From goosey at virgo.sdc.org Tue Jul 1 03:04:04 2008 From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey) Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 01:04:04 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Plug-in programs - Popular Science '79 Magazine In-Reply-To: <200806301416.50791.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <5631e580806300609v662d8875vb157eac9c951f1c4@mail.gmail.com> <200806301416.50791.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20080701070404.GB5897@virgo.sdc.org> On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 02:16:50PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Monday 30 June 2008, Rogelio Perea wrote: > >Found an interesting article worth reading if only to flash back to 1979... > > > >http://blog.modernmechanix.com/2008/06/25/with-plug-in-programs-anybody-can- > >use-these-personal-computers/ > I still have a TI99-4A and a few carts. Last time I plugged it in > was a decade ago, and it still worked just fine then. The TI99/4a is an interesting little machine. Shame it's so limited. Willard -- Willard Goosey goosey at sdc.org Socorro, New Mexico, USA I search my heart and find Cimmeria, land of Darkness and the Night. -- R.E. Howard From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 1 09:19:59 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 01 Jul 2008 09:19:59 -0400 Subject: [Coco] SAM/6883 datasheet? Message-ID: <1214918399.6332.38.camel@dev> Has anyone got one handy? I seem to have lost my electronic copy... grrr... C. From cocomalt at 6809.org.uk Tue Jul 1 09:51:54 2008 From: cocomalt at 6809.org.uk (Ciaran Anscomb) Date: Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:51:54 +0100 Subject: [Coco] SAM/6883 datasheet? In-Reply-To: <1214918399.6332.38.camel@dev> References: <1214918399.6332.38.camel@dev> Message-ID: <29779.1214920314@torch.6809.org.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > Has anyone got one handy? I seem to have lost my electronic copy... > grrr... I happen to have a copy at work, found on the net randomly at some point. Uploaded here: http://www.6809.org.uk/tmp/da/sn74ls783.pdf ..ciaran -- Ciaran Anscomb, Perl/C Hacker From PaulH96636 at aol.com Thu Jul 3 15:06:23 2008 From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:06:23 EDT Subject: [Coco] test message Message-ID: John, I sure hope you are feeling better since your hospital episode! Not much happening here with my Coco system(s); they've been in storage for such a long time that I'll likely need to go through the process of cleaning, deoxidizing contacts, and re-seating plug-in ICs. However, since purchasing a few items from Roger's offerings, I may be able to get in some Coco-ing using the emulators some time this summer. I see there's another lull in Coco traffic here lately so at least this message will tend to reduce the void a bit... ;-) -ph In a message dated 6/24/08 5:20:17 PM, johnchasteen.2 at juno.com writes: > > PaulH > > One of the reason you didn't see much action because? I didn't feel like > taking my wireless > notebook to the hospital. Started running a fever last Thursday and got > to come home > yesterday afternoon.? Marge and I missed my 80th birthday dinner. > Pneumonia in one > lobe in my lung. The doctor gives me several months and I should? be > 100%. > > While in the hospital I did get to study the Documentation for the > HDB-DOS that > CLOUD-9 provided with the SuperIDE unit. I am going to have a 250Meg CF > unit > in the IDE port. later I want to install some OS9 applications and BASIC > programs. > I don't have a lot of energy since I have to take some powerful pain > medicine so I > can tolerate the 6 week old shingles outbreak on one side of my back > > How are you using your coco system? > > Sure hope Bob Devries wasn't on that Ferry boat? that sunk in the > Philippine waters. That was the first thing that came to mind. > ? > John Chasteen > > On Sun, 22 June 2008 17:39:01 EDT PaulH96636 at aol.com writes: > > Haven't received any Coco / maltedmedia messages in days. > > Is the cocolist okay? > >? > > -ph > > > > > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > > fuel-efficient used cars.? ? ? > > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Planning for retirement? Click for free information on 401(k) plans. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3mKKfq47TyGMnL9MX7SfqKg1ama > cCUDlgYApCMsz3YD2TVAl/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ************** Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) From rms24g at gmail.com Thu Jul 3 14:57:06 2008 From: rms24g at gmail.com (Rich) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 14:57:06 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available Message-ID: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. I'm inclined to just toss it all, but I thought there might be somebody who would be interested in the whole lot. Since I feel it's too much trouble to ship it all, I was hoping someone might live close enough that they would take it all (or most of it) away. I live in Natick, MA. If you're interested, email me. Below are some highlights from what I have. There are many more smaller items than listed. Rich ============================ 3 - Coco3, 512K, 512K, 128K 2 - CoCo, gray, 64K 3 - FD502, dual, single, single 1 - gray, RS, full height drive 1 - dual, half height drive pair 2 - multipak interfaces 3 - Motorola MC68B09EP processors (new) NAP green screen 12 inches CM8 color monitor oki 92 printer RS printer DC modem IB 300 baud ADC modem 1200 baud Wordpak RS, 80 column cartridge rs232 pak sound pak plug n power X10 interface Rainbow - all except for the first ones Hot CoCo - all of them Color Computer Magazine - all of them Books - secrets, peeks & pokes, OS9, etc OS9 - Level 1 & 2, utilities and games RSDOS disk games Game cartridges From meirman at erols.com Thu Jul 3 15:29:27 2008 From: meirman at erols.com (meirman at erols.com) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 15:29:27 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available In-Reply-To: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> References: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080703152248.03c41500@erols.com> At 02:57 PM 7/3/08, Rich wrote: >My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided >it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. ... To be honest, I just joined this list to get some software to try to read an old 5.25" floppy for a friend of mine. (Now it turns out she doesn't even know what kind of computer she used to write it.) But what is Coco? Now once in Latin America, I ordered helado de coco, thinking it would be cocoa ice cream. But it was coconut ice cream. Am I on the right track? Thanks. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Thu Jul 3 16:20:00 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 20:20:00 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20080703152248.03c41500@erols.com> Message-ID: Coco = Color Computer. You can read most disks on a PC with Anadisk - you'll need the right size drive of course. Neil --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, meirman at ... wrote: > > At 02:57 PM 7/3/08, Rich wrote: > >My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided > >it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. > ... > To be honest, I just joined this list to get some software to try to > read an old 5.25" floppy for a friend of mine. (Now it turns out she > doesn't even know what kind of computer she used to write it.) > > But what is Coco? > > Now once in Latin America, I ordered helado de coco, thinking it > would be cocoa ice cream. But it was coconut ice cream. Am I on the > right track? > > Thanks. > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 3 16:53:57 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 16:53:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available In-Reply-To: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> References: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1215118437.1511.0.camel@dev> If you can wait a week or two (and no one else claims the gear), I'll drive up and get it .. I live in New York City but a 4-5 hour trip is worth it for THAT treasure trove .. C. On Thu, 2008-07-03 at 14:57 -0400, Rich wrote: > My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided > it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. > I'm inclined to just toss it all, but I thought there might be somebody > who would be interested in the whole lot. Since I feel it's too much > trouble to ship it all, I was hoping someone might live close enough > that they would take it all (or most of it) away. I live in Natick, MA. > If you're interested, email me. Below are some highlights from what I > have. There are many more smaller items than listed. > > Rich > > ============================ > > 3 - Coco3, 512K, 512K, 128K > 2 - CoCo, gray, 64K > 3 - FD502, dual, single, single > 1 - gray, RS, full height drive > 1 - dual, half height drive pair > 2 - multipak interfaces > 3 - Motorola MC68B09EP processors (new) > > NAP green screen 12 inches > CM8 color monitor > oki 92 printer > RS printer > DC modem IB 300 baud > ADC modem 1200 baud > Wordpak RS, 80 column cartridge > rs232 pak > sound pak > plug n power X10 interface > > Rainbow - all except for the first ones > Hot CoCo - all of them > Color Computer Magazine - all of them > Books - secrets, peeks & pokes, OS9, etc > > OS9 - Level 1 & 2, utilities and games > RSDOS disk games > Game cartridges > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From rod.barnhart at gmail.com Thu Jul 3 16:58:58 2008 From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart) Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 16:58:58 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available In-Reply-To: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> References: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6cd9b02e0807031358w74cfabc6oafa8605e0046bd99@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 2:57 PM, Rich wrote: > > My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided > it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. > I'm inclined to just toss it all, but I thought there might be somebody > who would be interested in the whole lot. Since I feel it's too much > trouble to ship it all, I was hoping someone might live close enough > that they would take it all (or most of it) away. I live in Natick, MA. > If you're interested, email me. Below are some highlights from what I > have. There are many more smaller items than listed. > > Rich > If you change your mind about shipping, let me know. I'd be interested in the lot, as I'm sure others would be as well. Rod aka Wintermute From sklammer at gmail.com Thu Jul 3 17:05:55 2008 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 17:05:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items Available In-Reply-To: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> References: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3925f0b0807031405g1c95f869rbbbcddea4db18f4c@mail.gmail.com> Rich, I hope that you find a home for this stuff and it isn't a dump :) If you decide to 'farm' some of it out, I may be interested in one of your MPIs... sk 2008/7/3 Rich : > My Coco stuff has been in storage for about 10 years and I've decided > it's time to get rid of it all because I'm never going to use it again. > I'm inclined to just toss it all, but I thought there might be somebody > who would be interested in the whole lot. Since I feel it's too much > trouble to ship it all, I was hoping someone might live close enough > that they would take it all (or most of it) away. I live in Natick, MA. > If you're interested, email me. Below are some highlights from what I > have. There are many more smaller items than listed. > > Rich > > ============================ > > 3 - Coco3, 512K, 512K, 128K > 2 - CoCo, gray, 64K > 3 - FD502, dual, single, single > 1 - gray, RS, full height drive > 1 - dual, half height drive pair > 2 - multipak interfaces > 3 - Motorola MC68B09EP processors (new) > > NAP green screen 12 inches > CM8 color monitor > oki 92 printer > RS printer > DC modem IB 300 baud > ADC modem 1200 baud > Wordpak RS, 80 column cartridge > rs232 pak > sound pak > plug n power X10 interface > > Rainbow - all except for the first ones > Hot CoCo - all of them > Color Computer Magazine - all of them > Books - secrets, peeks & pokes, OS9, etc > > OS9 - Level 1 & 2, utilities and games > RSDOS disk games > Game cartridges > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 3 17:31:26 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 17:31:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface Message-ID: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> Hi folks, I recently designed and built some PCBs built around the 82077AA-1 for the Coco 3 - it's a floppy controller for DD/HD disks (so it supports your standard 1.44MB 3.5" floppy). Since I had the room I also threw on an 8-bit IDE interface (typical waste-half-the-sector design). I'm still cranking on the software to verify operation (and that the Coco can keep up with the 14us data rate) but so far all signs are good. Ultimately it should work nicely as a high-density, no-halt controller for OS-9, if the software is properly tweaked - the 82077AA has a 16-byte FIFO that should eliminate the HALT/NMI hack of the Radio Shack design, if the Coco is running at 1.78MHz. As it's meant to take the place of a standard RS disk controller, it also has the 8K EEPROM 28-DIP socket on it for Disk Basic (or whatever). I personally don't use RS-DOS, so I had no intention of patching Disk Basic -- my ROM will simply allow automated booting either from floppy or an attached IDE disk. Also, I don't really plan on supporting multiple drives, as there's little need for more than one floppy drive when you've got a hard disk... but the controller itself actually will support two drives on an PC-style twisted cable. Anyway, I've got an extra board or two (and schematics, etc.) if anyone wants one for development purposes, either to patch Disk Basic or get in on the no-halt OS-9 driver action. At some point I may offer them for sale a la Cloud-9, but I doubt there's really enough interest for that.. C. From davehazelton at comcast.net Thu Jul 3 21:57:51 2008 From: davehazelton at comcast.net (David Hazelton) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 21:57:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> AS my Floppy controller has been dead for a few years, I'm interested in the final product. I could test it out, but since I haven't had my coco running for a few years, due to my B&B controller needed a floppy boot to load OS9. I'm not sure I can debug any of it. David Hazelton Chuck Youse wrote: > Hi folks, > > I recently designed and built some PCBs built around the 82077AA-1 for > the Coco 3 - it's a floppy controller for DD/HD disks (so it supports > your standard 1.44MB 3.5" floppy). Since I had the room I also threw on > an 8-bit IDE interface (typical waste-half-the-sector design). > > I'm still cranking on the software to verify operation (and that the > Coco can keep up with the 14us data rate) but so far all signs are good. > Ultimately it should work nicely as a high-density, no-halt controller > for OS-9, if the software is properly tweaked - the 82077AA has a > 16-byte FIFO that should eliminate the HALT/NMI hack of the Radio Shack > design, if the Coco is running at 1.78MHz. > > As it's meant to take the place of a standard RS disk controller, it > also has the 8K EEPROM 28-DIP socket on it for Disk Basic (or whatever). > > I personally don't use RS-DOS, so I had no intention of patching Disk > Basic -- my ROM will simply allow automated booting either from floppy > or an attached IDE disk. Also, I don't really plan on supporting > multiple drives, as there's little need for more than one floppy drive > when you've got a hard disk... but the controller itself actually will > support two drives on an PC-style twisted cable. > > Anyway, I've got an extra board or two (and schematics, etc.) if anyone > wants one for development purposes, either to patch Disk Basic or get in > on the no-halt OS-9 driver action. At some point I may offer them for > sale a la Cloud-9, but I doubt there's really enough interest for that.. > > C. > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 8.0.134 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1533 - Release Date: 7/3/2008 7:19 PM > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 3 22:55:08 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:55:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1215140108.1511.46.camel@dev> For those who are interested, I threw together a web page. Web designer I am not, and one section needs to be filled in (the programming details), but this should be enough to satisfy at least any initial curiosity: http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/fdc/index.html On Thu, 2008-07-03 at 21:57 -0400, David Hazelton wrote: > AS my Floppy controller has been dead for a few years, I'm interested in > the final product. I could test it out, but since I haven't had my coco > running for a few years, due to my B&B controller needed a floppy boot > to load OS9. I'm not sure I can debug any of it. > > David Hazelton > > > > Chuck Youse wrote: > > Hi folks, > > > > I recently designed and built some PCBs built around the 82077AA-1 for > > the Coco 3 - it's a floppy controller for DD/HD disks (so it supports > > your standard 1.44MB 3.5" floppy). Since I had the room I also threw on > > an 8-bit IDE interface (typical waste-half-the-sector design). > > > > I'm still cranking on the software to verify operation (and that the > > Coco can keep up with the 14us data rate) but so far all signs are good. > > Ultimately it should work nicely as a high-density, no-halt controller > > for OS-9, if the software is properly tweaked - the 82077AA has a > > 16-byte FIFO that should eliminate the HALT/NMI hack of the Radio Shack > > design, if the Coco is running at 1.78MHz. > > > > As it's meant to take the place of a standard RS disk controller, it > > also has the 8K EEPROM 28-DIP socket on it for Disk Basic (or whatever). > > > > I personally don't use RS-DOS, so I had no intention of patching Disk > > Basic -- my ROM will simply allow automated booting either from floppy > > or an attached IDE disk. Also, I don't really plan on supporting > > multiple drives, as there's little need for more than one floppy drive > > when you've got a hard disk... but the controller itself actually will > > support two drives on an PC-style twisted cable. > > > > Anyway, I've got an extra board or two (and schematics, etc.) if anyone > > wants one for development purposes, either to patch Disk Basic or get in > > on the no-halt OS-9 driver action. At some point I may offer them for > > sale a la Cloud-9, but I doubt there's really enough interest for that.. > > > > C. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG. > > Version: 8.0.134 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1533 - Release Date: 7/3/2008 7:19 PM > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jul 4 03:02:55 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 03:02:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> Message-ID: <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 03 July 2008, David Hazelton wrote: >AS my Floppy controller has been dead for a few years, I'm interested in >the final product. I could test it out, but since I haven't had my coco >running for a few years, due to my B&B controller needed a floppy boot >to load OS9. I'm not sure I can debug any of it. > >David Hazelton I too might be interested in it. I have a Disto SC-II no-halt now, but the no-halt driver cannot format a floppy without crashing. >Chuck Youse wrote: >> Hi folks, >> >> I recently designed and built some PCBs built around the 82077AA-1 for >> the Coco 3 - it's a floppy controller for DD/HD disks (so it supports >> your standard 1.44MB 3.5" floppy). Since I had the room I also threw on >> an 8-bit IDE interface (typical waste-half-the-sector design). >> >> I'm still cranking on the software to verify operation (and that the >> Coco can keep up with the 14us data rate) but so far all signs are good. >> Ultimately it should work nicely as a high-density, no-halt controller >> for OS-9, if the software is properly tweaked - the 82077AA has a >> 16-byte FIFO that should eliminate the HALT/NMI hack of the Radio Shack >> design, if the Coco is running at 1.78MHz. >> >> As it's meant to take the place of a standard RS disk controller, it >> also has the 8K EEPROM 28-DIP socket on it for Disk Basic (or whatever). >> >> I personally don't use RS-DOS, so I had no intention of patching Disk >> Basic -- my ROM will simply allow automated booting either from floppy >> or an attached IDE disk. Also, I don't really plan on supporting >> multiple drives, as there's little need for more than one floppy drive >> when you've got a hard disk... but the controller itself actually will >> support two drives on an PC-style twisted cable. What does it do with the 3rd ds line? That was not normally the fdc's responsibility, but was selected via separate latching buffers on the controller pcb. There were times I had considered replacing the 3 DS lines by feeding them to a 3x8 decoder to get 8 drives & then I wouldn't be moving drive cables all the time to switch from the various flavors of 5.25" drives to the 3.5". >> Anyway, I've got an extra board or two (and schematics, etc.) if anyone >> wants one for development purposes, either to patch Disk Basic or get in >> on the no-halt OS-9 driver action. At some point I may offer them for >> sale a la Cloud-9, but I doubt there's really enough interest for that.. How much? >> C. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG. >> Version: 8.0.134 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1533 - Release Date: 7/3/2008 >> 7:19 PM > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) First law of debate: Never argue with a fool. People might not know the difference. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 4 06:10:21 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:10:21 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <1215140108.1511.46.camel@dev> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> <1215140108.1511.46.camel@dev> Message-ID: <486DF70D.5090609@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > For those who are interested, I threw together a web page. Web designer > I am not, and one section needs to be filled in (the programming > details), but this should be enough to satisfy at least any initial > curiosity: > > http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/fdc/index.html Looks good, one sugestion for the next rev, would be to allow the use of a 27128 EPROM as this would allow the use of the full 16K of cartrige space, and is almost the same pinout, from memory the only difference is the additional address line. Actually one think I have done on several of my designs, is set the socket up for a 27512, which is a 64K EPROM, also in a 28 pin socket, I have then had a pair of jumpers on it's A14 and A15 lines so that I could select one of 4 banks of EPROM, usefull for example if you wanted to keep multiple versions of DOS available, or as in my case a version of RS-DOS for the CoCo, and DragonDos for the Dragon. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 4 06:27:50 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:27:50 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <486D839F.2010206@comcast.net> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Gene Heskett wrote: > On Thursday 03 July 2008, David Hazelton wrote: > What does it do with the 3rd ds line? That was not normally the fdc's > responsibility, but was selected via separate latching buffers on the > controller pcb. There were times I had considered replacing the 3 DS lines by > feeding them to a 3x8 decoder to get 8 drives & then I wouldn't be moving drive > cables all the time to switch from the various flavors of 5.25" drives to the > 3.5". Looking at the schematics in Eagle, and the data sheet for the Intel FDC. The FDC supports up to 4 drives, but as the interface is wired up for connection to standard PC type floppies, the DS2/3, and ME2/3 lines are not connected to the drive chain. However it would be possible to connect these so that 4 drives could be supported. Connecting the DS0..3 direct to the interface and the ME0..3 through some logic to the /MOTOR line. OK this would break compatibility with IBM drives, but would allow for up to 4 drives, and IBM drives could still be used with apropreate cable twists :) Another solution may be 2 IBM compatible drive connectors that differ just by which DS/ME combinations they have routed to them, so you would keep the current one, and add another with DS/ME 2..3 routed to it, though I'm not sure if this would work due to it effectivly being a Y shaped cable with the controler in the middle. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jul 4 11:03:05 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:03:05 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 high-density floppy controller/IDE interface In-Reply-To: <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 04 July 2008, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: >Gene Heskett wrote: >> On Thursday 03 July 2008, David Hazelton wrote: >> What does it do with the 3rd ds line? That was not normally the fdc's >> responsibility, but was selected via separate latching buffers on the >> controller pcb. There were times I had considered replacing the 3 DS >> lines by feeding them to a 3x8 decoder to get 8 drives & then I wouldn't >> be moving drive cables all the time to switch from the various flavors of >> 5.25" drives to the 3.5". > >Looking at the schematics in Eagle, and the data sheet for the Intel >FDC. The FDC supports up to 4 drives, but as the interface is wired up >for connection to standard PC type floppies, the DS2/3, and ME2/3 lines >are not connected to the drive chain. However it would be possible to >connect these so that 4 drives could be supported. Connecting the DS0..3 > direct to the interface and the ME0..3 through some logic to the >/MOTOR line. OK this would break compatibility with IBM drives, but >would allow for up to 4 drives, and IBM drives could still be used with >apropreate cable twists :) > >Another solution may be 2 IBM compatible drive connectors that differ >just by which DS/ME combinations they have routed to them, so you would >keep the current one, and add another with DS/ME 2..3 routed to it, >though I'm not sure if this would work due to it effectivly being a Y >shaped cable with the controler in the middle. Not recommended due to signal echo's, doubled terms notwithstanding even though this is a fairly slow circuit. Doubled terms would even be a good idea since these cables have about a 120 ohm impedance, but the average FDC chip probably couldn't drive a proper scsi termination (130 ohms to about a 3 volt supply) without letting out the smoke. >Cheers. I looked at it in eagle last night too Phill. And of the 3.5" drives I have, most, with a little detective work, can be addressed wherever you want them. Sometimes the artwork is labeled, more often not, and the addressing is cut & jump, but its usually there. For that reason the 4 drive setup looks to be doable if the ME2-3 and DS2-3 lines are brought out. I don't know as that could be done on all even pins like now or not, but on the 3.5" drives they commonly only have pin 1 and 33 as grounds, so that opens up the possibility of using an odd numbered pin for that at the controller end. Drives can always be physically patched. Overall, I like the idea, and I even have some old small ide drives around too. :) My drive tower overfloweth. :) >Phill. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) What I need is a MATURE RELATIONSHIP with a FLOPPY DISK ... From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 4 14:03:58 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:03:58 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 basic blues! In-Reply-To: <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1215194638.31404.5.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> So I've been hacking on some ROMs for this new-fangled floppy controller, and I ran into a nasty problem about two hours ago that's had me scratching my head... what appeared to be absolutely repeatable corruption in the ROM's address space! After swapping EEPROMs and other random hardware testing, I was left with the assumption that my code had a bug that was causing writes to the wrong areas or something.. I moved the stack around, etc.. But it turns out Super Extended Basic tries to patch the Disk ROMs! And since I'm 'pretending' to be a disk ROM, it was patching over my code.. Just a random vent .. and a warning to anyone else ... God bless Microware, but man, they had to do some ugly things to avoid copyright infringement of Microsoft's BASIC. Now back to the task at hand .. C. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 4 14:21:00 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 19:21:00 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 basic blues! In-Reply-To: <1215194638.31404.5.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1215194638.31404.5.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <486E6A0C.4070104@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > But it turns out Super Extended Basic tries to patch the Disk ROMs! And > since I'm 'pretending' to be a disk ROM, it was patching over my code.. Do you have any details of this (or is it documented somewhere), guess it would be there in the SECB Revealed disassembily, might be worth knowing for some of my projects too. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 4 14:26:12 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:26:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 basic blues! In-Reply-To: <486E6A0C.4070104@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1215194638.31404.5.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486E6A0C.4070104@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1215195972.31404.7.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> The Super Extended Basic unraveled book was my source - the patch of Disk Basic begins at $C322. C. On Fri, 2008-07-04 at 19:21 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > > But it turns out Super Extended Basic tries to patch the Disk ROMs! And > > since I'm 'pretending' to be a disk ROM, it was patching over my code.. > > Do you have any details of this (or is it documented somewhere), guess > it would be there in the SECB Revealed disassembily, might be worth > knowing for some of my projects too. > > Cheers. > > Phill. > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 4 14:35:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:35:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco 3 basic blues! In-Reply-To: <1215195972.31404.7.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215120686.1511.16.camel@dev> <200807040302.55743.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <486DFB26.8090706@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <200807041103.05309.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1215194638.31404.5.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486E6A0C.4070104@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1215195972.31404.7.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <1215196546.31404.10.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Fri, 2008-07-04 at 14:26 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > The Super Extended Basic unraveled book was my source - the patch of > Disk Basic begins at $C322. > > C. Sorry, this wasn't entirely clear (busy hacking over here!) - the code in Super Extended Basic that patches the ROM begins at $C322 in the Super Basic ROM. Which locations it actually patches differs based on the version of Disk Basic, but if you read the Super Basic disassembly it becomes clear. C. From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Fri Jul 4 20:59:29 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 19:59:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] VIC0-20 Message-ID: <20080704.211449.2780.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Hello Coco People I just found a cassette tape "An Introduction To Basic: Part 1 " Any takers? Your favorite charge "FREE' John ____________________________________________________________ Learn digital and video photography techniques, lighting and printing. Click now. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oLSqL7MU3siys3YDgHfgdeAtqHoGpFJtNsvdmZ6li328UON/ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 11:14:39 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 11:14:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! Message-ID: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> So after working pretty much dawn till dusk yesterday, and a couple more hours this morning, I've proven that the CoCo 3 at 1.78MHz can indeed read high-density floppies with the 82077AA-1! No HALT required! I've successfully read sectors from all parts of a PC-formatted disk (and verified the data). Of course, for the Coco 256-byte sectors are MUCH preferred; ideally 36 256-byte sectors per track. Has anyone ever heard of such a format? I could use some gap length hints. Also, does anyone know how I might format such a disk under Linux? setfdprm/fdformat doesn't seem to do the trick (fdformat ignores the setfdprm parameters... dumb) C. From jcewy at swbell.net Sat Jul 5 12:35:45 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 11:35:45 -0500 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. IMHO, I think a High Density CoCo OS-9 disk should be formatted the same as an MM/1 HD floppy. The MM/1 uses the WD37C65, and 33 256-byte sectors per track. I don't have any info immediately at hand about gap length. In the MM/1 technical manual the "rates" parameter to dmode is $10. Perhaps this is passed directly to the FDC, and the 37C65 datasheet might give more specific info. If you do decide to manufacture some boards, my temptation level would go sky high. Cost would be a factor for me. PCB only option would be cool. But I may have to download Eagle and see if I can fab a double-sided board. I have a homebrew CNC drill that I've done far too little with so far. I wonder where I can get ahold of the 82077AA. Nice work! JCE Chuck Youse wrote: > So after working pretty much dawn till dusk yesterday, and a couple more > hours this morning, I've proven that the CoCo 3 at 1.78MHz can indeed > read high-density floppies with the 82077AA-1! No HALT required! I've > successfully read sectors from all parts of a PC-formatted disk (and > verified the data). > > Of course, for the Coco 256-byte sectors are MUCH preferred; ideally 36 > 256-byte sectors per track. Has anyone ever heard of such a format? I > could use some gap length hints. Also, does anyone know how I might > format such a disk under Linux? setfdprm/fdformat doesn't seem to do > the trick (fdformat ignores the setfdprm parameters... dumb) > > C. > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 13:07:01 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 13:07:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> Message-ID: <1215277621.31404.24.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 11:35 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. > > IMHO, I think a High Density CoCo OS-9 disk should be formatted the same > as an MM/1 HD floppy. The MM/1 uses the WD37C65, and 33 256-byte > sectors per track. I don't have any info immediately at hand about gap > length. In the MM/1 technical manual the "rates" parameter to dmode is > $10. Perhaps this is passed directly to the FDC, and the 37C65 > datasheet might give more specific info. Hmm, that's a rather odd format. Is that a 5.25" HD floppy or 3.5"? The only problem I have with this is the fact that Linux freaks out when you have a combination of 256-byte sectors and an odd number of sectors per track. And really that only concerns me because one of the main advantages to having this controller is that it makes transport of files between systems much simpler. But really, it's not set in stone; it's all driver-driven at that point. Even differing device descriptors under OS-9 should give you the MM/1<->Coco enjoyment you want. C. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 5 13:08:05 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:08:05 +0100 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> Message-ID: <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Joel Ewy wrote: > Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. I'll second that :) > If you do decide to manufacture some boards, my temptation level would > go sky high. Cost would be a factor for me. PCB only option would be > cool. But I may have to download Eagle and see if I can fab a > double-sided board. I have a homebrew CNC drill that I've done far too > little with so far. I wonder where I can get ahold of the 82077AA. Humm having looked at the board produced by Eagle's auto-router, I think it would be hardish to produce that using DIY methods, either by your CNC, or by the photo etch process (as I use), as there are many through holes that would be almost impossible to hand top solder (specifically the ones for the PLCC). The board would need to be re-routed with this in mind. As a fairly experienced Eagle user I have come to the conclusion that the auto-router is not too good other than for the simplest of jobs and I mostly tend to hand route things, yes it can mean a fair amount of tedious work, it can also mean ripping things and starting again, but overall the finished result will be easier to work with. I do however tend to optimise mostly for DIY photo etching where you don't have plated through holes, though you can of course use component legs for this purpose, using turned pin IC sockets also helps greatly as they can be top soldered, with a little practice, and taking care on the order that you assemble the board. This of course does not matter so much if you are going to have the board made by a board house, as they generally can do plated holes and so this isn't so much of a concern. All IMHO of course. Cheers, Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From jdaggett at gate.net Sat Jul 5 13:18:58 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 13:18:58 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org>, <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> Message-ID: <486F74C2.13919.10FE96@jdaggett.gate.net> Joel If cost is an issue believe me y ou don't want to go off and buy one or two boards from a fab house. Unless yo uare interested in buying them for about $50 a board. Better solution is to have Chuck buy a given quantity of boards and buy a single board off him. Two layer boards the size of the small disk controller card with routing, soldermask and silkscreen will be about $15 per board at 20 board order. james On 5 Jul 2008 at 11:35, Joel Ewy wrote: > Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. > > IMHO, I think a High Density CoCo OS-9 disk should be formatted the > same as an MM/1 HD floppy. The MM/1 uses the WD37C65, and 33 256-byte > sectors per track. I don't have any info immediately at hand about > gap length. In the MM/1 technical manual the "rates" parameter to > dmode is $10. Perhaps this is passed directly to the FDC, and the > 37C65 datasheet might give more specific info. > > If you do decide to manufacture some boards, my temptation level would > go sky high. Cost would be a factor for me. PCB only option would be > cool. But I may have to download Eagle and see if I can fab a > double-sided board. I have a homebrew CNC drill that I've done far > too little with so far. I wonder where I can get ahold of the > 82077AA. > > Nice work! > > JCE > > Chuck Youse wrote: > > So after working pretty much dawn till dusk yesterday, and a couple > > more hours this morning, I've proven that the CoCo 3 at 1.78MHz can > > indeed read high-density floppies with the 82077AA-1! No HALT > > required! I've successfully read sectors from all parts of a > > PC-formatted disk (and verified the data). > > > > Of course, for the Coco 256-byte sectors are MUCH preferred; ideally > > 36 256-byte sectors per track. Has anyone ever heard of such a > > format? I could use some gap length hints. Also, does anyone know > > how I might format such a disk under Linux? setfdprm/fdformat > > doesn't seem to do the trick (fdformat ignores the setfdprm > > parameters... dumb) > > > > C. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1536 - Release Date: > 7/5/2008 10:15 AM > > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 14:15:21 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 14:15:21 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS9 gen (toolshed) Message-ID: <1215281721.31404.29.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> So I'm cobbling (almost literally) together a high-density boot disk for this new controller. Using toolshed, os9 gen keeps placing the boot track on track 17 rather than 34 - an artifact of a hard-coded assumption of 18 sectors/track. Shouldn't it read sectors/track out of LSN0? Any comments? C. From jcewy at swbell.net Sat Jul 5 16:19:27 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 15:19:27 -0500 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <486FD74F.2090404@swbell.net> Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Joel Ewy wrote: >> Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. > > I'll second that :) > >> If you do decide to manufacture some boards, my temptation level would >> go sky high. Cost would be a factor for me. PCB only option would be >> cool. But I may have to download Eagle and see if I can fab a >> double-sided board. I have a homebrew CNC drill that I've done far too >> little with so far. I wonder where I can get ahold of the 82077AA. > > Humm having looked at the board produced by Eagle's auto-router, I > think it would be hardish to produce that using DIY methods, either by > your CNC, or by the photo etch process (as I use), as there are many > through holes that would be almost impossible to hand top solder > (specifically the ones for the PLCC). > Without having looked into it ahead of time, I'm wondering if there's such a thing as a wire-wrap PLCC socket that could be installed with a spacer allowing for top-soldering... Oh, but there are those inside rows... Looking at a PLCC socket, I think one could carefully remove some plastic from the middle of the bottom of the socket in order to get a soldering iron down in there to do the inside rows. Wretched, I know. But I think doable for a one-off board. Hopefully the slightly longer leads wouldn't become little ratio transmitter towers, but I suppose that would be a possibility. I've certainly seen long socket leads used in things like CPU accelerator boards and memory boards for the Amiga 1000, and those running at 8MHz -- though I see a 24MHz crystal in there. > The board would need to be re-routed with this in mind. As a fairly > experienced Eagle user I have come to the conclusion that the > auto-router is not too good other than for the simplest of jobs and I > mostly tend to hand route things, yes it can mean a fair amount of > tedious work, it can also mean ripping things and starting again, but > overall the finished result will be easier to work with. > > I do however tend to optimise mostly for DIY photo etching where you > don't have plated through holes, though you can of course use > component legs for this purpose, using turned pin IC sockets also > helps greatly as they can be top soldered, with a little practice, and > taking care on the order that you assemble the board. > I'm not opposed to the idea of re-laying-out the board to, e.g. put all the inside row connections on the bottom of the board and all the outside connections on the top. But, of course, by the time one's gone to that much effort, buying a board somebody else has had professionally made becomes more attractive. JCE > This of course does not matter so much if you are going to have the > board made by a board house, as they generally can do plated holes and > so this isn't so much of a concern. > > All IMHO of course. > > Cheers, > > Phill. > From jcewy at swbell.net Sat Jul 5 16:47:04 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 15:47:04 -0500 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <1215277621.31404.24.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> <1215277621.31404.24.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <486FDDC8.2050506@swbell.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 11:35 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > >> Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. >> >> IMHO, I think a High Density CoCo OS-9 disk should be formatted the same >> as an MM/1 HD floppy. The MM/1 uses the WD37C65, and 33 256-byte >> sectors per track. I don't have any info immediately at hand about gap >> length. In the MM/1 technical manual the "rates" parameter to dmode is >> $10. Perhaps this is passed directly to the FDC, and the 37C65 >> datasheet might give more specific info. >> > > Hmm, that's a rather odd format. Is that a 5.25" HD floppy or 3.5"? > > This is 3.5" > The only problem I have with this is the fact that Linux freaks out when > you have a combination of 256-byte sectors and an odd number of sectors > per track. And really that only concerns me because one of the main > advantages to having this controller is that it makes transport of files > between systems much simpler. > And that's a good reason. > But really, it's not set in stone; it's all driver-driven at that point. > Even differing device descriptors under OS-9 should give you the > MM/1<->Coco enjoyment you want. > > C. > > True enough. Dmode to the rescue. I remember having several sets of device descriptors hanging around on the CoCo, and even an extra driver that ran the Disto SCII in halt-mode so I could read in 512-byte sectors for the 'rsdos' utility. I had a 'di' descriptor for reading IBM formatted disks (as they still would have been called in those days.). So I could 'rsdos -get -raw /di /h0 filename' or whatever. JCE > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From jdaggett at gate.net Sat Jul 5 18:10:52 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:10:52 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org>, <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net>, <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <486FB92C.19198.184002@jdaggett.gate.net> On 5 Jul 2008 at 18:08, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Joel Ewy wrote: > > Hey Chuck, this is good stuff you're working on. > > I'll second that :) > > > If you do decide to manufacture some boards, my temptation level > > would go sky high. Cost would be a factor for me. PCB only option > > would be cool. But I may have to download Eagle and see if I can > > fab a double-sided board. I have a homebrew CNC drill that I've > > done far too little with so far. I wonder where I can get ahold of > > the 82077AA. > > Humm having looked at the board produced by Eagle's auto-router, I > think it would be hardish to produce that using DIY methods, either by > your CNC, or by the photo etch process (as I use), as there are many > through holes that would be almost impossible to hand top solder > (specifically the ones for the PLCC). > Finally decided to install the freeware version of Eagle and look at the autoroute of the board. My only comment is to nix the autorouter and reroute it by hand. Typical autorouter layout. The PCB needs a bunch of cleanup just to make it. > The board would need to be re-routed with this in mind. As a fairly > experienced Eagle user I have come to the conclusion that the > auto-router is not too good other than for the simplest of jobs and I > mostly tend to hand route things, yes it can mean a fair amount of > tedious work, it can also mean ripping things and starting again, but > overall the finished result will be easier to work with. > > I do however tend to optimise mostly for DIY photo etching where you > don't have plated through holes, though you can of course use > component legs for this purpose, using turned pin IC sockets also > helps greatly as they can be top soldered, with a little practice, and > taking care on the > order that you assemble the board. > > This of course does not matter so much if you are going to have the > board made by a board house, as they generally can do plated holes and > so this isn't so much of a concern. > I would not try and do this other than on a CAD program and through a fab house. james From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sat Jul 5 18:30:19 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:30:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS9 gen (toolshed) In-Reply-To: <1215281721.31404.29.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215281721.31404.29.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <486FF5FB.3010408@worldnet.att.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > So I'm cobbling (almost literally) together a high-density boot disk for > this new controller. Using toolshed, os9 gen keeps placing the boot > track on track 17 rather than 34 - an artifact of a hard-coded > assumption of 18 sectors/track. Shouldn't it read sectors/track out of > LSN0? > > Any comments? > > C. Since 17x2=34 it looks like you may not have told the system adequately how many sides are on the disk or perhaps the correct density. You need to make sure the descriptor for the drive matches the format of the disk. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 18:35:24 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:35:24 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS9 gen (toolshed) In-Reply-To: <486FF5FB.3010408@worldnet.att.net> References: <1215281721.31404.29.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FF5FB.3010408@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1215297325.31404.31.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 18:30 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Since 17x2=34 it looks like you may not have told the system adequately > how many sides are on the disk or perhaps the correct density. You need > to make sure the descriptor for the drive matches the format of the disk. Nope - actually toolshed's os9 gen is hardcoded for 18 sectors/track. The LSN0 information is correct. I 'fixed' it in my local copy but it will need a real fix committed. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 19:01:34 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 19:01:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] More high-density success Message-ID: <1215298894.31404.42.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Well, folks, I think I can officially call the hardware a success. I just booted (partially) NitrOS-9 off a high-density floppy disk - of course it freaks out because the wrong boot module is in the boot track, but that's the next step on my list .. ! Then a polled mode I/O driver (for starters - the no-halt will get tricky, and I want to put the hardware through its paces first). I undercovered a rather nasty issue with the 82077 and its handling of 256-byte sectors. Not a show stopper, but it will make detecting underrun/overrun conditions impossible, which is unfortunate because they're possible if interrupts are disabled for too long - I have a feeling some of the kernel innards of NitrOS-9 will require some lovin' in order to cooperate with this controller - essentially dedicating FIRQ to a pseudo-dma scheme and only disabling it when the stack is invalid. Basically the problem is that this controller requires that the CPU transfer data in or out of it within 320uS of its request. Tight, but not impossible. If anyone wants the details of my scheme, pipe up and I'll bore you with the minutiae.. I've been watching the posts go back and forth, my apologies for not addressing any of them specifically, I've just been busy hacking.. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 19:13:24 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 19:13:24 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FB92C.19198.184002@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> , <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net>, <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <486FB92C.19198.184002@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215299604.31404.44.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 18:10 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > Finally decided to install the freeware version of Eagle and look at the autoroute of the > board. My only comment is to nix the autorouter and reroute it by hand. Typical autorouter > layout. The PCB needs a bunch of cleanup just to make it. Oh, yeah, there's no doubt the layout is crap. But I'm lazy - I put the schematic and layout together in a few hours and sent it off to get fabbed. I wasn't sure if it was going to work or not, but now that it seems to, I may invest the time into routing at least the important bits by hand. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 19:15:30 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 19:15:30 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <486FD74F.2090404@swbell.net> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <486FA2E1.9030501@swbell.net> <486FAA75.3020306@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <486FD74F.2090404@swbell.net> Message-ID: <1215299730.31404.47.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 15:19 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > Hopefully the slightly longer leads wouldn't become little ratio > transmitter towers, but I suppose that would be a possibility. I've > certainly seen long socket leads used in things like CPU accelerator > boards and memory boards for the Amiga 1000, and those running at 8MHz > -- though I see a 24MHz crystal in there. I wouldn't worry about the 24MHz, it's just for clocking for the FDC. As long as you don't use, you know, foot-long wires you should be fine. ;) From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 5 20:04:50 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 20:04:50 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Multi-pak interface and CART* Message-ID: <1215302690.31404.50.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Does CART* only work for the selected slot? I.e., if in a Coco 3, I wanted to be able to generate an interrupt (either IRQ* or FIRQ*, depending upon the GIME settings), is it possible? Are there any limitations (e.g., the slot must be selected)? I don't have an MPI, but I'd like for this thing to work for folks who have 'em, which is probably most .. C. From jdaggett at gate.net Sat Jul 5 22:08:11 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 22:08:11 -0400 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <1215299604.31404.44.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org>, <486FB92C.19198.184002@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215299604.31404.44.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <486FF0CB.14768.F1843F@jdaggett.gate.net> On 5 Jul 2008 at 19:13, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 18:10 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > > Finally decided to install the freeware version of Eagle and look at > > the autoroute of the board. My only comment is to nix the autorouter > > and reroute it by hand. Typical autorouter layout. The PCB needs a > > bunch of cleanup just to make it. > > Oh, yeah, there's no doubt the layout is crap. But I'm lazy - I put > the schematic and layout together in a few hours and sent it off to > get fabbed. I wasn't sure if it was going to work or not, but now > that it seems to, I may invest the time into routing at least the > important bits by hand. > > C. Chuck Please don't take offense. The only decent autorouter that I have ever used was Spectra, a CCT router. Autorouters have their place. I am used to doing very high frequency RF layout and critical digital layout. I have experience in layout for RF and critical EMI su ppression. So that tends to bias my opinion on autorouters. james From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sat Jul 5 23:39:42 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 23:39:42 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Multi-pak interface and CART* In-Reply-To: <1215302690.31404.50.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215302690.31404.50.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <200807052339.42881.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Saturday 05 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >Does CART* only work for the selected slot? I.e., if in a Coco 3, I >wanted to be able to generate an interrupt (either IRQ* or FIRQ*, >depending upon the GIME settings), is it possible? Are there any >limitations (e.g., the slot must be selected)? In a stock MPI, yes. One of its 2 major design flaws IMO. >I don't have an MPI, but I'd like for this thing to work for folks who >have 'em, which is probably most .. Generally speaking Chuck, if the usual fix for lost IRQ's has been done to the MPI, which consists of jumpering all 4 card sockets pin 8's together, and removing 3 of the 4 IRQ pullup resistors along the front of the pcb, then the CART* problem is a total non-issue, at least for os9/nitros9. By adding the jumpering, an IRQ from any slot gets through regardless of the state of $FF7F or the slide switch. You were concerned with IRQ response times in an earlier msg. While I was working on rzsz a decade+ back, I had rigged my scope up to see what those times were, and generally, with a jumpered MPI, any interrupt generated by the 6551 was at least serviced with a data read to clear the IRQ in around 16 microseconds, with an occasionally long lag (I think it was writing to disk at the time, or possibly scrolling a screen) of about 150 microseconds, so if you can handle a 320 u-s delay, I'd say you were pretty much home free. I never saw a response any longer than that. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) From goosey at virgo.sdc.org Sun Jul 6 05:13:19 2008 From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey) Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 03:13:19 -0600 Subject: [Coco] HD floppy controller update: success! In-Reply-To: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215270879.31404.17.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <20080706091319.GA17323@virgo.sdc.org> On Sat, Jul 05, 2008 at 11:14:39AM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > format such a disk under Linux? setfdprm/fdformat doesn't seem to do > the trick (fdformat ignores the setfdprm parameters... dumb) I was going to recommend investigating "superformat", the formatter that comes with setfdprm and the rest of the fdutils, but I looked at the info page and it doesn't support <512byte sectors. :-( Perhaps you have a newer/older/more capable version though. good luck Willard -- Willard Goosey goosey at sdc.org Socorro, New Mexico, USA I search my heart and find Cimmeria, land of Darkness and the Night. -- R.E. Howard From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 10:50:08 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 10:50:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] service manuals - coco 3 / MPI Message-ID: <1215355808.31404.64.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Hi folks.. does anyone have electronic copies of these, or paper copies they're willing to sell? C. From boisy at boisypitre.com Sun Jul 6 11:04:26 2008 From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre) Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 10:04:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Cloud-9 Lab South stuff for sale Message-ID: <45F1744B-C07D-4E5F-9753-8D7147129F11@boisypitre.com> All, I am doing some rearranging and cleaning around Lab South and have collected a bit of CoCo stuff that I can get rid of. COCO RGB MONITOR: - 25" Sony PVM-2530 Professional Monitor modified for CoCo 3 RGB Input. This is a GREAT monitor, HUGE and delivers a SHARP picture. Includes cable. VIDEO TAPES: - MM/1 Promotional VHS - Compiler CoCo Video Magazine (3 tapes) on VHS - Pacific Northwest 1992 CoCo Fest on VHS - Mid-America CoCo Fest 1993 on VHS Take the whole lot for $100 + shipping (warning, the monitor is heavy, so it will ship via freight. Will have to get back with you on a shipping quote) Boisy From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 14:20:19 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:20:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs Message-ID: <1215368419.31404.76.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Assuming that no one has a schematic/service manual for the MPI, I don't suppose anyone has enough knowledge to give me a specification for it? Point being I'd like to make a clone of it. C. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 6 15:01:07 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:01:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Cloud-9 Lab South stuff for sale In-Reply-To: <45F1744B-C07D-4E5F-9753-8D7147129F11@boisypitre.com> References: <45F1744B-C07D-4E5F-9753-8D7147129F11@boisypitre.com> Message-ID: <20080706190120.6D65820A33@qs281.pair.com> At 10:04 AM 7/6/2008, you wrote: >All, > >I am doing some rearranging and cleaning around Lab South and have >collected a bit of CoCo stuff that I can get rid of. > >COCO RGB MONITOR: >- 25" Sony PVM-2530 Professional Monitor modified for CoCo 3 RGB >Input. This is a GREAT monitor, HUGE and delivers a SHARP picture. >Includes cable. > >VIDEO TAPES: >- MM/1 Promotional VHS >- Compiler CoCo Video Magazine (3 tapes) on VHS >- Pacific Northwest 1992 CoCo Fest on VHS >- Mid-America CoCo Fest 1993 on VHS > >Take the whole lot for $100 + shipping (warning, the monitor is >heavy, so it will ship via freight. Will have to get back with you on >a shipping quote) > >Boisy Boisy, remember that UPS ships up to 150 lbs. and can be crated with wood or whatever you want even for normal ground delivery. You could build a crate out of spare wood and use thick stryofoam padding for the inside. The shipping label can be stuck to the wood somewhere. From jdaggett at gate.net Sun Jul 6 15:56:34 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 15:56:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs In-Reply-To: <1215368419.31404.76.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215368419.31404.76.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <4870EB32.21305.49B2E1@jdaggett.gate.net> Chuck I have a photo copy of the service manual for the 26-3024 model of the MPI. I could scan it and send it if you want. It really does not list much specificatios. Mostly troule shooting techniques and limited theory of operation. james On 6 Jul 2008 at 14:20, Chuck Youse wrote: > Assuming that no one has a schematic/service manual for the MPI, I > don't suppose anyone has enough knowledge to give me a specification > for it? Point being I'd like to make a clone of it. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1537 - Release Date: > 7/6/2008 5:26 AM > > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 16:08:33 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 16:08:33 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs In-Reply-To: <4870EB32.21305.49B2E1@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215368419.31404.76.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <4870EB32.21305.49B2E1@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215374913.31404.79.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 15:56 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > Chuck > > I have a photo copy of the service manual for the 26-3024 model of the > MPI. I could scan it and send it if you want. It really does not list much > specificatios. Mostly troule shooting techniques and limited theory of > operation. > > james If it's not too much trouble, we'd probably all benefit from an electronic copy - I can host it somewhere, I should begin to slap together an archive - Side question: did the 26-3024 use a PAL? Thanks C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 16:13:39 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 16:13:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update Message-ID: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Hope I'm not spamming y'all, just trying to keep you all in the loop. So I slapped together an OS-9 booter for the 82077 - I'll post it on the web page shortly - and I can successfully load the boot file via the controller. NitrOS-9 still craps out because it can't open /dd, but that's for another day, I guess. The only serious problem at this point is what can only be termed abysmal performance. During the boot process, I'm only getting slightly more than 1Kb/s (essentially 4-5 sectors/second) on the reads. I've tracked it down to the period of time between when I issue the read to the controller and the time it exits non-DMA mode (once the transfer is complete). Ideas: 1. Interleaving? 2. Head load/unload times? I wonder if anyone else has more experience with the nerdlies floppy drives and might be able to lend some insight. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 16:25:33 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 16:25:33 -0400 Subject: [Coco] source code for controller Message-ID: <1215375933.31404.87.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Now available at http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/fdc/index.html The ROM and the NitrOS-9 boot module, if anyone wants to take a peek (and/or figure out what I'm doing wrong to get such terrible performance!) C. From jps.subscriptions at gmail.com Sun Jul 6 16:31:03 2008 From: jps.subscriptions at gmail.com (J.P. Samson) Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 14:31:03 -0600 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs In-Reply-To: <1215374913.31404.79.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215368419.31404.76.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <4870EB32.21305.49B2E1@jdaggett.gate.net> <1215374913.31404.79.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: On Jul 6, 2008, at 2:08 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 15:56 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >> Chuck >> >> I have a photo copy of the service manual for the 26-3024 model of >> the >> MPI. I could scan it and send it if you want. It really does not >> list much >> specificatios. Mostly troule shooting techniques and limited theory >> of >> operation. >> >> james > > If it's not too much trouble, we'd probably all benefit from an > electronic copy - I can host it somewhere, I should begin to slap > together an archive - > > Side question: did the 26-3024 use a PAL? Yes, the 26-3024 uses a PAL. Many of us have upgraded the compatibility of this model with the CoCo3 using a GAL. I believe the users' manual for the 26-3124 Multipak includes the schematic. -- JP From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 17:59:10 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 17:59:10 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 16:13 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > The only serious problem at this point is what can only be termed > abysmal performance. During the boot process, I'm only getting slightly > more than 1Kb/s (essentially 4-5 sectors/second) on the reads. I've > tracked it down to the period of time between when I issue the read to > the controller and the time it exits non-DMA mode (once the transfer is > complete). Ideas: The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at 300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering anymore? ;) C. From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 6 18:14:10 2008 From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 18:14:10 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 17:59:10 -0400, Chuck Youse had a flock of green cheek conures squawk out: >On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 16:13 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > >> The only serious problem at this point is what can only be termed >> abysmal performance. During the boot process, I'm only getting slightly >> more than 1Kb/s (essentially 4-5 sectors/second) on the reads. I've >> tracked it down to the period of time between when I issue the read to >> the controller and the time it exits non-DMA mode (once the transfer is >> complete). Ideas: > >The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving >issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by >Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the >neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at >300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. > >Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering >anymore? ;) > It does sound like the interleave is set wrong. Back when hard drives big as a Kiev 6c, there were many programs to redo the interleave to speed up the access. Stephen -- From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 18:19:31 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 18:19:31 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <1215382771.13879.4.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 18:14 -0400, Stephen Castello wrote: > It does sound like the interleave is set wrong. Back when hard drives > big as a Kiev 6c, there were many programs to redo the interleave to > speed up the access. > > Stephen Indeed it was. I just did a quick check with a 2:1 interleave, and WHAM, performance increased by an order of magnitude. Thanks for listening :) C. From brucewcalkins at charter.net Sun Jul 6 18:17:57 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 18:17:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <234BB241E28140519B4887701258B80A@speedy> > The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving > issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by > Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the > neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at > 300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. > > Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering > anymore? ;) > > C. Some are listening, but don't know enough to add to the thread. Please keep up the work and keeping us posted. ~BWC~ From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Jul 6 18:36:52 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 17:36:52 -0500 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <48714904.4020102@swbell.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > Hope I'm not spamming y'all, just trying to keep you all in the loop. > > This kind of stuff is the very antithesis of spam on this list. JCE From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 6 18:32:01 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 23:32:01 +0100 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <487147E1.80307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 16:13 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving > issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by > Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the > neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at > 300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. > > Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering > anymore? ;) Yeah that seems reasonable, IIRC stock RS/Dragondos uses a 1:4 interleave, and most other DOSes of that vintage also seemed to use interleaving other than 1:1, which is as you say prolly what Linux is laying down when formatting, which is pretty much the reason that I always format CoCo/Dragon disks in the actual machine and then write them in Linux, because interleave is set when formatting, linux will write it correctly, however it always formats with 1:1, dunno if there is a way of over-riding this tho. Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 18:52:55 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 18:52:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <487147E1.80307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <487147E1.80307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1215384775.13879.10.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 23:32 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Yeah that seems reasonable, IIRC stock RS/Dragondos uses a 1:4 > interleave, and most other DOSes of that vintage also seemed to use > interleaving other than 1:1, which is as you say prolly what Linux is > laying down when formatting, which is pretty much the reason that I > always format CoCo/Dragon disks in the actual machine and then write > them in Linux, because interleave is set when formatting, linux will > write it correctly, however it always formats with 1:1, dunno if there > is a way of over-riding this tho. As is typical of Linux, you can configure everything under the sun, except what you need. The format interleave is more-or-less hardcoded. >From setup_format_params() in floppy.c: /* determine interleave */ il = 1; if (_floppy->fmt_gap < 0x22) il++; Grrrr. I wonder if I should use the extra space in this ROM (which does nothing but load the first 18 sectors from track 34 to $2600 and jumps to $2602) to add a menu of random nerdlies, including a FORMAT command. That won't be all that useful after I finish the OS-9 drivers, though. Or I wonder if I should patch floppy.c in Linux. That's the sort of thing that might even prove useful and should end up in the kernel proper. But Linux has gotten so big these days (code-wise and community-wise) I don't even know who to submit the patch to.. :) C. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 6 22:52:20 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 22:52:20 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <200807062252.20687.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 06 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 16:13 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: >> The only serious problem at this point is what can only be termed >> abysmal performance. During the boot process, I'm only getting slightly >> more than 1Kb/s (essentially 4-5 sectors/second) on the reads. I've >> tracked it down to the period of time between when I issue the read to >> the controller and the time it exits non-DMA mode (once the transfer is >> complete). Ideas: > >The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving >issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by >Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the >neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at >300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. > >Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering >anymore? ;) > >C. > I think you've hit it Chuck. The std interleave for os9 is 3, and I have used as high as 8 when using bru for backups. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) In spite of everything, I still believe that people are good at heart. -- Ann Frank From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 6 22:55:35 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 22:55:35 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <1215384775.13879.10.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <487147E1.80307@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1215384775.13879.10.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <200807062255.35758.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 06 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >On Sun, 2008-07-06 at 23:32 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: >> Yeah that seems reasonable, IIRC stock RS/Dragondos uses a 1:4 >> interleave, and most other DOSes of that vintage also seemed to use >> interleaving other than 1:1, which is as you say prolly what Linux is >> laying down when formatting, which is pretty much the reason that I >> always format CoCo/Dragon disks in the actual machine and then write >> them in Linux, because interleave is set when formatting, linux will >> write it correctly, however it always formats with 1:1, dunno if there >> is a way of over-riding this tho. > >As is typical of Linux, you can configure everything under the sun, >except what you need. The format interleave is more-or-less hardcoded. >From setup_format_params() in floppy.c: > > /* determine interleave */ > il = 1; > if (_floppy->fmt_gap < 0x22) > il++; > >Grrrr. > >I wonder if I should use the extra space in this ROM (which does nothing >but load the first 18 sectors from track 34 to $2600 and jumps to $2602) >to add a menu of random nerdlies, including a FORMAT command. That >won't be all that useful after I finish the OS-9 drivers, though. > >Or I wonder if I should patch floppy.c in Linux. That's the sort of >thing that might even prove useful and should end up in the kernel >proper. But Linux has gotten so big these days (code-wise and >community-wise) I don't even know who to submit the patch to.. :) > >C. > Ask on lkml, they will tell you who to send the patches to. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Q: Why do firemen wear red suspenders? A: To conform with departmental regulations concerning uniform dress. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 6 23:01:39 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 23:01:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 Message-ID: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> Hey all, Just a change of topic. I've never even *seen* a TC-9, can't even find a picture of one via Google. Anyone own one? Have any technical information on them? I'd love to get my hands on some info on this cousin of the Coco 3 - or even a machine itself (fat chance.. I know..) Schematics would be _superb_ .. C. From sklammer at gmail.com Mon Jul 7 00:00:45 2008 From: sklammer at gmail.com (Shain Klammer) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 00:00:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <48714904.4020102@swbell.net> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <48714904.4020102@swbell.net> Message-ID: <3925f0b0807062100g3ff6ec1bxd8ae0d774ba85650@mail.gmail.com> I'll second this... Chuck (et. al.) please keep it coming! I find it very interesting to follow along with your progress. sk 2008/7/6 Joel Ewy : > Chuck Youse wrote: > > Hope I'm not spamming y'all, just trying to keep you all in the loop. > > > > > This kind of stuff is the very antithesis of spam on this list. > > JCE > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From devries.bob at gmail.com Mon Jul 7 03:11:21 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 08:11:21 +0100 Subject: [Coco] service manuals - coco 3 / MPI In-Reply-To: <1215355808.31404.64.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1215355808.31404.64.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <8af15320807070011s64a7169dn919ea772cc071828@mail.gmail.com> The service manual for the coco3 is on the maltedmedia ftp site. There's a user manual for the MPI there too, with a schematic. On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 3:50 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > Hi folks.. does anyone have electronic copies of these, or paper copies > they're willing to sell? > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 7 10:24:05 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:24:05 -0600 Subject: [Coco] floppy controller update In-Reply-To: <200807062252.20687.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1215375219.31404.85.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <1215381550.13879.1.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <200807062252.20687.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 20:52:20 -0600, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 06 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >> [...] >> The more I think about this, the more I think it must be an interleaving >> issue. Consider that the sectors are most likely laid out in order by >> Linux's fdformat. Consider that I appear to be getting something in the >> neighborhood of one sector every 200-250ms, and then consider that at >> 300RPMs, one revolution takes about 200ms. Bingo. >> >> Does that seem right? Is anyone even listening to my jabbering >> anymore? ;) >> >> C. >> > I think you've hit it Chuck. The std interleave for os9 is 3, and I > have used > as high as 8 when using bru for backups. > Under NitrOS9, the best we could get was 2:1. We were close to 1:1, but not quite enough. If one changed the driver to do read track (instead of sector), and buffered it all, then one should be able to use 1:1. Would make the driver more complicated, though. -- L. Curtis Boyle From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 7 10:27:14 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:27:14 -0600 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> Message-ID: On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 21:01:39 -0600, Chuck Youse wrote: > Hey all, > > Just a change of topic. I've never even *seen* a TC-9, can't even find > a picture of one via Google. Anyone own one? Have any technical > information on them? I'd love to get my hands on some info on this > cousin of the Coco 3 - or even a machine itself (fat chance.. I know..) > > Schematics would be _superb_ .. > > C. I have one, althought I haven't ran it in years. Mark Marlette does as well (or, at least, did). I believe Allen Huffman does have a picture of mine on one of his Cocofest pictures sites, and Mark should still have copies of the schematic, although, from what I remember him telling me (I'm not much of a hardware guy), it didn't quite match the actual boards as manufactured. It was designed by Bob Puppo (of IBM Xt/Coco keyboard fame). -- L. Curtis Boyle From jcewy at swbell.net Mon Jul 7 11:06:59 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 10:06:59 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> I have a TC-9, Chuck. I have to say I've never been able to put it to very good use. It (mine at least) was always a bit flaky in operation. One of the main problems I had with it was that I could never get a hard drive hooked up to it. For some reason, it was incompatible with the Disto SCII, which I already had. So no no-halt floppy, and no 4-in-1 for RTC and SCSI. Before I got that figured out, I bought an MM/1, and the Tomcat sat mostly unused. I bought just the (populated) boards for the TC-9 (as I did for the MM/1), so I had to supply my own case, power supply, keyboard, drives, and even cables. One irritating mis-feature of the TC-9 was that the expansion bus header pins were arranged for some kind of crazy backwards-wired ribbon cable. When I made my own I had to separate the ribbon conductors into pairs, twist each pair, and then crimp that in an IDC. What on Earth they were thinking when they designed it that way is way beyond my comprehension. Maybe my homebrew cable is a factor in its unreliability. I don't know. I don't think I have a schematic, but I can try to scan the manual I do have. Maybe I can take some pictures of the beast, too. Crazy question: Does anybody know if there's any danger of static discharging through stuff you put on a flatbed scanner? Specifically, is it safe to scan floppy disks? If the consensus seems to be that there's no danger, then I'll scan the boot disk so everybody can see what the label looks like. Eventually I should make the other kind of image of the floppy and copy the EPROMs. Since they are EPROMs and not masked ROMs, those really should be backed up anyway. JCE Chuck Youse wrote: > Hey all, > > Just a change of topic. I've never even *seen* a TC-9, can't even find > a picture of one via Google. Anyone own one? Have any technical > information on them? I'd love to get my hands on some info on this > cousin of the Coco 3 - or even a machine itself (fat chance.. I know..) > > Schematics would be _superb_ .. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From dml_68 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 7 11:06:45 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 08:06:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Coco3.Com Forums In-Reply-To: <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> Message-ID: <564077.74285.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Over the last 24 hours I have been un-able to connect to the forums over at coco3.com. is anyone else having the same problem? I need my coco fix.. From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jul 7 11:40:38 2008 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 11:40:38 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco3.Com Forums In-Reply-To: <564077.74285.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <564077.74285.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5631e580807070840x47202bf6ia8fc67c077a8af41@mail.gmail.com> Just tried the forums at CoCo3.com - no problems accessing... -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Derek wrote: > Over the last 24 hours I have been un-able to connect to the forums over at > coco3.com. is anyone else having the same problem? I need my coco fix.. > > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 12:44:13 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 12:44:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] service manuals - coco 3 / MPI In-Reply-To: <8af15320807070011s64a7169dn919ea772cc071828@mail.gmail.com> References: <1215355808.31404.64.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <8af15320807070011s64a7169dn919ea772cc071828@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1215449053.21996.5.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 08:11 +0100, Bob Devries wrote: > The service manual for the coco3 is on the maltedmedia ftp site. There's a > user manual for the MPI there too, with a schematic. > D'oh! I get the stupid award.. :) C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 13:14:09 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:14:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> Message-ID: <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 10:06 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > I have a TC-9, Chuck. I have to say I've never been able to put it to > very good use. It (mine at least) was always a bit flaky in operation. > One of the main problems I had with it was that I could never get a hard > drive hooked up to it. For some reason, it was incompatible with the > Disto SCII, which I already had. So no no-halt floppy, and no 4-in-1 > for RTC and SCSI. Before I got that figured out, I bought an MM/1, and > the Tomcat sat mostly unused. Man, I'm a tad bit jealous - I want! I want! :) And btw, building a hard-drive interface for the thing would mostly likely be a piece of cake.. it doesn't get much easier than an IDE interface. Does it have any custom chips on it that you're aware of? One big problem with making a Coco 3 clone is the GIME. If the TC-9 did most of the naughty in PAL/GALs and discrete logic, then I might try to resurrect it.. The Coco 3 is a nice machine, but for 'serious' work it has some limitations, the poor keyboard, case, RS-DOS/Coco2 compatibility stuff ... My ideal NitrOS-9 machine would have no bells and whistles on-board, and just lots of expansion slots. I'm debating using a 63C09 and creating a custom MMU (which would cause problems with NitrOS-9, because I'd use a simpler mechanism than the GIME) or putting these handfuls 68008s or 68000/68010s to use and making NitrOS/68000.. I'm leaning towards the latter, if only because that eliminates the need for a DAT, and OS-9 lost a lot of its elegance when the MMU was introduced (Level 1 -> 2). But if I had schematics for a TC-9, well then .. I might steal the design.. wonder if Mr. Puppo would mind. C. From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 13:16:15 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 12:16:15 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707121615.fdpq757xckcck844@webmail.frontiernet.net> Curtis/Chuck, I indeed still have mine. In my collection. :) Mark Quoting "L. Curtis Boyle" : > On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 21:01:39 -0600, Chuck Youse > wrote: > >> Hey all, >> >> Just a change of topic. I've never even *seen* a TC-9, can't even find >> a picture of one via Google. Anyone own one? Have any technical >> information on them? I'd love to get my hands on some info on this >> cousin of the Coco 3 - or even a machine itself (fat chance.. I know..) >> >> Schematics would be _superb_ .. >> >> C. > I have one, althought I haven't ran it in years. Mark Marlette does as > well (or, at least, did). I believe Allen Huffman does have a picture > of mine on one of his Cocofest pictures sites, and Mark should still > have copies of the schematic, although, from what I remember him > telling me (I'm not much of a hardware guy), it didn't quite match the > actual boards as manufactured. It was designed by Bob Puppo (of IBM > Xt/Coco keyboard fame). > > -- > L. Curtis Boyle > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 13:17:53 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:17:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 development system Message-ID: <1215451073.21996.20.camel@dev> Here's another stupid question. I've perused the RTSI archive and can't seem to find the OS-9 Development system. Is it around anywhere? Scred and the debugger would be rad as I'll be moving my development to the Coco soon. C. From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 13:18:48 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 12:18:48 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707121848.fbx8lsbbwgksggw8@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, As I recall the TC-9 did use the GIME. Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 10:06 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: >> I have a TC-9, Chuck. I have to say I've never been able to put it to >> very good use. It (mine at least) was always a bit flaky in operation. >> One of the main problems I had with it was that I could never get a hard >> drive hooked up to it. For some reason, it was incompatible with the >> Disto SCII, which I already had. So no no-halt floppy, and no 4-in-1 >> for RTC and SCSI. Before I got that figured out, I bought an MM/1, and >> the Tomcat sat mostly unused. > > Man, I'm a tad bit jealous - I want! I want! :) And btw, building a > hard-drive interface for the thing would mostly likely be a piece of > cake.. it doesn't get much easier than an IDE interface. > > Does it have any custom chips on it that you're aware of? One big > problem with making a Coco 3 clone is the GIME. If the TC-9 did most of > the naughty in PAL/GALs and discrete logic, then I might try to > resurrect it.. The Coco 3 is a nice machine, but for 'serious' work it > has some limitations, the poor keyboard, case, RS-DOS/Coco2 > compatibility stuff ... > > My ideal NitrOS-9 machine would have no bells and whistles on-board, and > just lots of expansion slots. I'm debating using a 63C09 and creating a > custom MMU (which would cause problems with NitrOS-9, because I'd use a > simpler mechanism than the GIME) or putting these handfuls 68008s or > 68000/68010s to use and making NitrOS/68000.. I'm leaning towards the > latter, if only because that eliminates the need for a DAT, and OS-9 > lost a lot of its elegance when the MMU was introduced (Level 1 -> 2). > > But if I had schematics for a TC-9, well then .. I might steal the > design.. wonder if Mr. Puppo would mind. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 13:23:14 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:23:14 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707121848.fbx8lsbbwgksggw8@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <20080707121848.fbx8lsbbwgksggw8@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1215451394.21996.23.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 12:18 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > As I recall the TC-9 did use the GIME. > > Mark Hah, what did they do, buy the surplus from Tandy? :) I guess that means that the GIME can handle a 32MHz crystal, too.. oooooh. Guess I'll sacrifice the video display for some added speed. I do have all these 68B45s, too.. video board time .. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 13:54:38 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:54:38 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI question Message-ID: <1215453278.21996.26.camel@dev> Ok, so I know that multi-paks had some sort of problem with the Coco 3, requiring a modification to the PAL - something to do with conflicts with the GIME. As far as I can tell, the MPI only uses address FF7F - did it only partially decode and thus overlap with the GIME? Or was there a different problem? C. From jcewy at swbell.net Mon Jul 7 14:13:37 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:13:37 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215451394.21996.23.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <20080707121848.fbx8lsbbwgksggw8@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215451394.21996.23.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48725CD1.8030101@swbell.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 12:18 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > >> Chuck, >> >> As I recall the TC-9 did use the GIME. >> >> Mark >> > > Hah, what did they do, buy the surplus from Tandy? :) > > Something like that, yes. > I guess that means that the GIME can handle a 32MHz crystal, too.. > oooooh. Guess I'll sacrifice the video display for some added speed. I know they tweaked the speed a bit, but it did still use the GIME's video on a CM-8 or similar. > I > do have all these 68B45s, too.. video board time .. > > C. > > > Hmm... JCE > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From jcewy at swbell.net Mon Jul 7 14:22:19 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:22:19 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 10:06 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > >> I have a TC-9, Chuck. I have to say I've never been able to put it to >> very good use. It (mine at least) was always a bit flaky in operation. >> One of the main problems I had with it was that I could never get a hard >> drive hooked up to it. For some reason, it was incompatible with the >> Disto SCII, which I already had. So no no-halt floppy, and no 4-in-1 >> for RTC and SCSI. Before I got that figured out, I bought an MM/1, and >> the Tomcat sat mostly unused. >> > > Man, I'm a tad bit jealous - I want! I want! :) And btw, building a > hard-drive interface for the thing would mostly likely be a piece of > cake.. it doesn't get much easier than an IDE interface. > > I have a Glenside IDE interface that I have sometimes thought of trying. > Does it have any custom chips on it that you're aware of? One big > problem with making a Coco 3 clone is the GIME. If the TC-9 did most of > the naughty in PAL/GALs and discrete logic, then I might try to > resurrect it.. The Coco 3 is a nice machine, but for 'serious' work it > has some limitations, the poor keyboard, case, RS-DOS/Coco2 > compatibility stuff ... > It uses a GIME, some TTL chips, and the DAT board from a Disto 1M upgrade. A cursory glance reveals no PALs or GALs. > My ideal NitrOS-9 machine would have no bells and whistles on-board, and > just lots of expansion slots. I'm debating using a 63C09 and creating a > custom MMU (which would cause problems with NitrOS-9, because I'd use a > simpler mechanism than the GIME) or putting these handfuls 68008s or > 68000/68010s to use and making NitrOS/68000.. I'm leaning towards the > latter, if only because that eliminates the need for a DAT, and OS-9 > lost a lot of its elegance when the MMU was introduced (Level 1 -> 2). > > But if I had schematics for a TC-9, well then .. I might steal the > design.. wonder if Mr. Puppo would mind. > > I also have a couple of Motorola 6809 (not 6809E) EXORBUS boards, which are essentially SBCs that can be plugged into a bus to hook up to other stuff. I haven't done much with them yet, but I have looked into what it would take to run OS-9 from ROMs. They have a bunch of sockets that can be jumpered to accept (EP)ROMs of various capacities or SRAM chips. No MMU or DRAM controller, but those things could be added on an external board. I do have full schematics for these boards in the Motorola docs. I told somebody on this list (Willard Goosey?) that I would scan the docs sometime. I haven't done it yet, but haven't forgotten either. So maybe it's time to do a bunch of scanning... JCE > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 14:39:26 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:39:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> Message-ID: <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 13:22 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > It uses a GIME, some TTL chips, and the DAT board from a Disto 1M > upgrade. A cursory glance reveals no PALs or GALs. I have some 74S189s (16x4 static RAMs) that, in pairs, would make for a very GIME-like MMU (with 2MB of addressable space), minus the FExx fixed-page and always-map-FFEx-to-ROM features. My concern about designing such a system is the amount of modification that would be required to NitrOS-9 - in Level II in particular, the NitrOS team have made a lot of assumptions about the hardware platform and these references aren't really localized to one specific place. This isn't a criticism, their aim was "make it fast on a CoCo 3", a goal they've consistently met admirably, but that necessarily means a sacrifice of portability. It almost seems more straightforward to take NitrOS-9 Level 1 and port it to the 68000. I wonder if Radisys would take note of that project and get itchy as it could conceivably compete with their (still-current) OS9/68000 product, though it would probably differ in some significant ways. With a 68008 @ 8MHz, there would be a noticeable (but not extravagant) increase in speed. There's no complexity associated with a DAT or the ugliness that that introduced to Level II. The upgrade path to a 16MHz 68000 (still available, mind you) is largely brainless, and that provides 16MB+ of memory space. All of this while still maintaining a _very_ hackable system for good fun. > > > I also have a couple of Motorola 6809 (not 6809E) EXORBUS boards, which > are essentially SBCs that can be plugged into a bus to hook up to other > stuff. I haven't done much with them yet, but I have looked into what > it would take to run OS-9 from ROMs. They have a bunch of sockets that > can be jumpered to accept (EP)ROMs of various capacities or SRAM chips. > No MMU or DRAM controller, but those things could be added on an > external board. I do have full schematics for these boards in the > Motorola docs. I told somebody on this list (Willard Goosey?) that I > would scan the docs sometime. I haven't done it yet, but haven't > forgotten either. So maybe it's time to do a bunch of scanning... A basic 6809 system is rather easy to construct - a non-DAT system with 64K of RAM to run Level-1 would be a one-day project, assuming you have the parts. Might be more trouble than it's worth to try to use those EXORBUS boards, who knows. C. From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 14:42:43 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:42:43 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI question In-Reply-To: <1215453278.21996.26.camel@dev> References: <1215453278.21996.26.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48722B63.1696.189F87@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 13:54, Chuck Youse wrote: > Ok, so I know that multi-paks had some sort of problem with the Coco > 3, requiring a modification to the PAL - something to do with > conflicts with the GIME. As far as I can tell, the MPI only uses > address FF7F - did it only partially decode and thus overlap with the > GIME? Or was there a different problem? > > C. |-------------------- The later model sof the MPI uses $FF7F. If I remember correctly the original MPI uses $FF9F to do slot switch. This conflicts with the GIME's Horizontal Offset register. There is another conflict that I am not familiar with. The GIME chip knows when and where the MPU addresses anything within the 64K memory map of the 6809. The internal registers to the GIME chip are at $FF90 to $FFDF. Also the GIME chip mirrors the PIA registers at $FF00 - $FF03 AND $FF20 - $FF23. james From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 7 14:53:56 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 14:53:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 development system References: <1215451073.21996.20.camel@dev> Message-ID: > Here's another stupid question. I've perused the RTSI archive and can't > seem to find the OS-9 Development system. Is it around anywhere? Scred > and the debugger would be rad as I'll be moving my development to the > Coco soon. > > C. I have seen it somewhere on-line. Just where I can't recall. I am searching my hard drives for clues now. ~BWC~ From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 15:07:55 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:07:55 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, 189's last check were not in production. I made my first 2meg board with those and have since switched to CPLD design. Rocket was the name as I recall of Chris Burke's project. I recall it used the 68008 as well. Not enough orders to make the board. Details foggy..... Mark Cloud-9 68008 Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 13:22 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: >> Chuck Youse wrote: >> It uses a GIME, some TTL chips, and the DAT board from a Disto 1M >> upgrade. A cursory glance reveals no PALs or GALs. > > I have some 74S189s (16x4 static RAMs) that, in pairs, would make for a > very GIME-like MMU (with 2MB of addressable space), minus the FExx > fixed-page and always-map-FFEx-to-ROM features. > > My concern about designing such a system is the amount of modification > that would be required to NitrOS-9 - in Level II in particular, the > NitrOS team have made a lot of assumptions about the hardware platform > and these references aren't really localized to one specific place. > This isn't a criticism, their aim was "make it fast on a CoCo 3", a goal > they've consistently met admirably, but that necessarily means a > sacrifice of portability. > > It almost seems more straightforward to take NitrOS-9 Level 1 and port > it to the 68000. I wonder if Radisys would take note of that project > and get itchy as it could conceivably compete with their (still-current) > OS9/68000 product, though it would probably differ in some significant > ways. > > With a 68008 @ 8MHz, there would be a noticeable (but not extravagant) > increase in speed. There's no complexity associated with a DAT or the > ugliness that that introduced to Level II. The upgrade path to a 16MHz > 68000 (still available, mind you) is largely brainless, and that > provides 16MB+ of memory space. All of this while still maintaining a > _very_ hackable system for good fun. > >> > >> I also have a couple of Motorola 6809 (not 6809E) EXORBUS boards, which >> are essentially SBCs that can be plugged into a bus to hook up to other >> stuff. I haven't done much with them yet, but I have looked into what >> it would take to run OS-9 from ROMs. They have a bunch of sockets that >> can be jumpered to accept (EP)ROMs of various capacities or SRAM chips. >> No MMU or DRAM controller, but those things could be added on an >> external board. I do have full schematics for these boards in the >> Motorola docs. I told somebody on this list (Willard Goosey?) that I >> would scan the docs sometime. I haven't done it yet, but haven't >> forgotten either. So maybe it's time to do a bunch of scanning... > > A basic 6809 system is rather easy to construct - a non-DAT system with > 64K of RAM to run Level-1 would be a one-day project, assuming you have > the parts. Might be more trouble than it's worth to try to use those > EXORBUS boards, who knows. > > C. > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 7 15:19:44 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:19:44 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 development system References: <1215451073.21996.20.camel@dev> Message-ID: <3BFE32E686004E4AA842DCD31BF13FAA@speedy> > Here's another stupid question. I've perused the RTSI archive and can't > seem to find the OS-9 Development system. Is it around anywhere? Scred > and the debugger would be rad as I'll be moving my development to the > Coco soon. > > C. O.K. It is or was on-line at one point in time. I found reference to DSK files of both disks and a PDF of the manual. However, I do not have any record of who had them. ~BWC~ From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 15:23:22 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:23:22 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48723113.9060605@swbell.net>, <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 13:14, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 10:06 -0500, Joel Ewy wrote: > > I have a TC-9, Chuck. I have to say I've never been able to put it > > to very good use. It (mine at least) was always a bit flaky in > > operation. One of the main problems I had with it was that I could > > never get a hard drive hooked up to it. For some reason, it was > > incompatible with the Disto SCII, which I already had. So no > > no-halt floppy, and no 4-in-1 for RTC and SCSI. Before I got that > > figured out, I bought an MM/1, and the Tomcat sat mostly unused. > > Man, I'm a tad bit jealous - I want! I want! :) And btw, building a > hard-drive interface for the thing would mostly likely be a piece of > cake.. it doesn't get much easier than an IDE interface. > > Does it have any custom chips on it that you're aware of? One big > problem with making a Coco 3 clone is the GIME. If the TC-9 did most > of the naughty in PAL/GALs and discrete logic, then I might try to > resurrect it.. The Coco 3 is a nice machine, but for 'serious' work > it has some limitations, the poor keyboard, case, RS-DOS/Coco2 > compatibility stuff ... > The GIME chip is not that mysterious in that its functions can very well be done in a FPGA. Besiues RSDOS is more than capable for most uses. Granted the Coco2 backwards compatibility can be a limitation. But not in an FPGA based system with a large enough logic cells. > My ideal NitrOS-9 machine would have no bells and whistles on-board, > and just lots of expansion slots. I'm debating using a 63C09 and > creating a custom MMU (which would cause problems with NitrOS-9, > because I'd use a simpler mechanism than the GIME) or putting these > handfuls 68008s or 68000/68010s to use and making NitrOS/68000.. I'm > leaning towards the latter, if only because that eliminates the need > for a DAT, and OS-9 lost a lot of its elegance when the MMU was > introduced (Level 1 -> 2). > The MMU is rather simple in design. The basic design in the GIME according to the service manual uses a single port ram and a mux. In an FPGA this can very well be done with an assynchronous dual port ram. > But if I had schematics for a TC-9, well then .. I might steal the > design.. wonder if Mr. Puppo would mind. > You still are limited to 4 MHz max. A 6809 in an FPGA is doable to about 25MHz. With a big enough FPGA, like a Xilinx XC3S500E, you can add the GIME functions plus a WD1772+ FDC and at least one serial port, PS2 mouse and Keyboard, USB 2.0 and IDE interface. The MMU can be easily done to access 2MB of ram but why limit there? Even if you want to use as 68000, that to can be synthesized in a FPGA. james From farna at att.net Mon Jul 7 16:23:19 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:23:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 Message-ID: <48727B37.7040409@att.net> I recall the TC-9 using the GIME. The reason was for 100% OS-9 Level II compatibility, and there was hope for some DECB 2.1 compatibility (CoCo 3 only). The later never occurred, too many hardware differences I think. Easy enough to tweak an OS-9 driver for minor differences, DECB was harder to patch. There's an interview with Frank Hogg and I think a pic of a TC-9 in "Tandy's Little Wonder", downloadable from the maltedmedia site (ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/Farna/Tandy's%20Little%20Wonder/Cocobook-TLW2.pdf). I recorded a conversation with Frank Hogg about his CoCo involvement and wrote the article from that interview tape. Wish I still had the original cassette! -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 7 16:58:47 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:58:47 -0600 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48727B37.7040409@att.net> References: <48727B37.7040409@att.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:23:19 -0600, Frank Swygert wrote: > I recall the TC-9 using the GIME. The reason was for 100% OS-9 Level II > compatibility, and there was hope for some DECB 2.1 compatibility (CoCo > 3 only). The later never occurred, too many hardware differences I > think. Easy enough to tweak an OS-9 driver for minor differences, DECB > was harder to patch. Yes, it used the GIME, and a standard 28.xx MHz clock (I overclocked mine with a 32MHz crystal). If you bought the TC-9 prepackaged (like Bill Nobel & did), it came with a cable that switched the weird inverted connector to a standard cartridge port connector (your choice if you got a single or Y cable one, but if you were using the Y cable, you had to make sure that you're floppy controller was fully decoded). I ran mine with the stock Tandy floppy controller and a B&B hard drive (60MB) for years. Ran it with the 1MB RAM daughter board as well. Bill & I completely redid the keyboard/mouse/sound driver (TC9IO, which replaced CC3IO), from the original version by Bruce Isted. We added support for Numlock/Caps lock controllable by each window (instead of system wide), 8 bit sound support, and a bunch of keyboard updates, from what I remember. The RSDOS first version ROM (a replacement, larger ROM image than the original version it shipped with) was done, and was written by Chris Burke, but I could never get it running stably on my system (whether this was due to the overclock or not, I never did dig in deep enough to find out). We did some minor tweaks to the Serial port driver (dual port 6552, capable of up to 38400), but we did modify the mouse routines somewhat (3 button support was started for Logitech mice, I believe). It did boot a few times enough for me to type in a small BASIC program, but it always crash on me. There was also boot rom versions that booted from the Eliminator or B&B hard drive systems, as well as the floppy. I did mine off of floppy because of development (always had a stable floppy complete boot to reboot from is something went horribly wrong). > > There's an interview with Frank Hogg and I think a pic of a TC-9 in > "Tandy's Little Wonder", downloadable from the maltedmedia site > (ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/Farna/Tandy's%20Little%20Wonder/Cocobook-TLW2.pdf). > I recorded a conversation with Frank Hogg about his CoCo involvement and > wrote the article from that interview tape. Wish I still had the > original cassette! > -- L. Curtis Boyle From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jul 7 17:21:55 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:21:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI question In-Reply-To: <48722B63.1696.189F87@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215453278.21996.26.camel@dev> <48722B63.1696.189F87@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <487288F3.5020108@worldnet.att.net> jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > On 7 Jul 2008 at 13:54, Chuck Youse wrote: > > >>Ok, so I know that multi-paks had some sort of problem with the Coco >>3, requiring a modification to the PAL - something to do with >>conflicts with the GIME. As far as I can tell, the MPI only uses >>address FF7F - did it only partially decode and thus overlap with the >>GIME? Or was there a different problem? >> >>C. > > |-------------------- > > The later model sof the MPI uses $FF7F. If I remember correctly the original MPI > uses $FF9F to do slot switch. This conflicts with the GIME's Horizontal Offset > register. There is another conflict that I am not familiar with. > > The GIME chip knows when and where the MPU addresses anything within the > 64K memory map of the 6809. The internal registers to the GIME chip are at > $FF90 to $FFDF. Also the GIME chip mirrors the PIA registers at $FF00 - $FF03 > AND $FF20 - $FF23. > > james > James, I think there is a minor error above. The MPI always used $FF7F but ghosted to $FF9F. There is also a ghosting problem with some other third party hardware PAKs. The ghosting is removed by the MPI modifications. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jul 7 17:43:55 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:43:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OS-9 development system In-Reply-To: <1215451073.21996.20.camel@dev> References: <1215451073.21996.20.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48728E1B.70203@worldnet.att.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > Here's another stupid question. I've perused the RTSI archive and can't > seem to find the OS-9 Development system. Is it around anywhere? Scred > and the debugger would be rad as I'll be moving my development to the > Coco soon. > > C. > The LevelII development system can be found at http://www.clubltdstudios.com/coco/downunder/OS9/ along with many other great OS-9 programs. This def files in this package are not applicable to NitrOS-9 builds as many changes have been made. The package includes the manual, rma et.al, debug, scred, and more. From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 17:56:27 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:56:27 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: References: <48727B37.7040409@att.net> Message-ID: <20080707165627.qiwr2e4s5cs8kcck@webmail.frontiernet.net> Curtis, I don't recall what mods I made to your TC-9 but the design was terrible. After I got done mod'ing your machine it was running way better. That was a long time ago and don't recall the details. I have them written down somewhere in my files. The Kbus crap that was in there or whatever they called it was a lot of the problem. Never was a Puppo keyboard fan either.... Sorry. Your Xtal mod all you had to do is adjust the horz. osc. on the monitor to get it to lock. Some monitors would not shift that far. Still all a GREAT piece of history to have. :) Mark Quoting "L. Curtis Boyle" : > On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:23:19 -0600, Frank Swygert wrote: > >> I recall the TC-9 using the GIME. The reason was for 100% OS-9 >> Level II compatibility, and there was hope for some DECB 2.1 >> compatibility (CoCo 3 only). The later never occurred, too many >> hardware differences I think. Easy enough to tweak an OS-9 driver >> for minor differences, DECB was harder to patch. > Yes, it used the GIME, and a standard 28.xx MHz clock (I overclocked > mine with a 32MHz crystal). If you bought the TC-9 prepackaged (like > Bill Nobel & did), it came with a cable that switched the weird > inverted connector to a standard cartridge port connector (your choice > if you got a single or Y cable one, but if you were using the Y cable, > you had to make sure that you're floppy controller was fully decoded). > I ran mine with the stock Tandy floppy controller and a B&B hard drive > (60MB) for years. Ran it with the 1MB RAM daughter board as well. Bill > & I completely redid the keyboard/mouse/sound driver (TC9IO, which > replaced CC3IO), from the original version by Bruce Isted. We added > support for Numlock/Caps lock controllable by each window (instead of > system wide), 8 bit sound support, and a bunch of keyboard updates, > from what I remember. > The RSDOS first version ROM (a replacement, larger ROM image than > the original version it shipped with) was done, and was written by > Chris Burke, but I could never get it running stably on my system > (whether this was due to the overclock or not, I never did dig in deep > enough to find out). We did some minor tweaks to the Serial port driver > (dual port 6552, capable of up to 38400), but we did modify the mouse > routines somewhat (3 button support was started for Logitech mice, I > believe). It did boot a few times enough for me to type in a small > BASIC program, but it always crash on me. There was also boot rom > versions that booted from the Eliminator or B&B hard drive systems, as > well as the floppy. I did mine off of floppy because of development > (always had a stable floppy complete boot to reboot from is something > went horribly wrong). > >> >> There's an interview with Frank Hogg and I think a pic of a TC-9 in >> "Tandy's Little Wonder", downloadable from the maltedmedia site >> (ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/Farna/Tandy's%20Little%20Wonder/Cocobook-TLW2.pdf). I recorded a conversation with Frank Hogg about his CoCo involvement and wrote the article from that interview tape. Wish I still had the original >> cassette! >> > > > > -- > L. Curtis Boyle > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 7 18:19:58 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:19:58 -0600 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707165627.qiwr2e4s5cs8kcck@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <48727B37.7040409@att.net> <20080707165627.qiwr2e4s5cs8kcck@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:56:27 -0600, Mark Marlette wrote: > Curtis, > > I don't recall what mods I made to your TC-9 but the design was terrible. > > After I got done mod'ing your machine it was running way better. That > was a long time ago and don't recall the details. I have them written > down somewhere in my files. > > The Kbus crap that was in there or whatever they called it was a lot of > the problem. Never was a Puppo keyboard fan either.... Sorry. I never had a Puppo keyboard adaptor either... I hated the way that XT keyboards could only toggle the light settings, but had no idea if they were on or not in the first place (if you had a crash and rebooted, your lights could be backwards to what they were supposed to be). I just mentioned it because that ist he product that Bob was most associated with. The K-Bus was the 16 bit bus system that was supposed to allow a 68000/68020/68030, and other 16 bit cards, to interface with the TC-9 (which would become a fancy I/O card with it's own CPU, 512K or 1MB of RAM, etc., controlled by the 680x0 running OS-9 68K. While some IRQ lines were tied into spots to help do that, I never saw such a configuration running, and never had any of the cards (or K-Bus itself). It was a good idea (use the TC-9 portion as it's own, improved Coco 3 clone, and then use it as either a co-processing I/O card with a 680x0 later, or allow OS-9K to have multiple TC-9's running as separate mini computers all under the OSK roof), but would have required a lot of development. Bill & I had to pay full retail for our TC-9's; as developers, we weren't given any discounts. We did get the original source code for the TC-9 specific modules, and accidentally got a few pieces of level 2 upgrade (without docs, and years before the rest of it came out), but event that was incomplete (and not supposed to be there; Bruce sheepishly admitted that he had forgotten that his development system included the Level 2 upgrade (he was one of the developers), and when he made the TC-9 boot disks for distribution, several upgrade modules went with it). > > Your Xtal mod all you had to do is adjust the horz. osc. on the monitor > to get it to lock. Some monitors would not shift that far. My Magnavox did, but barely. I blew a cap out of it trying to push it further (computer worked fine, monitor blew up). > > Still all a GREAT piece of history to have. :) Yes. Eventually, I hope to try and fire it up again, and see if it still works. > > Mark > > > Quoting "L. Curtis Boyle" : > >> On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:23:19 -0600, Frank Swygert wrote: >> >>> I recall the TC-9 using the GIME. The reason was for 100% OS-9 Level >>> II compatibility, and there was hope for some DECB 2.1 compatibility >>> (CoCo 3 only). The later never occurred, too many hardware >>> differences I think. Easy enough to tweak an OS-9 driver for minor >>> differences, DECB was harder to patch. >> Yes, it used the GIME, and a standard 28.xx MHz clock (I overclocked >> mine with a 32MHz crystal). If you bought the TC-9 prepackaged (like >> Bill Nobel & did), it came with a cable that switched the weird >> inverted connector to a standard cartridge port connector (your choice >> if you got a single or Y cable one, but if you were using the Y cable, >> you had to make sure that you're floppy controller was fully decoded). >> I ran mine with the stock Tandy floppy controller and a B&B hard drive >> (60MB) for years. Ran it with the 1MB RAM daughter board as well. Bill >> & I completely redid the keyboard/mouse/sound driver (TC9IO, which >> replaced CC3IO), from the original version by Bruce Isted. We added >> support for Numlock/Caps lock controllable by each window (instead of >> system wide), 8 bit sound support, and a bunch of keyboard updates, >> from what I remember. >> The RSDOS first version ROM (a replacement, larger ROM image than >> the original version it shipped with) was done, and was written by >> Chris Burke, but I could never get it running stably on my system >> (whether this was due to the overclock or not, I never did dig in deep >> enough to find out). We did some minor tweaks to the Serial port driver >> (dual port 6552, capable of up to 38400), but we did modify the mouse >> routines somewhat (3 button support was started for Logitech mice, I >> believe). It did boot a few times enough for me to type in a small >> BASIC program, but it always crash on me. There was also boot rom >> versions that booted from the Eliminator or B&B hard drive systems, as >> well as the floppy. I did mine off of floppy because of development >> (always had a stable floppy complete boot to reboot from is something >> went horribly wrong). >> >>> >>> There's an interview with Frank Hogg and I think a pic of a TC-9 in >>> "Tandy's Little Wonder", downloadable from the maltedmedia site >>> (ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/Farna/Tandy's%20Little%20Wonder/Cocobook-TLW2.pdf). >>> I recorded a conversation with Frank Hogg about his CoCo involvement >>> and wrote the article from that interview tape. Wish I still had the >>> original cassette! >>> >> >> >> >> --L. Curtis Boyle >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- L. Curtis Boyle From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 18:22:12 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:22:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 14:07 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > 189's last check were not in production. I made my first 2meg board > with those and have since switched to CPLD design. > Yeah, I think you're right, but I do have about a dozen 74S189s. Problem with CPLD/FPGA designs is that as soon as you starting whipping out Verilog/VHDL, you might as well do the whole system on a chip. > Rocket was the name as I recall of Chris Burke's project. I recall it > used the 68008 as well. Not enough orders to make the board. Details > foggy..... Yeah, I certainly don't intend to earn a living selling these things. I expect a small community. With small quantity PCBs becoming easier just a handful of systems can be made without exorbitant cost. Thanks C. From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Mon Jul 7 18:21:26 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 17:21:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs Message-ID: <20080707.172126.2940.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Folks I have a copy of an MPI and Specs. It may take me several days to set up the scanner with my laptop. My desktop Xp system failed and I am trying with a backup I did on CD... so far I haven't selected the correct options to get the CD to read the files. Let me know all who want a copy of that e-mail with attachments of the MPI John On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:20:19 -0400 Chuck Youse writes: > Assuming that no one has a schematic/service manual for the MPI, I > don't > suppose anyone has enough knowledge to give me a specification for > it? > Point being I'd like to make a clone of it. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ____________________________________________________________ Sweepstakes!!! Enter for your chance to WIN a summer spa getaway! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ujj9lRzllpQsJI1beAaYNO1cj3DcmmwtVG0jCH9D2Ob79n/ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 18:25:44 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:25:44 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> , <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 15:23 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > The GIME chip is not that mysterious in that its functions can very well be done in a > FPGA. Besiues RSDOS is more than capable for most uses. Granted the Coco2 > backwards compatibility can be a limitation. But not in an FPGA based system with a > large enough logic cells. > See previous comments about FPGA. I've done plenty of FPGA logic design, including complete CPU cores and SoCs. It's just not that interesting when you have the whole system on a chip. But I guess if that's something that people want.. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 18:51:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:51:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI specs In-Reply-To: <20080707.172126.2940.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080707.172126.2940.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <1215471107.21996.59.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 17:21 -0500, John T Chasteen wrote: > Folks I have a copy of an MPI and Specs. > It may take me several days to set up the scanner with my laptop. I got the schematic etc. from someone already. I'll post 'em on the interwebs.. C. From dml_68 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 7 18:52:35 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:52:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Coco3.Com Forums In-Reply-To: <5631e580807070840x47202bf6ia8fc67c077a8af41@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <667815.83194.qm@web30208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Strange I can access it with IE but not Firefox 3.0.. Has to be one of my FF extensions or something. ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Mon, 7/7/08, Rogelio Perea wrote: From: Rogelio Perea Subject: Re: [Coco] Coco3.Com Forums To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 8:40 AM Just tried the forums at CoCo3.com - no problems accessing... -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Derek wrote: > Over the last 24 hours I have been un-able to connect to the forums over at > coco3.com. is anyone else having the same problem? I need my coco fix.. > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 18:53:29 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:53:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, Did you have your board gold plated on the edge like design docs? Small quauntity PWBs are expensive, setup fees can get you as well on the first run. Some don't change setup fees but then get you everytime you order the boards. I now just send in my photoplots and then the NRE has already been paid. I have paid $75 each a prototype on my larger boards in qty of 2 +s/h and that is considered a good deal. For whom???? :) Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 14:07 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: >> Chuck, >> >> 189's last check were not in production. I made my first 2meg board >> with those and have since switched to CPLD design. >> > > Yeah, I think you're right, but I do have about a dozen 74S189s. > Problem with CPLD/FPGA designs is that as soon as you starting whipping > out Verilog/VHDL, you might as well do the whole system on a chip. > >> Rocket was the name as I recall of Chris Burke's project. I recall it >> used the 68008 as well. Not enough orders to make the board. Details >> foggy..... > > Yeah, I certainly don't intend to earn a living selling these things. I > expect a small community. With small quantity PCBs becoming easier just > a handful of systems can be made without exorbitant cost. > > Thanks > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 19:02:58 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:02:58 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> , <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, There are free CPU cores, etc. Some have dabbled here but there is no GIME FPGA, others will say it isn't that hard, etc. Proof is in the pudding. If it isn't that hard, then do it, no time, busy, etc...Not implying you here.....There is a lot going on in the GIME. Some have booted to a green screen, etc but we all know that there is a lot of work in the details of a project and to get one that works, 95%+ of the apps requires a bunch of time. Details, details, details. Then the cost. Last I checked some of the FPGA prices were $250+. Sure there are bigger, better and faster ones now but my point is the same. This is a labor of love and small volume manufacturing costs more than one would think unless they have lived it. I tip my hat to you and your FDC controller project!!!! Nice job. Mark Cloud-9 Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 15:23 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > >> The GIME chip is not that mysterious in that its functions can very >> well be done in a >> FPGA. Besiues RSDOS is more than capable for most uses. Granted the Coco2 >> backwards compatibility can be a limitation. But not in an FPGA >> based system with a >> large enough logic cells. >> > > See previous comments about FPGA. > > I've done plenty of FPGA logic design, including complete CPU cores and > SoCs. It's just not that interesting when you have the whole system on > a chip. But I guess if that's something that people want.. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 19:07:16 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:07:16 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1215472036.21996.64.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 17:53 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Did you have your board gold plated on the edge like design docs? Nope, no gold-plating. I had three of these boards made by Sparkfun - batchpcb.com - not bad, it was like $54 for the three of them, shipping/setup included. But yeah, the bigger boards are going to be less cost-effective .. C. From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 7 19:29:30 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:29:30 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215472036.21996.64.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215472036.21996.64.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080707182930.96ijfiu6o8gco8cg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, Advice, do what you would like with it..... :) If you make a production board, go with the gold plating. My protoypes that are not gold edge will not function in the cart slot after ~1 month. You have to pull the cart out a few times to get the black off the contacts. Gold has no problems. They will hit you for another change for the extra work in their process. Regards, Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 17:53 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > >> Did you have your board gold plated on the edge like design docs? > > Nope, no gold-plating. > > I had three of these boards made by Sparkfun - batchpcb.com - not bad, > it was like $54 for the three of them, shipping/setup included. But > yeah, the bigger boards are going to be less cost-effective .. > > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 19:35:39 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:35:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707182930.96ijfiu6o8gco8cg@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215472036.21996.64.camel@dev> <20080707182930.96ijfiu6o8gco8cg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1215473739.21996.78.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:29 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > Advice, do what you would like with it..... :) > > If you make a production board, go with the gold plating. My protoypes > that are not gold edge will not function in the cart slot after ~1 > month. You have to pull the cart out a few times to get the black off > the contacts. Gold has no problems. > > They will hit you for another change for the extra work in their process. > > Regards, > > Mark Hah, ok, I'll see what happens with these, maybe I'll get lucky. Probably won't. Just to clarify, lest any wars break out, I'm really not trying to turn this into a business a la Cloud-9. :) Just a hobby.. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 19:39:51 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:39:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> , <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev> <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:02 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > There are free CPU cores, etc. Some have dabbled here but there is no > GIME FPGA, others will say it isn't that hard, etc. Proof is in the > pudding. If it isn't that hard, then do it, no time, busy, etc...Not > implying you here.....There is a lot going on in the GIME. > Well, one of the problems with implementing the GIME as a stand-alone FPGA stems from the fact that the GIME performs quite a few analog functions, and the digital functions on any suitable FPGA will be at the wrong voltage levels. E.g., composite and RGB outputs, not to mention the clock generation - as I'm sure you know the 6809 likes to drive its internal circuitry off the E clock. So any drop-in GIME replacement would have to be a board of sorts, an FPGA with some external components. If it's a matter of implementing a 6809 + GIME on a chip and interfacing that to an external bus, that's one thing. If it's a drop-in board to replace the GIME, that's another. But as I stated before, if you're going to go that far, might as well integrate a lot more into the FPGA. If your comments were meant as a gentlemanly challenge, I'll take it! But I want a free AT keyboard interface for my CoCo when I finish ;) > Some have booted to a green screen, etc but we all know that there is > a lot of work in the details of a project and to get one that works, > 95%+ of the apps requires a bunch of time. Details, details, details. > If I were to do this, I'd probably put a 6809 and a GIME-style MMU/interrupt controller on a chip, and interface that to a multi-slot Coco-style hardware bus through some LVX-family transceivers or something. The core+RAM can run at one speed, and external bus accesses can be synchronized to a free-running E clock @ 2MHz, much like the early 68ks did for 6800 peripherals. I wouldn't bother with the graphics functions of the GIME, as I don't care for RSDOS compatibility - might put in some logic to drive a VGA display and keyboard, but certainly not in a CoCo/SAM compatible fashion. > Then the cost. Last I checked some of the FPGA prices were $250+. Sure > there are bigger, better and faster ones now but my point is the same. > This is a labor of love and small volume manufacturing costs more than > one would think unless they have lived it. A suitable FPGA with more than enough area for a 6809 and GIME (with room to spare) would be an XC3S250E - the 144TQFP/4ns speed grade runs ~ $15 at qty 1. > I tip my hat to you and your FDC controller project!!!! Nice job. Thanks! Means much coming from Cloud-9. :) C. From fwp at deepthought.com Mon Jul 7 20:45:40 2008 From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 19:45:40 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> References: <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <487234EA.13264.104911@jdaggett.gate.net> <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev> <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080708004540.GH4144@warlock.deepthought.com> If you make the gime replacement available to the coco community in some way I'll buy you an AT keyboard adaptor!! Frank PS - notice I didn't say anything about you making a few pennies in the process. On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 07:39:51PM -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:02 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > > Chuck, > > > > There are free CPU cores, etc. Some have dabbled here but there is no > > GIME FPGA, others will say it isn't that hard, etc. Proof is in the > > pudding. If it isn't that hard, then do it, no time, busy, etc...Not > > implying you here.....There is a lot going on in the GIME. > > > > Well, one of the problems with implementing the GIME as a stand-alone > FPGA stems from the fact that the GIME performs quite a few analog > functions, and the digital functions on any suitable FPGA will be at the > wrong voltage levels. E.g., composite and RGB outputs, not to mention > the clock generation - as I'm sure you know the 6809 likes to drive its > internal circuitry off the E clock. So any drop-in GIME replacement > would have to be a board of sorts, an FPGA with some external > components. > > If it's a matter of implementing a 6809 + GIME on a chip and interfacing > that to an external bus, that's one thing. If it's a drop-in board to > replace the GIME, that's another. But as I stated before, if you're > going to go that far, might as well integrate a lot more into the FPGA. > > If your comments were meant as a gentlemanly challenge, I'll take it! > But I want a free AT keyboard interface for my CoCo when I finish ;) > > > Some have booted to a green screen, etc but we all know that there is > > a lot of work in the details of a project and to get one that works, > > 95%+ of the apps requires a bunch of time. Details, details, details. > > > > If I were to do this, I'd probably put a 6809 and a GIME-style > MMU/interrupt controller on a chip, and interface that to a multi-slot > Coco-style hardware bus through some LVX-family transceivers or > something. The core+RAM can run at one speed, and external bus accesses > can be synchronized to a free-running E clock @ 2MHz, much like the > early 68ks did for 6800 peripherals. > > I wouldn't bother with the graphics functions of the GIME, as I don't > care for RSDOS compatibility - might put in some logic to drive a VGA > display and keyboard, but certainly not in a CoCo/SAM compatible > fashion. > > > Then the cost. Last I checked some of the FPGA prices were $250+. Sure > > there are bigger, better and faster ones now but my point is the same. > > This is a labor of love and small volume manufacturing costs more than > > one would think unless they have lived it. > > A suitable FPGA with more than enough area for a 6809 and GIME (with > room to spare) would be an XC3S250E - the 144TQFP/4ns speed grade runs ~ > $15 at qty 1. > > > I tip my hat to you and your FDC controller project!!!! Nice job. > > Thanks! Means much coming from Cloud-9. :) > > C. > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 21:49:32 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:49:32 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net>, <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 19:39, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:02 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > > Chuck, > > > > There are free CPU cores, etc. Some have dabbled here but there is > > no GIME FPGA, others will say it isn't that hard, etc. Proof is in > > the pudding. If it isn't that hard, then do it, no time, busy, > > etc...Not implying you here.....There is a lot going on in the > > GIME. > > > > Well, one of the problems with implementing the GIME as a stand-alone > FPGA stems from the fact that the GIME performs quite a few analog > functions, and the digital functions on any suitable FPGA will be at > the wrong voltage levels. E.g., composite and RGB outputs, not to > mention the clock generation - as I'm sure you know the 6809 likes to > drive its internal circuitry off the E clock. So any drop-in GIME > replacement would have to be a board of sorts, an FPGA with some > external components. > The only analog functions are the composite video from the internal DAC the RGB DAC and the oscillator circuitry on board. The oscillator and its quadrature phase is rather easy to do in an FPGA given the modern DLL/DCM in most chips. > If it's a matter of implementing a 6809 + GIME on a chip and > interfacing that to an external bus, that's one thing. If it's a > drop-in board to replace the GIME, that's another. But as I stated > before, if you're going to go that far, might as well integrate a lot > more into the FPGA. > For my needs, whether the CPU is integrated or not is only a nicety. > If your comments were meant as a gentlemanly challenge, I'll take it! > But I want a free AT keyboard interface for my CoCo when I finish ;) > No, just made a suggestion. SInce you were talking about essentially recreating a COCO3 in discrete logic. I learned long ago that never fall inlove with your designs. Someone will always have a betterr or cheaper way. Learned that early in my engineering career. > A suitable FPGA with more than enough area for a 6809 and GIME (with > room to spare) would be an XC3S250E - the 144TQFP/4ns speed grade runs > ~ $15 at qty 1. I have an XC2S300E in an FT256 BGA package on a board now. And yes the GIME and the 6809 will fit with plenty of room and more I/O than I need. > > I tip my hat to you and your FDC controller project!!!! Nice job. > I am not really doing a FDC controller. I just came across a core one day about 4 months ago and found it interesting. It just proved to me that a FDC could be done in an FPGA. I have the core and may one day do something with it. My requirements right now is a small, portable and battery operated embedded board. The key requirement is small and with either a minimum of 512K of sram and and SPI flash or 8K of sram and 2MB of parallel flash. Currently leaning towards the large SRAM and serial flash. A 6809 processor would be nice since I am familiar with it. An HC11/12 would also suffice. Actually leaning to do something like embedding HC11 periherals around a 6809 core that is freely avaialble. Kind of like a HC11F1 with a 6809 core instead. james From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 22:13:35 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:13:35 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> , <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> , <1215473991.21996.84.camel@dev> <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 21:49 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > The only analog functions are the composite video from the internal DAC the RGB DAC > and the oscillator circuitry on board. The oscillator and its quadrature phase is rather easy > to do in an FPGA given the modern DLL/DCM in most chips. > The composite signal by itself will be a bitch. And don't forget the drive requirements on the E clock. Anyway, the point is it'd require external components, an FPGA alone won't suffice, but I think we agree on this point. > My requirements right now is a small, portable and battery operated embedded board. The > key requirement is small and with either a minimum of 512K of sram and and SPI flash or > 8K of sram and 2MB of parallel flash. Currently leaning towards the large SRAM and serial > flash. A 6809 processor would be nice since I am familiar with it. An HC11/12 would also > suffice. Actually leaning to do something like embedding HC11 periherals around a 6809 > core that is freely avaialble. Kind of like a HC11F1 with a 6809 core instead. Interesting! Do tell more .. C. From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 22:45:14 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:45:14 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MPI question In-Reply-To: <487288F3.5020108@worldnet.att.net> References: <1215453278.21996.26.camel@dev>, <48722B63.1696.189F87@jdaggett.gate.net>, <487288F3.5020108@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <48729C7A.29575.5F4567@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 17:21, Robert Gault wrote: > jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > On 7 Jul 2008 at 13:54, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > > > >>Ok, so I know that multi-paks had some sort of problem with the Coco > >>3, requiring a modification to the PAL - something to do with > >>conflicts with the GIME. As far as I can tell, the MPI only uses > >>address FF7F - did it only partially decode and thus overlap with > >>the GIME? Or was there a different problem? > >> > >>C. > > > > |-------------------- > > > > The later model sof the MPI uses $FF7F. If I remember correctly the > > original MPI uses $FF9F to do slot switch. This conflicts with the > > GIME's Horizontal Offset register. There is another conflict that I > > am not familiar with. > > > > The GIME chip knows when and where the MPU addresses anything within > > the 64K memory map of the 6809. The internal registers to the GIME > > chip are at $FF90 to $FFDF. Also the GIME chip mirrors the PIA > > registers at $FF00 - $FF03 AND $FF20 - $FF23. > > > > james > > > > James, I think there is a minor error above. The MPI always used $FF7F > but ghosted to $FF9F. There is also a ghosting problem with some other > third party hardware PAKs. The ghosting is removed by the MPI > modifications. > Just going on memory. I thought there ws a conflict with the GIME and maybe what you state is what I am thinking of. james From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 23:00:23 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:00:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <1215469544.21996.55.camel@dev>, <20080707180258.gjy3xb3b7r4gwowg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <4872A007.672.6D2529@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 18:02, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > There are free CPU cores, etc. Some have dabbled here but there is no > GIME FPGA, others will say it isn't that hard, etc. Proof is in the > pudding. If it isn't that hard, then do it, no time, busy, etc...Not > implying you here.....There is a lot going on in the GIME. > Nope because there is no easy method of retro fitting an existing Coco3 that is relatively cost effective, in my mind, or does not require soldering and desoldering on the main board. FPGAs can offer a solution to obsolescence of parts. One has to way the cost benifits of doing a FPGA replacement to redesign. The chip was somewhat complex. Especially for its time frame. Today it is a rather simple chip. > Some have booted to a green screen, etc but we all know that there is > a lot of work in the details of a project and to get one that works, > 95%+ of the apps requires a bunch of time. Details, details, details. > > Then the cost. Last I checked some of the FPGA prices were $250+. Sure > there are bigger, better and faster ones now but my point is the > same. This is a labor of love and small volume manufacturing costs > more than one would think unless they have lived it. > The Spartan 3 series are all under $100 single unit price. The Virtex line is the definitely more costlier. The lower density chips are under $25 single unit price. Moving to sub 100nM process has made the silicon much cheaper and faster. I believe the Spartan 3 series is 90nM process. I have even heard that 45nM process is just around the corner. I can remember when cracking the 1 micron barrier was hailed as great feat. That was in the 80's. Darn that seems a long time ago now. james From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 7 23:29:39 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:29:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 22:13, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 21:49 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > > The only analog functions are the composite video from the internal > > DAC the RGB DAC and the oscillator circuitry on board. The > > oscillator and its quadrature phase is rather easy to do in an FPGA > > given the modern DLL/DCM in most chips. > > > > The composite signal by itself will be a bitch. And don't forget the > drive requirements on the E clock. Anyway, the point is it'd require > external components, an FPGA alone won't suffice, but I think we agree > on this point. > ------------------------ Yes it is but is doable. The MC6809 with internal clock, the E and Q clock source current is 2 mA. The chip is depletion load NMOS technology. I am not sure of the geometry of the output transistors on teh clock. The spec is 2 mA so they may very well be NMOS and not bipolar. The MC6809E, no internal oscillator, the E and Q clocks are inputs and sink very little current. > > My requirements right now is a small, portable and battery operated > > embedded board. The key requirement is small and with either a > > minimum of 512K of sram and and SPI flash or 8K of sram and 2MB of > > parallel flash. Currently leaning towards the large SRAM and serial > > flash. A 6809 processor would be nice since I am familiar with it. > > An HC11/12 would also suffice. Actually leaning to do something like > > embedding HC11 periherals around a 6809 core that is freely > > avaialble. Kind of like a HC11F1 with a 6809 core instead. > > Interesting! Do tell more .. > > C. In my spare time, I have toyed with several ideas to improve the telescope controller I have for the telescope mount. It currently tracks and has limited slewing rates. I want faster slewing and better postioning controll with database for objects. I could easily buy but kind of want to do one myself. I first toyed with using an HC11F1 or K1 but they are now obsolete and getting scarce. Also considered a Coco3 and doing a shrink of the circuitry to fit in a small package. The Coco3 can be battery operated with ease. I like some of the instructions of the HC11 but also like the MC6809 instruction set. So recently I thought why not take the best of both and merge. Much of the HC11 peripheral are not that difficult to implement. The one thing that can't real easily be done in an FPGA is the EEPROM and A/D circuits. There maybe a work around that. How messy it gets is TBD. james From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 23:35:11 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:35:11 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> , <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215488111.23539.10.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 23:29 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > The MC6809E, no internal oscillator, the E and Q clocks are inputs and > sink very little current. I believe you are mistaken. The E clock on the 6809E is not a simple TTL signal, it has different voltage and current requirements because it directly drives the internal circuitry. Look at the data sheet. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 7 23:46:51 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:46:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215488111.23539.10.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> , <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> <1215488111.23539.10.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1215488812.23539.14.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 23:35 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 23:29 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > > The MC6809E, no internal oscillator, the E and Q clocks are inputs and > > sink very little current. > > I believe you are mistaken. The E clock on the 6809E is not a simple > TTL signal, it has different voltage and current requirements because it > directly drives the internal circuitry. Look at the data sheet. > > C. Hmm, so I just looked at the data sheet myself; it lists Vih for the E clock (separately) as VCC-0.75V (nominally 4.25V). I can't see any specific information on the current draw, but the sample clock circuit shows the E to the CPU separated from the E to the system and pulled up with 680ohms. I don't know if they're just trying to keep the rise times short or if they're trying to ensure a lower-impedance supply to the pin. ANYWAY, point still is that you can't drive those with a standard TTL output and certainly not a 3.3V FPGA IO pad. I'm pretty sure both the GIME and the SAM were designed to meet the E clock requirements without any external assistance. But now we're just drowning in details.. :) C. From operator at coco3.com Tue Jul 8 00:02:18 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:02:18 -0500 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? Message-ID: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the other day and finally got it on the web only to the find the Netscape and IE browsers are so out of date that JavaScript causes occasional crashes and lockups and just doesn't make for a nice web experience. I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE update site acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an iMac, and the FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site won't come up at all from either Netscape or IE. I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? From alsplace at pobox.com Tue Jul 8 00:10:22 2008 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 23:10:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <11CB4C8E-D96A-409F-9F79-F06935028E7B@pobox.com> On Jul 7, 2008, at 11:02 PM, Roger Taylor wrote: > I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo > projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? MESS, if still updated for PowerPC (I think it is), is really your only option. For Intel Macs, I've been running VCC just fine via Parallels! -- WE'RE FLOODED! http://web.mac.com/allenhuffman/Flood2008 Over 98,000 digital pics from Disney, Theme Parks, and Ren Fests! Visit http://www.AtTheFaire.com or http://www.DisneyFans.com (1980's Retro Computing: I want my CoCo 4! www.coco4.com) Orlando (and other places) cheap luxury vacation offers - and I get credit! http://www.WestgateResorts.com/or/index.cfm?acct=9009895609&sales=8664429956&language=en From jps.subscriptions at gmail.com Tue Jul 8 00:37:59 2008 From: jps.subscriptions at gmail.com (J.P. Samson) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 22:37:59 -0600 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1A7CB166-FB75-44E6-88E8-CD9A6A951F24@gmail.com> On Jul 7, 2008, at 10:02 PM, Roger Taylor wrote: > I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the > other day. I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE > update site acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an > iMac, and the FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site > won't come up at all from either Netscape or IE. > > I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo > projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? This is a Mac circa 1999, so she's nine plus years old. I believe the last version of the Mac OS X operating system that was officially compatible was 10.3 (Panther)--that's two revisions out-of-date from today. I think you will run into some difficulties finding software that will work on these older OS revisions now. http://guides.macrumors.com/iMac_G3#Apple_iMac_G3_.28266_MHz.29_5_Colors Some applications have features that only work in 10.5, the latest version of Mac OS X, although most still work in 10.4. The other problem is these applications have been compiled and linked, and are thus dependent on the later version of several core OS frameworks (libraries). Again, this means they will not work in 10.3. So unlike PC users content with Windows XP over Vista, I think you'll find most Mac users try to keep their OS up-to-date so they can keep running the latest software! The last version of IE for the Mac was 5.23. I have a copy I can e- mail you if need be, Roger--it's a 6.7MB file. Firefox 3 supposedly won't run on your older Mac as it requires version 10.4 of the OS. You could try Firefox 2. Worst case scenario is it'll crash on startup if it is incompatible with your version of Mac OS X: http://download.mozilla.org/?product=firefox-2.0.0.15&os=osx&lang=en-US -- JP From Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com Tue Jul 8 01:59:15 2008 From: Linux-Rules at austin.rr.com (LinuxRules) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:59:15 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <48728F6C.1200.2C4669@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215483215.23539.5.camel@dev> <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <48730233.7060004@austin.rr.com> jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > On 7 Jul 2008 at 22:13, Chuck Youse wrote: > > >> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 21:49 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >> >> >>> The only analog functions are the composite video from the internal >>> DAC the RGB DAC and the oscillator circuitry on board. The >>> oscillator and its quadrature phase is rather easy to do in an FPGA >>> given the modern DLL/DCM in most chips. >>> >>> >> The composite signal by itself will be a bitch. And don't forget the >> drive requirements on the E clock. Anyway, the point is it'd require >> external components, an FPGA alone won't suffice, but I think we agree >> on this point. >> >> > ------------------------ > > Yes it is but is doable. The MC6809 with internal clock, the E and Q clock > source current is 2 mA. The chip is depletion load NMOS technology. I am > not sure of the geometry of the output transistors on teh clock. The spec is 2 > mA so they may very well be NMOS and not bipolar. True. Being an ex-Mot guy from that group at that time, we had no bipolar "recipes" available to the MPU/MCU designers. Everything was Dep Loads (and d at mn glad to have 'em!) until the 146805 7 146818 came along. [6800(redesign), 6801/02/08, first 6805s, 6809, et al.......] Been lurking for a while, and I'm blown away by the talent demonstrated here. Sure wish we had had some of you folks back then!!! cheers, johnd From mdelyea at gmail.com Tue Jul 8 03:10:12 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 03:10:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <1A7CB166-FB75-44E6-88E8-CD9A6A951F24@gmail.com> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> <1A7CB166-FB75-44E6-88E8-CD9A6A951F24@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807080010h53d7694dnd778b18e9c028fe6@mail.gmail.com> I have an ibook thats a G3 300mhz. I've got Yellowdog linux on it right now. Everything works except I don't have an airport card to put in it so I have to hook it up via the built in ethernet. I believe you can also install Ubuntu up to dapper drake. On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 12:37 AM, J.P. Samson wrote: > On Jul 7, 2008, at 10:02 PM, Roger Taylor wrote: >> >> I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the other >> day. I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE update site >> acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an iMac, and the >> FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site won't come up at all >> from either Netscape or IE. >> >> I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo >> projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? > > This is a Mac circa 1999, so she's nine plus years old. I believe the last > version of the Mac OS X operating system that was officially compatible was > 10.3 (Panther)--that's two revisions out-of-date from today. I think you > will run into some difficulties finding software that will work on these > older OS revisions now. > > http://guides.macrumors.com/iMac_G3#Apple_iMac_G3_.28266_MHz.29_5_Colors > > Some applications have features that only work in 10.5, the latest version > of Mac OS X, although most still work in 10.4. The other problem is these > applications have been compiled and linked, and are thus dependent on the > later version of several core OS frameworks (libraries). Again, this means > they will not work in 10.3. So unlike PC users content with Windows XP over > Vista, I think you'll find most Mac users try to keep their OS up-to-date so > they can keep running the latest software! > > The last version of IE for the Mac was 5.23. I have a copy I can e-mail you > if need be, Roger--it's a 6.7MB file. Firefox 3 supposedly won't run on > your older Mac as it requires version 10.4 of the OS. You could try Firefox > 2. Worst case scenario is it'll crash on startup if it is incompatible with > your version of Mac OS X: > > http://download.mozilla.org/?product=firefox-2.0.0.15&os=osx&lang=en-US > > -- JP > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jdaggett at gate.net Tue Jul 8 07:44:34 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:44:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215488812.23539.14.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <1215488111.23539.10.camel@dev>, <1215488812.23539.14.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48731AE2.29160.141943@jdaggett.gate.net> On 7 Jul 2008 at 23:46, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 23:35 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 23:29 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > > > > The MC6809E, no internal oscillator, the E and Q clocks are > > > inputs and sink very little current. > > > > I believe you are mistaken. The E clock on the 6809E is not a > > simple TTL signal, it has different voltage and current requirements > > because it directly drives the internal circuitry. Look at the data > > sheet. > > > > C. > > Hmm, so I just looked at the data sheet myself; it lists Vih for the E > clock (separately) as VCC-0.75V (nominally 4.25V). I can't see any > specific information on the current draw, but the sample clock circuit > shows the E to the CPU separated from the E to the system and pulled > up with 680ohms. I don't know if they're just trying to keep the rise > times short or if they're trying to ensure a lower-impedance supply to > the pin. > > ANYWAY, point still is that you can't drive those with a standard TTL > output and certainly not a 3.3V FPGA IO pad. I'm pretty sure both the > GIME and the SAM were designed to meet the E clock requirements > without any external assistance. > The E Clock needs the higher voltage due to the larger internal buffer that it drives on the MC6809E. In order to operate to the 2+MHz range and overcome the larger input capacitance. Internally the E Clock is the dominant clock source. True the output of the IOB do not reach the voltage level requirements. That would require an externa buffer of some sort. I never trried to omply that an FPGA was a cure all. The approach to an FPGA based system would require that all the 5 volt logic be converted to 3 volt logic. That initself can present extra circuitry for level translation. Then again 5 volt logic is also becoming a bit more scarce lately. That led me to wonder if the HD63C09 could operate at 1 to 1.5 MHz at 3.6 VDC. > But now we're just drowning in details.. :) > True. From mark at cloud9tech.com Tue Jul 8 07:49:35 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:49:35 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <1215473739.21996.78.camel@dev> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev> <48723113.9060605@swbell.net> <1215450849.21996.16.camel@dev> <48725EDB.3040604@swbell.net> <1215455966.21996.47.camel@dev> <20080707140755.63fveiw8owww8cg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215469332.21996.50.camel@dev> <20080707175329.wad0gdq82sk4448k@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215472036.21996.64.camel@dev> <20080707182930.96ijfiu6o8gco8cg@webmail.frontiernet.net> <1215473739.21996.78.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080708064935.neto75r0g0s0840k@webmail.frontiernet.net> Chuck, That is what they all say......Just a hobby...... :) Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:29 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: >> Chuck, >> >> Advice, do what you would like with it..... :) >> >> If you make a production board, go with the gold plating. My protoypes >> that are not gold edge will not function in the cart slot after ~1 >> month. You have to pull the cart out a few times to get the black off >> the contacts. Gold has no problems. >> >> They will hit you for another change for the extra work in their process. >> >> Regards, >> >> Mark > > Hah, ok, I'll see what happens with these, maybe I'll get lucky. > Probably won't. > > Just to clarify, lest any wars break out, I'm really not trying to turn > this into a business a la Cloud-9. :) Just a hobby.. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jdaggett at gate.net Tue Jul 8 07:52:14 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:52:14 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48730233.7060004@austin.rr.com> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <4872A6E3.23119.87F164@jdaggett.gate.net>, <48730233.7060004@austin.rr.com> Message-ID: <48731CAE.6075.1B1BD1@jdaggett.gate.net> I to am an ex Mot employee. I knew a couple of the SPS eng in Austin and a few in Plantation and Boynton Beach. I seem to remeber that mixed bipolar and NMOS was not real successful in the late 70's. I told one manager back in 1999 that the HC11 would have been a better processor if it had the 6809 core with the peripheral integrated around it. AH but those were the days. james On 8 Jul 2008 at 0:59, LinuxRules wrote: > jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > On 7 Jul 2008 at 22:13, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > > > >> On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 21:49 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > >> > >> > >>> The only analog functions are the composite video from the > >>> internal DAC the RGB DAC and the oscillator circuitry on board. > >>> The oscillator and its quadrature phase is rather easy to do in an > >>> FPGA given the modern DLL/DCM in most chips. > >>> > >>> > >> The composite signal by itself will be a bitch. And don't forget > >> the drive requirements on the E clock. Anyway, the point is it'd > >> require external components, an FPGA alone won't suffice, but I > >> think we agree on this point. > >> > >> > > ------------------------ > > > > Yes it is but is doable. The MC6809 with internal clock, the E and > > Q clock > > source current is 2 mA. The chip is depletion load NMOS technology. > > I am not sure of the geometry of the output transistors on teh > > clock. The spec is 2 mA so they may very well be NMOS and not > > bipolar. > True. > Being an ex-Mot guy from that group at that time, we had no bipolar > "recipes" available to the MPU/MCU designers. Everything was Dep Loads > (and d at mn glad to have 'em!) until the 146805 7 146818 came along. > [6800(redesign), 6801/02/08, first 6805s, 6809, et al.......] > > Been lurking for a while, and I'm blown away by the talent > demonstrated here. Sure wish we had had some of you folks back then!!! > cheers, johnd > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.6/1539 - Release Date: > 7/7/2008 6:35 PM > > From jdaggett at gate.net Tue Jul 8 10:08:54 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:08:54 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <20080708064935.neto75r0g0s0840k@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <1215473739.21996.78.camel@dev>, <20080708064935.neto75r0g0s0840k@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <48733CB6.23013.983C69@jdaggett.gate.net> For me it is. Retirement is nice and occasionaly work at the local funeral home for extra spending money. Been there done that in electronics design work for a living and now I work at my own leasurely pace, when I feel like it. james On 8 Jul 2008 at 6:49, Mark Marlette wrote: > Chuck, > > That is what they all say......Just a hobby...... :) > > Mark > > Quoting Chuck Youse : > > > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:29 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > >> Chuck, > >> > >> Advice, do what you would like with it..... :) > >> > >> If you make a production board, go with the gold plating. My > >> protoypes that are not gold edge will not function in the cart slot > >> after ~1 month. You have to pull the cart out a few times to get > >> the black off the contacts. Gold has no problems. > >> > >> They will hit you for another change for the extra work in their > >> process. > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Mark > > > > Hah, ok, I'll see what happens with these, maybe I'll get lucky. > > Probably won't. > > > > Just to clarify, lest any wars break out, I'm really not trying to > > turn this into a business a la Cloud-9. :) Just a hobby.. > > > > C. > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.6/1540 - Release Date: > 7/8/2008 6:33 AM > > From jcewy at swbell.net Tue Jul 8 11:04:08 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:04:08 -0500 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807080010h53d7694dnd778b18e9c028fe6@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> <1A7CB166-FB75-44E6-88E8-CD9A6A951F24@gmail.com> <1b52e6c80807080010h53d7694dnd778b18e9c028fe6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <487381E8.9060404@swbell.net> mike delyea wrote: > I have an ibook thats a G3 300mhz. I've got Yellowdog linux on it > right now. Everything works except I don't have an airport card to > put in it so I have to hook it up via the built in ethernet. I > believe you can also install Ubuntu up to dapper drake. > > Yup. I don't know how much RAM you have Roger, but Ubuntu would probably prefer at least 128M RAM. Also, Gnome (particularly the Nautilus file manager) can be pretty sluggish on those older machines. Xubuntu is a little more usable in such a situation, in my experience. The last version of Ubuntu I have installed on a G3 iMac was something around 6.04 or 6.10, I think. Another issue is that the iMac CD drives are finicky about CD-R media. YMMV. JCE > On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 12:37 AM, J.P. Samson > wrote: > >> On Jul 7, 2008, at 10:02 PM, Roger Taylor wrote: >> >>> I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the other >>> day. I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE update site >>> acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an iMac, and the >>> FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site won't come up at all >>> from either Netscape or IE. >>> >>> I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo >>> projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? >>> >> This is a Mac circa 1999, so she's nine plus years old. I believe the last >> version of the Mac OS X operating system that was officially compatible was >> 10.3 (Panther)--that's two revisions out-of-date from today. I think you >> will run into some difficulties finding software that will work on these >> older OS revisions now. >> >> http://guides.macrumors.com/iMac_G3#Apple_iMac_G3_.28266_MHz.29_5_Colors >> >> Some applications have features that only work in 10.5, the latest version >> of Mac OS X, although most still work in 10.4. The other problem is these >> applications have been compiled and linked, and are thus dependent on the >> later version of several core OS frameworks (libraries). Again, this means >> they will not work in 10.3. So unlike PC users content with Windows XP over >> Vista, I think you'll find most Mac users try to keep their OS up-to-date so >> they can keep running the latest software! >> >> The last version of IE for the Mac was 5.23. I have a copy I can e-mail you >> if need be, Roger--it's a 6.7MB file. Firefox 3 supposedly won't run on >> your older Mac as it requires version 10.4 of the OS. You could try Firefox >> 2. Worst case scenario is it'll crash on startup if it is incompatible with >> your version of Mac OS X: >> >> http://download.mozilla.org/?product=firefox-2.0.0.15&os=osx&lang=en-US >> >> -- JP >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From mark at cloud9tech.com Tue Jul 8 11:52:16 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:52:16 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <48733CB6.23013.983C69@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215399699.21292.1.camel@dev>, <1215473739.21996.78.camel@dev>, <20080708064935.neto75r0g0s0840k@webmail.frontiernet.net> <48733CB6.23013.983C69@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <20080708105216.qdtgghr55w4kcc8o@webmail.frontiernet.net> james, That would be nice. The CoCo has been very good to me and it is still fun. I often wonder at times when you are working around the clock to make product happen if this is the right thing or not. I have said this before but it is worth saying again. My kids grew up around me and the CoCo. My daughter can do a 512k upgrade with no help. She can do the books, upgrade and package. I told her she was probably the only 16 year old that could do so at the time. She would just smile. She liked to help. Now both are grown and doing their own thing. So now I have to....I find production VERY boring and like to do development. Which is a small portion of the time. I'm sure you will agree, it it stops being fun then it is time to move on. For me the CoCo is still very much a part of my daily life and very much enjoyable. Mark Cloud-9 Quoting jdaggett at gate.net: > For me it is. Retirement is nice and occasionaly work at the local funeral > home for extra spending money. Been there done that in electronics design > work for a living and now I work at my own leasurely pace, when I feel like > it. > > james > > On 8 Jul 2008 at 6:49, Mark Marlette wrote: > >> Chuck, >> >> That is what they all say......Just a hobby...... :) >> >> Mark >> >> Quoting Chuck Youse : >> >> > On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 18:29 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: >> >> Chuck, >> >> >> >> Advice, do what you would like with it..... :) >> >> >> >> If you make a production board, go with the gold plating. My >> >> protoypes that are not gold edge will not function in the cart slot >> >> after ~1 month. You have to pull the cart out a few times to get >> >> the black off the contacts. Gold has no problems. >> >> >> >> They will hit you for another change for the extra work in their >> >> process. >> >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> >> Mark >> > >> > Hah, ok, I'll see what happens with these, maybe I'll get lucky. >> > Probably won't. >> > >> > Just to clarify, lest any wars break out, I'm really not trying to >> > turn this into a business a la Cloud-9. :) Just a hobby.. >> > >> > C. >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >> Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.6/1540 - Release Date: >> 7/8/2008 6:33 AM >> >> > > > From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Tue Jul 8 12:15:08 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 12:15:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade Message-ID: Hello everyone. I'm looking at this ebay auction: Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational-Set-Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need to be upgraded? What does it do? -- Charlie From farna at att.net Tue Jul 8 12:20:57 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:20:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 Message-ID: <487393E9.5070906@att.net> Is there a reason for having a drop in GIME replacement for the CC3? It's not like the GIMEs are especially susceptible to blowing like the 6809... At this point having RS-DOS compatibility is pretty much a moot point. Very little done there, and there are still plenty CC3s (and 2s) to be had cheap enough. Buy a spare if you're worried about parts in the future, just like us old car guys do (parts cars). I did like the ease of programming in DECB, but everyone claims Basic09 is just as easy once you learn it. I never thought so, it was closer to C programming to me, but then I never really learned anything but line number BASIC. The NitrOS-9 machine sounds promising though! Use the 6809 core in an FPGA running at a higher speed (10+ MHz) instead of one of the slower 68K processors and it should run as fast as one of the slower 68Ks. Then use a GIME compatible MMU and video (no need for composite?) just to make the system compatible with OS-9 programs -- at least so they would need only minor tweaks to run right. That would give you a nice software base to work with and a good number of people who might be interested in development work. There aren't a lot of OS-9 68K programs out there, and they are usually expensive. Might have to have a software or hardware "throttle" for the processor for some of the programs to work, but if things like Dynacalc will run with only a few patches that would be a great help! RS-DOS compatibility just requires way to much work -- you may as well put the entire CC3 in a FPGA and only have a few enhancements, like the upgrades that are currently available all built in (support for 2MB, and IDE or CF/SD card, real serial port, and modern floppy controller -- maybe use on of the PC integrated I/O chips?). Change the monitor to a standard RGB rather than the analog, and use a standard PC keyboard. But as far as enhancements, that would require re-writing DECB. Integrating 512K BASIC might be doable, but most of the enhancements would only be usable under OS-9. That being the case, a machine that only runs OS-9 (Nitros) would be a better way to go, and if someone wants to implement a 512K CC3 in FPGA (like the C=64) there's no need to go with a lot of enhancements, just make it compatible with readily available peripherals -- replace the printer port with a USB port even if you have to use circuitry like one of the USB to serial (or parallel) cables do and it can only be used as a printer port. Actually, I think that would be very difficult, as the printers are now dumb and rely on a driver and the host processor. I suppose a rather generic driver could be integrated, but would likely take another FPGA with processor to go between the CC3 circuitry and the printer, and when the printer driver becomes obsolete so would the entire machine. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From jcewy at swbell.net Tue Jul 8 12:45:26 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 11:45:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] TC-9 In-Reply-To: <487393E9.5070906@att.net> References: <487393E9.5070906@att.net> Message-ID: <487399A6.4020609@swbell.net> Frank Swygert wrote: > Is there a reason for having a drop in GIME replacement for the CC3? > It's not like the GIMEs are especially susceptible to blowing like the > 6809... ... The more compelling reason would be feature enhancement rather than replacement parts. Bigger address space, better graphics, etc. JCE From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 8 12:41:48 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 09:41:48 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. Message-ID: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> Heya List!! Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be known, I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet NGs for the last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some formatting thing I missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire set, and spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals have gotten mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) and just plain lost in moves. First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot Pack, Disto MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years ago, the little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and I'd like to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, but it never had a schematic or chip list anyway. 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of the Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the placement, a graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the MC-1 were always a mystery as well. 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 exclusively when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques I used. Can the 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any hard/software hacks to make it so? Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! =Mike 0= From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Tue Jul 8 12:55:59 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 11:55:59 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco fest 2009 Message-ID: <20080708.115559.3816.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Mark I have another MPI that doesn't work with my coco3. will you be equipped to troubleshoot and repair at the fest The $30.00 shipping round trip is prohibitive. I will be getting a coco3 that doesn't have any modifications. Is the new board you are developing going to be ready by "show time" ? John ____________________________________________________________ Are you safe? Click for quotes on a home security system. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3ni3dQbwEZ83WIjtFoburLNXGGnAeQQJHFFPc1cKxywwUBc1/ From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Tue Jul 8 14:06:49 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:06:49 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: Hello Mike. I recently drove for an hour and a half here in NJ to save some coco hardware that was bound for a dumpster. I got a lot of nice stuff, a prefect CM8 a 512k coco3 and dual 360K drive setup. A whole lot of peripherals. The Disto Mini Controller 1 was in the pile of peripherals. I will try to open it up and take pictures on the insides for you. What does the toggle switch do? Charlie "Mike 0rtloff" wrote in message news:20080708164139.2629720A33 at qs281.pair.com... > Heya List!! > > Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be > known, I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet > NGs for the last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some > formatting thing I missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) > > Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire set, > and spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals > have gotten mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) > and just plain lost in moves. > > First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot Pack, > Disto MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. > > ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent > troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) > > 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is > missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years ago, > the little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and > I'd like to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, > but it never had a schematic or chip list anyway. > > 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of the > Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the > 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the placement, > a graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the > MC-1 were always a mystery as well. > > 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 > exclusively when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques > I used. Can the 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any > hard/software hacks to make it so? > > Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! > > =Mike 0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From brucewcalkins at charter.net Tue Jul 8 16:12:21 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:12:21 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade References: Message-ID: > Hello everyone. > I'm looking at this ebay auction: > Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up > http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational-Set-Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > > I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need to be > upgraded? What does it do? > > -- > Charlie That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are "bragging" about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? ~BWC~ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 8 16:15:27 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Charles Youse) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:15:27 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4A3F1794-641D-4B23-A8FA-FCD927F1DA02@serialtechnologies.com> I'm thinking has something to do with a diode, made of germanium. Yes, that's what we call "useless insight" .. :) C. On Jul 8, 2008, at 4:12 PM, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: >> Hello everyone. >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational- >> Set- >> Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ >> 1QQcmdZViewItem >> >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need >> to be >> upgraded? What does it do? >> >> -- >> Charlie > > > That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are > "bragging" about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? > > ~BWC~ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jul 8 16:31:57 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:31:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200807081631.57913.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 08 July 2008, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: >> Hello everyone. >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational-Set-Up_W0Q >>QitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewI >>tem >> >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need to be >> upgraded? What does it do? >> >> -- >> Charlie > >That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are "bragging" >about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? > >~BWC~ Well, first off, a Geranium is a flower (or a weed, depending on ones definition of a weed) the last I knew. Diodes however are occasionally made out of germanium though, and have different characteristics than the usual silicon diode. Generally speaking they have much higher reverse leakage, and much lower reverse breakdown voltages, and about 1/3rd of the drop of a silicon diode in the fwd direction. About the only thing I can think of that might make them semi-useful in a coco would be as a low forward drop diode bypassing the mpi's pin 8's all the way back to the irq line in the coco. I understand that some folks did this as one method of avoiding lost characters from the modem. It will probably work, but the much better technical solution is to jumper all sockets of the MPI together at each ones pin 8, and then remove 3 of the 4 IRQ pullups along the front edge of the MPI pcb. >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The other line moves faster. From lamune at doki-doki.net Tue Jul 8 16:47:35 2008 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:47:35 -0700 Subject: [Coco] coco fest 2009 In-Reply-To: <20080708.115559.3816.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080708.115559.3816.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <4873D267.8070004@doki-doki.net> Hey John, Are you intentionally sending these private emails to the entire list, or are you just unaware that we're all reading these things? John T Chasteen wrote: > Mark > > I have another MPI that doesn't work with my coco3. > will you be equipped to troubleshoot and repair at the fest > The $30.00 shipping round trip is prohibitive. > > I will be getting a coco3 that doesn't have any modifications. > Is the new board you are developing going to be ready by "show time" ? > > John > ____________________________________________________________ > Are you safe? Click for quotes on a home security system. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3ni3dQbwEZ83WIjtFoburLNXGGnAeQQJHFFPc1cKxywwUBc1/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jimhrubik at earthlink.net Tue Jul 8 17:38:40 2008 From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James Hrubik) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:38:40 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BFBD3E0-17D9-4570-8845-BD34C74A710B@earthlink.net> The Geranium probably Diode when they watered it, and the Upgrade was for when it withered... oooooooo..... On Jul 8, 2008, at Tuesday, July 8, 2008 - 4:12 PM, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: >> Hello everyone. >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational- >> Set- >> Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ >> 1QQcmdZViewItem >> >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need >> to be >> upgraded? What does it do? >> >> -- >> Charlie > > > That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are > "bragging" about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? > > ~BWC~ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco =============================================================== | O thus be it ever, when free men shall stand | | Between their loved homes and the war's desolation! | | Blest with vict'ry and peace, may the Heaven-rescued land | | Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a Nation! | | Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just; | | And this be our motto: "In GOD is our trust!" | | And the Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave | | O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave. | ==========National Anthem, United States of America============ ......................AIM : appraisebee........................ From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Tue Jul 8 21:24:05 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:24:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco fest 2009 Message-ID: <20080708.202406.6016.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Mike when I hit reply key it sends it to the "coco LIST" What I did was to reply to an e-mail Mark sent to the LIST and this is what happened. I don't consider coco e-mail private. John On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:47:35 -0700 Mike Pepe writes: > Hey John, > > Are you intentionally sending these private emails to the entire > list, > or are you just unaware that we're all reading these things? > > > > John T Chasteen wrote: > > Mark > > > > I have another MPI that doesn't work with my coco3. > > will you be equipped to troubleshoot and repair at the fest > > The $30.00 shipping round trip is prohibitive. > > > > I will be getting a coco3 that doesn't have any modifications. > > Is the new board you are developing going to be ready by "show > time" ? > > > > John > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Are you safe? Click for quotes on a home security system. > > > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3ni3dQbwEZ83WIjtFoburLN XGGnAeQQJHFFPc1cKxywwUBc1/ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From davehazelton at comcast.net Tue Jul 8 22:50:56 2008 From: davehazelton at comcast.net (David Hazelton) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 22:50:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <487381E8.9060404@swbell.net> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> <1A7CB166-FB75-44E6-88E8-CD9A6A951F24@gmail.com> <1b52e6c80807080010h53d7694dnd778b18e9c028fe6@mail.gmail.com> <487381E8.9060404@swbell.net> Message-ID: <48742790.2070803@comcast.net> I don't have a G3, but I have a G4 and Opensuse 11.0 works on that and I can't find anywhere of a minimum PPC model. I am running Mac OS 10.5.4 on a G4 450 (10.5 minimum is a 850mhz) and 10.5 runs ok. on it. Would love to upgrade my CPU but can't see me spending $300 on a 10 year old machine. Other than Dual 1.8ghz sure would speed it up :) Joel Ewy wrote: > mike delyea wrote: > >> I have an ibook thats a G3 300mhz. I've got Yellowdog linux on it >> right now. Everything works except I don't have an airport card to >> put in it so I have to hook it up via the built in ethernet. I >> believe you can also install Ubuntu up to dapper drake. >> >> >> > Yup. I don't know how much RAM you have Roger, but Ubuntu would > probably prefer at least 128M RAM. Also, Gnome (particularly the > Nautilus file manager) can be pretty sluggish on those older machines. > Xubuntu is a little more usable in such a situation, in my experience. > The last version of Ubuntu I have installed on a G3 iMac was something > around 6.04 or 6.10, I think. Another issue is that the iMac CD drives > are finicky about CD-R media. YMMV. > > JCE > >> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 12:37 AM, J.P. Samson >> wrote: >> >> >>> On Jul 7, 2008, at 10:02 PM, Roger Taylor wrote: >>> >>> >>>> I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the other >>>> day. I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE update site >>>> acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an iMac, and the >>>> FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site won't come up at all >>>> from either Netscape or IE. >>>> >>>> I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo >>>> projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? >>>> >>>> >>> This is a Mac circa 1999, so she's nine plus years old. I believe the last >>> version of the Mac OS X operating system that was officially compatible was >>> 10.3 (Panther)--that's two revisions out-of-date from today. I think you >>> will run into some difficulties finding software that will work on these >>> older OS revisions now. >>> >>> http://guides.macrumors.com/iMac_G3#Apple_iMac_G3_.28266_MHz.29_5_Colors >>> >>> Some applications have features that only work in 10.5, the latest version >>> of Mac OS X, although most still work in 10.4. The other problem is these >>> applications have been compiled and linked, and are thus dependent on the >>> later version of several core OS frameworks (libraries). Again, this means >>> they will not work in 10.3. So unlike PC users content with Windows XP over >>> Vista, I think you'll find most Mac users try to keep their OS up-to-date so >>> they can keep running the latest software! >>> >>> The last version of IE for the Mac was 5.23. I have a copy I can e-mail you >>> if need be, Roger--it's a 6.7MB file. Firefox 3 supposedly won't run on >>> your older Mac as it requires version 10.4 of the OS. You could try Firefox >>> 2. Worst case scenario is it'll crash on startup if it is incompatible with >>> your version of Mac OS X: >>> >>> http://download.mozilla.org/?product=firefox-2.0.0.15&os=osx&lang=en-US >>> >>> -- JP >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.6/1540 - Release Date: 7/8/2008 6:33 AM > > > > From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 8 23:53:21 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:21 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 61, Issue 10 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080709035312.D449D20A35@qs281.pair.com> Hmm... looks like I need to set individual mode rather than digest... The germanium diode hack was to bypass the GIME chip & get a logic signal to the MPI for RS-232 stuff - did a couple of these back in like '91 - later, there was a software mod that did the same thing Charlie, you LUCKY dawg!!! I've had similar experiences with CL & computer gear, but never Coco, congrats on a great score! (and equal kudos for surviving 90 minutes of NJ driving, I've heard stories ;)) The toggle switch switches between the two ROMs, allows you to use different ROM-based setups, like patched DECB etc. I accidently broke the Vcc pin on my Disto DECB ROM and will soon be attempting to copy it (burners are $40 now - sheesh) but for the interim, I soldered a pin onto the ROM & =that= seems to work fine. I want to stuff a real DECB ROM into it but not sure if that would work. A picture would be great, I love how we can use modern tech to help preserve the old machines - ain't so easy with the TI-99 4/a tho ;) Feel free to email direct to me or maybe upload to a Coco support site, these MC-1s are understandably rare. Gotta go reset that digest-mode thingy... =M0= From gene.heskett at verizon.net Wed Jul 9 00:04:00 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 00:04:00 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 61, Issue 10 In-Reply-To: <20080709035312.D449D20A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080709035312.D449D20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200807090004.00091.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 08 July 2008, Mike 0rtloff wrote: [...] >A picture would be great, I love how we can use modern tech to help >preserve the old machines - ain't so easy with the TI-99 4/a tho ;) > Has the repair service on those finally been discontinued? One of our local schools had about 25 of them at one time, and as recently as 9 or 10 years ago, they could box up a funkity one and send it off to TI, and it would look like new a few days later when it came back, no charge. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Hoffer's Discovery: The grand act of a dying institution is to issue a newly revised, enlarged edition of the policies and procedures manual. From jlhickle at yahoo.com Wed Jul 9 10:45:27 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 07:45:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <4BFBD3E0-17D9-4570-8845-BD34C74A710B@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <648331.26275.qm@web36601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Would the Geranium upgrade make it more compatible with the SnapDragon 64? --- On Tue, 7/8/08, James Hrubik wrote: > From: James Hrubik > Subject: Re: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 5:38 PM > The Geranium probably Diode when they watered it, and the > Upgrade was > for when it withered... > > oooooooo..... > > On Jul 8, 2008, at Tuesday, July 8, 2008 - 4:12 PM, Bruce > W. Calkins > wrote: > > >> Hello everyone. > >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: > >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up > >> > http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational- > > >> Set- > >> > Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ > > >> 1QQcmdZViewItem > >> > >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade > and why does it need > >> to be > >> upgraded? What does it do? > >> > >> -- > >> Charlie > > > > > > That's at least two of us without a clue as to > what they are > > "bragging" about. Perhaps someone else has > a clue? > > > > ~BWC~ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > =============================================================== > | O thus be it ever, when free men shall stand > | > | Between their loved homes and the war's desolation! > | > | Blest with vict'ry and peace, may the Heaven-rescued > land | > | Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a > Nation! | > | Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just; > | > | And this be our motto: "In GOD is our trust!" > | > | And the Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave > | > | O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave. > | > ==========National Anthem, United States of > America============ > ......................AIM : > appraisebee........................ > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Wed Jul 9 12:51:46 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 09:51:46 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Coco Digest, Vol 61, Issue 10 In-Reply-To: <200807090004.00091.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20080709035312.D449D20A35@qs281.pair.com> <200807090004.00091.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20080709165136.E635420A33@qs281.pair.com> At 09:04 PM 7/8/2008, you wrote: > >A picture would be great, I love how we can use modern tech to help > >preserve the old machines - ain't so easy with the TI-99 4/a tho ;) > > >Has the repair service on those finally been discontinued? One of our local >schools had about 25 of them at one time, and as recently as 9 or 10 >years ago, >they could box up a funkity one and send it off to TI, and it would look like >new a few days later when it came back, no charge. Best Kept Secret I ever heard of - I was trying to get a couple TIs & that monster P-Box going back about twelve years ago... Wasn't even any real info on the 'Net back then. The TI is now just something my 2-YO is allowed to beat on, at least it was easy to hook up to a 1983 amber monitor & $1 Goodwill speakers ;) =M0= From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 15:21:01 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:21:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 Message-ID: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> Alright, folks, so I've been pondering the FPGA-based "Coco 4". The goal is to have a more modern 6809/GIME-compatible system that can run NitrOS-9 and still provide hacking fun. Here's what I have in mind: 1. An FPGA (Spartan 3S250 probably) containing: a. 6809-compatible core b. a memory/bus interface unit (w/ DAT/MMU), c. DMA controller, d. interrupt controller. 2. 2MB of on-board RAM; 3. External 3.3<->5V TTL transceivers for interfacing with an 8-bit bus, somewhat Coco compatible, with the addition of DMA interface signals. No guarantee that Coco cards that do their own address selection (i.e., don't use SCS* or CTS*) will work. E clock will run at 1 or 2MHz. 4. 4-8 slots A very basic "ROM" will reside in an FPGA block RAM; its job will be to scan the ROMs on the peripheral cards for a console device and a boot device and boot the system on the first set it finds. Note that the ROMs will have a mini-modular format like OS-9; some sort of indication of device type and some entry points to read/write to the device. (The contents of the peripheral ROMs will probably be copied into some RAM by the bus interface unit on RESET* before the CPU core is started. This way the ROMs will not have to occupy any space in the memory map and no special control registers will be required to map them in/out.) Important notes: 1. No support for 6309 instructions. These additions have been exploited nicely for increased performance in NitrOS-9, but IMHO are generally cumbersome and not orthogonal with respect to the rest of the instruction set. With a core running at 10-20MHz, there's little need to dirty up our code with these hacks. Also, given that I intend to do this in 'discrete' logic [almost] and don't have the advantage of microcode that the 6309 folks had. More registers and instructions means more combinational logic and thus lower speeds. (Note that I probably _will_ implement illegal instruction trap. Depends.) 2. The GIME support will be restricted to MMU functions and possibly the programmable timer. The interrupt controller will probably be compatible though the interrupt sources will differ. 3. I'm up in the air on integrated peripherals, particularly keyboard/video. I feel like that sort of stuff should be left to peripheral cards. I'll probably run this thing off an ACIA card + terminal rather than integrated video/keyboard. Any comments? Any interest? C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 15:35:21 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:35:21 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. Message-ID: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming up. 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. Hardware-wise, #2 and #3 are both easy. Software-wise, #3 will be a breeze. #2 will be tough because I'll need to write a new file manager and such. But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP doesn't count (too slow!). For those who are dubious, no, TCP/IP isn't terribly difficult to implement -- TCP can be tricky when your aim is high throughput, but I'm not aiming at that. We're talking limited window sizes here. C. From mdelyea at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 15:45:25 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 15:45:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807091245m728ed2b5l4f1eef8fa8c9e1ff@mail.gmail.com> Yes that sounds really useful. If I'm correct you would have a floppy controller, an IDE controller, ethernet and at least 1 serial port on the card? Yes, I'd really be interested in something like that. On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming > up. > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. > 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; > 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. > > Hardware-wise, #2 and #3 are both easy. Software-wise, #3 will be a > breeze. #2 will be tough because I'll need to write a new file manager > and such. > > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > doesn't count (too slow!). > > For those who are dubious, no, TCP/IP isn't terribly difficult to > implement -- TCP can be tricky when your aim is high throughput, but I'm > not aiming at that. We're talking limited window sizes here. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 15:53:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:53:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807091245m728ed2b5l4f1eef8fa8c9e1ff@mail.gmail.com> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <1b52e6c80807091245m728ed2b5l4f1eef8fa8c9e1ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1215633226.8132.28.camel@dev> Actually, I was intending separate cards; 1. An FDC card 2. An IDE controller (maybe. kinda pointless, my proto FDCs have IDE on them for _me_, and other folks have IDE controllers out there, Cloud-9 e.g.) 3. Dual UART card 4. Ethernet card C. On Wed, 2008-07-09 at 15:45 -0400, mike delyea wrote: > Yes that sounds really useful. If I'm correct you would have a floppy > controller, an IDE controller, ethernet and at least 1 serial port on > the card? Yes, I'd really be interested in something like that. > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Chuck Youse > wrote: > > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming > > up. > > > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. > > 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; > > 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. > > > > Hardware-wise, #2 and #3 are both easy. Software-wise, #3 will be a > > breeze. #2 will be tough because I'll need to write a new file manager > > and such. > > > > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > > doesn't count (too slow!). > > > > For those who are dubious, no, TCP/IP isn't terribly difficult to > > implement -- TCP can be tricky when your aim is high throughput, but I'm > > not aiming at that. We're talking limited window sizes here. > > > > C. > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From skwirl42 at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 16:00:52 2008 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:00:52 -0300 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> On 7/9/08, Chuck Youse wrote: > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > doesn't count (too slow!). I had been trying in the past to get ethernet going on the CoCo. My main problem was that my hardware design skills are next to non-existant. Added to that was the issue that at the time there were no decent compilers that would work on a modern host. However, there is now someone actively developing gcc6809, by the name of Brian Dominy. Support for any variant of OS9 is missing in the linker, however, and AFAIK, PIC code generation is also missing. However, if that were dealt with, uIP is a nice little TCP/IP stack that fits well inside 8K of RAM. I had managed to get it running within an ATmega8 processor with a small http server included. Ethernet hardware is pretty cheap these days, and a basic driver would probably be fine. uIP already contains AVR compatible C code for an RTL8019 controller. The RTL8091's address space is kinda large considering the CoCo's IO address footprint, however. -- James Dessart From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 16:10:25 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 16:10:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1215634225.8132.36.camel@dev> I'm not a uIP fan because of its rather unusual interface (the application is responsible for buffering data in case of retransmission, it's state-driven, etc.). It's meant for _very_ small uC environments, and a Coco 3 w/ OS-9 and 512K of RAM doesn't really qualify. I'd be much more comfortable with something more like the traditional socket interface, in the form of a file manager. Don't sell the Coco short! As for hardware, SiLabs makes a chip called the CP2200 which is an integrated 10baseT MAC/PHY. Interestingly, it probably will require very little in the way of bus interfacing to the Coco. Its only drawback is that it has odd requirements on the magnetics, 1:2.5 turns ratio on the transmit lines -- but that's just a minor annoyance rather than a serious problem. I've got three of the chips and three compatible jacks handy, so I'll give it a whirl. C. On Wed, 2008-07-09 at 17:00 -0300, James Dessart wrote: > On 7/9/08, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > > doesn't count (too slow!). > > I had been trying in the past to get ethernet going on the CoCo. My > main problem was that my hardware design skills are next to > non-existant. Added to that was the issue that at the time there were > no decent compilers that would work on a modern host. > > However, there is now someone actively developing gcc6809, by the name > of Brian Dominy. Support for any variant of OS9 is missing in the > linker, however, and AFAIK, PIC code generation is also missing. > > However, if that were dealt with, uIP is a nice little TCP/IP stack > that fits well inside 8K of RAM. I had managed to get it running > within an ATmega8 processor with a small http server included. > > Ethernet hardware is pretty cheap these days, and a basic driver would > probably be fine. uIP already contains AVR compatible C code for an > RTL8019 controller. The RTL8091's address space is kinda large > considering the CoCo's IO address footprint, however. > From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Wed Jul 9 16:42:14 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 15:42:14 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080709.154214.4884.1.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Mark When will the SUPERBOARD be ready to ship? I am getting a coco3 that hasn't been modified. John ____________________________________________________________ Huge inventory of used cars and trucks. Click now to find the used car you need! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oE0cNokZ7KjBPLhuUojglXBar94fWWrMcRtkWrV4SYRLs3n/ From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Wed Jul 9 18:47:19 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 18:47:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: Here you go. I hope the picture is god enough, the very top is cut off. If you need me to take it again, no problem. Let me know. http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad/MISC/distomc-1.jpg Charlie "Mike 0rtloff" wrote in message news:20080708164139.2629720A33 at qs281.pair.com... > Heya List!! > > Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be known, > I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet NGs for the > last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some formatting thing I > missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) > > Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire set, and > spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals have gotten > mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) and just plain > lost in moves. > > First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot Pack, Disto > MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. > > ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent > troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) > > 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is > missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years ago, the > little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and I'd like > to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, but it never > had a schematic or chip list anyway. > > 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of the > Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the > 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the placement, a > graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the MC-1 were > always a mystery as well. > > 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 exclusively > when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques I used. Can the > 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any hard/software hacks to make it > so? > > Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! > > =Mike 0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Wed Jul 9 18:49:41 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 18:49:41 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade References: Message-ID: "Bruce W. Calkins" wrote in message news:F048AB76B3334C3588D960FEEDB590F5 at speedy... >> Hello everyone. >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational-Set-Up_W0QQitemZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem >> >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need to be >> upgraded? What does it do? >> >> -- >> Charlie > > > That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are "bragging" > about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? > > ~BWC~ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > It seems that coco on ebay has flower power. ;-) Funny stuff. From chawks at dls.net Wed Jul 9 20:05:41 2008 From: chawks at dls.net (Christopher Hawks) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:05:41 -0500 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215634225.8132.36.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> <1215634225.8132.36.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48755255.6060606@dls.net> Chuck Youse said the following on 07/09/2008 03:10 PM: > I'm not a uIP fan because of its rather unusual interface (the > application is responsible for buffering data in case of retransmission, > it's state-driven, etc.). It's meant for _very_ small uC environments, > and a Coco 3 w/ OS-9 and 512K of RAM doesn't really qualify. I'd be > much more comfortable with something more like the traditional socket > interface, in the form of a file manager. Don't sell the Coco short! Remember 8k would be very large for a file manager and I doubt that it would be that small. I've been thinking about a port of uIP for NitrOS-9 (with some additions to make the interface cleaner). The thought of a file manager is neat however, and I'll consider that as well. (I've had some experience with TCP/IP (wrote a stack for OS-9/68000) and file managers (wrote an ISO9660 file manager for NitrOS-9 and OS-9/68000). > As for hardware, SiLabs makes a chip called the CP2200 which is an > integrated 10baseT MAC/PHY. Interestingly, it probably will require > very little in the way of bus interfacing to the Coco. Its only > drawback is that it has odd requirements on the magnetics, 1:2.5 turns > ratio on the transmit lines -- but that's just a minor annoyance rather > than a serious problem. I've got three of the chips and three > compatible jacks handy, so I'll give it a whirl. That'll give me some hardware to talk to! -- Christopher R. Hawks HAWKSoft --------------------------------------------------------- Microsoft is not the answer. Microsoft is the question. NO (or Linux) is the answer. -- Taken from a .signature from someone from the UK, source unknown From skwirl42 at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 20:09:28 2008 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 21:09:28 -0300 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <48755255.6060606@dls.net> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> <1215634225.8132.36.camel@dev> <48755255.6060606@dls.net> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30807091709j67eb393cq727712575a620e75@mail.gmail.com> On 7/9/08, Christopher Hawks wrote: > Remember 8k would be very large for a file manager and I doubt that > it would be that small. I've been thinking about a port of uIP for NitrOS-9 > (with some additions to make the interface cleaner). The thought of a file > manager is neat however, and I'll consider that as well. (I've had some > experience with TCP/IP (wrote a stack for OS-9/68000) and file managers > (wrote an ISO9660 file manager for NitrOS-9 and OS-9/68000). And it'd be nice if more than one process could take advantage of it. The main benefit to uIP is that the code is there. Yes, it does have an odd programming interface, but it works as advertised and is available now. It'd take a bit of tweaking to make it universally useful in NitrOS-9. Has anyone tried compiling the code using an OS9-hosted compiler? Might be worth a try. I don't have any such compilers on hand. -- James Dessart From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 20:14:09 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:14:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <48755255.6060606@dls.net> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <4c56cbd30807091300w7c372cf2ube06f8a817bde52c@mail.gmail.com> <1215634225.8132.36.camel@dev> <48755255.6060606@dls.net> Message-ID: <1215648849.6901.4.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-09 at 19:05 -0500, Christopher Hawks wrote: > Remember 8k would be very large for a file manager and I doubt that it would > be that small. I've been thinking about a port of uIP for NitrOS-9 (with some > additions to make the interface cleaner). The thought of a file manager is neat > however, and I'll consider that as well. (I've had some experience with TCP/IP > (wrote a stack for OS-9/68000) and file managers (wrote an ISO9660 file manager > for NitrOS-9 and OS-9/68000). Honestly- crafted in assembly language a file manager would not be so large. Consider the foundations; Ethernet driver, IP, ARP, ICMP - not 8K worth of stuff. TCP - not much different, provided you maintain a fixed buffer size and advertise a small window. Much of the overhead - code and data size - associated with TCP is directly related to high-performance! Even RBF weighs in at under 8K. This will be smaller .. C. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Wed Jul 9 21:04:27 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:04:27 +1000 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > Alright, folks, so I've been pondering the FPGA-based "Coco 4". The > goal is to have a more modern 6809/GIME-compatible system that can run > NitrOS-9 and still provide hacking fun. (snip) > Any comments? Any interest? Your post infers that you're already familiar with earlier discussions on this very topic on this mailing list - yes? There's a wealth of proposals and ideas from a number of us in the group, so not quite sure what you want us to add without re-iterating what's already been said?!? Since the discussions, Gary Becker has released an operational Coco 3 FPGA design based on John Kent's 6809 core. IIRC he has an "overclocking" mode. Note that I could never get his design working on my own hardware. YMMV. IMHO, I'd be adding peripherals inside the FPGA as far as possible. Maximum flexibility and minimum cost. Note that ethernet MAC, IDE controller and multiple UART cores, as you mention in your "two other things" thread, are all easily implemented on-chip (I've had plenty experience will all 3) with a few simple external support chips such as PHY and serial line drivers. And extended video modes are reasonably trivial - the problem is software support and squeezing enough grunt out of the 6809 to do anything useful with a few MB of pixels... Aside from that - interested? - yes, very! Time to do anything about it atm? Unfortunately, no. I'm guilty of having *way* too many irons in the fire to the point where I don't even know what to work on anymore. :( Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 21:44:29 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 21:44:29 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 11:04 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > IMHO, I'd be adding peripherals inside the FPGA as far as possible. Maximum > flexibility and minimum cost. Note that ethernet MAC, IDE controller and > multiple UART cores, as you mention in your "two other things" thread, are > all easily implemented on-chip (I've had plenty experience will all 3) with > a few simple external support chips such as PHY and serial line drivers. And > extended video modes are reasonably trivial - the problem is software > support and squeezing enough grunt out of the 6809 to do anything useful > with a few MB of pixels... Boooring. c. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 21:45:25 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 21:45:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1215654325.6901.8.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 11:04 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > Since the discussions, Gary Becker has released an operational Coco 3 FPGA > design based on John Kent's 6809 core. IIRC he has an "overclocking" mode. > Note that I could never get his design working on my own hardware. YMMV. And for the record -- no insult to John -- his 6809 core reeks of lack of actual ASIC design experience. C. From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Wed Jul 9 22:09:48 2008 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 23:09:48 -0300 Subject: [Coco] iMac/CoCo emulator users here? In-Reply-To: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708040232.613F320A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <48756F6C.8070207@adinet.com.uy> For Mac OS-9, I believe that the best browser around would be ICab http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICab Or you could even try Netscape 7 http://archive.netscape.com/releases Diego Roger Taylor wrote: > I obtained a very nice G3 266mhz iMac at a garage sale for $20 the > other day and finally got it on the web only to the find the Netscape > and IE browsers are so out of date that JavaScript causes occasional > crashes and lockups and just doesn't make for a nice web experience. > I can't find or access any updating sites yet. The IE update site > acts like it doesn't recognize that I'm visiting from an iMac, and the > FireFox site won't come up right, and the Safari site won't come up at > all from either Netscape or IE. > > I want to bring the iMac up to date somehow and use it with my CoCo > projects... will M.E.S.S. run on the iMac, any other CoCo emulators? > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jdaggett at gate.net Wed Jul 9 22:15:12 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 22:15:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48753870.8282.CF34E@jdaggett.gate.net> On 9 Jul 2008 at 15:35, Chuck Youse wrote: > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming > up. > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. > 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; > 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. > For me I think floppy disk system is archaic. Darn I have on eon my PC and I have hardly used it in the last three years. SUpport for USB drives would be more useful in my opinion than a floppy disk system. One could interface the Vinculum chip into an 8 bit system like a COco3 with little difficulty. james > Hardware-wise, #2 and #3 are both easy. Software-wise, #3 will be a > breeze. #2 will be tough because I'll need to write a new file > manager and such. > > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > doesn't count (too slow!). > > For those who are dubious, no, TCP/IP isn't terribly difficult to > implement -- TCP can be tricky when your aim is high throughput, but > I'm not aiming at that. We're talking limited window sizes here. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1542 - Release Date: > 7/9/2008 6:50 AM > > From farna at att.net Wed Jul 9 22:16:51 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 22:16:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 Message-ID: <48757113.4030303@att.net> Chuck, you have to remember that lot of people doing things for the CoCo and the old "home" computers are self-taught hobbyists. I understand your criticism, and it's probably deserved, but the guy did get the thing out there, and he does deserve a lot of credit just for that! So take what he did and improve it. Should be easier/quicker than writing from scratch, even if you do have to re-write 75% or so of the code. For your own benefit having preipherals as add-ons might be fine, but for max usefulness to others having what I consider the basics (FDC, dual IDE headers, and a couple serial ports) on board would be extremely nice. I'd rather see video on the board too, then it would make a nice little stand-alone computer, but using another PC (or even a CoCo!) as a terminal seems like an acceptable proposal. It's not like people interested in computers don't have one or two lying around now, and older computers that would work fine as a terminal are cheap and easy to find. Might be a good use for that old 486 Compaq laptop I've still got in good working order! Am I understanding correctly that the expansion buss would be pin compatible with the CoCo buss? That would be wonderful! I understand the decoding part. Since the computer will really be a NitrOS-9 dedicated machine, that shouldn't be a big problem. I'd really like to see a USB port on board, but a plug-in "smart card" would probably be better -- USB implemented via a microcontroller that translates signals for the CoCo buss. Drivers would have to be written specifically for certain peripherals, which would increase processor overhead, but as you said, running the 6809 at 10-20 mhz should help things out a lot! My main interest would be to operate a printer. Even if the card/port had to be dedicated to a certain brand/type printer it would still be useful since the only thing you can get anymore is USB inkjets (inexpensively). As long as it's a popular printer a ROM dedicated to a certain model would be fine. Even an adapter that plugged into the CoCo serial port, sort of like the old serial to parallel adapter, would be wonderful! Of course plugged into a terminal I suppose output can be redirected to the terminal printer. If using a PC not a problem, using something like a CoCo greatly limits printer output. Like others here I have lots of ideas, but not real skills to implement them with. The USB/printer idea might not be practical because of costs -- would likely end up retailing for $100 or more, then a new ROM might need to be developed when a printer model gets dropped! --------------- Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 21:45:25 -0400 From: Chuck Youse Subject: Re: [Coco] The X9 On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 11:04 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > > Since the discussions, Gary Becker has released an operational Coco 3 FPGA > > design based on John Kent's 6809 core. IIRC he has an "overclocking" mode. > > Note that I could never get his design working on my own hardware. YMMV. > And for the record -- no insult to John -- his 6809 core reeks of lack of actual ASIC design experience. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From rrivey at yahoo.com Wed Jul 9 23:00:17 2008 From: rrivey at yahoo.com (Richard Ivey) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 20:00:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! Message-ID: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Found a net little article about 8 player racing game via a pc server over the internet. http://home.ica.net/~leifb/commodore/racer/ If the Commodore can do it, why can't our little COCO? From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 9 23:05:23 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 23:05:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <48753870.8282.CF34E@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> <48753870.8282.CF34E@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1215659123.8306.2.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-09 at 22:15 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > On 9 Jul 2008 at 15:35, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming > > up. > > > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. > > 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; > > 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. > > > > For me I think floppy disk system is archaic. Darn I have on eon my PC and > I have hardly used it in the last three years. SUpport for USB drives would > be more useful in my opinion than a floppy disk system. One could interface > the Vinculum chip into an 8 bit system like a COco3 with little difficulty. > > james Go for it. C. From chadbh74 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 9 23:50:12 2008 From: chadbh74 at hotmail.com (Chad H) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 22:50:12 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This is apparently a mis-word used. "Geranium" is in fact a flower as many know, but some people actually refer to some diodes as "geranium diodes", and are using the wrong word. Two of the most common elements used to make diodes are Silicon and Germanium, hence the "Germanium Diodes", which is what this really is. As to its function on the CoCo? Well I don't have a clue. Anyone? - Chad -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Charlie Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 5:50 PM To: coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: Re: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade "Bruce W. Calkins" wrote in message news:F048AB76B3334C3588D960FEEDB590F5 at speedy... >> Hello everyone. >> I'm looking at this ebay auction: >> Tandy Color Computer 3 Complete Operational Set Up >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Color-Computer-3-Complete-Operational-Set-Up_W0QQi temZ180260384799QQihZ008QQcategoryZ4193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem >> >> I'm wondering what is Geranium Diode Upgrade and why does it need to be >> upgraded? What does it do? >> >> -- >> Charlie > > > That's at least two of us without a clue as to what they are "bragging" > about. Perhaps someone else has a clue? > > ~BWC~ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > It seems that coco on ebay has flower power. ;-) Funny stuff. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Thu Jul 10 03:16:42 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:16:42 +1000 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > Boooring. You asked for comments. I took the time to read your posts and then took the time to offer some, and this is the response I get. Not to mention a rather rude dismissive hand-waving concerning John's 6809 core. I think I'll be the one yawning at your posts from now on.... -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 10 08:58:19 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:58:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 17:16 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > > > Boooring. > > You asked for comments. I took the time to read your posts and then took the > time to offer some, and this is the response I get. > My apologies, it WAS a bit gruff and unwarranted - at least one mitigating factor to consider was that I was piss-drunk, not that that's an excuse. The SoC CoCo has been done (as you pointed out), and frankly, if we're going to just put everything in one FPGA, why don't we just run this stuff in emulators? That's just not fun. You are (I assume) an EE. Why do _you_ think it would be fun? > Not to mention a rather rude dismissive hand-waving concerning John's 6809 core. It was not meant to be rude, it was simply an observation, and an accurate one. I'm fairly familiar with his core, and it carries the hallmarks of someone who isn't schooled in digital design. Does it work? Yes, I've used it in the past and it seems to be reasonably accurate. Does that mean it's good? Not necessarily. Excessive resources (be it speed, memory, gate area, etc.) make up the difference these days between people's competence (or lack thereof) and their ability to execute. John's core reads more like a software emulator than a hardware representation of an 8-bit microprocessor, it slides by because FPGAs are giant and fast. Sorry John. I could go off on a little tangent about modern comp sci grads or professional "programmers" who seem unable to churn out even the simplest of code without requiring ungodly amounts of RAM and CPUs running in the GHz range for even modest performance. Same principle applies. > I think I'll be he one yawning at your posts from now on.... Yes, don't bother, as I'll be keeping my mouth shut. There is no market for my 'archaic' projects anyway - I've been working on them to pass some time and make my CoCo usable (for instance, I didn't have a floppy controller) as an amateur radio base station; things don't really get interesting in EE until radio, anyway.. So my designs, (schematics, PCBs, software), etc. will be available on www.serialtechnologies.com for those who need some hardware for whatever reason, and for the rare person who is interested I will announce new stuff on the list. But I will, in general, lurk rather than speak. Happy trails, C. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Thu Jul 10 09:30:29 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 23:30:29 +1000 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48760EF5.6060707@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > My apologies, it WAS a bit gruff and unwarranted Accepted. > The SoC CoCo has been done (as you pointed out), and frankly, if we're > going to just put everything in one FPGA, why don't we just run this > stuff in emulators? That's just not fun. You are (I assume) an EE. > Why do _you_ think it would be fun? I can sort of see your POV, but to me, the flexibility of design and re-configurability on-the-fly are big selling points. As an EE, I like the idea of being able to spin a board early on and still leave a lot of options available for the finished product. I don't really see much difference between laying down a 16550 and instantiating a 16550 VHDL core in an FPGA. At the end of the day, you still have a physical PCB to which you can attach real coco carts, real coco disk drives and a modem - regardless of whether or not the PCB contains 1 chip or 10. And that's still different (for me) again to running a Coco emulator on a PC. I guess having a very broad range of retro interests, a 'generic' FPGA solution is attractive to me because it can be used for a variety of platforms. I have the same PCB running Apple II, BBC, C64, TRS-80, Coco and Amiga designs, plus many more. > I could go off on a little tangent about modern comp sci grads or > professional "programmers" who seem unable to churn out even the > simplest of code without requiring ungodly amounts of RAM and CPUs > running in the GHz range for even modest performance. Same principle > applies. I agree! > Yes, don't bother, as I'll be keeping my mouth shut. There is no market > for my 'archaic' projects anyway - I've been working on them to pass > some time and make my CoCo usable (for instance, I didn't have a floppy > controller) as an amateur radio base station; things don't really get > interesting in EE until radio, anyway.. You'd be surprised. I find most 'archaic' (retro) projects interesting, and regardless of the perceived market I think you'll find there are others interested in what you're doing. I wouldn't tackle the problems the same way as you do, but they're interesting none-the-less. Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 09:49:15 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:49:15 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215659123.8306.2.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev>, <48753870.8282.CF34E@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1215659123.8306.2.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4875DB1B.18469.387DE@jdaggett.gate.net> I am! james On 9 Jul 2008 at 23:05, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Wed, 2008-07-09 at 22:15 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > On 9 Jul 2008 at 15:35, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > > > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have > > > coming up. > > > > > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. 2. > > > A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; 3. A dual > > > 16550-compatible UART card. > > > > > > > For me I think floppy disk system is archaic. Darn I have on eon my > > PC and I have hardly used it in the last three years. SUpport for > > USB drives would be more useful in my opinion than a floppy disk > > system. One could interface the Vinculum chip into an 8 bit system > > like a COco3 with little difficulty. > > > > james > > Go for it. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 09:49:15 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:49:15 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. In-Reply-To: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> References: <1215632121.8132.26.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4875DB1B.1653.387AF@jdaggett.gate.net> On 9 Jul 2008 at 15:35, Chuck Youse wrote: > .. on the drawing board, if anyone's interested in what I have coming > up. > > 1. Well, I need to respin the FDC. Couple of changes required. > 2. A 10baseT ethernet interface w/ IP stack for NitrOS-9; > 3. A dual 16550-compatible UART card. > For me I think floppy disk system is archaic. Darn I have on eon my PC and I have hardly used it in the last three years. SUpport for USB drives would be more useful in my opinion than a floppy disk system. One could interface the Vinculum chip into an 8 bit system like a COco3 with little difficulty. james > Hardware-wise, #2 and #3 are both easy. Software-wise, #3 will be a > breeze. #2 will be tough because I'll need to write a new file > manager and such. > > But I really think the only thing that makes using NitrOS-9 today > somewhat problematic is its lack of Ethernet/IP support. I could > _totally_ use it as a workstation if it were networked. And no, SLIP > doesn't count (too slow!). > > For those who are dubious, no, TCP/IP isn't terribly difficult to > implement -- TCP can be tricky when your aim is high throughput, but > I'm not aiming at that. We're talking limited window sizes here. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1542 - Release Date: > 7/9/2008 6:50 AM > > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jul 10 10:08:39 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 10:08:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> Message-ID: <200807101008.39504.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 10 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: [...] >So my designs, (schematics, PCBs, software), etc. will be available on >www.serialtechnologies.com for those who need some hardware for whatever >reason, and for the rare person who is interested I will announce new >stuff on the list. But I will, in general, lurk rather than speak. > >Happy trails, >C. > I disagree Chuck, I'm following the progress reports with interest. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) And if you wonder, What I am doing, As I am heading for the sink. I am spitting out all the bitterness, Along with half of my last drink. From underserf at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 11:16:04 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:16:04 -0700 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com> >http://home.ica.net/~leifb/commodore/racer/ > >If the Commodore can do it, why can't our little COCO? Ummm, because the Commie even today has a much larger userbase? What was once labor for profit is today a labor of love, and if ya got more lovers... Just like the engineers on the list are discussing, with modern FPGA/GAL logic you can turn a Cuisinart into a Channel F, all it takes is money. Or such is as I've been told ;) =M0= From mark at cloud9tech.com Thu Jul 10 11:35:26 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 10:35:26 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <20080709.154214.4884.1.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080709.154214.4884.1.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <20080710103526.da6gk9znp0ccks4w@webmail.frontiernet.net> John, I work on it when I can. Currently system orders are 8 weeks ARO. Summer/Fall is a very busy time for me. I'm taking vacation tomorrow just to process orders. Common occurance for me. Regards, Mark Quoting John T Chasteen : > Mark > > When will the SUPERBOARD be ready to ship? > I am getting a coco3 that hasn't been modified. > > John > ____________________________________________________________ > Huge inventory of used cars and trucks. Click now to find the used > car you need! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oE0cNokZ7KjBPLhuUojglXBar94fWWrMcRtkWrV4SYRLs3n/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From underserf at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 11:50:01 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:50:01 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> BEAUTIFUL image Charlie, if there's an archive site, they should put that up. It looks like the case & PCB are cherry, unlike mine which saw some 5 years of daily use. The one you have is around 4 years newer than mine or, more accurately, the chips are newer & one of the 7406s on my board are replaced with a 7416 on yours (the 16 is tougher than the 06 as I recall) Mine has 4 chips socketed in addition to the ROMs. Disto must have figured us for pretty clumsy Back In The Day ;) BIG thanx for the help, Charlie! Funny, even Howard Medical has no idea what their Slot Pack Three was and is *heh* Peace! =M0= >Here you go. I hope the picture is god enough, the very top is cut off. If >you need me to take it again, no problem. >Let me know. >http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad/MISC/distomc-1.jpg > >Charlie > >"Mike 0rtloff" wrote in >message news:20080708164139.2629720A33 at qs281.pair.com... > > Heya List!! > > > > Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be known, > > I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet NGs for the > > last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some formatting thing I > > missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) > > > > Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire set, and > > spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals have gotten > > mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) and just plain > > lost in moves. > > > > First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot Pack, Disto > > MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. > > > > ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent > > troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) > > > > 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is > > missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years ago, the > > little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and I'd like > > to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, but it never > > had a schematic or chip list anyway. > > > > 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of the > > Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the > > 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the placement, a > > graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the MC-1 were > > always a mystery as well. > > > > 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 exclusively > > when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques I used. Can the > > 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any hard/software hacks to make it > > so? > > > > Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! > > > > =Mike 0= > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From farna at att.net Thu Jul 10 13:12:32 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:12:32 -0400 Subject: [Coco] two other things.. Message-ID: <48764300.6060706@att.net> The problem at least *was* that all CoCo/OS-9 related software was on floppy disks. With ethernet support floppies become less necessary, just download the software! Same with USB or CF cards -- download it onto a PC then transfer to a card/USB drive if nothing else. When you discover a hidden trove of old floppy disks you'll be up the creek, or have to find someone who can transfer them. Realistically, however, I don't think not having a floppy will be a big problem. A two channel IDE controller fixes that -- one channel for a HD, one for a CF card adapter -- or two CF adapters... who needs 80 GB or more with OS-9? A couple big CF cards should supply all the storage necessary. Why not an emulator? If you make a small single board computer it can be used for both development and actual applications. A lot of people have done that with the CoCo. There's also the ease of interfacing to the CoCo buss even if you build in all the most desired peripherals and just have a single slot -- there's always the option of a "Y" cable if that single slot is properly buffered. That would keep costs down too. That's what makes the terminal design you mentioned most attractive. The system will run just fine with no monitor or terminal plugged in. The serial port (at least one of them) needs to be buffered so that a terminal can be plugged in/out while the thing is running without interfering with operation though. Might have to tweak the driver for that also. Just put the thing in a small plastic box, then I can connect that old 486 laptop to it and have a nice portable system! If you make it and I get one, I might just mount it in a flat box that could be strapped to the bottom of the laptop, making it an inch or so thicker. The one good thing about the old 486 is it has a real serial port! Might even be able to tap into the power supply for a true portable, though the battery in it went a long time ago. What with playing with old cars so much now, I don't really have a lot of time for computer work, and I've just about forgot what little C programming I knew... I'd even have a hard time hacking something out in DECB!! ---------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:49:15 -0400 From: jdaggett at gate.net For me I think floppy disk system is archaic. Darn I have on eon my PC and I have hardly used it in the last three years. SUpport for USB drives would be more useful in my opinion than a floppy disk system. One could interface the Vinculum chip into an 8 bit system like a COco3 with little difficulty. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Thu Jul 10 13:38:06 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 12:38:06 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080710.123806.3724.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Mark On your web site you sasay the SUPERBOARD is comming soon. Is the SUPERBOARD MOD. AVAILABLE NOW? If so, how much is this upgrade going to cost? John On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 10:35:26 -0500 Mark Marlette writes: > John, > > I work on it when I can. > > Currently system orders are 8 weeks ARO. > > Summer/Fall is a very busy time for me. > > I'm taking vacation tomorrow just to process orders. Common > occurance for me. > > Regards, > > Mark > > Quoting John T Chasteen : > > > Mark > > > > When will the SUPERBOARD be ready to ship? > > I am getting a coco3 that hasn't been modified. > > > > John > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Huge inventory of used cars and trucks. Click now to find the used > > > car you need! > > > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oE0cNokZ7KjBPLhuUojglX Bar94fWWrMcRtkWrV4SYRLs3n/ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From mark at cloud9tech.com Thu Jul 10 14:41:32 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:41:32 -0500 Subject: [Coco] coco SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <20080710.123806.3724.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080710.123806.3724.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <20080710134132.b6xlk2w0qo0gow00@webmail.frontiernet.net> John, Coming soon is a relative statement. The tab should WAY OVER DUE, it is...... :( There are only so many hours in a day and answering Emails takes time away from doing other tasks. Completing orders which allows me to do development. Base board is going to be $150-$170, minus downpayments, options ~half of what the standalone product costs. This is subject to change. Until the design is locked and ready to be released anything is possible. Are you vacationing in Europe somewhere? Mark Quoting John T Chasteen : > Mark > On your web site you sasay the SUPERBOARD is comming soon. > Is the SUPERBOARD MOD. AVAILABLE NOW? > If so, how much is this upgrade going to cost? > John > > On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 10:35:26 -0500 Mark Marlette > writes: >> John, >> >> I work on it when I can. >> >> Currently system orders are 8 weeks ARO. >> >> Summer/Fall is a very busy time for me. >> >> I'm taking vacation tomorrow just to process orders. Common >> occurance for me. >> >> Regards, >> >> Mark >> >> Quoting John T Chasteen : >> >> > Mark >> > >> > When will the SUPERBOARD be ready to ship? >> > I am getting a coco3 that hasn't been modified. >> > >> > John >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > Huge inventory of used cars and trucks. Click now to find the used >> >> > car you need! >> > >> > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oE0cNokZ7KjBPLhuUojglX > Bar94fWWrMcRtkWrV4SYRLs3n/ >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From skwirl42 at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 16:01:18 2008 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:01:18 -0300 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> On 7/10/08, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > Ummm, because the Commie even today has a much larger userbase? What was > once labor for profit is today a labor of love, and if ya got more lovers... Part of the problem is that there just aren't enough of us. Other than NitrOS-9, I don't know of a project that has more than a couple of people working on it. Please, correct me if I'm wrong. -- James Dessart From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 16:23:42 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 16:23:42 -0400 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com>, <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> James My impressions are that for the Coco there is this issue of which do you develop for, the OS9 users or the RSDOS users or both? My understnding that the Commodore does not have this type of conflict in their user base. Obviously the OS9 userbase would benefit more from a TCP/IP. There has always been this compatability conflict that has plagued the Coco for years. james On 10 Jul 2008 at 17:01, James Dessart wrote: > On 7/10/08, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > Ummm, because the Commie even today has a much larger userbase? > > What was > > once labor for profit is today a labor of love, and if ya got more > > lovers... > > Part of the problem is that there just aren't enough of us. Other than > NitrOS-9, I don't know of a project that has more than a couple of > people working on it. Please, correct me if I'm wrong. > > -- > James Dessart > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1544 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 7:37 AM > > From underserf at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 17:03:16 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:03:16 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> Earlier today I had noticed Dennis B?thory-Kitsz =is= maltedmedia... I promptly dove into my ancient, dusty boxes searching for the magazines he once published. Didn't find 'em (they're there, somewhere) but I stumbled across the following document, from a kit I purchased in '91... --- begin author unknown INTERRUPT MODIFICATION INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS The purpose of this modification is to correct a problem with the flow of the cartridge interrupt to the CPU in a Color Computer 3. The cartridge interrupt is used primarily in OS/9 with the RS232 Pak to inform the CPU when a character has been received. The ACIAPAK driver requires this interrupt signal to operate properly, although the MODPAK driver does not. The signal in the CoC03 is routed througi1 the GIME chip, which every so often does not pass it to the CPU. When this occurs, the ACIAPAK driver (and thus the /T2 or similar port) locks up. Terminal programs and other software utilizing an ACIAPAK type port show a tendency to lock up because of this problem. The modification consists of a jumper with a diode wired into it, which connects the cartridge interrupt directly to the CPU, bypassing the GIME. The diode keeps interrupt signals from going backwards. [and as anyone can tell you, the forward voltage drop of a germanium diode is lower than a similar silicon diode, so more of the signal gets through, something must have been out of spec for it to matter] Note that this modification only affects the CoCo3 motherboard and that if a Multi-Pak Interface is being used that it can also cause the same problem. The cartridge interrupt is routed through the Multi-Pak controller chip, which also may loose interrupt signals occasionally. If this is the case, simply wiring pin 8 ( CART) from the slot for the RS232 pak to pin 8 of the card edge will solve it. No traces need be cut and any number or all of the slots can be wired together. INSTALLATION Open the case by removing the screws in the bottom, exposing the motherboard. Locate resistor R7, which is right next to the metal grounding tab for the keyboard on the left side. Clip the BLACK lead onto the right side of R7 (closest to the big 6821 chip). Next, locate R2, which is directly behind the reset button. Clip the RED lead onto the side of R2 away from the reset button. The unit is now installed, and the only difference that should be noticed is elimination of the ACIA lock-up syndrome. ----- end document [there's an ASCII graphic at the bottom of this document, but experience with ASCII is it only looks good on paper ;)] As the engineers & software authors in here can tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would have a problem =M0= >This is apparently a mis-word used. "Geranium" is in fact a flower as many >know, but some people actually refer to some diodes as "geranium diodes", >and are using the wrong word. Two of the most common elements used to make >diodes are Silicon and Germanium, hence the "Germanium Diodes", which is >what this really is. As to its function on the CoCo? Well I don't have a >clue. Anyone? >- Chad From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 10 17:09:23 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:09:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 14:03 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > The ACIAPAK driver requires this interrupt signal > to operate properly, although the MODPAK driver > does not. The signal in the CoC03 is routed > througi1 the GIME chip, which every so often does > not pass it to the CPU. Am I reading this right when I infer that the GIME has some sort of bug w/r/t its interrupt 'controller'? That would be a rather nasty flaw .. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 10 17:16:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:16:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev> References: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1215724606.8451.63.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 17:09 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 14:03 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > The ACIAPAK driver requires this interrupt signal > > to operate properly, although the MODPAK driver > > does not. The signal in the CoC03 is routed > > througi1 the GIME chip, which every so often does > > not pass it to the CPU. > > Am I reading this right when I infer that the GIME has some sort of bug > w/r/t its interrupt 'controller'? That would be a rather nasty flaw .. > > C. Hmm, ok, after looking at the schematic of the Coco 3 my concerns have increased. This modification bridges CART* straight to the IRQ* pin of the processor, bypassing the GIME entirely. Any ideas what the actual GIME bug was? Anyone? C. From Torsten at Dittel.info Thu Jul 10 17:41:35 2008 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 23:41:35 +0200 Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> References: <1215631261.8132.21.camel@dev> <4875601B.9040302@iinet.net.au> <1215654269.6901.6.camel@dev> <4875B75A.2030607@iinet.net.au> <1215694699.8451.39.camel@dev> Message-ID: Chuck Youse schrieb: > [...] But I will, in general, lurk rather than speak. Chuck, just my 0.02?: I enjoyed that kind of "fresh breeze" here when you showed up reporting your project status / issues / successes. So please feel free to continue like you did, at least regarding the projects, maybe just avoiding comments in the future ;-) Regards, Torsten (EE & CoCo-Nut from across the pond) From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 18:05:29 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:05:29 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> References: , , <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net> On 10 Jul 2008 at 14:03, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > As the engineers & software authors in here can > tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in > the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would have > a problem Funny I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an unmodified MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I used T2 to connect to my printer. Oh well maybe I was lucky. james From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 18:15:35 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:15:35 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <1215724606.8451.63.camel@dev> References: , <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev>, <1215724606.8451.63.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487651C7.17995.A91789@jdaggett.gate.net> Chuck To me it seems more a hardware fix to correct a bug in the ACIA pack more than a GIME fix. As it was only the ACIA pack that seemed to have issues. Although the GIME chip did have some quirks with it in the 1986 production run, the 1987 part from VLSI was more stable. There were timing issues with some of the 1986 GIME chips. Especially in the video section. The IDMA timings are very critical and have little margin for error when the Coco 3 is ran at 1.78 MHz buss rate. james On 10 Jul 2008 at 17:16, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 17:09 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > > On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 14:03 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > > > The ACIAPAK driver requires this interrupt signal > > > to operate properly, although the MODPAK driver > > > does not. The signal in the CoC03 is routed > > > througi1 the GIME chip, which every so often does > > > not pass it to the CPU. > > > > Am I reading this right when I infer that the GIME has some sort of > > bug w/r/t its interrupt 'controller'? That would be a rather nasty > > flaw .. > > > > C. > > Hmm, ok, after looking at the schematic of the Coco 3 my concerns have > increased. This modification bridges CART* straight to the IRQ* pin > of the processor, bypassing the GIME entirely. > > Any ideas what the actual GIME bug was? Anyone? > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1544 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 7:37 AM > > From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Thu Jul 10 18:46:11 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:46:11 +1000 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com>, <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > My impressions are that for the Coco there is this issue of which do you > develop for, the OS9 users or the RSDOS users or both? My understnding > that the Commodore does not have this type of conflict in their user > base. You make a good point, but the bottom line is the size of the user base. Sadly, the two microcomputers that I grew up with (TRS-80 Model I & Coco) have relatively small enthusiast followings these days which does tend to stifle any medium-to-large scale (cooperative) development efforts. There's also very little incentive for a developer to produce a "commercial" product. The C64 OTOH, has a large user base to this day, rivaled perhaps only by the Apple II. As you correctly surmise, the C64 DOS existed in the ROM of the disk drive itself and, aside from the various turbo loaders, AFAIK there was no significant third-party DOS incompatible with the former. The Apple II has devotees split between DOS 3.3 and ProDOS, similar to the Coco dilemma, but with a much larger user base, it's less of a problem. Similarly, IIUC there are two (incompatible) 3rd party Ethernet cards available for the A2, although it may be the case (now) that one is dominant. > Obviously the OS9 userbase would benefit more from a TCP/IP. There has > always been this compatability conflict that has plagued the Coco for > years. Agreed. However for me, I'd find myself mucking about with TRS-80 stuff more frequently if there was something equivalent to the Apple II CFFA (compact flash adapter). It might just be me, but the idea of carrying around my entire TRS-80 software collection on a compact flash card (or equivalent) in my pocket - that I can run on a *real* TRS-80 or (FPGA) hardware emulation - has a certain appeal. Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 10 18:48:26 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:48:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> , <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com> , <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1215730106.8451.66.camel@dev> On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 08:46 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > Agreed. However for me, I'd find myself mucking about with TRS-80 stuff more > frequently if there was something equivalent to the Apple II CFFA (compact > flash adapter). It might just be me, but the idea of carrying around my > entire TRS-80 software collection on a compact flash card (or equivalent) in > my pocket - that I can run on a *real* TRS-80 or (FPGA) hardware emulation - > has a certain appeal. By TRS-80 you're referring to the Model I? C. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Thu Jul 10 19:45:31 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 09:45:31 +1000 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <1215730106.8451.66.camel@dev> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> , <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com> , <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> <1215730106.8451.66.camel@dev> Message-ID: <48769F1B.6000209@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > By TRS-80 you're referring to the Model I? Actually, the TRS-80 Model I/III/4 *and* the Coco computers. My father bought a TRS-80 Model I, which I lived on, until he bought me a Model 4P. In between I bought myself a Coco 1. Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Thu Jul 10 19:54:06 2008 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 20:54:06 -0300 Subject: [Coco] If the Commodore can do it! In-Reply-To: <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> References: <914257.34649.qm@web34705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, <20080710151555.48A3720A36@qs281.pair.com>, <4c56cbd30807101301t27568a8fw65d0bac80b963bde@mail.gmail.com> <4876378E.9970.42AC0D@jdaggett.gate.net> <48769133.1040905@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <4876A11E.5030101@adinet.com.uy> The CoCo is very close to do this. With a SuperIDE and a CF card, you can carry your system to wherever there is a CoCo. And VCC will eventually be able to read your CoCo's CF card from any PC. Diego > > Agreed. However for me, I'd find myself mucking about with TRS-80 > stuff more frequently if there was something equivalent to the Apple > II CFFA (compact flash adapter). It might just be me, but the idea of > carrying around my entire TRS-80 software collection on a compact > flash card (or equivalent) in my pocket - that I can run on a *real* > TRS-80 or (FPGA) hardware emulation - has a certain appeal. > > Regards, > From underserf at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 20:57:33 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:57:33 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <20080711005723.C07E420A33@qs281.pair.com> Quoting James... >I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an unmodified >MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I used >T2 to connect to my printer. I couldn't get past 2400 without hiccups and crashes, even screwed the CC3/MPI to a board (saw that in Rainbow I think) but the goofy diode hack worked and I seem to recall getting 115k through my hacked-up DCM-3 to the Apple // or maybe it was the Compaq suitcase. By the time I installed my 6309 & patched up OS/9, the diode hack was redundant. Sure glad Mark & Boisys' program kept me from chopping up another DCM tho ;) Watching characters scroll by at 300 baud is kinda soothing, if not hynotic :) Peace! =M0= From jdaggett at gate.net Thu Jul 10 22:11:23 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 22:11:23 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080711005723.C07E420A33@qs281.pair.com> References: , <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net>, <20080711005723.C07E420A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4876890B.15643.4ED798@jdaggett.gate.net> I was running 9600 baud to my printer and as far as I can remember had no issues. Then again ther were several that had sparkles with their 1986 GIME and I never saw any with mine. go figure? james On 10 Jul 2008 at 17:57, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > Quoting James... > > >I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an > >unmodified MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were > >reported then. I used T2 to connect to my printer. > > I couldn't get past 2400 without hiccups and crashes, even screwed the > CC3/MPI to a board (saw that in Rainbow I think) but the goofy diode > hack worked and I seem to recall getting 115k through my hacked-up > DCM-3 to the Apple // or maybe it was the Compaq suitcase. By the time > I installed my 6309 & patched up OS/9, the diode hack was redundant. > > Sure glad Mark & Boisys' program kept me from chopping up another DCM > tho ;) > > Watching characters scroll by at 300 baud is kinda soothing, if not > hynotic :) > > Peace! > > =M0= > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 6:43 PM > > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jul 10 23:45:15 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 23:45:15 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev> References: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1215724163.8451.59.camel@dev> Message-ID: <200807102345.15600.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 10 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 14:03 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> The ACIAPAK driver requires this interrupt signal >> to operate properly, although the MODPAK driver >> does not. The signal in the CoC03 is routed >> througi1 the GIME chip, which every so often does >> not pass it to the CPU. > >Am I reading this right when I infer that the GIME has some sort of bug >w/r/t its interrupt 'controller'? That would be a rather nasty flaw .. That actually turned out to be a miss read of the gime specs as they weren't very clear, and the gime wasn't always being re-initialized correctly after an IRQ was serviced. The fix was incorporated in all the edition 9 clock modules, and has never been a problem since. The only other thing that is related to the ACIA and IRQ's in general is that the slot selector logic in the MPI's will block an IRQ from an unselected slot until such time as that slot becomes selected, which if the IRQ doesn't get through, might be never. The fix for that is to jumper all 4 slots together at pin 8, and remove 3 of the 4 IRQ pullup resistors along the front edge of the MPI's PCB. *S9 can handle the rest, and other than those who might keep games multiple game carts in the MPI, I can't think of a scenario where that would effect an rsdos program. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "You don't go out and kick a mad dog. If you have a mad dog with rabies, you take a gun and shoot him." -- Pat Robertson, TV Evangelist, about Muammar Kadhafy From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jul 10 23:47:41 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 23:47:41 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <20080710210311.9ADF120A35@qs281.pair.com> <48764F69.23443.9FDBD4@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <200807102347.41382.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 10 July 2008, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >On 10 Jul 2008 at 14:03, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> As the engineers & software authors in here can >> tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in >> the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would have >> a problem > >Funny > >I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an unmodified >MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I used >T2 to connect to my printer. > You were sending, and a decently written driver would have handled that situation. It was incoming data that triggered that little bug. >Oh well maybe I was lucky. > >james > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) He who minds his own business is never unemployed. From farna at att.net Fri Jul 11 09:51:46 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 09:51:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The X9 Message-ID: <48776572.5000603@att.net> Yes Chuck, please do continue to talk about your designs and progress! Might be a good idea to lay off the keyboard after laying on "the sauce" though... ;> Seriously, you came back with an immediate apology and further explanation of both what you meant and why the comments were a little... terse. I've worked with engineers all my life (structural and electrical, and architects -- construction). Many are a little arrogant when dealing with amateurs, and some suffer greatly from NIH syndrome ("Not Invented Here"). You don't seem to suffer from that, just a touch of arrogance. But I have to tell you, start trying to tell me how your 68 AMC had a Ford 390 in it or some other BS about Ramblers and American Motors Corporation cars and I'm likely to get a little arrogant with you too! I know those things inside and out, and the history behind them. I'm not a big performance guy though, so start asking about performance advice and I'll send you somewhere else -- anything over mild improvements anyway. The point is we all have our fields of expertise and tend to get a bit touchy about them at times, I think! When I first went into the USAF it was as a carpenter, and wood working is also a hobby. Would you believe that everyone who can swing a hammer and knows how to use a hand saw thinks they're a carpenter?? The nerve of those guys!!! ;> ------------- From: Gene Heskett Subject: Re: [Coco] The X9 > >So my designs, (schematics, PCBs, software), etc. will be available on > >www.serialtechnologies.com for those who need some hardware for whatever > >reason, and for the rare person who is interested I will announce new > >stuff on the list. But I will, in general, lurk rather than speak. > > > >Happy trails, > >C. > > > I disagree Chuck, I'm following the progress reports with interest. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 11 10:07:20 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:07:20 -0400 Subject: [Coco] the bit-banger Message-ID: <1215785240.12359.12.camel@dev> Does anybody _really_ use this in a *S9 setup? I'm sorely tempted to disconnect the interrupt line (SERINT) from the GIME chip in my system and hook it to the cartridge port so I can generate FIRQ* from the expansion bus... and no, I can't just tie the interrupt to FIRQ* directly, I need a means to enable/disable the interrupt individually. The ability to dynamically change it between FIRQ* and IRQ* is also ridiculously useful (for the FDC anyway). Mind you, _I_ don't use the bit-banger (I use a UART for RS-232, use of the bit-banger REALLY eats CPU cycles), but I'd rather find the least-intrusive mod for others who might want to use this FDC .. I'll also see if using the interrupt mechanism on PIA1 is feasible. C. From jlhickle at yahoo.com Fri Jul 11 12:29:06 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 09:29:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] The X9 In-Reply-To: <48776572.5000603@att.net> Message-ID: <440429.82239.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- On Fri, 7/11/08, Frank Swygert wrote: > The point is we all have our fields of expertise and tend > to get a bit touchy about them at times, I think! When I > first went into the USAF it was as a carpenter, and wood > working is also a hobby. Would you believe that everyone > who can swing a hammer and knows how to use a hand saw > thinks they're a carpenter?? The nerve of those guys!!! > ;> > And everyone who pushes the wheelbarrow and rolls up the extension cords is "in construction". From michael at musicheadproductions.org Fri Jul 11 12:59:40 2008 From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Harwood) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:59:40 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Free COCO III In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Free (except for the price of shipping) to a good home is a COCO III with floppy disk drive. This unique unit was originally given to me by the one and only Mary Kramer, and has the floppy disk controller mounted inside the COCO case. I do not know any other specifics about the unit other than it does boot up. First come first serve - please email me privately at michael at musicheadproductions.org and be prepared for my .ASK anti-spam engine that requires you to respond to a query to be added to my white list. Thanks! Regards, Michael Harwood From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 11 13:45:47 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:45:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Free COCO III In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1215798347.6517.0.camel@dev> I'm assuming someone will beat me to the punch, but if not, I can certainly give it a good home. C. On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 10:59 -0600, Michael Harwood wrote: > Free (except for the price of shipping) to a good home is a COCO III with > floppy disk drive. This unique unit was originally given to me by the one > and only Mary Kramer, and has the floppy disk controller mounted inside the > COCO case. I do not know any other specifics about the unit other than it > does boot up. > > First come first serve - please email me privately at > michael at musicheadproductions.org and be prepared for my .ASK anti-spam > engine that requires you to respond to a query to be added to my white list. > > Thanks! > > Regards, > Michael Harwood > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 11 13:51:03 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:51:03 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Free COCO III In-Reply-To: <1215798347.6517.0.camel@dev> References: <1215798347.6517.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1215798663.6517.2.camel@dev> Grrrrrrrrr...... stupid mail client replied to the wrong place Sorry folks C. On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 13:45 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > I'm assuming someone will beat me to the punch, but if not, I can > certainly give it a good home. > > C. > > On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 10:59 -0600, Michael Harwood wrote: > > Free (except for the price of shipping) to a good home is a COCO III with > > floppy disk drive. This unique unit was originally given to me by the one > > and only Mary Kramer, and has the floppy disk controller mounted inside the > > COCO case. I do not know any other specifics about the unit other than it > > does boot up. > > > > First come first serve - please email me privately at > > michael at musicheadproductions.org and be prepared for my .ASK anti-spam > > engine that requires you to respond to a query to be added to my white list. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Regards, > > Michael Harwood > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Fri Jul 11 14:01:51 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:01:51 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade Message-ID: <20080711.130151.3452.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> James I have a question On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:05:29 -0400 jdaggett at gate.net writes: > On 10 Jul 2008 at 14:03, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > As the engineers & software authors in here can > > tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in > > the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would > have > > a problem > > Funny > > I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an > unmodified > MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I > used > T2 to connect to my printer. What is T2 ?? > > Oh well maybe I was lucky. > > james > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ____________________________________________________________ Fabulous Spa Getaway! Enter for your chance to WIN great beauty prizes everyday! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7UrpaC1zq0OGri3u99w40sgF2cRhTOV7cxIaM6s75mreCrv/ From jdaggett at gate.net Fri Jul 11 14:35:28 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:35:28 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080711.130151.3452.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080711.130151.3452.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <48776FB0.4670.16A3B14@jdaggett.gate.net> On 11 Jul 2008 at 13:01, John T Chasteen wrote: > James I have a question > > On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:05:29 -0400 jdaggett at gate.net writes: > > On 10 Jul 2008 at 14:03, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > > > As the engineers & software authors in here can > > > tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in > > > the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would > > have > > > a problem > > > > Funny > > > > I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an > > unmodified > > MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I > > > > > used > > T2 to connect to my printer. > > What is T2 ?? > Device Descriptor T2 for OS9. james > > > > > Oh well maybe I was lucky. > > > > james > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Fabulous Spa Getaway! > Enter for your chance to WIN great beauty prizes everyday! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7UrpaC1zq0OGri3u99w > 40sgF2cRhTOV7cxIaM6s75mreCrv/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1546 - Release Date: > 7/11/2008 6:47 AM > > From mdelyea at gmail.com Fri Jul 11 14:43:37 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:43:37 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Free COCO III In-Reply-To: <1215798663.6517.2.camel@dev> References: <1215798347.6517.0.camel@dev> <1215798663.6517.2.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807111143w3a608e4ewdc1d7390ea409f9@mail.gmail.com> I'd like to know if it still has the cartridge port free. On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:51 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > Grrrrrrrrr...... stupid mail client replied to the wrong place > > Sorry folks > C. > > On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 13:45 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: >> I'm assuming someone will beat me to the punch, but if not, I can >> certainly give it a good home. >> >> C. >> >> On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 10:59 -0600, Michael Harwood wrote: >> > Free (except for the price of shipping) to a good home is a COCO III with >> > floppy disk drive. This unique unit was originally given to me by the one >> > and only Mary Kramer, and has the floppy disk controller mounted inside the >> > COCO case. I do not know any other specifics about the unit other than it >> > does boot up. >> > >> > First come first serve - please email me privately at >> > michael at musicheadproductions.org and be prepared for my .ASK anti-spam >> > engine that requires you to respond to a query to be added to my white list. >> > >> > Thanks! >> > >> > Regards, >> > Michael Harwood >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Fri Jul 11 14:53:22 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:53:22 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Fw: Re: coco SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080711.135323.3452.5.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Mark your correct. I have been regaining my strength playing in the computer room with the coco3 and the SuperIDE unit that is equipped with two 250 Meg CF units. I hurried and packed my coco3 system in a cart and went to our monthly Glenside coco club meeting where I got some great instructions and help loading the CF units with programs. Also Chris Hawks brought a USB memory CF adapter and made backups files of both CF units with my Xp PC. I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite Write programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk for OS-9 Profile, OS-9 DeskMate and Basic O9. That will teach me to open the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. I would appreciate any information on where I can download or obtain these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF memory. Thanks for your help. John On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 16:44:55 -0500 Mark Marlette writes: > Well I hope all is going better for you. > > I suppose if you can't vacation you might as well COCO it!!!!!! :) > > Mark > > Quoting John T Chasteen : > > > Mark > > With the Shingles I also had 4 days in the Hospital with > Pneumonia > > My "Energy Level" was almost zero... so we canceled and let our > trip > > insurance pay us for not going. > > > > John ____________________________________________________________ Beauty Product Reviews Read Unbiased Beauty Product Reviews and Join Our Product Review Team! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7UvszLOIGT5maRvuEN4QvyL4p2XOxxYccJ3pMEBy9LyqVu5/ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 11 16:21:20 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 16:21:20 -0400 Subject: [Coco] the bit-banger In-Reply-To: <1215785240.12359.12.camel@dev> References: <1215785240.12359.12.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1215807680.6517.6.camel@dev> On Fri, 2008-07-11 at 10:07 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > Does anybody _really_ use this in a *S9 setup? Actually, digging through the SCBBT and SCBBP source code, it looks like the drivers don't use any interrupts at all. E.g., the SERINT input to the GIME is unused under NitrOS-9. Can anyone confirm? Maybe I missed something somewhere.. C. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jul 11 18:14:20 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:14:20 -0400 Subject: [Coco] the bit-banger In-Reply-To: <1215785240.12359.12.camel@dev> References: <1215785240.12359.12.camel@dev> Message-ID: <200807111814.20173.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 11 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >Does anybody _really_ use this in a *S9 setup? ATM I am Chuck. I needed a printer & you can't buy one that understands ascii now for several years. So I grabbed a usb<->serial adapter and a couple of long usb extension cables, and I'm feeding /p to this box at 9600 baud, where a script watches that usb port and collects the data. When the data stops, it turns around and sends it to lp3, which is a 110 dollar brother laser printer sitting on the top shelf of the coco's desk. Sort of Rube Goldburgish, but it worked till a lightning strike right on top of me sent a surge, and the coco isn't on the same power leg as everything in this room is, so it blew the adapter. I bought some more just like it, but somehow that one is sending trash and I haven't had the time to scope it out and see if /p is still at 9600 baud, I had to play with tuneport because it was closer to 15kbaud originally. >I'm sorely tempted to >disconnect the interrupt line (SERINT) from the GIME chip in my system >and hook it to the cartridge port so I can generate FIRQ* from the >expansion bus... and no, I can't just tie the interrupt to FIRQ* >directly, I need a means to enable/disable the interrupt individually. >The ability to dynamically change it between FIRQ* and IRQ* is also >ridiculously useful (for the FDC anyway). >Mind you, _I_ don't use the bit-banger (I use a UART for RS-232, use of >the bit-banger REALLY eats CPU cycles), but I'd rather find the >least-intrusive mod for others who might want to use this FDC .. > >I'll also see if using the interrupt mechanism on PIA1 is feasible. > >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "Get back to your stations!" "We're beaming down to the planet, sir." -- Kirk and Mr. Leslie, "This Side of Paradise", stardate 3417.3 From gene.heskett at verizon.net Fri Jul 11 18:17:34 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:17:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Geranium Diode Upgrade In-Reply-To: <48776FB0.4670.16A3B14@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <20080711.130151.3452.4.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> <48776FB0.4670.16A3B14@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <200807111817.34755.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Friday 11 July 2008, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: >On 11 Jul 2008 at 13:01, John T Chasteen wrote: >> James I have a question >> >> On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:05:29 -0400 jdaggett at gate.net writes: >> > On 10 Jul 2008 at 14:03, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> > > As the engineers & software authors in here can >> > > tell ya, the ACIA driver was modified sometime in >> > > the early 90s and only a stone-stock OS/9 L2 (like mine ;) would >> > >> > have >> > >> > > a problem >> > >> > Funny >> > >> > I ran a Stock unmodified OS9 system and the RS232 pack in an >> > unmodified >> > MPI(white 3124?) and never had any issues that were reported then. I >> > >> > >> > used >> > T2 to connect to my printer. >> >> What is T2 ?? > >Device Descriptor T2 for OS9. > More specifically it is generally assigned to the first deluxe rs-232 pack in the system. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The American nation in the sixth ward is a fine people; they love the eagle -- on the back of a dollar. -- Finlay Peter Dunne From rvanscherpe at gmail.com Sat Jul 12 11:23:26 2008 From: rvanscherpe at gmail.com (Ron VanScherpe) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 08:23:26 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Rainbow Magazines For Sale Message-ID: Hi All, I have the following Rainbow Magazines for sale. Note they are all unbound, meaning that the pages are loose. 1982 -------- Rainbow Book of Adventures 1983 -------- December & July 1984 ------- January, February, June, August & September 1985 ------- February, April, August, September & November 1986 ------- COMPLETE 1987 ------- COMPLETE 1988 ------- COMPLETE 1989 -------- January, February, March, April,May,June,July,August & September 1990 ------- January,Februaruy, March & May I am asking $25 for 12 issues + Shipping or all for $100 + shipping. 90% are in excellent condition while the other 10% are worn or a bit water damaged. The COMPLETE sets are in execellent condition. Please let me know if you are still interested. Ron. From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 11:35:09 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 11:35:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if someone needs pictures, numbers, etc. Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 11:50 AM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. BEAUTIFUL image Charlie, if there's an archive site, they should put that up. It looks like the case & PCB are cherry, unlike mine which saw some 5 years of daily use. The one you have is around 4 years newer than mine or, more accurately, the chips are newer & one of the 7406s on my board are replaced with a 7416 on yours (the 16 is tougher than the 06 as I recall) Mine has 4 chips socketed in addition to the ROMs. Disto must have figured us for pretty clumsy Back In The Day ;) BIG thanx for the help, Charlie! Funny, even Howard Medical has no idea what their Slot Pack Three was and is *heh* Peace! =M0= >Here you go. I hope the picture is god enough, the very top is cut off. If >you need me to take it again, no problem. >Let me know. >http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad/MISC/distomc-1.jpg > >Charlie > >"Mike 0rtloff" wrote in >message news:20080708164139.2629720A33 at qs281.pair.com... > > Heya List!! > > > > Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be known, > > I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet NGs for the > > last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some formatting thing I > > missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) > > > > Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire set, and > > spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals have gotten > > mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) and just plain > > lost in moves. > > > > First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot Pack, Disto > > MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. > > > > ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent > > troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) > > > > 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is > > missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years ago, the > > little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and I'd like > > to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, but it never > > had a schematic or chip list anyway. > > > > 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of the > > Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the > > 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the placement, a > > graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the MC-1 were > > always a mystery as well. > > > > 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 exclusively > > when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques I used. Can the > > 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any hard/software hacks to make it > > so? > > > > Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! > > > > =Mike 0= > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1544 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 7:37 AM From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 12 14:54:51 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 14:54:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> Message-ID: <3A772ABF-C018-4EDB-A9AE-80755941312C@serialtechnologies.com> Were there any significant differences between the MPI and the Slot III? Or was the Slot III a 'compatible' unit? C. On Jul 12, 2008, at 11:35 AM, Tom Seagrove wrote: > I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if > someone needs > pictures, numbers, etc. > > Tom > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 11:50 AM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > BEAUTIFUL image Charlie, if there's an archive site, they should put > that up. It looks like the case & PCB are cherry, unlike mine which > saw some 5 years of daily use. > > The one you have is around 4 years newer than mine or, more > accurately, the chips are newer & one of the 7406s on my board are > replaced with a 7416 on yours (the 16 is tougher than the 06 as I > recall) > > Mine has 4 chips socketed in addition to the ROMs. Disto must have > figured us for pretty clumsy Back In The Day ;) > > BIG thanx for the help, Charlie! > > Funny, even Howard Medical has no idea what their Slot Pack Three was > and is *heh* > > Peace! > > =M0= > > > >> Here you go. I hope the picture is god enough, the very top is cut >> off. If >> you need me to take it again, no problem. >> Let me know. >> http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad/MISC/distomc-1.jpg >> >> Charlie >> >> "Mike 0rtloff" wrote in >> message news:20080708164139.2629720A33 at qs281.pair.com... >>> Heya List!! >>> >>> Been a long time since I last posted on any kind of list. Truth be > known, >>> I'd forgotten about the CoCo List, but lurked on the UseNet NGs >>> for the >>> last decade or so... Bear with me if there's some formatting thing I >>> missed or some strange s/w requirement before posting ;) >>> >>> Getting my CoCo system(s) back together, still have the entire >>> set, and >>> spares (MC-10 to Coco3) but in the last 15 years, peripherals have > gotten >>> mutilated (young children), destroyed (Northridge Quake) and just >>> plain >>> lost in moves. >>> >>> First I'll try a few questions about the Howard Medical Slot >>> Pack, Disto >>> MC-1 & the Tandy/RS 26-3129 controller. >>> >>> ( I'm no engineer or systems analyst, but I fancy myself a decent >>> troubleshooter and lead fumes don't scare me ;)) >>> >>> 1. Anyone have an =image= of the Howard Medical Slot Pack 3, mine is >>> missing a chip. I may have let somebody have it like 10 years >>> ago, the >>> little sticker I put (noting what chip it was) there fell off and >>> I'd > like >>> to get the thing going again, I have the manual somewhere, but it >>> never >>> had a schematic or chip list anyway. >>> >>> 2, My Disto MiniController-1 died about 94, an indirect result of >>> the >>> Northridge quake. I've replaced all the socketed chips (save for the >>> 6ms/DS modded DECB from Disto) but again, not sure of the >>> placement, a >>> graphic of the PCB would be just the ticket. The jumpers on the MC-1 > were >>> always a mystery as well. >>> >>> 3rd, and last question - It's been a long time, I ran OS/9 >>> exclusively >>> when I was real active but forgot a lot of the techniques I used. >>> Can > the >>> 26-3129 support DS 360k drives at all? Any hard/software hacks to >>> make > it >>> so? >>> >>> Enuff annoying you all for now, and BIG thanx in advance! >>> >>> =Mike 0= >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1544 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 > 7:37 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 12 15:22:59 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 12:22:59 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> Message-ID: <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> Heya Tom!!! >I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if someone needs >pictures, numbers, etc. Whoa - I almost missed that :) Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on (maybe?) the RTSI site. Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* =Mike 0= From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 12 15:27:06 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 12:27:06 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <3A772ABF-C018-4EDB-A9AE-80755941312C@serialtechnologies.co m> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <3A772ABF-C018-4EDB-A9AE-80755941312C@serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <20080712192657.E8C1320A33@qs281.pair.com> >Were there any significant differences between the MPI and the Slot >III? Or was the Slot III a 'compatible' unit? HUGE differences, Chuck - 3 slots, no onboard slot selection, same dimensions as a long disk controller. Mostly useful under OS/9 but I seem to recall it worked under DECB to allow a RS-232 pak & disk controller to be used simultaneously & the 3rd slot prevented beating on your CoCos expansion port when using ROM games. The buffering allowed the use of Y-cables too, AFAICR. =Mike 0= From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 12 16:13:56 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:13:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080712192657.E8C1320A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <3A772ABF-C018-4EDB-A9AE-80755941312C@serialtechnologies.com> <20080712192657.E8C1320A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1F9FCA30-E864-44B5-8167-74A1626046C3@serialtechnologies.com> On Jul 12, 2008, at 3:27 PM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > HUGE differences, Chuck - 3 slots, no onboard slot selection, same > dimensions as a long disk controller. Mostly useful under OS/9 but > I seem to recall it worked under DECB to allow a RS-232 pak & disk > controller to be used simultaneously & the 3rd slot prevented > beating on your CoCos expansion port when using ROM games. The > buffering allowed the use of Y-cables too, AFAICR. > Hmm, how did they manage slot selection at all? Without some mechanism for controlling who gets CTS* and SCS* a lot of cartridges simply won't work together on the same bus .. C. From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 12 17:18:20 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 14:18:20 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <1F9FCA30-E864-44B5-8167-74A1626046C3@serialtechnologies.co m> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <3A772ABF-C018-4EDB-A9AE-80755941312C@serialtechnologies.com> <20080712192657.E8C1320A33@qs281.pair.com> <1F9FCA30-E864-44B5-8167-74A1626046C3@serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <20080712211812.4CDAC20A33@qs281.pair.com> >Hmm, how did they manage slot selection at all? Without some >mechanism for controlling who gets CTS* and SCS* a lot of cartridges >simply won't work together on the same bus .. POKEs, Chuck, works for 1.78 MHz clock, DS disk access, Speech Sound Pack... can't recall 'em all, but it seems the PEEKs & POKEs (!) are online. Looking at it, without reverse-engineering it, looks like it has some kind of decoding going on, but no PAL. I wish companies wouldn't completely abandon stuff... but then, if frogs had wings, they wouldn't bump their butts when they hopped, eh? ;) =M0= From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Sat Jul 12 19:10:39 2008 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 18:10:39 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement Message-ID: <487939EF.5010802@sbcglobal.net> Well, our great Texas Legislator really messed up this time. A bill was drafted, passed, sign by the Governor and took effect on July 1, 2008. This bill added a requirement for all IT persons now have to ahear to. If you do any kind of analysis of the hard drive on a computer or repair of a computer, you have to have a PI license. Yes, that is correct, a Private Investigation License or you can end up in jail for a year and a $4,000 fine. The company you work for can also be fined $10,000 for each day that you work on a computer without the PI license. It seems the PI Association wrote the law and no one read it prior to passing it on the floor and sending it to the Governor for his signuture. It was designed to plug a loop hole where CSI type people that work on cases where data on the hard drive of a computer is evidence and the person searching it was NOT a Licensed Investigator, thus was not qualified and have the data on the hard drive thrown out. But they wrote it TOO broad and now it covers anyone that works on a computer. Even the 12 year old next door neighbor. LOL So here in Texas if you work on computers, you half to have a PI license. To obtain a PI license, you either have to take pass a Criminal Investigate Course or serve as an apprientice to a Licensed PI for three years. This means you can not work on any computer for a min of three years. CIC course is a 4 year College Course. If Rolan and Martin was still had their TV show, I am sure the Texas Legislator would get the Whoope award. -- From marcus.chiado at gmail.com Sat Jul 12 19:18:17 2008 From: marcus.chiado at gmail.com (Marcus Vinicius Garrett Chiado) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:18:17 -0300 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? Message-ID: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> What?s up, guys? A friend of mine has found out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULmi2KIRc98 Is that a special version of Thexder? I mean, the one I have doesn?t feature music at all, only sound effects if I ain?t wrong. Is that a S&SC or a Orch 90 version? Thanks, MARCUS VINICIUS GARRETT CHIADO Editor da Jogos 80: http://www.jogos80.com ?lbum da minha cole??o: http://garrettimus.org/album_atualizado/ Meu blog de games: http://garrettimus.wordpress.com/ Meu blog de Terror: http://terrorvision.wordpress.com/ Colecionador de videogames antigos e de micros 8 bits "Quem tem um(a) filho(a), tem o maior tesouro do mundo" From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Sat Jul 12 19:15:29 2008 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 18:15:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement Message-ID: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> BTW, the law does not state what brand of computer, so any computer that use a storage device is subject to this la. Which means in Texas you can not legally even work on your own COCO. LOL -- From brucewcalkins at charter.net Sat Jul 12 19:37:39 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 19:37:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? References: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: That must be the PC version. ~BWC~ ==================== What?s up, guys? A friend of mine has found out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULmi2KIRc98 Is that a special version of Thexder? I mean, the one I have doesn?t feature music at all, only sound effects if I ain?t wrong. Is that a S&SC or a Orch 90 version? Thanks, MARCUS VINICIUS GARRETT CHIADO From os9dude at gmail.com Sat Jul 12 19:41:47 2008 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 19:41:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? In-Reply-To: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> References: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5631e580807121641p45b52533m62f5303b206dd63d@mail.gmail.com> The CoCo 3 version of Thexder was a really stripped down version of the original game, no music at all. Back in the days when Thexder came out I had read the reviews and one od the pluses was the music score. When I saw the version for the CoCo 3 released I immediately bought it... and thougt I had gotten a lemon after I plugged it at home. Truth is that the port to the CoCo 3 had no music score. Look at the morphing animation between the two versions, it is more crudely done in the CoCo 3. There are other versions for other platforms that have even better animation and better sounding music. I am not a ML programming guru at all, my question is how difficult would it have been to put the music to be used with the Speech & Sound Pak if available? -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 7:18 PM, Marcus Vinicius Garrett Chiado < marcus.chiado at gmail.com> wrote: > What?s up, guys? > > A friend of mine has found out this video: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULmi2KIRc98 > > Is that a special version of Thexder? I mean, the one I have doesn?t > feature > music at all, only sound effects if I ain?t wrong. Is that a S&SC or a Orch > 90 version? > > > > Thanks, > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 12 19:43:19 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 19:43:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? In-Reply-To: References: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6BFF6243-8EE1-481D-9709-2520957C585C@serialtechnologies.com> It's the Tandy 1000 version. Definitely - you can tell by the three- voice arrangement of the Moonlight Sonata heard in the beginning. This version wouldn't have run on any standard PCs given the special graphics and sound capabilities of the Tandy 1000s are employed here ... C. On Jul 12, 2008, at 7:37 PM, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > That must be the PC version. > > ~BWC~ > > ==================== > > What?s up, guys? > > A friend of mine has found out this video: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULmi2KIRc98 > > Is that a special version of Thexder? I mean, the one I have doesn > ?t feature > music at all, only sound effects if I ain?t wrong. Is that a S&SC > or a Orch > 90 version? > > Thanks, > > MARCUS VINICIUS GARRETT CHIADO > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 20:36:01 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:36:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 Pak, and a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some pictures... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:23 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. Heya Tom!!! >I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if someone needs >pictures, numbers, etc. Whoa - I almost missed that :) Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on (maybe?) the RTSI site. Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* =Mike 0= -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 20:38:50 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:38:50 -0400 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> References: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <003001c8e480$d1a30dd0$74e92970$@com> ..or your iPhone, digital camera, video recorder, DVR, TIVO, etc, etc, etc... -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of John Donaldson Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 7:15 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement BTW, the law does not state what brand of computer, so any computer that use a storage device is subject to this la. Which means in Texas you can not legally even work on your own COCO. LOL -- -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 20:51:38 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:51:38 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> Message-ID: <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No Halt Controller. -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Tom Seagrove Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 8:36 PM To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 Pak, and a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some pictures... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:23 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. Heya Tom!!! >I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if someone needs >pictures, numbers, etc. Whoa - I almost missed that :) Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on (maybe?) the RTSI site. Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* =Mike 0= -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 12 21:05:26 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 21:05:26 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Message-ID: ooooh! please share those.. C. On Jul 12, 2008, at 8:51 PM, Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No > Halt > Controller. > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Tom Seagrove > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 8:36 PM > To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 > Pak, and > a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for > something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some > pictures... > > Tom > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:23 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > Heya Tom!!! > >> I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if >> someone > needs >> pictures, numbers, etc. > > Whoa - I almost missed that :) > > Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put > up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM > SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on > (maybe?) the RTSI site. > > Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, > I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew > up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on > the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) > > BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* > > =Mike 0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > 7/12/2008 > 7:40 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > 7/12/2008 > 7:40 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 21:22:12 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 21:22:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Message-ID: <003201c8e486$e0cf6d20$a26e4760$@com> I am going to go do the pictures of the SPIII now. You are REALLY special...I am about to break the seal for the first time on this thing. First, exterior pictures, then interior... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Youse Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 9:05 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. ooooh! please share those.. C. On Jul 12, 2008, at 8:51 PM, Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No > Halt > Controller. > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Tom Seagrove > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 8:36 PM > To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 > Pak, and > a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for > something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some > pictures... > > Tom > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:23 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > Heya Tom!!! > >> I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if >> someone > needs >> pictures, numbers, etc. > > Whoa - I almost missed that :) > > Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put > up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM > SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on > (maybe?) the RTSI site. > > Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, > I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew > up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on > the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) > > BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* > > =Mike 0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > 7/12/2008 > 7:40 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > 7/12/2008 > 7:40 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From chawks at dls.net Sat Jul 12 21:28:21 2008 From: chawks at dls.net (Christopher Hawks) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:28:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> Message-ID: <48795A35.9090104@dls.net> Tom Seagrove said the following on 07/12/2008 07:36 PM: > I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 Pak, and > a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for > something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some > pictures... The switch is for changing slots (just like a multi-pak). You can change to one of the 2 slots closest to the Coco (pokes worked too, same as the multi-pak). The 3rd slot was for self decoding paks (like the Burke and Burke). -- Christopher R. Hawks HAWKSoft --------------------------------------------------------- "Windows '98 is so similar to Windows '95 because Apple hasn't invented anything worth copying since 1995." -- Jakob Nielsen From kevdig at hypersurf.com Sat Jul 12 21:27:27 2008 From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 18:27:27 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Message-ID: <487959FE.7090905@hypersurf.com> Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No Halt > Controller. > Hey! I think I have one of these! It is in a black metal case, right? I would like the docs and schematics. kevin From marcus.chiado at gmail.com Sat Jul 12 21:41:52 2008 From: marcus.chiado at gmail.com (Marcus Vinicius Garrett Chiado) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 22:41:52 -0300 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? In-Reply-To: <6BFF6243-8EE1-481D-9709-2520957C585C@serialtechnologies.com> References: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> <6BFF6243-8EE1-481D-9709-2520957C585C@serialtechnologies.com> Message-ID: <94583fe40807121841g7ad339cag65eda461c79c3208@mail.gmail.com> Thanks, guys. The MSX (a popular japanese computer back in the day) version is also fantastic. Marcus. From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 21:43:18 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 21:43:18 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <48795A35.9090104@dls.net> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <48795A35.9090104@dls.net> Message-ID: <003301c8e489$d343fd80$79cbf880$@com> Yes, I believe I had mine arranged from the coco, floppy controller, RS-232, B&B. I bought it from someone named Chris at the First Last Atlanta CoCoFest in 1990....hey, wait, I got it from YOU!! :) It worked great and never had a single problem with it. Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Hawks Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 9:28 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. Tom Seagrove said the following on 07/12/2008 07:36 PM: > I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 Pak, and > a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for > something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some > pictures... The switch is for changing slots (just like a multi-pak). You can change to one of the 2 slots closest to the Coco (pokes worked too, same as the multi-pak). The 3rd slot was for self decoding paks (like the Burke and Burke). -- Christopher R. Hawks HAWKSoft --------------------------------------------------------- "Windows '98 is so similar to Windows '95 because Apple hasn't invented anything worth copying since 1995." -- Jakob Nielsen -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From tjseagrove at writeme.com Sat Jul 12 21:44:54 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 21:44:54 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <487959FE.7090905@hypersurf.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <487959FE.7090905@hypersurf.com> Message-ID: <003401c8e48a$0ca4dd10$25ee9730$@com> Yes..the proper name for it was DMC Floppy Disk Controller and was made by Sardis Technologies. -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Diggs Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 9:27 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No Halt > Controller. > Hey! I think I have one of these! It is in a black metal case, right? I would like the docs and schematics. kevin -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 7:40 AM From cdiman7 at flash.net Sat Jul 12 23:34:37 2008 From: cdiman7 at flash.net (KARL SEFCIK) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:34:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <487939EF.5010802@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <162497.47731.qm@web80206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> John, I'm sure they were referring to businesses, not the lowly Coco owner. But businesses that repair computers, like say the computers from Steven Grant the SOB that decapitated his wife, may have had pictures of that buried on his PC. And this way, the computer technician wouldn't help cover something like that up. http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2324220,00.asp And I'm looking through the bill to fuind the legaleze. http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/80R/billtext/html/HB02833F.htm SECTION 3. Section 1702.102(a), Occupations Code, is amended to read as follows: (a) Unless the person holds a license as a security services contractor, a person may not: (1) act as an alarm systems company, armored car company, courier company, guard company, [or] guard dog company, locksmith company, or private security consultant company; ........................................................ (b) For purposes of Subsection (a)(1), obtaining or furnishing information includes information obtained or furnished through the review and analysis of, and the investigation into the content of, computer-based data not available to the public. Other than this, I looked at the bill lots of times, and I didn't see anything that talked about computer repaoir techs. A lot about Security officercontractors and armored car contractorws having to be licensed. If you can find it, the loinkl to the bill (with the HR in it) is there. -----Karl --- John Donaldson wrote: > Well, our great Texas Legislator really messed up > this time. A bill was > drafted, passed, sign by the Governor and took > effect on July 1, 2008. > This bill added a requirement for all IT persons now > have to ahear to. > If you do any kind of analysis of the hard drive on > a computer or repair > of a computer, you have to have a PI license. Yes, > that is correct, a > Private Investigation License or you can end up in > jail for a year and a > $4,000 fine. The company you work for can also be > fined $10,000 for each > day that you work on a computer without the PI > license. It seems the PI > Association wrote the law and no one read it prior > to passing it on the > floor and sending it to the Governor for his > signuture. It was designed > to plug a loop hole where CSI type people that work > on cases where data > on the hard drive of a computer is evidence and the > person searching it > was NOT a Licensed Investigator, thus was not > qualified and have the > data on the hard drive thrown out. But they wrote it > TOO broad and now > it covers anyone that works on a computer. Even the > 12 year old next > door neighbor. LOL > > So here in Texas if you work on computers, you half > to have a PI > license. To obtain a PI license, you either have to > take pass a Criminal > Investigate Course or serve as an apprientice to a > Licensed PI for three > years. This means you can not work on any computer > for a min of three > years. CIC course is a 4 year College Course. > > If Rolan and Martin was still had their TV show, I > am sure the Texas > Legislator would get the Whoope award. > > > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From underserf at comcast.net Sun Jul 13 01:19:50 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 22:19:50 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <003201c8e486$e0cf6d20$a26e4760$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <003201c8e486$e0cf6d20$a26e4760$@com> Message-ID: <20080713051941.F152720A35@qs281.pair.com> >I am going to go do the pictures of the SPIII now. You are REALLY >special... I've been called "special" before, but that was in 1968 :) >I am about to break the seal for the first time on this thing. >First, exterior pictures, then interior... BEAUTIFUL!!! Biggest Thanx! You guys know what I discovered? I thought the RTSI archives went down years ago, and that all they had was a handful of manuals and such... I think I downloaded nearly 2000 Coco-related files, zillions of .DSK archives... Makes up nicely for all I've lost. and still no sign of my port of Solitaire to OS/9 :^/ =M0= >Tom > >-----Original Message----- >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On >Behalf Of Chuck Youse >Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 9:05 PM >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts >Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > >ooooh! please share those.. > >C. > >On Jul 12, 2008, at 8:51 PM, Tom Seagrove wrote: > > > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No > > Halt > > Controller. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > > Behalf Of Tom Seagrove > > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 8:36 PM > > To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts' > > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > > > I used mine under OS9 with a Sardis No Halt disk controller, RS-232 > > Pak, and > > a Burke and Burke HD Controller. There is a switch on the side for > > something that I don't remember... :) Will go get it and do up some > > pictures... > > > > Tom > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > > Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff > > Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:23 PM > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > > > Heya Tom!!! > > > >> I have a SlotPak III in mint condition... I can did it out if > >> someone > > needs > >> pictures, numbers, etc. > > > > Whoa - I almost missed that :) > > > > Could you please do the same thing that Charlie did for me, i.e., put > > up somewhere or email me a nice hi-res photo of the component-side HM > > SPIII? I'm gonna track down the manual, scan it in & post it on > > (maybe?) the RTSI site. > > > > Not that there's much use for it, with the DriveWire thing I bought, > > I've already done what I needed to, show my kids the games they grew > > up on (more like cut their teeth, my oldest is an IT guy, started on > > the CoCo as soon as stopped drooling on the keys... 16 months ;) > > > > BIG thanx, Tom, I await with baited breath!!! *VBG* > > > > =Mike 0= > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > > 7/12/2008 > > 7:40 AM > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: > > 7/12/2008 > > 7:40 AM > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.9/1548 - Release Date: 7/12/2008 >7:40 AM > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From joef6809 at gmail.com Sun Jul 13 04:46:03 2008 From: joef6809 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 04:46:03 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 Message-ID: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> I know this was discussed on the list before but I can't for the life of me find it. Just got a NOS tube of these @ 350ns. Anyone remember if that fast enough for a coco3. BTW anyone know of a cheap programmer that will write these. Thanks. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 13 07:05:55 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 07:05:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> Message-ID: <200807130705.56018.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 13 July 2008, Joe wrote: >I know this was discussed on the list before but I can't for the life of me > find it. Just got a NOS tube of these @ 350ns. Anyone remember if that fast > enough for a coco3. BTW anyone know of a cheap programmer that will write > these. >Thanks. That could be a tad slow, but one never knows how fast the part is till you scope it out. I once had a 2028 fail in a whole sea of them in a time base corrector, and there were none locally available. Its supposed to be a 90 nanosecond part and was being used at about 90 according to my measurements. But the wholesaler in the next town did have some 6116's, which are a cmos version with the same footprint, and rated at 250 nanoseconds. I plugged one of them in and it worked for the next 10 years, running cooler than the 2028's around it, at an 90 ns cycle time. From the looks of the data buss, it may actually have been the fastest chip in there. >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Be careful! Is it classified? From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Sun Jul 13 11:10:58 2008 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 10:10:58 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <162497.47731.qm@web80206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <162497.47731.qm@web80206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <487A1B02.5000708@sbcglobal.net> Karl, Somewhere in the bill the wording is there. Both the radio talk shows and local newspapers were talking about the loophole. John Donaldson KARL SEFCIK wrote: >John, > I'm sure they were referring to businesses, not the >lowly Coco owner. But businesses that repair >computers, like say the computers from Steven Grant >the SOB that decapitated his wife, may have had >pictures of that buried on his PC. And this way, the >computer technician wouldn't help cover something like >that up. >http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2324220,00.asp >And I'm looking through the bill to fuind the >legaleze. >http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/80R/billtext/html/HB02833F.htm > SECTION 3. Section 1702.102(a), Occupations >Code, is > amended to read as follows: > (a) Unless the person holds a license as a >security services > contractor, a person may not: > (1) act as an alarm systems company, >armored car > company, courier company, guard company, [or] guard >dog company, > locksmith company, or private security consultant >company; >........................................................ > (b) For purposes of Subsection (a)(1), >obtaining or > furnishing information includes information >obtained or furnished > through the review and analysis of, and the >investigation into the > content of, computer-based data not available to >the public. > > Other than this, I looked at the bill lots of >times, and I didn't see anything that talked about >computer repaoir techs. A lot about Security >officercontractors and armored car contractorws >having to be licensed. If you can find it, the loinkl >to the bill (with the HR in it) is there. >-----Karl > >--- John Donaldson >wrote: > > > >>Well, our great Texas Legislator really messed up >>this time. A bill was >>drafted, passed, sign by the Governor and took >>effect on July 1, 2008. >>This bill added a requirement for all IT persons now >>have to ahear to. >>If you do any kind of analysis of the hard drive on >>a computer or repair >>of a computer, you have to have a PI license. Yes, >>that is correct, a >>Private Investigation License or you can end up in >>jail for a year and a >>$4,000 fine. The company you work for can also be >>fined $10,000 for each >>day that you work on a computer without the PI >>license. It seems the PI >>Association wrote the law and no one read it prior >>to passing it on the >>floor and sending it to the Governor for his >>signuture. It was designed >>to plug a loop hole where CSI type people that work >>on cases where data >>on the hard drive of a computer is evidence and the >>person searching it >>was NOT a Licensed Investigator, thus was not >>qualified and have the >>data on the hard drive thrown out. But they wrote it >>TOO broad and now >>it covers anyone that works on a computer. Even the >>12 year old next >>door neighbor. LOL >> >>So here in Texas if you work on computers, you half >>to have a PI >>license. To obtain a PI license, you either have to >>take pass a Criminal >>Investigate Course or serve as an apprientice to a >>Licensed PI for three >>years. This means you can not work on any computer >>for a min of three >>years. CIC course is a 4 year College Course. >> >>If Rolan and Martin was still had their TV show, I >>am sure the Texas >>Legislator would get the Whoope award. >> >> >> >>-- >> >>-- >>Coco mailing list >>Coco at maltedmedia.com >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 11:15:00 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 10:15:00 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <487939EF.5010802@sbcglobal.net> References: <487939EF.5010802@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <20080713151521.5F2F320A33@qs281.pair.com> At 06:10 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: >Well, our great Texas Legislator really messed up this time. A bill >was drafted, passed, sign by the Governor and took effect on July 1, >2008. This bill added a requirement for all IT persons now have to >ahear to. If you do any kind of analysis of the hard drive on a >computer or repair of a computer, you have to have a PI license. >Yes, that is correct, a Private Investigation License or you can end >up in jail for a year and a $4,000 fine. The company you work for >can also be fined $10,000 for each day that you work on a computer >without the PI license. It seems the PI Association wrote the law >and no one read it prior to passing it on the floor and sending it >to the Governor for his signuture. It was designed to plug a loop >hole where CSI type people that work on cases where data on the hard >drive of a computer is evidence and the person searching it was NOT >a Licensed Investigator, thus was not qualified and have the data on >the hard drive thrown out. But they wrote it TOO broad and now it >covers anyone that works on a computer. Even the 12 year old next >door neighbor. LOL > >So here in Texas if you work on computers, you half to have a PI >license. To obtain a PI license, you either have to take pass a >Criminal Investigate Course or serve as an apprientice to a Licensed >PI for three years. This means you can not work on any computer for >a min of three years. CIC course is a 4 year College Course. > >If Rolan and Martin was still had their TV show, I am sure the Texas >Legislator would get the Whoope award. There's no doubt in my mind that they'll fix this bad law writeup. I seriously doubt that the tens of thousands of computer repair people and home repair hobbyists will stop doing what they do. There's also the option of just replacing a hard drive and OS at the customer's expense. However, everybody should worry about who's snooping around on their computers while they're being repaired. I would probably make the repair person come to my home and work by the hour as I look on if I was worried about personal data being stolen. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 11:21:42 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 10:21:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> References: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <20080713152200.2EA3720A33@qs281.pair.com> At 06:15 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: >BTW, the law does not state what brand of computer, so any computer >that use a storage device is subject to this la. Which means in >Texas you can not legally even work on your own COCO. LOL Solution: Just hire illegal aliens (from south of the border) to do the computer repair work, and our government won't bother them at all. ;) From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 11:23:07 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 10:23:07 -0500 Subject: [Coco] A Thexder version with music? In-Reply-To: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.co m> References: <94583fe40807121618x118e75e2ic17cb8140a341a9c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080713152324.44A3020A33@qs281.pair.com> At 06:18 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: >What?s up, guys? > >A friend of mine has found out this video: >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULmi2KIRc98 > >Is that a special version of Thexder? I mean, the one I have doesn?t feature >music at all, only sound effects if I ain?t wrong. Is that a S&SC or a Orch >90 version? Perhaps that is just dubbed into video soundtrack. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 11:37:29 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 10:37:29 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <487A1B02.5000708@sbcglobal.net> References: <162497.47731.qm@web80206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <487A1B02.5000708@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <20080713153749.4A22F20A33@qs281.pair.com> At 10:10 AM 7/13/2008, you wrote: >Karl, > Somewhere in the bill the wording is there. Both the radio talk > shows and local newspapers were talking about the loophole. > >John Donaldson Most loopholes, whether intentional or not, allow for sneaking through the cracks of a law in certain circumstances, but I've never known a loophole to totally wipe out an industry, especially one such as computer repair which is growing while we're sitting here. And I'll repair my CoCo and other PCs, and my friends or family's computer anytime I feel like it. :) They'll come after me right after they come after those neighbors who have the year-round garage sale, or the people down the road who's dealing drugs out of their house all through the night, and right after they stop letting people drive down the emergency lane at 60mph and cut you off while you're about to make a right turn... when THAT becomes illegal like it should be, I'll trust Texas law. However, EVERYBODY's doing it, so the public wins and the law loses. *IN FACT* the emergency lanes in Texas keep getting 6 inches wider every year or two and now appear to be turning lanes (even when the real turning lane is clearly marked just to the left of the emergency lane), but you can't tell that to a million alcoholics and weed smokers, hell no... just keep your seatbelt on and your kids on the left side of the car and maybe, just maybe.... your day will go without being airlifted to a hospital, while the guy who cut you off (sometimes driving an 18-wheeler, mind you), keeps on driving by smiling. From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Sun Jul 13 12:26:33 2008 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 13:26:33 -0300 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <20080713152200.2EA3720A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> <20080713152200.2EA3720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <487A2CB9.6030201@adinet.com.uy> Just let me know, I'll be first on line ;-) Diego Roger Taylor wrote: > At 06:15 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: >> BTW, the law does not state what brand of computer, so any computer >> that use a storage device is subject to this la. Which means in Texas >> you can not legally even work on your own COCO. LOL > > > Solution: Just hire illegal aliens (from south of the border) to do > the computer repair work, and our government won't bother them at > all. ;) > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 12:57:38 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 11:57:38 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <487A2CB9.6030201@adinet.com.uy> References: <48793B11.9040009@sbcglobal.net> <20080713152200.2EA3720A33@qs281.pair.com> <487A2CB9.6030201@adinet.com.uy> Message-ID: <20080713165802.F0BA720A33@qs281.pair.com> At 11:26 AM 7/13/2008, you wrote: >Just let me know, I'll be first on line ;-) > >Diego > > >Roger Taylor wrote: >>At 06:15 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: >>>BTW, the law does not state what brand of computer, so any >>>computer that use a storage device is subject to this la. Which >>>means in Texas you can not legally even work on your own COCO. LOL >> >> >>Solution: Just hire illegal aliens (from south of the border) to >>do the computer repair work, and our government won't bother them at all. ;) Har har (sounds of a donkey sounding off) From jdaggett at gate.net Sun Jul 13 14:46:19 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:46:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> Message-ID: <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net> Joe They are useful as long as you keep the Clock at 0.89MHz. They are to slow for the 1.78MHz clock. As for programming them most older, 80's vintage, EPROM programers will suffice. james On 13 Jul 2008 at 4:46, Joe wrote: > I know this was discussed on the list before but I can't for the life > of me find it. Just got a NOS tube of these @ 350ns. Anyone remember > if that fast enough for a coco3. BTW anyone know of a cheap programmer > that will write these. Thanks. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1549 - Release Date: > 7/12/2008 4:31 PM > > From lamune at doki-doki.net Sun Jul 13 17:47:25 2008 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:47:25 -0700 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of jdaggett at gate.net > Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 11:46 AM > To: Joe; CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] MCM68766 > > Joe > > They are useful as long as you keep the Clock at 0.89MHz. They are to > slow > for the 1.78MHz clock. As for programming them most older, 80's > vintage, > EPROM programers will suffice. > > james > Keep in mind that this rating is the maximum guaranteed access time. It's quite possible the device may be faster-it's just guaranteed not to be any slower. Regardless, though, it'll work at the stock clock rate, as pointed out above. From cdiman7 at flash.net Sun Jul 13 21:01:10 2008 From: cdiman7 at flash.net (KARL SEFCIK) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 18:01:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <20080713165802.F0BA720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <732328.56167.qm@web80203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Riger, I looked all last night through the bill, and I doidn't see anything about computer techs, there was a lot about Security officers, and contractors and alarm contractors. Nothing about the lowly computer repasir tech except the parts that held the data for Alarms or security, since so much of that is on hard disk now, instead of videotape or 8 track. Karl p.s. If it is there, where is it? --- Roger Taylor wrote: > At 11:26 AM 7/13/2008, you wrote: > >Just let me know, I'll be first on line ;-) > > > >Diego > > > > > >Roger Taylor wrote: > >>At 06:15 PM 7/12/2008, you wrote: > >>>BTW, the law does not state what brand of > computer, so any > >>>computer that use a storage device is subject to > this la. Which > >>>means in Texas you can not legally even work on > your own COCO. LOL > >> > >> > >>Solution: Just hire illegal aliens (from south of > the border) to > >>do the computer repair work, and our government > won't bother them at all. ;) > > > Har har (sounds of a donkey sounding off) > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 13 22:27:36 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 21:27:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <732328.56167.qm@web80203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20080713165802.F0BA720A33@qs281.pair.com> <732328.56167.qm@web80203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20080714022800.719DB20A33@qs281.pair.com> At 08:01 PM 7/13/2008, you wrote: >Riger, > I looked all last night through the bill, and I >doidn't see anything about computer techs, there was a >lot about Security officers, and contractors and alarm > contractors. Nothing about the lowly computer repasir >tech except the parts that held the data for Alarms or >security, since so much of that is on hard disk now, >instead of videotape or 8 track. >Karl >p.s. If it is there, where is it? ?? I never said it was there. In fact, I'm saying I can't believe such a new law exists. Read back through the thread to the original messages. From jdaggett at gate.net Sun Jul 13 23:21:34 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 23:21:34 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender>, <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net>, <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> Message-ID: <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> Mike You need 250nS access time for the ROM memory for the Coco to run at 1.78MHz period. On the ROMs and static ram the access time and the cycle time are equivalent. The maximum access time is the fastest that the ROM can operate at. The inverse of 350nS is about 2.85MHz. Since the Coco uses IDMA to access both data and video memory, at 1.78MHz half of the 560 nS cycle time is used to access data/program memory. The other half is used to access video memory. That is 260nS for a read cycle at 1.78MHz. This means in a Coco system the fastest clock for 350nS ROMs is about 1.425 MHz. Like I said before they work fine with the clock at 0.89MHz Motorola speced that part at 250nS and 350nS. If it works reliably at the faster speed, it would have been marked that. Even if it had an access time of 300nS, which is faster than 350nS, it is still to slow for 1.78MHz clock. james On 13 Jul 2008 at 14:47, Mike Pepe wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of jdaggett at gate.net > > Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 11:46 AM > > To: Joe; CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > > Subject: Re: [Coco] MCM68766 > > > > Joe > > > > They are useful as long as you keep the Clock at 0.89MHz. They are > > to slow for the 1.78MHz clock. As for programming them most older, > > 80's vintage, EPROM programers will suffice. > > > > james > > > > Keep in mind that this rating is the maximum guaranteed access time. > It's quite possible the device may be faster-it's just guaranteed not > to be any slower. > > Regardless, though, it'll work at the stock clock rate, as pointed out > above. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1550 - Release Date: > 7/13/2008 5:58 PM > > From joef6809 at gmail.com Mon Jul 14 00:01:15 2008 From: joef6809 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 00:01:15 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender>, <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net>, <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <6DDC721136D742ED9CF331C92CF88F4A@bender> Yes that's what I was coming up with, One the other hand I know I was running a coco3 with Ados 3 and a 68766 back in the day. I also know the fastest they ever made these chips was 300ns. Sooo with a little luck I can probably find a couple that will run fast enough. Got 15 to play with. As for programming them, Yes any programmer circa late 80's early 90's will work, Its just finding one with the software that will work under NT. There are some recent ones that will support it but they are like $500.00. I'm going to homebrew route and build my own. Would anyone else be interested in building one assuming I get it working? I've come up with a really small 2 chip design that works on paper at least. I'm talking just 68766 support and breadboard type of thing. BTW while I'm asking stupid questions anyone know the diff between a 68766 and a 68764?? The spec sheets seem to indicate they are identical AFAIK. thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Mike Pepe" ; "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 11:21 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] MCM68766 > Mike > > You need 250nS access time for the ROM memory for the Coco to run at > 1.78MHz period. On the ROMs and static ram the access time and the cycle > time are equivalent. The maximum access time is the fastest that the ROM > can operate at. The inverse of 350nS is about 2.85MHz. Since the Coco > uses IDMA to access both data and video memory, at 1.78MHz half of the > 560 nS cycle time is used to access data/program memory. The other half is > used to access video memory. That is 260nS for a read cycle at 1.78MHz. > This means in a Coco system the fastest clock for 350nS ROMs is about > 1.425 MHz. Like I said before they work fine with the clock at 0.89MHz > > Motorola speced that part at 250nS and 350nS. If it works reliably at the > faster speed, it would have been marked that. Even if it had an access > time > of 300nS, which is faster than 350nS, it is still to slow for 1.78MHz > clock. > > james > > On 13 Jul 2008 at 14:47, Mike Pepe wrote: > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- >> > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of jdaggett at gate.net >> > Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 11:46 AM >> > To: Joe; CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts >> > Subject: Re: [Coco] MCM68766 >> > >> > Joe >> > >> > They are useful as long as you keep the Clock at 0.89MHz. They are >> > to slow for the 1.78MHz clock. As for programming them most older, >> > 80's vintage, EPROM programers will suffice. >> > >> > james >> > >> >> Keep in mind that this rating is the maximum guaranteed access time. >> It's quite possible the device may be faster-it's just guaranteed not >> to be any slower. >> >> Regardless, though, it'll work at the stock clock rate, as pointed out >> above. >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >> Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1550 - Release Date: >> 7/13/2008 5:58 PM >> >> > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 14 05:47:33 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 05:47:33 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender>, <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net>, <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local><487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> <6DDC721136D742ED9CF331C92CF88F4A@bender> Message-ID: YES, I would love to have the circuit schematic. For the few I would need to program, breadboard or wire wrap would work well. Thanks, ~BWC~ > I'm going to homebrew route and build my own. Would anyone else be > interested in building one assuming I get it working? I've come up with a > really small 2 chip design that works on paper at least. I'm talking just > 68766 support and breadboard type of thing. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 09:23:07 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:23:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> , <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net> , <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1216041787.6517.20.camel@dev> On Sun, 2008-07-13 at 23:21 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > Mike > > You need 250nS access time for the ROM memory for the Coco to run at > 1.78MHz period. On the ROMs and static ram the access time and the cycle > time are equivalent. The maximum access time is the fastest that the ROM > can operate at. The inverse of 350nS is about 2.85MHz. Since the Coco > uses IDMA to access both data and video memory, at 1.78MHz half of the > 560 nS cycle time is used to access data/program memory. The other half is > used to access video memory. That is 260nS for a read cycle at 1.78MHz. > This means in a Coco system the fastest clock for 350nS ROMs is about > 1.425 MHz. Like I said before they work fine with the clock at 0.89MHz I think that you're perhaps over-complicating the situation; the access-interleaving done by the GIME really only applies to the dynamic RAMs -- the GIME does not get in the middle of bus cycles for ROMs or I/O regions, except as an address-decoder (S[2:0]). The access time of the I/O ports and EEPROMs must be < ~280ns, not because of any interleaving, but because an access begins on the positive edge of the E clock, and is completed on the negative edge (more or less). At 50% duty cycle that means the access time is roughly 1/2 the period of the system clock. Or did I miss something? C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 10:15:47 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:15:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak Message-ID: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Hi folks, It looks like tomorrow I'm going to be coming into possession of much cool Coco gear, including a "Wordpak". Now, back in my 64K Coco 2 days I drooled much over this mystical item described in Rainbow magazine, and I'm very much looking forward to getting it going. Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? Google isn't too helpful, I see references to a Wordpak, Wordpak II, and a Wordpak RS. There is a NitrOS-9 driver for the Wordpak II that sheds some light. (Looks like a 6845-based card.) But does anyone know what the differences in the models are? Does it have a composite output? Any info appreciated. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 10:28:45 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:28:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Message-ID: <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> On Sat, 2008-07-12 at 20:51 -0400, Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No Halt > Controller. Thanks for the pics of the Slot 3! So where are these schematics for the Sardis? ;) C. From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 14 10:34:05 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:34:05 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Message-ID: WordPak = composite output 80 by 24 WordPakII=composite output 80 by 24 with an input, so your composite output from your CoCo can be routed top the same monitor. There is a relay or electronic switch to control weather the input or the WordPak is outputing to the monitor. WordPakRS=? I don't have one or any documentation for one. To the best of my knowledge all are based on the 6845 monochrome monitor driver chip. Since the data is input to the WordPak serially, it can get behind. Under OS-9 Level 1 release 2 I went to a 64 by 24 software driven display and shelved the WordPakII. A do itch to get this stuff out and refresh my memory, time and space however remains at a premium. ~BWC~ > Hi folks, > > It looks like tomorrow I'm going to be coming into possession of much > cool Coco gear, including a "Wordpak". Now, back in my 64K Coco 2 days > I drooled much over this mystical item described in Rainbow magazine, > and I'm very much looking forward to getting it going. > > Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? Google isn't too > helpful, I see references to a Wordpak, Wordpak II, and a Wordpak RS. > There is a NitrOS-9 driver for the Wordpak II that sheds some light. > (Looks like a 6845-based card.) But does anyone know what the > differences in the models are? Does it have a composite output? Any > info appreciated. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 14 10:40:03 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:40:03 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> YIKES! Did I miss something? Did Tom post the Slot Pack III pix somewheres already? =M0= >Thanks for the pics of the Slot 3! > >So where are these schematics for the Sardis? ;) > >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 10:42:17 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:42:17 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 07:40 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > YIKES! > > Did I miss something? Did Tom post the Slot Pack III pix somewheres already? > > =M0= He did, over the weekend! 19-some-odd emails of pics. It might be that your client/mail provider/spam filter/whatever removed them. I can post them on el-interwebo if you want? C. From jdaggett at gate.net Mon Jul 14 10:59:20 2008 From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:59:20 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <1216041787.6517.20.camel@dev> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender>, <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net>, <1216041787.6517.20.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487B3188.17714.B34B1B@jdaggett.gate.net> On 14 Jul 2008 at 9:23, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sun, 2008-07-13 at 23:21 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > Mike > > > > You need 250nS access time for the ROM memory for the Coco to run at > > 1.78MHz period. On the ROMs and static ram the access time and the > > cycle time are equivalent. The maximum access time is the fastest > > that the ROM can operate at. The inverse of 350nS is about 2.85MHz. > > Since the Coco uses IDMA to access both data and video memory, at > > 1.78MHz half of the 560 nS cycle time is used to access data/program > > memory. The other half is used to access video memory. That is > > 260nS for a read cycle at 1.78MHz. This means in a Coco system the > > fastest clock for 350nS ROMs is about 1.425 MHz. Like I said before > > they work fine with the clock at 0.89MHz > > I think that you're perhaps over-complicating the situation; the > access-interleaving done by the GIME really only applies to the > dynamic RAMs -- the GIME does not get in the middle of bus cycles for > ROMs or I/O regions, except as an address-decoder (S[2:0]). > > The access time of the I/O ports and EEPROMs must be < ~280ns, not > because of any interleaving, but because an access begins on the > positive edge of the E clock, and is completed on the negative edge > (more or less). At 50% duty cycle that means the access time is > roughly 1/2 the period of the system clock. > > Or did I miss something? Access time of ROMS is equal to the read cycle time. Thus for an access time of 350nS that is speced from the time that the address is valid to the time that the data is outputed from the ROM. In the 6809 the address is valid approxiamtely on the falling edge of the Q Clock. Data is clocked into the processor on the next falling edge of the E Clock. The 6809 cycle starts on the falling edge of the Eclock. james From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 11:02:51 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:02:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 10:34 -0400, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > WordPak = composite output 80 by 24 > > WordPakII=composite output 80 by 24 with an input, so your composite output > from your CoCo can be routed top the same monitor. There is a relay or > electronic switch to control weather the input or the WordPak is outputing > to the monitor. > > WordPakRS=? I don't have one or any documentation for one. > Hmm, I may have to reverse-engineer it! Much fun. > To the best of my knowledge all are based on the 6845 monochrome monitor > driver chip. Actually, the 6845 is color-agnostic. It's responsible for generating timing and address data for a display, but leaves it to external circuitry to generate pixel data - the CGA card from IBM, for example, was 6845-based and color. > Since the data is input to the WordPak serially, it can get > behind. Under OS-9 Level 1 release 2 I went to a 64 by 24 software driven > display and shelved the WordPakII. So the Workpak II was just too slow? That sucks. Can you define 'get behind'? :) Was it terribly slow on scrolling, perhaps? C. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 14 11:21:42 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:21:42 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Quoting Chuck Youse : > Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? I'd kinda be interested in seeing a schematic of it. Or failing that high quality scans of the top/bottom of the board....I'm assuming that it's a standard coco cart. Cheers. Phill. ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 11:27:27 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:27:27 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: <487B3188.17714.B34B1B@jdaggett.gate.net> References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> , <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> , <1216041787.6517.20.camel@dev> <487B3188.17714.B34B1B@jdaggett.gate.net> Message-ID: <1216049247.6517.66.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 10:59 -0400, jdaggett at gate.net wrote: > > Access time of ROMS is equal to the read cycle time. Thus for an access time of 350nS that > is speced from the time that the address is valid to the time that the data is outputed from > the ROM. In the 6809 the address is valid approxiamtely on the falling edge of the Q Clock. > Data is clocked into the processor on the next falling edge of the E Clock. The 6809 cycle > starts on the falling edge of the Eclock. Actually, the address is valid on the *positive* edge of the Q clock, and remains valid until the negative edge of the E clock. But most 6800-family MPUs don't have the quadrature clock, and as such the 6800 peripherals only have E inputs. On the positive edge of E, bus signals are assumed valid, and a bus cycle is in progress; it ends on the negative edge. Thus, at 2MHz your access time is 1/2 of E, which is 250ns (roughly). As for the ROMs in question, you make a good point that ROMs are read-only devices, and therefore I think there's a good chance that 350ns versions would work on the Coco at 1.78MHz -- from the datasheet: 1. the address-valid to output-valid time (access time) is 350ns; 2. output-enable to output-valid time is 150ns. At 1.78MHz, address-valid to CPU-latch of data (Q rise to E fall) is ~420ns. The only question is what the timings look like for address-valid before output-enable, which the datasheet I have doesn't address. It all depends on the timing of S[2:0] from the GIME, as they're responsible for OE* on the ROM. In any case, I still don't see what this has to do with interleaved DMA for video. :) C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 11:30:11 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:30:11 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 16:21 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Quoting Chuck Youse : > > > Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? > > I'd kinda be interested in seeing a schematic of it. Or failing that > high quality scans of the top/bottom of the board....I'm assuming that > it's a > standard coco cart. > > Cheers. > > Phill. When I get it, I will do. I will probably also reverse-engineer and make clone boards. I'm personally not too interested in graphics and color etc. that the GIME provides. I'd rather overclock the thing for better CPU performance and leave video to a different device. C. From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Mon Jul 14 11:35:46 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:35:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com><002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com><20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com><002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com><003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com><1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev><20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> Message-ID: "Chuck Youse" wrote in message news:1216046537.6517.36.camel at dev... > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 07:40 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> YIKES! >> >> Did I miss something? Did Tom post the Slot Pack III pix somewheres >> already? >> >> =M0= > > He did, over the weekend! 19-some-odd emails of pics. It might be that > your client/mail provider/spam filter/whatever removed them. I can post > them on el-interwebo if you want? > > C. Please do. I've head about this device and would like to see it. Thanks Charlie From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 14 11:56:59 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 08:56:59 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080714155652.933BF20A33@qs281.pair.com> WTH? Didn't see any images, ever, on the list - must be the MIME setting on the listserver... fixed it. No filters set, images received constantly from several other sources, manual spam trapping. I thought the list was searchable - doesn't look like maltedmedia.com archives the images. If a repost wouldn't choke the list bandwidth, I =should= see it now, but direct email to me works too ;) Thanx for the info, I had figured Tom just got too busy. :) =M0= > > Did I miss something? Did Tom post the Slot Pack III pix > somewheres already? > > > > =M0= > >He did, over the weekend! 19-some-odd emails of pics. It might be that >your client/mail provider/spam filter/whatever removed them. I can post >them on el-interwebo if you want? > >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 14 12:07:40 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:07:40 -0700 Subject: [Coco] DriveWire Message-ID: <20080714160732.2EE1620A36@qs281.pair.com> I really don't want to keep bugging Boisy Pitre, anybody else using DriveWire? =M0= From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 14 12:11:47 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 12:11:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> Message-ID: <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> >> Since the data is input to the WordPak serially, it can get >> behind. Under OS-9 Level 1 release 2 I went to a 64 by 24 software >> driven >> display and shelved the WordPakII. > > So the Workpak II was just too slow? That sucks. Can you define 'get > behind'? :) Was it terribly slow on scrolling, perhaps? > > C. The WORD-PAK output will occasionally get behind a fast typist. You will watch the characters being placed on the screen too. It was faster than a 300 baud modem, but you do often watch them printing to the screen one character at a time. The normal screen output has to be converted and fed to the WORD-PAK through an output address in high RAM. IIRC, this address was reassigned in the CoCo 3 so the WORD-PAK does not work with the CoCo 3. OTOH the CoCo 3 has 80 by 24 (26 with a poke or two) so the WORD-PAK would be redundant, unless you wanted to run two monitors. I have not scanned the manual in to make a PDF yet. Seeing as said manual has a copyright notice I might not even get around to it. ~BWC~ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 12:22:50 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 12:22:50 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> Message-ID: <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 12:11 -0400, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > >> Since the data is input to the WordPak serially, it can get > >> behind. Under OS-9 Level 1 release 2 I went to a 64 by 24 software > >> driven > >> display and shelved the WordPakII. > > > > So the Workpak II was just too slow? That sucks. Can you define 'get > > behind'? :) Was it terribly slow on scrolling, perhaps? > > > > C. > > The WORD-PAK output will occasionally get behind a fast typist. You will > watch the characters being placed on the screen too. It was faster than a > 300 baud modem, but you do often watch them printing to the screen one > character at a time. Wow. Sounds like a serious flaw in implementation (hardware or software). No way a 6845-based display needs to be that slow, doesn't matter if you're latching addresses to write characters to the screen - three memory stores instead of one, slower by a factor of three but certainly shouldn't be noticed by a human.. And yeah, what I gathered is that the Wordpak has some address conflicts with the GIME. Big surprise.. C. From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 14 12:44:58 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 12:44:58 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev><1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev><5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> Message-ID: <37330D12687B491A909AC1765699552B@speedy> > Wow. Sounds like a serious flaw in implementation (hardware or > software). No way a 6845-based display needs to be that slow, > C. Well, that is my remembrance of the device. Maybe I had a defective one? Like I said earlier, once I set up OS-9 L1 R2 with a 64 by 24 driver on a CoCo 2 with a monochrome monitor driver, I stopped messing with the WORD-PAK. And it was not long after that I was messing with a CoCo 3. And all of that was 10 years or so behind the curve. Seeing as I got my first CoCo 3 from a friend who found it at the dump, with it's hard drive and associated hardware, software and documentation somewhere around 1994. ~BWC~ From fwp at deepthought.com Mon Jul 14 13:42:31 2008 From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 12:42:31 -0500 Subject: [Coco] DriveWire In-Reply-To: <20080714160732.2EE1620A36@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080714160732.2EE1620A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20080714174231.GN4144@warlock.deepthought.com> I do and I love it. Frank On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 09:07:40AM -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > I really don't want to keep bugging Boisy Pitre, anybody else using DriveWire? > > =M0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 14 13:39:08 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:39:08 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 16:21 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: >> Quoting Chuck Youse : >> [wordpak board] > When I get it, I will do. I will probably also reverse-engineer and > make clone boards. Hehehe that's pretty much the intention here too :) It's a shame I don't have a Dragon Plus board, that also had a 6845 for 80x25 (with it's own 2k of video ram), and added an extra 64K of ram to whatever the basic machine had so 96K or 128K. I'd really like to reverse engineer that :) Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 13:49:04 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:49:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1216057744.6517.75.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 18:39 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > > It's a shame I don't have a Dragon Plus board, that also had a 6845 for > 80x25 (with it's own 2k of video ram), and added an extra 64K of ram to > whatever the basic machine had so 96K or 128K. I'd really like to > reverse engineer that :) Just make one! :) C. From adit at nationsdial.com Mon Jul 14 13:51:06 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:51:06 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak Manual In-Reply-To: <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> Message-ID: <93C38568-D074-464D-A25D-7530868EAE20@nationsdial.com> On Jul 14, 2008, at 9:11 AM, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > I have not scanned the manual in to make a PDF yet. Seeing as said > manual has a copyright notice I might not even get around to it. > The Word-Pak/Word-Pak II UM REV F (Nov 1984) & Word-Pak installation Guide are part of the CoCo/OS-9 archive and are probably available on the maltedmedia FTP site (try Manuals/PBJ ) If it isn't up there let me know and I'll upload it or e-mail it. Dean From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 14:04:43 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 14:04:43 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak Manual In-Reply-To: <93C38568-D074-464D-A25D-7530868EAE20@nationsdial.com> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <93C38568-D074-464D-A25D-7530868EAE20@nationsdial.com> Message-ID: <1216058683.6517.77.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 10:51 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote: > The Word-Pak/Word-Pak II UM REV F (Nov 1984) & Word-Pak installation > Guide are part of the CoCo/OS-9 archive and are probably available on > the maltedmedia FTP site (try Manuals/PBJ ) If it isn't up there let > me know and I'll upload it or e-mail it. Damn. I should really spend more time perusing maltedmedia and rtsi before opening my trap on the list. Thanks - they're definitely there. C. From dml_68 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 14 14:19:30 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:19:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] DriveWire In-Reply-To: <20080714160732.2EE1620A36@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <860777.44954.qm@web30203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I am thinking about purchasing it very soon. Any feedback on how well it works or any problems would be helpful to me. thank you ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Mon, 7/14/08, Mike 0rtloff wrote: From: Mike 0rtloff Subject: [Coco] DriveWire To: coco at maltedmedia.com Date: Monday, July 14, 2008, 9:07 AM I really don't want to keep bugging Boisy Pitre, anybody else using DriveWire? =M0= -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 14:30:53 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 14:30:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1216060253.6517.80.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 18:39 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 16:21 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > >> Quoting Chuck Youse : > >> > [wordpak board] > > When I get it, I will do. I will probably also reverse-engineer and > > make clone boards. > > Hehehe that's pretty much the intention here too :) Looks like the Wordpak manual has a schematic. W00t! Haven't looked to closely, but based on the docs I've read, I think they're using the 6545, not the 6845. The one nice feature of the 6545 was that it would act as a gateway to the display RAM, requiring neither complex multiplexing nor dual-ported RAM. Of course, these days, dual-ported RAM is cheap, and any design I make will probably use that.. C. From lothan at newsguy.com Mon Jul 14 14:55:05 2008 From: lothan at newsguy.com (Lothan) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:55:05 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Message-ID: <2CF2CD3064F940EE982CF3759C97475B@Crossfire> The WordPak RS was sold through Radio Shack stores from the special sourcing catalog (or whatever they called that catalog that included third-party hardware and software). If I remember correctly, the WordPak RS was a modified version of the WordPak or WordPak II (can't remember which) to use different I/O addresses. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Bruce W. Calkins" Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 7:34 AM To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Subject: Re: [Coco] Wordpak > WordPak = composite output 80 by 24 > > WordPakII=composite output 80 by 24 with an input, so your composite > output from your CoCo can be routed top the same monitor. There is a > relay or electronic switch to control weather the input or the WordPak is > outputing to the monitor. > > WordPakRS=? I don't have one or any documentation for one. > > To the best of my knowledge all are based on the 6845 monochrome monitor > driver chip. Since the data is input to the WordPak serially, it can get > behind. Under OS-9 Level 1 release 2 I went to a 64 by 24 software driven > display and shelved the WordPakII. A do itch to get this stuff out and > refresh my memory, time and space however remains at a premium. > > > > ~BWC~ > > > > > >> Hi folks, >> >> It looks like tomorrow I'm going to be coming into possession of much >> cool Coco gear, including a "Wordpak". Now, back in my 64K Coco 2 days >> I drooled much over this mystical item described in Rainbow magazine, >> and I'm very much looking forward to getting it going. >> >> Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? Google isn't too >> helpful, I see references to a Wordpak, Wordpak II, and a Wordpak RS. >> There is a NitrOS-9 driver for the Wordpak II that sheds some light. >> (Looks like a 6845-based card.) But does anyone know what the >> differences in the models are? Does it have a composite output? Any >> info appreciated. >> >> C. >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 14 14:57:46 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:57:46 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> My previous response looked a bit vague - yes, I =would= like o see 'em posted (to the Web) or emailed direct to me, I didn't see 'em, likely cuz I had my account set to plaintext :^/ =M0= > > He did, over the weekend! 19-some-odd emails of pics. It might be that > > your client/mail provider/spam filter/whatever removed them. I can post > > them on el-interwebo if you want? > > > > C. >Please do. I've head about this device and would like to see it. >Thanks >Charlie > > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From joef6809 at gmail.com Mon Jul 14 15:03:19 2008 From: joef6809 at gmail.com (Joe F) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:03:19 -0400 Subject: [Coco] MCM68766 In-Reply-To: References: <1F6D7C87F2084166A7975AA7F06BA7CA@bender> <487A153B.3275.149931@jdaggett.gate.net> <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D658@fenestra.lamunet.local> <487A8DFE.22220.1EC5337@jdaggett.gate.net> <6DDC721136D742ED9CF331C92CF88F4A@bender> Message-ID: <4ceb32a20807141203w9f3f85es86d44c37c648abed@mail.gmail.com> Ok at least 1 person is as brave/stupid as I. gimme a week or two any I'll post it to my website. Like I said look real good on paper, I'll find out what real life has to say as soon as the chips come in On 7/14/08, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > > YES, I would love to have the circuit schematic. For the few I would need > to program, breadboard or wire wrap would work well. > > Thanks, > > ~BWC~ > > > > I'm going to homebrew route and build my own. Would anyone else be >> interested in building one assuming I get it working? I've come up with a >> really small 2 chip design that works on paper at least. I'm talking just >> 68766 support and breadboard type of thing. >> > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 15:03:29 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:03:29 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1216062209.6517.87.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 11:57 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > My previous response looked a bit vague - yes, I =would= like o see > 'em posted (to the Web) or emailed direct to me, I didn't see 'em, > likely cuz I had my account set to plaintext :^/ > > =M0= I'll post 'em in a bit. A little busy at this precise moment, but hang in there .. C. From adit at nationsdial.com Mon Jul 14 16:18:52 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:18:52 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Sardis Controller Manual In-Reply-To: <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> Message-ID: On Jul 12, 2008, at 5:51 PM, Tom Seagrove wrote: > Oh, I also have the documentation and schematics for the Sardis No > Halt > Controller. > Tom, any chance I could get a copy for the CoCo/OS-9 archive? Dean From brucewcalkins at charter.net Mon Jul 14 16:47:07 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:47:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev><20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk><1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216060253.6517.80.camel@dev> Message-ID: <9EA59566DD0D45A7AB98E09D437D8C98@speedy> > Looks like the Wordpak manual has a schematic. W00t! Haven't looked to > closely, but based on the docs I've read, I think they're using the > 6545, not the 6845. The one nice feature of the 6545 was that it would > act as a gateway to the display RAM, requiring neither complex > multiplexing nor dual-ported RAM. > > C. My book shows the 6845E in the parts list. ~BWC~ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 16:52:01 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:52:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <9EA59566DD0D45A7AB98E09D437D8C98@speedy> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <20080714162142.uum8yi0n4ww0sk88@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216049411.6517.70.camel@dev> <487B8F3C.3090008@aurigae.demon.co.uk> <1216060253.6517.80.camel@dev> <9EA59566DD0D45A7AB98E09D437D8C98@speedy> Message-ID: <1216068721.12717.1.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 16:47 -0400, Bruce W. Calkins wrote: > My book shows the 6845E in the parts list. > ~BWC~ Hmm, yeah, you're right. They mention it _several_ times - I need to go over this schematic in detail, the 'shadow' register might be a latch or somesuch. The schematic is, unfortunately, not all that clear. It'll make more sense once I get the board. C. From afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 14 17:06:51 2008 From: afra at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:06:51 +0100 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak Manual In-Reply-To: <1216058683.6517.77.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <93C38568-D074-464D-A25D-7530868EAE20@nationsdial.com> <1216058683.6517.77.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487BBFEB.4060607@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 10:51 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote: > >> The Word-Pak/Word-Pak II UM REV F (Nov 1984) & Word-Pak installation >> Guide are part of the CoCo/OS-9 archive and are probably available on >> the maltedmedia FTP site (try Manuals/PBJ ) If it isn't up there let >> me know and I'll upload it or e-mail it. > > Damn. I should really spend more time perusing maltedmedia and rtsi > before opening my trap on the list. Sorry to be a pain, can someone remind me of the addresses of these archives please ? Cheers. Phill. -- Phill Harvey-Smith, Programmer, Hardware hacker, and general eccentric ! "You can twist perceptions, but reality won't budge" -- Rush. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 17:12:13 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:12:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak Manual In-Reply-To: <487BBFEB.4060607@aurigae.demon.co.uk> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <93C38568-D074-464D-A25D-7530868EAE20@nationsdial.com> <1216058683.6517.77.camel@dev> <487BBFEB.4060607@aurigae.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: <1216069933.12717.3.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 22:06 +0100, Phill Harvey-Smith wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 10:51 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote: > > > >> The Word-Pak/Word-Pak II UM REV F (Nov 1984) & Word-Pak installation > >> Guide are part of the CoCo/OS-9 archive and are probably available on > >> the maltedmedia FTP site (try Manuals/PBJ ) If it isn't up there let > >> me know and I'll upload it or e-mail it. > > > > Damn. I should really spend more time perusing maltedmedia and rtsi > > before opening my trap on the list. > > Sorry to be a pain, can someone remind me of the addresses of these > archives please ? ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/ http://www.rtsi.com/ftparchive.html C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 17:25:56 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:25:56 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade Message-ID: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> Does anyone have one of these the want to part with? I'm pimping out one of my Coco systems to serve as my main dev box, and I'd like to bump a past the 512K mark, as I'll probably be hammering this system pretty hard... Barring that, does anyone have the boolean equations for U6 on the 1MB upgrade? :) The schematics are available, but not the PAL stuff .. C. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 14 17:51:53 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 07:51:53 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487BCA79.1070408@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > Was it terribly slow on scrolling, perhaps? Anyone who has designed a 6845 text-based display that suffers from terribly slow scrolling should not have any business designing hardware, IMHO! ;) Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 14 17:56:24 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 07:56:24 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > Wow. Sounds like a serious flaw in implementation (hardware or > software). No way a 6845-based display needs to be that slow, doesn't > matter if you're latching addresses to write characters to the screen - > three memory stores instead of one, slower by a factor of three but > certainly shouldn't be noticed by a human.. Yeeow!! I'd also be very interested to know exactly how they managed to make it so slow - must've taken some doing! ;) Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 18:42:02 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:42:02 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 11:57 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > My previous response looked a bit vague - yes, I =would= like o see > 'em posted (to the Web) or emailed direct to me, I didn't see 'em, > likely cuz I had my account set to plaintext :^/ > > =M0= Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ Enjoy C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 18:47:52 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:47:52 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 17:25 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > Barring that, does anyone have the boolean equations for U6 on the 1MB > upgrade? :) The schematics are available, but not the PAL stuff .. Nevermind, found the PAL equations after all... C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 20:15:25 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:15:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <487BCA79.1070408@iinet.net.au> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <487BCA79.1070408@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1216080925.12717.24.camel@dev> On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 07:51 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > Anyone who has designed a 6845 text-based display that suffers from terribly > slow scrolling should not have any business designing hardware, IMHO! ;) > Strangely enough, few driver writers use the origin registers to scroll the display. Even the PC/XT BIOS (and as a result, all following generations of PC-compatible crap) ignores this obvious optimization. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 20:19:51 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:19:51 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1216081191.12717.30.camel@dev> On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 07:56 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > Yeeow!! I'd also be very interested to know exactly how they managed to make > it so slow - must've taken some doing! ;) I think it's the snow-avoidance. This board appears to suffer from the same problem as the first-generation CGA boards (not MDA, IIRC). Contention between the CPU and the video display, CPU gets priority. If you don't wait for a blanking interval you get snow. Combine this will a lack of interrupts from the Wordpak and a multi-tasking OS like OS-9, and I can see how one might get into that mess.. just conjecture though, haven't looked at the drivers closely enough to determine why. C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 20:21:03 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:21:03 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> Message-ID: <1216081264.12717.31.camel@dev> On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 07:56 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: ?| Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" Doesn't that imply that you do it with less power, too? ;) C. From tjseagrove at writeme.com Mon Jul 14 20:28:18 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:28:18 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> Message-ID: <00f801c8e611$ae225fe0$0a671fa0$@com> Thanks for doing that..was going to ask if you could post somewhere... I will get the docs scanned tomorrow. Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Youse Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 6:42 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 11:57 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > My previous response looked a bit vague - yes, I =would= like o see > 'em posted (to the Web) or emailed direct to me, I didn't see 'em, > likely cuz I had my account set to plaintext :^/ > > =M0= Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ Enjoy C. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1551 - Release Date: 7/14/2008 6:49 AM From johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net Mon Jul 14 20:56:04 2008 From: johnadonaldson at sbcglobal.net (John Donaldson) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:56:04 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement Message-ID: <487BF5A4.4090602@sbcglobal.net> Karl, It's there, otherwise so many articles about would not have been written about it. Do a Google search of "Texas IT PI Law" and look at how many articles there are about this law. John Donaldson -- From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 14 21:03:06 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:03:06 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> WOW - too VERY cool!!! Mine is only approximately similar to that one, but the missing chip looks to be the 7408 - jeez, man, those pics are HUGE, one of those rare times when I'm grateful I have a fatpipe connection . Even more info than I thought I needed, ain't that the neatest?!? HUGE THANKS to Tom for these exquisite images, worthy of upload to the archive indeed, and massive thanx to you too Chuck for making certain I saw 'em!!! Love that floral background *VBG* =M0= >Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) > >http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ > >Enjoy >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From adit at nationsdial.com Mon Jul 14 22:20:29 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:20:29 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> Message-ID: <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> On Jul 14, 2008, at 3:47 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 17:25 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > >> Barring that, does anyone have the boolean equations for U6 on the >> 1MB >> upgrade? :) The schematics are available, but not the PAL stuff .. > > Nevermind, found the PAL equations after all... > > Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very close look at them can comment. Dean From gene.heskett at verizon.net Mon Jul 14 22:32:30 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:32:30 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> Message-ID: <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Monday 14 July 2008, Dean Leiber wrote: >On Jul 14, 2008, at 3:47 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: >> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 17:25 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: >>> Barring that, does anyone have the boolean equations for U6 on the >>> 1MB >>> upgrade? :) The schematics are available, but not the PAL stuff .. >> >> Nevermind, found the PAL equations after all... > >Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are >errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't >exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very >close look at them can comment. > >Dean I can second that. Tony didn't trust anybody. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "The Schizophrenic: An Unauthorized Autobiography" From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 14 22:46:48 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:46:48 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 22:32 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > >Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are > >errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't > >exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very > >close look at them can comment. > > > >Dean > > I can second that. Tony didn't trust anybody. > Niiiiiiice.... then why publish the schematics at all? Silly... Bad Tony! I will never read 'Turn of the Screw' with the same warm fuzzies again. C. From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 14 23:48:54 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 13:48:54 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216081264.12717.31.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> <1216081264.12717.31.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487C1E26.1070700@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 07:56 +1000, Mark McDougall wrote: > > ???| Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do > it > | | with less resistance!" > > Doesn't that imply that you do it with less power, too? ;) Not necessarily - just more current. Even so, don't forget that resistance is inversely proportional to cross-sectional area! ;) Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 14 23:55:25 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 13:55:25 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216081191.12717.30.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <5351D9BA741B4B6D929E797035CF7167@speedy> <1216052570.6517.73.camel@dev> <487BCB88.4070503@iinet.net.au> <1216081191.12717.30.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487C1FAD.90107@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > I think it's the snow-avoidance. This board appears to suffer from the > same problem as the first-generation CGA boards (not MDA, IIRC). > Contention between the CPU and the video display, CPU gets priority. If > you don't wait for a blanking interval you get snow. True, I think I over-estimated the design of the pak. I was thinking a FIFO in the cart which wrote to VRAM during H or V blank... but now I'm guessing it's a single port that software takes care to write only after a VBLANK interrupt... Anyway, I type so slowly I probably wouldn't notice! ;) Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From msmcdoug at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 14 23:56:31 2008 From: msmcdoug at iinet.net.au (Mark McDougall) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 13:56:31 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216080925.12717.24.camel@dev> References: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> <1216047771.6517.43.camel@dev> <487BCA79.1070408@iinet.net.au> <1216080925.12717.24.camel@dev> Message-ID: <487C1FEF.4040909@iinet.net.au> Chuck Youse wrote: > Strangely enough, few driver writers use the origin registers to scroll > the display. Even the PC/XT BIOS (and as a result, all following > generations of PC-compatible crap) ignores this obvious optimization. I shake my head in wonder then. I know the BBC Micro did a proper job of it (scrolling) though! Regards, -- | Mark McDougall | "Electrical Engineers do it | | with less resistance!" From lamune at doki-doki.net Tue Jul 15 01:29:30 2008 From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:29:30 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev><56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <4C8EB9FD6963BD4C8BA6B0B60FE8E4DD01D65D@fenestra.lamunet.local> I third that... I found the "error" in the schematic for the no-halt controller. It was sneaky too, but I found it. That Tony, whadda guy. :) > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco- > bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Gene Heskett > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 7:33 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade > > On Monday 14 July 2008, Dean Leiber wrote: > >On Jul 14, 2008, at 3:47 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > >> On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 17:25 -0400, Chuck Youse wrote: > >>> Barring that, does anyone have the boolean equations for U6 on the > >>> 1MB > >>> upgrade? :) The schematics are available, but not the PAL stuff .. > >> > >> Nevermind, found the PAL equations after all... > > > >Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are > >errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't > >exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very > >close look at them can comment. > > > >Dean > > I can second that. Tony didn't trust anybody. > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > "The Schizophrenic: An Unauthorized Autobiography" > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cdiman7 at flash.net Tue Jul 15 02:36:18 2008 From: cdiman7 at flash.net (KARL SEFCIK) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 23:36:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] New Texas IT Requirement In-Reply-To: <487BF5A4.4090602@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <571896.71940.qm@web80203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> John, I'll look again, but the media has gotten things wrong before, and just ran with it in the wrong direction. The bill is written in legaleze, and a lot is hard to read cause so much is crossed out, but what I saw was for alarm monitor and Securoity contractors not having a criminal background (they listed all the ways to have one too). But we wouldn't want the media to be the fool, like remember Hurricane Jeanne? The name was a variation of Jeannie, and should have been pronounced as such, but from the start, it was pronounced Jean. And I think we already had Gene that year too. And Lego blocks, are Leggo, but one G should make the E long, like Leego, but from the get go, the E is short. So who didn't do their research on these? The media, and I'll keep checking, but so far, I've only seen a reference to data used for alarm or security applications. Thnaks for the reply though. Karl --- John Donaldson wrote: > Karl, > It's there, otherwise so many articles about > would not have been > written about it. > Do a Google search of "Texas IT PI Law" and look at > how many articles > there are about this law. > > John Donaldson > > -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From flexser at fiu.edu Tue Jul 15 02:40:14 2008 From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 02:40:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: <1216044947.6517.32.camel@dev> Message-ID: I have some recollection of the differences between the 3 models. The Wordpak II differed from the original PBJ Wordpak (or am I remembering PBJ as the maker's initials on account of peanut butter and jelly?) in that its display memory could be upgraded, to allow swapping in different screens worth of display by switching the display origin. The Wordpak-RS was a version sold by RS (though only through the Express Order program, I believe), and had a different base address, presumably to avoid address conflicts with something or other. Art On Mon, 14 Jul 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: > Hi folks, > > It looks like tomorrow I'm going to be coming into possession of much > cool Coco gear, including a "Wordpak". Now, back in my 64K Coco 2 days > I drooled much over this mystical item described in Rainbow magazine, > and I'm very much looking forward to getting it going. > > Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? Google isn't too > helpful, I see references to a Wordpak, Wordpak II, and a Wordpak RS. > There is a NitrOS-9 driver for the Wordpak II that sheds some light. > (Looks like a 6845-based card.) But does anyone know what the > differences in the models are? Does it have a composite output? Any > info appreciated. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Tue Jul 15 08:11:04 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 08:11:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200807150811.04962.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Tuesday 15 July 2008, Arthur Flexser wrote: >I have some recollection of the differences between the 3 models. The > Wordpak II differed from the original PBJ Wordpak (or am I remembering PBJ > as the maker's initials on account of peanut butter and jelly?) in that its > display memory could be upgraded, to allow swapping in different screens > worth of display by switching the display origin. > >The Wordpak-RS was a version sold by RS (though only through the Express > Order program, I believe), and had a different base address, presumably to > avoid address conflicts with something or other. > >Art > Its been 15 years since I did it, but I have an RS model, and one of the first things I did to it was to fix the broken address decoding. On the coco, most peripherals need a 4 byte block of addresses and the RS is no different in that regard. But the stock decoding used the upper two bytes of one block, and the lower 2 bytes of the next one up, effectively using 8 bytes in the coco3's very precious I/O space. That was fairly easy to fix and the snooping for where to fix the driver for the address changes led to some other driver changes too. At that time, the os9 driver for it was co80, and it has an initialization table that is fed to the 6845 at bootup as the 6845 has 32 internal registers that control its operation. As the stock display used an 80x24 area on a 13" amber screen that was actually about the size of a postcard, with 2 to 3" of wasted space around it, I changed some of those values which had the effect of running the monitor at about 18.5 khz horizontal and around 75 or 80 hz vertically. The magnavox PC Monitor 80 is quite tolerant and it ran that way on my machine, with the 80x24 display nearly filling the 13" display for about 10 years. With only a 6116 for memory, the display was limited to 80x25 maximum. With additional memory it could have just as easily handled a 132x72 screen. Had there been larger cmos memories available at the time, I might have gone that way too. One other change I made was to give it a ttl output on a db9 connector, much more stable synch. >On Mon, 14 Jul 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >> Hi folks, >> >> It looks like tomorrow I'm going to be coming into possession of much >> cool Coco gear, including a "Wordpak". Now, back in my 64K Coco 2 days >> I drooled much over this mystical item described in Rainbow magazine, >> and I'm very much looking forward to getting it going. >> >> Question is, does anyone know ANYTHING about it? Google isn't too >> helpful, I see references to a Wordpak, Wordpak II, and a Wordpak RS. >> There is a NitrOS-9 driver for the Wordpak II that sheds some light. >> (Looks like a 6845-based card.) But does anyone know what the >> differences in the models are? Does it have a composite output? Any >> info appreciated. >> >> C. >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I'm sorry if the correct way of doing things offends you. From mark at cloud9tech.com Tue Jul 15 11:23:31 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 10:23:31 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Message-ID: <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> Same goes for his equations....... I asked him about this at one of the fests as I had a ton of corrections. Not one of his products as I recall was documented properly, especially the 1-2 meg boards. He just smiled........ A trained eye will catch the mistakes. The casual observer will not. Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Mon, 2008-07-14 at 22:32 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> >Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are >> >errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't >> >exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very >> >close look at them can comment. >> > >> >Dean >> >> I can second that. Tony didn't trust anybody. >> > > Niiiiiiice.... then why publish the schematics at all? Silly... > > Bad Tony! I will never read 'Turn of the Screw' with the same warm > fuzzies again. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From farna at att.net Tue Jul 15 11:33:41 2008 From: farna at att.net (Frank Swygert) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 11:33:41 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade Message-ID: <487CC355.3030104@att.net> Oh the "Turn of the Screw" columns/book are all 100% correct, it was just the commercial products that had errors in them. Not enough to prevent normal trouble shooting, just enough to prevent directly copying the design. An accomplished designer such as yourself should be able to spot the error since you fully understand circuit design. I couldn't, but then I wouldn't be doing more than basic trouble shooting, and the schematics he provided were good enough for that. Any good engineer could have reverse engineered his stuff easy enough, he just made sure it wasn't simple! --------------- Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:46:48 -0400 From: Chuck Youse Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade >> > >Be careful of schematics from Disto because sometimes there are >> > >errors in them;from what I recall hearing once, the errors weren't >> > >exactly an accident either. :-) Maybe someone who has taken a very >> > >close look at them can comment. >> > > >> > >Dean >> > > > > I can second that. Tony didn't trust anybody. > > > Niiiiiiice.... then why publish the schematics at all? Silly... Bad Tony! I will never read 'Turn of the Screw' with the same warm fuzzies again. -- Frank Swygert Publisher, "American Motors Cars" Magazine (AMC) For all AMC enthusiasts http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html (free download available!) From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 15 11:37:31 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 11:37:31 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1216136251.17658.2.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 10:23 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > Same goes for his equations....... > > I asked him about this at one of the fests as I had a ton of > corrections. Not one of his products as I recall was documented > properly, especially the 1-2 meg boards. > > He just smiled........ > > A trained eye will catch the mistakes. The casual observer will not. I didn't look very closely, but I did go a little cross-eyed when I saw the output from a NAND gate tied to an output from the PAL. Didn't make much sense. I wonder if that's part of it. Maybe I'm better off putting mental muscle into making my own upgrade board. Take advantage of newer parts (CPLD). Thanks for the warnings folks. C. From tjseagrove at writeme.com Tue Jul 15 18:20:22 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 18:20:22 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <013401c8e6c8$f97d8660$ec789320$@com> You should have seen his mailbox when they arrived there!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:03 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. WOW - too VERY cool!!! Mine is only approximately similar to that one, but the missing chip looks to be the 7408 - jeez, man, those pics are HUGE, one of those rare times when I'm grateful I have a fatpipe connection . Even more info than I thought I needed, ain't that the neatest?!? HUGE THANKS to Tom for these exquisite images, worthy of upload to the archive indeed, and massive thanx to you too Chuck for making certain I saw 'em!!! Love that floral background *VBG* =M0= >Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) > >http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ > >Enjoy >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1551 - Release Date: 7/14/2008 6:49 AM From tjseagrove at writeme.com Tue Jul 15 18:21:44 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 18:21:44 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <013501c8e6c9$29da81a0$7d8f84e0$@com> The floral background was due to the fact I was too lazy to pull out my "green screen" fabric and cover over the table cloth... -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:03 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. WOW - too VERY cool!!! Mine is only approximately similar to that one, but the missing chip looks to be the 7408 - jeez, man, those pics are HUGE, one of those rare times when I'm grateful I have a fatpipe connection . Even more info than I thought I needed, ain't that the neatest?!? HUGE THANKS to Tom for these exquisite images, worthy of upload to the archive indeed, and massive thanx to you too Chuck for making certain I saw 'em!!! Love that floral background *VBG* =M0= >Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) > >http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ > >Enjoy >C. > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1551 - Release Date: 7/14/2008 6:49 AM From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 15 23:01:57 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 23:01:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. In-Reply-To: <013401c8e6c8$f97d8660$ec789320$@com> References: <20080708164139.2629720A33@qs281.pair.com> <20080710154951.12E2820A33@qs281.pair.com> <002001c8e434$dedf2f20$9c9d8d60$@com> <20080712192250.7E53420A37@qs281.pair.com> <002f01c8e480$6d6d3700$4847a500$@com> <003101c8e482$9bf58760$d3e09620$@com> <1216045725.6517.34.camel@dev> <20080714144001.49B3120A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216046537.6517.36.camel@dev> <20080714185738.9A3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> <1216075322.12717.17.camel@dev> <20080715010259.2D3B520A33@qs281.pair.com> <013401c8e6c8$f97d8660$ec789320$@com> Message-ID: <1216177317.20909.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> Oh, wow. It just occurred to me that Tom sent them to me, and not the list! That certainly explains why no one else saw 'em :) Thanks again Tom! C. On Tue, 2008-07-15 at 18:20 -0400, Tom Seagrove wrote: > You should have seen his mailbox when they arrived there!!!!! > > -----Original Message----- > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On > Behalf Of Mike 0rtloff > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:03 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts > Subject: Re: [Coco] Slot Pack 3, MC-1, etc. > > WOW - too VERY cool!!! > > Mine is only approximately similar to that one, but the missing chip > looks to be the 7408 - jeez, man, those pics are HUGE, one of those > rare times when I'm grateful I have a fatpipe connection . > > Even more info than I thought I needed, ain't that the neatest?!? > > HUGE THANKS to Tom for these exquisite images, worthy of upload to > the archive indeed, and massive thanx to you too Chuck for making > certain I saw 'em!!! > > Love that floral background *VBG* > > =M0= > > > >Not a lot of explanation, just a lot of photos :) > > > >http://www.serialtechnologies.com/coco/sp3/ > > > >Enjoy > >C. > > > > > > > >-- > >Coco mailing list > >Coco at maltedmedia.com > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.10/1551 - Release Date: 7/14/2008 > 6:49 AM > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Wed Jul 16 01:18:57 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:18:57 -0500 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080716.001858.2208.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our last coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite Write programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk for OS-9 Profile OS-9 DeskMate and Basic O9. That will teach me to open the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. I would appreciate any information on where I can download or obtain these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF memory. Thanks for your help. John ____________________________________________________________ Summer Spa Sweepstakes Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ From brucewcalkins at charter.net Wed Jul 16 11:38:08 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:38:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD References: <20080716.001858.2208.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <88DD21CA1F22421A8E723589EC62EEF3@speedy> They may be somewhere on RTSI or MaltedMedia in DSK or Zipped DSK. Basic 09 should be on the second OS-9 Level Two disk. ~BWC~ > The bad news is I am missing the program disk for > OS-9 Profile > OS-9 DeskMate > and Basic O9. > > I would appreciate any information on where > I can download or obtain these program disk. > > Thanks for your help. > John From dml_68 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 11:58:50 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <20080716.001858.2208.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <254946.88252.qm@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not find OS-9 Profile though. If you can't find it let me know and I will pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can find it for you. http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen wrote: From: John T Chasteen Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD To: coco at maltedmedia.com Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our last coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite Write programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk for OS-9 Profile OS-9 DeskMate and Basic O9. That will teach me to open the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. I would appreciate any information on where I can download or obtain these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF memory. Thanks for your help. John ____________________________________________________________ Summer Spa Sweepstakes Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From adit at nationsdial.com Wed Jul 16 12:39:48 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 09:39:48 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: On Jul 15, 2008, at 8:23 AM, Mark Marlette wrote: > Same goes for his equations....... > > I asked him about this at one of the fests as I had a ton of > corrections. Not one of his products as I recall was documented > properly, especially the 1-2 meg boards. > > He just smiled........ > > A trained eye will catch the mistakes. The casual observer will not. > > Mark Guys, I don't suppose anybody still has a list of corrections or errors for the Disto schematics? If so, it would be great to include them as an addendum to the schematic package so people don't have to keep finding the errors. Dean From mark at cloud9tech.com Wed Jul 16 14:07:06 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 13:07:06 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: References: <1216070756.12717.16.camel@dev> <1216075672.12717.19.camel@dev> <56823DE2-0C1C-40DC-9481-1DA60CA03DC7@nationsdial.com> <200807142232.30076.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216090008.16480.0.camel@fanelia.blacksun.org> <20080715102331.ik4jiab40woss84o@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <20080716130706.jw23w5mr4sg8ssg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> Dean, I do still have them but I am so far behind right now at C-9 North I can't take on anymore projects/tasks. I'll write this as a note on my whiteboard as a to-do. Mark Cloud-9 Quoting Dean Leiber : > > On Jul 15, 2008, at 8:23 AM, Mark Marlette wrote: > >> Same goes for his equations....... >> >> I asked him about this at one of the fests as I had a ton of >> corrections. Not one of his products as I recall was documented >> properly, especially the 1-2 meg boards. >> >> He just smiled........ >> >> A trained eye will catch the mistakes. The casual observer will not. >> >> Mark > > Guys, > > I don't suppose anybody still has a list of corrections or errors for > the Disto schematics? If so, it would be great to include them as an > addendum to the schematic package so people don't have to keep finding > the errors. > > Dean > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jlhickle at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 14:30:44 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:30:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080716130706.jw23w5mr4sg8ssg0@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Write REAL small on that to-do list so you'll have room for "Parallel Port" ;) --- On Wed, 7/16/08, Mark Marlette wrote: > From: Mark Marlette > Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 2:07 PM > Dean, > > I do still have them but I am so far behind right now at > C-9 North I > can't take on anymore projects/tasks. > > I'll write this as a note on my whiteboard as a to-do. > > Mark > Cloud-9 > > Quoting Dean Leiber : > > > > > On Jul 15, 2008, at 8:23 AM, Mark Marlette wrote: > > > >> Same goes for his equations....... > >> > >> I asked him about this at one of the fests as I > had a ton of > >> corrections. Not one of his products as I recall > was documented > >> properly, especially the 1-2 meg boards. > >> > >> He just smiled........ > >> > >> A trained eye will catch the mistakes. The casual > observer will not. > >> > >> Mark > > > > Guys, > > > > I don't suppose anybody still has a list of > corrections or errors for > > the Disto schematics? If so, it would be great to > include them as an > > addendum to the schematic package so people don't > have to keep finding > > the errors. > > > > Dean > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 16 14:38:15 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:38:15 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 11:30 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: > Write REAL small on that to-do list so you'll have room for > "Parallel Port" ;) > Interesting. A TL16C552 is a dual 16550 + parallel port in one chip. Pretty simple hardware project, actually, and something I was planning on sometime soon .. C. From mark at cloud9tech.com Wed Jul 16 15:00:30 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:00:30 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> That is what is on the Superboard. Mark Quoting Chuck Youse : > On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 11:30 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: >> Write REAL small on that to-do list so you'll have room for >> "Parallel Port" ;) >> > > Interesting. A TL16C552 is a dual 16550 + parallel port in one chip. > Pretty simple hardware project, actually, and something I was planning > on sometime soon .. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 16 15:09:52 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:09:52 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <1216235392.9093.2.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 14:00 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > That is what is on the Superboard. > > Mark Ah. There's no description on cloud9tech.com about the SuperBoard other than 'coming soon,' so I have no idea what's on it. C. From fwp at deepthought.com Wed Jul 16 16:25:58 2008 From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:25:58 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <20080716202558.GD10850@warlock.deepthought.com> You speak of the Superboard in the present tense. Is there any information we can gleen from that?? :-) Frank On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 02:00:30PM -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > > That is what is on the Superboard. > > Mark > > Quoting Chuck Youse : > >> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 11:30 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: >>> Write REAL small on that to-do list so you'll have room for >>> "Parallel Port" ;) >>> >> >> Interesting. A TL16C552 is a dual 16550 + parallel port in one chip. >> Pretty simple hardware project, actually, and something I was planning >> on sometime soon .. >> >> C. >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From jlhickle at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 15:45:58 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 12:45:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <130015.20687.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 7/16/08, Chuck Youse wrote: > From: Chuck Youse > > Interesting. A TL16C552 is a dual 16550 + parallel port in > one chip. > Pretty simple hardware project, actually, and something I > was planning > on sometime soon .. > I attempted to design my own but the heat from the tubes was melting the Coco's case ;) From jlhickle at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 15:47:23 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 12:47:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216235392.9093.2.camel@dev> Message-ID: <911183.65820.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 7/16/08, Chuck Youse wrote: > From: Chuck Youse > Subject: Re: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" > Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 3:09 PM > On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 14:00 -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: > > That is what is on the Superboard. > > > > Mark > > Ah. There's no description on cloud9tech.com about the > SuperBoard other > than 'coming soon,' so I have no idea what's on > it. > > If Mark released the SuperBoard before it is ready, then Cloud-9 would be another MicroSoft. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 16 15:57:18 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:57:18 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <911183.65820.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <911183.65820.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1216238238.9093.4.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 12:47 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: > > If Mark released the SuperBoard before it is ready, then Cloud-9 would be another MicroSoft. > > Wasn't referring to the timing, just the fact that I don't have any details. c. From jps.subscriptions at gmail.com Wed Jul 16 16:01:30 2008 From: jps.subscriptions at gmail.com (J.P. Samson) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:01:30 -0600 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <1216238238.9093.4.camel@dev> References: <911183.65820.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216238238.9093.4.camel@dev> Message-ID: On Jul 16, 2008, at 1:57 PM, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 12:47 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: >> If Mark released the SuperBoard before it is ready, then Cloud-9 >> would be another MicroSoft. > Wasn't referring to the timing, just the fact that I don't have any > details. http://www.frontiernet.net/~mmarlette/Cloud-9/ComingSoon/index.html Not sure what level of detail you are looking for, Chuck. The above page seems to give a pretty good list of features. Basically, the SuperBoard and its add-ons will encompass most of the products Cloud-9 currently produces, plus serial and parallel ports, networking, more RAM, more ROM's, etc. -- JP From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Wed Jul 16 16:08:45 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 16:08:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: References: <911183.65820.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216238238.9093.4.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1216238925.9093.6.camel@dev> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 14:01 -0600, J.P. Samson wrote: > > Not sure what level of detail you are looking for, Chuck. The above > page seems to give a pretty good list of features. Basically, the > SuperBoard and its add-ons will encompass most of the products Cloud-9 > currently produces, plus serial and parallel ports, networking, more > RAM, more ROM's, etc. Ah, didn't click on the "Coming Soon" tab. C. From skwirl42 at gmail.com Wed Jul 16 16:58:17 2008 From: skwirl42 at gmail.com (James Dessart) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 17:58:17 -0300 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080716202558.GD10850@warlock.deepthought.com> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> <20080716202558.GD10850@warlock.deepthought.com> Message-ID: <4c56cbd30807161358m172d5e6bxc5226a96251c0789@mail.gmail.com> On 7/16/08, Frank Pittel wrote: > You speak of the Superboard in the present tense. Is there any > information we can gleen from that?? :-) As far as I know, it still needs to be properly tested, and all the bugs ironed out. But the feature set has been locked in for a while. -- James Dessart From mark at cloud9tech.com Wed Jul 16 17:58:47 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 16:58:47 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disto 1MB or 2MB upgrade In-Reply-To: <20080716202558.GD10850@warlock.deepthought.com> References: <798959.71648.qm@web36607.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216233495.9093.0.camel@dev> <20080716140030.q17htayes8gcwcwg@webmail.frontiernet.net> <20080716202558.GD10850@warlock.deepthought.com> Message-ID: <20080716165847.9hoshtuo00wo4ow8@webmail.frontiernet.net> Frank, That means yes we are working on it when we can. My real job and summer duties are through the roof. Business is good at C-9 which makes free time almost not available other than to get orders out. M Quoting Frank Pittel : > > You speak of the Superboard in the present tense. Is there any > information we can gleen from that?? :-) > > Frank > > > On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 02:00:30PM -0500, Mark Marlette wrote: >> >> That is what is on the Superboard. >> >> Mark >> >> Quoting Chuck Youse : >> >>> On Wed, 2008-07-16 at 11:30 -0700, Jim Hickle wrote: >>>> Write REAL small on that to-do list so you'll have room for >>>> "Parallel Port" ;) >>>> >>> >>> Interesting. A TL16C552 is a dual 16550 + parallel port in one chip. >>> Pretty simple hardware project, actually, and something I was planning >>> on sometime soon .. >>> >>> C. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >>> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Thu Jul 17 01:32:05 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 00:32:05 -0500 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080717.003205.5516.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my DeskTop as a folder with 3 files. The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I do have LiveWire which I have never used. I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps called DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so I can install on the coco3. I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 file. I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now with the HELP. Thanks for your help... so far so good John On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not find > Derek pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can find > it for you. > > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen > wrote: > From: John T Chasteen > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM > > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our > last > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite > Write > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk > for > OS-9 Profile > OS-9 DeskMate > and Basic O9. > That will teach me to open > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. > > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or > obtain > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF > memory. > > Thanks for your help. > John > > ____________________________________________________________ > Summer Spa Sweepstakes > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From underserf at comcast.net Thu Jul 17 11:39:28 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 08:39:28 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 Message-ID: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> [my bad, I thought we were s'posed to post images, sorry] Has anyone used color composite monitors such as the Magnavox Color Monitor 40 with a CoCo3? With the composite input, I figure it ought to be no worse than my Sanyo studio monitor TV, maybe better. I got a potentially righteous deal on one. Any thoughts? Worst case, it looks to be a decent display for an NES ;) Ah, a question comes to mind. Back about '91, I built a little two-transistor circuit to pick off , amplify & buffer the composite signal going into the CoCo2 onboard modulator. I think the circuit was in a Rainbow issue, not sure which. Anybody recall which issue it was in (mebbe the Seattle Public Library has it 'fiched) or perhaps have the schematic as a GIF somewheres? TIA! =M0= From dml_68 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 17 12:16:00 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 09:16:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <20080717.003205.5516.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <929195.11232.qm@web30206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Do you have a 5.25" drive on your main system (not the coco)? ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Wed, 7/16/08, John T Chasteen wrote: From: John T Chasteen Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD To: coco at maltedmedia.com Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 10:32 PM Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my DeskTop as a folder with 3 files. The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I do have LiveWire which I have never used. I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps called DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so I can install on the coco3. I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 file. I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now with the HELP. Thanks for your help... so far so good John On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not find > Derek pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can find > it for you. > > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen > wrote: > From: John T Chasteen > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM > > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our > last > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite > Write > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk > for > OS-9 Profile > OS-9 DeskMate > and Basic O9. > That will teach me to open > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. > > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or > obtain > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF > memory. > > Thanks for your help. > John > > ____________________________________________________________ > Summer Spa Sweepstakes > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Thu Jul 17 12:32:51 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 11:32:51 -0500 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080717.113251.4628.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Derek I don't have any type of drive on my notebook. I can send an e-mail to my Desktop computer. There I have a 3.5 in drive. Then on my old Pentium, which is not on the Internet, does have a 3.5 and a 5.25 inch drives available Thanks John On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 09:16:00 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: > Do you have a 5.25" drive on your main system (not the coco)? > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > --- On Wed, 7/16/08, John T Chasteen > wrote: > From: John T Chasteen > Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 10:32 PM > > Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my > DeskTop as > a folder with 3 files. > > The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I do > have > LiveWire which I have never used. > > I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps called > DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . > > My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so I > can > install on the coco3. > > I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 file. > > I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now with > the > HELP. > > Thanks for your help... so far so good > > John > > > On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek > writes: > > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not > find > > > Derek OS-9 Profile though. If you can't find it let me know and I will > > pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can > find > > it for you. > > > > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip > > > > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > > > > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen > > wrote: > > From: John T Chasteen > > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM > > > > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. > > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our > > > last > > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite > > Write > > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk > > > for > > OS-9 Profile > > OS-9 DeskMate > > and Basic O9. > > That will teach me to open > > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. > > > > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or > > obtain > > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and > > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF > > memory. > > > > Thanks for your help. > > John > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Summer Spa Sweepstakes > > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! > > > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 > glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > ____________________________________________________________ Save on a Fashion Design Education. Click Now! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oIaxyQKTpfgjtXSutVeG2DLY1pky63m3jFkkOtBjH3TopzT/ From mdelyea at gmail.com Thu Jul 17 12:41:17 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:41:17 -0400 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <20080717.113251.4628.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080717.113251.4628.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807170941s5a478371xac941622dd8d6e26@mail.gmail.com> Do you have an emulator on the 486? If you format an OS9 disk on your coco then stick it in your 486, I think you can write to it with Jeff Vavasour's emulator. On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 12:32 PM, John T Chasteen wrote: > Derek > I don't have any type of drive on my notebook. > I can send an e-mail to my Desktop computer. There I > have a 3.5 in drive. Then on my old Pentium, which is not on the > Internet, > does have a 3.5 and a 5.25 inch drives available > > Thanks > > John > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 09:16:00 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: >> Do you have a 5.25" drive on your main system (not the coco)? >> >> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> >> --- On Wed, 7/16/08, John T Chasteen >> wrote: >> From: John T Chasteen >> Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD >> To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 10:32 PM >> >> Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my >> DeskTop as >> a folder with 3 files. >> >> The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I do >> have >> LiveWire which I have never used. >> >> I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps called >> DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . >> >> My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so I >> can >> install on the coco3. >> >> I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 file. >> >> I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now with >> the >> HELP. >> >> Thanks for your help... so far so good >> >> John >> >> >> On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek >> writes: >> > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not >> find >> > >> Derek > OS-9 Profile though. If you can't find it let me know and I will >> > pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can >> find >> > it for you. >> > >> > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip >> > >> > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> > >> > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen >> > wrote: >> > From: John T Chasteen >> > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD >> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM >> > >> > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. >> > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our >> >> > last >> > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite >> > Write >> > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk >> >> > for >> > OS-9 Profile >> > OS-9 DeskMate >> > and Basic O9. >> > That will teach me to open >> > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. >> > >> > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or >> > obtain >> > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and >> > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF >> > memory. >> > >> > Thanks for your help. >> > John >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > Summer Spa Sweepstakes >> > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! >> > >> > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 >> glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> > >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > Save on a Fashion Design Education. Click Now! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oIaxyQKTpfgjtXSutVeG2DLY1pky63m3jFkkOtBjH3TopzT/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From ktailor01 at lineone.net Thu Jul 17 12:54:09 2008 From: ktailor01 at lineone.net (Kish Tailor) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:54:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 References: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <5B5913FB58FA49039B94A95BA6D3A19E@admin8fb12a457> I have a Goldstar RGBi monitor if anyone wants to send me a offer for it. It's still brand new in a box. Paypal only please. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike 0rtloff" To: Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 11:39 AM Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 > [my bad, I thought we were s'posed to post images, sorry] > > Has anyone used color composite monitors such as the Magnavox Color > Monitor 40 with a CoCo3? With the composite input, I figure it ought to > be no worse than my Sanyo studio monitor TV, maybe better. I got a > potentially righteous deal on one. > > Any thoughts? > > Worst case, it looks to be a decent display for an NES ;) > > Ah, a question comes to mind. Back about '91, I built a little > two-transistor circuit to pick off , amplify & buffer the composite signal > going into the CoCo2 onboard modulator. I think the circuit was in a > Rainbow issue, not sure which. > > Anybody recall which issue it was in (mebbe the Seattle Public Library has > it 'fiched) or perhaps have the schematic as a GIF somewheres? > > TIA! > > =M0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: > 270.5.0/1558 - Release Date: 7/17/2008 9:56 AM > > > From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Thu Jul 17 12:58:33 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 11:58:33 -0500 Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD Message-ID: <20080717.115833.4628.1.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Derek I will be happy to send you a check to cover shipping (postage)and gas and diskette expense If you would be able to mail to me John Chasteen 950 Chelsea Lane Schaumburg, IL 60193 If you will be able to do that, send me your mailing address and the expense amount. John On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 12:41:17 -0400 "mike delyea" writes: > Do you have an emulator on the 486? If you format an OS9 disk on > your > coco then stick it in your 486, I think you can write to it with > Jeff > Vavasour's emulator. > > On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 12:32 PM, John T Chasteen > wrote: > > Derek > > I don't have any type of drive on my notebook. > > I can send an e-mail to my Desktop computer. There I > > have a 3.5 in drive. Then on my old Pentium, which is not on the > > Internet, > > does have a 3.5 and a 5.25 inch drives available > > > > Thanks > > > > John > > > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 09:16:00 -0700 (PDT) Derek > writes: > >> Do you have a 5.25" drive on your main system (not the coco)? > >> > >> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > >> > >> --- On Wed, 7/16/08, John T Chasteen > >> wrote: > >> From: John T Chasteen > >> Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > >> To: coco at maltedmedia.com > >> Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 10:32 PM > >> > >> Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my > >> DeskTop as > >> a folder with 3 files. > >> > >> The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I > do > >> have > >> LiveWire which I have never used. > >> > >> I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps > called > >> DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . > >> > >> My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so > I > >> can > >> install on the coco3. > >> > >> I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 > file. > >> > >> I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now > with > >> the > >> HELP. > >> > >> Thanks for your help... so far so good > >> > >> John > >> > >> > >> On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek > > >> writes: > >> > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not > >> find > >> > > >> Derek >> OS-9 Profile though. If you can't find it let me know and I > will > >> > pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I > can > >> find > >> > it for you. > >> > > >> > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip > >> > > >> > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** > >> > > >> > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen > >> > wrote: > >> > From: John T Chasteen > >> > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD > >> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > >> > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM > >> > > >> > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. > >> > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at > our > >> > >> > last > >> > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and > Elite > >> > Write > >> > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program > disk > >> > >> > for > >> > OS-9 Profile > >> > OS-9 DeskMate > >> > and Basic O9. > >> > That will teach me to open > >> > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program > disk. > >> > > >> > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or > >> > obtain > >> > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and > >> > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the > CF > >> > memory. > >> > > >> > Thanks for your help. > >> > John > >> > > >> > ____________________________________________________________ > >> > Summer Spa Sweepstakes > >> > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! > >> > > >> > > > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 > >> glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Coco mailing list > >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Coco mailing list > >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Coco mailing list > >> Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Coco mailing list > >> Coco at maltedmedia.com > >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > >> > >> > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Save on a Fashion Design Education. Click Now! > > > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oIaxyQKTpfgjtXSutVeG2D LY1pky63m3jFkkOtBjH3TopzT/ > > > > -- > > Coco mailing list > > Coco at maltedmedia.com > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From dml_68 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 17 16:51:48 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 13:51:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807170941s5a478371xac941622dd8d6e26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <779244.98916.qm@web30204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If you use Drivewire from Cloud-9 (you said Livewire but perhpas you meant Drivewire?) on the coco end it should assign the Disk image on your PC a Drive number and your real coco disk drive a drive number then you should be able to use the RSDOS Backup command so if your Laptop has the disk image assigned as Drive 1 and your CoCo has the real 5.25" Drive assigned as Drive 0 you would type Backup 1 to 0 and that would write the disk image file to your real coco drive. If you use OS-9 on the CoCo then it would be the same just use the disk copy command in os-9 with the assigned drive letters. The other option is to use the Darren's COCO Disk Image tool here: http://www.coco3.com/users/DarrenA/?M=A This requires a Windows System with a floppy drive. It will write a disk image to a real floppy disk useable on your coco. I have a 3.5" drive in my coco and I use it allthe time. I will also work with a 5.25" drive as well. ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Thu, 7/17/08, mike delyea wrote: From: mike delyea Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Date: Thursday, July 17, 2008, 9:41 AM Do you have an emulator on the 486? If you format an OS9 disk on your coco then stick it in your 486, I think you can write to it with Jeff Vavasour's emulator. On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 12:32 PM, John T Chasteen wrote: > Derek > I don't have any type of drive on my notebook. > I can send an e-mail to my Desktop computer. There I > have a 3.5 in drive. Then on my old Pentium, which is not on the > Internet, > does have a 3.5 and a 5.25 inch drives available > > Thanks > > John > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 09:16:00 -0700 (PDT) Derek writes: >> Do you have a 5.25" drive on your main system (not the coco)? >> >> ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> >> --- On Wed, 7/16/08, John T Chasteen >> wrote: >> From: John T Chasteen >> Subject: Re: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD >> To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 10:32 PM >> >> Thanks Derek for the DeskMate3 Ziped file which I have on my >> DeskTop as >> a folder with 3 files. >> >> The next big problem is getting to a coco 5.25 inch diskette. I do >> have >> LiveWire which I have never used. >> >> I looked on rtsi.com and found a file in the /os9_6x09/apps called >> DeskMate3_Patch.lzh . >> >> My next big problem is getting these files on a 5.25 in floppy so I >> can >> install on the coco3. >> >> I hav Radio Shack OS9L2 disks so I think I can find BASIC)9 file. >> >> I need plenty more help to get to the next srep. Don't stop now with >> the >> HELP. >> >> Thanks for your help... so far so good >> >> John >> >> >> On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 08:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Derek >> writes: >> > Here is Deskmate 2 Disk Set and OS-9 Basic L1 Disk. I could not >> find >> > >> Derek > OS-9 Profile though. If you can't find it let me know and I will >> > pull out my DVD Archives and sort through those to see if I can >> find >> > it for you. >> > >> > http://rapidshare.com/files/130151252/os9_1.zip >> > >> > ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** >> > >> > --- On Tue, 7/15/08, John T Chasteen >> > wrote: >> > From: John T Chasteen >> > Subject: [Coco] : coco 3 with SUPERBOARD >> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com >> > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 2008, 10:18 PM >> > >> > I am trying to set up a coco3 with several applications. >> > I brought about 7 programs I wanted to get help installing. at our >> >> > last >> > coco meeting. So far I have DYNACALC OS-9 spreadsheet and Elite >> > Write >> > programs installed. The bad news is I am missing the program disk >> >> > for >> > OS-9 Profile >> > OS-9 DeskMate >> > and Basic O9. >> > That will teach me to open >> > the boxes the documentation comes in and check for program disk. >> > >> > I would appreciate any information on where I can download or >> > obtain >> > these program disk. I still have plenty programs Tapes and >> > color computer disk that came with the Magazines to load the CF >> > memory. >> > >> > Thanks for your help. >> > John >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > Summer Spa Sweepstakes >> > Enter for your chance to WIN a Summer Spa Vacation! >> > >> > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/JKFkuJi7Ubfdpqr95VCoD3EKtl3d5 >> glCRuJ5ENIcYsd7JruPsndGnP/ >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Coco mailing list >> > Coco at maltedmedia.com >> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > >> > >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > Save on a Fashion Design Education. Click Now! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oIaxyQKTpfgjtXSutVeG2DLY1pky63m3jFkkOtBjH3TopzT/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From tonym at compusource.net Sat Jul 19 00:33:04 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (Tony Mori) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 00:33:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Looking for a Disto SC2 References: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <004c01c8e958$895b8750$9864a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com> As the subject says....need a Disto SC2 for my collection... Anyone got one available for trade/sale? I have various hardware, like: CoCo3 with the Tandy 512KB upgrade inside PBJ WordPak Floppy drives (RS FD-502 drive+cable, no FDC though - well, not an FD-502) Various 26-3022(is that correct?) +12V-required longer/older FDC's Other stuff, like joysticks, CoCoMax interface, HiRez mouse/joystick interface, HMS/JM FDC's, etc... Stack of programs from the early 'fests... I *MIGHT* be convinced to trade a Disto MPROM+Manual for an SC2 (I have no S/W though...) Let me know what it would take... Tony From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 19 07:48:09 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 04:48:09 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 In-Reply-To: <5B5913FB58FA49039B94A95BA6D3A19E@admin8fb12a457> References: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> <5B5913FB58FA49039B94A95BA6D3A19E@admin8fb12a457> Message-ID: <20080719114802.74AB120A33@qs281.pair.com> Hmm, things =have= changed since I last accessed the list from FIDO... spam wasn't allowed Back Then ;) My questions weren't addressed by this post. Is the Goldstar monitor composite input? Is the max resolution higher, the same or less than a Magnavox Color Monitor 40? Is the audio built-in, does it support CoCo resolutions better than a Magnavox Color Monitor 40? Is it made more recently than 1985 (when the Color Monitor 40 was popular) All we =do= learn is you =require= PayPal. :^/ Mine was a local deal, the shipping alone made buying it (or any other CRT) online prohibitively expensive for a typical "as-is" online used item purchase. I went ahead & bought it because the seller offered me a money-back guarantee if it didn't meet my needs. Which it does indeed. Though 80-column text is a barely legible, 40 column & 640 x 192 graphics look fine on it. Kinda neat having the built-in audio too, one less wall-wart on my squid. It will do nicely until Mr Justus starts shipping his adapters again, at which point this monitor becomes an excellent general-purpose color composite monitor (for my kids' Nintendo stable for example) Thanx anyway listers, I originally posted in the hopes one of us was old enuff to recall (but young enuff not to have forgotten ;) just =which= monitors sold in '87 worked well with the CoCo3. Still cool to be able to learn new stuff even now :) Peace! =M0= >I have a Goldstar RGBi monitor if anyone wants to send me a offer >for it. It's still brand new in a box. > >Paypal only please. >----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike 0rtloff" >To: >Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 11:39 AM >Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 > > >>[my bad, I thought we were s'posed to post images, sorry] >> >>Has anyone used color composite monitors such as the Magnavox Color >>Monitor 40 with a CoCo3? With the composite input, I figure it >>ought to be no worse than my Sanyo studio monitor TV, maybe better. >>I got a potentially righteous deal on one. >> >>Any thoughts? >> >>Worst case, it looks to be a decent display for an NES ;) >> >>Ah, a question comes to mind. Back about '91, I built a little >>two-transistor circuit to pick off , amplify & buffer the composite >>signal going into the CoCo2 onboard modulator. I think the circuit >>was in a Rainbow issue, not sure which. >> >>Anybody recall which issue it was in (mebbe the Seattle Public >>Library has it 'fiched) or perhaps have the schematic as a GIF somewheres? >> >>TIA! >> >>=M0= >> >> >>-- >>Coco mailing list >>Coco at maltedmedia.com >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >>No virus found in this incoming message. >>Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus >>Database: 270.5.0/1558 - Release Date: 7/17/2008 9:56 AM >> >> > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Sat Jul 19 10:05:48 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 09:05:48 -0500 Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related Message-ID: <20080719.090548.2588.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Hello coco friends My Xp desk top computer failed and I want to test the hard drive? I can boot DOS 6.2 but for some reason it won't install because the way the c: drive is formatted. This is an older computer and has an IDE drive and also a 3.5 floppy. I have fdisk and several dos commands available. How can I test the harddrive? John PS: you can answer me off LIST ____________________________________________________________ Need cash? Click to get a cash advance. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3mKes9PtTd7E13u6NEMWoIaL19AJNGab8PyvrGWcROQ2r8el/ From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 10:44:38 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 07:44:38 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 In-Reply-To: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <93f331ac0807190744m1792af1ft73d3b0b707cdb203@mail.gmail.com> Did you check the links on the other list? Neil On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 8:39 AM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > Ah, a question comes to mind. Back about '91, I built a little > two-transistor circuit to pick off , amplify & buffer the composite signal > going into the CoCo2 onboard modulator. I think the circuit was in a Rainbow > issue, not sure which. > > Anybody recall which issue it was in (mebbe the Seattle Public Library has > it 'fiched) or perhaps have the schematic as a GIF somewheres? From dml_68 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 19 10:54:29 2008 From: dml_68 at yahoo.com (Derek) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 07:54:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related In-Reply-To: <20080719.090548.2588.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <307822.41367.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> On your DOS disk there should be a file called chkdsk. Boot to a: and type chkdsk c: You can also use chkdsk c:/auto to try and fix data corruption errors and I believe chkdsk c: /surface will do a scan for physical errors on the hard drive and then display them for you. If you run this and it says that it can not find C: then from your MS-DOS disk you can type sys c:. This will re-write the MS-DOS boot file on the hard drive and can give you access to your drive via DOS at least so you can back up data before doing an XP re-install. If it still will not see the drive then you are most likely looking at a having to delete and recreate the partition using Fdisk and then re-formating the drive. ** Mistrust Authority. Promote Decentralization ** --- On Sat, 7/19/08, John T Chasteen wrote: From: John T Chasteen Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related To: coco at maltedmedia.com Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 7:05 AM Hello coco friends My Xp desk top computer failed and I want to test the hard drive? I can boot DOS 6.2 but for some reason it won't install because the way the c: drive is formatted. This is an older computer and has an IDE drive and also a 3.5 floppy. I have fdisk and several dos commands available. How can I test the harddrive? John PS: you can answer me off LIST ____________________________________________________________ Need cash? Click to get a cash advance. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3mKes9PtTd7E13u6NEMWoIaL19AJNGab8PyvrGWcROQ2r8el/ -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 19 11:10:50 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 11:10:50 -0400 Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related In-Reply-To: <307822.41367.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <307822.41367.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1216480250.18474.10.camel@dev> On Sat, 2008-07-19 at 07:54 -0700, Derek wrote: > On your DOS disk there should be a file called chkdsk. Boot to a: and type chkdsk c: > > > > You can also use chkdsk c:/auto to try and fix data corruption errors > and I believe chkdsk c: /surface will do a scan for physical errors on the hard drive and > then display them for you. > > If you run this and it says that it can not find C: then from your MS-DOS disk you can type sys c:. This will re-write the MS-DOS boot file on the hard drive and can give you access to your drive via DOS at least so you can back up data before doing an XP re-install. If it still will not see the drive then you are most likely looking at a having to delete and recreate the partition using Fdisk and then re-formating the drive. > > The reason he can't access his hard drive is because DOS won't assign a logical drive (e.g. 'C:') to partitions that aren't FAT16. FAT32 and NTFS (the filesystems used by Windows XP) have different partition types. Therefore DOS ignores them, and there IS no drive C:. Therefore neither 'chkdsk' nor 'sys' will work. At best, you can repartition the drive, format it, and run a surface scan on the partition. Or get a third-party tool/write a tool that either uses BIOS vector 13H or direct access to the IDE registers to perform the needed diagnostics. C. From mdelyea at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 11:25:06 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 11:25:06 -0400 Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related In-Reply-To: <1216480250.18474.10.camel@dev> References: <307822.41367.qm@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1216480250.18474.10.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807190825p7513deebpee00dbed5aae5df9@mail.gmail.com> Sorry, (xp topic on the coco list - sheesh), you need to boot the XP installation CD and select repair with the recovery console at the welcome to setup screen. Then run chkdsk /r after selecting the windows installation to logon to (usually 1). On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sat, 2008-07-19 at 07:54 -0700, Derek wrote: >> On your DOS disk there should be a file called chkdsk. Boot to a: and type chkdsk c: >> >> >> >> You can also use chkdsk c:/auto to try and fix data corruption errors >> and I believe chkdsk c: /surface will do a scan for physical errors on the hard drive and >> then display them for you. >> >> If you run this and it says that it can not find C: then from your MS-DOS disk you can type sys c:. This will re-write the MS-DOS boot file on the hard drive and can give you access to your drive via DOS at least so you can back up data before doing an XP re-install. If it still will not see the drive then you are most likely looking at a having to delete and recreate the partition using Fdisk and then re-formating the drive. >> >> > > The reason he can't access his hard drive is because DOS won't assign a > logical drive (e.g. 'C:') to partitions that aren't FAT16. FAT32 and > NTFS (the filesystems used by Windows XP) have different partition > types. Therefore DOS ignores them, and there IS no drive C:. > > Therefore neither 'chkdsk' nor 'sys' will work. At best, you can > repartition the drive, format it, and run a surface scan on the > partition. Or get a third-party tool/write a tool that either uses BIOS > vector 13H or direct access to the IDE registers to perform the needed > diagnostics. > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com Sat Jul 19 11:26:05 2008 From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 11:26:05 -0400 Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related In-Reply-To: <20080719.090548.2588.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> References: <20080719.090548.2588.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <0r148491ifpludolh6jed7s9nnidbdgp32@4ax.com> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 09:05:48 -0500, John T Chasteen had a flock of green cheek conures squawk out: >Hello coco friends > >My Xp desk top computer failed and I want to test the hard drive? >I can boot DOS 6.2 but for some reason it won't install because the way >the c: drive is formatted. >This is an older computer and has an IDE drive and also a 3.5 floppy. > >I have fdisk and several dos commands available. > >How can I test the harddrive? Go to the hard drive manufacturer's web site and get their test program. Stephen -- From jlhickle at yahoo.com Sat Jul 19 12:02:56 2008 From: jlhickle at yahoo.com (Jim Hickle) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 09:02:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related In-Reply-To: <20080719.090548.2588.2.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Message-ID: <732904.33031.qm@web36601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Try: http://www.bootdisk.com/bootdisk.htm Scroll down to: XP Quick Boot Diskette , there will be 3 links on the line. Click on Read.1st for instructions. I think the same page has programs/drivers for DOS that let you read & write to NTFS disks. --- On Sat, 7/19/08, John T Chasteen wrote: > From: John T Chasteen > Subject: [Coco] PC Xp related > To: coco at maltedmedia.com > Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 10:05 AM > Hello coco friends > > My Xp desk top computer failed and I want to test the hard > drive? > I can boot DOS 6.2 but for some reason it won't install > because the way > the c: drive is formatted. > This is an older computer and has an IDE drive and also a > 3.5 floppy. > > I have fdisk and several dos commands available. > > How can I test the harddrive? > > John > > PS: you can answer me off LIST > ____________________________________________________________ > Need cash? Click to get a cash advance. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3mKes9PtTd7E13u6NEMWoIaL19AJNGab8PyvrGWcROQ2r8el/ > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 19 13:10:07 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 13:10:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] IP stack for NitrOS9 Message-ID: <1216487407.18474.23.camel@dev> Good morning folks, Next project on my list is an Ethernet card for the Coco; hardware-wise, this will be pretty straightforward. The software is by far the more complex part of the problem, and I've got two approaches. I wonder if anyone has got any comments. There are three approaches to take; one is to simply provide the hardware and leave the rest to user-space processing, a la uIP or something. Personally, while I think this is a good approach on a memory/cycle-hungry microcontroller, this is a cop-out under OS-9. So I'm left with kernel solutions. Two main approaches: 1. Implement as an SCF/SBF file manager to attempt to maintain the unified I/O system of OS-9; 2. Create kernel extensions to implement a separate set of system calls for network I/O. I'm leaning towards #2. Essentially this will take the form of a module that's a 'peer' (rather than a client) of IOMan ("NetMan", maybe?) that implements extra system calls to manipulate sockets. There will also be a new kind of OS-9 system module for a 'network device'. The network devices can take the form of serial drivers that implement [C]SLIP/PPP, or Ethernet. (Don't expect NetMAn to handle ARP; ezch Ethernet device will do this itself. The redundancy doesn't bother me since an OS-9 box isn't likely to have more than one interface anyway..) This means that read/write to network connections will differ from read/write to files. In practice, this doesn't affect much; especially the lack of a sort of 'select' system call under OS-9 means the lack of unification isn't really a consideration. (May be able to implement some sort of async socket I/O with signals.) Along with the network-stack proper, we should implement a pseudo-tty SCF driver/devices, so that when the stack is ready, things like 'telnet' can be implemented in a straightforward manner. It's not part of the network stack, but it most useful for network-related things. Thoughts? C. From adit at nationsdial.com Sat Jul 19 22:14:07 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 19:14:07 -0700 Subject: [Coco] IP stack for NitrOS9 In-Reply-To: <1216487407.18474.23.camel@dev> References: <1216487407.18474.23.camel@dev> Message-ID: On Jul 19, 2008, at 10:10 AM, Chuck Youse wrote: > > > So I'm left with kernel solutions. Two main approaches: > > 1. Implement as an SCF/SBF file manager to attempt to maintain the > unified I/O system of OS-9; > 2. Create kernel extensions to implement a separate set of system > calls > for network I/O. > > Perhaps it would help if you took a look at the approach Microware took. I have an old Microware catalog and it gives a brief description about a Network Fille Manager (NFM) and an Internet Support Package (ISP). I haven't looked at the latest catalogs so maybe a look at the Radisys site would be in order. If you can't find anything there, I can scan the old catalog pages if you like. Dean From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sat Jul 19 22:18:55 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 22:18:55 -0400 Subject: [Coco] IP stack for NitrOS9 In-Reply-To: References: <1216487407.18474.23.camel@dev> Message-ID: <1216520335.6121.1.camel@dev> On Sat, 2008-07-19 at 19:14 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote: > Perhaps it would help if you took a look at the approach Microware > took. I have an old Microware catalog and it gives a brief > description about a Network Fille Manager (NFM) and an Internet > Support Package (ISP). I haven't looked at the latest catalogs so > maybe a look at the Radisys site would be in order. If you can't find > anything there, I can scan the old catalog pages if you like. It occurred to me that following OSK's footsteps might be the best path, but it seems that such information is very difficult to get hold of. I personally have never used an OSK system .. but maybe I can do some digging. Appreciate the offer to scan the catalog pages - I hope it doesn't come to that, but I'll let you know! THanks c. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Jul 20 04:15:09 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 08:15:09 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <486D2102.10502@gmail.com> Message-ID: Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? Neil From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 20 09:25:48 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 09:25:48 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 20 July 2008, Neil Morrison wrote: >Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? > >Neil Interesting, I wonder what their business model includes besides selling the networking hardware? Even that seems pretty low key. Nowhere on the page can a working order link or a price be found. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) semper en excretus From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 20 09:47:00 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 09:47:00 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 09:25 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 20 July 2008, Neil Morrison wrote: > >Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? > > > >Neil > > Interesting, I wonder what their business model includes besides selling the > networking hardware? Even that seems pretty low key. Nowhere on the page can > a working order link or a price be found. > They're not selling anything. All they're doing is providing a text-based Internet service to generate ASCII data for your display. Hooking up to the Coco or any other device is done through a bog-standard Lantronix or similar RS232-remote-management device. If you want to put all the network hardware and software in an external device, and hang it on a serial port on an 8-bit micro, limit yourself to a single fixed TCP session at a time, and then declare that the 8-bit is 'networked,' go right ahead. Doesn't fit my definition. :) C. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 20 10:34:05 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 10:34:05 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> References: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> Message-ID: <200807201034.05418.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 20 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 09:25 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: >> On Sunday 20 July 2008, Neil Morrison wrote: >> >Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? >> > >> >Neil >> >> Interesting, I wonder what their business model includes besides selling >> the networking hardware? Even that seems pretty low key. Nowhere on the >> page can a working order link or a price be found. > >They're not selling anything. All they're doing is providing a >text-based Internet service to generate ASCII data for your display. >Hooking up to the Coco or any other device is done through a >bog-standard Lantronix or similar RS232-remote-management device. > >If you want to put all the network hardware and software in an external >device, and hang it on a serial port on an 8-bit micro, limit yourself >to a single fixed TCP session at a time, and then declare that the 8-bit >is 'networked,' go right ahead. Doesn't fit my definition. :) > >C. Nor mine. And is rendered even less interesting by not being able to ascertain the cost of such a hookup. And, because it would be piped through an existing serial hardware port, that implies single threaded. No thanks. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Individualists unite! From charles.shrader at gmail.com Sun Jul 20 09:36:08 2008 From: charles.shrader at gmail.com (Charles Shrader) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 09:36:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000201c8ea6d$91ef67e0$800101df@CHUCK03> This is COOL! I'm going to try to set up a kiosk in our kitchen so my wife can read current news on a Commodore 64 when she's making coffee. We'll see how it goes... Chuck -----Original Message----- From: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com [mailto:ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Neil Morrison Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:15 AM To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com Subject: [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net Have you seen http://www.startty. com/ ??? Neil No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.2/1562 - Release Date: 7/19/2008 2:01 PM From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 20 13:01:08 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 13:01:08 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <200807201034.05418.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> <200807201034.05418.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1216573268.6671.12.camel@dev> On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 10:34 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > Nor mine. And is rendered even less interesting by not being able to ascertain > the cost of such a hookup. And, because it would be piped through an existing > serial hardware port, that implies single threaded. No thanks. Those serial/Ethernet gateway devices have a limited market (the A/V control market, and remote console management for servers) so they have high margins, my guess is ~$200 per port in small quantities. C. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Jul 20 14:38:33 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 18:38:33 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <000201c8ea6d$91ef67e0$800101df@CHUCK03> Message-ID: Really? I would be thinking how hard it would be to suck my morning coffee out of my pants. :) Neil --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Charles Shrader" wrote: > > This is COOL! I'm going to try to set up a kiosk in our kitchen so my wife > can read current news on a Commodore 64 when she's making coffee. > > We'll see how it goes... > > Chuck From davehazelton at comcast.net Sun Jul 20 16:59:25 2008 From: davehazelton at comcast.net (David Hazelton) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 16:59:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] IP stack for NitrOS9 In-Reply-To: References: <1216487407.18474.23.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4883A72D.9060801@comcast.net> Dean Leiber wrote: > > On Jul 19, 2008, at 10:10 AM, Chuck Youse wrote: >> >> >> So I'm left with kernel solutions. Two main approaches: >> >> 1. Implement as an SCF/SBF file manager to attempt to maintain the >> unified I/O system of OS-9; >> 2. Create kernel extensions to implement a separate set of system calls >> for network I/O. >> >> > > Perhaps it would help if you took a look at the approach Microware > took. I have an old Microware catalog and it gives a brief description > about a Network Fille Manager (NFM) and an Internet Support Package > (ISP). I haven't looked at the latest catalogs so maybe a look at the > Radisys site would be in order. If you can't find anything there, I > can scan the old catalog pages if you like. > > > > Dean > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.comVersion: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: > 270.5.2/1561 - Release Date: 7/18/2008 6:35 PM > > > I have used NFM on a 68030 Fuji machine, and Have the executables I believe somewhere on Disk. Along with NFS Client...I believe. I'm not sure what sources are with them, but I know the source of Driver for the SME board is not included. I don't know if any of this helps, but I can go hunt for it and see if I can read them still....probably on my MM1/B My intentions were to find hardware for the MM1B to network that. Never happened..... :( From underserf at comcast.net Sun Jul 20 18:49:12 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 15:49:12 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <000201c8ea6d$91ef67e0$800101df@CHUCK03> References: <000201c8ea6d$91ef67e0$800101df@CHUCK03> Message-ID: <20080720224906.9FA2020A33@qs281.pair.com> Looks like it might be capable of doing something I've tinkered with on and off over the years - mating my MC-10 to my BC785. I had pretty much dumped =that= idea in favor of using my CoCo2 and a LCD display from All Electronics, under OS/9 L1 . Hell, =anything= beats coughing up 400 bucks for a remote control head ;) =M0= >This is COOL! I'm going to try to set up a kiosk in our kitchen so my wife >can read current news on a Commodore 64 when she's making coffee. > >We'll see how it goes... > >Chuck > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com [mailto:ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com] >On Behalf Of Neil Morrison >Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:15 AM >To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com >Subject: [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net > > > >Have you seen http://www.startty. com/ ??? > >Neil > > > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.2/1562 - Release Date: 7/19/2008 >2:01 PM > > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Sun Jul 20 19:27:49 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 16:27:49 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Magnavox Color Monitor 40 In-Reply-To: <93f331ac0807190744m1792af1ft73d3b0b707cdb203@mail.gmail.co m> References: <20080717153923.B29B320A35@qs281.pair.com> <93f331ac0807190744m1792af1ft73d3b0b707cdb203@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080720232743.D9CB120A35@qs281.pair.com> >Did you check the links on the other list? Ah, you're referring to the MC-10 list. Welp, since you mentioned it, I did a little linkchasing, and yeah, THERE it was!!! Part of it at least... The Marty Goodman transistor buffer/amp for the video. The Rainbow had a similarf circuit, one that incorporated the monochrome output as well as composite. VERY nice tho, now I'll have something for my newly-acquired monitor to do whilst my CoCo3 uses a R. Justus adapter. =M0= >Neil > >On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 8:39 AM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > > > Ah, a question comes to mind. Back about '91, I built a little > > two-transistor circuit to pick off , amplify & buffer the composite signal > > going into the CoCo2 onboard modulator. I think the circuit was > in a Rainbow > > issue, not sure which. > > > > Anybody recall which issue it was in (mebbe the Seattle Public Library has > > it 'fiched) or perhaps have the schematic as a GIF somewheres? > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 20 21:53:57 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 21:53:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE Message-ID: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> This byte in the device descriptor appears to be unused (or at least, not useful) on Coco OS-9 (both levels 1 and 2). While it's set in the device descriptor, it appears to be cleared in the device static storage area (rather than copied from the descriptor) before the call to the driver's INIT routine during I$Attach (in both Level 1 and Level 2 IOMAN). I'd like to re-use this byte as the multi-pak slot indicator, as I can't see that that's in the device descriptor anywhere else and appears to be hard-coded into the respective device drivers. Am I going to make something explode if I try to repurpose this byte? C. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Sun Jul 20 23:03:02 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:03:02 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > This byte in the device descriptor appears to be unused (or at least, > not useful) on Coco OS-9 (both levels 1 and 2). While it's set in the > device descriptor, it appears to be cleared in the device static storage > area (rather than copied from the descriptor) before the call to the > driver's INIT routine during I$Attach (in both Level 1 and Level 2 > IOMAN). > > I'd like to re-use this byte as the multi-pak slot indicator, as I can't > see that that's in the device descriptor anywhere else and appears to be > hard-coded into the respective device drivers. > > Am I going to make something explode if I try to repurpose this byte? > > C. > Nothing should explode but you may not want to hard code the slot. A more flexible scheme would be to use a driver data byte for each device installed in the MPI. It would be the responsibility of the device during its init phase to store the current value of the MPI I/O byte, search for itself scanning through the slots, and saving the found slot. Each time the device (driver) runs, it swaps MPI slots as needed. Of course if you are writing code exclusively for your own use, do whatever you want. If you will be writing code for distribution, you don't want to force a user into a specific MPI slot. Let your driver find the correct slot so the user is free to stuff the MPI at random. From neilsmorr at gmail.com Mon Jul 21 02:44:01 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 06:44:01 -0000 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again Message-ID: I see eBay has a TRS-80 section again under Vintage Computing. Not many items there - I guess it'll take time. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 21 08:35:33 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 08:35:33 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 23:03 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > Chuck Youse wrote: > > This byte in the device descriptor appears to be unused (or at least, > > not useful) on Coco OS-9 (both levels 1 and 2). While it's set in the > > device descriptor, it appears to be cleared in the device static storage > > area (rather than copied from the descriptor) before the call to the > > driver's INIT routine during I$Attach (in both Level 1 and Level 2 > > IOMAN). > > > > I'd like to re-use this byte as the multi-pak slot indicator, as I can't > > see that that's in the device descriptor anywhere else and appears to be > > hard-coded into the respective device drivers. > > > > Am I going to make something explode if I try to repurpose this byte? > > > > C. > > > > Nothing should explode but you may not want to hard code the slot. A > more flexible scheme would be to use a driver data byte for each device > installed in the MPI. It would be the responsibility of the device > during its init phase to store the current value of the MPI I/O byte, > search for itself scanning through the slots, and saving the found slot. > Each time the device (driver) runs, it swaps MPI slots as needed. Thanks for the response. And interesting idea - but - there are three problems I can see with this scheme: 1. auto-probing is dangerous business - not every device can be detected safely, which may lead to interference with or crashing other devices .. 2. What if there are multiple instances of a card in the multi-pak (e.g., more than one RS-232 card)? 3. Architecturally, OS-9 doesn't do any auto-probing of this sort; port addresses, drive geometries, etc. are all hard-coded into the device descriptors. These save the system a lot of guesswork, and the associated code/speed. MPI slot is just another of these values (and V.PAGE seems the right place to me, as slot selection is in fact a form of address extension). So probing just doesn't match the rest of the system architecture that well. C. From petrander at gmail.com Mon Jul 21 11:02:06 2008 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:02:06 +0200 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> References: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> Message-ID: Hmmm... even though this may not be the way of connecting the coco to the internet, it may inspire a way forward. Our CoCo will never be able to parse and render modern day complex webpages. HTTP-requests routed through a special server that does the hard work and delivers web pages in a format that the CoCo can handle, that might actually work! But those are just my ? 0.05... Cheers, Fedor 2008/7/20 Chuck Youse : > On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 09:25 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Sunday 20 July 2008, Neil Morrison wrote: > > >Have you seen http://www.startty.com/ ??? > > > > > >Neil > > > > Interesting, I wonder what their business model includes besides selling > the > > networking hardware? Even that seems pretty low key. Nowhere on the > page can > > a working order link or a price be found. > > > > They're not selling anything. All they're doing is providing a > text-based Internet service to generate ASCII data for your display. > Hooking up to the Coco or any other device is done through a > bog-standard Lantronix or similar RS232-remote-management device. > > If you want to put all the network hardware and software in an external > device, and hang it on a serial port on an 8-bit micro, limit yourself > to a single fixed TCP session at a time, and then declare that the 8-bit > is 'networked,' go right ahead. Doesn't fit my definition. :) > > C. > > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 21 11:39:07 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Charles Youse) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 11:39:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Coco on the 'net In-Reply-To: References: <200807200925.48959.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <1216561620.6671.9.camel@dev> Message-ID: On Jul 21, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hmmm... even though this may not be the way of connecting the coco > to the > internet, it may inspire a way forward. Our CoCo will never be able > to parse > and render modern day complex webpages. HTTP-requests routed through a > special server that does the hard work and delivers web pages in a > format > that the CoCo can handle, that might actually work! > > But those are just my ? 0.05... > > Cheers, > Fedor > IP networks existed and were plenty useful long before HTTP and the web. They continue to be useful for these other purposes and the Coco has plenty of horsepower for those. C. From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jul 21 12:48:02 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:48:02 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> Message-ID: <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> Chuck Youse wrote: > On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 23:03 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: >> Chuck Youse wrote: >>> This byte in the device descriptor appears to be unused (or at least, >>> not useful) on Coco OS-9 (both levels 1 and 2). While it's set in the >>> device descriptor, it appears to be cleared in the device static storage >>> area (rather than copied from the descriptor) before the call to the >>> driver's INIT routine during I$Attach (in both Level 1 and Level 2 >>> IOMAN). >>> >>> I'd like to re-use this byte as the multi-pak slot indicator, as I can't >>> see that that's in the device descriptor anywhere else and appears to be >>> hard-coded into the respective device drivers. >>> >>> Am I going to make something explode if I try to repurpose this byte? >>> >>> C. >>> >> Nothing should explode but you may not want to hard code the slot. A >> more flexible scheme would be to use a driver data byte for each device >> installed in the MPI. It would be the responsibility of the device >> during its init phase to store the current value of the MPI I/O byte, >> search for itself scanning through the slots, and saving the found slot. >> Each time the device (driver) runs, it swaps MPI slots as needed. > > Thanks for the response. And interesting idea - but - there are three > problems I can see with this scheme: > > 1. auto-probing is dangerous business - not every device can be detected > safely, which may lead to interference with or crashing other devices .. > > 2. What if there are multiple instances of a card in the multi-pak > (e.g., more than one RS-232 card)? > > 3. Architecturally, OS-9 doesn't do any auto-probing of this sort; port > addresses, drive geometries, etc. are all hard-coded into the device > descriptors. These save the system a lot of guesswork, and the > associated code/speed. MPI slot is just another of these values (and > V.PAGE seems the right place to me, as slot selection is in fact a form > of address extension). So probing just doesn't match the rest of the > system architecture that well. > > C. You only probe once, curing the init phase of the driver. That uses an insignificant amount of processor time. If you are going to create a system with multiple RS-232 cards or disk controllers, you will need to also create custom drivers as none of the current ones are designed this way. As I said, if this is just for you then modify OS-9 to your hearts content. :) Auto-probing is not dangerous if done with correct coding. Obviously one turns off interrupts before switching the MPI, uses the intended device, and resets the system as it was found when the driver gets finished. This is exactly what a driver must do if not the floppy controller. Study the NitrOS-9 code for examples. From Carey at cebridge.net Mon Jul 21 13:01:11 2008 From: Carey at cebridge.net (Carey) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:01:11 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Hundreds of old CoCo disk.... References: Message-ID: <001001c8eb53$6522ede0$6601a8c0@server> A couple years ago I was going to get rid of my CoCo stuff and throw away several hundred CoCo disks. This group talked me out of it, so instead I sent them to Andrew & Tim. (Can't remember last names or email addresses.) Andrew got a lot of the regular stuff (games, utils, etc.) and Tim got the copy protected stuff, some stuff I wasn't sure if it was copy protected, along with some regular stuff that I couldn't fit into Andrew's box. I was wondering if those disks were ever posted anywhere? That was the point of my sending the disks to them instead of throwing them away. Andrew got done, but I don't know if they were posted or not. Don't know about Tim. Any info? Carey From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 21 13:32:33 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 11:32:33 -0600 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:48:02 -0600, Robert Gault wrote: > > You only probe once, curing the init phase of the driver. That uses an > insignificant amount of processor time. > > If you are going to create a system with multiple RS-232 cards or disk > controllers, you will need to also create custom drivers as none of the > current ones are designed this way. > As I said, if this is just for you then modify OS-9 to your hearts > content. :) > > Auto-probing is not dangerous if done with correct coding. Obviously one > turns off interrupts before switching the MPI, uses the intended device, > and resets the system as it was found when the driver gets finished. > This is exactly what a driver must do if not the floppy controller. > Study the NitrOS-9 code for examples. > That may be true for disk controllers, but RS-232 does allow multiple cards (the Comm-4 board from Alpha technologies had 4 ports, as an example). The device descriptor determines it by the address of the card, and each get's their own buffer (especially if using SACIA for 6551 based ports, and DACIA for 6552 based ports). When we used to run the Coco 3/Nitros9 system here at work, we had 3 parallel ports, and 8 serial ports (4 6551, 4 6552 (2 ports per chip on the latter), and we drove 8 ADM terminals from those. -- L. Curtis Boyle From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 21 16:48:36 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 16:48:36 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1216673316.15369.6.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-21 at 12:48 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > > Auto-probing is not dangerous if done with correct coding. When you start poking around at registers without knowing what exactly is there, you have NO idea what the results might be. If I think there's a UART at a given address and it's in fact an IDE controller, the side effects can be harmful. ISA auto-probing was pretty hit-or-miss back before PCI took over the world. I can cite a large set of cases where system initializations simply failed (and systems would hang) because auto-probing isn't safe. The solutions were invariably "turn off autoprobing for X". C. From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Mon Jul 21 17:08:57 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:08:57 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE In-Reply-To: <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <1216674537.15369.21.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-21 at 12:48 -0400, Robert Gault wrote: > > If you are going to create a system with multiple RS-232 cards or disk > controllers, you will need to also create custom drivers as none of the > current ones are designed this way. Except in cases where there would *clearly* never be multiple devices (e.g., the Coco keyboard/video situation), then you can blame the driver writers for shorted-sightedness, laziness, or incompetence. It's clear that the architects of OS-9 intended for drivers to be used with multiple instances of device, wherever they might be. If the device descriptor has the full address information in it (V.PAGE, V.PORT and sub-device information on busses like 'drive number' as found in RBF devices), nothing prevents the driver-writer from supporting multiple instances except, well, the driver-writer. The static per-device area is where one is supposed to track the pertinent state details. Anyway, yes, this is for custom hardware anyway, so I don't really have much choice except to write the drivers ... so kind of a pointless conversation. C. From RJRTTY at aol.com Mon Jul 21 17:36:37 2008 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:36:37 EDT Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again Message-ID: In a message dated 7/21/2008 2:44:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, neilsmorr at gmail.com writes: >I see eBay has a TRS-80 section again under Vintage Computing. Not many >items there - I guess it'll take time. Yes but if you navigate the Vintage Computing manually you will find that they miss a lot. Everything marked "TRS-80" is listed but anything marked "TANDY" or "coco" or "Radio Shack" or any other way is not. All they do is perform the "TRS-80" search for you. ..... lazy bastards..... Roy **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) From georgeramsower at gmail.com Mon Jul 21 17:46:42 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 16:46:42 -0500 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net><1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> ----- Original Message ----- From: "L. Curtis Boyle" >> > That may be true for disk controllers, but RS-232 does allow multiple > cards (the Comm-4 board from Alpha technologies had 4 ports, as an > example). The device descriptor determines it by the address of the card, > and each get's their own buffer (especially if using SACIA for 6551 based > ports, and DACIA for 6552 based ports). When we used to run the Coco > 3/Nitros9 system here at work, we had 3 parallel ports, and 8 serial ports > (4 6551, 4 6552 (2 ports per chip on the latter), and we drove 8 ADM > terminals from those. > Are the drivers and descriptors available for these chips? I've been wanting to build a new board for my coco using one of these chips to replace the 6551 chips I'm using now. My current board has three of the 6551 chips and from what I hear, the 46551 and 46552 are superior. I use stock OS-9 L2 on a 512K CC3. Thanks, George From georgeramsower at gmail.com Mon Jul 21 17:48:56 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 16:48:56 -0500 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again References: Message-ID: <003901c8eb7b$94369910$d4b1b1d8@house> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 4:36 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again > In a message dated 7/21/2008 2:44:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > neilsmorr at gmail.com writes: > > > >>I see eBay has a TRS-80 section again under Vintage Computing. Not many >>items there - I guess it'll take time. > > > Yes but if you navigate the Vintage Computing manually you will > find that they miss a lot. Everything marked "TRS-80" is listed > but anything marked "TANDY" or "coco" or "Radio Shack" or > any other way is > not. All they do is perform the "TRS-80" search for you. > > ..... lazy bastards..... > > Roy Isn't it up to the seller to make the decision on where to place their ad? George From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Mon Jul 21 20:08:22 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:08:22 -0600 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:46:42 -0600, George Ramsower wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- From: "L. Curtis Boyle" > > >>> >> That may be true for disk controllers, but RS-232 does allow >> multiple cards (the Comm-4 board from Alpha technologies had 4 ports, >> as an example). The device descriptor determines it by the address of >> the card, and each get's their own buffer (especially if using SACIA >> for 6551 based ports, and DACIA for 6552 based ports). When we used to >> run the Coco 3/Nitros9 system here at work, we had 3 parallel ports, >> and 8 serial ports (4 6551, 4 6552 (2 ports per chip on the latter), >> and we drove 8 ADM terminals from those. >> > > Are the drivers and descriptors available for these chips? I've been > wanting to build a new board for my coco using one of these chips to > replace the 6551 chips I'm using now. > My current board has three of the 6551 chips and from what I hear, the > 46551 and 46552 are superior. > I use stock OS-9 L2 on a 512K CC3. > > Thanks, > > George Both SACIA and DACIA were part of Nitros9 at least up until 2.01, so I assume the source should be with the current NitrOS9 project. Both were originally done by Bruce Isted, and I don't recall too many changes being done afterwards by any of us on the NitrOS9 team. Also, what I meant with "4 6551, 4 6552" is that we had 4 ports running off of 6551 chips (4 chips; 1 port per chip), and 4 running off of 6552 chips (2 chips, 2 ports per chip, with up to 38.4kbaud and none of the nasty bugs with date/DTR that the 6551's had). The 6552 was used in the TC-9, and the Eliminator disk/hard drive/clock/parallel port/dual serial port controller that Frank Hogg sold for the Coco. That was an excellent controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure (even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last number right; going from foggy memory here). -- L. Curtis Boyle From shadow at shadowgard.com Mon Jul 21 22:54:23 2008 From: shadow at shadowgard.com (shadow at shadowgard.com) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 19:54:23 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4884E96F.3797.2F19E653@shadow.shadowgard.com> On 21 Jul 2008 at 6:44, Neil Morrison wrote: > I see eBay has a TRS-80 section again under Vintage Computing. Not many > items there - I guess it'll take time. When I can get them out of storage and get decent shots of them, I'll have a bunch of CoCo and MC-10 stuff going up. -- Leonard Erickson (aka shadow) shadow at shadowgard dot com From smostrom7 at comcast.net Tue Jul 22 00:16:09 2008 From: smostrom7 at comcast.net (Steve Ostrom) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 23:16:09 -0500 Subject: [Coco] New Color Computer Project Message-ID: If I recall correctly, Steve Bjork announced a new Color Computer group or company at this past CocoFest. Has anyone heard how he is doing with this project? It sounded very ambitious and almost too good to be true, but oh so mouthwatering for some of us diehard Coco-ists. I think it involved new hardware and software, and he had already assembled a group of programmers and designers to make it happen. -- Steve -- From georgeramsower at gmail.com Tue Jul 22 00:35:30 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 23:35:30 -0500 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net><1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net><003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <005e01c8ebb4$5fb57fb0$d4b1b1d8@house> > On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:46:42 -0600, George Ramsower > wrote: > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "L. Curtis Boyle" >> >> >>>> >>> That may be true for disk controllers, but RS-232 does allow >>> multiple cards (the Comm-4 board from Alpha technologies had 4 ports, >>> as an example). The device descriptor determines it by the address of >>> the card, and each get's their own buffer (especially if using SACIA >>> for 6551 based ports, and DACIA for 6552 based ports). When we used to >>> run the Coco 3/Nitros9 system here at work, we had 3 parallel ports, >>> and 8 serial ports (4 6551, 4 6552 (2 ports per chip on the latter), >>> and we drove 8 ADM terminals from those. >>> >> >> Are the drivers and descriptors available for these chips? I've been >> wanting to build a new board for my coco using one of these chips to >> replace the 6551 chips I'm using now. >> My current board has three of the 6551 chips and from what I hear, the >> 46551 and 46552 are superior. >> I use stock OS-9 L2 on a 512K CC3. >> >> Thanks, >> >> George > > Both SACIA and DACIA were part of Nitros9 at least up until 2.01, so I > assume the source should be with the current NitrOS9 project. Both were > originally done by Bruce Isted, and I don't recall too many changes being > done afterwards by any of us on the NitrOS9 team. > Also, what I meant with "4 6551, 4 6552" is that we had 4 ports running > off of 6551 chips (4 chips; 1 port per chip), and 4 running off of 6552 > chips (2 chips, 2 ports per chip, with up to 38.4kbaud and none of the > nasty bugs with date/DTR that the 6551's had). The 6552 was used in the > TC-9, and the Eliminator disk/hard drive/clock/parallel port/dual serial > port controller that Frank Hogg sold for the Coco. That was an excellent > controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure > (even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last > number right; going from foggy memory here). > > > -- > L. Curtis Boyle Thank you for being so kind with my stupidity. I was thinking of the chips from another mfg that works better. I think they have five digits in their nomenclature. I need to look into the 6552 and see if it is pin compatible. Perhaps I could just swap the chips if they are. .... assuming the drivers will work on those. Darn.. I still have about seven or eight of the 6551 chips left. The OS9 drivers work good up to about 9600 with the 6551 chips. Faster is always better! George From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 22 08:35:10 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 08:35:10 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <005e01c8ebb4$5fb57fb0$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net><1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> <005e01c8ebb4$5fb57fb0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <1216730110.15369.48.camel@dev> On Mon, 2008-07-21 at 23:35 -0500, George Ramsower wrote: > > Thank you for being so kind with my stupidity. I was thinking of the chips > from another mfg that works better. I think they have five digits in their > nomenclature. > > I need to look into the 6552 and see if it is pin compatible. > Perhaps I could just swap the chips if they are. .... assuming the drivers > will work on those. > Darn.. I still have about seven or eight of the 6551 chips left. > > The OS9 drivers work good up to about 9600 with the 6551 chips. Faster is > always better! You might be thinking of the 16550. I am currently working on a dual x 16550 UART card (two serial ports, and actually a parallel port too as that seems to be in some demand). They will run up to 115.2kbps with the 1.8432MHz oscillator that will be on board. I expect it will be available in ~ 6 weeks. Stay tuned. C. From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Tue Jul 22 11:14:48 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 09:14:48 -0600 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <005e01c8ebb4$5fb57fb0$d4b1b1d8@house> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> <005e01c8ebb4$5fb57fb0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 22:35:30 -0600, George Ramsower wrote: > > Thank you for being so kind with my stupidity. I was thinking of the > chips from another mfg that works better. I think they have five digits > in their nomenclature. > > I need to look into the 6552 and see if it is pin compatible. > Perhaps I could just swap the chips if they are. .... assuming the > drivers will work on those. > Darn.. I still have about seven or eight of the 6551 chips left. > > The OS9 drivers work good up to about 9600 with the 6551 chips. Faster > is always better! > > George I am guessing you were probably thinking of the 16550/16650/16750 series (with FIFO's and 115kbaud... each higher number increased the size of the FIFO buffer, starting at 16 bytes with the 16550). Rick Ulland and others made boards for the Coco using these, which could handle much higher speeds because you would only get an IRQ once the buffer was full, and not every byte (the overhead for that is atrocious). I seem to recall that Gimix, on their 6809 system, actually had some serial cards with a 256 byte buffer, which means the serial port could be read/written to as fast as a floppy controller, with very high speeds and low CPU overhead. They had DMA on top of that too, as well. I don't think a board that sophisticated was every made for the Coco, though... and probably would have been too expensive anyways. -- L. Curtis Boyle From diegoba at adinet.com.uy Tue Jul 22 17:35:07 2008 From: diegoba at adinet.com.uy (Diego Barizo) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:35:07 -0300 Subject: [Coco] New Color Computer Project In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4886528B.6000207@adinet.com.uy> Take a look at http://www.coco4.com/ Diego Steve Ostrom wrote: > If I recall correctly, Steve Bjork announced a new Color Computer group or company at this past CocoFest. Has anyone heard how he is doing with this project? It sounded very ambitious and almost too good to be true, but oh so mouthwatering for some of us diehard Coco-ists. I think it involved new hardware and software, and he had already assembled a group of programmers and designers to make it happen. > > -- Steve -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > From tjseagrove at writeme.com Tue Jul 22 19:57:22 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:57:22 -0400 Subject: [Coco] New Color Computer Project In-Reply-To: <4886528B.6000207@adinet.com.uy> References: <4886528B.6000207@adinet.com.uy> Message-ID: <010201c8ec56$af5142a0$0df3c7e0$@com> I think Steve was asking if anyone had heard of any updates on the project. All the info at www.coco4.com looks the same as when it was announced. I am very much looking forward to it myself... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Diego Barizo Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 5:35 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: Re: [Coco] New Color Computer Project Take a look at http://www.coco4.com/ Diego Steve Ostrom wrote: > If I recall correctly, Steve Bjork announced a new Color Computer group or company at this past CocoFest. Has anyone heard how he is doing with this project? It sounded very ambitious and almost too good to be true, but oh so mouthwatering for some of us diehard Coco-ists. I think it involved new hardware and software, and he had already assembled a group of programmers and designers to make it happen. > > -- Steve -- > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.4/1566 - Release Date: 7/22/2008 6:00 AM From neilsmorr at gmail.com Tue Jul 22 20:17:49 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:17:49 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: [RainbowArchive] Rainbow on tape References: Message-ID: <012401c8ec5a$11e60c40$0101a8c0@NewBaby> See http://www.trs-80.com/trs80-main-emulators.htm I slightly prefer Vavasour's but any will do. Do you have a real Coco with a floppy drive? Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: aravan72rs I won an EBAY auction of 50 rainbow on tapes. I have been going through them, and hopefully I could add to the list of some that are already here. Is there any certain "emulator" I should use to create the virtual disks? . From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 22 20:25:19 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:25:19 -0700 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> >That was an excellent >controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure >(even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last >number right; going from foggy memory here). I understood the WD1003-WAH was the HD controller that plugged into simple interface device & direct into the MPI. Found THAT one, to match my 30-MEG WD HD, at my favorite electronics store Hard to find, like so? http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-WD-1002-27X-8-Bit-ISA-RLL-Drive-Controller-Card_W0QQitemZ320152809926QQihZ011QQcategoryZ4193QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262 ;) =M0= From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 22 22:53:07 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 22:53:07 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Wordpak RS update Message-ID: <1216781588.17918.4.camel@dev> Ok, folks, a few weeks ago there was some back and forth about the various Wordpak models and some doubts about the 6845 CRTC in the middle of all that business... I cracked open my Wordpak RS today - the registers are located at $FF76-$FF79, and, as I suspected from the published schematics, it is a 6545, NOT a 6845. And yes, the difference is vitally important to the design.. I verified this, too, by swapping in a 68B45. When the video registers are jimmied, a valid display (and text) is generated, but no updates of video RAM can take place because the 6845 lacks that one feature of the 6545! C. From curtisboyle at sasktel.net Wed Jul 23 11:53:02 2008 From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 09:53:02 -0600 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:25:19 -0600, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> That was an excellent >> controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure >> (even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last >> number right; going from foggy memory here). > > I understood the WD1003-WAH was the HD controller that plugged into > simple interface device & direct into the MPI. Found THAT one, to match > my 30-MEG WD HD, at my favorite electronics store > > Hard to find, like so? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-WD-1002-27X-8-Bit-ISA-RLL-Drive-Controller-Card_W0QQitemZ320152809926QQihZ011QQcategoryZ4193QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262 > > ;) > That's an XT bus card. The card the Eliminator used was MUCH bigger, and controlled 3 hard drives and 4 floppies off of the same board, all no halt. -- L. Curtis Boyle From Torsten at Dittel.info Wed Jul 23 15:56:43 2008 From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 21:56:43 +0200 Subject: [Coco] Boot DOS CoCo-Emulator(s) from an SD-Card? Message-ID: Roger (or others interested of course), I remember you have been able to setup a bootable CF card containing DOS CoCo-Emulator(s) (and some DSK or even HD images). Would that work for an SD-Card too? Or a more generic question: how can I create an e.g. MS-DOS 7 (W98) bootable SD-Card? I have a 0-MB USB stick which is equipped with an SD-Card (<2GB) and XP. The SD-Card should be bootable on a Netbook with an internal SD-Reader (e.g. ASUS eeePC 900). Regards, Torsten From neilsmorr at gmail.com Thu Jul 24 02:11:58 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:11:58 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay has TRS-80 section again References: <003901c8eb7b$94369910$d4b1b1d8@house> Message-ID: <00cc01c8ed55$9565a9d0$0101a8c0@NewBaby> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: >> Yes but if you navigate the Vintage Computing manually you will >> find that they miss a lot. Everything marked "TRS-80" is listed >> but anything marked "TANDY" or "coco" or "Radio Shack" or any other way >> is >> not. All they do is perform the "TRS-80" search for you. >> >> ..... lazy bastards..... >> >> Roy From: "George Ramsower" > > Isn't it up to the seller to make the decision on where to place their ad? > > George Yes. eBay doesn't make the decision, only the seller does. Neil From kevdig at hypersurf.com Thu Jul 24 16:20:12 2008 From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 13:20:12 -0700 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <4888E3FC.5080405@hypersurf.com> I forgot who wrote (Curtis?): > >> That was an excellent >> controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure >> (even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last >> number right; going from foggy memory here). Your powers of recallection do you credit, Mr. Bond. It is indeed a WD-1002-05, a "G" in my case. The card is about the same size as the foot print of a 5.25" drive. kevin P.S.: How does one spell "recallection"? From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Thu Jul 24 16:37:46 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 16:37:46 -0400 Subject: [Coco] V.PAGE 46551 and 46552 drivers In-Reply-To: <4888E3FC.5080405@hypersurf.com> References: <1216605237.6671.22.camel@dev> <4883FC66.3080307@worldnet.att.net> <1216643733.15202.16.camel@dev> <4884BDC2.5090602@worldnet.att.net> <003401c8eb7b$43d582b0$d4b1b1d8@house> <20080723002514.6EA5A20A33@qs281.pair.com> <4888E3FC.5080405@hypersurf.com> Message-ID: <1216931866.17918.32.camel@dev> On Thu, 2008-07-24 at 13:20 -0700, Kevin Diggs wrote: > I forgot who wrote (Curtis?): > > > >> That was an excellent > >> controller, except for no RS-DOS compatibility, and it's use of obscure > >> (even at the time) WD-1002-05 controller cards (hope I got that last > >> number right; going from foggy memory here). > > Your powers of recallection do you credit, Mr. Bond. It is indeed a > WD-1002-05, a "G" in my case. The card is about the same size as the > foot print of a 5.25" drive. > > kevin > > P.S.: How does one spell "recallection"? "recollection" Interestingly enough, its root word isn't "recall", it's "collect". I smell foul play of the British sort. Phill? :) C. From chargeron at cox.net Thu Jul 24 19:08:51 2008 From: chargeron at cox.net (chargeron) Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 16:08:51 -0700 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Color Computer 68b03 test References: <012401c8ec5a$11e60c40$0101a8c0@NewBaby> Message-ID: <171C9363EF4B452BB1C3618DB05A6141@GATOR> Does anyone have a basic program that will test if a hitachi chip is present??? thanks Ron Delvaux ----- Original Message ----- From: Neil Morrison To: RainbowArchive at yahoogroups.com Cc: Coco on Yahoo Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 5:17 PM Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [RainbowArchive] Rainbow on tape See http://www.trs-80.com/trs80-main-emulators.htm I slightly prefer Vavasour's but any will do. Do you have a real Coco with a floppy drive? Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: aravan72rs I won an EBAY auction of 50 rainbow on tapes. I have been going through them, and hopefully I could add to the list of some that are already here. Is there any certain "emulator" I should use to create the virtual disks? . No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.4/1566 - Release Date: 7/22/2008 6:00 AM From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Fri Jul 25 00:31:39 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 00:31:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Color Computer 68b03 test In-Reply-To: <171C9363EF4B452BB1C3618DB05A6141@GATOR> References: <012401c8ec5a$11e60c40$0101a8c0@NewBaby> <171C9363EF4B452BB1C3618DB05A6141@GATOR> Message-ID: <4889572B.3040207@worldnet.att.net> chargeron wrote: > Does anyone have a basic program that will test if a hitachi chip is present??? > > thanks > Ron Delvaux Strictly speaking, it is not possible to determine whether a Coco's CPU is an MC6809 or an H6309 with anything other than an ml program. However, it is possible to use Basic to POKE a machine language program into memory, run it, and report the results. What is needed is an ml program that uses an opcode which give different results for a 6809 and 6309. As an example, COMD is a 6309 opcode which is $1043. For a 6809, this is an illegal instruction so the $10 is skipped over and $43 is used which is the opcode COMA. The following Basic program generates an ml program that tries to do a LDD $FFFF COMD STD TEMP which only works with a 6309. 10 REM CPUTEST 20 CLEAR256,&H7000 30 LI=80 40 FOR M=&H7000 TO &H7008 STEP10:SUM=0 50 FOR I=0TO9:READA$:VA=VAL("&H"+A$):SUM=SUM+VA:POKE M+I,VA:NEXT:READ CHK:IFSUM<>CHK THEN PRINT"ERROR IN LINE"LI:END 60 LI=LI+10:NEXT 70 EXEC&H7000 80 PRINT"YOUR CPU IS A"; 90 IFPEEK(&H7021)=0 THENPRINT" 6309"ELSE PRINT" 6809" 100 END 110 DATA CC, FF, FF, 10, 43, FD, 70, 20, 39, 00, 1251 50 is one long line but may not appear that way via e-mail. From petrander at gmail.com Fri Jul 25 14:54:33 2008 From: petrander at gmail.com (Fedor Steeman) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 20:54:33 +0200 Subject: [Coco] New Batch of scanned in manuals! Message-ID: Hi all, After a long break I have again scanned in a whole bunch of the copied manuals that I have in my possession. You can find the new batch on the usual address: http://steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/ Please remember: This is a quick and dirty scanning job facilitated by my all-in-one with document feeder. There may be duplicates or missing pages, and of some files the pages still need to be sorted and interleaved. If there is anyone willing and able to do so... be my guest! Cheers, Fedor From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Fri Jul 25 15:23:58 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Charles Youse) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 15:23:58 -0400 Subject: [Coco] New Batch of scanned in manuals! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1D8A3BA6-0376-46F3-98D4-6DEE98654463@serialtechnologies.com> Awesome! On Jul 25, 2008, at 2:54 PM, Fedor Steeman wrote: > Hi all, > > After a long break I have again scanned in a whole bunch of the copied > manuals that I have in my possession. You can find the new batch on > the > usual address: http://steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/ > > Please remember: This is a quick and dirty scanning job facilitated > by my > all-in-one with document feeder. There may be duplicates or missing > pages, > and of some files the pages still need to be sorted and > interleaved. If > there is anyone willing and able to do so... be my guest! > > Cheers, > > Fedor > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From adit at nationsdial.com Fri Jul 25 19:16:28 2008 From: adit at nationsdial.com (Dean Leiber) Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 16:16:28 -0700 Subject: [Coco] New Batch of scanned in manuals! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Jul 25, 2008, at 11:54 AM, Fedor Steeman wrote: > Please remember: This is a quick and dirty scanning job facilitated > by my > all-in-one with document feeder. There may be duplicates or missing > pages, > and of some files the pages still need to be sorted and > interleaved. If > there is anyone willing and able to do so... be my guest! Fedor, I'll sort/interleave, etc. them when I bookmark them for inclusion for the CoCo/OS-9 Archive project. I just thought I'd mention it so people don't duplicate the effort. BTW, thanks for the new scans! Dean From dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com Sat Jul 26 08:28:53 2008 From: dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 08:28:53 -0400 Subject: [Coco] OT: My new book Message-ID: <200807261229.m6QCTWLX031593@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net> Hi all, No, it's not a computer book. Entirely different, but if you ever liked my writing, here it is: "Country Stores of Vermont: A History and Guide" from the History Press. You can get it on Amazon: Or you can email me directly for an autographed copy (not to above address, which is CoCo list only, but to bathory at maltedmedia dot com) And now back to your regular work... Dennis From rvanscherpe at gmail.com Sat Jul 26 12:36:07 2008 From: rvanscherpe at gmail.com (Ron VanScherpe) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:36:07 -0700 Subject: [Coco] Unbound Rainbow & Color Computer Magazines Message-ID: Anyone interested in unbound Rainbow and Color Computer Magazines? Please let me know. Email me at rvanscherpe 'at' gmail 'dot' com Ron. From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 17:03:23 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 14:03:23 -0700 Subject: [Coco] New Batch of scanned in manuals! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080726210318.3843520A35@qs281.pair.com> >After a long break I have again scanned in a whole bunch of the copied >manuals that I have in my possession. You can find the new batch on the >usual address: http://steeman.dk/CoCoManuals/ VERY cool, Fedor, much gratitude for the effort! =M0= From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 17:34:06 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 14:34:06 -0700 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter Message-ID: <20080726213402.6510320A33@qs281.pair.com> Ordered my R. Justus video adapter like Monday the 21st, it was shipped out & I received it on the 25th. Wow. EBay vendors could learn a thing or three from Mr Justus ;) As to the adapter, very nice, looks homebrew but I think that adds personality - if I wanted bland generic, I can always open up my Gateway notebook. (it's closed, being a virtual HD to the CoCo3 ;) Works sweet, I always wondered what a =solid= green border would look like *heh*, works flawlessly on everything I plugged it into. Between DriveWire & the Roy Justus RGB-to-VGA adapter, I got lots to keep me busy while I save up for the SuperIDE. For the life of me tho, I can't recall which of the many sites that describe the RGB-VGA converter that it was I hit first, I think I was just chasin' links... At any rate, biggest thanks go out to the operators of the CoCo Lounge, CoCo3.com & all the rest, you helped awaken in me a long-dormant psychosis for which my family will be eternally grateful! *heheh* =M0= From RJRTTY at aol.com Sat Jul 26 18:09:53 2008 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 18:09:53 EDT Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter Message-ID: In a message dated 7/26/2008 5:34:25 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, underserf at comcast.net writes: Ordered my R. Justus video adapter like Monday the 21st, it was shipped out & I received it on the 25th. Wow. EBay vendors could learn a thing or three from Mr Justus ;) I am glad you like it. Thanks for the positive feedback :) There is one minor detail you should know about the converter. Well it is really about the coco3. The coco3 generates the three primary colors slightly out of sync with each other and the pixel clock. Green is in sync with the pixel clock but red is slightly out of sync and blue is WAY out of sync. What all of this means is that text looks good with black on a pure green backround. Text looks ok with a black on a pure red backround but text looks terrible with a black on pure blue backround. The reason this doesn't show up with say a CM8 monitor is that the bandwidth is so much smaller with the old monitors that they "soak up" this distortion but the bandwidth of my converter on an SVGA monitor is greater and shows the original signal warts and all. The converter uses special input filters to correct this to some extent but it cannot eliminate it completely. The bottom line is to avoid pure blue and pure red in text screens. Oddly enough blue with just a little green or red looks perfectly okay. Same for red with a little green or blue mixed in and all other color combinations look okay too. Go figure....... Roy **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 19:32:47 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 16:32:47 -0700 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080726233242.6D9DC20A33@qs281.pair.com> At 03:09 PM 7/26/2008, you wrote: >Oddly enough blue with just a little green or red looks perfectly >okay. Same for red with a little green or blue mixed in and all >other color combinations look okay too. Go figure....... I gotta try all kinds of color combos anyway, anything but black on white (or, white on black) looks weird to me, the result of years spent wearing the wrong grade welding lens. It seems RadioShack went outta their way to introduce idiosyncrasies into every aspect of their hardware, from the Speech-Sound Pak (my kids were downright FRIGHTENED by it's "voice") to the oddball floppydrives to a bitbanger port that "couldn't" do more'n 1200 baud... S'alright I reckon, it kept things interesting all these years ;) =M0= From underserf at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 19:33:47 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 16:33:47 -0700 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080726233342.346B120A36@qs281.pair.com> oh, almost forgot, you maybe have a picture of the component side of the adapter to quell my quriosity? =) =M0= From johnchasteen.2 at juno.com Sat Jul 26 23:30:47 2008 From: johnchasteen.2 at juno.com (John T Chasteen) Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 22:30:47 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Disk of the Month Message-ID: <20080726.223047.5684.0.johnchasteen.2@juno.com> Where can I find out about "The Glenside Color Computer Club's Disk of the Month" They have disk from January 1992 through 1996. I would like to find documentation for all these programs. John ____________________________________________________________ Recharge and relax. Click for great vacation ideas. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nMAbbBpjJL2TtJXFVwDZIOKtA1huuxoBilN70vMy9KbO82d/ From devries.bob at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 00:58:55 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 14:58:55 +1000 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia Message-ID: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> Hi, guys & gals, I'm now back at home in Australia. I'll be working to get a visa for my lovely wife Catherine to come here, and I'm hoping she'll join me in early September. Hmm, I wonder what her reaction will be to all my Coco and other computer grear? (just keeping this OT by that line :P ) -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Sun Jul 27 01:20:09 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 01:20:09 -0400 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia In-Reply-To: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> On Sun, 2008-07-27 at 14:58 +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > Hmm, I wonder what her reaction will be to all my Coco and other computer > grear? (just keeping this OT by that line :P ) Do Cocos work upside down? C. From devries.bob at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 01:33:56 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:33:56 +1000 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> <1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <007301c8efaa$5ecd70e0$0701a8c0@master> Chuck Youse said: > Do Cocos work upside down? Ah, well, we of course had to have special Australian versions made for that very reason. :P -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] I'm back in Australia > On Sun, 2008-07-27 at 14:58 +1000, Bob Devries wrote: > >> Hmm, I wonder what her reaction will be to all my Coco and other computer >> grear? (just keeping this OT by that line :P ) > > Do Cocos work upside down? > > C. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 27 04:07:41 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 04:07:41 -0400 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia In-Reply-To: <1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> <1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <200807270407.41094.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 27 July 2008, Chuck Youse wrote: >On Sun, 2008-07-27 at 14:58 +1000, Bob Devries wrote: >> Hmm, I wonder what her reaction will be to all my Coco and other computer >> grear? (just keeping this OT by that line :P ) > >Do Cocos work upside down? > >C. > Dunno why not, after all Bob is upside down too. :-) > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I love you, not only for what you are, but for what I am when I am with you. -- Roy Croft From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Sun Jul 27 09:51:12 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:51:12 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter References: Message-ID: wrote in message news:d1d.2d1e9570.35bcfab1 at aol.com... > > > There is one minor detail you should know about the converter. > Well it is really about the coco3. The coco3 generates the > three primary colors slightly out of sync with each other and > the pixel clock. Green is in sync with the pixel clock but > red is slightly out of sync and blue is WAY out of sync. > > What all of this means is that text looks good with > black on a pure green backround. Text looks ok with a black > on a pure red backround but text looks terrible with a black > on pure blue backround. The reason this doesn't show up > with say a CM8 monitor is that the bandwidth is so much > smaller with the old monitors that they "soak up" this > distortion but the bandwidth of my converter on an SVGA > monitor is greater and shows the original signal warts and all. > > The converter uses special input filters to correct this to some > extent but it cannot eliminate it completely. The bottom line is > to avoid pure blue and pure red in text screens. > > Oddly enough blue with just a little green or red looks perfectly > okay. Same for red with a little green or blue mixed in and all > other color combinations look okay too. Go figure....... > > Roy > Hi Roy. Would WIDTH80 CLS3 show the text to be terrible as you say? I just tried it out with your XRGB adapter and it actually looks fantastic on my NEC XV15. Now that I have several LCD flat panels in my home with VGA inputs, I'll be ordering your VGA adapter when I can get some extra cash together. It will be nice to play coco games on a big screen TV. Everyone gives excellent reviews to your VGA box and it looks so easy to use vs this XRGB which is a mess of wires. Plus after you told me yours busted im afraid to move mine :) Charlie From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 27 10:01:10 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:01:10 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps Message-ID: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602&t=k&z=8&om=1 Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 27 10:53:45 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 10:53:45 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 27 July 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: >http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602 >&t=k&z=8&om=1 > >Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. > Humm, nothing there but trees, planted in nice neat rows. What were we supposed to see Roger? >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Underlying Principle of Socio-Genetics: Superiority is recessive. From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Jul 27 10:54:24 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:24 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <488C8C20.1050802@swbell.net> Uh. Oops! About a mile and a half too far southeast. (The subject, not the coordinate you specified.) JCE Roger Taylor wrote: > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602&t=k&z=8&om=1 > > > Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From jcewy at swbell.net Sun Jul 27 11:02:21 2008 From: jcewy at swbell.net (Joel Ewy) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 10:02:21 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <488C8DFD.3050704@swbell.net> Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 27 July 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: > >> http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602 >> &t=k&z=8&om=1 >> >> Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. >> >> > Humm, nothing there but trees, planted in nice neat rows. What were we supposed > to see Roger? > > Try again, Gene. I found what he was looking at. You probably can't identify it until you get to almost the tightest zoom. If you're seeing just trees, you must be veering off to one side. This is something rather out of place in the water. JCE >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > > > > From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 27 11:27:13 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 11:27:13 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <200807271127.13209.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 27 July 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: >http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602 >&t=k&z=8&om=1 > >Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. I was rolling the mouse wheel, which must have zoomed to where the pointer was. Now, using the + button, I see what looks like a 60 year old airplane half submerged. Somewhat resembles an old Convair 580, but probably even smaller. I take it there is a story that I missed since I'm subbed through Dennis's server? -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I've already told you more than I know. From larrybo at idirect.com Sun Jul 27 12:52:40 2008 From: larrybo at idirect.com (Larry Osborne) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 12:52:40 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Heskett" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] maps > On Sunday 27 July 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: >>http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.141602 >>&t=k&z=8&om=1 >> >>Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. >> > Humm, nothing there but trees, planted in nice neat rows. What were we > supposed > to see Roger? > You didn't see the apparent aircraft down in the water? Larry >>-- >>Coco mailing list >>Coco at maltedmedia.com >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > > -- > Cheers, Gene > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > Underlying Principle of Socio-Genetics: > Superiority is recessive. > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From gene.heskett at verizon.net Sun Jul 27 14:05:01 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 14:05:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC> Message-ID: <200807271405.01188.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Sunday 27 July 2008, Larry Osborne wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gene Heskett" >To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" >Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:53 AM >Subject: Re: [Coco] maps > >> On Sunday 27 July 2008, Roger Taylor wrote: >>>http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=27.426488,-81.32517&spn=3.349248,5.1416 >>>02 &t=k&z=8&om=1 >>> >>>Go to this Google map coordinate and keep hitting zoom. >> >> Humm, nothing there but trees, planted in nice neat rows. What were we >> supposed >> to see Roger? > >You didn't see the apparent aircraft down in the water? >Larry I do when I kill it, reload, and use the plus button instead of the scroll wheel. Apparently when you zoom using the wheel, it zooms centered on the pointer rather that the entered co-ordinates. With a 60-70 foot wingspan its too big to be a twin beech & a little too small to be a convair 580. With the tail out of place, its hard to ID for sure. Google was many pages down when I found this: This took place back in 1981 carrying drugs to Miami. The aircraft suffered engine failure shortly after taking off from Runway 14 @ Sebring Regional Airport. The Pilot tried to land the aircraft in an open field north of the lake but skidded into the shallow waters of the lake. All passengers and crew walked away. But still no ID on the aircraft itself. Ahh, another 20 minutes of wading through the swamp called Google, and found this: So its a "Type: De Havilland DH.104 Dove 6BA" That lake seems at least a mile from anything civilized. Zoomed back out, one can see the dredging operations tracks as they have attempt a partial cleanup by dredging out a couple of feet of muck from too darned much fertilizer and laundry soaps man is putting into the environment. That airplane may have been mostly underwater till the drought. OTOH, would that not leave a coat of algae that would have, in 27 years, discolored the paint? Odd, says he to no one in particular. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Woolsey-Swanson Rule: People would rather live with a problem they cannot solve rather than accept a solution they cannot understand. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 27 14:35:12 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:35:12 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <200807271405.01188.gene.heskett@verizon.net> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC> <200807271405.01188.gene.heskett@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20080727183527.848EA20A37@qs281.pair.com> At 01:05 PM 7/27/2008, you wrote: >I do when I kill it, reload, and use the plus button instead of the scroll >wheel. Apparently when you zoom using the wheel, it zooms centered on the >pointer rather that the entered co-ordinates. With a 60-70 foot wingspan its >too big to be a twin beech & a little too small to be a convair 580. With >the tail out of place, its hard to ID for sure. Every now and then on blogs and assorted sites, people will post the links to Google map coordinates you can zoom in on to find interesting objects. I found that one pretty interesting. The owners of the plane (if they survived) might not even know the image is there. It looks like a "safe" landing to me, seeing that the plane just cleared some land and almost hit the other land across the small body of water. From operator at coco3.com Sun Jul 27 15:38:54 2008 From: operator at coco3.com (Roger Taylor) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 14:38:54 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <20080727183527.848EA20A37@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com> <200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC> <200807271405.01188.gene.heskett@verizon.net> <20080727183527.848EA20A37@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <20080727193909.4F88820A33@qs281.pair.com> At 01:35 PM 7/27/2008, you wrote: >At 01:05 PM 7/27/2008, you wrote: >>I do when I kill it, reload, and use the plus button instead of the scroll >>wheel. Apparently when you zoom using the wheel, it zooms centered on the >>pointer rather that the entered co-ordinates. With a 60-70 foot wingspan its >>too big to be a twin beech & a little too small to be a convair 580. With >>the tail out of place, its hard to ID for sure. > >Every now and then on blogs and assorted sites, people will post the >links to Google map coordinates you can zoom in on to find interesting objects. >I found that one pretty interesting. The owners of the plane (if >they survived) might not even know the image is there. It looks >like a "safe" landing to me, seeing that the plane just cleared some >land and almost hit the other land across the small body of water. I think I found an extra hobby :) Here's another example... It's somebody about ~20 miles from the plane crash. Just keep zooming until you see it. http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=27.412442,-81.277169&spn=71.456872,151.171875&z=3 I imagine that without an established database of cool Earth sites and objects to see on this map, that finding things on your own would be like finding a minnow in the ocean. However, I did find the ski boat by mistake. You can even see that it was a windy day on the water. Hey, somebody put a CoCo out in their backyard and give us the coordinates. From underserf at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 10:04:58 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 07:04:58 -0700 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter Message-ID: <20080727202727.3882420A33@qs281.pair.com> Darren said... >If you have DriveWire, then it should be clear that the bit banger >hardware is actually capable of much more than 1200 baud. Indeed - when =exactly= was that feature discovered? It ain't doc'ed in any Tandy/RS manual, one HAD TO buy a RS-232 cart (or hack the 300 baud modem cart) to get 115k at all. My only point was that Tandy deliberately messed with everything CoCo oriented that they sold, so a messy RGB output is par for the course ;) Oh, thanx loads for that source code, nicely readable too, even 15 years after I last assembled anything ;) =M0= From georgeramsower at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 18:24:36 2008 From: georgeramsower at gmail.com (George Ramsower) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:24:36 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps References: <20080727140124.9A95D20A37@qs281.pair.com><200807271053.45350.gene.heskett@verizon.net><740113B7C0C14E9485F77BCFE8DA7B85@UserPC><200807271405.01188.gene.heskett@verizon.net><20080727183527.848EA20A37@qs281.pair.com> <20080727193909.4F88820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <003201c8f037$8df06a70$d4b1b1d8@house> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" > > I think I found an extra hobby :) > > Here's another example... > It's somebody about ~20 miles from the plane crash. Just keep zooming > until you see it. > > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=27.412442,-81.277169&spn=71.456872,151.171875&z=3 > > I imagine that without an established database of cool Earth sites and > objects to see on this map, that finding things on your own would be like > finding a minnow in the ocean. However, I did find the ski boat by > mistake. You can even see that it was a windy day on the water. > > Hey, somebody put a CoCo out in their backyard and give us the > coordinates. I looked at my place and apparently, these are old images. I started improving my property back in early 2003. This image was made prior to that. http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=29.928355,-98.399279&spn=0.002092,0.003272&z=18&layer=t George From neilsmorr at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 18:29:40 2008 From: neilsmorr at gmail.com (Neil Morrison) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:29:40 -0700 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master> <1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> Message-ID: <037f01c8f038$7676ef80$0101a8c0@NewBaby> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Youse" > Do Cocos work upside down? > > C. The computers are fine. It's the cats that have problems. Neil From brucewcalkins at charter.net Sun Jul 27 18:49:39 2008 From: brucewcalkins at charter.net (Bruce W. Calkins) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:49:39 -0400 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master><1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> <037f01c8f038$7676ef80$0101a8c0@NewBaby> Message-ID: <4F660F27019B4A3482CF4B36517FCDA7@speedy> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Youse" > >> Do Cocos work upside down? >> >> C. > > The computers are fine. It's the cats that have problems. > > Neil Cats ALWAYS have problems. If in doubt, just ask one. ~BWC~ From tonym at compusource.net Sun Jul 27 19:57:35 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 23:57:35 GMT Subject: [Coco] maps Message-ID: <200807271957252.SM02700@[63.69.23.239]> This one is REALLY old already, but still a bit strange. This is a US Navy building, i believe: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&t=k&ll=32.676147,-117.157743&spn=0.001508,0.002596&om=1 Tony -----Original Message----- From: George Ramsower georgeramsower at gmail.com Sent 7/27/2008 6:24:36 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: Re: [Coco] maps ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" I think I found an extra hobby :) Here's another example... It's somebody about ~20 miles from the plane crash. Just keep zooming until you see it. http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=27.412442,-81.277169&spn=71.456872,151.171875&z=3 I imagine that without an established database of cool Earth sites and objects to see on this map, that finding things on your own would be like finding a minnow in the ocean. However, I did find the ski boat by mistake. You can even see that it was a windy day on the water. Hey, somebody put a CoCo out in their backyard and give us the coordinates. I looked at my place and apparently, these are old images. I started improving my property back in early 2003. This image was made prior to that. http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=29.928355,-98.399279&spn=0.002092,0.003272&z=18&layer=t George -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From os9dude at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 21:25:25 2008 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:25:25 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <200807271957252.SM02700@63.69.23.239> References: <200807271957252.SM02700@63.69.23.239> Message-ID: <5631e580807271825y6bd5474eh5a5812f83ef9526d@mail.gmail.com> I'd love to see a crop circle in the outline of a CoCo :-) On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 7:57 PM, tonym wrote: > This one is REALLY old already, but still a bit strange. > > This is a US Navy building, i believe: > > > http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&t=k&ll=32.676147,-117.157743&spn=0.001508,0.002596&om=1 > > > Tony > > -----Original Message----- > From: George Ramsower georgeramsower at gmail.com > Sent 7/27/2008 6:24:36 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com > Subject: Re: [Coco] maps > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Roger Taylor" > I think I found an extra hobby :) > > Here's another example... > It's somebody about ~20 miles from the plane crash. Just keep zooming > until you see it. > > > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=27.412442,-81.277169&spn=71.456872,151.171875&z=3 > > I imagine that without an established database of cool Earth sites and > objects to see on this map, that finding things on your own would be like > finding a minnow in the ocean. However, I did find the ski boat by > mistake. You can even see that it was a windy day on the water. > > Hey, somebody put a CoCo out in their backyard and give us the > coordinates. > > I looked at my place and apparently, these are old images. I started > improving my property back in early 2003. This image was made prior to > that. > > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=29.928355,-98.399279&spn=0.002092,0.003272&z=18&layer=t > > George > From RJRTTY at aol.com Sun Jul 27 21:34:41 2008 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:34:41 EDT Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter Message-ID: In a message dated 7/26/2008 7:33:46 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, underserf at comcast.net writes: oh, almost forgot, you maybe have a picture of the component side of the adapter to quell my quriosity? =) =M0= I don't have a picture but just take the top off of your unit. Make sure the ribbon cable is in the notch cut for it when you replace the top. Roy **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) From RJRTTY at aol.com Sun Jul 27 21:34:43 2008 From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:34:43 EDT Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter Message-ID: In a message dated 7/27/2008 9:51:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, chazbeenhad at hotmail.com writes: Hi Roy. Would WIDTH80 CLS3 show the text to be terrible as you say? I just tried it out with your XRGB adapter and it actually looks fantastic on my NEC XV15. The pure blue screen is CLS 7 in WIDTH80. The XRGB adapter has advanced (and expensive) filtering on it's inputs. That's why it cost you 200 bucks.... Roy **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) From devries.bob at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 21:46:45 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 11:46:45 +1000 Subject: [Coco] I'm back in Australia References: <006701c8efa5$7b32aca0$0701a8c0@master><1217136009.23715.0.camel@dev> <037f01c8f038$7676ef80$0101a8c0@NewBaby> Message-ID: <009e01c8f053$cccdf2a0$0701a8c0@master> Neil said: > The computers are fine. It's the cats that have problems. Hehe, and I have four of those. :P -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil Morrison" To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 8:29 AM Subject: Re: [Coco] I'm back in Australia > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Youse" > >> Do Cocos work upside down? >> >> C. > > The computers are fine. It's the cats that have problems. > > Neil > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Sun Jul 27 22:46:17 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:46:17 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter References: Message-ID: wrote in message news:c72.34953e77.35be7c33 at aol.com... > > In a message dated 7/27/2008 9:51:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > chazbeenhad at hotmail.com writes: > > Hi Roy. Would WIDTH80 CLS3 show the text to be terrible as you say? > I just tried it out with your XRGB adapter and it actually looks > fantastic > on my NEC XV15. > > > > The pure blue screen is CLS 7 in WIDTH80. > > The XRGB adapter has advanced (and expensive) > filtering on it's inputs. That's why it cost you > 200 bucks.... > > Roy > I checked out cls7 and it was still perfect. 200 bucks... I hardly remember that. I think I was just very excited to get my coco on a vga screen. I was suprised to learn later that I was the only one to get one of these devices. It was worth every penny. I use it several times a week and it works great. The battery died in the remote though. :) Charlie From underserf at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 21:29:56 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:29:56 -0700 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080728025740.E89CD20A33@qs281.pair.com> > >Hi Roy. Would WIDTH80 CLS3 show the text to be terrible as you say? >I just tried it out with your XRGB adapter and it actually looks fantastic >on my NEC XV15. I Googled (ow!) XRGB & found a $300 thing made in China... Does Mr Justus make one too? Inquiring minds want to know! =M0= From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com Sun Jul 27 23:22:47 2008 From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie) Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 23:22:47 -0400 Subject: [Coco] The CoCo to VGA adapter References: <20080728025740.E89CD20A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: "Mike 0rtloff" wrote in message news:20080728025740.E89CD20A33 at qs281.pair.com... > >> >>Hi Roy. Would WIDTH80 CLS3 show the text to be terrible as you say? >>I just tried it out with your XRGB adapter and it actually looks fantastic >>on my NEC XV15. > > I Googled (ow!) XRGB & found a $300 thing made in China... Does Mr Justus > make one too? > > Inquiring minds want to know! > > =M0= Roy can make the XRGB-2 Plus compatible with the coco3. Here is a page I host, made by Roy that describes the process. http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad/coco/xrgb/ Charlie From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 28 10:13:28 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 07:13:28 -0700 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs Message-ID: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago and afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no longer access my cassette input or output. I can't really see anything related to the cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps that get cut. (actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? =M0= From os9dude at gmail.com Mon Jul 28 10:21:42 2008 From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 10:21:42 -0400 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs In-Reply-To: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <5631e580807280721u1645a8c9y546604ff06e47d93@mail.gmail.com> Interesting... but I haven't heard of any such happenings upon upgrading the CoCo's RAM. I did mine years ago using the standard (then) 512k expansion from Radio Shack, didn't have any problems whatsoever with it other than a slight increase in operating temperature inside the CoCo 3 case. -=[ Rogelio ]=- On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 10:13 AM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago and > afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no longer access > my cassette input or output. I can't really see anything related to the > cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps that get cut. > > (actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) > > Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? > > =M0= From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net Mon Jul 28 10:23:04 2008 From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 10:23:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs In-Reply-To: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <488DD648.3020202@worldnet.att.net> Mike 0rtloff wrote: > I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago and > afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no longer > access my cassette input or output. I can't really see anything related > to the cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps that get cut. > > (actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) > > Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? > > =M0= > Should not be any connection between a memory upgrade and cassette I/O. List all hardware changes made and, if any, software changes when installing the memory board. Do you hear the cassette relay click? Does MOTORON cause anything to happen? Is the cassette "cable" plugged into the cassette correctly vs motor control and input/output? Are there any other failures since the memory was installed? Any loose ICs? Voltage reference points on motherboard OK? From mark at cloud9tech.com Mon Jul 28 11:53:50 2008 From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 10:53:50 -0500 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs Message-ID: <20080728105350.ywv9kc7t8soso0cw@webmail.frontiernet.net> Mike, The caps cut are RAS/CAS caps. Nothing common. Sure you cut the correct ones or didn't cut a trace around the caps. ?? Mark Cloud-9 Quoting Mike 0rtloff : > I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago and > afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no longer > access my cassette input or output. I can't really see anything related > to the cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps that get cut. > > (actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) > > Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? > > =M0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Mon Jul 28 12:48:45 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 09:48:45 -0700 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs In-Reply-To: <20080728105350.ywv9kc7t8soso0cw@webmail.frontiernet.net> References: <20080728105350.ywv9kc7t8soso0cw@webmail.frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <20080728164841.1D3DD20A35@qs281.pair.com> Feh... Yeah, I ignored the advice I'd given out for years. Everyone I ever knew around CoCos =always= had another Coco, even 1s & 2s, as backup & test jigs where possible. Whipped out my backup CoCo to try to see if the CCR-81 worked there (as it did just in June) It would appear that =somehow= both my cassette cables have gone flaky or something. The CCR-81 had a hardware failure right in the middle of my testing against my 128k Coco3. Went to the Panasonic tapedeck but still, nothing loads that did a few weeks ago Just a coincidence that I noticed the cassette loading issues after the upgrade, but as Mark pointed out, I indeed may have nicked a trace or such. Checked just to be sure ;) These cassette cables are ancient, kinda weird to have two fail, but both gotta be at least 20 years old. Methinx I'll hack together a new cable & try again. I just wanted to get this old weird educational software archived. Stuff from Dorsett Educational Systems that made interesting use of tape audio interspersed with program & binary data files. Great response time guys ;) =M0= From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 28 13:01:40 2008 From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:01:40 -0400 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs In-Reply-To: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <5lur84prkh8i7ov5lnnvn4d9rmcnv73pbl@4ax.com> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 07:13:28 -0700, Mike 0rtloff had a flock of green cheek conures squawk out: >I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago >and afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no >longer access my cassette input or output. I can't really see >anything related to the cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps >that get cut. > >(actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) > >Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? > >=M0= No, but the pins in the din connector on the cable and Coco need cleaning. I have to use some contact cleaner on all the connectors, inside and out, every so often to keep my Coco3 working. Stephen -- From devries.bob at gmail.com Mon Jul 28 19:54:41 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 09:54:41 +1000 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs References: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <003f01c8f10d$50a88770$0701a8c0@master> Don't you just hate it when something fails during an upgrade. You're left wondering if you've somehow screwed up. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike 0rtloff" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 12:13 AM Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs >I purchased & installed the memory upgrade from Cloud9 a while ago and >afterwards ( couple days ago, actually) discovered I could no longer access >my cassette input or output. I can't really see anything related to the >cassette I/O anywheres =near= the couple caps that get cut. > > (actual Tandy computer tape drive as well as the Panasonic version of it) > > Anyone ever hear of losing cassette I/O after a 512k upgrade? > > =M0= > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 29 11:03:25 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:03:25 -0700 Subject: [Coco] memory upgrade & CLOADs In-Reply-To: <5lur84prkh8i7ov5lnnvn4d9rmcnv73pbl@4ax.com> References: <20080728141324.43AF820A33@qs281.pair.com> <5lur84prkh8i7ov5lnnvn4d9rmcnv73pbl@4ax.com> Message-ID: <20080729150321.7A12C20A33@qs281.pair.com> (green cheek conures? Had to look that one up :) Yeah, I kinda forgot that one too, even tho I have contact cleaner, I always forget to use it ;) (applied, nothing changed except now my kid got a hold of an unused swab and is chasing the cat with it) Still, kinda weird to have simultaneous failures on two different computers/tapedecks/cables. Digging out my CoCo 1 now, before I give up & break out the soldering iron ;) =M0= >No, but the pins in the din connector on the cable and Coco need >cleaning. > >I have to use some contact cleaner on all the connectors, inside and >out, every so often to keep my Coco3 working. > >Stephen >-- > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From alxevans at concentric.net Tue Jul 29 11:16:46 2008 From: alxevans at concentric.net (Theodore (Alex) Evans) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:16:46 -0500 Subject: [Coco] maps Message-ID: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> tonym wrote: > This one is REALLY old already, but still a bit strange. > > This is a US Navy building, i believe: > > http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&t=k&ll=32.676147,-117.157743&spn=0.001508,0.002596&om=1 > > > > Tony > > -----Original Message----- > From: George Ramsower georgeramsower at gmail.com > Sent 7/27/2008 6:24:36 PM > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com > Subject: Re: [Coco] maps > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Taylor" I think I found an > extra hobby :) > > Here's another example... > It's somebody about ~20 miles from the plane crash. Just keep zooming > until you see it. > > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=27.412442,-81.277169&spn=71.456872,151.171875&z=3 > > > I imagine that without an established database of cool Earth sites > and objects to see on this map, that finding things on your own would > be like finding a minnow in the ocean. However, I did find the ski > boat by mistake. You can even see that it was a windy day on the water. > > Hey, somebody put a CoCo out in their backyard and give us the > coordinates. > > I looked at my place and apparently, these are old images. I started > improving my property back in early 2003. This image was made prior to > that. > http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=29.928355,-98.399279&spn=0.002092,0.003272&z=18&layer=t > > > George > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: > 270.5.6/1577 - Release Date: 7/28/2008 6:55 AM > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco There were a number of government buldings built with similar configurations to use space efficiently, some have been remodeled since more people started seeing what they look like from the air (or space). From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 29 18:24:39 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 15:24:39 -0700 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> References: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> Message-ID: <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> I was surprised to see that building un-modified, it was remodeled in like 2006, no? >There were a number of government buldings built with similar >configurations to use space efficiently, some have been remodeled >since more people started seeing what they look like from the air (or space). > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From mdelyea at gmail.com Tue Jul 29 18:45:37 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:45:37 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807291545q253f25abk6349f28ebb7cd4cb@mail.gmail.com> Vas ist? On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:24 PM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > I was surprised to see that building un-modified, it was remodeled in like > 2006, no? > >> There were a number of government buldings built with similar >> configurations to use space efficiently, some have been remodeled since more >> people started seeing what they look like from the air (or space). >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > > > -- > Coco mailing list > Coco at maltedmedia.com > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco > From mdelyea at gmail.com Tue Jul 29 18:46:01 2008 From: mdelyea at gmail.com (mike delyea) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 18:46:01 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807291545q253f25abk6349f28ebb7cd4cb@mail.gmail.com> References: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> <1b52e6c80807291545q253f25abk6349f28ebb7cd4cb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1b52e6c80807291546m2391dc5fs53843d9933abd39b@mail.gmail.com> That was a joke people. On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:45 PM, mike delyea wrote: > Vas ist? > > On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:24 PM, Mike 0rtloff wrote: >> I was surprised to see that building un-modified, it was remodeled in like >> 2006, no? >> >>> There were a number of government buldings built with similar >>> configurations to use space efficiently, some have been remodeled since more >>> people started seeing what they look like from the air (or space). >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Coco mailing list >>> Coco at maltedmedia.com >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> >> >> -- >> Coco mailing list >> Coco at maltedmedia.com >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco >> > From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 29 19:52:20 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 16:52:20 -0700 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807291546m2391dc5fs53843d9933abd39b@mail.gmail.co m> References: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> <1b52e6c80807291545q253f25abk6349f28ebb7cd4cb@mail.gmail.com> <1b52e6c80807291546m2391dc5fs53843d9933abd39b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080729235216.358A020A33@qs281.pair.com> At 03:46 PM 7/29/2008, you wrote: >That was a joke people. Joke? The building actually exists, looks like that and freaked people out - so they altered it. Interesting, but dryly humorous :^/ =M0= From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 29 19:55:44 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 19:55:44 -0400 Subject: [Coco] maps In-Reply-To: <1b52e6c80807291546m2391dc5fs53843d9933abd39b@mail.gmail.com> References: <488F345E.9020803@concentric.net> <20080729222435.76BD420A33@qs281.pair.com> <1b52e6c80807291545q253f25abk6349f28ebb7cd4cb@mail.gmail.com> <1b52e6c80807291546m2391dc5fs53843d9933abd39b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1217375744.2859.0.camel@dev> On Tue, 2008-07-29 at 18:46 -0400, mike delyea wrote: > That was a joke people. > > On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:45 PM, mike delyea wrote: > > Vas ist? > > How can you joke about such a thing? I am _horribly_ offended by your poor German spelling... C. ;) From underserf at comcast.net Tue Jul 29 20:00:02 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 17:00:02 -0700 Subject: [Coco] NitrOS9 $? Message-ID: <20080730000011.6C46720A33@qs281.pair.com> Everything below this first paragraph is by way of explanation, the main question now (after 3 different 360k drives, all sans warrantee of course, died or DOA'ed) is how much would whoever charge for a couple bootable NitrOS9 system disks, set up to do whatever it takes to speak to DriveWire, one on a 35tSS, & one 40tDS? I've tried a bunch of different variations on creating a NitrOS9 bootdisk =on= the CoCo via DriveWire. I can mount the DSK image, but backing up that image to a real floppy ON a CoCo (even those formatted under OS/9 L2, 35t, SS) fails to produce a bootable disk. Do I need to use the Convert_disk routine described on Mr Boyles' site even tho this all occurs on a real CoCo? I notice that ALL the DSK images boot fine under VCC, am I stuck using the MS/AMD clone to create bootdisks using the FDrawcmd.sys & a FD on the clone? Sheesh - FIRST I gotta find a 360 that does more'n format 8^/ =M0= From cyouse at serialtechnologies.com Tue Jul 29 20:07:10 2008 From: cyouse at serialtechnologies.com (Chuck Youse) Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 20:07:10 -0400 Subject: [Coco] NitrOS9 $? In-Reply-To: <20080730000011.6C46720A33@qs281.pair.com> References: <20080730000011.6C46720A33@qs281.pair.com> Message-ID: <1217376430.2859.2.camel@dev> On Tue, 2008-07-29 at 17:00 -0700, Mike 0rtloff wrote: > Everything below this first paragraph is by way of explanation, the > main question now (after 3 different 360k drives, all sans warrantee > of course, died or DOA'ed) is how much would whoever charge for a > couple bootable NitrOS9 system disks, set up to do whatever it takes > to speak to DriveWire, one on a 35tSS, & one 40tDS? > > I've tried a bunch of different variations on creating a NitrOS9 > bootdisk =on= the CoCo via DriveWire. > > I can mount the DSK image, but backing up that image to a real floppy > ON a CoCo (even those formatted under OS/9 L2, 35t, SS) fails to > produce a bootable disk. > > Do I need to use the Convert_disk routine described on Mr Boyles' > site even tho this all occurs on a real CoCo? > > I notice that ALL the DSK images boot fine under VCC, am I stuck > using the MS/AMD clone to create bootdisks using the FDrawcmd.sys & a > FD on the clone? Sheesh - FIRST I gotta find a 360 that does more'n format 8^/ > > =M0= I'd be more than happy to help; unfortunately I don't have a license for DriveWire so I'm not sure I can legally be of assistance ... Grr.. C. From underserf at comcast.net Wed Jul 30 18:12:48 2008 From: underserf at comcast.net (Mike 0rtloff) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:12:48 -0700 Subject: [Coco] NitrOS9 $? In-Reply-To: <1217376430.2859.2.camel@dev> References: <20080730000011.6C46720A33@qs281.pair.com> <1217376430.2859.2.camel@dev> Message-ID: <20080730221244.A9FA820A33@qs281.pair.com> Somehow I missed page 6 of the DW manual (I was stuck in the HDB-DOS manual) So I've got my CoCo running NitrOS-9, very kewl, been a long time since I've run OS/9 but it's coming back. Should be able to figure out a bootdisk now ;) bleh =M0= >I'd be more than happy to help; unfortunately I don't have a license for >DriveWire so I'm not sure I can legally be of assistance ... > >Grr.. >C. From tonym at compusource.net Wed Jul 30 22:46:27 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:46:27 GMT Subject: [Coco] NitrOS9 $? Message-ID: <200807302246644.SM07112@[63.69.23.239]> You can also get the SuperDriver disk from Cloud9. Basically a ready-to-go boot disk with NitrOS9 Mark/Boisy wanna chime in? Tony -----Original Message----- From: Mike 0rtloff underserf at comcast.net Sent 7/30/2008 6:12:48 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com Subject: Re: [Coco] NitrOS9 $? Somehow I missed page 6 of the DW manual (I was stuck in the HDB-DOS manual) So I've got my CoCo running NitrOS-9, very kewl, been a long time since I've run OS/9 but it's coming back. Should be able to figure out a bootdisk now ;) bleh =M0 I'd be more than happy to help; unfortunately I don't have a license for DriveWire so I'm not sure I can legally be of assistance ... Grr.. C. -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco From alsplace at pobox.com Wed Jul 30 22:52:01 2008 From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 21:52:01 -0500 Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... In-Reply-To: <200807302246644.SM07112@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200807302246644.SM07112@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <6245D3D0-6C1A-4C80-8581-9E0D6ADEC1E2@pobox.com> When I was using the CoCo full-time, one of the things I spent the most time on was doing music in Musica 2, Bells & Whistles, and other music programs. I was a big fan of computer music, which led me to get in to musical keyboards, synthesizers, sequencers, etc. Ten years ago, I joined my love of Disney theme parks with music and did some arrangements of Disney ride songs, like the one from the Pirates of the Caribbean ride. That file has been on my website for ages, and has spread all over. Imagine my surprise when I heard it being used in an arcade crane game last month! The story here: http://www.disneyfans.com/audio/pirateschest.htm -- Allen From tonym at compusource.net Wed Jul 30 23:18:01 2008 From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:18:01 GMT Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... Message-ID: <200807302318722.SM01924@[63.69.23.239]> -----Original Message----- >From: Allen Huffman alsplace at pobox.com >Sent 7/30/2008 10:52:01 PM >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts coco at maltedmedia.com >Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... > >When I was using the CoCo full-time, one of the things I spent the >most time on was doing music in Musica 2, Bells & Whistles, and other >music programs. I was a big fan of computer music, which led me to get >in to musical keyboards, synthesizers, sequencers, etc. Ten years >ago, I joined my love of Disney theme parks with music and did some >arrangements of Disney ride songs, like the one from the Pirates of >the Caribbean ride. > >That file has been on my website for ages, and has spread all over. >Imagine my surprise when I heard it being used in an arcade crane game >last month! The story here: > >http://www.disneyfans.com/audio/pirateschest.htm > >-- Allen > Hmmm.......no royalty checks? Tony From tjseagrove at writeme.com Wed Jul 30 23:41:30 2008 From: tjseagrove at writeme.com (Tom Seagrove) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:41:30 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... In-Reply-To: <6245D3D0-6C1A-4C80-8581-9E0D6ADEC1E2@pobox.com> References: <200807302246644.SM07112@[63.69.23.239]> <6245D3D0-6C1A-4C80-8581-9E0D6ADEC1E2@pobox.com> Message-ID: <006601c8f2bf$51cc06a0$f56413e0$@com> Let us know when you update your website with more info.... Tom -----Original Message----- From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On Behalf Of Allen Huffman Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 10:52 PM To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... When I was using the CoCo full-time, one of the things I spent the most time on was doing music in Musica 2, Bells & Whistles, and other music programs. I was a big fan of computer music, which led me to get in to musical keyboards, synthesizers, sequencers, etc. Ten years ago, I joined my love of Disney theme parks with music and did some arrangements of Disney ride songs, like the one from the Pirates of the Caribbean ride. That file has been on my website for ages, and has spread all over. Imagine my surprise when I heard it being used in an arcade crane game last month! The story here: http://www.disneyfans.com/audio/pirateschest.htm -- Allen -- Coco mailing list Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.7/1581 - Release Date: 7/30/2008 6:56 AM From rcrislip at neo.rr.com Thu Jul 31 01:41:04 2008 From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (richec) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 01:41:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... In-Reply-To: <200807302318722.SM01924@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200807302318722.SM01924@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <200807310141.04928.rcrislip@neo.rr.com> I played it. Nice tune, I always like that riff. The movies were cool too 8-). From dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com Thu Jul 31 07:22:52 2008 From: dennis-ix at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 07:22:52 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Off topic - my music in an arcade crane game... In-Reply-To: <200807302318722.SM01924@[63.69.23.239]> References: <200807302318722.SM01924@[63.69.23.239]> Message-ID: <200807311123.m6VBNcLX006335@tv-failover-01.trans-video.net> At 11:18 PM 7/30/2008, you wrote: >Hmmm.......no royalty checks? Not likely! Royalties on arrangements only go to the original composer. :) Dennis From devries.bob at gmail.com Thu Jul 31 19:47:17 2008 From: devries.bob at gmail.com (Bob Devries) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 09:47:17 +1000 Subject: [Coco] Coco up & running Message-ID: <005e01c8f367$c630ff20$0701a8c0@master> Well, after my sojourn to the Philippines, I have my coco set up and running again. I've done some rearrangements of the furniture and it's now easier to get to and use. Hmm, need to replace the battery in the 4-in-1 I think. The clock was wrong when I powered up. -- Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me the capacity to be his spokesman, so that I know how to help the weary. website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ From gene.heskett at verizon.net Thu Jul 31 22:03:04 2008 From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 22:03:04 -0400 Subject: [Coco] Coco up & running In-Reply-To: <005e01c8f367$c630ff20$0701a8c0@master> References: <005e01c8f367$c630ff20$0701a8c0@master> Message-ID: <200807312203.04890.gene.heskett@verizon.net> On Thursday 31 July 2008, Bob Devries wrote: >Well, after my sojourn to the Philippines, I have my coco set up and running >again. I've done some rearrangements of the furniture and it's now easier to >get to and use. > >Hmm, need to replace the battery in the 4-in-1 I think. The clock was wrong >when I powered up. Check it with a meter before you condem it Bob, the 4n1 has no protection from power up/down glitches, and will get itself trashed in my experience, about once in every 5 power cycles. >-- >Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia > >Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me >the capacity to be his spokesman, >so that I know how to help the weary. > >website: http://www.home.gil.com.au/~bdevasl >my blog: http://bdevries.invigorated.org/ > > >-- >Coco mailing list >Coco at maltedmedia.com >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Prejudice: A vagrant opinion without visible means of support. -- Ambrose Bierce