[arg_discuss] ARG SIG Conference

[libfli at aol.com]

 or what about making an effort to have ARGs have a larger presence @GDC?? 
since that is already an established conference & it might be a great way to have
many people learn more about this world.? kinda


like GDC Mobile - maybe there could be GDC Xmedia day (w/ARGs a part of it)





-----Original Message-----




From: Michael Monello <mmonello at campfirenyc.com>


To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG <arg_discuss at igda.org>


Sent: Thu, Aug 6, 2009 8:10 pm


Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Conference
















Well there ya go. The idea of tracts crosses streams. I agree that adding tracts 



to ARGFest is the way to do it, and will expand the community. And of course an 



education tract, which I didn't mention!







-Mike











On 8/6/09 11:39 PM, "Burcu Bakioglu" <bbakiogl at gmail.com> wrote:







Michele, I am not sure you are correct in your perception of not being able



to add more panels without cutting into the social time. If there is any



group of people who like there social time and like to throw extravagant



parties, it is the Second Life community. These people like to party and



socialize till death. I mean we all got back from ARGFest about several



weeks ago, and I bet none of our lives have been disrupted after that. When



I go to SLCC, I literally don't sleep for three days lest I miss something,



panel or otherwise. So when I get back, I need to recover for a week, but I



made so many new connections and established my old connections.







When I first started going to SLCC, I went there to establish connections so



I can figure out who to contact for interviews with the griefer community.



This was 2005, SL community was relatively small, the convention in SF was



very small. There were two track of panels that lasted half a day, I think.



We had about 100 people in the educator's list that year. In three years,



the population in the educator's list exploded to over a million.



Researcher's list was added. Other tracks were added, such as community



track and business track. But still to this day, the educator's track is by



far the strongest part of SLCC.







When I came to Portland I saw a convention similar to 2005 SLCC. Trust me,



this is not preteen stage, we need to give it a big push. With proper



funding and strategy, this community will explode, hell it is already



exploding. Back then, virtual worlds was the big thing, and it got bigger



when it was appropriated for educational, business, and entertainment



purposes. Now ARGs are in that same position. That is why ARGFest should not



limit itself with the unfiction community and rather expand. Unless it



expands to areas of research, businesss, education, entertainment, the



festival will seriously run the risk of dimishing due to lack of funding and



such. I understand it first started because a group of unfiction people



wanted to meet in RL and that is fine for then. But now it needs to expand.



Community is great, activities are great, but they need to be somehow



rendered legitimate. For example, I gave two talks in SLCC and I can put



that in my CV, others get grants and funding for their research and projects



in SL. They gives everything in SL some kind of a legitimacy. That gives me



funding, that gets me hired, so I have a vested interest in following



everyting in SL and keeping my communication alive. 2/3 of my connections on



Twitter/FAcebook and other social networks is from SL. ARGFest needs to step



up into that position. Trust me, social time won't go away when you add more



panels. The participants may lose sleep for a night or two not to miss



anything. But the festival will gain legitimacy and people will have reason



to participate in it. Which is not that bad if you ask me... But of course,



ARG sig conference can and will step into that position too. The question



is, will ARGFest become a part of it. It should because it is one of the



better solidified ARG communities if you ask me. There's also, what, Anchor



Cove? We all need these under one roof. We need something that would give



everyone a reason to come. Noone has the time or the money to follow



everything ARG. Why force them to make a decision like this? We need to have



a united thing. The segmented communities can happen in their own sites,



such as unfiction, anchor cove, etc... But we need to celebrate everything



ARG together. That's why I like the title ARGFest. While we are going there



to celebrate everything ARG, we should be able to come out of there with



useful ideas, theory, reseach, case studies, connections, etc...







Let's keep the big picture in mind here, folks :)







Yours trully,







The renegade :P







On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 9:34 PM, Michelle Senderhauf <varineq at gmail.com>wrote:








> My first thoughts were - Oh my god, no!  What will it do to ARGfest?





>  Surely, all of the developers will stop coming!  Then where will the





> panels





> be?  Then players who want to meet developers will have to choose between





> the two and will surely go to ARG-SIG. Then ARGfest will slowly die...





> nooooooooo!





> Then I got over it.





>





> I think ARGfest is still in its awkward preteen years.  We want more





> panels,





> but can't add them without cutting into social time.  I'd love to have





> workshops and more casual discussions (the best discussions I heard all





> weekend were when 15 or so people were sitting in the hospitality room on





> Sunday night), but if we add them we're again cutting into social time.





>  Many of the players can't attend a conference that stretches into the





> week,





> so we can't really add more days of panels.  So what does ARGfest want to





> be





> when it grows up?  A serious conference or a social event (or can it be





> both





> as it grows)?  Also, does it want to be an event for both players and





> developers?





>





> The one thing I have to ask is why not just have the conferences in the





> same





> place and avoid separating the audience?  You could have the





> ARG-SIG-DEV-CON





> (ha! that's a horrible name) during the week and end it with ARGfest on the





> weekend.  Plenty of professional conferences are during the week, so I





> would





> think most developers wouldn't have a problem attending.  Then they would





> have the option for staying an extra day or two to hang out socially with





> the players (or attend any player-focused panels).  Players who really want





> to attend the professional portion of the conference could arrive a day or





> two early.





>





> Michelle





>





>





>





>





>





>





> On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 7:41 PM, Brooke Thompson <brooke at giantmice.com





> >wrote:





>





> > Oh, yeah, I got what you were saying and I do share your worry about what





> a





> > second conference could do to ARGFest. The strange mix of an audience





> that





> > it attracts is part of it's charm, for m. It's an environment that I'm





> very





> > keen to nurture. Which is why I'm so sensitive to the "closed" and





> > "exclusive" talk - but also why l really appreciate the feedback :)





> >





> > I think that's why I lean towards the ARG SIG conference being about





> > reaching out to a more professional audience. Not that I'd want it to be





> > stodgy or anything, but it seems to fit the "mission" of the SIG while





> also





> > making it more distinct from ARGFest. But that does raise the concern





> over





> > what it would do to the professional & acadmic sorts that would go to





> > ARGFest but can't quite justify two ARG-centric conferences.





> >





> >





> >





> >





> >





> >





> >





> >





> >





> > On Aug 6, 2009, at 8:06 PM, Burcu Bakioglu wrote:





> >





> >  Oh Brooke, I totally understand why you got defensive. I was referring





> to





> >> the characterizations, hence i put it in quotation marks... Even Wendy





> >> kinda





> >> mentioned in her email that ARGFest is a tight-knit community.  I heard





> >> this





> >> remark and those like others from other people as well. But even so,





> >> you're





> >> right, in that there was a great eclectic group there in Portland this





> >> year.





> >> I guess my worry is that creating an alternative conference would erode





> >> this





> >> just beginning eclectic environment. Does this make sense?





> >>





> >> Now having said that, I have to admit, that suspecting a certain kind of





> a





> >> reaction from the audience, I did refrain from voicing some opinions I





> had





> >> as least publicly. Because I knew that those opinions would not have





> >> perceived positively within the unfiction community, because they have





> >> certain rules of engagement. They know what is acceptable and not





> >> accepable





> >> in their community. So I didn't muddy the waters...





> >>





> >> So your point is well taken and we should not be eager to categorize a





> >> group





> >> that easily. But even as we throw these labels around, we don't realize





> >> that





> >> we are falling into similar traps. That was main point.





> >>





> >> b.





> >>





> >> On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 7:54 PM, Brooke Thompson <brooke at giantmice.com





> >> >wrote:





> >>





> >>  I'm sure y'all are expecting this seeing as I'm not all that quiet and





> >>> have





> >>> somehow found myself on the organizational committees of ARGFest and





> the





> >>> ARG





> >>> SIG conference (hows does this happen?! i just wanted to help moderate





> a





> >>> couple threads, that is all)





> >>>





> >>> I, too, wonder how the conferences would effect each other - would one





> >>> pull





> >>> from the other? would they enhance each other? is there room for two?





> is





> >>> there something to be gained or lost by the influence of the player





> >>> enthusiast types? etc etc. So this discussion is really great. But...





> >>>





> >>> I've got to get a bit defensive over the bit about ARGFest being





> labelled





> >>> as closed and exclusive.





> >>>





> >>> Unfiction started one night in a chat channel when two friends said





> "hey!





> >>> we should meet for beers!" and a couple more said "oh hey! what about





> >>> me!" -





> >>> and a couple weeks later, 15 people showed up in Vegas. A couple months





> >>> later, we met up again in Orlando and like 10 more people showed up -





> >>> whoa.





> >>> Two years later, we thought it'd be cool to see if we could meet the





> guys





> >>> who did AotH & PerplexCity but "hey, they probably won't know about





> this,





> >>> so





> >>> let's invite them and give them a reason to come". The conference was





> >>> born.





> >>> (ok, it wasn't exactly like that, but pretty darn close... it was born





> >>> out





> >>> of a desire to be anything but exclusive, it was about being inclusive





> >>> and





> >>> meeting new people!)





> >>>





> >>> It is still run by the community leaders at unfiction (the organizing





> >>> team





> >>> this year was the admins and a few portland locals) and, yes, our first





> >>> thoughts always go to the community that we are a part of - but we do





> >>> look





> >>> beyond that and try to be quite welcoming. Not only because we're





> >>> friendly





> >>> folk, but because we want to get to know others and we want them to get





> >>> to





> >>> know us. We don't want to be this exclusive little club; we want to





> meet





> >>> and





> >>> get to know the Brian Clarks and Mike Monellos and Yomi Ayenis and





> Jeromy





> >>> Barbers and Non Chalances of the world. It doesn't matter if they're on





> >>> unfiction or, even, if they've ever heard of it. We think it's kinda





> cool





> >>> that some have gone on to become fairly active on the UF forums, but





> the





> >>> ARG





> >>> Community is so much more than that and relationships made at ARGFest





> >>> have





> >>> continued to bloom on twitter and facebook and some have even grown





> into





> >>> collaborations. Which is really kinda cool when you think that a lot of





> >>> these people didn't know each other before ARGFest and many people were





> >>> fairly unaware of and/or unknown by unfiction just a couple months





> before





> >>> ARGFest.





> >>>





> >>> There may be a lot of traditions and cultural mores and whatnot, but I





> >>> think that's just as true of any conference of this size no matter if





> it





> >>> comes out of a online message board or a professional organization.





> And,





> >>> you





> >>> might be surprised by just how un-unfiction the conference really is.





> We





> >>> haven't gotten the survey out there yet (small and exhausted volunteer





> >>> team...  it's coming) but my guess is that it was about 60/40 on the





> >>> attendees who would self-identify as being a part of the UF community.





> >>>





> >>> I think it's just at a funny size with a strange mix of players and





> >>> designers, hobbyists and professionals - which makes it quite hard to





> >>> describe and/or provide focus for. But it also makes for a great and





> >>> unique





> >>> event filled with all sorts of new (and old) perspectives.





> >>>





> >>> Defensive bit over... I'm absolutely loving this feedback (even if I





> >>> disagree with the premise). It is awesome! I would very much like to





> see





> >>> a





> >>> lot more of it :)





> >>>





> >>> _______________________________________________





> >>> ARG_Discuss mailing list





> >>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org





> >>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss





> >>>





> >>>





> >>





> >>





> >> --





> >> Thanks,</burcu>





> >>





> >> Burcu S. Bakioglu, Ph.D.





> >>





> >> http://www.palefirer.com





> >> http://palefirer.com/blog/





> >> Skype: PaleFireR





> >> AIM: PaleFireR





> >>





> >> --





> >> "Congratulations! You're the first human to fail the Turing test."





> >> _______________________________________________





> >> ARG_Discuss mailing list





> >> ARG_Discuss at igda.org





> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss





> >>





> >





> > _______________________________________________





> > ARG_Discuss mailing list





> > ARG_Discuss at igda.org





> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss





> >





> _______________________________________________





> ARG_Discuss mailing list





> ARG_Discuss at igda.org





> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss





>
















--



Thanks,</burcu>







Burcu S. Bakioglu, Ph.D.







http://www.palefirer.com



http://palefirer.com/blog/



Skype: PaleFireR



AIM: PaleFireR







--



"Congratulations! You're the first human to fail the Turing test."



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