion to a more Windows GUI is in order :D )
>
> NOW to dowload the AR2 archives... as I now have the DOS interface version of AR 1.5 (precompiled) and the 1.3 source.
>
> Not familiar with all that has taken place, but willing to put what I do know, and learn what I dont in helping somewhere.
>
>
> All that is needed to make AR MSDOS compatible is a couple of
> functions to swap the hi/lo bytes of a 16bit integer in the right
> places.
>
> Stephen
>
>   
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>   



From operator at coco3.com  Sun Oct 19 16:23:26 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 15:23:26 -0500
Subject: [Coco] M.E.S.S. CoCo emulators
Message-ID: <20081019202330.B7C3420A33@qs281.pair.com>

Hello folks,

I downloaded M.E.S.S. 0.127 today (plus the i686 optimized version) 
for Windows.  The first thing I noticed is that the CoCo modes 
(emulators) cause the Windows mouse cursor to vanish, as if being 
disabled.  I have to hit ALT-ESC to minimize the CoCo window and then 
kill the GUI sometimes to get back control.  Why is this happening, 
and why has every CoCo revision gotten slower and more erratic on 
each release?  Who's on this team of CoCo developers and how does 
something so obvious go unnoticed?

Other emulation modes seem to work fine, but I haven't tried each and 
every emulation.  Has anyone else noticed the mouse bug, and if so, I 
haven't seen anything written about it since it's release in August.

This isn't a bug report since I don't report bugs to M.E.S.S. 
anymore.  I did this years ago and my reports went unanswered.  I'm 
not on the team since I do not use their development tools and also 
don't want to get involved in such a messy system that keeps changing 
this much from version to version.  I'll simply step back to another 
working version and wait 1 or 2 more years until they get it right 
for a little while more, before breaking yet another revision.

One other potential problem: there's now no formal listing of the 
supported emulations?  Instead, I have to parse the sysinfo.dat file 
and strip out the needed info.  If this fails, I'll fall back to my 
own compiled list of M.E.S.S. systems that's included with my IDE 
installation.  I'm even thinking of merging the two lists of M.E.S.S. 
systems as they are loaded due to a problem I just noticed: M.E.S.S. 
.127 doesn't show the coco2b, coco2, and other coco modes in the 
sysinfo.dat file, but there they are in the MESSGUI.EXE 
application!  So the developers are hiding or keeping these modes out 
of any external file now?  Wow.

So, what I've had to do over time with the M.E.S.S. system is try to 
battle these crippling changes that keep affecting my Rainbow IDE 
that promises to work seamlessly to provide source code to emulation 
in one click.

My newest tricks will involve looking through the entire chosen MESS 
folder for files containing bios system info and all the .exe tools 
involved in the system.  This way, the drunken M.E.S.S. team of 
developers can rename, move things around, or do away with the BIOS 
names listing altogether, and Rainbow should keep on working with it.

IN THE WORSE CASE, a Rainbow user can always step back to a version 
or two back of M.E.S.S. that worked fine before the "current" version 
was broken.  Or, tweak the Rainbow IDE 2.0 options for M.E.S.S. which 
will be ready for any changes made to imgtool.exe (including -switch 
changes), and the M.E.S.S. CLI switches for forcing modes before launching.

On top of that, you should know that I'm working to support the VCC 
CoCo 3 emulator in the same way Rainbow works with M.E.S.S., so 
unless you're developing for other vintage systems using my IDE, and 
prefer to do only CoCo development, you wouldn't have to worry with 
M.E.S.S. or any of the issues I mentioned above.

Rainbow IDE 2.0 is not released yet but today I've got it where you 
can configure the M.E.S.S. launcher to mount floppies with new and 
old versions of M.E.S.S., mount tapes and cartridges, even if the 
M.E.S.S. team changes their CLI switch names and format.

Btw, I'm interested in knowing what version of M.E.S.S. any current 
Rainbow IDE 1.x users are using and what issues you've noticed or 
would like to see improved?
-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From tlindner at macmess.org  Sun Oct 19 16:40:06 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 13:40:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] M.E.S.S. CoCo emulators
In-Reply-To: <20081019202330.B7C3420A33@qs281.pair.com>
Message-ID: <1ip28dw.yb98oo1v0yhryM%tlindner@macmess.org>

Roger Taylor  wrote:

> One other potential problem: there's now no formal listing of the 
> supported emulations?

It's built into the executable. See the -listfull switch. Parsing the
sysinfo.dat file is the wrong way to go.

Or better use: -listxml. The resulting machine readable output contains
a lot of useful information.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org                                              Bright


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Sun Oct 19 16:41:39 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:41:39 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
Message-ID: 

All,

Perhaps everyone running Linux already knows about this, but I thought I'd 
mention:

http://www.osadl.org/RBF-File-System.rbf-file-system.0.html

Even if you have a newer kernel, grab both source tarballs since all the 
documentation is in the older one.

After build,

$ modprobe rbf

Then, OS-9 diskette images can be mounted as:

$ mount -t rbf -o loop,sector=256,nomagic some_disk.dsk /mnt

Use whatever mount point is appropriate for your system.  Seems to support 
read and write without problems.


Steve


-- 


From operator at coco3.com  Sun Oct 19 17:34:06 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:34:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] M.E.S.S. CoCo emulators
In-Reply-To: <20081019202330.B7C3420A33@qs281.pair.com>
References: <20081019202330.B7C3420A33@qs281.pair.com>
Message-ID: <20081019213411.2CABE20A35@qs281.pair.com>

Ok, apparently the use of the -nu or -newui CLI switch will bring up 
the preferred window type, as opposed to a window without a menu bar 
or a Windows mouse cursor.  I can't imagine why those items are 
missing from the old GUI window or why anyone would want that mode.

-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From operator at coco3.com  Sun Oct 19 17:49:51 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:49:51 -0500
Subject: [Coco] M.E.S.S. CoCo emulators
In-Reply-To: <1ip28dw.yb98oo1v0yhryM%tlindner@macmess.org>
References: <20081019202330.B7C3420A33@qs281.pair.com>
	<1ip28dw.yb98oo1v0yhryM%tlindner@macmess.org>
Message-ID: <20081019214958.3E42A20A33@qs281.pair.com>

At 03:40 PM 10/19/2008, you wrote:
>Roger Taylor  wrote:
>
> > One other potential problem: there's now no formal listing of the
> > supported emulations?
>
>It's built into the executable. See the -listfull switch. Parsing the
>sysinfo.dat file is the wrong way to go.
>
>Or better use: -listxml. The resulting machine readable output contains
>a lot of useful information.


Rainbow has a LearnMESS() procedure called at the start of the 
program that catalogs what systems are in the current/latest install 
of M.E.S.S.

I also have a file called messbios.txt with the condensed info (along 
with index for my small photo for that system) updated as of probably 
.124 or so, but I want Rainbow to update itself to what systems are 
currently part of the copy of M.E.S.S. the IDE user is pointing to at 
the time.  This means the user can choose different versions of 
M.E.S.S. at any time and not have a conflict.  On my system, I've got 
D:\MESS  D:\MESS104b   D:\MESS127   D:\MESS127_i686   etc...

Right now, I'm getting all the full names from sysinfo.dat (from 
.127) live but it involves more logic than I want to use and it takes 
about 8 seconds to process the entire file.  That's a bummer.  It has 
to skip TONS of text that is put there to show up in the M.E.S.S. GUI 
under System Info, etc.

I can probably have the IDE call M.E.S.S. using -listfull or whatever 
options I need then capture the stdout and scan it, but no matter 
where I'm getting this info, there's a BIOS nickname *and* full 
system name that I'm interested in, where the full name is shown in 
the drop-down listbox in the IDE panels, and the BIOS name is used 
when I launch M.E.S.S..

I think what I'll do is call LearnMESS() when the IDE user points to 
the M.E.S.S. .exe module and hits Apply or OK to accept it.  But... 
if a past version doesn't understand -the -listfull option, I'll have 
to recognize that nothing was obtained from the stdout listing and 
then try other means of learning the supported BIOSes... then if all 
else fails, use my own messbios.txt file.


-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sun Oct 19 19:22:48 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 19:22:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1224458568.12740.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Sun, 2008-10-19 at 16:41 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
> All,
> 
> Perhaps everyone running Linux already knows about this, but I thought I'd 
> mention:
> 
> http://www.osadl.org/RBF-File-System.rbf-file-system.0.html

Rad, I was totally unaware of this.  I may have to modify it to work on
"half-sector" disks..
C.




From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sun Oct 19 19:43:09 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 19:43:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] f83 for the 6809 -- It'a Alive!
In-Reply-To: <5b0704c10810171321i47d7600bg51fa6281ec964467@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1224249038.4937.5.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1ioy2o8.zuqxc0hyn481M%tlindner@macmess.org>
	<5d802cd0810171133g11631079k457e2918a1f87bab@mail.gmail.com>
	<5b0704c10810171321i47d7600bg51fa6281ec964467@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1224459789.12740.15.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Fri, 2008-10-17 at 13:21 -0700, tim lindner wrote:

> Sometimes I think I mouth-off like this just so smarter people than I
> can put me in my place. :)
> 
> A version of DSKCON that is relocatable and doesn't use predefined
> variable address would be nice.

Hah, I with you on this one, Tim, it's probably best just to rip the
appropriate routines.  A change of disk controller isn't terribly
important, that should require just new Forth words, much like OS-9
would require a new driver.  Reason being that if you're using Forth,
you're presumably not looking for much compatibility.

C.




From fredprov5 at usfamily.net  Sun Oct 19 21:06:39 2008
From: fredprov5 at usfamily.net (Fred D. Provoncha)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 20:06:39 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Stuck in Paladin's Legacy Again
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <48FBD9A1.3090603@usfamily.net>

If Allan Chaney is out there listening, I've got another question for 
you about Paladin's Legacy. Here's where I'm at up to this point:

I have acquired all 5 scrolls. I've got the Ring of Teleportation. I've 
got the theives kit, climbing gear, snow boots, some really good armor & 
weapons, and my experience level is now 7 (max 1750 HP).

I've descended into the mines near the dwarven city, in an effort to 
find the elven torch. I've gotten down to level 3 and so far I can't 
seem to find it. I can't get past level 3 of the dungeon because I keep 
running into a nasty creature called a "Balron" which I am unable to 
defeat. What do I do? How do I get past it?

Thanks,
Fred Provoncha
Stansbury Park, UT


--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---



From linville at tuxdriver.com  Sun Oct 19 21:07:27 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 21:07:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224458568.12740.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<1224458568.12740.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081020010727.GB7549@tuxdriver.com>

On Sun, Oct 19, 2008 at 07:22:48PM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Sun, 2008-10-19 at 16:41 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
> > All,
> > 
> > Perhaps everyone running Linux already knows about this, but I thought I'd 
> > mention:
> > 
> > http://www.osadl.org/RBF-File-System.rbf-file-system.0.html
> 
> Rad, I was totally unaware of this.  I may have to modify it to work on
> "half-sector" disks..

If you decide to pick-up an RBF project, it would probably be best if
it were turned into a FUSE filesystem.  That would have the benefit
of not needing to either patch new kernels or to keep-up with changing
internal kernel APIs.

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From skwirl42 at gmail.com  Sun Oct 19 21:21:52 2008
From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 22:21:52 -0300
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020010727.GB7549@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<1224458568.12740.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020010727.GB7549@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/19/08, John W. Linville  wrote:

> If you decide to pick-up an RBF project, it would probably be best if
>  it were turned into a FUSE filesystem.  That would have the benefit
>  of not needing to either patch new kernels or to keep-up with changing
>  internal kernel APIs.

Plus it could be made to run on Mac OS X, which I think a few of us
use. It'd be nice to have FUSE drivers for both RS-DOS format and RBF.
It'd make using CoCo images so much easier. Perhaps even read-only
support for casette images.

-- 
James Dessart



From tlindner at macmess.org  Sun Oct 19 22:10:09 2008
From: tlindner at macmess.org (tim lindner)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 19:10:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1ip2nrk.14vf14wtbkfgqM%tlindner@macmess.org>

James Dessart  wrote:

> On 10/19/08, John W. Linville  wrote:
> 
> > If you decide to pick-up an RBF project, it would probably be best if
> >  it were turned into a FUSE filesystem.  That would have the benefit
> >  of not needing to either patch new kernels or to keep-up with changing
> >  internal kernel APIs.
> 
> Plus it could be made to run on Mac OS X, which I think a few of us
> use. It'd be nice to have FUSE drivers for both RS-DOS format and RBF.
> It'd make using CoCo images so much easier. 

Boisy put together a FUSE (and MacFUSE) extension in toolshed. It is
currently broken, not sure why. I have not looked into it.

> Perhaps even read-only support for casette images.

This would even been eiaser now with the libcecb I wrote.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at macmess.org                                              Bright


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Sun Oct 19 23:50:12 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 20:50:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Sardis Technologies DMC "No-Halt" Floppy Controller
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <179327.60222.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hey everyone,

I e-Mailed David Wiens of Sardis Technologies (email below) and there is a chance he may release the DMC Controller info to the community. I dunno what we as a community can do to encourage this, but this could be some good news if he does so.

Sardis Technologies still has a website, as he is still in business working with Microcontroller Software and Hardware Design.


-Later!
?-WB-???    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.



> From: David C. Wiens 
> Subject: Re: "no halt" DMC floppy disk controller
> To: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com
> Date: Sunday, October 19, 2008, 8:59 PM
> Hi Bill,
> 
> Thanks for your interest in the DMC floppy disk controller.
> 
> Yes, it was compatible with the CoCo 3 (and CoCo 2).  As a
> matter of 
> fact, I was inspired to design it when the CoCo 3 and OS-9
> Level II were 
> released.
> 
> No, unfortunately it is no longer available for sale, and
> hasn't been 
> for over 15 years.
> 
> Would I be willing to release the design to the CoCo
> community?  
> Probably.  But it might be several months before I have
> time to look for it.
> 
> Building one would require finding a 1773 floppy disk
> controller chip.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Dave Wiens
> Sardis Technologies
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 07:49:38 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 07:49:38 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>
References: 
	<1224458568.12740.6.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020010727.GB7549@tuxdriver.com>
	<4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 19 Oct 2008, James Dessart wrote:

> On 10/19/08, John W. Linville  wrote:
>
>> If you decide to pick-up an RBF project, it would probably be best if
>>  it were turned into a FUSE filesystem.  That would have the benefit
>>  of not needing to either patch new kernels or to keep-up with changing
>>  internal kernel APIs.
>
> Plus it could be made to run on Mac OS X, which I think a few of us
> use. It'd be nice to have FUSE drivers for both RS-DOS format and RBF.
> It'd make using CoCo images so much easier. Perhaps even read-only
> support for casette images.

In general, I agree completely.  However, the RBF module seems to be 
actively maintained and was recently updated for 2.6.24+ kernels.

Steve


-- 


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 20 09:27:45 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 09:27:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>
	
Message-ID: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 20 October 2008, Steven Hirsch wrote:
>On Sun, 19 Oct 2008, James Dessart wrote:
>> On 10/19/08, John W. Linville  wrote:
>>> If you decide to pick-up an RBF project, it would probably be best if
>>>  it were turned into a FUSE filesystem.  That would have the benefit
>>>  of not needing to either patch new kernels or to keep-up with changing
>>>  internal kernel APIs.
>>
>> Plus it could be made to run on Mac OS X, which I think a few of us
>> use. It'd be nice to have FUSE drivers for both RS-DOS format and RBF.
>> It'd make using CoCo images so much easier. Perhaps even read-only
>> support for casette images.
>
>In general, I agree completely.  However, the RBF module seems to be
>actively maintained and was recently updated for 2.6.24+ kernels.
>
>Steve

That is in fact pretty old, Steve.  I'm running 2.6.27.2, at least 2 years 
newer.  I build my own so I can play the canary part.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
"I may kid around about drugs, but really, I take them seriously."
- Doctor Graper


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 20 09:40:48 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 09:40:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: 
	<4c56cbd30810191821o4ee4232fr22942cc922a3bbb3@mail.gmail.com>
	
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 09:27 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> >In general, I agree completely.  However, the RBF module seems to be
> >actively maintained and was recently updated for 2.6.24+ kernels.
> >
> >Steve
> 
> That is in fact pretty old, Steve.  I'm running 2.6.27.2, at least 2 years 
> newer.  I build my own so I can play the canary part.
> 

Hmm? 2.6.24 was released in Jan 2008 methinks.

C.




From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 20 10:22:35 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 10:22:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 20 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 09:27 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> >In general, I agree completely.  However, the RBF module seems to be
>> >actively maintained and was recently updated for 2.6.24+ kernels.
>> >
>> >Steve
>>
>> That is in fact pretty old, Steve.  I'm running 2.6.27.2, at least 2 years
>> newer.  I build my own so I can play the canary part.
>
>Hmm? 2.6.24 was released in Jan 2008 methinks.
>
My mistake, Feb 8, 2008 TBE, according to the date of the 
linux-2.6.24.1.tar.gz file (2.6.24 was badly broken & pulled) on 
ftp.kernel.org right now.

My, how time fly's when one is busy.  And I have been.  I spent the summer 
building an attached garage with little help, see

 to see what has been occupying my time. :)

OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of 
kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax 
restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
How many chunks could checkchunk check if checkchunk could check chunks?
	-- Alan Cox


From carlos.bragatto at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 10:34:19 2008
From: carlos.bragatto at gmail.com (Carlos Bragatto)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 13:34:19 -0100
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <16bae8870810200734q30818e59x4ea2dafad832ee95@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> My, how time fly's when one is busy.  And I have been.  I spent the summer
> building an attached garage with little help, see
>
>  to see what has been occupying my
> time. :)



Kudos!

But Gene, couldn't you generate a web album using something like JAlbum? It
generates fantastic web albums, and if you have a Macintosh, you can use
Bananalbum, which is way cooler.

Carlos


From chaneya at acwoodworksinc.com  Mon Oct 20 10:52:42 2008
From: chaneya at acwoodworksinc.com (Allan Chaney)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 09:52:42 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Stuck in Paladin's Legacy Again
In-Reply-To: <48FBD9A1.3090603@usfamily.net>
References: 
	<48FBD9A1.3090603@usfamily.net>
Message-ID: <004401c932c3$81cdced0$85696c70$@com>

Fred,

No problem.  Yes the mines are tough without the Elven Torch because it gets
darker the deeper you go.  (It's a nice touch of programming if I do say so
myself.) :)

Anyway, the Elven torch can be found by entering the mines on the other side
of the mountains.  The Torch is in the second level after the very simple
mazelike first level.  The Torch is in the first room you encounter on that
second level in a black box guarded by two orcs.  There are some other
chests as well.  To go deeper into the mines from this level you'll need to
keep your eyes peeled for a secret passage.  Just look at the moss texture
on the walls and if the moss looks different, just try walking through the
wall.  One game quirk you will want to be very aware of is that there is
only one save game.  And the mine levels refresh  with creatures and chests
every time you enter them.  So if you are running around deep in the mines
and very low on health and you save game.  That's it. That's where you are
saved.  Given your health status, you may not be able to make it out of the
mines because every mine lvl you enter in order to get out refreshes with
creatures.  Just make sure you have some health potions (purchased at the
cathedral) or better yet.  Save your game just before you enter the mines
and then don't save again until you get out.  You don't want to get stuck
down there and not be able to get out.
It will also help once you find the Sorcerer's Eye.  This lets you see a
bloweup map of all levels and maps.


Spoiler for End Game:
The mines form a V that goes under the mountains. It's 2 levels deep on each
side of the mountain converging into a shared 3rd level at the apex of the
V.  Then if you find the secret passage in lvl 3 (bottom right corner of the
map) you go even deeper for 2 more levels.  Tons of treasures are found in
level 4 and in level 5, you'll have to access the boat to get around on lvl
5 since it's flooded.  You don't need to own a boat, you just find one in
the level.  With the boat you can actually leave that map lvl by sailing out
between the wall squares.  This loads the final lvl of the mines where you
will find The Keeper and the Mystical Armor and Weapons of the Paladin.
Along with a bunch of really nasty creatures.

The Keeper will teleport you to the Nether Regions where you will face the
final Bad Guy.  But believe me you're not ready for that....yet

Allan

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Fred D. Provoncha
Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2008 8:07 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Stuck in Paladin's Legacy Again

If Allan Chaney is out there listening, I've got another question for 
you about Paladin's Legacy. Here's where I'm at up to this point:

I have acquired all 5 scrolls. I've got the Ring of Teleportation. I've 
got the theives kit, climbing gear, snow boots, some really good armor & 
weapons, and my experience level is now 7 (max 1750 HP).

I've descended into the mines near the dwarven city, in an effort to 
find the elven torch. I've gotten down to level 3 and so far I can't 
seem to find it. I can't get past level 3 of the dungeon because I keep 
running into a nasty creature called a "Balron" which I am unable to 
defeat. What do I do? How do I get past it?

Thanks,
Fred Provoncha
Stansbury Park, UT


--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1734 - Release Date: 10/20/2008
7:25 AM



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 20 10:57:28 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 10:57:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <16bae8870810200734q30818e59x4ea2dafad832ee95@mail.gmail.com>
References: 
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<16bae8870810200734q30818e59x4ea2dafad832ee95@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810201057.28750.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 20 October 2008, Carlos Bragatto wrote:
>On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Gene Heskett 
wrote:
>> My, how time fly's when one is busy.  And I have been.  I spent the summer
>> building an attached garage with little help, see
>>
>>  to see what has been occupying my
>> time. :)
>
>Kudos!
>
>But Gene, couldn't you generate a web album using something like JAlbum? It
>generates fantastic web albums, and if you have a Macintosh, you can use
>Bananalbum, which is way cooler.
>
>Carlos
>
All linux house here, and a quick search of yumex's offerings didn't find 
JAlbum.

I have been playing some with Amaya, but that has a very steep learning curve.
I just found I have bluefish installed & maybe I can cobble up something in 
it.  OTOH, a quick google search found it, & its dl'ing bow.

>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
American by birth; Texan by the grace of God.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 20 11:04:11 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:04:11 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of 
> kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax 
> restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
> 

I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.

C.




From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Oct 20 11:14:06 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:14:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
> > OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of 
> > kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax 
> > restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
> > 
> 
> I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.

http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt

If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Oct 20 11:20:09 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:20:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <20081020152009.GD4571@tuxdriver.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:14:06AM -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> > On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > 
> > > OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of 
> > > kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax 
> > > restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
> > > 
> > 
> > I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
> 
> http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
> 
> If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
> implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)

Should read "If you want a stable API then implement it in userland --
hence my FUSE suggestion.  Or, get your code merged in the kernel so
others maintain it as the API changes." :-)

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 20 11:29:01 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:29:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 11:14 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:

> > I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
> 
> http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
> 
> If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
> implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)

Whichever ass-hat wrote that document isn't writing it for me:

Executive Summary
18	-----------------
19	You think you want a stable kernel interface, but you really do not, and
20	you don't even know it.  What you want is a stable running driver, and
21	you get that only if your driver is in the main kernel tree.  You also
22	get lots of other good benefits if your driver is in the main kernel
23	tree, all of which has made Linux into such a strong, stable, and mature
24	operating system which is the reason you are using it in the first
25	place.

Total horseshit.  And for the record, the main reason why so many people use Linux is because so many other people use Linux.  It's as simple as that.

C.




From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Oct 20 11:34:29 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:34:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:29:01AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 11:14 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
> > On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> 
> > > I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
> > 
> > http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
> > 
> > If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
> > implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)
> 
> Whichever ass-hat wrote that document isn't writing it for me:
> 
> Executive Summary
> 18	-----------------
> 19	You think you want a stable kernel interface, but you really do not, and
> 20	you don't even know it.  What you want is a stable running driver, and
> 21	you get that only if your driver is in the main kernel tree.  You also
> 22	get lots of other good benefits if your driver is in the main kernel
> 23	tree, all of which has made Linux into such a strong, stable, and mature
> 24	operating system which is the reason you are using it in the first
> 25	place.
> 
> Total horseshit.  And for the record, the main reason why so many people use Linux is because so many other people use Linux.  It's as simple as that.

Well, I'll just vaguely smile and pretend that you've said something
meainingful, then drop the discussion... :-)

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com  Mon Oct 20 14:21:27 2008
From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:21:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco MPI
Message-ID: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>

What is the value of a working MPI Unit
I just acquired 2 more units. 
Any coco part or units I sell is
donated to the Chicago coco Fest fund.
This is one of the highlights of the year.

Hope to see you there. 

John
____________________________________________________________
Get help now! Click to find the right drug rehab solution for you.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nCeL6OYWrDlwrbnNl1bm2w29QnFrssgdcz97eTlRBJtN4Sd/


From mechacoco at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 15:43:33 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 13:43:33 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Coco MPI
In-Reply-To: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>
References: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810201243g63c5cfc5ld2d9614a064d9ee8@mail.gmail.com>

Which MPI model(s) are they?  I'm still on the lookout for a silver
26-3024 model in very good cosmetic condition to complete my
collection.

The value may also depend on whether or not the upgrade for CoCo 3
compatibility has been installed, especially for the later 26-3124
model which is more dificult to upgrade.

Darren

--------

On 10/20/08, John T Chasteen wrote:
> What is the value of a working MPI Unit
> I just acquired 2 more units.
> Any coco part or units I sell is
> donated to the Chicago coco Fest fund.
> This is one of the highlights of the year.
>
> Hope to see you there.
>
> John


From badfrog at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 15:47:28 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:47:28 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Coco MPI
In-Reply-To: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>
References: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810201247y5ac400bcuf749cf77afa50e03@mail.gmail.com>

My silver one went for $80, and my newer model went for over $130,
both were CoCo 3 modified.


On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 1:21 PM, John T Chasteen
 wrote:
> What is the value of a working MPI Unit
> I just acquired 2 more units.
> Any coco part or units I sell is
> donated to the Chicago coco Fest fund.
> This is one of the highlights of the year.
>
> Hope to see you there.
>
> John
> ____________________________________________________________
> Get help now! Click to find the right drug rehab solution for you.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nCeL6OYWrDlwrbnNl1bm2w29QnFrssgdcz97eTlRBJtN4Sd/
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From mechacoco at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 15:59:48 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 13:59:48 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Coco MPI
In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810201247y5ac400bcuf749cf77afa50e03@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20081020.142127.3128.2.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>
	<9efa17da0810201247y5ac400bcuf749cf77afa50e03@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810201259h64f22719x237d4975f5ef211c@mail.gmail.com>

You did very well!  They often go for much less on eBay.  I got a
like-new, boxed 3124 (the later model) for $38.00.

Darren

------
On 10/20/08, Sean wrote:
> My silver one went for $80, and my newer model went for over $130,
> both were CoCo 3 modified.
>


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 17:57:50 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:57:50 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, John W. Linville wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
>> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>
>>> OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of
>>> kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax
>>> restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
>>>
>>
>> I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
>
> http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
>
> If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
> implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)

Yow.  Not my intention to trigger a flame-war over Linux kernel stability 
(or lack thereof).  I have long since given up on building my own, and 
simply am using what Ubuntu 8.04 LTS shipped with.  The module works fine 
there and meets my needs.

Steve


-- 


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Oct 20 18:14:24 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 18:14:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	
Message-ID: <20081020221424.GG4571@tuxdriver.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 05:57:50PM -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
> On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, John W. Linville wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
>>> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>>
>>>> OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of
>>>> kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax
>>>> restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
>>
>> http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
>>
>> If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
>> implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)
>
> Yow.  Not my intention to trigger a flame-war over Linux kernel stability 
> (or lack thereof).  I have long since given up on building my own, and  
> simply am using what Ubuntu 8.04 LTS shipped with.  The module works fine 
> there and meets my needs.

I would have thought you could reserve the words "flame war" for
Chuck's post rather than mine...I didn't name the file...

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 18:39:34 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 18:39:34 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020221424.GG4571@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	
	<20081020221424.GG4571@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, John W. Linville wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 05:57:50PM -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
>> On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, John W. Linville wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04:11AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 10:22 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> OTOH, I just applied it to a 2.6.27.2 tree, but the compiler had a litter of
>>>>> kittens & failed rather verbosely.  And I know very little of the syntax
>>>>> restrictions it has now.  Lots of them were pointer miss-matches.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I love how a minor minor rev change in Linux means API breakage.
>>>
>>> http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/stable_api_nonsense.txt
>>>
>>> If you want a stable API, get your code merged in the kernel or
>>> implement it in userland instead -- hence my FUSE suggestion. :-)
>>
>> Yow.  Not my intention to trigger a flame-war over Linux kernel stability
>> (or lack thereof).  I have long since given up on building my own, and
>> simply am using what Ubuntu 8.04 LTS shipped with.  The module works fine
>> there and meets my needs.
>
> I would have thought you could reserve the words "flame war" for
> Chuck's post rather than mine...I didn't name the file...

The words are relative to the situation and not anyone's post in specific.


-- 


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 20 20:52:51 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 20:52:51 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 11:34 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
>  
> > Whichever ass-hat wrote that document isn't writing it for me:
> > 
> > Executive Summary
> > 18	-----------------
> > 19	You think you want a stable kernel interface, but you really do not, and
> > 20	you don't even know it.  What you want is a stable running driver, and
> > 21	you get that only if your driver is in the main kernel tree.  You also
> > 22	get lots of other good benefits if your driver is in the main kernel
> > 23	tree, all of which has made Linux into such a strong, stable, and mature
> > 24	operating system which is the reason you are using it in the first
> > 25	place.
> > 
> > Total horseshit.  And for the record, the main reason why so many people use Linux is because so many other people use Linux.  It's as simple as that.
> 
> Well, I'll just vaguely smile and pretend that you've said something
> meainingful, then drop the discussion... :-)

My point was

1. I do want a stable kernel interface, despite his implication that I
don't and I'm too stupid to know better.
2. I do not want a stable kernel interface because I want some stupid
driver to work.
3. I do not use Linux because it's a strong, stable and mature operating
system.  I use Linux because I'm forced to for various reasons under
various circumstances.  The reasons my clients force me to use Linux are
varied and often based on incomplete information and bad assumptions.

To simplify the unstable API problem as "I want my driver to work" is
really quite narrow, and the author is on shaky ground at best.  Some of
the reasons the author of the above "white paper" cites as justification
for an unstable API (e.g., alignment of structures caused by different
versions of the compiler) are absolutely ridiculous.  The fact that I
have to compile a kernel module against _exactly_ the kernel I am
running - thousands of compile-time options included - is ludicrous.
That Linux HAS thousands of compile-time options is similarly ludicrous.

Linux often gets the job done, but it doesn't mean it's not a big piece
of shit.  It simply has a lot of market share, which means it will
continue to have a lot of market share.  That's the way of things.  But
let's be honest and recognize that Linux gained all that initial
traction not on technical merit, but on "religious" fervor, the
rebellion against Microsoft, and the perception that Linux was "cool" by
a generation of kids who'd never seen anything but Windows.

Ugh, I have to stop here before I start bleeding out my orifices.

C.




From boisy at tee-boy.com  Mon Oct 20 22:17:01 2008
From: boisy at tee-boy.com (Boisy Pitre)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 21:17:01 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: 

This discussion highlights one of the reasons ToolShed was developed  
the way it was.  As a command-line, user state utility written in C,  
it could be easily ported from OS to OS.  FUSE puts ToolShed pretty  
much on par with a filesystem module like the RBF filesystem, so we  
have the best of both worlds.

I have been considering taking ToolShed into a new direction:  
rewriting it in Java.  Right now the pain of having to cross compile  
and juggle different versions for different platforms is a headache.   
Porting ToolShed to Java would eliminate this (though this would break  
FUSE support).  Perhaps just porting tools like rma/rlink to Java  
would be a start.  I have already started a from-scratch write of RMA  
in Java.

Regards,
Boisy G. Pitre
--
Tee-Boy
Email: boisy at tee-boy.com
Web: http://www.tee-boy.com

On Oct 20, 2008, at 7:52 PM, Chuck Youse wrote:

> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 11:34 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
>>
>>> Whichever ass-hat wrote that document isn't writing it for me:
>>>
>>> Executive Summary
>>> 18	-----------------
>>> 19	You think you want a stable kernel interface, but you really do  
>>> not, and
>>> 20	you don't even know it.  What you want is a stable running  
>>> driver, and
>>> 21	you get that only if your driver is in the main kernel tree.   
>>> You also
>>> 22	get lots of other good benefits if your driver is in the main  
>>> kernel
>>> 23	tree, all of which has made Linux into such a strong, stable,  
>>> and mature
>>> 24	operating system which is the reason you are using it in the  
>>> first
>>> 25	place.
>>>
>>> Total horseshit.  And for the record, the main reason why so many  
>>> people use Linux is because so many other people use Linux.  It's  
>>> as simple as that.
>>
>> Well, I'll just vaguely smile and pretend that you've said something
>> meainingful, then drop the discussion... :-)
>
> My point was
>
> 1. I do want a stable kernel interface, despite his implication that I
> don't and I'm too stupid to know better.
> 2. I do not want a stable kernel interface because I want some stupid
> driver to work.
> 3. I do not use Linux because it's a strong, stable and mature  
> operating
> system.  I use Linux because I'm forced to for various reasons under
> various circumstances.  The reasons my clients force me to use Linux  
> are
> varied and often based on incomplete information and bad assumptions.
>
> To simplify the unstable API problem as "I want my driver to work" is
> really quite narrow, and the author is on shaky ground at best.   
> Some of
> the reasons the author of the above "white paper" cites as  
> justification
> for an unstable API (e.g., alignment of structures caused by different
> versions of the compiler) are absolutely ridiculous.  The fact that I
> have to compile a kernel module against _exactly_ the kernel I am
> running - thousands of compile-time options included - is ludicrous.
> That Linux HAS thousands of compile-time options is similarly  
> ludicrous.
>
> Linux often gets the job done, but it doesn't mean it's not a big  
> piece
> of shit.  It simply has a lot of market share, which means it will
> continue to have a lot of market share.  That's the way of things.   
> But
> let's be honest and recognize that Linux gained all that initial
> traction not on technical merit, but on "religious" fervor, the
> rebellion against Microsoft, and the perception that Linux was  
> "cool" by
> a generation of kids who'd never seen anything but Windows.
>
> Ugh, I have to stop here before I start bleeding out my orifices.
>
> C.
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 20 22:54:36 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 22:54:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <200810201057.28750.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: 
	<16bae8870810200734q30818e59x4ea2dafad832ee95@mail.gmail.com>
	<200810201057.28750.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <200810202254.37025.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 20 October 2008, Gene Heskett wrote:
>On Monday 20 October 2008, Carlos Bragatto wrote:
>>On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Gene Heskett
>
>wrote:
>>> My, how time fly's when one is busy.  And I have been.  I spent the
>>> summer building an attached garage with little help, see
>>>
>>>  to see what has been occupying my
>>> time. :)
>>
>>Kudos!
>>
>>But Gene, couldn't you generate a web album using something like JAlbum? It
>>generates fantastic web albums, and if you have a Macintosh, you can use
>>Bananalbum, which is way cooler.
>>
>>Carlos
>
>All linux house here, and a quick search of yumex's offerings didn't find
>JAlbum.
>
>I have been playing some with Amaya, but that has a very steep learning
> curve. I just found I have bluefish installed & maybe I can cobble up
> something in it.  OTOH, a quick google search found it, & its dl'ing bow.
>
But JAlbum crashed early in the install, so I have NDI if it works or not.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
No one knows what he can do till he tries.
		-- Publilius Syrus


From fredprov5 at usfamily.net  Mon Oct 20 23:02:33 2008
From: fredprov5 at usfamily.net (Fred D. Provoncha)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 22:02:33 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Stuck in Paladin's Legacy Again
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <48FD464E.4030706@usfamily.net>

> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 09:52:42 -0500
> From: "Allan Chaney" 
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Stuck in Paladin's Legacy Again
> To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'" 
> Message-ID: <004401c932c3$81cdced0$85696c70$@com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Fred,
>
> No problem.  Yes the mines are tough without the Elven Torch because it gets
> darker the deeper you go.  (It's a nice touch of programming if I do say so
> myself.)  :) 
>
> Anyway, the Elven torch can be found by entering the mines on the other side
> of the mountains.  The Torch is in the second level after the very simple
> mazelike first level.  The Torch is in the first room you encounter on that
> second level in a black box guarded by two orcs.  There are some other
> chests as well.  To go deeper into the mines from this level you'll need to
> keep your eyes peeled for a secret passage.  Just look at the moss texture
> on the walls and if the moss looks different, just try walking through the
> wall.  One game quirk you will want to be very aware of is that there is
> only one save game.  And the mine levels refresh  with creatures and chests
> every time you enter them.  So if you are running around deep in the mines
> and very low on health and you save game.  That's it. That's where you are
> saved.  Given your health status, you may not be able to make it out of the
> mines because every mine lvl you enter in order to get out refreshes with
> creatures.  Just make sure you have some health potions (purchased at the
> cathedral) or better yet.  Save your game just before you enter the mines
> and then don't save again until you get out.  You don't want to get stuck
> down there and not be able to get out.
> It will also help once you find the Sorcerer's Eye.  This lets you see a
> bloweup map of all levels and maps.

Thanks for the help Allan. I had tried a while back to go down into that other mine on the other side of the mountains and I got my butt kicked down there by some nasty creatures. But it's been a while and I've bulked up my experience & HP since then so I ought to try again.

I'll look out for that secret passage. I'm glad you mentioned it, I never would have thought to look for one and I doubt I would have noticed it.

I did notice there was only one save game. I have been making a habit all along of saving the game BEFORE going down into the mines. I always assumed I couldn't save the game while down there, I didn't know you could.

I'll keep my eyes peeled for the Sorcerer's Eye (sorry, couldn't resist the pun). I haven't found it yet.

Thanks again for the help,

Fred Provoncha
Stansbury Park, UT




--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---



From tjseagrove at writeme.com  Mon Oct 20 23:26:30 2008
From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 23:26:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Sardis Technologies DMC "No-Halt" Floppy Controller
In-Reply-To: <179327.60222.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: 
	<179327.60222.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00da01c9332c$cf72bab0$6e583010$@com>

Good news here...I purchased one of those controllers from him in 1990.  I
also bought the schematics for it which I can put my hands on as I know
right where they are located.  If he is ok with it, I can prepare them and
send/upload wherever is needed.  An image of the driver disk would be really
good too.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Bill Barnes
Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2008 11:50 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Sardis Technologies DMC "No-Halt" Floppy Controller

Hey everyone,

I e-Mailed David Wiens of Sardis Technologies (email below) and there is a
chance he may release the DMC Controller info to the community. I dunno what
we as a community can do to encourage this, but this could be some good news
if he does so.

Sardis Technologies still has a website, as he is still in business working
with Microcontroller Software and Hardware Design.


-Later!
?-WB-???    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.



> From: David C. Wiens 
> Subject: Re: "no halt" DMC floppy disk controller
> To: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com
> Date: Sunday, October 19, 2008, 8:59 PM
> Hi Bill,
> 
> Thanks for your interest in the DMC floppy disk controller.
> 
> Yes, it was compatible with the CoCo 3 (and CoCo 2).  As a
> matter of 
> fact, I was inspired to design it when the CoCo 3 and OS-9
> Level II were 
> released.
> 
> No, unfortunately it is no longer available for sale, and
> hasn't been 
> for over 15 years.
> 
> Would I be willing to release the design to the CoCo
> community?  
> Probably.  But it might be several months before I have
> time to look for it.
> 
> Building one would require finding a 1773 floppy disk
> controller chip.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Dave Wiens
> Sardis Technologies
> 


__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

--
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Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
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Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1731 - Release Date: 10/18/2008
6:01 PM



From snhirsch at gmail.com  Tue Oct 21 07:48:34 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 07:48:34 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, Boisy Pitre wrote:

> I have been considering taking ToolShed into a new direction: rewriting it in 
> Java.  Right now the pain of having to cross compile and juggle different 
> versions for different platforms is a headache.  Porting ToolShed to Java 
> would eliminate this (though this would break FUSE support).  Perhaps just 
> porting tools like rma/rlink to Java would be a start.  I have already 
> started a from-scratch write of RMA in Java.

Oh, my god no...  Please do not do that.  My feelings about Java are even 
less benevolent than Chuck's are relative to Linux :-).  Seriously, at 
work (developing design-automation software) we refer to Java as "..write 
once, debug everywhere) due to the fact that our average box requires 
between 4 and 5 complete JVM installs to support all the "portable" 
applications that "just run anywhere".

There's the tool that only works on IBM Java 1.4, not Sun 1.4 mind you, 
just IBMs release.  There's another that requires an ancient 1.3 JVM and 
won't bloody run on anything newer.  And on, and on.

Then, there's the inevitable situation where, when the throughput of your 
workstation grinds down to a halt, you discover one of the Java binaries 
off in the background using 100% of the CPU doing Lord-Knows-What and 
requiring a SIGKILL to correct.  The threaded model always sounds good on 
paper, but it can be pathologically complex to assure correctness and 
avoid deadlocks and race conditions.

I've done a reasonably large amount of cross-platform coding in my day and 
find that with contemporary ANSI compliant compilers, C and C++ are at 
least as portable as Java applications if you stay away from questionable 
constructs.  More so, if you take into account that the language is not a 
moving target.

Even with GUI environments there are now reasonable cross-platform choices 
(Qt, anyone?).

If you cannot be disuaded from this move, would you at least ensure that 
the final CVS repository for the C based version is up-to-date with your 
sandbox and that it stays available?

Steve


-- 


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Tue Oct 21 08:48:15 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 08:48:15 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
Message-ID: <1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 07:48 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
> On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, Boisy Pitre wrote:

> The threaded model always sounds good on 
> paper, but it can be pathologically complex to assure correctness and 
> avoid deadlocks and race conditions.

Eh, mostly due to the fact that most programmers don't seem to grok that
threads are useful but should be used sparingly.  Seems, too, that some
newer synchronization schemes (e.g., serializing tokens) are completely
ignored.  We're still in a mutex/condition-variable world.

> I've done a reasonably large amount of cross-platform coding in my day and 
> find that with contemporary ANSI compliant compilers, C and C++ are at 
> least as portable as Java applications if you stay away from questionable 
> constructs.  More so, if you take into account that the language is not a 
> moving target.
> 

I have to agree on this one; I haven't actually done too much poking
under the hood with Toolshed and I am at a loss for where the system
dependencies might lie, aside from word order and word size (and those
are straightforward to cope with).  

Heh, I still think that C++ is a bit of a moving target.  The compiler
implementations are far more varied in my experience, requiring that one
keeps to a subset and allow for wide behavioral differences.  As such
I'm not a huge fan and would rather use Ada for very large, complex
systems.  (Hey, did I ever mention that I dated Bjarne's secretary's
niece for a few years?  Claim to fame!)

C.




From linville at tuxdriver.com  Tue Oct 21 09:05:12 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:05:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 08:48:15AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:

> Heh, I still think that C++ is a bit of a moving target.

ACK

> As such
> I'm not a huge fan and would rather use Ada for very large, complex
> systems.

Aha!  This explains soooooo much! :-) :-) :-)

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Tue Oct 21 09:15:27 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:15:27 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 21 Oct 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:

> On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 07:48 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:
>> On Mon, 20 Oct 2008, Boisy Pitre wrote:
>
>> The threaded model always sounds good on
>> paper, but it can be pathologically complex to assure correctness and
>> avoid deadlocks and race conditions.
>
> Eh, mostly due to the fact that most programmers don't seem to grok that
> threads are useful but should be used sparingly.  Seems, too, that some
> newer synchronization schemes (e.g., serializing tokens) are completely
> ignored.  We're still in a mutex/condition-variable world.

I didn't mean to suggest that threads should never be used, only that they 
are often (as you seem to agree) misused.

>> I've done a reasonably large amount of cross-platform coding in my day and
>> find that with contemporary ANSI compliant compilers, C and C++ are at
>> least as portable as Java applications if you stay away from questionable
>> constructs.  More so, if you take into account that the language is not a
>> moving target.
>>
>
> I have to agree on this one; I haven't actually done too much poking
> under the hood with Toolshed and I am at a loss for where the system
> dependencies might lie, aside from word order and word size (and those
> are straightforward to cope with).
>
> Heh, I still think that C++ is a bit of a moving target.  The compiler
> implementations are far more varied in my experience, requiring that one
> keeps to a subset and allow for wide behavioral differences.  As such
> I'm not a huge fan and would rather use Ada for very large, complex
> systems.  (Hey, did I ever mention that I dated Bjarne's secretary's
> niece for a few years?  Claim to fame!)

That was certainly true up until perhaps 4 or 5 years ago, but things are 
much, much better now.  I'm working on the development of an extremely 
complex EDA application that makes heavy use of templates. 
Traditionally, this was nightmarish when moving between platforms but 
we've had surprisingly few problems.  With the release of g++4, I'd have 
to say even the GNU compiler is marching to the same drummer as, e.g. xlC 
(IBM RISC compiler).

And, hey, if it had been up to me the world would have settled on Modula-2 
or one of its object-oriented successors (Modula-3 or Oberon).  As it 
turns out, it wasn't up to me :-).  They pay me well to work in C++, so I 
smile and go with the flow.

Sorry to pull this off-topic.  I'll hold my peace...


Steve


-- 


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Tue Oct 21 09:16:44 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:16:44 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>
References: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 21 Oct 2008, John W. Linville wrote:

> On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 08:48:15AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
>
>> Heh, I still think that C++ is a bit of a moving target.
>
> ACK
>
>> As such
>> I'm not a huge fan and would rather use Ada for very large, complex
>> systems.
>
> Aha!  This explains soooooo much! :-) :-) :-)

Heh.  In software we have Ada people and C people.  In hardware, it's VHDL 
vs. Verilog.  Same fight, different ring...

Steve


-- 


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Tue Oct 21 09:26:21 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:26:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>
	
Message-ID: <1224595581.24945.12.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 09:16 -0400, Steven Hirsch wrote:

> Heh.  In software we have Ada people and C people.  In hardware, it's VHDL 
> vs. Verilog.  Same fight, different ring...

*laughs* Interestingly enough, I prefer C and Verilog.  It's just when
you start talking about complex projects with generics etc that I start
jumping on the Ada bandwagon.  C++ has really awkwardly band-aided such
things on to C.  I understand that it works very well in the right
hands, it's just not exactly elegant.

C.




From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Tue Oct 21 09:30:00 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:30:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>
References: <1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021130512.GA17268@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <1224595800.24945.14.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 09:05 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:

> Aha!  This explains soooooo much! :-) :-) :-)

Doesn't it? :)

Oh, and to show you how much I stand by my principles, I'm currently
knee-deep in C#... I sold out faster than Metallica.

C.




From linville at tuxdriver.com  Tue Oct 21 09:38:27 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:38:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 08:52:51PM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-10-20 at 11:34 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:
> >  
> > > Whichever ass-hat wrote that document isn't writing it for me:
> > > 
> > > Executive Summary
> > > 18	-----------------
> > > 19	You think you want a stable kernel interface, but you really do not, and
> > > 20	you don't even know it.  What you want is a stable running driver, and
> > > 21	you get that only if your driver is in the main kernel tree.  You also
> > > 22	get lots of other good benefits if your driver is in the main kernel
> > > 23	tree, all of which has made Linux into such a strong, stable, and mature
> > > 24	operating system which is the reason you are using it in the first
> > > 25	place.
> > > 
> > > Total horseshit.  And for the record, the main reason why so many people use Linux is because so many other people use Linux.  It's as simple as that.
> > 
> > Well, I'll just vaguely smile and pretend that you've said something
> > meainingful, then drop the discussion... :-)
> 
> My point was
> 
> 1. I do want a stable kernel interface, despite his implication that I
> don't and I'm too stupid to know better.
> 2. I do not want a stable kernel interface because I want some stupid
> driver to work.
> 3. I do not use Linux because it's a strong, stable and mature operating
> system.  I use Linux because I'm forced to for various reasons under
> various circumstances.  The reasons my clients force me to use Linux are
> varied and often based on incomplete information and bad assumptions.
> 
> To simplify the unstable API problem as "I want my driver to work" is
> really quite narrow, and the author is on shaky ground at best.  Some of
> the reasons the author of the above "white paper" cites as justification
> for an unstable API (e.g., alignment of structures caused by different
> versions of the compiler) are absolutely ridiculous.  The fact that I
> have to compile a kernel module against _exactly_ the kernel I am
> running - thousands of compile-time options included - is ludicrous.
> That Linux HAS thousands of compile-time options is similarly ludicrous.
> 
> Linux often gets the job done, but it doesn't mean it's not a big piece
> of shit.  It simply has a lot of market share, which means it will
> continue to have a lot of market share.  That's the way of things.  But
> let's be honest and recognize that Linux gained all that initial
> traction not on technical merit, but on "religious" fervor, the
> rebellion against Microsoft, and the perception that Linux was "cool" by
> a generation of kids who'd never seen anything but Windows.
> 
> Ugh, I have to stop here before I start bleeding out my orifices.

Chuck,

I'm so glad you took the opportunity to have your say -- especially
with such well-reasoned and factual arguments!  You are right,
the Linux kernel developers should hobble themselves with technical
decisions that make you happy -- especially since you so clearly want
to be a part of their community!

I'm so sorry that the evil Linux empire has been tormenting you -- I
mean you practically can't even buy a computer without Linux preloaded
on it, and I can't remember the last time I saw Windows or Mac or
Solaris software for sale, not to mention phones running Symbian
or WinCE.  How does the world survive?  And those stupid clients
of yours, making decisions that you wouldn't make...how dare they?
It's as if they think they know something that you don't.

Well, keep the faith!  I'm sure someday all the religious zealots
will come around and put Windows back on top...until then, keep the
world safe for proprietary software!

John

P.S.  Now you've had your spew, and I've had my sarcastic retorts --
are we done?  I'm sure some are already going to claim that this
"flame war" is "out of control" and "tearing the community apart"
or whatever...
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Tue Oct 21 10:21:36 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:21:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
References: 
	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 09:38 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:

> Chuck,
> 
> I'm so glad you took the opportunity to have your say -- especially
> with such well-reasoned and factual arguments!  You are right,
> the Linux kernel developers should hobble themselves with technical
> decisions that make you happy -- especially since you so clearly want
> to be a part of their community!
> 
> I'm so sorry that the evil Linux empire has been tormenting you -- I
> mean you practically can't even buy a computer without Linux preloaded
> on it, and I can't remember the last time I saw Windows or Mac or
> Solaris software for sale, not to mention phones running Symbian
> or WinCE.  How does the world survive?  And those stupid clients
> of yours, making decisions that you wouldn't make...how dare they?
> It's as if they think they know something that you don't.
> 
> Well, keep the faith!  I'm sure someday all the religious zealots
> will come around and put Windows back on top...until then, keep the
> world safe for proprietary software!
> 
> John
> 
> P.S.  Now you've had your spew, and I've had my sarcastic retorts --
> are we done?  I'm sure some are already going to claim that this
> "flame war" is "out of control" and "tearing the community apart"
> or whatever...

Thanks for attacking me personally rather than addressing the issues.
(You must be a Republican.)

C.




From linville at tuxdriver.com  Tue Oct 21 10:57:13 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:57:13 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:21:36AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Tue, 2008-10-21 at 09:38 -0400, John W. Linville wrote:

> > P.S.  Now you've had your spew, and I've had my sarcastic retorts --
> > are we done?  I'm sure some are already going to claim that this
> > "flame war" is "out of control" and "tearing the community apart"
> > or whatever...
> 
> Thanks for attacking me personally rather than addressing the issues.
> (You must be a Republican.)

Wow, Chuck...wow.  For someone so quick to start throwing-around
insults, you seem pretty thin-skinned WRT sarcasm.

I'm sorry I couldn't "address the issues" like you did, with words like
"ass-hat", "horseshit", "ludicrous", "piece of shit", and "religious".
Yet, I fail to see how I attacked you personally.  Maybe I could have
addressed your apparent desire for a stable kernel API -- except that
you never elucidated on _why_ you want one, merely stating that you
_do_ want one.  Anyway, that discussion is a bit OT for the list --
which is why I tried to end this thread with a "vague smile" after
your original "horseshit" comments.

As for your commentary above relating to American politics, I "hope"
you can "change" the tone here and/or drop the thread completely.
As for me, I need to report back to my IRC meeting for all the
Republican Linux kernel developers...

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 21 13:59:39 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:59:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 64, Issue 28
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <549873.17060.qm@web31106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I'll send off an e-mail and ask, as that  may be all there is to the controller package.

-Later!  ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting.

> Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 23:26:30 -0400
> From: "Tom Seagrove"
> 
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Sardis Technologies DMC
> "No-Halt" Floppy
> 	Controller
> To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer
> Enthusiasts'" 
> Message-ID: <00da01c9332c$cf72bab0$6e583010$@com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Good news here...I purchased one of those controllers from
> him in 1990.  I
> also bought the schematics for it which I can put my hands
> on as I know
> right where they are located.  If he is ok with it, I can
> prepare them and
> send/upload wherever is needed.  An image of the driver
> disk would be really
> good too.
> 
> Tom
> 



      


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Oct 21 19:50:17 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:50:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Fwd: COCO materials]
Message-ID: <48FE6AB9.3070706@worldnet.att.net>

I received the attached message from Fr. Joseph Neiman, who not only has 
Coco hardware to give away or sell but also:
"Robert: Thanks for your reply. Any way you can help me spread the word, 
I would appreciate. I hesitate to throw out all this stuff. I have 
several years of Rainbow and Hot Coco magazines and a lot of stuff that 
other Coco users gave me in the past. If I can't find someone 
interested, it will all be tossed."

If anyone has an interest in what Fr. Joseph has, please send him e-mail 
and make him a reasonable offer.

"Fr. Joseph Neiman" 
-------------- next part --------------
An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: "Fr. Joseph Neiman" 
Subject: COCO materials
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:09:05 -0400
Size: 1717
Url: 

From johnguin at hotmail.com  Wed Oct 22 00:02:13 2008
From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 21:02:13 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Question for Diego
In-Reply-To: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>
References: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>
Message-ID: 

Say Diego,

I saw your TRS-80 "diploma" on the coco3 site at
http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1357

I've never seen or heard of this before.

Can you remember any details on what you had to do to earn this certificate?
No matter what, it looks like it was fun and you have a nice momento.

Thanks,
John Guin



From neilsmorr at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 01:29:02 2008
From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 22:29:02 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Question for Diego
References: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>
	
Message-ID: 

I have the English student manuals for that course.

I also taught Color Computer Camp once but have nothing from that one.

Neil


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John" 

> Say Diego,
>
> I saw your TRS-80 "diploma" on the coco3 site at
> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1357
>
> I've never seen or heard of this before.
>
> Can you remember any details on what you had to do to earn this 
> certificate?
> No matter what, it looks like it was fun and you have a nice momento.
>
> Thanks,
> John Guin



From neilsmorr at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 01:27:34 2008
From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 22:27:34 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
Message-ID: 


Note: Contact "Fr. Joseph Neiman"  NOT ME!

FWIW, some of the Mail Stop type places will pack and ship on your C/C if 
Fr. Neiman will drop it off there for you.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Fr. Joseph Neiman" 

> Greetings:
>
> I have a collection of COCO stuff: three computers, two monitors, disk 
> drives, multipak, game cartridges, and etc. I had intended to set up an 
> Ebay account and sell the items, but that is no longer an option.
>
> Instead of throwing the stuff away, I found your name through an Internet 
> website, that you are in Michigan, and wondered if you would like to pick 
> up my whole collection and sell or do what you would like with it.
>
> Please advise.
>
> Peace...
>
> Joseph
>
> Fr. Joseph Neiman
> 34462 First St
> Paw Paw, MI 49079
>
> jneiman at btc-bci.com



From flexser at fiu.edu  Wed Oct 22 04:17:24 2008
From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 04:17:24 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Question for Diego
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 21 Oct 2008, Neil Morrison wrote:

> I have the English student manuals for that course.
> 
> I also taught Color Computer Camp once but have nothing from that one.
> 
> Neil
> 

Aw, Neil, don't forget that fine collectible T-shirt you mentioned recently!

Art




From ken.schunk at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 07:24:14 2008
From: ken.schunk at gmail.com (Kenneth Schunk)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 07:24:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>



Ya know, I usually only lurk here, but it occurs to me that instead of
trading insults via this mailing list you could "take it outside" and
just flame each other using direct email addresses....


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Wed Oct 22 08:11:17 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 08:11:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Wed, 2008-10-22 at 07:24 -0400, Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> 
> 
> Ya know, I usually only lurk here, but it occurs to me that instead of
> trading insults via this mailing list you could "take it outside" and
> just flame each other using direct email addresses....
> 

It "occurred" to you?  But it didn't occur to you to send your thoughts
to us via direct email, did it?  The irony kills me.  If you don't want
to read what I (or anyone else) has to say, use your delete button, or
filters, or get off the list.  

I hope for your sake that McCain/Palin get elected.  Palin has made it
clear that her goals for her Vice Presidency involve wasting my tax
dollars on "special-needs" (read: retarded) children: sounds like you
could really use the help..

C.




From boisy at tee-boy.com  Wed Oct 22 08:25:39 2008
From: boisy at tee-boy.com (Boisy Pitre)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 07:25:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <984ACC1E-7E4B-4517-B44D-77591435844A@tee-boy.com>

Did someone drop you on your head when you were a baby, or beat you  
with a belt so many times that you carry this inane insensitivity with  
you constantly, berating anyone who gets in your path with your  
firebrand scorched-earth flaming?

I've had my share of controversial posts lately, but I've kept it on  
topic and above the belt.  This stuff is getting very low indeed.  You  
obviously cannot be polite, and I suspect you won't leave the list  
voluntarily; I would hope the moderator steps in and gives you the boot.


On Oct 22, 2008, at 7:11 AM, Chuck Youse wrote:

> On Wed, 2008-10-22 at 07:24 -0400, Kenneth Schunk wrote:
>> 
>>
>> Ya know, I usually only lurk here, but it occurs to me that instead  
>> of
>> trading insults via this mailing list you could "take it outside" and
>> just flame each other using direct email addresses....
>>
>
> It "occurred" to you?  But it didn't occur to you to send your  
> thoughts
> to us via direct email, did it?  The irony kills me.  If you don't  
> want
> to read what I (or anyone else) has to say, use your delete button, or
> filters, or get off the list.
>
> I hope for your sake that McCain/Palin get elected.  Palin has made it
> clear that her goals for her Vice Presidency involve wasting my tax
> dollars on "special-needs" (read: retarded) children: sounds like you
> could really use the help..
>
> C.
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

Regards,
Boisy G. Pitre
--
Tee-Boy
Email: boisy at tee-boy.com
Web: http://www.tee-boy.com



From diegoba at adinet.com.uy  Wed Oct 22 09:41:08 2008
From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 10:41:08 -0300
Subject: [Coco] Question for Diego
In-Reply-To: 
References: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>
	
Message-ID: <48FF2D74.1030301@adinet.com.uy>

Well, it's a bit of a long story.
The local Radio Shack was not an electronic store, was just a computer 
store.
In order to increase sales, they were giving lessons there. The first 
year, it was just LOGO. I remember that my teacher was a young, pretty 
systems ingeneer who was learning just fast enough to stay one step 
ahead of us, a bunch of kids 8 to 10 years old.
I became quite a good friend with everyone there (the place was more 
like a big office with a workshop than a store) and when the next year 
they added an introduction to BASIC to the LOGO class, I was invited to 
take it for free.
But the diploma came years latter, when I needed something to show with 
a resumee. I went, asked if they could give me some kind of certificate, 
and they managed to get this one out. (By that time I had never used a 
TRS-80 with "Level II Basic")
I really miss that place and the people.
All of them wearing suits but the tech guy, all very nice to me 'till 
the end...

Diego


John wrote:
> Say Diego,
>
> I saw your TRS-80 "diploma" on the coco3 site at
> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Gallery&g2_itemId=1357
>
> I've never seen or heard of this before.
>
> Can you remember any details on what you had to do to earn this certificate?
> No matter what, it looks like it was fun and you have a nice momento.
>
> Thanks,
> John Guin
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>    



From linville at tuxdriver.com  Wed Oct 22 09:21:54 2008
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 09:21:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081022132154.GC15808@tuxdriver.com>

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 07:24:14AM -0400, Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> 
> 
> Ya know, I usually only lurk here, but it occurs to me that instead of
> trading insults via this mailing list you could "take it outside" and
> just flame each other using direct email addresses....

Once again, I resent the implication that I'm "trading insults".
The worst I've sent Chuck's way is that he is "thin-skinned WRT
sarcasm", and I originally tried to end the thread with a "vague
smile".  How rude of me!

Yet you tar us with the same brush...unbelievable!

John
-- 
John W. Linville		Linux should be at the core
linville at tuxdriver.com			of your literate lifestyle.


From operator at coco3.com  Wed Oct 22 18:39:27 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 17:39:27 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Rainbow 2.0 compiles BCC program
Message-ID: <20081022224017.E8BD520A33@qs281.pair.com>

This may be good news to Rainbow DE users...

In the move towards supporting compilers and linkers (including those 
for CoCo development), I thought I would start with Borland's C++ system.

And... after pounding the keyboard for hours today, Rainbow IDE 2.0 
(in progress) has just compiled a working .exe program for Windows 
using Borland's BCC compiler.  The bcc.ini file Rainbow uses is set 
up in the Builders folder but the BCC compiler itself is where it's 
always been, in C:\dev\borland\bcc55.  Rainbow knows where the BIN 
files are, and since BCC.exe calls ILINK.exe, and my IDE has the PATH 
environment variable set to the Borland bins, it worked well.  The 
.obj and .exe are now sitting in \Projects\bcc as I hoped.  All local 
.h files are in my project folder where they should be, while stdlib 
stuff is in the Borland \includes and \lib folders.

Rainbow IDE is set up for the easiest CoCo development experience 
ever, but since it supports any assembly tools and can copy the 
objects onto virtual disk files, then mount ROMs or disks in 
M.E.S.S., the IDE is a multi-platform development suite, meaning I 
also have Vectrex developers using the IDE, Atari developers and others.

I just discovered that (with no surprise) developers are still 
cranking out Atari 2600 games, Intellivision games, and for other 
oldie systems just like, we the CoCo world, are doing for ourselves 
to keep this great thing alive for even longer.

Maybe, just maybe, eventually, Rainbow IDE users from the various 
vintage communities will be able to port some of the classic games to 
other systems.
For example, what about Raiders of the Lost Ark (Atari 2600) ported 
to the CoCo 3?  Why not?  Could there be C source code (or another 
compiler) available somewhere out there for those classic Atari 
games, and using tricks like Sock Master did with Kong, it would be 
possible with some work to do things like this.

And there's no better way to test the code right after you click the 
Go button than to see a pop-up Atari or CoCo window running the game 
(or not).  :)

If there's any feature requests from paid users, now is a good time 
to get some suggestions sent my way as I work madly to get Rainbow 
2.0 released before Xmas.

-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From ed.orbea at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 23:03:56 2008
From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 20:03:56 -0700
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
Message-ID: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com>

This question will probably have to be answered by Robert Gault as the 
guru of RGBDos, and I'm sorry if I seem to ramble, but....

I am running VCC 1.40 in a Windows XP, SP3 laptop.
VCC is configured as
6809 @ 1mhz speed with 512k of RAM
Multipak with: slot 1 empty, slot 2 empty, slot 3 FD-502, slot 4 Hard 
Drive + Cloud9 RTC
FD-502 if configured with no overclocking, RGBDos
FD-502 drive 0 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 1 (no 
Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
FD-502 drive 1 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 2 (with 
Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
FD-502 drive 2 is empty
FD-502 drive 3 is empty
HD Drive 0 is the Nitros09 VHD

I want to upgrade the current Nirtos-9 on the VHD from 3.2.6 to 3.2.8, 
so I:
saved boot as boot_vcc
saved emudsk as emudsk.dr
saved h0 as h0_emu.dd
saved d0 as d0_emu.dd
all from the default VHD boot disk (which does boot 3.2.6 with /h0 as /dd)
copied these files into the appropriate folders on nitros9 3.2.8 disk 2

Then I used copy -r to replace all the files in CMDS, NITROS9, SYS, DEFS 
on the VHD from the 3.2.8 release disk

Then I made a new mb script using boot_vcc
Then I made a revised standard.bl file usine the emudsk.dr, h0_emu.dd 
and dd_emu.dd, as well as d0_40dd.dd, d1_40dd.dd, d2_40dd.dd, cloud9 
cloud9 clock file, w1 to w3 and so on.
I them made sure that dmode for /d2 showed: dns=01, cyl=28, sid=02, anf 
formated it as a 40tkDSDD disk

Then I executed my modified mb to create a new 3.2.8 boot disk, and 
populated it

I am able to boot Nitros-9 from this disk, and /dd is indeed /h0, so... 
So Far So Good
Then I tried to backup 0 to 254 which is the boot floppy on the VHD
But, when I run link.bas fron drive 254 (the tools disk) it fails, so I 
thought that if I formatted a 35thSSSD floppy and made it a boot disk, I 
could execute the backup and subsequent link command, so could 
"basically" boot without any floppy drive

So I created a new blank 35tk, SSSD from the VCC menu (as a dmk type of 
file, just like above, but as a 35tkSSSD disk)
After booting the release disks I used dmode to change /d2 to cyl=23, 
sid=01
Them I used the modified mb script to create a new boot disk and 
'sparcely' populated it.
When I insert this disk in /d0 and boot, it displays 6 "." showing it 
has read 6 sectore of LNSO and then hangs.
It does not matter if I have the system configured to use a HD 
controller or not, nor does it matter if I have selected Disk Basic or 
RGBDos, but when I replace it with any other "boor disk" then the boot 
completes successfully

I have done an ident -s to compare the os9boot file on the 35tkSSSD disk 
against the 40tkDSDD, and they exactly match.
The CMDS dir on the 35tkSSSD disk contains: shell, grfdrv, utilpak1, 
wcreate, swread and dmode
The root directory on the 35tkSSSD disk contains OS9boot, sysgo and the 
CMDS directory
Dcheck doesn't show any problems with the 35tkSSSD disk.

So what did I miss, what do I need to check?

Thanks

Ed Orbea





From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Oct 22 23:20:19 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 23:20:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
In-Reply-To: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com>
References: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810222320.20005.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 22 October 2008, Ed Orbea wrote:
>This question will probably have to be answered by Robert Gault as the
>guru of RGBDos, and I'm sorry if I seem to ramble, but....
>
>I am running VCC 1.40 in a Windows XP, SP3 laptop.
>VCC is configured as
>6809 @ 1mhz speed with 512k of RAM
>Multipak with: slot 1 empty, slot 2 empty, slot 3 FD-502, slot 4 Hard
>Drive + Cloud9 RTC
>FD-502 if configured with no overclocking, RGBDos
>FD-502 drive 0 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 1 (no
>Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
>FD-502 drive 1 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 2 (with
>Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
>FD-502 drive 2 is empty
>FD-502 drive 3 is empty
>HD Drive 0 is the Nitros09 VHD
>
>I want to upgrade the current Nirtos-9 on the VHD from 3.2.6 to 3.2.8,
>so I:
>saved boot as boot_vcc
>saved emudsk as emudsk.dr
>saved h0 as h0_emu.dd
>saved d0 as d0_emu.dd
>all from the default VHD boot disk (which does boot 3.2.6 with /h0 as /dd)
>copied these files into the appropriate folders on nitros9 3.2.8 disk 2
>
>Then I used copy -r to replace all the files in CMDS, NITROS9, SYS, DEFS
>on the VHD from the 3.2.8 release disk
>
>Then I made a new mb script using boot_vcc
>Then I made a revised standard.bl file usine the emudsk.dr, h0_emu.dd
>and dd_emu.dd, as well as d0_40dd.dd, d1_40dd.dd, d2_40dd.dd, cloud9
>cloud9 clock file, w1 to w3 and so on.
>I them made sure that dmode for /d2 showed: dns=01, cyl=28, sid=02, anf
>formated it as a 40tkDSDD disk
>
>Then I executed my modified mb to create a new 3.2.8 boot disk, and
>populated it
>
>I am able to boot Nitros-9 from this disk, and /dd is indeed /h0, so...
>So Far So Good
>Then I tried to backup 0 to 254 which is the boot floppy on the VHD
>But, when I run link.bas fron drive 254 (the tools disk) it fails, so I
>thought that if I formatted a 35thSSSD floppy and made it a boot disk, I
>could execute the backup and subsequent link command, so could
>"basically" boot without any floppy drive
>
>So I created a new blank 35tk, SSSD from the VCC menu (as a dmk type of
>file, just like above, but as a 35tkSSSD disk)
>After booting the release disks I used dmode to change /d2 to cyl=23,
>sid=01
>Them I used the modified mb script to create a new boot disk and
>'sparcely' populated it.
>When I insert this disk in /d0 and boot, it displays 6 "." showing it
>has read 6 sectore of LNSO and then hangs.
>It does not matter if I have the system configured to use a HD
>controller or not, nor does it matter if I have selected Disk Basic or
>RGBDos, but when I replace it with any other "boor disk" then the boot
>completes successfully
>
>I have done an ident -s to compare the os9boot file on the 35tkSSSD disk
>against the 40tkDSDD, and they exactly match.
>The CMDS dir on the 35tkSSSD disk contains: shell, grfdrv, utilpak1,
>wcreate, swread and dmode
>The root directory on the 35tkSSSD disk contains OS9boot, sysgo and the
>CMDS directory
>Dcheck doesn't show any problems with the 35tkSSSD disk.
>
>So what did I miss, what do I need to check?

Thanks for enough clues.  We don't normally get that with the first 
message. :)

You missed the boot track, normally on track 34, the last track of a 35 track 
floppy since the tracks are numbered from zero.  This does not have a 
directory entry, and if its bits are allocated in the FAT because it is 
installed, then dcheck should have fussed about those 18 sectors as being in 
the allocation map (FAT) but not in the directory structure.  And you said it 
was clean.  Too clean in this case.

The modules 'boot', 'rel' and os9p1/krnp1 reside in this hidden track.

Inspect carefully, the mb script in a text editor, IIRC there was a typu in my 
copy that would cause the boot track install to fail, silently.  A stray ` 
character IIRC.

>Thanks
>
>Ed Orbea
>
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
"...Deep Hack Mode--that mysterious and frightening state of
consciousness where Mortal Users fear to tread."
(By Matt Welsh)


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Oct 23 00:01:10 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 00:01:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
In-Reply-To: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com>
References: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48FFF706.7010103@worldnet.att.net>

Ed, that is an amazing description and I applaud you. This is what makes 
troubleshooting easy.

Ed Orbea wrote:
> This question will probably have to be answered by Robert Gault as the 
> guru of RGBDos, and I'm sorry if I seem to ramble, but....
> 
> I am running VCC 1.40 in a Windows XP, SP3 laptop.
> VCC is configured as
> 6809 @ 1mhz speed with 512k of RAM
> Multipak with: slot 1 empty, slot 2 empty, slot 3 FD-502, slot 4 Hard 
> Drive + Cloud9 RTC

I would suggest slot 4 FD-502 with RGBDOS and slot 3 with Hard Drive & 
clock. May not make any difference but it would be more typical with 
slot 4 selected for MPI start.

> FD-502 if configured with no overclocking, RGBDos
> FD-502 drive 0 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 1 (no 
> Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
> FD-502 drive 1 is Nitros9 40tkdsdd, ver 030208, 6809, disk 2 (with 
> Nitros9, Bootlist, scripts directory)
> FD-502 drive 2 is empty
> FD-502 drive 3 is empty
> HD Drive 0 is the Nitros09 VHD
> 
> I want to upgrade the current Nirtos-9 on the VHD from 3.2.6 to 3.2.8, 
> so I:
> saved boot as boot_vcc
> saved emudsk as emudsk.dr
> saved h0 as h0_emu.dd
> saved d0 as d0_emu.dd
No, that would be wrong. D0, D1, D2, and D3 are all floppy descriptors 
and work with the FD-502.

> all from the default VHD boot disk (which does boot 3.2.6 with /h0 as /dd)
> copied these files into the appropriate folders on nitros9 3.2.8 disk 2
Kind of depends what you mean by copy. If you booted NitrOS-9 from the 
hard drive and saved that boot module, that's correct.
You can't save h0 as dd because the name would be wrong. Check to see 
what dd points to when you boot from the VHD. If it is the hard drive, 
then just save dd. If it points to the FD-502, then save h0 put rename 
it and verify it with dEd.

> 
> Then I used copy -r to replace all the files in CMDS, NITROS9, SYS, DEFS 
> on the VHD from the 3.2.8 release disk
Probably OK and certainly needs to be done. However, it would be safer 
to make a copy of the .vhd image, do the copying on that, keeping the 
original .vhd as a backup.

> 
> Then I made a new mb script using boot_vcc
> Then I made a revised standard.bl file usine the emudsk.dr, h0_emu.dd 
> and dd_emu.dd, as well as d0_40dd.dd, d1_40dd.dd, d2_40dd.dd, cloud9 
> cloud9 clock file, w1 to w3 and so on.
> I them made sure that dmode for /d2 showed: dns=01, cyl=28, sid=02, anf 
> formated it as a 40tkDSDD disk
Some problems here. You need to create a boot disk that can be backed up 
to the .vhd image. That means the disk must be a 35 track single sided 
image, so dsn=1 cyl=23 sid=1.

> 
> Then I executed my modified mb to create a new 3.2.8 boot disk, and 
> populated it
> 
> I am able to boot Nitros-9 from this disk, and /dd is indeed /h0, so... 
> So Far So Good
> Then I tried to backup 0 to 254 which is the boot floppy on the VHD
But as indicated above, this can't work because under RGBDOS or HDBDOS 
the drives on the hard drive must be single sided 35 track drives.

> But, when I run link.bas fron drive 254 (the tools disk) it fails, so I 
> thought that if I formatted a 35thSSSD floppy and made it a boot disk, I 
> could execute the backup and subsequent link command, so could 
> "basically" boot without any floppy drive
Yes!

> 
> So I created a new blank 35tk, SSSD from the VCC menu (as a dmk type of 
> file, just like above, but as a 35tkSSSD disk)
Nope, this might have worked but create a dsk(jvc) image not dmk.

> After booting the release disks I used dmode to change /d2 to cyl=23, 
> sid=01
> Them I used the modified mb script to create a new boot disk and 
> 'sparcely' populated it.
Guess it depends what 'sparcely' means to you. The disk needs the kernel 
on track 34 and the os9boot file, nothing else is required.

> When I insert this disk in /d0 and boot, it displays 6 "." showing it 
> has read 6 sectore of LNSO and then hangs.
Not quite right. The dots are the number of sectors read from os9boot. 
However, it should not have gotten this far if Boot really was the .vhd 
boot rather than the floppy boot.
The most you should have been able to get was to load into memory track 
34. As soon as Boot starts running there should have been a failure.

> It does not matter if I have the system configured to use a HD 
> controller or not, nor does it matter if I have selected Disk Basic or 
> RGBDos, but when I replace it with any other "boor disk" then the boot 
> completes successfully
> 
> I have done an ident -s to compare the os9boot file on the 35tkSSSD disk 
> against the 40tkDSDD, and they exactly match.
That's good if the correct modules were on these disks. If not correct, 
they are the same but the wrong ones.

> The CMDS dir on the 35tkSSSD disk contains: shell, grfdrv, utilpak1, 
> wcreate, swread and dmode
> The root directory on the 35tkSSSD disk contains OS9boot, sysgo and the 
> CMDS directory
> Dcheck doesn't show any problems with the 35tkSSSD disk.
You don't need any directories or sysgo unless you plan to boot from the 
disk as a floppy. Booting from the .vhd image needs just track 34 and 
the os9boot file.

> 
> So what did I miss, what do I need to check?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Ed Orbea
> 

Compare the ident of boot used to make the new kernel with the ident of 
boot when booting from the .vhd image. They need to be the same.
Make sure that the os9boot file indeed contains the emu driver, h0 and 
dd_h0.
You also want to save init from the vhd boot and get that into the new 
os9boot file.

Try the above and if you still have problems, send me the new boot disk 
so I can see what you've done and test it.


From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 23 09:03:30 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 06:03:30 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] 1986 Magazine Archive
Message-ID: <623496.47947.qm@web30202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I have the 1986 Magazine Archive up (This is a complete year with all 12 issues). To get the download links visit the coco3.com forum here: 
http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3458#3458

1987 and 1988 complete years will also be up soon. Also some scanned newsletters and other goodies will be up fairly soon as well.

Enjoy!





** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 


      


From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Thu Oct 23 22:54:03 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 21:54:03 -0500
Subject: [Coco]  This tickles me....
Message-ID: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>

 I'm amused at what sometimes happens here on the Coco list.

 When we begin talking about topics not directly related to COCOS this list 
sometimes develops some differences of opinions and escelates into some sour 
notes being exchanged.
  It is normal for folks to have disagreements on topics. However, this 
shouldn't happen on this Coco list because, most always, the topics aren't 
even Coco topics.

 I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep the 
subjects in line with the directive of this list group.

 It's difficult to argue about how we go about working with a Coco. All the 
arguments have been discussed for many years and are finally settled.

 Linux, Microsoft, Apple, IBM, Ford and Chevy and the weather have nothing 
to do with this list. Not even politics and the economy have anything to do 
with this list.

 What tickles me is when someone says "Shut UP, already!" yhen, suddenly 
there is almost no traffic at all. This implies that there is too much 
traffic on OFF TOPIC discussions on the Coco listgroup..

 Personally, I wasn't even following the last topic that resulted in sour 
notes until just out of curiosity, I opened one of the last messages in that 
discussion to find that folks were exchanging very clever blows at each 
other. It's sad but, I was impressed how the verbiage was well designed.

 Perhaps we could improve this listgroup if we worked dilligently at trying 
to keep it directly related to a Coco.

 I betcha that whatever off topic discussion we get into has a listgroup on 
that topic somewhere else, having the same debate.

 I would think it wouldn't be too difficult to find that listgroup, join up 
and carry on there.

 Whucha say? Can we work on this?


George

 



From briang0671 at sbcglobal.net  Fri Oct 24 00:29:20 2008
From: briang0671 at sbcglobal.net (Brian Goers)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 23:29:20 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video at the CoCoFest!
Message-ID: <49014F20.1080005@sbcglobal.net>

To all
I don't remember who brought up the subject or if anyone replied to the 
person.
They asked about streaming a video at the fest. Well I for one don't 
have the equipment or the knowledge on how to do this.
I don't recall anyone at the Glenside meeting say they know how to do it 
either.
So. If someone wants to set up a video of the Fest and/or seminars, you 
are welcome to do it.
I'll try to be involved enough to keep it running, but you will need to 
set up a small group to do it your selves.
Can we put it on a servo so the viewer can move it around?
Email me and we will discuss it.
Brian

-- 
Brian Goers
Glenside Vice-President of Special Events
IDE Boards are available.

The 18th Annual ?LAST? Chicago CoCoFEST!
Will be held March 28 & 29 2009
Holiday Inn & Suites Elgin.



From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 01:14:26 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 00:14:26 -0500
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me.... Update!.. It ain't so bad...
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <015a01c93597$63736310$d4b1b1d8@house>

 If you haven't read my previous post, please read the quoted part first.
-------------

 I took the little time it takes to figure this...

 I  checked the count at  this month's messages at 346. Then I deleted all 
the BS that was NOT coco related and the result was 258 messages.

 That's only 88 messages! ( My decision on that). I'm probably not exactly 
in-tune with everyone on that. I did delete all messages that I was involved 
wiith, just to be sure I had no bias in this simple test.

 I suppose this isn't as bad as it appeared at first, because the related 
massages aren't as loud as the BS... if you choose to read the BS.

 I don't, usually. However, 88 BS messages out of 346 results in about one 
in four messages that we could do without.

 It ain't so bad.

George


> I'm amused at what sometimes happens here on the Coco list.
>
> When we begin talking about topics not directly related to COCOS this list 
> sometimes develops some differences of opinions and escelates into some 
> sour notes being exchanged.
>  It is normal for folks to have disagreements on topics. However, this 
> shouldn't happen on this Coco list because, most always, the topics aren't 
> even Coco topics.
>
> I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep the 
> subjects in line with the directive of this list group.
>
> It's difficult to argue about how we go about working with a Coco. All the 
> arguments have been discussed for many years and are finally settled.
>
> Linux, Microsoft, Apple, IBM, Ford and Chevy and the weather have nothing 
> to do with this list. Not even politics and the economy have anything to 
> do with this list.
>
> What tickles me is when someone says "Shut UP, already!" yhen, suddenly 
> there is almost no traffic at all. This implies that there is too much 
> traffic on OFF TOPIC discussions on the Coco listgroup..
>
> Personally, I wasn't even following the last topic that resulted in sour 
> notes until just out of curiosity, I opened one of the last messages in 
> that discussion to find that folks were exchanging very clever blows at 
> each other. It's sad but, I was impressed how the verbiage was well 
> designed.
>
> Perhaps we could improve this listgroup if we worked dilligently at trying 
> to keep it directly related to a Coco.
>
> I betcha that whatever off topic discussion we get into has a listgroup on 
> that topic somewhere else, having the same debate.
>
> I would think it wouldn't be too difficult to find that listgroup, join up 
> and carry on there.
>
> Whucha say? Can we work on this?
>
>
> George
>



From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 24 09:02:11 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 06:02:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <786667.78703.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

There will always be off topic discussions on here and messages that start on topic then drift far off topic. I for one do not want to control what gets said here. I think it how it works now is pretty good. When a message goes far off topic the community here regulates itself and when things go to far there is an outcry that tends to hush things up. I for one do not feel the need to control each and every conversation here, one because it's really not possible and two I am just that in need of controlling every situation around me. Let people be themselves without the attempt to regulate.




** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 

--- On Thu, 10/23/08, George Ramsower  wrote:
From: George Ramsower 
Subject: [Coco]  This tickles me....
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Date: Thursday, October 23, 2008, 7:54 PM

 I'm amused at what sometimes happens here on the Coco list.

 When we begin talking about topics not directly related to COCOS this list 
sometimes develops some differences of opinions and escelates into some sour 
notes being exchanged.
  It is normal for folks to have disagreements on topics. However, this 
shouldn't happen on this Coco list because, most always, the topics
aren't 
even Coco topics.

 I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep
the 
subjects in line with the directive of this list group.

 It's difficult to argue about how we go about working with a Coco. All the

arguments have been discussed for many years and are finally settled.

 Linux, Microsoft, Apple, IBM, Ford and Chevy and the weather have nothing 
to do with this list. Not even politics and the economy have anything to do 
with this list.

 What tickles me is when someone says "Shut UP, already!" yhen,
suddenly 
there is almost no traffic at all. This implies that there is too much 
traffic on OFF TOPIC discussions on the Coco listgroup..

 Personally, I wasn't even following the last topic that resulted in sour 
notes until just out of curiosity, I opened one of the last messages in that 
discussion to find that folks were exchanging very clever blows at each 
other. It's sad but, I was impressed how the verbiage was well designed.

 Perhaps we could improve this listgroup if we worked dilligently at trying 
to keep it directly related to a Coco.

 I betcha that whatever off topic discussion we get into has a listgroup on 
that topic somewhere else, having the same debate.

 I would think it wouldn't be too difficult to find that listgroup, join up

and carry on there.

 Whucha say? Can we work on this?


George

 


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



      


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 24 15:03:08 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:03:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist:  Rainbows & other CoCo stuff
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <982556.63619.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Im trying to find out for myself if this is a lot deal or being sold by piece.



http://stlouis.craigslist.org/bks/886718145.html


-Later!  ?-WB-??? -- BABIC Computer Consulting.




      


From badfrog at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 15:06:07 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:06:07 -0500
Subject: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist: Rainbows & other CoCo stuf
In-Reply-To: <982556.63619.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: 
	<982556.63619.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810241206m4f2b5d8dm655ad714acb3747f@mail.gmail.com>

I sent that guy an e-mail Monday and never heard back.

On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 2:03 PM, Bill Barnes  wrote:
> Im trying to find out for myself if this is a lot deal or being sold by piece.
>
> 
>
> http://stlouis.craigslist.org/bks/886718145.html
>
>
> -Later!   -WB-    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 24 17:39:32 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:39:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
In-Reply-To: <48FFF706.7010103@worldnet.att.net>
References: <48FFE99C.4020701@gmail.com> <48FFF706.7010103@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <49024094.1010901@worldnet.att.net>

Ed,
You mention counting .... during the boot. I should have spotted this as 
a problem. The normal rb1773 boot includes the . routine but the hard 
drive emu boot does not.

Most likely, you have the wrong boot module.


From tjseagrove at writeme.com  Fri Oct 24 18:10:16 2008
From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:10:16 -0400
Subject: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist: Rainbows & other CoCo stuf
In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810241206m4f2b5d8dm655ad714acb3747f@mail.gmail.com>
References: 	<982556.63619.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9efa17da0810241206m4f2b5d8dm655ad714acb3747f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004801c93625$4bca2a80$e35e7f80$@com>

I have the xls with all the details.  Email me privately and I will send it
back to you.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Sean
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 3:06 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist: Rainbows & other CoCo stuf

I sent that guy an e-mail Monday and never heard back.

On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 2:03 PM, Bill Barnes 
wrote:
> Im trying to find out for myself if this is a lot deal or being sold by
piece.
>
> 
>
> http://stlouis.craigslist.org/bks/886718145.html
>
>
> -Later!   -WB-    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.2/1742 - Release Date: 10/24/2008
8:33 AM



From badfrog at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 18:13:56 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:13:56 -0500
Subject: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist: Rainbows & other CoCo stuf
In-Reply-To: <004801c93625$4bca2a80$e35e7f80$@com>
References: 
	<982556.63619.qm@web31102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9efa17da0810241206m4f2b5d8dm655ad714acb3747f@mail.gmail.com>
	<004801c93625$4bca2a80$e35e7f80$@com>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810241513q122b8704i3777e5b5b53662f8@mail.gmail.com>

He just got back to me.  Has alot of stuff!  I sent him the link to
this list to help him out.

On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 5:10 PM, Tom Seagrove  wrote:
> I have the xls with all the details.  Email me privately and I will send it
> back to you.
>
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> Behalf Of Sean
> Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 3:06 PM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> Subject: Re: [Coco] St. Louis Craigslist: Rainbows & other CoCo stuf
>
> I sent that guy an e-mail Monday and never heard back.
>
> On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 2:03 PM, Bill Barnes 
> wrote:
>> Im trying to find out for myself if this is a lot deal or being sold by
> piece.
>>
>>  href="http://stlouis.craigslist.org/bks/886718145.html"http://stlouis.craigs
> list.org/bks/886718145.html
>>
>> http://stlouis.craigslist.org/bks/886718145.html
>>
>>
>> -Later!   -WB-    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.2/1742 - Release Date: 10/24/2008
> 8:33 AM
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Fri Oct 24 20:53:29 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 20:53:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: <1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 21:54 -0500, George Ramsower wrote:

>  I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep the 
> subjects in line with the directive of this list group.
> 

Actually, when I do bring up things that are on-topic - usually me
asking detailed questions about NitrOS-9 - they're more often than not
ignored.  I don't know if it's because no one knows the answers, or if
those in the know don't care to respond.  I'm still waiting for any
insight as to why V.PAGE isn't used in the Coco version of OS-9, and if
anyone thinks it's unwise to appropriate it for Multi-Pak slot
information.  Funny how Boisy, King of NitrOS-9 Hill, only seems to pipe
up to turn on that Cajun charm and call for my ejection from the list
(Jesus would have done the same, I'm sure), or defend one of his
wares.  

I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just
seems that the Coco has become a gigantic waste of space and time, and
the remnants of the Coco community just aren't all that dynamic any
more.  There remains much interesting work that can be done with our
8-bit buddy, especially on the NitrOS-9 side in terms of consolidation,
clean-up, and even "Coco 4" type development, just for pure hack value.
But sadly there is only a very small audience for such things.  The
greatest base seems to be people playing games in emulators, which is
unfortunate.

Anyway, Hail Satan, kill the babies, get your gay on, etc. etc.
C.





From ed.orbea at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 22:03:59 2008
From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 19:03:59 -0700
Subject: [Coco]  VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
References: 48FFF706.7010103@worldnet.att.net
Message-ID: <49027E8F.7090803@gmail.com>

Here are dumps of my current /h0 and /dd modules. These should properly 
use EmuDsk.dr to make a 35tksssd boot disk that can be copied and linked 
to vhd to untilately "boot without a floppy in VCC"

/dd:

Address   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
-------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF  .M./.!q.K.#.&...
00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003  ........Z at ..@. at .
00000020 2044 C452 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BC24 3E     DDRBFEmuDsk<$>


/h0


Address   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
-------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF  .M./.!q.K.#.&...
00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003  ........Z at ..@. at .
00000020 2048 B052 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BFE6 96     H0RBFEmuDsk?f.






From ed.orbea at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 22:07:42 2008
From: ed.orbea at gmail.com (Ed Orbea)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 19:07:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco]  VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
Message-ID: <49027F6E.2070202@gmail.com>

Thanks for the information, I am currently working thought the items you 
identified.
There are a few things I do need to correct.
(1) I said that I "saved d0 as d0_emu.dd", what I meant to say was that 
I saved dd and dd_emu.dd.
(2) I am working from a copy of vhd, not the original

Here is a dump of /h0:

Address   0  1 2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F 0 2 4 6 8 A C E
-------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----------------
00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF .M,/.!q.K.#.&...
00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003 ........Z at ..@. at .
00000020 2048 B052 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BFE6 96    H0RBFEmuDsk?F.

Here is the ident from the 40tkdsdd 3.8.6 floppy that boots to VHD. This 
is the 40tkdsdd boot I made to "test" things. WHen I try to make a 
35tksdss version of the disk (dmode: cyl=23 sid-1 dns=1), it formats and 
is created successfully, but then I try to boot from it (doesn't matter 
if these is a vhd or not, nor does it matter if I am using RGBDOS or 
not), it fails during boot, right after the 6th "." is displayed as part 
of the boot process. It is my understanding that each "." signifies the 
successful read of a LSNO sector.

  18 $C0 $A08C87 . KrnP2
  13 $C1 $310A4A . IOMan
   1 $C0 $3F9827 . Init
  37 $D1 $09EDE5 . RBF
   1 $E1 $85815B . EmuDsk
  82 $F1 $BFE696 . H0
   1 $E1 $2F617B . rb1773
  82 $F1 $37B271 . DD
  82 $F1 $37A8D9 . D0
  82 $F1 $B3CBA2 . D1
  82 $F1 $BF6E4C . D2
  16 $D1 $3F50A2 . SCF
   2 $E1 $CD4489 . VTIO
   4 $C1 $CF4A25 . KeyDrv
   3 $C1 $918510 . SndDrv
   7 $C1 $A4C5CC . JoyDrv
   2 $C1 $C3E661 . CoWin
  83 $F1 $012B5D . Term
  83 $F1 $3B6153 . W
  83 $F1 $A9B825 . W1
  83 $F1 $6A4A21 . W2
  83 $F1 $4820E4 . W3
   5 $D1 $6F9717 . PipeMan
   2 $E1 $895C5F . Piper
  80 $F1 $D512FB . Pipe
   9 $C1 $A9E4A4 . Clock
   1 $21 $484309 . Clock2

So if I understand correctly, I do not need rb1773.dr in the boot file.







From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 22:47:52 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 21:47:52 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Chuck Never give up on a Coco .. was >This tickles me....
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <000c01c9364c$13ea33e0$d4b1b1d8@house>

From: "Chuck Youse"

> Actually, when I do bring up things that are on-topic - usually me
> asking detailed questions about NitrOS-9 - they're more often than not
> ignored.  I don't know if it's because no one knows the answers, or if
> those in the know don't care to respond.  I'm still waiting for any
> insight as to why V.PAGE isn't used in the Coco version of OS-9, and if
> anyone thinks it's unwise to appropriate it for Multi-Pak slot 
> information.

  I've learned that danged near all of the time, there will be a response to 
a query on a coco question. Sometimes, the reply will be something that 
won't help because(in my case) I neglected to tell that I already tried 
that. DOH! on my part. I'm bad about that and also not giving enough 
information on the problem.

>   Funny how Boisy, King of NitrOS-9 Hill, only seems to pipe
> up to turn on that Cajun charm and call for my ejection from the list
> (Jesus would have done the same, I'm sure), or defend one of his
> wares.

 I think this may have happened when you first joined the list and haven't 
had a chance to be established here. Newbies are almost always scrutinized 
when they start out  as if  they know what they are talking about. We've had 
problems with folks stepping in and acting like they can show everyone how 
things should be done when in fact, they are actually blow hards.
 I think you are doing well here and have shown you are a benefit to the 
list. Keep it up!

 Ask your question again and perhaps direct the subject line to include your 
targeted person. Get their attention!

>
> I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).

 I missed the point on that one. How does Richard beat Chuck?

> I've
> got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just
> seems that the Coco has become a gigantic waste of space and time, and
> the remnants of the Coco community just aren't all that dynamic any
> more.  There remains much interesting work that can be done with our
> 8-bit buddy, especially on the NitrOS-9 side in terms of consolidation,
> clean-up, and even "Coco 4" type development, just for pure hack value.
> But sadly there is only a very small audience for such things.  The
> greatest base seems to be people playing games in emulators, which is
> unfortunate.

  It seems that most of the software development I see here are applications 
for developing software. Most run on PCs and little is actually developed 
for a Coco.
  I think if someone were to develop hardware and/or software that would 
enable a coco to easily interface to devices that are readily available for 
PCs could initiate some new interests. Things such as a way to use a coco to 
operate X10 controllers and have inputs to monitor things such as 
temperature, rain, noises, switches on doors, windows, pressure switches in 
door mats...etc.
.
 Build a coco system that can "Bill Gates" your house. This doesn't require 
much computing power but would make things fun again for a coco user.

 I'll post another message to attract attention to this subject.

---------

 The existing and new hardware stuff is exciting. Before the end of the 
month, I plan to get a few things such as the RGB converter box to enable me 
to use a newer monitor on my coco.
 Another is the PC keyboard adapter.
 I wish someone would build a stand alone adapter to use a memory stick... 
uh... CF? or whatever. The only one available now requires an IDE hard drive 
interface to use it.
 The computer I want to use this device on is floppy only. Doesn't need a 
hard disk. It would be nice to eliminate the floppy drive on that coco. The 
other computer that could use the memory stick does have a hard drive, but 
it's SCSI. The memory stick would be a convenient way to build the boot disk 
(on the computer with the hard drive) to use on the other, as I am now doing 
with 3.5 floppies. I suppose the MESS emulator on this PC could substitute 
for the Coco with the hard drive. Memory stick adapters are plentiful for 
PCs.

 I'm probably the only person here that would buy one. Therefore, it 
wouldn't be economically feasible to begin production on something like this 
just for ME!
 I might could build an adapter, but I don't how to write the ML code and 
make an EPROM to use it as a mass storage device such as a floppy drive. The 
EPROM would enable me to boot to OS9 and then there is the driver for OS9 to 
use it. Beyond my ability there.
 The floppy drive coco has four eight bit output ports and four eight bit 
input ports. I've connected just about everything you can imagine to that 
coco. I'm using it right now to operate my tiny milling machine. I only know 
Basic09 and don't have time to learn other languages.

 There are too danged many things that can be done with a coco to just give 
up on it. I can't program a PC and besides, these darned things are too fast 
today to wire up my children 74XX/X chips to... I think.

>
> Anyway, Hail Satan, kill the babies, get your gay on, etc. etc.
> C.

 The best totally "Politically Incorrect" statement I've seen is:

 " Nuke a gay whale for Jesus "

George 



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Oct 24 23:00:22 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 23:00:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200810242300.23006.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 24 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 21:54 -0500, George Ramsower wrote:
>>  I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep the
>> subjects in line with the directive of this list group.
>
>Actually, when I do bring up things that are on-topic - usually me
>asking detailed questions about NitrOS-9 - they're more often than not
>ignored.  I don't know if it's because no one knows the answers, or if
>those in the know don't care to respond.  I'm still waiting for any
>insight as to why V.PAGE isn't used in the Coco version of OS-9, and if
>anyone thinks it's unwise to appropriate it for Multi-Pak slot
>information.

V.PAGE?  Yes its used, by the memory manager, and the windowing system IIRC.  
I believe I also used it in myram. (my ramdisk, in 3rd party tree)  Since 
myram still works under 3.2.8, I have to assume it is still valid, and not 
open for grabs.

[...]

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Neutrino overload on the nameserver


From boisy at tee-boy.com  Fri Oct 24 23:40:29 2008
From: boisy at tee-boy.com (Boisy Pitre)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 22:40:29 -0500
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <088A2F68-36D8-4792-8E4E-B9A8693AD1D5@tee-boy.com>


On Oct 24, 2008, at 7:53 PM, Chuck Youse wrote:

> On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 21:54 -0500, George Ramsower wrote:
>
>> I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could  
>> keep the
>> subjects in line with the directive of this list group.
>>
>
> Actually, when I do bring up things that are on-topic - usually me
> asking detailed questions about NitrOS-9 - they're more often than not
> ignored.  I don't know if it's because no one knows the answers, or if
> those in the know don't care to respond.  I'm still waiting for any
> insight as to why V.PAGE isn't used in the Coco version of OS-9, and  
> if
> anyone thinks it's unwise to appropriate it for Multi-Pak slot
> information.  Funny how Boisy, King of NitrOS-9 Hill, only seems to  
> pipe
> up to turn on that Cajun charm and call for my ejection from the list
> (Jesus would have done the same, I'm sure), or defend one of his
> wares.

Hey Chuck, I see you're still taking pot shots.  You have a real chip  
on your shoulder about anything related to Christianity or Republicans.

Don't deviate.  Stay on topic.

> I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
> got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment -  
> just
> seems that the Coco has become a gigantic waste of space and time, and
> the remnants of the Coco community just aren't all that dynamic any
> more.  There remains much interesting work that can be done with our
> 8-bit buddy, especially on the NitrOS-9 side in terms of  
> consolidation,
> clean-up, and even "Coco 4" type development, just for pure hack  
> value.
> But sadly there is only a very small audience for such things.  The
> greatest base seems to be people playing games in emulators, which is
> unfortunate.

I have to agree with you on this.  Despite your asinine posting  
behavior, you do ask some of the most detailed technical questions of  
anyone on this list.

V.PAGE... I don't have any particular insight as to why it seems to be  
ignored in NitrOS-9.  I suspect it's part of the same philosophy that  
Microware had with OS-9 Level One's floppy driver which didn't take  
advantage of double-sided drives: hard-code to the common case to save  
space and make things work faster, etc.




From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 23:41:27 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 22:41:27 -0500
Subject: [Coco]  Fun things that can be done with a coco..
Message-ID: <001201c93653$903de250$d4b1b1d8@house>

 A Coco is a very powerful tool!!

 It's not blindingly fast, but it has enough power to operate some things 
faster than needed.

 I have used Cocos to open and close windows in my house, monitor the 
weather, page my beeper(that's an old thing), move objects and even tell me 
when the sun has come up.

 A coco can be easily wired up to things and the built in basic is easy to 
write simple softare to operate these devices.

 Controlling things around the house is a fun thing to do with a coco. 
There's lots of software and hardware available today for PCs to do this 
sort of thing. The most popular is the X10 protocall and it's simple, 
doesn't require speed and it's economical. However, the software available 
is for PCs( MS and Apple)! Ugh!

 A Color Computer can do everything that is required in this scenario to 
totally control your house. A coco uses a LOT less energy, the software to 
operate an X10 controller is simple and it's FUN!

 You can turn your electric water heater on and off at certain times, turn 
selected lights on and off at certain times or use motion detectors to turn 
lights on or off or to activate a siren. The possibilites are limitless.
 The X10 controller is programmable. The coco only needs to program the 
controller and the coco can be turned off after the controller is 
programmed.
 If monitoring things is important, such as switches from motion detectors, 
temperature switches, rain detectors or even a loud noise detectors, then a 
coco is the perfect tool to do this task.

 All we need is a simple driver to interpret our desired commands and send 
them to the X10 controller through a serial port. That's all.

 The hardware to enable us to detect those sensors is another story. It 
isn't available right now unless you use the joystick ports.

 I bet, if enough folks were to chime in here and express an interest, 
someone would come up with the things we need to do this, so we wouldn't 
have to run a five hundred watt PC to do what a coco can do with less than 
100 watts of electriciy.

 We have a lot of folks watching this list that have cocos. Who would be 
interested in using one to control your house? Speak up! Silence is golden 
but, in this case, silence is a lead balloon.



George



 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Oct 24 23:53:23 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 23:53:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
In-Reply-To: <49027F6E.2070202@gmail.com>
References: <49027F6E.2070202@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49029833.5080008@worldnet.att.net>

Ed Orbea wrote:
> Thanks for the information, I am currently working thought the items you 
> identified.
> There are a few things I do need to correct.
> (1) I said that I "saved d0 as d0_emu.dd", what I meant to say was that 
> I saved dd and dd_emu.dd.
Is this a typo? Do you mean you saved dd as dd_emu.dd?
> (2) I am working from a copy of vhd, not the original
> 
> Here is a dump of /h0:
> 
> Address   0  1 2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F 0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> -------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----------------
> 00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF .M,/.!q.K.#.&...
> 00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003 ........Z at ..@. at .
> 00000020 2048 B052 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BFE6 96    H0RBFEmuDsk?F.
> 
> Here is the ident from the 40tkdsdd 3.8.6 floppy that boots to VHD. This 
> is the 40tkdsdd boot I made to "test" things. WHen I try to make a 
> 35tksdss version of the disk (dmode: cyl=23 sid-1 dns=1), it formats and 
> is created successfully, but then I try to boot from it (doesn't matter 
> if these is a vhd or not, nor does it matter if I am using RGBDOS or 
> not), it fails during boot, right after the 6th "." is displayed as part 
> of the boot process. It is my understanding that each "." signifies the 
> successful read of a LSNO sector.
This should not be happening. The VCC distributed hard drive does not in 
my hands display dots during the boot process. You must have the wrong 
boot module installed on your floppy.

> 
>  18 $C0 $A08C87 . KrnP2
crc OK
>  13 $C1 $310A4A . IOMan
crc OK
>   1 $C0 $3F9827 . Init
crc OK
>  37 $D1 $09EDE5 . RBF
crc OK
>   1 $E1 $85815B . EmuDsk
crc OK
>  82 $F1 $BFE696 . H0
crc OK
>   1 $E1 $2F617B . rb1773
crc OK
>  82 $F1 $37B271 . DD
crc Bad. I can't match this to any drive descriptor.
>  82 $F1 $37A8D9 . D0
crc OK for 40 track double sided
>  82 $F1 $B3CBA2 . D1
crc OK for 49 track double sided
>  82 $F1 $BF6E4C . D2
crc OK for 40 track double sided
>  16 $D1 $3F50A2 . SCF
crc OK
>   2 $E1 $CD4489 . VTIO
crc OK
>   4 $C1 $CF4A25 . KeyDrv
crc OK
>   3 $C1 $918510 . SndDrv
crc OK
>   7 $C1 $A4C5CC . JoyDrv
crc OK
>   2 $C1 $C3E661 . CoWin
crc OK
>  83 $F1 $012B5D . Term
crc OK
>  83 $F1 $3B6153 . W
>  83 $F1 $A9B825 . W1
>  83 $F1 $6A4A21 . W2
>  83 $F1 $4820E4 . W3
W# are OK
>   5 $D1 $6F9717 . PipeMan
crc OK
>   2 $E1 $895C5F . Piper
crc OK
>  80 $F1 $D512FB . Pipe
crc OK
>   9 $C1 $A9E4A4 . Clock
crc OK
>   1 $21 $484309 . Clock2
crc OK for Cloud9
> 
> So if I understand correctly, I do not need rb1773.dr in the boot file.
> 

You do need rb1773.dr because without it, you can't access floppies.

The contents of os9boot looks correct except for DD. It is not the CRC 
from the distributed VCC .vhd image which is $BDBB72. If sysgo is set to 
use DD, then the boot most likely would fail.

There is still no information on Rel, Krn, and Boot. These are on track 
34 and you would need special software to check the CRCs on the boot 
disk. You can check the CRC of Boot when you save it to the Boottrack 
directory. It should be $2B0B09.

This disk would fail to boot as a floppy unless it was also on the .vhd 
and LINK had been run when the hard drive would be used as soon as the 
kernel started to run. It could only be used to boot strictly from the 
floppy if the normal floppy boot module was on track 34.

===========================================
Why not e-mail me your boot disk? That's the fastest way for me to tell 
what is wrong.


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Oct 25 00:11:03 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 00:11:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] VCC, VHD, NitrOS09 3.2.6 and RGD Dos question
In-Reply-To: <49027E8F.7090803@gmail.com>
References: 48FFF706.7010103@worldnet.att.net <49027E8F.7090803@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49029C57.1060404@worldnet.att.net>

Ed Orbea wrote:
> Here are dumps of my current /h0 and /dd modules. These should properly 
> use EmuDsk.dr to make a 35tksssd boot disk that can be copied and linked 
> to vhd to untilately "boot without a floppy in VCC"
> 
> /dd:
> 
> Address   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> -------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF  .M./.!q.K.#.&...
> 00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003  ........Z at ..@. at .
> 00000020 2044 C452 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BC24 3E     DDRBFEmuDsk<$>
> 
This is a good CRC. There may have been other descriptors on VCC at one 
time with incorrect base addresses which would result in different CRCs.
The base address should be $FF80 but a set with $FFE0 may have been 
released. Interestingly enough, the $FFE0 set works.
> 
> /h0
> 
> 
> Address   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> -------- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 00000000 87CD 002F 0021 F181 CB00 2300 26FF 07FF  .M./.!q.K.#.&...
> 00000010 800F 0100 0080 0100 5A40 0100 4000 4003  ........Z at ..@. at .
> 00000020 2048 B052 42C6 456D 7544 73EB BFE6 96     H0RBFEmuDsk?f.
> 
> 
> 


From rbihler at msn.com  Sat Oct 25 00:32:37 2008
From: rbihler at msn.com (Ron Bihler)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 22:32:37 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Chuck Never give up on a Coco ..My view.
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house><1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<000c01c9364c$13ea33e0$d4b1b1d8@house>
Message-ID: 

My 2 cents worth, If not interested (Press Delete now)

At times the conversations drift far from topic, and can be heated to say 
the least.  However one can always press the delete button and maintaining 
activity on the list is still more important than controls.

It's been great that I have had been able to get help on the list.  A great 
percentage of good help has come from Chuck.  Doing some light beta testing 
for him, we have had some great brain storming sessions.  Not to meantion he 
has helped my interest in getting back into the Coco and the community after 
a very long departure.  Heck I am motivated enought to be working on a PS2 
Keyboard to Coco adapter, also a new case for the Coco that will hold the 
HD's, Floppies, CC3, MPI and PS as I don't want to stuff it into a PC case 
as I did many years ago. Much of this is directly thanks to Chucks interest 
in the Coco, and seeing someone put a bunch of time into the machine for the 
heck of it as I don't see any venture for the Coco as a big money maker.  I 
for one will say Chuck's IDE card is very simple and effective, glad to have 
a HD on the system.  His other projects are just icing on the cake.

As George has pointed out, there is really a large potental number of 
hardware application for the Coco, with some hardware help it can simple and 
effective.  Not a hi powered big PC to run your lights :)

I do wish I can find a copy of RiBBS source one day as I would really like 
to run RiBBS via the network Card, Chuck is working on - I still hope so 
anyway.

Anyway back to my point, this is a very talented group of people on the list 
with vastly different idea's.  However the common theme is we are on the 
list for a reason and a common goal (Coco).  Try to find support for an Old 
Ohio Scientific Machine (Another project of mine) and in short order the 
Coco list is vastly better even with the faults and differences of idea's.

Stepping off the soap box now.

Ron



From badfrog at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 01:27:42 2008
From: badfrog at gmail.com (Sean)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 00:27:42 -0500
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <9efa17da0810242227v7fd461fgf67c021523de6cc5@mail.gmail.com>

I know I'm part of the base you don't like... I want to play the games
on the emulators, otherwise I don't have a lot of reason for playing
around on the CoCo anymore...

Now, had some Linus Torvalds equivalent made an open-source OS9 for
the PC about 15 years ago... Well, that could have been pretty sweet.
I really miss the modules and OS layout, it would have been really
good on the PC.  Multiple terminals and windows back in 1990... Put
MS-DOS to shame!



On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 7:53 PM, Chuck Youse
 wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 21:54 -0500, George Ramsower wrote:
>
>>  I'm fairly sure this stuff wouldn't happen as often if we could keep the
>> subjects in line with the directive of this list group.
>>
>
> Actually, when I do bring up things that are on-topic - usually me
> asking detailed questions about NitrOS-9 - they're more often than not
> ignored.  I don't know if it's because no one knows the answers, or if
> those in the know don't care to respond.  I'm still waiting for any
> insight as to why V.PAGE isn't used in the Coco version of OS-9, and if
> anyone thinks it's unwise to appropriate it for Multi-Pak slot
> information.  Funny how Boisy, King of NitrOS-9 Hill, only seems to pipe
> up to turn on that Cajun charm and call for my ejection from the list
> (Jesus would have done the same, I'm sure), or defend one of his
> wares.
>
> I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
> got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just
> seems that the Coco has become a gigantic waste of space and time, and
> the remnants of the Coco community just aren't all that dynamic any
> more.  There remains much interesting work that can be done with our
> 8-bit buddy, especially on the NitrOS-9 side in terms of consolidation,
> clean-up, and even "Coco 4" type development, just for pure hack value.
> But sadly there is only a very small audience for such things.  The
> greatest base seems to be people playing games in emulators, which is
> unfortunate.
>
> Anyway, Hail Satan, kill the babies, get your gay on, etc. etc.
> C.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Sat Oct 25 02:08:07 2008
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 06:08:07 +0000
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
Message-ID: <102520080608.22725.4902B7C700069704000058C522135753330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>

From: Chuck Youse 

 Funny how Boisy, King of NitrOS-9 Hill, only seems to pipe
> up to turn on that Cajun charm and call for my ejection from the list
> (Jesus would have done the same, I'm sure), or defend one of his
> wares.  

Funny, I've been around this list since near the beginning, and I've never seen Boise call for anybody's ejection.  Several times, he's retreated into the ozone to get away from bullshit like yours.  In the last six, seven years I think he's been regular maybe 30% of the time, due to other responsibilities such as school and actually producing product, and he's done fantastic at both.

> I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
> got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just

Midtown in what city? -- if it's Manhattan (the only place on the planet where "Midtown" actually has meaning), I'll come collect it at the curb and bring it over to Jersey.  Just tell me the day.

> seems that the Coco has become a gigantic waste of space and time, and
> the remnants of the Coco community just aren't all that dynamic any
> more.  There remains much interesting work that can be done with our
> 8-bit buddy, especially on the NitrOS-9 side in terms of consolidation,
> clean-up, and even "Coco 4" type development, just for pure hack value.
> But sadly there is only a very small audience for such things.  The
> greatest base seems to be people playing games in emulators, which is
> unfortunate.
> 
> Anyway, Hail Satan, kill the babies, get your gay on, etc. etc.

I think somebody got pissed off somewhere, but I can't follow the threads well enough to figure it out.  Further effort is not worth my time.  Goodbye, Charles.  (I hope I can call you Charles -- I hate nicknames and diminutives of real names).  The rest of us will just hack on (except Dennis -- but he did more hacking per month for pushing a decade than most of us can think of in a lifetime and he just wants to do music now -- damned good music in my arrogant opinion, I've seen it performed).  (The only bigger hacker I can think of than Dennis would be Steve Ciarcia, but they fed off each others' ideas with profit to everybody back in the day).
--
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this:  If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off".  Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_

The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time.  Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation.  For us individuals, BOHICA.


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Sat Oct 25 02:22:15 2008
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 06:22:15 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Chuck Never give up on a Coco .. was >This tickles me....
Message-ID: <102520080622.7466.4902BB170005E0E400001D2A22064246130B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>

From: "George Ramsower" 

> 
>  The best totally "Politically Incorrect" statement I've seen is:
> 
>  " Nuke a gay whale for Jesus "

It's election season, not please or piss off the Green,  Gay and God crowds.  There are real political issues at hand.

Vote from the rooftops.
--
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this:  If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off".  Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_

The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time.  Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation.  For us individuals, BOHICA.


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Sat Oct 25 02:54:19 2008
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 06:54:19 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Fun things that can be done with a coco..
Message-ID: <102520080654.28037.4902C29B0003848300006D8522007507440B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>

From: "George Ramsower" 
>  A Coco is a very powerful tool!!
> 
>  It's not blindingly fast, but it has enough power to operate some things 
> faster than needed.
> 
>  I have used Cocos to open and close windows in my house, monitor the 
> weather, page my beeper(that's an old thing), move objects and even tell me 
> when the sun has come up.

Why in the names of Yeshua, Maryam and Giuseppe would you want your computer to tell you when the sun comes up?  The rays blasting through the curtains do that.  Unless you're keeping an exact log that you think your local TV weather reporter is ignoring.

To quote Ambrose Bierce (a much wiser man than either of us) from somewhat over a century back:

DAWN, n.  The time when men of reason go to bed.  Certain old men
prefer to rise at about that time, taking a cold bath and a long walk
with an empty stomach, and otherwise mortifying the flesh.  They then
point with pride to these practices as the cause of their sturdy
health and ripe years; the truth being that they are hearty and old,
not because of their habits, but in spite of them.  The reason we find
only robust persons doing this thing is that it has killed all the
others who have tried it.

--
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this:  If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off".  Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_

The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time.  Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation.  For us individuals, BOHICA.

 -------------- Original message ----------------------



From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 06:59:21 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 05:59:21 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Fun things that can be done with a coco..
References: <102520080654.28037.4902C29B0003848300006D8522007507440B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <001401c93690$bc9212d0$d4b1b1d8@house>


----- Original Message ----- 

> From: "George Ramsower"
>>  A Coco is a very powerful tool!!
>>
>>  It's not blindingly fast, but it has enough power to operate some things
>> faster than needed.
>>
>>  I have used Cocos to open and close windows in my house, monitor the
>> weather, page my beeper(that's an old thing), move objects and even tell 
>> me
>> when the sun has come up.
>
> Why in the names of Yeshua, Maryam and Giuseppe would you want your 
> computer to tell you when the sun comes up?  The rays blasting through the 
> curtains do that.  Unless you're keeping an exact log that you think your 
> local TV weather reporter is ignoring.
>
> To quote Ambrose Bierce (a much wiser man than either of us) from somewhat 
> over a century back:
>
> DAWN, n.  The time when men of reason go to bed.  Certain old men
> prefer to rise at about that time, taking a cold bath and a long walk
> with an empty stomach, and otherwise mortifying the flesh.  They then
> point with pride to these practices as the cause of their sturdy
> health and ripe years; the truth being that they are hearty and old,
> not because of their habits, but in spite of them.  The reason we find
> only robust persons doing this thing is that it has killed all the
> others who have tried it.
>
> --
> Ward Griffiths

 You made me laugh!...

 Because it was somethingto do with an LDR.
 Just for fun.
 It was easy to see that it worked correctly, yes?

 That simple little thing evlolved into a light beam sensor I used to detect 
someone in my area in the trailer park I lived. If the beam was broken, the 
coco, using a modem, called my display pager and left me a number to let me 
know what happened at the house, the light beam being broken was just one of 
the things the coco was monitoring.

 George




From tvefoo at yahoo.com  Sat Oct 25 07:46:02 2008
From: tvefoo at yahoo.com (Tveo Loatouse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 04:46:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Will there be a better gshell?
Message-ID: <2696.94042.qm@web58108.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

Hi,

I am a big fan of OS-9. I was wondering if there ever will be a updated gshell? I for one, would like to see it do, instead of asking for a path when copying a file or directory, couldn't it (gshell) paste by clicking instead? This feature alone would add miles to gshell.

tvefoo



      


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sat Oct 25 08:31:23 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 08:31:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <200810242300.23006.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810242300.23006.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1224937883.13182.9.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Fri, 2008-10-24 at 23:00 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> 
> V.PAGE?  Yes its used, by the memory manager, and the windowing system IIRC.  
> I believe I also used it in myram. (my ramdisk, in 3rd party tree)  Since 
> myram still works under 3.2.8, I have to assume it is still valid, and not 
> open for grabs.
> 

Hm, I don't see myram.  I also see no references in the kernel, other
than in IOMan, where V.PAGE is explicitly cleared in the static device
data area right before INIT is called on any device driver.  (Just
because I don't see any more references doesn't mean it's not used - it
just means its not referenced as V.PAGE - i.e., disassembly that never
got its constants cleaned up or offsets from other fields are used,
etc.)

Seeing as V.PAGE is supposed to be used as the address extension field -
for systems that place I/O registers behind address translation rather
than in front - it's meaningless on a Coco unless you have a multi-pak
(which has its own address-translation hardware to map different slots
into FF40-FF5F).  I'm curious why the memory manager gets its fingers
into that.  I can see why the window manager might want make use of this
field, but that shouldn't affect non-Window devices (it certainly
doesn't pay attention to what's in the descriptor; it's always HW.PAGE,
window devices or not, under Level 2).

It would seem the only reason why the kernel even needs to reference
this field is to determine which instance of a device driver to invoke.
I.e., two devices at FF40 with V.PAGE=0 would be e.g., two drives on the
same disk controller, a third drive at FF40 with V.PAGE=1 would be a
different instance of the same driver.  It's clear that this was
Microware's intent, and it's also clear that it was unused on the Coco.
for some reason no one used the translation ability of the multi-pak and
instead did address decoding on each board..

Anyway, if you could provide further information it would be
interesting.

Thanks,
C.




From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sat Oct 25 08:38:22 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 08:38:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <102520080608.22725.4902B7C700069704000058C522135753330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>
References: <102520080608.22725.4902B7C700069704000058C522135753330B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1224938302.13182.15.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Sat, 2008-10-25 at 06:08 +0000, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote:
> From: Chuck Youse 

> > I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> > e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> > think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
> > got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just
> 
> Midtown in what city? -- if it's Manhattan (the only place on the planet where "Midtown" actually has meaning), I'll come collect it at the curb and bring it over to Jersey.  Just tell me the day.

Yes, Manhattan.  I've got two Coco 3s (one 512K, one 128k) and a CM-8
here, as well as a pile of Rainbow/Hot Coco, some hard disk interfaces
and drives and other assorted custom boards.  If you want the rest (more
monitors, more Cocos, 6309s, 5.25" drives, disk controllers, and other
nerdlies) you'll have to hit Queens (Forest Hills) where the lab is
afterwards.  Not a huge deal, I live right by the Queens/Midtown Tunnel,
so it's a straight shot if you're driving.

C.




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Oct 25 09:09:21 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 09:09:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Will there be a better gshell?
In-Reply-To: <2696.94042.qm@web58108.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
References: <2696.94042.qm@web58108.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <49031A81.3070409@worldnet.att.net>

Tveo Loatouse wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I am a big fan of OS-9. I was wondering if there ever will be a updated gshell? I for one, would like to see it do, instead of asking for a path when copying a file or directory, couldn't it (gshell) paste by clicking instead? This feature alone would add miles to gshell.
> 
> tvefoo
> 
> 
> 
There could be if you write the needed software. :)


From tvefoo at yahoo.com  Sat Oct 25 09:38:29 2008
From: tvefoo at yahoo.com (Tveo Loatouse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 06:38:29 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Will there be a better gshell?
Message-ID: <522616.76043.qm@web58105.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

Tveo Loatouse wrote:
> I am a big fan of OS-9. I was wondering ...
 
Robert Gault wrote:
> There could be if you write the needed software. :)

I don't have enough expertise for that, so I guess there won't be any update soon.

Thanks anyway.
tvefoo.



      


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Sat Oct 25 10:27:33 2008
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 14:27:33 +0000
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
Message-ID: <102520081427.23922.49032CD5000A2D2600005D7222007374780B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>

Call me on my cell.  two-zero-one two-eight-six three-seven-eight-seven.  If I don't answer (I may be driving, and a cell phone while driving is a heavy fine and many points in Jersey) leave a voicemail.  I'll call back soonest.

I'm headed over to Brooklyn for the first time in several years either today or tomorrow to visit my brother (or as close to one as I'll ever have -- my first wife's husband) at MyMoe hospital (we've been estranged for a while since an argument between him and La Esposa).  Side trips can be made over La Esposa's protestations.  (Mostly over me bringing any more of "that useless old computer crap" into the basement, but that's an old fight and I have plenty of countermeasures acquired lately that I haven't used yet).

--
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this:  If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off".  Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_

The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time.  Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation.  For us individuals, BOHICA.

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Chuck Youse 
> On Sat, 2008-10-25 at 06:08 +0000, wdg3rd at comcast.net wrote:
> > From: Chuck Youse 
> 
> > > I was just beginning to inventory my Coco crap to either off-load on
> > > e-bay or chuck (I'm proud that my nickname is a common slang term, I
> > > think only guys named Richard really have me beat on that one).  I've
> > > got tons of Coco crap in my lab and in my tiny midtown apartment - just
> > 
> > Midtown in what city? -- if it's Manhattan (the only place on the planet where 
> "Midtown" actually has meaning), I'll come collect it at the curb and bring it 
> over to Jersey.  Just tell me the day.
> 
> Yes, Manhattan.  I've got two Coco 3s (one 512K, one 128k) and a CM-8
> here, as well as a pile of Rainbow/Hot Coco, some hard disk interfaces
> and drives and other assorted custom boards.  If you want the rest (more
> monitors, more Cocos, 6309s, 5.25" drives, disk controllers, and other
> nerdlies) you'll have to hit Queens (Forest Hills) where the lab is
> afterwards.  Not a huge deal, I live right by the Queens/Midtown Tunnel,
> so it's a straight shot if you're driving.



From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 12:58:12 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 09:58:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
Message-ID: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>

I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this message
does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on :-(

I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I have both a
NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor available to use
for the system.  In the past when I tried to use the LCD monitor with the
VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had trouble syncing up after a
reset.

The CRT monitor works find, but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else tried
an LCD monitor and experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA converter?
If so, did you find a work-around?

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sat Oct 25 13:35:30 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 13:35:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <9efa17da0810242227v7fd461fgf67c021523de6cc5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<1224896009.10920.25.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<9efa17da0810242227v7fd461fgf67c021523de6cc5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1224956130.13182.37.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Sat, 2008-10-25 at 00:27 -0500, Sean wrote:
> I know I'm part of the base you don't like... I want to play the games
> on the emulators, otherwise I don't have a lot of reason for playing
> around on the CoCo anymore...
> 
> Now, had some Linus Torvalds equivalent made an open-source OS9 for
> the PC about 15 years ago... Well, that could have been pretty sweet.
> I really miss the modules and OS layout, it would have been really
> good on the PC.  Multiple terminals and windows back in 1990... Put
> MS-DOS to shame!
> 

This is actually on my list now that I'm ditching the Coco proper.  I
have several (professional) products that call for an RTOS to run on x64
machines, and the choices in this arena (aside from stupidly expensive
commercial ones) are pretty limited.  The industry standard these days
is Linux - just about all "appliance" items are running some hacked up
version of Linux (most of them in violation of the GPL, but that's a
different matter).  I've had my fair share of building embedded Linux
systems, and it's an amazing exercise in wasted resources, both in
development and at runtime.  Something slimmer and OS-9 like would suit
me just fine.  The x64 stuff provides position independence without
segmentation, and along with a ginormous address space (44+ bits in
current implementations), a similar architecture is now possible.  Page
tables can be used to prevent unintentional access to other modules for
safety, but everyone can still share a unified address space.  (For
performance, the page protection can be turned off to avoid TLB flushes
and misses.)

Device descriptors will probably be changed to reflect PCI vendor/card
and instance information rather than device addresses.  That's minor.
The semantics of device drivers, etc. will have to change - OS-9
serializes access to the device drivers to provide sychronization, but
on today's architectures that's a huge performance limitation.  And
obviously, SMP support is a must, which also affects synchronization.
Blah, blah, blah.

But for the most part, the system can remain very similar.  

I'll drop a line to the list when I've got something tangible.  I wonder
if I would be exposed legally in some way, pissing off Radisys.

C.




From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 13:46:09 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 10:46:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <889830d00810251046i387f19ffgd4659116c8ee372c@mail.gmail.com>

We need to set up a CoCo rescue fund or network for situation like this.
There is too much CoCo stuff in landfills already.

Maybe we could rescue the stuff and then ship it to GCC to sell at the Fests
and help recoup their costs of putting on the Fests?

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Neil Morrison  wrote:

>
> Note: Contact "Fr. Joseph Neiman" >
> NOT ME!
>
> FWIW, some of the Mail Stop type places will pack and ship on your C/C if
> Fr. Neiman will drop it off there for you.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fr. Joseph Neiman" >
>
> > Greetings:
> >
> > I have a collection of COCO stuff: three computers, two monitors, disk
> > drives, multipak, game cartridges, and etc. I had intended to set up an
> > Ebay account and sell the items, but that is no longer an option.
> >
> > Instead of throwing the stuff away, I found your name through an Internet
>
> > website, that you are in Michigan, and wondered if you would like to pick
>
> > up my whole collection and sell or do what you would like with it.
> >
> > Please advise.
> >
> > Peace...
> >
> > Joseph
> >
> > Fr. Joseph Neiman
> > 34462 First St
> > Paw Paw, MI 49079
> >
> > jneiman at btc-bci.com 
>
>  _
> Recent Activity
>
>    -  1
>    New Members
>
>  Visit Your Group
> 
>  Yahoo! Finance
>
> It's Now Personal
>
> Guides, news,
>
> advice & more.
>  Need traffic?
>
> Drive customers
>
> With search ads
>
> on Yahoo!
>  Yahoo! Groups
>
> Dog Group
>
> Connect and share with
>
> dog owners like you
>   .
>
> __,_._,___
>


From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 13:46:09 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 10:46:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <889830d00810251046i387f19ffgd4659116c8ee372c@mail.gmail.com>

We need to set up a CoCo rescue fund or network for situation like this.
There is too much CoCo stuff in landfills already.

Maybe we could rescue the stuff and then ship it to GCC to sell at the Fests
and help recoup their costs of putting on the Fests?

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Neil Morrison  wrote:

>
> Note: Contact "Fr. Joseph Neiman" >
> NOT ME!
>
> FWIW, some of the Mail Stop type places will pack and ship on your C/C if
> Fr. Neiman will drop it off there for you.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fr. Joseph Neiman" >
>
> > Greetings:
> >
> > I have a collection of COCO stuff: three computers, two monitors, disk
> > drives, multipak, game cartridges, and etc. I had intended to set up an
> > Ebay account and sell the items, but that is no longer an option.
> >
> > Instead of throwing the stuff away, I found your name through an Internet
>
> > website, that you are in Michigan, and wondered if you would like to pick
>
> > up my whole collection and sell or do what you would like with it.
> >
> > Please advise.
> >
> > Peace...
> >
> > Joseph
> >
> > Fr. Joseph Neiman
> > 34462 First St
> > Paw Paw, MI 49079
> >
> > jneiman at btc-bci.com 
>
>  _
> Recent Activity
>
>    -  1
>    New Members
>
>  Visit Your Group
> 
>  Yahoo! Finance
>
> It's Now Personal
>
> Guides, news,
>
> advice & more.
>  Need traffic?
>
> Drive customers
>
> With search ads
>
> on Yahoo!
>  Yahoo! Groups
>
> Dog Group
>
> Connect and share with
>
> dog owners like you
>   .
>
> 
>


From Nuxie at aol.com  Sat Oct 25 13:49:39 2008
From: Nuxie at aol.com (Nuxie at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 13:49:39 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
Message-ID: 

 
In a message dated 10/25/2008 12:46:52 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
nutz4coco at gmail.com writes:

We need  to set up a CoCo rescue fund or network for situation like this.
There is  too much CoCo stuff in landfills already.

Maybe we could rescue the  stuff and then ship it to GCC to sell at the Fests
and help recoup their  costs of putting on the Fests?

-Jim  Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On  Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Neil Morrison   wrote:

>
> Note: Contact "Fr. Joseph Neiman"  
>
> NOT  ME!
>
> FWIW, some of the Mail Stop type places will pack and ship  on your C/C if
> Fr. Neiman will drop it off there for  you.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fr. Joseph  Neiman" >
>
> > Greetings:
>  >
> > I have a collection of COCO stuff: three computers, two  monitors, disk
> > drives, multipak, game cartridges, and etc. I had  intended to set up an
> > Ebay account and sell the items, but that  is no longer an option.
> >
> > Instead of throwing the  stuff away, I found your name through an Internet
>
> >  website, that you are in Michigan, and wondered if you would like to  
pick
>
> > up my whole collection and sell or do what you would  like with it.
> >
> > Please advise.
> >
>  > Peace...
> >
> > Joseph
> >
> > Fr.  Joseph Neiman
> > 34462 First St
> > Paw Paw, MI  49079
> >
> > jneiman at btc-bci.com  
>
>  _
> Recent  Activity
>
>    -  1
>    New  
Members
>
>   Visit Your Group
>  

>   Yahoo! Finance
>
> It's Now  
Personal
>
>  Guides, news,
>
> advice & more.
>  Need  traffic?
>
> Drive  
customers
>
>  With search ads
>
> on Yahoo!
>  Yahoo!  Groups
>
> Dog  
Group
>
>  Connect and share with
>
> dog owners like you
>    .
>
> 
>

--
Coco mailing  list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco


SEND IT TO ME!!! I can rescue it and find it all good homes. I can pay up  to 
40 dallars shipping.
Mary
**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, 
no registration required and great graphics ? check it out! 
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Oct 25 13:50:37 2008
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 13:50:37 EDT
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
Message-ID: 

In a message dated 10/25/2008 12:58:37 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nutz4coco at gmail.com writes:


>I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this  message
>does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on  :-(

>I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I  have both a
>NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor  available to use
>for the system.  In the past when I tried to use  the LCD monitor with the
>VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had  trouble syncing up after a
>reset.

>The CRT monitor works find,  but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else tried
>an LCD monitor and  experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA converter?
>If so, did you  find a work-around?
 
Jim,
 
    Some LCD monitors are more "picky" than others.   Also you have
an early version of the converter.   If you want to try to  fix this we can 
exchange
your converter for a newer one that has more stable operation and see
if that helps with your situation.
 
Roy
 
**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, 
no registration required and great graphics ? check it out! 
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)


From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 16:30:42 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 13:30:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <889830d00810251330g6a9ebe4eg1e5c2bdc6851bbb8@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks to the quick response Roy, I sent you a message off line.

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 10:50 AM,  wrote:

> In a message dated 10/25/2008 12:58:37 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> nutz4coco at gmail.com writes:
>
>
> >I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this  message
> >does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on  :-(
>
> >I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I  have both
> a
> >NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor  available to use
> >for the system.  In the past when I tried to use  the LCD monitor with the
> >VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had  trouble syncing up after a
> >reset.
>
> >The CRT monitor works find,  but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else
> tried
> >an LCD monitor and  experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA
> converter?
> >If so, did you  find a work-around?
>
> Jim,
>
>    Some LCD monitors are more "picky" than others.   Also you have
> an early version of the converter.   If you want to try to  fix this we can
> exchange
> your converter for a newer one that has more stable operation and see
> if that helps with your situation.
>
> Roy
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your
> favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics ? check it out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 17:15:32 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 17:15:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>
References: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 25 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:

> I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this message
> does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on :-(
>
> I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I have both a
> NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor available to use
> for the system.  In the past when I tried to use the LCD monitor with the
> VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had trouble syncing up after a
> reset.
>
> The CRT monitor works find, but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else tried
> an LCD monitor and experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA converter?
> If so, did you find a work-around?

I can only guess that the video timing from your VGA converter (what model 
is it?) is right on the edge of the range for the LCD.  I've had great 
success with a Wei-Ya ACV-011 CGA --> VGA converter for my C128 and am 
planning to try it with the CoCo RGB output.  These are little open PCB 
units that power on a 12V wall-wart and are primarily designed for 
retrofit of game machines.  I picked mine up for $70 US.

I've also been using a Highway Model 100 (unfortunately far more 
expensive) as a scan doubler for an Amiga 2000 and to run Apple IIGS video 
through the LCD.  As you can tell, I'm on a campaign to eliminate CRT 
monitors.

Steve


-- 


From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 17:30:12 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 14:30:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
In-Reply-To: 
References: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>
	
Message-ID: <889830d00810251430r13c48f0aw9235b6e33a2164f8@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Steve,

I use the VGA converter that Roy Justice makes.  I have pictures up on my
site at: http://miba51.com/CoCo_VGA_Adpater.html

It works great with CRTs, but as Roy stated in a previous email, I do have
an older model and that may be the reason why mine is a bit touchy with LCDs
(Viewsonic VA 721 to be exact)

For now I can get by with the NEC MultiSync, but eventually I would like to
move up to a LCD because of space limitations.

I have a swing arm CRT stand that I was planning to use for the monitor, but
it's sort of iffy and the monitor is heavy, so I placed the disk drives,
speakers, and converter box on the stand to get them out of the way and make
room on the desk for the monitor.  Not the most conventional use of a CRT
stand, but it did solve a desk realestate issue :-)

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Steven Hirsch  wrote:

> On Sat, 25 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:
>
>  I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this message
>> does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on :-(
>>
>> I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I have both
>> a
>> NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor available to use
>> for the system.  In the past when I tried to use the LCD monitor with the
>> VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had trouble syncing up after a
>> reset.
>>
>> The CRT monitor works find, but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else
>> tried
>> an LCD monitor and experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA
>> converter?
>> If so, did you find a work-around?
>>
>
> I can only guess that the video timing from your VGA converter (what model
> is it?) is right on the edge of the range for the LCD.  I've had great
> success with a Wei-Ya ACV-011 CGA --> VGA converter for my C128 and am
> planning to try it with the CoCo RGB output.  These are little open PCB
> units that power on a 12V wall-wart and are primarily designed for retrofit
> of game machines.  I picked mine up for $70 US.
>
> I've also been using a Highway Model 100 (unfortunately far more expensive)
> as a scan doubler for an Amiga 2000 and to run Apple IIGS video through the
> LCD.  As you can tell, I'm on a campaign to eliminate CRT monitors.
>
> Steve
>
>
> --
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From snhirsch at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 18:59:10 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 18:59:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810251430r13c48f0aw9235b6e33a2164f8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>
	
	<889830d00810251430r13c48f0aw9235b6e33a2164f8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 25 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:

> Hi Steve,
>
> I use the VGA converter that Roy Justice makes.  I have pictures up on my
> site at: http://miba51.com/CoCo_VGA_Adpater.html

Very cool.  And the price is certainly right!

> It works great with CRTs, but as Roy stated in a previous email, I do have
> an older model and that may be the reason why mine is a bit touchy with LCDs
> (Viewsonic VA 721 to be exact)

It's a little hard to understand why even the most primitive of LCDs would 
have trouble with 31.5Khz VGA, but I am far from an expert on video.

> For now I can get by with the NEC MultiSync, but eventually I would like to
> move up to a LCD because of space limitations.
>
> I have a swing arm CRT stand that I was planning to use for the monitor, but
> it's sort of iffy and the monitor is heavy, so I placed the disk drives,
> speakers, and converter box on the stand to get them out of the way and make
> room on the desk for the monitor.  Not the most conventional use of a CRT
> stand, but it did solve a desk realestate issue :-)

I will post here when I get things connected to the Wei-Ya unit.


> -Jim Cox
> http://miba51.blogspot.com/
> http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Steven Hirsch  wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 25 Oct 2008, Jim Cox wrote:
>>
>>  I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this message
>>> does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on :-(
>>>
>>> I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I have both
>>> a
>>> NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor available to use
>>> for the system.  In the past when I tried to use the LCD monitor with the
>>> VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had trouble syncing up after a
>>> reset.
>>>
>>> The CRT monitor works find, but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else
>>> tried
>>> an LCD monitor and experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA
>>> converter?
>>> If so, did you find a work-around?
>>>
>>
>> I can only guess that the video timing from your VGA converter (what model
>> is it?) is right on the edge of the range for the LCD.  I've had great
>> success with a Wei-Ya ACV-011 CGA --> VGA converter for my C128 and am
>> planning to try it with the CoCo RGB output.  These are little open PCB
>> units that power on a 12V wall-wart and are primarily designed for retrofit
>> of game machines.  I picked mine up for $70 US.
>>
>> I've also been using a Highway Model 100 (unfortunately far more expensive)
>> as a scan doubler for an Amiga 2000 and to run Apple IIGS video through the
>> LCD.  As you can tell, I'm on a campaign to eliminate CRT monitors.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

-- 


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Oct 25 19:28:52 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:28:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <1224937883.13182.9.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<200810242300.23006.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224937883.13182.9.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200810251928.52236.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 25 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>On Fri, 2008-10-24 at 23:00 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> V.PAGE?  Yes its used, by the memory manager, and the windowing system
>> IIRC. I believe I also used it in myram. (my ramdisk, in 3rd party tree) 
>> Since myram still works under 3.2.8, I have to assume it is still valid,
>> and not open for grabs.
>
>Hm, I don't see myram.  I also see no references in the kernel, other
>than in IOMan, where V.PAGE is explicitly cleared in the static device
>data area right before INIT is called on any device driver.  (Just
>because I don't see any more references doesn't mean it's not used - it
>just means its not referenced as V.PAGE - i.e., disassembly that never
>got its constants cleaned up or offsets from other fields are used,
>etc.)
>
>Seeing as V.PAGE is supposed to be used as the address extension field -
>for systems that place I/O registers behind address translation rather
>than in front - it's meaningless on a Coco unless you have a multi-pak
>(which has its own address-translation hardware to map different slots
>into FF40-FF5F).  I'm curious why the memory manager gets its fingers
>into that.  I can see why the window manager might want make use of this
>field, but that shouldn't affect non-Window devices (it certainly
>doesn't pay attention to what's in the descriptor; it's always HW.PAGE,
>window devices or not, under Level 2).
>
>It would seem the only reason why the kernel even needs to reference
>this field is to determine which instance of a device driver to invoke.
>I.e., two devices at FF40 with V.PAGE=0 would be e.g., two drives on the
>same disk controller, a third drive at FF40 with V.PAGE=1 would be a
>different instance of the same driver.  It's clear that this was
>Microware's intent, and it's also clear that it was unused on the Coco.
>for some reason no one used the translation ability of the multi-pak and
>instead did address decoding on each board..
>
>Anyway, if you could provide further information it would be
>interesting.
>
>Thanks,
>C.
>
Probably the best description of V.PAGE is in Kevin D.'s "Inside OS9".

My copy is in the basement someplace, and I'm beat from carving cherry all day 
(making an entertainment center, drawers are hell), and am supposed to be at 
the transmitter about 1 AM for the rest of the night so I'm not going to dig 
it out tonight.

>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Q. Why is this so clumsy?
A. The trick is to use Perl's strengths rather than its weaknesses.
             -- Larry Wall in <8225 at jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV>


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Oct 25 19:40:02 2008
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:40:02 EDT
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
Message-ID: 

In a message dated 10/25/2008 6:59:29 P.M.  Eastern Daylight Time, 
snhirsch at gmail.com writes:
>> It works great  with CRTs, but as Roy stated in a previous email, I do have
>> an older  model and that may be the reason why mine is a bit touchy with 
LCDs
>>  (Viewsonic VA 721 to be exact)

>It's a little hard to understand why  even the most primitive of LCDs would 
>have trouble with 31.5Khz VGA, but  I am far from an expert on video.  

actually the trouble is on the Horiz sync line coming out of the
Coco3.  It has some noise on it and has to be filtered with a
capacitor so the converter can phase-lock to it.   I discovered  this
late in the game..  :)    Hey I am learning this stuff  as I go.....
 
Roy
 
**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, 
no registration required and great graphics ? check it out! 
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Sat Oct 25 20:23:53 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 20:23:53 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <200810251928.52236.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <000c01c93583$c6823620$d4b1b1d8@house>
	<200810242300.23006.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224937883.13182.9.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810251928.52236.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1224980633.13182.57.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Sat, 2008-10-25 at 19:28 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> >
> Probably the best description of V.PAGE is in Kevin D.'s "Inside OS9".

Ok.  I have a copy in the lab somewhere.  

Thanks
C.




From tonym at compusource.net  Sat Oct 25 20:38:48 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 00:38:48 GMT
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
Message-ID: <200810252038546.SM01116@[63.69.23.239]>

-----Original Message-----
>From: Gene Heskett gene.heskett at verizon.net
>Sent 10/25/2008 7:28:52 PM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: Re: [Coco] This tickles me....
>
>On Saturday 25 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>On Fri, 2008-10-24 at 23:00 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> V.PAGE? Yes its used, by the memory manager, and the windowing system
> IIRC. I believe I also used it in myram. (my ramdisk, in 3rd party tree) 
> Since myram still works under 3.2.8, I have to assume it is still valid,
> and not open for grabs.
>
>Probably the best description of V.PAGE is in Kevin D.'s "Inside OS9".
>
>My copy is in the basement someplace, and I'm beat from carving cherry all day 
>(making an entertainment center, drawers are hell), and am supposed to be at 
>the transmitter about 1 AM for the rest of the night so I'm not going to dig 
>it out tonight.
>

Don't know if that's necessary...isn't that on the ftp site?

Yep - here 'tis:

ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/VARIOUS/TUTORIALS/OS9/INSIDEOS9/InsideOS9.pdf


T

From operator at coco3.com  Sat Oct 25 20:56:55 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:56:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] LCD monitors with VGA converter box.
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com
 >
References: <889830d00810250958m75f000fq4849fd6e1c99ef04@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081026005720.EAAD120A33@qs281.pair.com>

At 11:58 AM 10/25/2008, you wrote:
>I would like to ask a CoCo related question and I am hopeing this message
>does get lost in all the flaming and bashing going on :-(
>
>I finally have my CoCo set up where I can actually use it and I have both a
>NED MultiSync XV15 CRT monitor and a 15 inch LCD monitor available to use
>for the system.  In the past when I tried to use the LCD monitor with the
>VGA converter box, the LCD monitor always had trouble syncing up after a
>reset.
>
>The CRT monitor works find, but is a major space hog.  Has anyone else tried
>an LCD monitor and experienced issues with syncing up to the VGA converter?
>If so, did you find a work-around?



I have a box from Roy and it works fine.  If you have the same model 
maybe you could ask him if there's a tweak you could do to it.


-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Oct 25 21:26:13 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 21:26:13 -0400
Subject: [Coco] This tickles me....
In-Reply-To: <200810252038546.SM01116@[63.69.23.239]>
References: <200810252038546.SM01116@[63.69.23.239]>
Message-ID: <200810252126.13150.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 25 October 2008, tonym wrote:
>-----Original Message-----
>
>>From: Gene Heskett gene.heskett at verizon.net
>>Sent 10/25/2008 7:28:52 PM
>>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
>>Subject: Re: [Coco] This tickles me....
>>
>>On Saturday 25 October 2008, Chuck Youse wrote:
>>On Fri, 2008-10-24 at 23:00 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> V.PAGE? Yes its used, by the memory manager, and the windowing system
>> IIRC. I believe I also used it in myram. (my ramdisk, in 3rd party tree)
>> Since myram still works under 3.2.8, I have to assume it is still valid,
>> and not open for grabs.
>>
>>Probably the best description of V.PAGE is in Kevin D.'s "Inside OS9".
>>
>>My copy is in the basement someplace, and I'm beat from carving cherry all
>> day (making an entertainment center, drawers are hell), and am supposed to
>> be at the transmitter about 1 AM for the rest of the night so I'm not
>> going to dig it out tonight.
>
>Don't know if that's necessary...isn't that on the ftp site?
>
>Yep - here 'tis:
>
>ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/VARIOUS/TUTORIALS/OS9/INSIDEOS9/InsideOS9.pdf
>
I wasn't aware it had been scanned, thanks Tony.

>T



-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Beware of a tall black man with one blond shoe.


From underserf at yahoo.com  Sat Oct 25 21:30:35 2008
From: underserf at yahoo.com (Mike Ortloff)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 18:30:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810251046i387f19ffgd4659116c8ee372c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <929706.9023.qm@web56605.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

As long as they ask $50 for a CoCo floppy drive on eBay, and they GET it, CoCos shouldn't have any problem avoiding landfills.

=US=



From georgeramsower at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 21:55:29 2008
From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:55:29 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Fw: COCO materials
References: <929706.9023.qm@web56605.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <002001c937d7$172e81f0$d4b1b1d8@house>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Ortloff"
> As long as they ask $50 for a CoCo floppy drive on eBay, and they GET it, 
> CoCos shouldn't have any problem avoiding landfills.
>
  Ignorance is bliss... except in this case.
  Most people don't know what they have and the value of it.

 I'm a pack-rat and I know(usually) what I have.  However, I do pack-rat 
things that have absoulutely no value to anyone but myself.


  If I were to have a garage sale, I expect that I wouldn't sell much of 
anything. Most of what I have that I would be willing to sell is useless to 
most folks.

 Junk!

  If I don't want it anymore, it figures(in my world) that no one else would 
want it either. It's only good for the price per pound once I'm done with 
it.

  Folks that have no need for old things have no idea how much other folks 
may have a need for those things.  The owners of these old things toss them 
and those of us who want them lose out.

 It's sad.

 Recycle, re-use and RE-CLAIM!

 Now, if I could reclaim the exhaust from SUVs, I could drive my car to and 
from work for free!.

.... well, almost

George 



From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:12:45 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:12:45 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Shots of my CoCo
Message-ID: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>

I put some shots of my CoCo up at:
http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/

Feel free leave a comment if you want.

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:29:06 2008
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 22:29:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net><200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net><1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com><1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com><1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com><1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com><5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: 


"Chuck Youse"  
wrote in message 
news:1224677477.24945.89.camel at dev.serialtechnologies.com...
> On Wed, 2008-10-22 at 07:24 -0400, Kenneth Schunk wrote:
>> 
> I hope for your sake that McCain/Palin get elected.  Palin has made it
> clear that her goals for her Vice Presidency involve wasting my tax
> dollars on "special-needs" (read: retarded) children: sounds like you
> could really use the help..
>
> C.
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

Hey, as the father of an autistic child I don't appreciate you throwing 
around the retarded thing as an insult.You can't begin to understand the 
pain a parent feels daily when faced with the reality of a mental disorder. 
If you think its a waste of your money...fine. Who gives a shit about you 
anyway.... But please find a more intelligent way to insult people.

Charlie





From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:32:40 2008
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 22:32:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Shots of my CoCo
References: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 


"Jim Cox"  wrote in 
message news:889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46 at mail.gmail.com...
>I put some shots of my CoCo up at:
> http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/
>
> Feel free leave a comment if you want.
>
> -Jim Cox
> http://miba51.blogspot.com/
> http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

Nice coco setup Jim. :-) Thats the same monitor I use with my coco! You know 
its very old but the picture is still perfect.

Charlie





From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au  Sun Oct 26 22:54:01 2008
From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 13:54:01 +1100
Subject: [Coco] Shots of my CoCo
In-Reply-To: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>
References: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49052D49.3000707@iinet.net.au>

Jim Cox wrote:

> I put some shots of my CoCo up at:
> http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/
> 
> Feel free leave a comment if you want.

That's way too tidy for someone that does "real work" on the Coco! ;)

Regards,

-- 
|              Mark McDougall                | "Electrical Engineers do it
|     |   with less resistance!"


From nutz4coco at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:57:24 2008
From: nutz4coco at gmail.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:57:24 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Shots of my CoCo
In-Reply-To: <49052D49.3000707@iinet.net.au>
References: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>
	<49052D49.3000707@iinet.net.au>
Message-ID: <889830d00810261957k34effa5p33bf0f1d74ce76f7@mail.gmail.com>

Very true Mark!  I should have noted that I just finished setting it up this
weekend.  I have set it up before then never really done anything with it,
but now the system is in a dedicated place and I intend to use it ;-)

-Jim Cox
http://miba51.blogspot.com/
http://cloudymidnights.blogspot.com/


On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Mark McDougall wrote:

> Jim Cox wrote:
>
>  I put some shots of my CoCo up at:
>> http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/
>>
>> Feel free leave a comment if you want.
>>
>
> That's way too tidy for someone that does "real work" on the Coco! ;)
>
> Regards,
>
> --
> |              Mark McDougall                | "Electrical Engineers do it
> |  >
>   |   with less resistance!"
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 27 00:30:36 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 00:30:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Shots of my CoCo
In-Reply-To: <49052D49.3000707@iinet.net.au>
References: <889830d00810261912i36ffc239g4cf6be83631c5d46@mail.gmail.com>
	<49052D49.3000707@iinet.net.au>
Message-ID: <200810270030.36137.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Sunday 26 October 2008, Mark McDougall wrote:
>Jim Cox wrote:
>> I put some shots of my CoCo up at:
>> http://8-bit-retro-computing.blogspot.com/
>>
>> Feel free leave a comment if you want.
>
>That's way too tidy for someone that does "real work" on the Coco! ;)
>
>Regards,

I'll second that in a heartbeat.  If it wasn't for the keyboard being clear, 
I'd never find mine in the mess.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
A is for Apple.
		-- Hester Pryne


From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com  Mon Oct 27 08:39:13 2008
From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 08:39:13 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
Message-ID: <1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>

On Sun, 2008-10-26 at 22:29 -0400, Charlie wrote:

> Hey, as the father of an autistic child I don't appreciate you throwing 
> around the retarded thing as an insult.You can't begin to understand the 
> pain a parent feels daily when faced with the reality of a mental disorder. 
> If you think its a waste of your money...fine. Who gives a shit about you 
> anyway.... But please find a more intelligent way to insult people.

1. If your kid is a drooling mess who can't speak, there's no point in
wasting resources in the hope that one day, maybe, they'll be able to
"contribute to society" by working at McDonald's.  In other words, if
there's cognitive impairment, we can't fix that, so why do we bother?

2. If you kid has actually got working gray matter, then let them sink
or swim.  The ones with mettle will swim, and will learn valuable
lessons along the way.  The ones who make it through school,
post-secondary education, etc. will be equipped to handle the REAL
world, which will not give them any special consideration.  They need to
learn to handle their "differentness" without help.

I "suffer" from Asperger's Syndrome; I grew up with it in the 80s and
90s, before the every-kid-has-got-a-disorder craze kicked in (it started
with ADD and Ritalin, and then new kid on the block is autism).  I knew
that I was an odd one, but I hid it well, and I didn't know what the
cause was until an English shrink spotted the signs (and she didn't spot
them until, well, we started sleeping together -- you get pretty good at
playing the stupid social games that "norms" play, even if you don't
understand their purpose).  It's not like there's anything anyone can do
about it, but it's always good to know that you're not a latent
psycho-killer, you just think differently, and value different things,
and you're not the only one.

Anyway, this is not meant to turn biographical.

Somehow, in this country, equal-opportunity has turned into
equal-everything, which is a sad transformation.  Education is one of
these areas that turns my stomach -- face it people, some people are
just smarter than others.  But as George Carlin pointed out, we are
afraid to call people "stupid" in this country -- everyone's got some
sort of "learning disability".  We're trying to squeeze pegs of all
sizes into the round hole, and the end result is a continual
dumbing-down of our high-school graduates.  It's EMBARRASSING.
Special-needs kids fall into this category, and I stated in my two
bullet-points above.  Either you've got the skills to survive in the
world as it is, or you don't.  If you're coddled, you never develop the
skills.  Ultimately it's a self-defeating tactic.

Palin's baby Trig is especially disturbing.  She WILLFULLY brought a
child into the world, knowing that it would present a burden rather than
a contribution to society.  She did this because she believes that an
invisible man in the sky wants her to do this, and if she doesn't do
what he says, she's going to burn in eternal fire.  And now she's trying
to say that it's society's responsibility to help people carry that
burden..... am I the only one who is dumbfounded?

It's bad enough that the government asks us to pay for other people's
children to begin with.  We're dealing with population pressures as it
is, and people who can't keep it in their pants get TAX DEDUCTIONS.  And
they want to increase those deductions!  Honestly, if you want to
reproduce, be sure you can afford to cover the costs of the kid.  Don't
make me eat the difference, thankyouverymuch.  (And don't get me started
on the welfare system, where we PAY people to reproduce..)

And, back on point, if you have a disabled kid, don't make me pay for
self-defeating coddling programs.

C.




From fwp at deepthought.com  Mon Oct 27 10:33:14 2008
From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 09:33:14 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 08:39:13AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
> On Sun, 2008-10-26 at 22:29 -0400, Charlie wrote:
> 
> > Hey, as the father of an autistic child I don't appreciate you throwing 
> > around the retarded thing as an insult.You can't begin to understand the 
> > pain a parent feels daily when faced with the reality of a mental disorder. 
> > If you think its a waste of your money...fine. Who gives a shit about you 
> > anyway.... But please find a more intelligent way to insult people.



Chuck,

What I find amazing is that you haven't figured out why people don't want to
help you with your questions or problems.


From skwirl42 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 10:10:08 2008
From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:10:08 -0300
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>
References: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <4c56cbd30810270710g94ccbe1hedc257129cc34719@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/27/08, Frank Pittel  wrote:

>  What I find amazing is that you haven't figured out why people don't want to
>  help you with your questions or problems.

It seems to me that the CoCo community is too small to shun competent
contributors because of their socio-political views, or their surly
behaviour.

-- 
James Dessart



From dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com  Mon Oct 27 11:14:36 2008
From: dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:14:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT Discussion Closed: Re:  Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200810271515.m9RFFWLX004674@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net>

Friends,

The political/social discussion is now closed. Further off-topic 
comments will result in banning.

I'm sorry to bring this up AGAIN, but off-topic discussion has become 
a nuisance to many list members. I've had three more unsubs and a 
long an very much to-the-point direct complaint.

Whatever is bothering you -- the economy, politics, personal 
challenges -- please keep it off the list in this particularly 
volatile time. Hey, I haven't had work for a month either. So let's 
all chill, and let me find some work instead of monitoring this list, 
thankyouverymuch. :)

This list is for CoCo topics. Let's keep to those topics, please, or 
at least computer topics that bear on many list members. No more 
off-topic politics, sociology, religion, psychology, etc.

No further notices, and no followups.

Dennis










From jcewy at swbell.net  Mon Oct 27 12:36:13 2008
From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 10:36:13 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>
References: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>		<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <4905EDFD.6030603@swbell.net>

Frank Pittel wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 08:39:13AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote:
>   
>> On Sun, 2008-10-26 at 22:29 -0400, Charlie wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> Hey, as the father of an autistic child I don't appreciate you throwing 
>>> around the retarded thing as an insult.You can't begin to understand the 
>>> pain a parent feels daily when faced with the reality of a mental disorder. 
>>> If you think its a waste of your money...fine. Who gives a shit about you 
>>> anyway.... But please find a more intelligent way to insult people.
>>>       
>
> 
>
> Chuck,
>
> What I find amazing is that you haven't figured out why people don't want to
> help you with your questions or problems.
>
>   
Well, it seems he has told us why.  He says he has Asperger's Syndrome
and is therefore incapable of understanding 'the stupid social games
that "norms" play', including apparently those of civility and tact.  So
maybe Chuck doesn't have a choice in the matter, though it doesn't sound
like he thinks it's appropriate for people to take the abilities,
disabilities, thoughts, or feelings of others into account when
interacting with them, so I assume he wouldn't want us to make that a
consideration in our interactions with him.  I've long ago made up my
mind that this is simply the way Chuck is, and I'm not ever going to
take anything that Chuck says personally.  This is a choice I can make
in my responses to Chuck, and it is a choice I have made before in
interactions with some others on this list.  Still, when discussing
purely technical issues, Chuck can sometimes have something useful to
contribute, and I simply chuck the rest.  :-)  (Yes, I got the Richard
joke...)

I was interested in following Chuck's hardware projects and would have
liked to have seen more -- especially of the HD floppy controller and
Ethernet adapter.  But alas, it sounds as if Chuck has decided to play a
"stupid social game" and stomp off in a huff with all his marbles, and
getting rid of all his CoCo stuff.  If he's serious about that, I hope
Ward is also serious about picking it up, so it can be of use to someone.

Chuck, I agree with you that many of the social games 'norms' play are
stupid.  I may not be two standard deviations off the 'norm', but I
probably am one.  Still, think of it as a quirk in the compiler that you
have to work around.  Learn to play the game just well enough to avoid
making everybody mad.  If empathy for other people's feelings isn't a
part of your register set, you can at least emulate it in software. 
Make it one of your direct page variables, and check its contents every
time you feel like using words like 'stupid' or 'dumbass' or you get the
urge to ridicule somebody's politics, religion, or choice of operating
system.  I get those urges too.  But I try not to act on them. 

You'll probably get more answers to your technical questions if fewer
people have you on their kill lists.  Believe it or not, even those who
have a vastly different world-view from your own are capable of
comprehending and imparting complex technical information, and
appreciating your own technical skills and accomplishments.  But they
are much more likely to do these things if you refrain from calling them
names.

JCE

> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>   



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Oct 27 12:10:52 2008
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 12:10:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30810270710g94ccbe1hedc257129cc34719@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081027143314.GA3963@warlock.deepthought.com>
	<4c56cbd30810270710g94ccbe1hedc257129cc34719@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810271210.52681.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 27 October 2008, James Dessart wrote:
>On 10/27/08, Frank Pittel  wrote:
>>  What I find amazing is that you haven't figured out why people don't want
>> to help you with your questions or problems.
>
>It seems to me that the CoCo community is too small to shun competent
>contributors because of their socio-political views, or their surly
>behaviour.

I have a tendency to agree with that synopsis.  The aspergers(sp?) might help 
to explain that.  But Chuck does need to find some respect for others.  For 
those with the syndrome, it can be a non-stop battle.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Generosity and perfection are your everlasting goals.


From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 27 12:26:35 2008
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:26:35 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net><200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net><1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com><1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com><1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com><1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com><20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com><5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com><1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: 

Chuck you are simply an ass.
The point is that you have no right to be going around calling people a
retard.
It certantly isn't needed in a group like this. You can type forever, you
will never be justified in doing so.
Like I said "who gives a shit about you anyway" and lets add "or your
views".

Charlie



"Chuck Youse" 
wrote in message
news:1225111153.13182.106.camel at dev.serialtechnologies.com...
> On Sun, 2008-10-26 at 22:29 -0400, Charlie wrote:
>
> > Hey, as the father of an autistic child I don't appreciate you throwing
> > around the retarded thing as an insult.You can't begin to understand the
> > pain a parent feels daily when faced with the reality of a mental
disorder.
> > If you think its a waste of your money...fine. Who gives a shit about
you
> > anyway.... But please find a more intelligent way to insult people.
>
> 1. If your kid is a drooling mess who can't speak, there's no point in
> wasting resources in the hope that one day, maybe, they'll be able to
> "contribute to society" by working at McDonald's.  In other words, if
> there's cognitive impairment, we can't fix that, so why do we bother?
>
> 2. If you kid has actually got working gray matter, then let them sink
> or swim.  The ones with mettle will swim, and will learn valuable
> lessons along the way.  The ones who make it through school,
> post-secondary education, etc. will be equipped to handle the REAL
> world, which will not give them any special consideration.  They need to
> learn to handle their "differentness" without help.
>
> I "suffer" from Asperger's Syndrome; I grew up with it in the 80s and
> 90s, before the every-kid-has-got-a-disorder craze kicked in (it started
> with ADD and Ritalin, and then new kid on the block is autism).  I knew
> that I was an odd one, but I hid it well, and I didn't know what the
> cause was until an English shrink spotted the signs (and she didn't spot
> them until, well, we started sleeping together -- you get pretty good at
> playing the stupid social games that "norms" play, even if you don't
> understand their purpose).  It's not like there's anything anyone can do
> about it, but it's always good to know that you're not a latent
> psycho-killer, you just think differently, and value different things,
> and you're not the only one.
>
> Anyway, this is not meant to turn biographical.
>
> Somehow, in this country, equal-opportunity has turned into
> equal-everything, which is a sad transformation.  Education is one of
> these areas that turns my stomach -- face it people, some people are
> just smarter than others.  But as George Carlin pointed out, we are
> afraid to call people "stupid" in this country -- everyone's got some
> sort of "learning disability".  We're trying to squeeze pegs of all
> sizes into the round hole, and the end result is a continual
> dumbing-down of our high-school graduates.  It's EMBARRASSING.
> Special-needs kids fall into this category, and I stated in my two
> bullet-points above.  Either you've got the skills to survive in the
> world as it is, or you don't.  If you're coddled, you never develop the
> skills.  Ultimately it's a self-defeating tactic.
>
> Palin's baby Trig is especially disturbing.  She WILLFULLY brought a
> child into the world, knowing that it would present a burden rather than
> a contribution to society.  She did this because she believes that an
> invisible man in the sky wants her to do this, and if she doesn't do
> what he says, she's going to burn in eternal fire.  And now she's trying
> to say that it's society's responsibility to help people carry that
> burden..... am I the only one who is dumbfounded?
>
> It's bad enough that the government asks us to pay for other people's
> children to begin with.  We're dealing with population pressures as it
> is, and people who can't keep it in their pants get TAX DEDUCTIONS.  And
> they want to increase those deductions!  Honestly, if you want to
> reproduce, be sure you can afford to cover the costs of the kid.  Don't
> make me eat the difference, thankyouverymuch.  (And don't get me started
> on the welfare system, where we PAY people to reproduce..)
>
> And, back on point, if you have a disabled kid, don't make me pay for
> self-defeating coddling programs.
>
> C.
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 27 13:02:08 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 10:02:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Sardis Technologies "no halt" DMC floppy disk controller
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <642383.92521.qm@web31108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


First: CAN WE PLEASE KILL THE FLAMES on disabilities??? It only alienates and splits the group.  [I'm biting my toungue on this as I type, just to follow my own advice.] You don't like things as they are??? VOTE for those who believe the way you do and try to make a change!!!



Second, AND WHAT more PEOPLE WILL BE INTERESTED IN:

Does anyone know the status of SDISK as far as D.P. Johnson is concerned?
 
[forwarded mesage follows]

"Re: "no halt" DMC floppy disk controller
Sunday, October 26, 2008 4:01 PM
From: "David C. Wiens"
To: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com

Hi Bill,

One possible obstacle to releasing the DMC controller design into the public domain is that the drivers contain code I licensed from D.P. Johnson (SDISK).  I would need to find him and get his permission before the driver could be released.

I also have some of the two-piece metal cases (black painted aluminum) used for the DMC controller, probably at least 30 or 40, maybe more.

Regards,

Dave Wiens
Sardis Technologies"




      


From deemcr at robinson-west.com  Mon Oct 27 13:19:22 2008
From: deemcr at robinson-west.com (Michael C. Robinson)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 10:19:22 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
Message-ID: <1225127962.680.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com>

If Sarah Palin was wrong to keep her downs syndrome baby, then
Chuck's mother was wrong to keep him.  And about sleeping with
a psychiatrist, why didn't you marry her first Chuck?  Autistic
people are not retards, Asbergers is a form of autism.  
Furthermore, even though a lot of autistic people are marginal
in most areas, they will be exception in one or two.  My brother
can remember anybodys birthday which means he is great with names
too.  Sadly, Sarah Palin is the unappreciated exception to the rule.
Ninety percent of the time in the US the down's syndrome child is
murdered.  Yes, abortion is murder.  Bill Gates probably has
asbergers, should he have been aborted?  The don't let them live
crap will lead to a lot of famous people, more than one might think.
Furthermore, autism is sadly on the rise.  Autism is a disease that
won't go away over night.  Learn to respect the list Chuck or have
someone proofread before you post and follow his/her recommendations.



From mechacoco at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 13:21:49 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:21:49 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Sardis Technologies "no halt" DMC floppy disk controller
In-Reply-To: <642383.92521.qm@web31108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: 
	<642383.92521.qm@web31108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810271021t13332f96l2a358171f612c01b@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/27/08, Bill Barnes wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone know the status of SDISK as far as D.P. Johnson is concerned?
>
> [forwarded mesage follows]
>
>
> Hi Bill,
>
> One possible obstacle to releasing the DMC controller design into the public
> domain is that the drivers contain code I licensed from D.P. Johnson
> (SDISK).  I would need to find him and get his permission before the driver
> could be released.
>

---

The status of the driver code license should not hold up the release
of the hardware design. There are people on this list capable of
writing a new driver, myself included.

Darren


From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com  Mon Oct 27 17:48:32 2008
From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 16:48:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT:  Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1225127962.680.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>		<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	
	<1225127962.680.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com>
Message-ID: <49063730.6020609@austin.rr.com>

Michael C. Robinson wrote:


> murdered.  Yes, abortion is murder.  Bill Gates probably has
> asbergers, should he have been aborted?  The don't let them live
>   
As one who would prefer to live in a world without abortion, my 
automatic answer
would usually be no, No, NO. In Bill's case - and maybe a couple of 
others - I'm sorely
tempted to say.....err, well, hmmm, that 
is..........*MAYBE*..................

johnd



From tonym at compusource.net  Mon Oct 27 19:30:54 2008
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 23:30:54 GMT
Subject: [Coco] OT:  Linux RBF filesystem support
Message-ID: <200810271930171.SM01828@[63.69.23.239]>

>-----Original Message-----
>From: LinuxRules Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com
>Sent 10/27/2008 5:48:32 PM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux RBF filesystem support
>
>Michael C. Robinson wrote:
>
>


Dennis already called this thread off limits about, oh, 8 hours ago.

Act like the adults you all are, and stop already.

From mrspock12 at juno.com  Mon Oct 27 20:32:52 2008
From: mrspock12 at juno.com (carl j england)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 19:32:52 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 64, Issue 30
Message-ID: <20081027.193252.2376.0.mrspock12@juno.com>

 

> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 06:03:30 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Derek 
> Subject: [Coco] 1986 Magazine Archive
> To: CoCo List 
> Message-ID: <623496.47947.qm at web30202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> I have the 1986 Magazine Archive up (This is a complete year with 
> all 12 issues). To get the download links visit the coco3.com forum 
> here: 
> &file=viewtopic&p=3458#3458
> 
> 1987 and 1988 complete years will also be up soon. Also some scanned 
> newsletters and other goodies will be up fairly soon as well.
> 
> Enjoy!
> 
> 


wow!!! excellent scans.

are there any more????

carl
____________________________________________________________
Are you safe? Click for quotes on a home security system. 
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3ni3dQl2Qyyg4qpkA4qlU7A3033Zog35NDPrO7q4UNpSsAzn/


From operator at coco3.com  Mon Oct 27 21:04:50 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 20:04:50 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Tim Lindner or Boisy, os9.exe
Message-ID: <20081028010521.143C220A36@qs281.pair.com>

Tim or Boisy,

The version of os9.exe I have hopefully is the latest copy for Windows.

The problem I'm seeing is os9.exe reports ERROR #248 when I supply 
full pathnames for the source file amd/or destination virtual disk.

For example:

os9 copy -r "c:\Program Files\Rainbow 
IDE\Projects\CoCo\RMA\Files\main.r" "c:\Program Files\Rainbow 
IDE\Projects\CoCo\RMA\Disks\test.dsk","main.r"
ERROR #248

Now, if I set my current directory to c:\Program Files\Rainbow 
IDE\Projects\CoCo\RMA", the following works fine:

os9 copy -r "Files\main.r" "Disks\test.dsk","main.r"


In finding this bug, I may have found an improvement to my software 
(or not).  I like to supply full pathnames to the called compilers, 
assemblers, linkers, and imaging tools, but now I think I'll leave it 
an option via a checkbox somewhere to pass relative or full paths for 
the filenames that go in the command strings.

-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From snhirsch at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 21:35:54 2008
From: snhirsch at gmail.com (Steven Hirsch)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 21:35:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT Discussion Closed: Re: Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <200810271515.m9RFFWLX004674@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>
	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>
	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<200810271515.m9RFFWLX004674@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 27 Oct 2008, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:

> Friends,
>
> The political/social discussion is now closed. Further off-topic comments 
> will result in banning.
>
> I'm sorry to bring this up AGAIN, but off-topic discussion has become a 
> nuisance to many list members. I've had three more unsubs and a long an very 
> much to-the-point direct complaint.
>
> Whatever is bothering you -- the economy, politics, personal challenges -- 
> please keep it off the list in this particularly volatile time. Hey, I 
> haven't had work for a month either. So let's all chill, and let me find some 
> work instead of monitoring this list, thankyouverymuch. :)
>
> This list is for CoCo topics. Let's keep to those topics, please, or at least 
> computer topics that bear on many list members. No more off-topic politics, 
> sociology, religion, psychology, etc.

Thanks, Dennis.

Please accept my apologies for starting that thread.

Steve


-- 


From operator at coco3.com  Mon Oct 27 23:06:27 2008
From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 22:06:27 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OS9 RMA working in Rainbow IDE
Message-ID: <20081028030737.0256020A33@qs281.pair.com>

Hooray.   The best I can explain what I just did is:

- Rainbow IDE 2.0 -
project name = RMA
source files = main.asm {told to output as main.r}
target disks = ~os9L2_1.dsk   ~os9L2_2.dsk

~ means 'existing' .dsk file was pointed to, as a template
Rainbow can make fresh disks or use existing preformatted virtual 
disks in case imgtool.exe, decb.exe, or os9.exe craps out one day or 
becomes incompatible with the current Rainbow setup.  In any of those 
cases, just use an existing .dsk image and... voila.

source file: main.asm

* Requires OS-9 Level Two RMA assembler
* (or a Windows/Linux ported version of RMA)

PRGRM	equ	$10
OBJCT	equ	$1
stk	equ	200
	psect	rmatest,$11,$81,0,stk,entry

name	fcs	"dir"
prm	fcb	$d
prmsize	equ	*-prm

entry	leax	name,pcr
	leau	prm,pcr
	ldy	#prmsize
	lda	#PRGRM+OBJCT
	clrb
	os9	F$FORK
	os9	F$WAIT
	os9	F$EXIT

	endsect
	

After clicking the BUILD button, the CoCo emulator window pops up, I 
type 'DOS' and in a few seconds I see the OS-9 Level Two prompt.  I 
type 'DIR'.  There's the OS-9 system directories plus my 'main.r' 
file in the root directory.

Now I've gotta play around with 'rlink.exe' now and see if it 
works.  In the past, I had copies that locked up, or didn't work with 
the .r files but I couldn't tell which was bad, the ROF files or the 
rlink.  We'll see.

Ofcourse, os9asm.exe (OS-9 Level One assembler) works without a 
linker.  So, Rainbow IDE 2.0 will be ready to develop OS-9 software 
disks out of the box, whether onto blank floppies or existing OS-9 
floppies (virtual .dsk) for quicker testing.

Thanks to the ToolShed guys for supplying these Windows-compatible 
CLI utilities that make it all possible from within the IDE much 
easier than working around the command prompt.  I've automated so 
much stuff that it's pretty much: put a check by the options you 
want, click Go.

-- 
Roger Taylor

http://www.wordofthedayonline.com



From paulh96636 at aol.com  Tue Oct 28 00:11:09 2008
From: paulh96636 at aol.com (paulh96636 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 00:11:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Video at the CoCoFest!
In-Reply-To: <49014F20.1080005@sbcglobal.net>
References: <49014F20.1080005@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <8CB06CA56AB76A7-A0C-645@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com>

I guess that person would be me.? As I had lived in Hawaii during part of the '60s, a recent nostalgia online trip brought
to my attention that a resident of Kona, Hi had an online webcam of his view of the ocean from his house.? He also
mentioned setting up a mobile cam to record part of the 2008 Ironman event.? Apparently to go mobile, he uses a
laptop with a pc card broadband device in the pcmcia slot.?I'm guessing that he is able to pay the $70/month charge
for its use by taking out only a month's service? for special events like ironman.? He can use a tripod setup for the
larger camera, but also can switch to a 'hat cam'.? Joe Trent is the name, and his porch cam is interactive, in that
the viewer can shift the camera's position and magnification when it's operational.

He is also the webmaster at www.konafriends.com, so I'd suggest contacting him for more details to see if GCC 
might be interested in a similar thing to do.???I don't know if anyone on the list read my original post and took a look
at the ironman event.????Ironman was little mentioned in the media, but was televised professionally, to be shown
sometime in?December.? The?top 5 finishers were mentioned, none from the U.S.A.???? ?-ph


-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Goers 
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
Sent: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:29 am
Subject: [Coco] Video at the CoCoFest!


To all?
I don't remember who brought up the subject or if anyone replied to the person.?
They asked about streaming a video at the fest. Well I for one don't have the equipment or the knowledge on how to do this.?
I don't recall anyone at the Glenside meeting say they know how to do it either.?
So. If someone wants to set up a video of the Fest and/or seminars, you are welcome to do it.?
I'll try to be involved enough to keep it running, but you will need to set up a small group to do it your selves.?
Can we put it on a servo so the viewer can move it around??
Email me and we will discuss it.?
Brian?
?
-- Brian Goers?
Glenside Vice-President of Special Events?
IDE Boards are available.?
?
The 18th Annual ?LAST? Chicago CoCoFEST!?
Will be held March 28 & 29 2009?
Holiday Inn & Suites Elgin.?
?
--?
Coco mailing list?
Coco at maltedmedia.com?
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco?



From boisy at tee-boy.com  Tue Oct 28 07:01:12 2008
From: boisy at tee-boy.com (Boisy Pitre)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 06:01:12 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Tim Lindner or Boisy, os9.exe
In-Reply-To: <20081028010521.143C220A36@qs281.pair.com>
References: <20081028010521.143C220A36@qs281.pair.com>
Message-ID: 

Roger,

This sounds like a bug specific to the Windows port, which Robert  
Gault manages.  Robert can probably chime in here on what the issue  
may be.

Regards,
Boisy G. Pitre
--
Tee-Boy
Email: boisy at tee-boy.com
Web: http://www.tee-boy.com

On Oct 27, 2008, at 8:04 PM, Roger Taylor wrote:

> Tim or Boisy,
>
> The version of os9.exe I have hopefully is the latest copy for  
> Windows.
>
> The problem I'm seeing is os9.exe reports ERROR #248 when I supply  
> full pathnames for the source file amd/or destination virtual disk.
>
> For example:
>
> os9 copy -r "c:\Program Files\Rainbow IDE\Projects\CoCo\RMA\Files 
> \main.r" "c:\Program Files\Rainbow IDE\Projects\CoCo\RMA\Disks 
> \test.dsk","main.r"
> ERROR #248
>
> Now, if I set my current directory to c:\Program Files\Rainbow IDE 
> \Projects\CoCo\RMA", the following works fine:
>
> os9 copy -r "Files\main.r" "Disks\test.dsk","main.r"
>
>
> In finding this bug, I may have found an improvement to my software  
> (or not).  I like to supply full pathnames to the called compilers,  
> assemblers, linkers, and imaging tools, but now I think I'll leave  
> it an option via a checkbox somewhere to pass relative or full paths  
> for the filenames that go in the command strings.
>
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
>
> http://www.wordofthedayonline.com
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Oct 28 07:58:57 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 07:58:57 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Tim Lindner or Boisy, os9.exe
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20081028010521.143C220A36@qs281.pair.com>
	
Message-ID: <4906FE81.7010809@worldnet.att.net>

Boisy Pitre wrote:
> Roger,
> 
> This sounds like a bug specific to the Windows port, which Robert Gault 
> manages.  Robert can probably chime in here on what the issue may be.
> 
> Regards,
> Boisy G. Pitre
> -- 
> Tee-Boy
> Email: boisy at tee-boy.com
> Web: http://www.tee-boy.com

Looking at the source code for os9copy.c, there could be a problem. For 
example
static char *ExtractFilename( char *path )
{
     /* This works for both native file paths and os9 file paths */
	
     char *a, *b;
	
     a = strchr(path, ',');
	
     if (a == NULL)
     {
         /* Native file */
         a = strrchr(path, '/');
		
         if (a == NULL)
             return path;
		
         return a + 1;
     }
	
     b = strrchr(a, '/');
	
     if (b == NULL)
         return a + 1;
	
     return b + 1;
}

All the code dealing with path uses / but Windows uses \. Unless there 
is a conversion somewhere, I'd expect a problem.

I've another issue resulting from the loss of two hard drives earlier 
this year. I can't as yet verify a good compilation of the source code. 
Msys/mingw32 is not fully working and I have lost needed support 
programs for Borland (dial-up complicates this issue.)
==============
The last working version of os9.exe does just as Roger describes with 
the 248 error after a full path name.


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Oct 28 08:23:01 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 08:23:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Tim Lindner or Boisy, os9.exe
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20081028010521.143C220A36@qs281.pair.com>
	
Message-ID: <49070425.1000302@worldnet.att.net>

Well / and \ can't be the issue as os9 dir works with either local or 
full Windows path names.


From farna at att.net  Tue Oct 28 10:06:52 2008
From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 09:06:52 -0500
Subject: [Coco] behavior on list (was Linux RBF filesystem support)
Message-ID: <49071C7C.4070905@att.net>

Can I agree with both of you? I hesitated to post a reply to this because contributing to the thread only lengthens it, but I think I can say something that will help...

Chuck already admitted part of the problem... he thinks very differently from others. That's apparently both a blessing and a curse, it seems to me. "Different" thinkers often come up with solutions that others over look, but in some cases have problems relating well with others... and others have problems relating well with them. I can understand some of Chuck's views completely, and they aren't without merit, but bluntly speaking out isn't the best way to convey them. 

The very best way for all of us to co-exist on this list is to STAY ON TOPIC and not wander off so far. I don't care about Chuck's political/religious/etc. views. He has the right to have them, and to voice them... in an appropriate arena. The CoCo-List was set up SPECIFICALLY to discuss CoCo related topics. Linux and other computer and electronic related topics are sometimes a little off-key, but tolerable IMHO -- politics and such aren't. 

I can fault Chuck for responding to such input, but no more than all the rest of you -- in some cases myself as well. The only way such a thread can continue is for people to continue responding. If Chuck or anyone else says something you don't like, the quickest way to shut that thread up is to NOT respond. Instead, we "take the bait" (though I don't think Chuck was intentionally baiting someone -- he has the knack to give his blunt opinion if questioned the least little bit about it, so someone may have been baiting him, though I don't know for sure, haven't read many of those messages and don't intend to). 

When Chuck posts questions and solutions to programming and hardware issues, they are pretty thorough and detailed. He seems to take criticism and back off when proven wrong, even though he comes on a little strong when saying he thinks something is flawed. For the CoCo, losing him on the list would be a loss, despite his sometimes non-mainstream views on other subjects. I bet if we all posted our views on politics and other topics (PLEASE DON'T!!), we might find that only a very few of us would be willing to associate with each other. Freedom of speach doesn't apply to ALL forums -- this one was set up with ONE topic in mind, and everything else should go somewhere else. It's not censorship -- you KNEW what the topic was when you signed up. 

So I say try to ignore those posts that aren't on topic and let them die off! I moderate a list, and know that ANY list can get volatile if not "policed" somewhat. But the best list environment is when the users police themselves by not sustaining "bad" threads. 

-------------
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:10:08 -0300
From: "James Dessart" 

On 10/27/08, Frank Pittel  wrote:
>  What I find amazing is that you haven't figured out why people don't want to
>  help you with your questions or problems.


It seems to me that the CoCo community is too small to shun competent
contributors because of their socio-political views, or their surly
behaviour.

-- 
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Motors Cars" 
Magazine (AMC)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html
(free download available!)



From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 28 10:52:56 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 07:52:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] 1987 RBM Magazine Archive (Complete Year)
Message-ID: <386624.1257.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I have gotten 1987 RBM Archive uploaded. This is the complete year (All 12 issues). Next up will be RBM 1988 Complete year and a batch of newsletters.

Link for the archive has been posted here: 
http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3477#3477

All my previous Software, Documentation and Magazine Archives links can be found at the coco3.com forums.

Enjoy!

** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 


      


From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com  Tue Oct 28 11:31:53 2008
From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 10:31:53 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Sorry, Dennis!
In-Reply-To: <2816.72.237.57.86.1225144376.squirrel@webmail7.pair.com>
References: <200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021133827.GB17268@tuxdriver.com>	<1224598896.24945.34.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081021145713.GE17268@tuxdriver.com>	<5914fa50810220424x303557dco5794d4e8d5654dcf@mail.gmail.com>	<1224677477.24945.89.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>		<1225111153.13182.106.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	
	<1225127962.680.9.camel@goose.robinson-west.com>
	<49063730.6020609@austin.rr.com>
	<2816.72.237.57.86.1225144376.squirrel@webmail7.pair.com>
Message-ID: <49073069.90501@austin.rr.com>

Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> John,
>
> This thread is CLOSED. No posts, no followups.
>
> Dennis
Didn't see the Closed message. My apologies.
[So many posts, so little time. D'oh]

johnd


From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com  Tue Oct 28 21:19:40 2008
From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 21:19:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Cassette To Disk Transfer
Message-ID: <20081028.211940.3612.0.JohnChasteen.2@Juno.com>

Hello Coco Folks

We have moved our Coco system to Florida for the Winter.

I promised to copy some Chromasette tapes to disk.

I seem to remember there was a discussion last Summer.

Is there any troubles I should be careful  to be successful?

I think I can load a tape file to coco3 memory then run the program

to make sure it works.  I do have a TDP-100 to try some of the programs.

When satisfied I have a good file then save to disk.

Your comments will be appreciated

John
____________________________________________________________
Free quote and debt consolidation information.  Click Here.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m2XhrTXSpsWeRiLX4dDTAuUELRIDFPo0eueb61WBrAWsri5/


From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com  Tue Oct 28 21:27:26 2008
From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 21:27:26 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Digital Rainbow Magazine
Message-ID: <20081028.212727.3612.2.JohnChasteen.2@Juno.com>

What is the URL for these digital files?

John
 
____________________________________________________________
Love Graphic Design? Find a school near you. Click Now.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oLKlOfIH8yvEzIgWFk4fvRkP3b7zCpUsVdpUu5bSV4Izl8d/


From devries.bob at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 21:33:07 2008
From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:33:07 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Cassette To Disk Transfer
References: <20081028.211940.3612.0.JohnChasteen.2@Juno.com>
Message-ID: <003a01c93966$4ef58350$6a135e77@aceraspire>

Many ML(machine language) programs which were supplied on tape will likely 
not run on a disk system because they have a load address in the disk 
variable space from the top of screen ram up.

Also, some programs which were supplied on tape had additional data files. 
This is fine for disk, except if those files all have the same filename 
(often 8 spaces, or no name at all). This makes transfer to disk 
problematical.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John T Chasteen" 
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 11:19 AM
Subject: [Coco] Cassette To Disk Transfer


> Hello Coco Folks
>
> We have moved our Coco system to Florida for the Winter.
>
> I promised to copy some Chromasette tapes to disk.
>
> I seem to remember there was a discussion last Summer.
>
> Is there any troubles I should be careful  to be successful?
>
> I think I can load a tape file to coco3 memory then run the program
>
> to make sure it works.  I do have a TDP-100 to try some of the programs.
>
> When satisfied I have a good file then save to disk.
>
> Your comments will be appreciated
>
> John
> ____________________________________________________________
> Free quote and debt consolidation information.  Click Here.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m2XhrTXSpsWeRiLX4dDTAuUELRIDFPo0eueb61WBrAWsri5/
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Tue Oct 28 23:32:22 2008
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (wdg3rd at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 03:32:22 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Cassette To Disk Transfer
Message-ID: <102920080332.6151.4907D946000AF23E0000180722058864420B9DCC090B99@comcast.net>

From: John T Chasteen 
> Hello Coco Folks
> 
> We have moved our Coco system to Florida for the Winter.
> 
> I promised to copy some Chromasette tapes to disk.
> 
> I seem to remember there was a discussion last Summer.
> 
> Is there any troubles I should be careful  to be successful?
> 
> I think I can load a tape file to coco3 memory then run the program
> 
> to make sure it works.  I do have a TDP-100 to try some of the programs.
> 
> When satisfied I have a good file then save to disk.
> 
> Your comments will be appreciated

Be wary of programs with ML to be embedded into DATA statements, such as Leo Christopherson was famous for, both in the TRS-80 Model One (Android Nim, Dancing Demon, etc) and Color Computer (Klendathu).  The program will load then save fine if you don''t run it.  If you run it, everything changes after the filler in the DATA statements is poked full of the real program and graphic data.  It'll save, but it'll never LLIST coherently.
--
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

"What I know [about the art of the sword] boils down to this:  If you see a guy running at you with a sword, put two rounds in his chest to slow him down, then one into his brain to finish him off".  Aaron Allston, _Sidhe Devil_

The two halves of the ruling Party are arguing over who gets to be the Top this time.  Either wins, Top or Bottom, they both win by the situation.  For us individuals, BOHICA.


From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Wed Oct 29 15:10:24 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 12:10:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
Message-ID: <318329.92726.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I just converted a fresh batch of disks from real 5.25" floppies to .DSK format that had been sent to me by a friend here on the list. The links to the downloads are here

http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3480#3480

More goodies to come as I get disks converted and also magazine scans uploaded!

Enjoy!

** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 


      


From johnguin at hotmail.com  Wed Oct 29 20:08:12 2008
From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 17:08:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco]  Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: <48FF2D74.1030301@adinet.com.uy>
References: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>	
	<48FF2D74.1030301@adinet.com.uy>
Message-ID: 

Hello all,

I seem to remember BASIC "coding guidelines" said to initialize and declare
all variables at the beginning of a program.  In addition to making the code
somewhat more readable, I seem to remember some minor performance gains from
this as well (especially if you declared the most often used variables
first).

Anyway, does anyone have any written documentation from any source that
recommends putting the variables first?  I think I may have an old Commodore
book buried somewhere, but was hoping someone here could point me to a
source more quickly.

Thanks,
John Guin



From mechacoco at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 20:54:27 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 18:54:27 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
References: <0AF64DA1-1E2A-47BF-885E-B8A17177D10F@verizon.net>
	
	<48FF2D74.1030301@adinet.com.uy>
	
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810291754k6f842250x490ae745dc11fbaa@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/29/08, John  wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I seem to remember BASIC "coding guidelines" said to initialize and declare
> all variables at the beginning of a program.  In addition to making the code
> somewhat more readable, I seem to remember some minor performance gains from
> this as well (especially if you declared the most often used variables
> first).

For performance reasons, you should put all initialization code
towards the end of the program in a subroutine and then use a GOSUB to
call it from beginning of your program. The reasoning for this is that
every GOTO statement which branches back to an earlier line number
causes the interpreter to start searching for that line number from
the very beginning. Therefore, the fewer number of one-time-executed
lines at the beginning of the program, the better.

I seriously doubt there are very many programs that will actually
benefit from this kind of optimization.

Darren


From devries.bob at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 21:19:51 2008
From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 11:19:51 +1000
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
References: <318329.92726.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <006701c93a2d$9f4f8d60$6a135e77@aceraspire>

Derek,
I get Access Denied when I try to follow that link.
Could you post the actual links here?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek" 
To: "CoCo List" 
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 5:10 AM
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded


>I just converted a fresh batch of disks from real 5.25" floppies to .DSK 
>format that had been sent to me by a friend here on the list. The links to 
>the downloads are here
>
> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3480#3480
>
> More goodies to come as I get disks converted and also magazine scans 
> uploaded!
>
> Enjoy!
>
> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Oct 29 21:34:00 2008
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 21:34:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
In-Reply-To: <006701c93a2d$9f4f8d60$6a135e77@aceraspire>
References: <318329.92726.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<006701c93a2d$9f4f8d60$6a135e77@aceraspire>
Message-ID: <49090F08.7090404@worldnet.att.net>

Bob Devries wrote:
> Derek,
> I get Access Denied when I try to follow that link.
> Could you post the actual links here?
> 

Bob,
You most probably are registered at coco3.com. All you need to do is log 
in and the link will work.


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Wed Oct 29 23:10:58 2008
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 03:10:58 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer]  Question about BASIC coding guidelines
Message-ID: 

As for searching through line numbers, Darren is right.  If the line
number is lower than the current one the interpreter starts at the
beginning.  If the line number is greater than the current one it
starts searching at the next line.  (Just so you know, there are some
BASICs out there that include the memory address of the lines being
called so no search occurs.  Not on the CoCo though.)

There is one other important detail Darren left out.  Variables are
searched from start to end of the variable storage area so you want to
declare most used or time critical variables first.  Faster BASIC and
Other Mysteries or some similar book detailed this.

Also, if you can keep a loop on a single line it's faster than spread
over multiple lines.  Actually, if you can reduce the number of lines
used by placing more on your lines the less searching has to take
place and the faster it takes place since code is stored in sort of a
linked list.  Less lines to search, the lest nodes in the list.  

----------------------------------------
On 10/29/08, John wrote:

> Hello all,

>

> I seem to remember BASIC "coding guidelines" said to initialize and
declare

> all variables at the beginning of a program. In addition to making
the code

> somewhat more readable, I seem to remember some minor performance
gains from

> this as well (especially if you declared the most often used variables

> first).


For performance reasons, you should put all initialization code
towards the end of the program in a subroutine and then use a GOSUB to
call it from beginning of your program. The reasoning for this is that
every GOTO statement which branches back to an earlier line number
causes the interpreter to start searching for that line number from
the very beginning. Therefore, the fewer number of one-time-executed
lines at the beginning of the program, the better.

I seriously doubt there are very many programs that will actually
benefit from this kind of optimization.

Darren 



From dml_68 at yahoo.com  Wed Oct 29 23:34:56 2008
From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 20:34:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
In-Reply-To: <006701c93a2d$9f4f8d60$6a135e77@aceraspire>
Message-ID: <903175.19993.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Bob,

I e-mailed you the links directly. I don't post direct links to the any Rainbow Magazine or Software archives on the e-mail list .



** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **


 

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, Bob Devries  wrote:
From: Bob Devries 
Subject: Re: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 6:19 PM

Derek,
I get Access Denied when I try to follow that link.
Could you post the actual links here?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek" 
To: "CoCo List" 
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 5:10 AM
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded


>I just converted a fresh batch of disks from real 5.25" floppies to
.DSK 
>format that had been sent to me by a friend here on the list. The links to 
>the downloads are here
>
>
http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3480#3480
>
> More goodies to come as I get disks converted and also magazine scans 
> uploaded!
>
> Enjoy!
>
> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



      


From mechacoco at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 23:39:59 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 21:39:59 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810292039k51fc84baw23fe871e0a820239@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/29/08, James Diffendaffer wrote:
> ...
>
> There is one other important detail Darren left out.  Variables are
> searched from start to end of the variable storage area so you want to
> declare most used or time critical variables first.  Faster BASIC and
> Other Mysteries or some similar book detailed this.
>
> ...

---

Good point James. Declaring frequently used variables early could
definitely improve performance, especially for variables accessed
repeatedly in loops.

Darren


From devries.bob at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 02:46:45 2008
From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 16:46:45 +1000
Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
References: <903175.19993.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003101c93a5b$4d60e340$061e5e77@aceraspire>

thanks for those links. much appreciated

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek" 
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 1:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded


> Bob,
>
> I e-mailed you the links directly. I don't post direct links to the any 
> Rainbow Magazine or Software archives on the e-mail list .
>
>
>
> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>
>
>
>
> --- On Wed, 10/29/08, Bob Devries  wrote:
> From: Bob Devries 
> Subject: Re: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
> Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 6:19 PM
>
> Derek,
> I get Access Denied when I try to follow that link.
> Could you post the actual links here?
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Derek" 
> To: "CoCo List" 
> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 5:10 AM
> Subject: [Coco] New batch of Coco Disks Archived & Uploaded
>
>
>>I just converted a fresh batch of disks from real 5.25" floppies to
> .DSK
>>format that had been sent to me by a friend here on the list. The links to
>>the downloads are here
>>
>>
> http://www.coco3.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3480#3480
>>
>> More goodies to come as I get disks converted and also magazine scans
>> uploaded!
>>
>> Enjoy!
>>
>> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization **
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From flexser at fiu.edu  Thu Oct 30 02:57:00 2008
From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 02:57:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

The claim about performance gains is certainly true, though so small I doubt
you'd notice it in most cases.  I wouldn't bother declaring scalar variables
unless they are used really, really often.  (Might be worth it for FOR/NEXT loop
variables, if the loop is executed a lot and if BASIC's FOR/NEXT processing
doesn't directly store the variable's address with the other loop parameters
when the loop is entered, which I'm not sure of.)  But putting the most
frequently used arrays first in the DIM statement would be good practice.  
Since RS BASIC doesn't distinguish between integer and floating-point variables,
I see no particular gain in readability from declaring scalars, nor any method
of doing so other than initializing them to some value, which itself chews up a
bit of computing time.  (Conceivably, it is legal to put a scalar in a DIM
statement, but doing so also requires some extra computing time.)  Under RS
BASIC all variables are initialized to zero anyway on their initial use or when
a CLEAR statement is executed.

Art

On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, John wrote:

> Hello all,
> 
> I seem to remember BASIC "coding guidelines" said to initialize and declare
> all variables at the beginning of a program.  In addition to making the code
> somewhat more readable, I seem to remember some minor performance gains from
> this as well (especially if you declared the most often used variables
> first).
> 
> Anyway, does anyone have any written documentation from any source that
> recommends putting the variables first?  I think I may have an old Commodore
> book buried somewhere, but was hoping someone here could point me to a
> source more quickly.
> 
> Thanks,
> John Guin
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From os9dude at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 04:57:34 2008
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 04:57:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <5631e580810300157t34287e54m8827bd690caceedb@mail.gmail.com>

I don't know if this would translate to the CoCo's Basic implementation: In
order to speed up program execution time it was suggested to put all
subroutines at the beginning of a program, that meant starting off with a 0
GOTO XXX line sending control of the program to a bottom part where all
variables were declared and then branch back to continue normal execution -
all called subroutines within the running program would GOSUB to the initial
lines of the code.

This came from a TRS-80 Graphics book while discussing the implementation of
an arcade game in Basic.

Should probably toy with two versions of the same program this weekend and
benchmark (if possible) any speed improvements/fallbacks between the two:
one written in straightforward fashion and the other with the jump to
declare + subroutines at the beggining.



-=[ R ]=-




On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 11:10 PM, James Diffendaffer <
jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com> wrote:

> As for searching through line numbers, Darren is right.  If the line
> number is lower than the current one the interpreter starts at the
> beginning.  If the line number is greater than the current one it
> starts searching at the next line.  (Just so you know, there are some
> BASICs out there that include the memory address of the lines being
> called so no search occurs.  Not on the CoCo though.)
>
> There is one other important detail Darren left out.  Variables are
> searched from start to end of the variable storage area so you want to
> declare most used or time critical variables first.  Faster BASIC and
> Other Mysteries or some similar book detailed this.
>
> Also, if you can keep a loop on a single line it's faster than spread
> over multiple lines.  Actually, if you can reduce the number of lines
> used by placing more on your lines the less searching has to take
> place and the faster it takes place since code is stored in sort of a
> linked list.  Less lines to search, the lest nodes in the list.
>


From shadow at shadowgard.com  Thu Oct 30 10:04:07 2008
From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 07:04:07 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <49095C67.4993.20D0A762@shadow.shadowgard.com>

On 30 Oct 2008 at 3:10, James Diffendaffer wrote:

> As for searching through line numbers, Darren is right.  If the line
> number is lower than the current one the interpreter starts at the
> beginning.  If the line number is greater than the current one it
> starts searching at the next line.  (Just so you know, there are some
> BASICs out there that include the memory address of the lines being
> called so no search occurs.  Not on the CoCo though.)
> 
> There is one other important detail Darren left out.  Variables are
> searched from start to end of the variable storage area so you want to
> declare most used or time critical variables first.  Faster BASIC and
> Other Mysteries or some similar book detailed this.
> 
> Also, if you can keep a loop on a single line it's faster than spread
> over multiple lines.  Actually, if you can reduce the number of lines
> used by placing more on your lines the less searching has to take
> place and the faster it takes place since code is stored in sort of a
> linked list.  Less lines to search, the lest nodes in the list.  

Not sure if CoCo BASIC does this or not, but in other TRS-80 BASICs 
the line numbers for THEN, GOTO, GOSUB, etc are stored as literals.

Thus "GOTO 1000" takes two more bytes than "GOTO 10".

This makes a speed difference as well. 

When trying for speed, you want to number lines by *ones*. And statrt 
with:

0 GOTO ????

where ???? is the initialization routines. Line ne needs to be the 
most called subroutine,, etc.

--
Leonard Erickson (aka shadow)
shadow at shadowgard dot com




From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 30 14:19:26 2008
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 18:19:26 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: <49095C67.4993.20D0A762@shadow.shadowgard.com>
Message-ID: 

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, shadow at ... wrote:

> Not sure if CoCo BASIC does this or not, but in other TRS-80 BASICs 
> the line numbers for THEN, GOTO, GOSUB, etc are stored as literals.
> 
> Thus "GOTO 1000" takes two more bytes than "GOTO 10".
> 
> This makes a speed difference as well. 

I know some BASICs tokenize the number (store it as a 16bit integer)
which makes the code smaller and faster (ok... if you don't get out of
single digit line numbers it might not be smaller).  I don't remember
what the CoCo does.




From mechacoco at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 14:54:37 2008
From: mechacoco at gmail.com (Darren A)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 12:54:37 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: 
References: <49095C67.4993.20D0A762@shadow.shadowgard.com>
	
Message-ID: <5d802cd0810301154l2ab40c0cqc124b24ce925abcc@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/30/08, James Diffendaffer  wrote:
>
> I know some BASICs tokenize the number (store it as a 16bit integer)
> which makes the code smaller and faster (ok... if you don't get out of
> single digit line numbers it might not be smaller).  I don't remember
> what the CoCo does.
>

The CoCo does not tokenize the line numbers following GOTO, GOSUB and
THEN. It performs an ASCII to Integer conversion every time such a
statement is executed.  Likewise, literal numbers in expressions must
go through an even lengthier ASCII to FP conversion.

Darren


From da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 30 15:03:20 2008
From: da3m0n_slay3r at yahoo.com (Bill Barnes)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 12:03:20 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: <5d802cd0810301154l2ab40c0cqc124b24ce925abcc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <588994.82709.qm@web31106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Based on this, it would be faster to make all numeric constants within a program to be assigned to a variable within basic. Only drawback is if you accidently modify the value of the variable, as the CoCo BASIC doesn't allow for c constant variable. 

-Later!
 -WB-    -- BABIC Computer Consulting.

--- On Thu, 10/30/08, Darren A  wrote:
From: Darren A 
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Date: Thursday, October 30, 2008, 1:54 PM

On 10/30/08, James Diffendaffer  wrote:
>
> I know some BASICs tokenize the number (store it as a 16bit integer)
> which makes the code smaller and faster (ok... if you don't get out of
> single digit line numbers it might not be smaller).  I don't remember
> what the CoCo does.
>

The CoCo does not tokenize the line numbers following GOTO, GOSUB and
THEN. It performs an ASCII to Integer conversion every time such a
statement is executed.  Likewise, literal numbers in expressions must
go through an even lengthier ASCII to FP conversion.

Darren

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



      


From alxevans at concentric.net  Thu Oct 30 17:11:23 2008
From: alxevans at concentric.net (Theodore (Alex) Evans)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 14:11:23 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
References: 	<200810200927.45605.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<1224510048.12740.17.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<200810201022.36013.gene.heskett@verizon.net>	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>		
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <490A22FB.60304@concentric.net>

Chuck Youse wrote:

> Heh, I still think that C++ is a bit of a moving target.  The compiler
> implementations are far more varied in my experience, requiring that one
> keeps to a subset and allow for wide behavioral differences.  As such
> I'm not a huge fan and would rather use Ada for very large, complex
> systems.  (Hey, did I ever mention that I dated Bjarne's secretary's
> niece for a few years?  Claim to fame!)

Now all we need is the guy who swears by COBOL!



From rod.barnhart at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 19:20:14 2008
From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 19:20:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <490A22FB.60304@concentric.net>
References: 
	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>
	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	
	
	<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>
	<490A22FB.60304@concentric.net>
Message-ID: <6cd9b02e0810301620i62902513ycfccca48059cae0d@mail.gmail.com>

> Now all we need is the guy who swears by COBOL!

I know a few people who swear AT cobol, but none who swear BY it ;)

'mute


From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au  Thu Oct 30 22:39:26 2008
From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 13:39:26 +1100
Subject: [Coco] Linux RBF filesystem support
In-Reply-To: <6cd9b02e0810301620i62902513ycfccca48059cae0d@mail.gmail.com>
References: 	<1224515051.12740.19.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020151406.GC4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224516541.12740.24.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<20081020153428.GE4571@tuxdriver.com>	<1224550371.12740.54.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>			<1224593295.24945.10.camel@dev.serialtechnologies.com>	<490A22FB.60304@concentric.net>
	<6cd9b02e0810301620i62902513ycfccca48059cae0d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <490A6FDE.3080105@iinet.net.au>

Rod Barnhart wrote:

> I know a few people who swear AT cobol, but none who swear BY it ;)

LOL!

Apologies in advance if I've told this story here before, but around 1990 I 
was working in a PC group doing DOS & Windows apps in C and a 4GL called 
'SQL Windows' when the establishment of a company-wide IT department saw us 
suddenly under the management of a new IT general manager eager to make his 
stamp. A new application development strategy was being developed with 
outside consultants, and rumors started flying that *all* development, 
including PC-based, was to use COBOL.

Not sure of the source or of the truth of it, but none-the-less the majority 
of us decided that we'd walk out the door en-mass if it ever came to pass. 
It never did of course. Never-the-less, it rapidly became a much less 
pleasant place to work...

Regards,

-- 
|              Mark McDougall                | "Electrical Engineers do it
|     |   with less resistance!"


From diegoba at adinet.com.uy  Fri Oct 31 08:34:07 2008
From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 10:34:07 -0200
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
In-Reply-To: <5631e580810300157t34287e54m8827bd690caceedb@mail.gmail.com>
References: 
	<5631e580810300157t34287e54m8827bd690caceedb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <490AFB3F.8080803@adinet.com.uy>

I did check that a while ago with some biggish program of mine, and 
there was an improvement.
Also noticed speed changes when doing
FOR A=0 TO 1 STEP 0
code that might change X or Y
IF X=Y THEN A=1
NEXT A

Instead of
90 code that might change X or Y
100 IF X<>Y THEN 90

But the difference is only notorious if the routine is after many code 
lines, because of the GOTO behavior explained before
Diego

Rogelio Perea wrote:
> I don't know if this would translate to the CoCo's Basic implementation: In
> order to speed up program execution time it was suggested to put all
> subroutines at the beginning of a program, that meant starting off with a 0
> GOTO XXX line sending control of the program to a bottom part where all
> variables were declared and then branch back to continue normal execution -
> all called subroutines within the running program would GOSUB to the initial
> lines of the code.
>
> This came from a TRS-80 Graphics book while discussing the implementation of
> an arcade game in Basic.
>
> Should probably toy with two versions of the same program this weekend and
> benchmark (if possible) any speed improvements/fallbacks between the two:
> one written in straightforward fashion and the other with the jump to
> declare + subroutines at the beggining.
>
>
>
> -=[ R ]=-
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 11:10 PM, James Diffendaffer<
> jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>  wrote:
>
>    
>> As for searching through line numbers, Darren is right.  If the line
>> number is lower than the current one the interpreter starts at the
>> beginning.  If the line number is greater than the current one it
>> starts searching at the next line.  (Just so you know, there are some
>> BASICs out there that include the memory address of the lines being
>> called so no search occurs.  Not on the CoCo though.)
>>
>> There is one other important detail Darren left out.  Variables are
>> searched from start to end of the variable storage area so you want to
>> declare most used or time critical variables first.  Faster BASIC and
>> Other Mysteries or some similar book detailed this.
>>
>> Also, if you can keep a loop on a single line it's faster than spread
>> over multiple lines.  Actually, if you can reduce the number of lines
>> used by placing more on your lines the less searching has to take
>> place and the faster it takes place since code is stored in sort of a
>> linked list.  Less lines to search, the lest nodes in the list.
>>
>>      
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>    



From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 31 20:11:53 2008
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (theother_bob)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 17:11:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
Message-ID: <424191.50559.qm@web81504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I don't know about that for sure, but I can say from first hand benchmarking that it speeds Basic up to use Hex numbers instead of decimal. To prove it, try the following benchmarks:
?
10 TIMER=0:FOR X=1 TO 1000:N=&HC0C0*&H2:NEXT:T=TIMER;?T
?
10 TIMER=0:FOR X=1 TO 1000:N=49344*2:NEXT:T=TIMER:?T
?
I'm not actually running these now, but I'm confident you will see a faster time on the first example in RS Basic.

For Benchmarking especially, it is best to eliminate as much OS overhead as possible. Keep lines to the least (and lowest)?number?possible, put subroutines at the beginning of the program, declare frequently used variables first... all good practices I have experienced noticeable improvements from. There are also some POKEs that can make really major speed and security?improvements in Basic.

Cheers,
Bob


----- Original Message ----
From: Bill Barnes 
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 2:03:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Question about BASIC coding guidelines

Based on this, it would be faster to make all numeric constants within a program to be assigned to a variable within basic. Only drawback is if you accidently modify the value of the variable, as the CoCo BASIC doesn't allow for c constant variable. 

-Later!
-WB-? ? -- BABIC Computer Consulting.

--- On Thu, 10/30/08, Darren A  wrote:
From: Darren A 
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Question about BASIC coding guidelines
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
Date: Thursday, October 30, 2008, 1:54 PM

On 10/30/08, James Diffendaffer? wrote:
>
> I know some BASICs tokenize the number (store it as a 16bit integer)
> which makes the code smaller and faster (ok... if you don't get out of
> single digit line numbers it might not be smaller).? I don't remember
> what the CoCo does.
>

The CoCo does not tokenize the line numbers following GOTO, GOSUB and
THEN. It performs an ASCII to Integer conversion every time such a
statement is executed.? Likewise, literal numbers in expressions must
go through an even lengthier ASCII to FP conversion.

Darren

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



? ? ? 

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



      


From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com  Fri Oct 31 20:28:34 2008
From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 20:28:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Rainbow digital Files
Message-ID: <20081031.202834.5548.0.Johnchasteen.2@juno.com>

What is the URL for  Rainbow 1986?

John
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