[Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Is this a discussion about a new Coco?

[Vern Burke]

So where's your great version? You're so critical about how Mark
is doing it, but I don't see any rubber meeting the road.

So, big fat hairy deal you made something for a completely different
computer and sold more of them. Put up or shut up here and now.

Vern

PS Yes, I'm one of the pre-orders for the SuperBoard.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Diffendaffer" <jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>
To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:45 PM
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Is this a discussion about a new Coco?



>

>

>

> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mark Marlette <mark at c...> wrote:

> > At 10:36 AM 4/18/2005, you wrote:

> > that includes all of the options, including the Ethernet. The

> Ethernet chip

> > alone costs well over $65 and that doesn't include the support

> chips. Then

>

>

> Oh please... $65?  What chip are you using?  There are pleanty of

> controller chips for under $15 in single quantity... not my fault if

> you chose an expensive one.  Geeze... a Coldfire CPU with built in

> ethernet, USB and PCI is less than $40 in small quantity!  I could

> build a board based on a coldfire and a couple PCI chips, a PLD and

> emulate the $%#& thing cheaper and faster.

>

> If you integrate everything onto a larger PLD you can do everything

> that was posted with that list for under $100 cost.  Cost is what I

> was talking about.  The reduced cost of the board + chips will make up

> for the large PLD.  Most of the parts on that list for the Superboard

> are on the Open Cores site!

>

> Cloud-9 is charging over $100 for an IDE board! IDE!!!!  And we're not

> talking about UDMA here either.  All that requires is to adjust some

> buss logic and decode the address!  It requires around 4 TTL chips (if

> you don't overdesign the thing) for under $10 at Radio Shack!

>

> I did a price check on getting an IDE/USB board printed.  It was under

> $17 each in quantity 20 and that was the first quote with solder mask.

>  If I were to order 100, drop solder mask and shop around it's

> probably under $10.  The chips + connectors are under $20 in quantity 1.

>

> > add in the cost of the PCB board, CPLDs which are in the $8-11 range

> each

> > which there are 4-6 of them on the board.  As you can see without

> evening

> > spending a whole a lot of time on it that the price goes up very

> fast. You

> > must have been a sleep that day in Business Economics. Prove me

> wrong and

> > send me the product. You can't.

>

> You must have been asleep in Business Economics.  There isn't enough

> of a CoCo market to waste building a business on.  It's not like they

> are making new CoCo's.  Your trying to turn a hobby into a business...

> which is ok but don't claim it's more than it is.

>

> > It is easier for you to sit back and do

> > nothing but critique other peoples work and say it is too expensive.

> >

> > I can tell by your previous posts that you have done VERY little with

> > developing products.

>

> I used to own a company that built hardware for the Amiga, some of

> which I designed, I know what I'm talking about.  We were selling more

> hardware in a week that Cloud-9 has sold since it was started.

> A.I.R. sold over $750,000 worth of product (1 product) in the first 6

> months and it took us over half of that time just to build up

> manufacturing ability and a dealer network.  At the time I sold out we

> were doing about $90,000 per month and had 4(?) products.

>

> BTW, we were paying under $2/board on a circuit board about half the

> size this IDE/USB board would be.

>

> > You want to use discrete components rather than

> > current technology. As that is you choice, I have DONE both and this

> is a

>

> You want to use PLDs so people can't copy your design.  I want to

> design something someone can download the design, print their own

> circuit board and use off the shelf parts on.  Totally different goal.

>  If I wanted to make my life easier I'd use the PLD and forget having

> to worry about how to fit all the parts in such a small space.

>

> For something like the Superboard I'd use a larger PLD instead of

> multiple small PLDs since it will be smaller for about the same price.

>

> > I have fifty-seven down payments for the SuperBoard with many follow on

> > orders.

>

> WOW!  57!!!!  That's smaller than what A.I.R.'s first order was (200)

> and the next week it was twice that.  Within 2 months we had to hire

> people to assemble our stuff.

>

> > I'm not taking anymore down payments as the initial price to

> > produce has been met. Maybe you have more business sense than I do

> or just

> > have more money to throw around? Can you put out over $5700 to

> produce this

> > ONE board? Remember we produce more than this one board. I'll do the

> math

> > for you.... 57 * $100(your price) = $5700. I used $100, even though

> it is

> > more expensive than that. You would go broke because you will loose

> money

> > on every board sold. This is a hobby business for me, love and

> passion of

>

> I was talking cost.  Distributor markup should be at least 50%, dealer

> markup should be at least 75% and direct sales should be 100%.

>

> > the machine. I can't afford to make those types of errors and be around

> > here very long.

>

> And is this business you've been running as a hobby paying your bills?

>  Do you have another job?

>

> > We have been around and will continue to be around because

> > of the thought and planning that goes in to each and every product

> we produce.

>

> Marketing BS.  If you had to live off of Cloud-9 you'd starve and if

> you died would the company be around to take care of your customers

> tomorrow?

>

> > With the given facts, you are WAY off base on your price and statement.

>

> According to you... a guy that will spend $65 on an ethernet

> controller and who sells an IDE board for $100.

>

>

>

>

>

>

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