From btradish at earthlink.net  Tue Sep  2 04:55:16 2008
From: btradish at earthlink.net (John Evans)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 04:55:16 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] NYTimes: Book series with web component,
	also serialized TV
Message-ID: <8731609.1220345716470.JavaMail.root@mswamui-backed.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Today's New York Times has a couple of articles that it seemed like those on
this list might find interesting. You can read them free online (although
I suspect they get archived in the members-only section after a while).

"Author of Book Series Sends Kids on a Web Treasure Hunt"

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/books/02rior.html?ref=arts

"Scholastic has deployed its considerable marketing fire power behind the new series, which is tied to a Web-based game (www.the39clues.com) and collectors? cards. The publisher, which thrived on the enormous success of the Harry Potter novels, is now facing the reality that many children are now as engrossed in the Internet and video games as they are in books.

?The idea is that every aspect will add to the storytelling in its own way,? said David Levithan, an executive editorial director for multimedia publishing at Scholastic. ?The Web or card experience is not at all going to replicate the book experience, nor is the book experience going to replicate the Web.?"

And, maybe not quite as ARG-focused but possibly still interesting:

"Television Keeps a Hand in the Online Game With Serialized Shows"

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/arts/television/02seri.html?ref=arts

"What ?N.? really demonstrates is that the Internet could use more Stephen King. The story, involving therapy, obsessive-compulsive disorder and an evil presence trapped in a New England field, is C-grade King. (It was adapted for the serial by Marc Guggenheim, a creator of ?Eli Stone.?) But it still has enough narrative pull to drag you from snippet to snippet, even when there?s less than a minute of new material."

--
John Evans
Chaoseed Software - http://chaoseed.com


From adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com  Tue Sep  2 11:29:30 2008
From: adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com (Adam Martin)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 16:29:30 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG finishing today, I think?
Message-ID: <ca93830d0809020829u2fd3cd0dnb37adaa470869465@mail.gmail.com>

I've just been reminiscing about Develop with Margaret Robertson, who
gave a talk about the future of ARGs, with a miniARG in her talk.
Judging from the anxiety in the air, I think the denouement may be
extremely imminent, so if you're not doing anything in the next hour
and you're in London, it might be worth taking a look.  Slides from
the talk are her - which is here (
http://www.omicronpie.com/Develop08%20ARG.pdf )

From sande at samugames.com  Tue Sep  2 12:15:00 2008
From: sande at samugames.com (Sande Chen)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 12:15:00 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] NYTimes: Book series with web component,
	also serialized TV
In-Reply-To: <mailman.7.1220364005.5053.arg_discuss@igda.org>
References: <mailman.7.1220364005.5053.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <48BD6684.4020904@samugames.com>

Yes, I have heard about the Scholastic project.  Maybe they'll do a MMO?


Sande



----------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 04:55:16 -0400 (EDT)
> From: John Evans <btradish at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [arg_discuss] NYTimes: Book series with web component,	also
> 	serialized TV
> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG <arg_discuss at igda.org>
> Message-ID:
> 	<8731609.1220345716470.JavaMail.root at mswamui-backed.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> Today's New York Times has a couple of articles that it seemed like those on
> this list might find interesting. You can read them free online (although
> I suspect they get archived in the members-only section after a while).
> 
> "Author of Book Series Sends Kids on a Web Treasure Hunt"
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/books/02rior.html?ref=arts
> 
> "Scholastic has deployed its considerable marketing fire power behind the new series, which is tied to a Web-based game (www.the39clues.com) and collectors? cards. The publisher, which thrived on the enormous success of the Harry Potter novels, is now facing the reality that many children are now as engrossed in the Internet and video games as they are in books.
> 
> ?The idea is that every aspect will add to the storytelling in its own way,? said David Levithan, an executive editorial director for multimedia publishing at Scholastic. ?The Web or card experience is not at all going to replicate the book experience, nor is the book experience going to replicate the Web.?"
> 
> And, maybe not quite as ARG-focused but possibly still interesting:
> 
> "Television Keeps a Hand in the Online Game With Serialized Shows"
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/arts/television/02seri.html?ref=arts
> 
> "What ?N.? really demonstrates is that the Internet could use more Stephen King. The story, involving therapy, obsessive-compulsive disorder and an evil presence trapped in a New England field, is C-grade King. (It was adapted for the serial by Marc Guggenheim, a creator of ?Eli Stone.?) But it still has enough narrative pull to drag you from snippet to snippet, even when there?s less than a minute of new material."
> 
> --
> John Evans
> Chaoseed Software - http://chaoseed.com
> 

From adrian at mssv.net  Thu Sep  4 09:11:11 2008
From: adrian at mssv.net (Adrian Hon)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 14:11:11 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
Message-ID: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

Anyone going to Austin GDC this year? I'm giving a talk about our We
Tell Stories project on Wednesday, and it'd be nice to meet up with
anyone else there.

Cheers,

Adrian

-- 
Adrian Hon - mssv.net
Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org

From andrhia at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 09:44:26 2008
From: andrhia at gmail.com (Andrea Phillips)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 09:44:26 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
Message-ID: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com>

Aloha!

So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice thing
to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody who
happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
However, in order to encourage people to all get together
periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these informal
chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.

Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US; 8:00
Friday morning in Sydney.

Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions

Hope to see you there!
-- 
Andrea Phillips
http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
Words * Culture * Interaction

From agent.lex at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 10:36:51 2008
From: agent.lex at gmail.com (Agent Lex)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 15:36:51 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
In-Reply-To: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>

Either you sent that out an hour and 45 after it started, or you got  
your time conversion wrong. Assuming 1800 Eastern, it would be 2300 UK  
and 1500 Pacific. Not sure about Oz.

- Lex

Sent from my iPhone

On 4 Sep 2008, at 14:44, "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com> wrote:

> Aloha!
>
> So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice thing
> to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody who
> happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
> However, in order to encourage people to all get together
> periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these informal
> chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.
>
> Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US; 8:00
> Friday morning in Sydney.
>
> Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
> http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions
>
> Hope to see you there!
> -- 
> Andrea Phillips
> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
> Words * Culture * Interaction
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss

From andrhia at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 10:43:38 2008
From: andrhia at gmail.com (Andrea Phillips)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:43:38 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
In-Reply-To: <C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
References: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com>
	<C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5c799fd60809040743i55d5eb9dkafc41e169b521678@mail.gmail.com>

Doh! You're right, of course. They just shouldn't let me do math.

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:36 AM, Agent Lex <agent.lex at gmail.com> wrote:
> Either you sent that out an hour and 45 after it started, or you got your
> time conversion wrong. Assuming 1800 Eastern, it would be 2300 UK and 1500
> Pacific. Not sure about Oz.
>
> - Lex
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 4 Sep 2008, at 14:44, "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Aloha!
>>
>> So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice thing
>> to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody who
>> happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
>> However, in order to encourage people to all get together
>> periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these informal
>> chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.
>>
>> Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US; 8:00
>> Friday morning in Sydney.
>>
>> Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
>>
>> http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions
>>
>> Hope to see you there!
>> --
>> Andrea Phillips
>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>



-- 
Andrea Phillips
http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
Words * Culture * Interaction

From me at addlepated.net  Thu Sep  4 10:50:48 2008
From: me at addlepated.net (D. Cook)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 09:50:48 -0500
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>
References: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <681B9A76-8128-405A-9893-BBE9EBCC096F@addlepated.net>

I won't be at the conference, but I do live in Austin, so I'd be happy  
to meet up with attendees as well.
Dee

On Sep 4, 2008, at 8:11 AM, Adrian Hon wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Anyone going to Austin GDC this year? I'm giving a talk about our We
> Tell Stories project on Wednesday, and it'd be nice to meet up with
> anyone else there.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Adrian


From sande at samugames.com  Thu Sep  4 12:07:05 2008
From: sande at samugames.com (Sande Chen)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:07:05 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] adrian@mssv.net
In-Reply-To: <mailman.9.1220536802.35544.arg_discuss@igda.org>
References: <mailman.9.1220536802.35544.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <48C007A9.8070900@samugames.com>


Yup, I'll be there.  I don't think we got a chance to sit and talk at 
SXSW.  Busy schedules.

Sande Chen

> 
>    1. Austin GDC? (Adrian Hon)
>    2. ARG SIG Informal Chat Today! (Andrea Phillips)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 14:11:11 +0100
> From: "Adrian Hon" <adrian at mssv.net>
> Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
> To: ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> Message-ID:
> 	<52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Anyone going to Austin GDC this year? I'm giving a talk about our We
> Tell Stories project on Wednesday, and it'd be nice to meet up with
> anyone else there.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Adrian
> 

-- 
Writers Cabal Blog  http://writerscabal.wordpress.com
Co-Author, Serious Games: Games That Educate, Train, and Inform
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1592006221/ref=nosim/sandechen

From voyetra at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  4 12:13:43 2008
From: voyetra at hotmail.com (Santiago Mendez)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 13:13:43 -0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
In-Reply-To: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com><C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
	<5c799fd60809040743i55d5eb9dkafc41e169b521678@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com><C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
	<5c799fd60809040743i55d5eb9dkafc41e169b521678@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY115-DS460D458E20AE58E26151AAD590@phx.gbl>

This site will probably come in handy. It's usefulness is only surpassed by 
it's incredible easiness.
http://www.clocklink.com/world_clock.php

- Sam
http://dig.mixnmojo.com/sam

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 11:43 AM
To: "Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG" <arg_discuss at igda.org>
Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!

> Doh! You're right, of course. They just shouldn't let me do math.
>
> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:36 AM, Agent Lex <agent.lex at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Either you sent that out an hour and 45 after it started, or you got your
>> time conversion wrong. Assuming 1800 Eastern, it would be 2300 UK and 
>> 1500
>> Pacific. Not sure about Oz.
>>
>> - Lex
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 4 Sep 2008, at 14:44, "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Aloha!
>>>
>>> So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice thing
>>> to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody who
>>> happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
>>> However, in order to encourage people to all get together
>>> periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these informal
>>> chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.
>>>
>>> Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US; 8:00
>>> Friday morning in Sydney.
>>>
>>> Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
>>>
>>> http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions
>>>
>>> Hope to see you there!
>>> --
>>> Andrea Phillips
>>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Andrea Phillips
> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
> Words * Culture * Interaction
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
> 

From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep  4 12:26:50 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 09:26:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-DS460D458E20AE58E26151AAD590@phx.gbl>
References: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com><C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
	<5c799fd60809040743i55d5eb9dkafc41e169b521678@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY115-DS460D458E20AE58E26151AAD590@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1890.69.144.84.21.1220545610.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Um, I'm getting "permission denied" when I try mibbit. Is it just me?

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


On Thu, September 4, 2008 9:13 am, Santiago Mendez wrote:
> This site will probably come in handy. It's usefulness is only
> surpassed by
> it's incredible easiness.
> http://www.clocklink.com/world_clock.php
>
> - Sam
> http://dig.mixnmojo.com/sam
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 11:43 AM
> To: "Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG" <arg_discuss at igda.org>
> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
>
>> Doh! You're right, of course. They just shouldn't let me do math.
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:36 AM, Agent Lex <agent.lex at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Either you sent that out an hour and 45 after it started, or you
>>> got your
>>> time conversion wrong. Assuming 1800 Eastern, it would be 2300 UK
>>> and
>>> 1500
>>> Pacific. Not sure about Oz.
>>>
>>> - Lex
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On 4 Sep 2008, at 14:44, "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Aloha!
>>>>
>>>> So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice
>>>> thing
>>>> to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody
>>>> who
>>>> happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
>>>> However, in order to encourage people to all get together
>>>> periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these
>>>> informal
>>>> chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.
>>>>
>>>> Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US;
>>>> 8:00
>>>> Friday morning in Sydney.
>>>>
>>>> Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions
>>>>
>>>> Hope to see you there!
>>>> --
>>>> Andrea Phillips
>>>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>>>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Andrea Phillips
>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep  4 13:15:03 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:15:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
In-Reply-To: <1890.69.144.84.21.1220545610.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <5c799fd60809040644u48117896l125b2024be436866@mail.gmail.com><C49B410C-91E7-4FB2-93DC-02E1AFBF67F8@gmail.com>
	<5c799fd60809040743i55d5eb9dkafc41e169b521678@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY115-DS460D458E20AE58E26151AAD590@phx.gbl>
	<1890.69.144.84.21.1220545610.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <2443.69.144.84.21.1220548503.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

I guess it was just me. It's working now.

WD


On Thu, September 4, 2008 9:26 am, Wendy Despain wrote:
> Um, I'm getting "permission denied" when I try mibbit. Is it just me?
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
>
> On Thu, September 4, 2008 9:13 am, Santiago Mendez wrote:
>> This site will probably come in handy. It's usefulness is only
>> surpassed by
>> it's incredible easiness.
>> http://www.clocklink.com/world_clock.php
>>
>> - Sam
>> http://dig.mixnmojo.com/sam
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 11:43 AM
>> To: "Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG" <arg_discuss at igda.org>
>> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG SIG Informal Chat Today!
>>
>>> Doh! You're right, of course. They just shouldn't let me do math.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:36 AM, Agent Lex <agent.lex at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Either you sent that out an hour and 45 after it started, or you
>>>> got your
>>>> time conversion wrong. Assuming 1800 Eastern, it would be 2300 UK
>>>> and
>>>> 1500
>>>> Pacific. Not sure about Oz.
>>>>
>>>> - Lex
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On 4 Sep 2008, at 14:44, "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Aloha!
>>>>>
>>>>> So in the informal chat last week, we decided it would be a nice
>>>>> thing
>>>>> to just keep the chat running any hour, day or night, for anybody
>>>>> who
>>>>> happens to have a minute. So it is said, and so it shall be done!
>>>>> However, in order to encourage people to all get together
>>>>> periodically, I'm going to try to keep up announcing these
>>>>> informal
>>>>> chats, later by 3 hours every time, to see how that goes.
>>>>>
>>>>> Today, that means 18:00 Eastern US; 13:00 UK; 21:00 Pacific US;
>>>>> 8:00
>>>>> Friday morning in Sydney.
>>>>>
>>>>> Instructions on how to get on IRC on the wiki here:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.igda.org/wiki/Alternate_Reality_Games_SIG/IRC_Chats/IRC_Instructions
>>>>>
>>>>> Hope to see you there!
>>>>> --
>>>>> Andrea Phillips
>>>>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>>>>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Andrea Phillips
>>> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
>>> Words * Culture * Interaction
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep  4 13:19:35 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:19:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>
References: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2473.69.144.84.21.1220548775.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>


I'll be in Austin. I'm also speaking. My topic isn't as interesting
though, it's about the IGDA Writing SIG. :-)

I'd love to get together sometime and have an ARG-focused conversation.

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com

On Thu, September 4, 2008 6:11 am, Adrian Hon wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Anyone going to Austin GDC this year? I'm giving a talk about our We
> Tell Stories project on Wednesday, and it'd be nice to meet up with
> anyone else there.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Adrian
>
> --
> Adrian Hon - mssv.net
> Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
> Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep  4 13:53:41 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:53:41 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] new TV show ARGs?
In-Reply-To: <2473.69.144.84.21.1220548775.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <52a6f3110809040611k2fd2f094md0f9a606aaedd317@mail.gmail.com>
	<2473.69.144.84.21.1220548775.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <2905.69.144.84.21.1220550821.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Hey everyone,

I have a journalist asking me if I know how many of the new TV shows
launching this season in the US have alternate reality-type things
attached.

Does anybody know? Have a good way of figuring out? I'd be happy to
pass her along to you.

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From dbwall at mac.com  Thu Sep  4 17:47:07 2008
From: dbwall at mac.com (D B Wall)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 16:47:07 -0500
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>

I am. When is your session?  


On Thursday, September 04, 2008, at 08:11AM, "Adrian Hon" <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>Anyone going to Austin GDC this year? I'm giving a talk about our We
>Tell Stories project on Wednesday, and it'd be nice to meet up with
>anyone else there.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Adrian
>
>-- 
>Adrian Hon - mssv.net
>Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
>Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>_______________________________________________
>ARG_Discuss mailing list
>ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
>

From elan at fourthwallstudios.com  Sat Sep  6 19:33:17 2008
From: elan at fourthwallstudios.com (Elan Lee)
Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 16:33:17 -0700
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC? (Adrian Hon)
Message-ID: <35cc46690809061633w4354b6a6lb8b6ee533987c4d3@mail.gmail.com>

I'll be going (and speaking) as well!

Elan

From elanlee at gmail.com  Sat Sep  6 19:34:12 2008
From: elanlee at gmail.com (Elan Lee)
Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 16:34:12 -0700
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC? (Adrian Hon)
In-Reply-To: <35cc46690809061633w4354b6a6lb8b6ee533987c4d3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <35cc46690809061633w4354b6a6lb8b6ee533987c4d3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <35cc46690809061634m6d6d4fddja27bacfd8a5ff2b3@mail.gmail.com>

I'll be going (and speaking) as well!

Elan

From adrian at mssv.net  Sun Sep  7 06:52:25 2008
From: adrian at mssv.net (Adrian Hon)
Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 11:52:25 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
Message-ID: <52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>

Nice to see a lot of people coming along! My session is at 3pm to 4pm
on Wednesday, after which I have to immediately dash to the airport.
Annoyingly, this means that I will miss Elan's talk at 4:30pm.

I wonder if we should meet up during a lunchtime or break somewhere,
or perhaps in the evening? I haven't been to Austin GDC before, does
anyone have suggestions for good places to meet?

Adrian

-- 
Adrian Hon - mssv.net
Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org

From dbwall at mac.com  Tue Sep  9 17:36:08 2008
From: dbwall at mac.com (D B Wall)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:36:08 -0500
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
	<52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5653291605067451562954104745238170334-Webmail2@me.com>

The game writer's sig is meeting up at the gingerman pub. Wendy has a link to their site for directions.
 
On Sunday, September 07, 2008, at 05:52AM, "Adrian Hon" <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
>Nice to see a lot of people coming along! My session is at 3pm to 4pm
>on Wednesday, after which I have to immediately dash to the airport.
>Annoyingly, this means that I will miss Elan's talk at 4:30pm.
>
>I wonder if we should meet up during a lunchtime or break somewhere,
>or perhaps in the evening? I haven't been to Austin GDC before, does
>anyone have suggestions for good places to meet?
>
>Adrian
>
>-- 
>Adrian Hon - mssv.net
>Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
>Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>_______________________________________________
>ARG_Discuss mailing list
>ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
>

From Markus.Montola at uta.fi  Thu Sep 11 08:49:06 2008
From: Markus.Montola at uta.fi (Markus Montola)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 15:49:06 +0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>

Hello all!

As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros and  
Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.

Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain  
copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?

The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions  
letter, as our publisher operates in USA. And the more important  
question: Has anyone done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at  
Microsoft ?) would have such info. I guess the games people are all  
about Games for Windows and XBOX anyway...


So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know  
more about who holds The Beast rights? :-)


Best,

  - Markus Montola

From dan at sixtostart.com  Thu Sep 11 08:55:45 2008
From: dan at sixtostart.com (Dan Hon)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:55:45 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
Message-ID: <651A6B26-C7B6-45D5-841B-34CF2E9CC489@sixtostart.com>

You'll need clearance for your publisher. We've never denied  
clearance, just drop a line to the team behind whatever game you want  
to include.

--
Dan Hon, CEO, Six to Start
m: +44 7870 600 828
t: +44 33 3340 7490, f: +44 33 3340 7494




On 11 Sep 2008, at 13:49, Markus Montola wrote:

> Hello all!
>
> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros  
> and Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss  
> ARGs.
>
> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain  
> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>
> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions  
> letter, as our publisher operates in USA. And the more important  
> question: Has anyone done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at  
> Microsoft ?) would have such info. I guess the games people are all  
> about Games for Windows and XBOX anyway...
>
>
> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know  
> more about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>
>
> Best,
>
> - Markus Montola
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From baroblik at videotron.ca  Thu Sep 11 09:01:31 2008
From: baroblik at videotron.ca (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Genevi=E8ve_Cardin?=)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 09:01:31 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
Message-ID: <F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>

In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to  
user screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are  
talking about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the  
project can give you better screen shots than the one you've picked,  
and also you'll have the full proof approbation before selling you book.

It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which  
business you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when  
someone talks about their production.



I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec :  
www.unhommemort.com  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need  
any screen shots ;)


Genevi?ve Cardin
Baroblik communication et multim?dia
Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres

cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
baroblik at videotron.ca




On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:

> Hello all!
>
> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros  
> and Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss  
> ARGs.
>
> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain  
> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>
> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions  
> letter, as our publisher operates in USA. And the more important  
> question: Has anyone done this, and does anyone have an idea who  
> (at Microsoft ?) would have such info. I guess the games people are  
> all about Games for Windows and XBOX anyway...
>
>
> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know  
> more about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>
>
> Best,
>
>  - Markus Montola
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep 11 13:10:50 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 10:10:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
In-Reply-To: <F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
Message-ID: <2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

I know I should be able to figure this out on my own, but I simple
can't. Today is the day for the weekly informal chat... right? what
time??

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From dan at sixtostart.com  Thu Sep 11 13:13:46 2008
From: dan at sixtostart.com (Dan Hon)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 18:13:46 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
In-Reply-To: <2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>

May I suggest that the SIG set up a public Google Calendar if it  
hasn't done so already?
--
Dan Hon, CEO, Six to Start
m: +44 7870 600 828
t: +44 33 3340 7490, f: +44 33 3340 7494




On 11 Sep 2008, at 18:10, Wendy Despain wrote:

> I know I should be able to figure this out on my own, but I simple
> can't. Today is the day for the weekly informal chat... right? what
> time??
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From andres at jengibre.com.ar  Thu Sep 11 13:14:57 2008
From: andres at jengibre.com.ar (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andres_Marti=ADnez_Quijano?=)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 14:14:57 -0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
In-Reply-To: <8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>	<2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>
Message-ID: <48C95211.1040406@jengibre.com.ar>

+1!

Dan Hon wrote:
> May I suggest that the SIG set up a public Google Calendar if it hasn't
> done so already?
> -- 
> Dan Hon, CEO, Six to Start
> m: +44 7870 600 828
> t: +44 33 3340 7490, f: +44 33 3340 7494
> 
> On 11 Sep 2008, at 18:10, Wendy Despain wrote:
> 
>> I know I should be able to figure this out on my own, but I simple
>> can't. Today is the day for the weekly informal chat... right? what
>> time??

From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep 11 13:24:10 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 10:24:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <5653291605067451562954104745238170334-Webmail2@me.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
	<52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>
	<5653291605067451562954104745238170334-Webmail2@me.com>
Message-ID: <2999.69.144.84.21.1221153850.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Sorry this has taken me a few days to get back to! I always feel like
I'm in crunch mode when I know I'll be out of the office for several
days.

The official bar for the conference is apparently Maggie Mae's
http://www.maggiemaesaustin.com/ but it can get pretty crowded, so
this year everyone participating in the "Game Writing" track is being
encouraged to meet up at the Gingerman http://austin.gingermanpub.com/
so it's easier to find people you recognize. That's where I will
likely be most evenings (starting Sunday) and of course everyone is
welcome to join the hardest drinkers at the convention (ie. writers)
there, even if you're not one yourself.

There are quite a few restaurants within a block or so of the
convention center (if you go out the main entrance) things like PF
Chang's are pretty easy to find.

Also, the IGDA Writing SIG will have a booth in the lobby of the
convention center along with the local Austin IGDA chapter. The SIG is
planning to have an official "lunch spot" designated each day and you
can find out where it is by stopping by our booth if you would like to
join us for a more food-oriented gathering. (Although for  me it's
always about the food... but I digress.)

ARG enthusiasts/developers are always welcome in a Game Writing group
as we all share an interest in interactive narrative of one kind or
another. So if you're feeling social next week, join us!

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com
Writing SIG Chair




On Tue, September 9, 2008 2:36 pm, D B Wall wrote:
> The game writer's sig is meeting up at the gingerman pub. Wendy has a
> link to their site for directions.
>
> On Sunday, September 07, 2008, at 05:52AM, "Adrian Hon"
> <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
>>Nice to see a lot of people coming along! My session is at 3pm to 4pm
>>on Wednesday, after which I have to immediately dash to the airport.
>>Annoyingly, this means that I will miss Elan's talk at 4:30pm.
>>
>>I wonder if we should meet up during a lunchtime or break somewhere,
>>or perhaps in the evening? I haven't been to Austin GDC before, does
>>anyone have suggestions for good places to meet?
>>
>>Adrian
>>
>>--
>>Adrian Hon - mssv.net
>>Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
>>Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>>_______________________________________________
>>ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From voyetra at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 11 13:30:54 2008
From: voyetra at hotmail.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Santiago_M=E9ndez?=)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 14:30:54 -0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
In-Reply-To: <8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com> 
	<8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W52BAD0BAC24A07E29F43D4AD560@phx.gbl>


Yes, Google Calendar! Please!

> From: dan at sixtostart.com
> To: arg_discuss at igda.org
> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 18:13:46 +0100
> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
> 
> May I suggest that the SIG set up a public Google Calendar if it  
> hasn't done so already?
> --
> Dan Hon, CEO, Six to Start
> m: +44 7870 600 828
> t: +44 33 3340 7490, f: +44 33 3340 7494
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 11 Sep 2008, at 18:10, Wendy Despain wrote:
> 
> > I know I should be able to figure this out on my own, but I simple
> > can't. Today is the day for the weekly informal chat... right? what
> > time??
> >
> > Wendy Despain
> > quantumcontent.com
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > ARG_Discuss mailing list
> > ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss

_________________________________________________________________
Ingres? ya a MSN Deportes y enterate de las ?ltimas novedades del mundo deportivo.
http://msn.foxsports.com/fslasc/

From adrijackmarie at gmail.com  Thu Sep 11 13:35:43 2008
From: adrijackmarie at gmail.com (Adrien MARIE)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 19:35:43 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W52BAD0BAC24A07E29F43D4AD560@phx.gbl>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<2895.69.144.84.21.1221153050.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<8A7E0440-2D97-4B23-92FE-79FFA0E786B0@sixtostart.com>
	<BAY115-W52BAD0BAC24A07E29F43D4AD560@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <ECA342E6-4E74-4E8D-BE1D-D5209674847E@gmail.com>

so what time then this informal chat ?

On 11 Sep 2008, at 7:30, Santiago M?ndez wrote:

>
> Yes, Google Calendar! Please!
>
>> From: dan at sixtostart.com
>> To: arg_discuss at igda.org
>> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 18:13:46 +0100
>> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] informal IRC chat today?
>>
>> May I suggest that the SIG set up a public Google Calendar if it
>> hasn't done so already?
>> --
>> Dan Hon, CEO, Six to Start
>> m: +44 7870 600 828
>> t: +44 33 3340 7490, f: +44 33 3340 7494
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11 Sep 2008, at 18:10, Wendy Despain wrote:
>>
>>> I know I should be able to figure this out on my own, but I simple
>>> can't. Today is the day for the weekly informal chat... right? what
>>> time??
>>>
>>> Wendy Despain
>>> quantumcontent.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Ingres? ya a MSN Deportes y enterate de las ?ltimas novedades del  
> mundo deportivo.
> http://msn.foxsports.com/fslasc/
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From adrian at mssv.net  Thu Sep 11 17:12:20 2008
From: adrian at mssv.net (Adrian Hon)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 22:12:20 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <2999.69.144.84.21.1221153850.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
	<52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>
	<5653291605067451562954104745238170334-Webmail2@me.com>
	<2999.69.144.84.21.1221153850.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <52a6f3110809111412u7425d16do752ed43d79de7d09@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for the info!

Unfortunately I'm not sure whether I'll be able to make it to the
conference at all now, thanks to Hurricane Ike. IAH is closed from
noon on Friday through to the end of Saturday, and it's not clear
whether I can fly in on Sunday. Monday is also unlikely...

adrian

On Thu, Sep 11, 2008 at 6:24 PM, Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com> wrote:
> Sorry this has taken me a few days to get back to! I always feel like
> I'm in crunch mode when I know I'll be out of the office for several
> days.
>
> The official bar for the conference is apparently Maggie Mae's
> http://www.maggiemaesaustin.com/ but it can get pretty crowded, so
> this year everyone participating in the "Game Writing" track is being
> encouraged to meet up at the Gingerman http://austin.gingermanpub.com/
> so it's easier to find people you recognize. That's where I will
> likely be most evenings (starting Sunday) and of course everyone is
> welcome to join the hardest drinkers at the convention (ie. writers)
> there, even if you're not one yourself.
>
> There are quite a few restaurants within a block or so of the
> convention center (if you go out the main entrance) things like PF
> Chang's are pretty easy to find.
>
> Also, the IGDA Writing SIG will have a booth in the lobby of the
> convention center along with the local Austin IGDA chapter. The SIG is
> planning to have an official "lunch spot" designated each day and you
> can find out where it is by stopping by our booth if you would like to
> join us for a more food-oriented gathering. (Although for  me it's
> always about the food... but I digress.)
>
> ARG enthusiasts/developers are always welcome in a Game Writing group
> as we all share an interest in interactive narrative of one kind or
> another. So if you're feeling social next week, join us!
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
> Writing SIG Chair
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, September 9, 2008 2:36 pm, D B Wall wrote:
>> The game writer's sig is meeting up at the gingerman pub. Wendy has a
>> link to their site for directions.
>>
>> On Sunday, September 07, 2008, at 05:52AM, "Adrian Hon"
>> <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
>>>Nice to see a lot of people coming along! My session is at 3pm to 4pm
>>>on Wednesday, after which I have to immediately dash to the airport.
>>>Annoyingly, this means that I will miss Elan's talk at 4:30pm.
>>>
>>>I wonder if we should meet up during a lunchtime or break somewhere,
>>>or perhaps in the evening? I haven't been to Austin GDC before, does
>>>anyone have suggestions for good places to meet?
>>>
>>>Adrian
>>>
>>>--
>>>Adrian Hon - mssv.net
>>>Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
>>>Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
>
>



-- 
Adrian Hon - mssv.net
Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org

From adrian at mssv.net  Fri Sep 12 06:59:39 2008
From: adrian at mssv.net (Adrian Hon)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 11:59:39 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Austin GDC?
In-Reply-To: <52a6f3110809111412u7425d16do752ed43d79de7d09@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4856.216.166.176.218.1074935108.spork@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<122280628875873423537494049110123255654-Webmail2@me.com>
	<52a6f3110809070352o109aaad1vf7dd0a89eb827ae7@mail.gmail.com>
	<5653291605067451562954104745238170334-Webmail2@me.com>
	<2999.69.144.84.21.1221153850.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<52a6f3110809111412u7425d16do752ed43d79de7d09@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <52a6f3110809120359y2d7ba504jec7b0110fa7220e7@mail.gmail.com>

Just to monopolise the conversation, I actually *am* coming to the
conference now, but I'm arriving on Monday afternoon, and now have to
sort out a place to crash on Monday and Tuesday nights. If you have
any offers or suggestions, I would be eternally grateful!

Adrian

On Thu, Sep 11, 2008 at 10:12 PM, Adrian Hon <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
> Thanks for the info!
>
> Unfortunately I'm not sure whether I'll be able to make it to the
> conference at all now, thanks to Hurricane Ike. IAH is closed from
> noon on Friday through to the end of Saturday, and it's not clear
> whether I can fly in on Sunday. Monday is also unlikely...
>
> adrian
>
> On Thu, Sep 11, 2008 at 6:24 PM, Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com> wrote:
>> Sorry this has taken me a few days to get back to! I always feel like
>> I'm in crunch mode when I know I'll be out of the office for several
>> days.
>>
>> The official bar for the conference is apparently Maggie Mae's
>> http://www.maggiemaesaustin.com/ but it can get pretty crowded, so
>> this year everyone participating in the "Game Writing" track is being
>> encouraged to meet up at the Gingerman http://austin.gingermanpub.com/
>> so it's easier to find people you recognize. That's where I will
>> likely be most evenings (starting Sunday) and of course everyone is
>> welcome to join the hardest drinkers at the convention (ie. writers)
>> there, even if you're not one yourself.
>>
>> There are quite a few restaurants within a block or so of the
>> convention center (if you go out the main entrance) things like PF
>> Chang's are pretty easy to find.
>>
>> Also, the IGDA Writing SIG will have a booth in the lobby of the
>> convention center along with the local Austin IGDA chapter. The SIG is
>> planning to have an official "lunch spot" designated each day and you
>> can find out where it is by stopping by our booth if you would like to
>> join us for a more food-oriented gathering. (Although for  me it's
>> always about the food... but I digress.)
>>
>> ARG enthusiasts/developers are always welcome in a Game Writing group
>> as we all share an interest in interactive narrative of one kind or
>> another. So if you're feeling social next week, join us!
>>
>> Wendy Despain
>> quantumcontent.com
>> Writing SIG Chair
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, September 9, 2008 2:36 pm, D B Wall wrote:
>>> The game writer's sig is meeting up at the gingerman pub. Wendy has a
>>> link to their site for directions.
>>>
>>> On Sunday, September 07, 2008, at 05:52AM, "Adrian Hon"
>>> <adrian at mssv.net> wrote:
>>>>Nice to see a lot of people coming along! My session is at 3pm to 4pm
>>>>on Wednesday, after which I have to immediately dash to the airport.
>>>>Annoyingly, this means that I will miss Elan's talk at 4:30pm.
>>>>
>>>>I wonder if we should meet up during a lunchtime or break somewhere,
>>>>or perhaps in the evening? I haven't been to Austin GDC before, does
>>>>anyone have suggestions for good places to meet?
>>>>
>>>>Adrian
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Adrian Hon - mssv.net
>>>>Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
>>>>Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>>ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>>
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>
>>
>> Wendy Despain
>> quantumcontent.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Adrian Hon - mssv.net
> Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
> Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org
>



-- 
Adrian Hon - mssv.net
Chief Creative at Six to Start - www.sixtostart.com
Founder of Let's Change the Game - www.letschangethegame.org

From adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com  Fri Sep 12 08:06:05 2008
From: adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com (Adam Martin)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 13:06:05 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
Message-ID: <ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>

Perhaps each arg owner could add a screenshot of their ARG to the
flickr photopool for designs we could put onto the back of MOO cards
to promote ARGs?

http://www.flickr.com/groups/809268 at N25/

(c.f. the transcript of the last IRC chat, especially this post:
http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/arg_discuss/2008-August/001523.html
)

2008/9/11 Genevi?ve Cardin <baroblik at videotron.ca>:
> In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to user
> screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
> Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are talking
> about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the project can give
> you better screen shots than the one you've picked, and also you'll have the
> full proof approbation before selling you book.
>
> It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which business
> you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when someone talks
> about their production.
>
>
>
> I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec : www.unhommemort.com
>  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need any screen shots ;)
>
>
> Genevi?ve Cardin
> Baroblik communication et multim?dia
> Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
> de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres
>
> cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
> baroblik at videotron.ca
>
>
>
>
> On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:
>
>> Hello all!
>>
>> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros and
>> Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.
>>
>> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain
>> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>>
>> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions letter, as
>> our publisher operates in USA. And the more important question: Has anyone
>> done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at Microsoft ?) would have such
>> info. I guess the games people are all about Games for Windows and XBOX
>> anyway...
>>
>>
>> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know more
>> about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>>  - Markus Montola
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>

From baroblik at videotron.ca  Fri Sep 12 09:14:08 2008
From: baroblik at videotron.ca (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Genevi=E8ve_Cardin?=)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 09:14:08 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6DB443C4-8342-4B47-A528-FA6F370D41BA@videotron.ca>

Great idea !

Genevi?ve Cardin
Baroblik communication et multim?dia
Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres

cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
baroblik at videotron.ca




On 08-09-12, at 08:06, Adam Martin wrote:

> Perhaps each arg owner could add a screenshot of their ARG to the
> flickr photopool for designs we could put onto the back of MOO cards
> to promote ARGs?
>
> http://www.flickr.com/groups/809268 at N25/
>
> (c.f. the transcript of the last IRC chat, especially this post:
> http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/arg_discuss/2008-August/001523.html
> )
>
> 2008/9/11 Genevi?ve Cardin <baroblik at videotron.ca>:
>> In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to  
>> user
>> screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
>> Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are  
>> talking
>> about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the  
>> project can give
>> you better screen shots than the one you've picked, and also  
>> you'll have the
>> full proof approbation before selling you book.
>>
>> It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which  
>> business
>> you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when  
>> someone talks
>> about their production.
>>
>>
>>
>> I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec :  
>> www.unhommemort.com
>>  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need any screen shots ;)
>>
>>
>> Genevi?ve Cardin
>> Baroblik communication et multim?dia
>> Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
>> de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres
>>
>> cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
>> baroblik at videotron.ca
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:
>>
>>> Hello all!
>>>
>>> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros  
>>> and
>>> Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.
>>>
>>> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain
>>> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>>>
>>> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions  
>>> letter, as
>>> our publisher operates in USA. And the more important question:  
>>> Has anyone
>>> done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at Microsoft ?)  
>>> would have such
>>> info. I guess the games people are all about Games for Windows  
>>> and XBOX
>>> anyway...
>>>
>>>
>>> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might  
>>> know more
>>> about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>>  - Markus Montola
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From bclark at gmdstudios.com  Fri Sep 12 12:28:57 2008
From: bclark at gmdstudios.com (Brian Clark)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 12:28:57 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <009c01c914f4$a8609f10$6500a8c0@Tricorder>

While I know publishers are frequently risk-adverse, and laws are different
from country to country, here in the U.S. you actually have a lot more
latitude than that (speaking as someone who's also done a lot of content
publishing over the years.)

The "Fair Use" exclusion on copyrights has long-standing (and well tested)
provisions when the excerpts or illustrative examples are being used in
critique or review. UK has a similar law structure, and in Australia in the
same rights are contained under the concept "fair dealings exceptions".

Of course, that's a fuzzy zone ... and getting a release form isn't fuzzy at
all (but I'm a big advocate of people understanding their fair use rights as
a content publisher!)

Actionable advice: consult an attorney, try to get the releases, but argue
you don't actually need them :)

-----Original Message-----
From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
Behalf Of Adam Martin
Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 8:06 AM
To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights

Perhaps each arg owner could add a screenshot of their ARG to the
flickr photopool for designs we could put onto the back of MOO cards
to promote ARGs?

http://www.flickr.com/groups/809268 at N25/

(c.f. the transcript of the last IRC chat, especially this post:
http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/arg_discuss/2008-August/001523.html
)

2008/9/11 Genevi?ve Cardin <baroblik at videotron.ca>:
> In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to user
> screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
> Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are talking
> about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the project can
give
> you better screen shots than the one you've picked, and also you'll have
the
> full proof approbation before selling you book.
>
> It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which business
> you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when someone talks
> about their production.
>
>
>
> I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec : www.unhommemort.com
>  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need any screen shots ;)
>
>
> Genevi?ve Cardin
> Baroblik communication et multim?dia
> Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
> de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres
>
> cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
> baroblik at videotron.ca
>
>
>
>
> On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:
>
>> Hello all!
>>
>> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros and
>> Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.
>>
>> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain
>> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>>
>> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions letter,
as
>> our publisher operates in USA. And the more important question: Has
anyone
>> done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at Microsoft ?) would have
such
>> info. I guess the games people are all about Games for Windows and XBOX
>> anyway...
>>
>>
>> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know more
>> about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>>  - Markus Montola
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
_______________________________________________
ARG_Discuss mailing list
ARG_Discuss at igda.org
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From dflor71 at gmail.com  Fri Sep 12 18:42:29 2008
From: dflor71 at gmail.com (David Flor)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:42:29 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>

Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.

For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating a 
new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My concern is 
that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as 
possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself), which 
is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But if 
someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they 
might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from men 
wearing dark glasses or lab coats.

But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because it 
violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of violating 
that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm curious 
how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is the 
fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do you 
take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really matter?

Thanks!

Tnx & Rgds...
David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )

From markus.montola at uta.fi  Sat Sep 13 02:56:38 2008
From: markus.montola at uta.fi (Markus Montola)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 09:56:38 +0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
Message-ID: <48CB6426.1090106@uta.fi>

Thank you, Genevi?ve and Adrian!

It seems that the hard time at the Microsoft's PR agency will continue. :-)

  - Markus Montola


Genevi?ve Cardin kirjoitti:
> In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to user 
> screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
> Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are talking 
> about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the project can 
> give you better screen shots than the one you've picked, and also you'll 
> have the full proof approbation before selling you book.
> 
> It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which 
> business you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when 
> someone talks about their production.
> 
> 
> 
> I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec : 
> www.unhommemort.com  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need any 
> screen shots ;)
> 
> 
> Genevi?ve Cardin
> Baroblik communication et multim?dia
> Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
> de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres
> 
> cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
> baroblik at videotron.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:
> 
>> Hello all!
>>
>> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros and 
>> Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.
>>
>> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain 
>> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>>
>> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions 
>> letter, as our publisher operates in USA. And the more important 
>> question: Has anyone done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at 
>> Microsoft ?) would have such info. I guess the games people are all 
>> about Games for Windows and XBOX anyway...
>>
>>
>> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know 
>> more about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>>  - Markus Montola
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From Bryan.Alexander at nitle.org  Sat Sep 13 12:21:44 2008
From: Bryan.Alexander at nitle.org (Bryan Alexander)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:21:44 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca><ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
	<48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <08119B28F4B3FF46A5747921C9FAA678B7ACAF@AA1EXCH06.office.share.org>

Maybe a bit off-topic, but I'm just wondering how Superstruct will
interact with user-generated content on users' sites.
  Will they stalk blogs via Technorati (or G's B-search), and assign
people to post comments, or...?

-----Original Message-----
From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org]
On Behalf Of David Flor
Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers

Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.

For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating a 
new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My concern is

that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as 
possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself), which 
is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But if 
someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they 
might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from men 
wearing dark glasses or lab coats.

But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because it 
violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of violating 
that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm curious 
how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is the 
fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do you 
take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really matter?

Thanks!

Tnx & Rgds...
David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
_______________________________________________
ARG_Discuss mailing list
ARG_Discuss at igda.org
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss

From joel_josephson at kindersite.org  Sun Sep 14 02:11:25 2008
From: joel_josephson at kindersite.org (Kindersite Joel)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 09:11:25 +0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] EU funded ARG for language learning motivation
Message-ID: <014f01c91630$b9d4ebb0$6402a8c0@770V>

I am a partner in a European Union funded education project called ARGuing 
http://arg.paisley.ac.uk/index.php being coordinated by Prof. Thomas 
Connolly (Chair European Association for Games in Education) of University
of West of Scotland.

The project is using an ARG to motivate European students to engage with 
language learning.

One of the steps we need to take within the project is to examine and 
include 'Case Studies' of the use of other ARGs or similar games in 
education. I would be very grateful if members of the list could help me by 
sending me any literature you produced on any games (case studies, research 
etc.)  that you used in education, including initialization, development, 
implementation and results. We would be particularly interested in problems 
and benefits that you noted.

I would also be very grateful for the names and contact details or web 
addresses were I could find more examples.

I hope my request is not to much of a burden, any help would be greatly 
appreciated. I am not involving Prof. Connolly directly in this research as 
I am leading this Workpackage.

Many thanks

Joel

Joel H Josephson. Executive Director
http://www.kindersite.org
Where children play and teachers learn
Stockholm Prize Finalists
European Union Projects: ARGuing, Don?t Give Up, ALL, TOOL2, Chain Stories, 
Languages from the Cradle, FaceIt 


From baroblik at videotron.ca  Sun Sep 14 12:08:10 2008
From: baroblik at videotron.ca (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Genevi=E8ve_Cardin?=)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 12:08:10 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
References: <616931.90207.qm@web25907.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<20080911154906.1hou640w4ksgkooo@imp2.uta.fi>
	<F44CFDE1-2F32-47D0-86E8-F4F3A54BC5F7@videotron.ca>
	<ca93830d0809120506r60c6ab9fq44b9c173ec7a7506@mail.gmail.com>
	<48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9DBF8102-C46E-4BFB-80B6-343617B6E213@videotron.ca>

I think you should keep it as realistic as possible.
There's always a few signs in the game, that let people know it's  
actually a game.

In The Rivard Project, we had a blog almost shut down because  
authorities seeing that the words : Cosa Nostra, Kennedy,  
assassination, FBI and CIA were appearing on a same place, regarding  
a mission taking place in Texas, France and Canada, flagged that  
something strange was going on. That fact got people more involve in  
the game.

You'll sure have people freaking out, but I think the first thing  
they will do, to check if there's really something bad going on, will  
be turning on the TV to CNN, or listening to radio.
If there's nothing there about a chaos or something horrible comming,  
they'll figure out it's something stages for a game.

But, it's always hard to tell, what people might say or do ...

Good luck !

Genevi?ve Cardin
Baroblik communication et multim?dia
Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres

cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
baroblik at videotron.ca




On 08-09-12, at 18:42, David Flor wrote:

> Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.
>
> For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating  
> a new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My  
> concern is that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and  
> plausible as possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving  
> it myself), which is fine for people who are aware of its existence  
> in the game. But if someone chances across this not knowing it's a  
> game and, well, they might panic. And I might soon be getting  
> knocks from my door from men wearing dark glasses or lab coats.
>
> But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because  
> it violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of  
> violating that or being taken too seriously I go for the former,  
> but I'm curious how some of you handle situations such as this. How  
> realistic is the fear of being taken literally and seriously, and  
> what measures do you take to safeguard you and would-be believers?  
> Or does it really matter?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Tnx & Rgds...
> David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
> Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From bclark at gmdstudios.com  Mon Sep 15 13:17:31 2008
From: bclark at gmdstudios.com (Brian Clark)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 13:17:31 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>

So let me give you some advice from the "dark side" so to speak, as someone
who has gotten those calls from men in dark glasses and still isn't afraid
of managed controversy as a palette useful in some situations.

In general, make sure that law enforcement doesn't have to solve any puzzles
to figure out how to get in touch with you: domain registry transparency is
a good first step. Not only does it send the message "nothing to hide here"
but it helps ensure your first contact might be by telephone.

In general, cooperate fully with their requests if you can as a good
citizen: you want them to write "harmless prankster" in your file. This
means if you CAN cease and desist, do ... that's the ultimate indie fallback
on liability.

Those two general rules will get you through most of your encounters with
cyber-savvy law enforcement, but won't protect you from something silly or
threatening utilized in a dead drop or live event. I keep assuming, though,
that once they put "harmless prankster" in your file they stop calling, but
that doesn't seem to be true.

-----Original Message-----
From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
Behalf Of David Flor
Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers

Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.

For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating a 
new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My concern is 
that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as 
possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself), which 
is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But if 
someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they 
might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from men 
wearing dark glasses or lab coats.

But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because it 
violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of violating 
that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm curious 
how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is the 
fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do you 
take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really matter?

Thanks!

Tnx & Rgds...
David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
_______________________________________________
ARG_Discuss mailing list
ARG_Discuss at igda.org
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Mon Sep 15 14:03:52 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:03:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
References: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
	<000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
Message-ID: <46270.198.202.202.20.1221501832.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

I'll just throw in my two cents here.

1) I can tell you from experience, if you put a disclaimer on a page
or site, even if it's a huge colorful box jumping out at the reader,
some people will ignore/not see/not understand the disclaimer and will
call you or email you or whatnot with their complaints and concerns.

2) Players who see the disclaimers don't mind it and are willing to
pretend it's not there for the sake of the game.

My conclusions from these two points - put a disclaimer on there, and
prepare a plan/talking points for when you get complaints from people
who still think it's real.

I did a site for Gene Roddenberry's Earth: Final Conflict that was a
PR site for "invading" aliens, who were convincing the populace they
were friendly. One part of their site included a "press clippings"
section with "fake" news stories from "real" news outlets like the
Chicago Tribune. One news story talked about how the aliens had
provided a cure for multiple sclerosis. In the very first line of the
story it said the cure was provided _by aliens_. And I thought that
would be enough to clue in readers that this was not a news story to
be taken seriously.

I was wrong. After a couple of weeks we got a torrent of hate mail
from a group of people with MS who thought we were peddling a snakeoil
cure for the disease. Or something. I never could quite grasp how they
were reading this news story. At any rate, someone had done a google
search on MS and cure, found our story, got mad about it, posted about
it on a message board and started an email storm.

We even got phone calls. Finally I broke down and put a disclaimer on
the page in a big blue box with bold letters explaining that this was
a work of science-fiction and we included MS because we had friends
and family affected by the disease and one of the things we hoped for
the future that a cure would be found somehow.

I expected players to express outrage at the disclaimer and the angry
emails to stop. (We were spending too much time trying to calm the
masses, and not enough time pushing the game forward, that's why we
decided to take the step and put up the disclaimer.)

What actually happened was that the players didn't mention it, and the
angry emails were only cut down by 3/4ths. Still, it was a huge
reduction and by then we had a form letter response we could send. So
the reduction in hate mail was a big bonus, but not what I expected.

I wondered if the players had even seen the disclaimer, so at one
point I pulled a player aside who I trusted and asked her in private
(via internet, not in person) if the disclaimer had been spotted by
the player base, and if so - why hadn't anyone mentioned it?

She responded saying yes of course it had been spotted, as they kept
an eagle eye on all the sites, but all the players surmised why it was
there and it didn't impact their play experience at all so no one
talked about it.

Yay for players!!

And that's my two cents, enhanced by an anecdote.

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com

PS. All our sites had copyright notices at the bottom with info on who
really created them, not faked. These also were spotted by players,
investigated, and they actually appreciated them because it convinced
them that this was "officially sanctioned" by the TV show and not
fanfic.




On Mon, September 15, 2008 10:17 am, Brian Clark wrote:
> So let me give you some advice from the "dark side" so to speak, as
> someone
> who has gotten those calls from men in dark glasses and still isn't
> afraid
> of managed controversy as a palette useful in some situations.
>
> In general, make sure that law enforcement doesn't have to solve any
> puzzles
> to figure out how to get in touch with you: domain registry
> transparency is
> a good first step. Not only does it send the message "nothing to hide
> here"
> but it helps ensure your first contact might be by telephone.
>
> In general, cooperate fully with their requests if you can as a good
> citizen: you want them to write "harmless prankster" in your file.
> This
> means if you CAN cease and desist, do ... that's the ultimate indie
> fallback
> on liability.
>
> Those two general rules will get you through most of your encounters
> with
> cyber-savvy law enforcement, but won't protect you from something
> silly or
> threatening utilized in a dead drop or live event. I keep assuming,
> though,
> that once they put "harmless prankster" in your file they stop
> calling, but
> that doesn't seem to be true.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org
> [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
> Behalf Of David Flor
> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
>
> Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.
>
> For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating a
> new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My concern
> is
> that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as
> possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself), which
> is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But if
> someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they
> might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from men
> wearing dark glasses or lab coats.
>
> But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because it
> violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of violating
> that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm curious
> how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is the
> fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do you
> take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really
> matter?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Tnx & Rgds...
> David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
> Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com  Mon Sep 15 14:37:39 2008
From: adam.m.s.martin at googlemail.com (Adam Martin)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 19:37:39 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <46270.198.202.202.20.1221501832.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
	<000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
	<46270.198.202.202.20.1221501832.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <ca93830d0809151137u1fad0a2n91e34fb4df1dd493@mail.gmail.com>

Awesome anecdote :).

Of course, by contrast, for perplexcity we made sure there was NO
reference to who we really were on the majority of the sites, all
domain regs were fully anonymized, etc. This was partly just to stop
people from pre-discovering sites whose names would give away spoilers
for future plot - which didn't always work, because when a domain had
the word "perplex" in it somewhere, it was easy enough to discover
without knowing who owned it.

The only funny call I remember receiving was someone who managed to
find the private cell phone number of one of the staff, and phone up
to say that our main website had the default administrator
user/password and anyone could hack in to it. Fortunately, even though
it LOOKED like our website was running Movable Type, it wasn't (as
most people do, we were statically imaging the live server from a
private, offline, server that was running the real blog software).

And one where someone apologized for crashing our servers (although
IIRC that was a coincidence).

2008/9/15 Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com>:
> I'll just throw in my two cents here.
>
> 1) I can tell you from experience, if you put a disclaimer on a page
> or site, even if it's a huge colorful box jumping out at the reader,
> some people will ignore/not see/not understand the disclaimer and will
> call you or email you or whatnot with their complaints and concerns.
>
> 2) Players who see the disclaimers don't mind it and are willing to
> pretend it's not there for the sake of the game.
>
> My conclusions from these two points - put a disclaimer on there, and
> prepare a plan/talking points for when you get complaints from people
> who still think it's real.
>
> I did a site for Gene Roddenberry's Earth: Final Conflict that was a
> PR site for "invading" aliens, who were convincing the populace they
> were friendly. One part of their site included a "press clippings"
> section with "fake" news stories from "real" news outlets like the
> Chicago Tribune. One news story talked about how the aliens had
> provided a cure for multiple sclerosis. In the very first line of the
> story it said the cure was provided _by aliens_. And I thought that
> would be enough to clue in readers that this was not a news story to
> be taken seriously.
>
> I was wrong. After a couple of weeks we got a torrent of hate mail
> from a group of people with MS who thought we were peddling a snakeoil
> cure for the disease. Or something. I never could quite grasp how they
> were reading this news story. At any rate, someone had done a google
> search on MS and cure, found our story, got mad about it, posted about
> it on a message board and started an email storm.
>
> We even got phone calls. Finally I broke down and put a disclaimer on
> the page in a big blue box with bold letters explaining that this was
> a work of science-fiction and we included MS because we had friends
> and family affected by the disease and one of the things we hoped for
> the future that a cure would be found somehow.
>
> I expected players to express outrage at the disclaimer and the angry
> emails to stop. (We were spending too much time trying to calm the
> masses, and not enough time pushing the game forward, that's why we
> decided to take the step and put up the disclaimer.)
>
> What actually happened was that the players didn't mention it, and the
> angry emails were only cut down by 3/4ths. Still, it was a huge
> reduction and by then we had a form letter response we could send. So
> the reduction in hate mail was a big bonus, but not what I expected.
>
> I wondered if the players had even seen the disclaimer, so at one
> point I pulled a player aside who I trusted and asked her in private
> (via internet, not in person) if the disclaimer had been spotted by
> the player base, and if so - why hadn't anyone mentioned it?
>
> She responded saying yes of course it had been spotted, as they kept
> an eagle eye on all the sites, but all the players surmised why it was
> there and it didn't impact their play experience at all so no one
> talked about it.
>
> Yay for players!!
>
> And that's my two cents, enhanced by an anecdote.
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> PS. All our sites had copyright notices at the bottom with info on who
> really created them, not faked. These also were spotted by players,
> investigated, and they actually appreciated them because it convinced
> them that this was "officially sanctioned" by the TV show and not
> fanfic.
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, September 15, 2008 10:17 am, Brian Clark wrote:
>> So let me give you some advice from the "dark side" so to speak, as
>> someone
>> who has gotten those calls from men in dark glasses and still isn't
>> afraid
>> of managed controversy as a palette useful in some situations.
>>
>> In general, make sure that law enforcement doesn't have to solve any
>> puzzles
>> to figure out how to get in touch with you: domain registry
>> transparency is
>> a good first step. Not only does it send the message "nothing to hide
>> here"
>> but it helps ensure your first contact might be by telephone.
>>
>> In general, cooperate fully with their requests if you can as a good
>> citizen: you want them to write "harmless prankster" in your file.
>> This
>> means if you CAN cease and desist, do ... that's the ultimate indie
>> fallback
>> on liability.
>>
>> Those two general rules will get you through most of your encounters
>> with
>> cyber-savvy law enforcement, but won't protect you from something
>> silly or
>> threatening utilized in a dead drop or live event. I keep assuming,
>> though,
>> that once they put "harmless prankster" in your file they stop
>> calling, but
>> that doesn't seem to be true.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org
>> [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
>> Behalf Of David Flor
>> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
>> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
>> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
>>
>> Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.
>>
>> For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating a
>> new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My concern
>> is
>> that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as
>> possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself), which
>> is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But if
>> someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they
>> might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from men
>> wearing dark glasses or lab coats.
>>
>> But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because it
>> violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of violating
>> that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm curious
>> how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is the
>> fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do you
>> take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really
>> matter?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Tnx & Rgds...
>> David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
>> Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>

From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Mon Sep 15 16:42:00 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 13:42:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <ca93830d0809151137u1fad0a2n91e34fb4df1dd493@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
	<000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
	<46270.198.202.202.20.1221501832.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<ca93830d0809151137u1fad0a2n91e34fb4df1dd493@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <60982.198.202.202.20.1221511320.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Anecdotes, I got. :)

It was unbelievably easy to reach us via phone. We had veeeerry
helpful switchboard people who prided themselves in their ability to
get callers to the person who could help them with their problem. They
did a remarkable job.

To the point of connecting the disgruntled player right to my phone so
they could deliver the bomb threat to my voice mail. Also the
switchboard person confirmed where we were located. (I learned to let
all calls go to voicemail if I didn't recognize the number.)

Fortunately, along with the very helpful switchboard, we also had a
security team headed by an ex-fbi agent. There are a few benefits to
having an office within a big company.

He got the recording of the bomb threat off my voicemail and said he
"took care of it" and they escorted me from my office to my car for
about a week. When I asked what they meant by "took care of it" they
said, "don't worry about it." To which I said, "Um, yessir."

So don't exactly know how that turned out, but no one on my team (or
our office) came to harm. I suspect the caller had no idea how serious
a bomb threat could be. (This was pre-9/11)

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com



On Mon, September 15, 2008 11:37 am, Adam Martin wrote:
> Awesome anecdote :).
>
> Of course, by contrast, for perplexcity we made sure there was NO
> reference to who we really were on the majority of the sites, all
> domain regs were fully anonymized, etc. This was partly just to stop
> people from pre-discovering sites whose names would give away spoilers
> for future plot - which didn't always work, because when a domain had
> the word "perplex" in it somewhere, it was easy enough to discover
> without knowing who owned it.
>
> The only funny call I remember receiving was someone who managed to
> find the private cell phone number of one of the staff, and phone up
> to say that our main website had the default administrator
> user/password and anyone could hack in to it. Fortunately, even though
> it LOOKED like our website was running Movable Type, it wasn't (as
> most people do, we were statically imaging the live server from a
> private, offline, server that was running the real blog software).
>
> And one where someone apologized for crashing our servers (although
> IIRC that was a coincidence).
>
> 2008/9/15 Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com>:
>> I'll just throw in my two cents here.
>>
>> 1) I can tell you from experience, if you put a disclaimer on a page
>> or site, even if it's a huge colorful box jumping out at the reader,
>> some people will ignore/not see/not understand the disclaimer and
>> will
>> call you or email you or whatnot with their complaints and concerns.
>>
>> 2) Players who see the disclaimers don't mind it and are willing to
>> pretend it's not there for the sake of the game.
>>
>> My conclusions from these two points - put a disclaimer on there,
>> and
>> prepare a plan/talking points for when you get complaints from
>> people
>> who still think it's real.
>>
>> I did a site for Gene Roddenberry's Earth: Final Conflict that was a
>> PR site for "invading" aliens, who were convincing the populace they
>> were friendly. One part of their site included a "press clippings"
>> section with "fake" news stories from "real" news outlets like the
>> Chicago Tribune. One news story talked about how the aliens had
>> provided a cure for multiple sclerosis. In the very first line of
>> the
>> story it said the cure was provided _by aliens_. And I thought that
>> would be enough to clue in readers that this was not a news story to
>> be taken seriously.
>>
>> I was wrong. After a couple of weeks we got a torrent of hate mail
>> from a group of people with MS who thought we were peddling a
>> snakeoil
>> cure for the disease. Or something. I never could quite grasp how
>> they
>> were reading this news story. At any rate, someone had done a google
>> search on MS and cure, found our story, got mad about it, posted
>> about
>> it on a message board and started an email storm.
>>
>> We even got phone calls. Finally I broke down and put a disclaimer
>> on
>> the page in a big blue box with bold letters explaining that this
>> was
>> a work of science-fiction and we included MS because we had friends
>> and family affected by the disease and one of the things we hoped
>> for
>> the future that a cure would be found somehow.
>>
>> I expected players to express outrage at the disclaimer and the
>> angry
>> emails to stop. (We were spending too much time trying to calm the
>> masses, and not enough time pushing the game forward, that's why we
>> decided to take the step and put up the disclaimer.)
>>
>> What actually happened was that the players didn't mention it, and
>> the
>> angry emails were only cut down by 3/4ths. Still, it was a huge
>> reduction and by then we had a form letter response we could send.
>> So
>> the reduction in hate mail was a big bonus, but not what I expected.
>>
>> I wondered if the players had even seen the disclaimer, so at one
>> point I pulled a player aside who I trusted and asked her in private
>> (via internet, not in person) if the disclaimer had been spotted by
>> the player base, and if so - why hadn't anyone mentioned it?
>>
>> She responded saying yes of course it had been spotted, as they kept
>> an eagle eye on all the sites, but all the players surmised why it
>> was
>> there and it didn't impact their play experience at all so no one
>> talked about it.
>>
>> Yay for players!!
>>
>> And that's my two cents, enhanced by an anecdote.
>>
>> Wendy Despain
>> quantumcontent.com
>>
>> PS. All our sites had copyright notices at the bottom with info on
>> who
>> really created them, not faked. These also were spotted by players,
>> investigated, and they actually appreciated them because it
>> convinced
>> them that this was "officially sanctioned" by the TV show and not
>> fanfic.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, September 15, 2008 10:17 am, Brian Clark wrote:
>>> So let me give you some advice from the "dark side" so to speak, as
>>> someone
>>> who has gotten those calls from men in dark glasses and still isn't
>>> afraid
>>> of managed controversy as a palette useful in some situations.
>>>
>>> In general, make sure that law enforcement doesn't have to solve
>>> any
>>> puzzles
>>> to figure out how to get in touch with you: domain registry
>>> transparency is
>>> a good first step. Not only does it send the message "nothing to
>>> hide
>>> here"
>>> but it helps ensure your first contact might be by telephone.
>>>
>>> In general, cooperate fully with their requests if you can as a
>>> good
>>> citizen: you want them to write "harmless prankster" in your file.
>>> This
>>> means if you CAN cease and desist, do ... that's the ultimate indie
>>> fallback
>>> on liability.
>>>
>>> Those two general rules will get you through most of your
>>> encounters
>>> with
>>> cyber-savvy law enforcement, but won't protect you from something
>>> silly or
>>> threatening utilized in a dead drop or live event. I keep assuming,
>>> though,
>>> that once they put "harmless prankster" in your file they stop
>>> calling, but
>>> that doesn't seem to be true.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org
>>> [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
>>> Behalf Of David Flor
>>> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
>>> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
>>> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
>>>
>>> Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.
>>>
>>> For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating
>>> a
>>> new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My
>>> concern
>>> is
>>> that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as
>>> possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself),
>>> which
>>> is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But
>>> if
>>> someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they
>>> might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from
>>> men
>>> wearing dark glasses or lab coats.
>>>
>>> But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because
>>> it
>>> violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of
>>> violating
>>> that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm
>>> curious
>>> how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is
>>> the
>>> fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do
>>> you
>>> take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really
>>> matter?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Tnx & Rgds...
>>> David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
>>> Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>>
>>
>> Wendy Despain
>> quantumcontent.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From dflor71 at gmail.com  Mon Sep 15 17:45:01 2008
From: dflor71 at gmail.com (David Flor)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 17:45:01 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
In-Reply-To: <60982.198.202.202.20.1221511320.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
References: <48CAF055.4060306@gmail.com>
	<000f01c91756$f09b84c0$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
	<46270.198.202.202.20.1221501832.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
	<ca93830d0809151137u1fad0a2n91e34fb4df1dd493@mail.gmail.com>
	<60982.198.202.202.20.1221511320.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>
Message-ID: <50b4b0580809151445m7531cadeqbf1b7b6bd69a0035@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for the input everyone. Bright red glaring disclaimer it is! :)

And while we're on the subject, I'd like to thank the folks at Aporia
Agathon for making my wife think I'm taking my son away from her and
putting him in a school she's never heard of...

http://www.brainclouds.net/Darklight/20080915/Too-Close-To-Home.aspx

I've tried to explain this strange little industry, really I have.
Maybe when it becomes an actual profession such explanation won't be
necessary.

Tnx & Rgds...
David Flor
Darklight Interactive

On Mon, Sep 15, 2008 at 4:42 PM, Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com> wrote:
> Anecdotes, I got. :)
>
> It was unbelievably easy to reach us via phone. We had veeeerry
> helpful switchboard people who prided themselves in their ability to
> get callers to the person who could help them with their problem. They
> did a remarkable job.
>
> To the point of connecting the disgruntled player right to my phone so
> they could deliver the bomb threat to my voice mail. Also the
> switchboard person confirmed where we were located. (I learned to let
> all calls go to voicemail if I didn't recognize the number.)
>
> Fortunately, along with the very helpful switchboard, we also had a
> security team headed by an ex-fbi agent. There are a few benefits to
> having an office within a big company.
>
> He got the recording of the bomb threat off my voicemail and said he
> "took care of it" and they escorted me from my office to my car for
> about a week. When I asked what they meant by "took care of it" they
> said, "don't worry about it." To which I said, "Um, yessir."
>
> So don't exactly know how that turned out, but no one on my team (or
> our office) came to harm. I suspect the caller had no idea how serious
> a bomb threat could be. (This was pre-9/11)
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, September 15, 2008 11:37 am, Adam Martin wrote:
>> Awesome anecdote :).
>>
>> Of course, by contrast, for perplexcity we made sure there was NO
>> reference to who we really were on the majority of the sites, all
>> domain regs were fully anonymized, etc. This was partly just to stop
>> people from pre-discovering sites whose names would give away spoilers
>> for future plot - which didn't always work, because when a domain had
>> the word "perplex" in it somewhere, it was easy enough to discover
>> without knowing who owned it.
>>
>> The only funny call I remember receiving was someone who managed to
>> find the private cell phone number of one of the staff, and phone up
>> to say that our main website had the default administrator
>> user/password and anyone could hack in to it. Fortunately, even though
>> it LOOKED like our website was running Movable Type, it wasn't (as
>> most people do, we were statically imaging the live server from a
>> private, offline, server that was running the real blog software).
>>
>> And one where someone apologized for crashing our servers (although
>> IIRC that was a coincidence).
>>
>> 2008/9/15 Wendy Despain <wendeth at wendydespain.com>:
>>> I'll just throw in my two cents here.
>>>
>>> 1) I can tell you from experience, if you put a disclaimer on a page
>>> or site, even if it's a huge colorful box jumping out at the reader,
>>> some people will ignore/not see/not understand the disclaimer and
>>> will
>>> call you or email you or whatnot with their complaints and concerns.
>>>
>>> 2) Players who see the disclaimers don't mind it and are willing to
>>> pretend it's not there for the sake of the game.
>>>
>>> My conclusions from these two points - put a disclaimer on there,
>>> and
>>> prepare a plan/talking points for when you get complaints from
>>> people
>>> who still think it's real.
>>>
>>> I did a site for Gene Roddenberry's Earth: Final Conflict that was a
>>> PR site for "invading" aliens, who were convincing the populace they
>>> were friendly. One part of their site included a "press clippings"
>>> section with "fake" news stories from "real" news outlets like the
>>> Chicago Tribune. One news story talked about how the aliens had
>>> provided a cure for multiple sclerosis. In the very first line of
>>> the
>>> story it said the cure was provided _by aliens_. And I thought that
>>> would be enough to clue in readers that this was not a news story to
>>> be taken seriously.
>>>
>>> I was wrong. After a couple of weeks we got a torrent of hate mail
>>> from a group of people with MS who thought we were peddling a
>>> snakeoil
>>> cure for the disease. Or something. I never could quite grasp how
>>> they
>>> were reading this news story. At any rate, someone had done a google
>>> search on MS and cure, found our story, got mad about it, posted
>>> about
>>> it on a message board and started an email storm.
>>>
>>> We even got phone calls. Finally I broke down and put a disclaimer
>>> on
>>> the page in a big blue box with bold letters explaining that this
>>> was
>>> a work of science-fiction and we included MS because we had friends
>>> and family affected by the disease and one of the things we hoped
>>> for
>>> the future that a cure would be found somehow.
>>>
>>> I expected players to express outrage at the disclaimer and the
>>> angry
>>> emails to stop. (We were spending too much time trying to calm the
>>> masses, and not enough time pushing the game forward, that's why we
>>> decided to take the step and put up the disclaimer.)
>>>
>>> What actually happened was that the players didn't mention it, and
>>> the
>>> angry emails were only cut down by 3/4ths. Still, it was a huge
>>> reduction and by then we had a form letter response we could send.
>>> So
>>> the reduction in hate mail was a big bonus, but not what I expected.
>>>
>>> I wondered if the players had even seen the disclaimer, so at one
>>> point I pulled a player aside who I trusted and asked her in private
>>> (via internet, not in person) if the disclaimer had been spotted by
>>> the player base, and if so - why hadn't anyone mentioned it?
>>>
>>> She responded saying yes of course it had been spotted, as they kept
>>> an eagle eye on all the sites, but all the players surmised why it
>>> was
>>> there and it didn't impact their play experience at all so no one
>>> talked about it.
>>>
>>> Yay for players!!
>>>
>>> And that's my two cents, enhanced by an anecdote.
>>>
>>> Wendy Despain
>>> quantumcontent.com
>>>
>>> PS. All our sites had copyright notices at the bottom with info on
>>> who
>>> really created them, not faked. These also were spotted by players,
>>> investigated, and they actually appreciated them because it
>>> convinced
>>> them that this was "officially sanctioned" by the TV show and not
>>> fanfic.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, September 15, 2008 10:17 am, Brian Clark wrote:
>>>> So let me give you some advice from the "dark side" so to speak, as
>>>> someone
>>>> who has gotten those calls from men in dark glasses and still isn't
>>>> afraid
>>>> of managed controversy as a palette useful in some situations.
>>>>
>>>> In general, make sure that law enforcement doesn't have to solve
>>>> any
>>>> puzzles
>>>> to figure out how to get in touch with you: domain registry
>>>> transparency is
>>>> a good first step. Not only does it send the message "nothing to
>>>> hide
>>>> here"
>>>> but it helps ensure your first contact might be by telephone.
>>>>
>>>> In general, cooperate fully with their requests if you can as a
>>>> good
>>>> citizen: you want them to write "harmless prankster" in your file.
>>>> This
>>>> means if you CAN cease and desist, do ... that's the ultimate indie
>>>> fallback
>>>> on liability.
>>>>
>>>> Those two general rules will get you through most of your
>>>> encounters
>>>> with
>>>> cyber-savvy law enforcement, but won't protect you from something
>>>> silly or
>>>> threatening utilized in a dead drop or live event. I keep assuming,
>>>> though,
>>>> that once they put "harmless prankster" in your file they stop
>>>> calling, but
>>>> that doesn't seem to be true.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org
>>>> [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
>>>> Behalf Of David Flor
>>>> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 6:42 PM
>>>> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
>>>> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Disclaimers
>>>>
>>>> Hey everyone, got a question out of curiosity.
>>>>
>>>> For the upcoming game "Superstruct", I'm in the process of creating
>>>> a
>>>> new website and some other things that fit in to the game. My
>>>> concern
>>>> is
>>>> that I'm designing it to be as realistic looking and plausible as
>>>> possible (I'm going to have a hard time disbelieving it myself),
>>>> which
>>>> is fine for people who are aware of its existence in the game. But
>>>> if
>>>> someone chances across this not knowing it's a game and, well, they
>>>> might panic. And I might soon be getting knocks from my door from
>>>> men
>>>> wearing dark glasses or lab coats.
>>>>
>>>> But I'm hesitant to put a disclaimer somewhere on the site because
>>>> it
>>>> violates the TINAG a mentality. Granted, given the choice of
>>>> violating
>>>> that or being taken too seriously I go for the former, but I'm
>>>> curious
>>>> how some of you handle situations such as this. How realistic is
>>>> the
>>>> fear of being taken literally and seriously, and what measures do
>>>> you
>>>> take to safeguard you and would-be believers? Or does it really
>>>> matter?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Tnx & Rgds...
>>>> David "Nighthawk" Flor ( dflor71 at gmail.com )
>>>> Darklight Interactive ( http://www.dlimedia.com/ )
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Wendy Despain
>>> quantumcontent.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
> Wendy Despain
> quantumcontent.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>

From markus.montola at uta.fi  Fri Sep 19 04:21:31 2008
From: markus.montola at uta.fi (Markus Montola)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 11:21:31 +0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
In-Reply-To: <009c01c914f4$a8609f10$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
References: <009c01c914f4$a8609f10$6500a8c0@Tricorder>
Message-ID: <48D3610B.7090002@uta.fi>

Just to provide an update; apparently Microsoft has outsourced these 
things to PR agencies. At least the one person I talked with in those 
agencies took quite a bit of convincing before she believed that such 
property exists and that it might be Microsoft property even. After a 
while she pointed me to ask permissions from 42 Entertainment, which I 
believe does not own the rights.

So it's good to hear that the fair use can be fair at times.

  - Markus Montola

(PS. Our publisher does not care much if we get permissions or not; 
their approach is that it's author responsibility to obtain permissions 
and they assume we do. They don't want to know if we have such papers or 
not -- I believe in case of a problem they just shrug and point to our 
direction...)

> While I know publishers are frequently risk-adverse, and laws are different
> from country to country, here in the U.S. you actually have a lot more
> latitude than that (speaking as someone who's also done a lot of content
> publishing over the years.)
> 
> The "Fair Use" exclusion on copyrights has long-standing (and well tested)
> provisions when the excerpts or illustrative examples are being used in
> critique or review. UK has a similar law structure, and in Australia in the
> same rights are contained under the concept "fair dealings exceptions".
> 
> Of course, that's a fuzzy zone ... and getting a release form isn't fuzzy at
> all (but I'm a big advocate of people understanding their fair use rights as
> a content publisher!)
> 
> Actionable advice: consult an attorney, try to get the releases, but argue
> you don't actually need them :)
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org [mailto:arg_discuss-bounces at igda.org] On
> Behalf Of Adam Martin
> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2008 8:06 AM
> To: Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG
> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] ARG website copyrights
> 
> Perhaps each arg owner could add a screenshot of their ARG to the
> flickr photopool for designs we could put onto the back of MOO cards
> to promote ARGs?
> 
> http://www.flickr.com/groups/809268 at N25/
> 
> (c.f. the transcript of the last IRC chat, especially this post:
> http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/arg_discuss/2008-August/001523.html
> )
> 
> 2008/9/11 Genevi?ve Cardin <baroblik at videotron.ca>:
>> In Quebec, Canada, it's always better to ask written permission to user
>> screen shots, and visual elements from a game (XBox or online).
>> Just because it informs the developer of that game that you are talking
>> about his creation, and most of all, someone involve in the project can
> give
>> you better screen shots than the one you've picked, and also you'll have
> the
>> full proof approbation before selling you book.
>>
>> It's not something really hard to get (well it depends from which business
>> you need it from) and generally everyone likes to know when someone talks
>> about their production.
>>
>>
>>
>> I did what's consider to be the first ARG in Quebec : www.unhommemort.com
>>  (in french - 90 000 subscribers) - if you need any screen shots ;)
>>
>>
>> Genevi?ve Cardin
>> Baroblik communication et multim?dia
>> Consultation, id?ation et sc?narisation
>> de sites web et d'environnements interactifs multi-fen?tres
>>
>> cell : (514) 924-TOUI (8684)
>> baroblik at videotron.ca
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 08-09-11, at 08:49, Markus Montola wrote:
>>
>>> Hello all!
>>>
>>> As I've mentioned earlier, I'm writing a book with Jaakko Stenros and
>>> Annika Waern on pervasive games. In our book, we also discuss ARGs.
>>>
>>> Now that we plan to illustrate our book, we should probably obtain
>>> copyrights for website screen captures -- maybe?
>>>
>>> The question is: Do you think we should get written permissions letter,
> as
>>> our publisher operates in USA. And the more important question: Has
> anyone
>>> done this, and does anyone have an idea who (at Microsoft ?) would have
> such
>>> info. I guess the games people are all about Games for Windows and XBOX
>>> anyway...
>>>
>>>
>>> So, anyone being able to give a tip here? Or, Elan, you might know more
>>> about who holds The Beast rights? :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>>  - Markus Montola

From steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org  Mon Sep 22 04:17:24 2008
From: steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org (Steve Vosloo)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 10:17:24 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] Introducing myself
Message-ID: <48D75494.9050801@shuttleworthfoundation.org>

Hi all,

I'm based in South Africa at the Shuttleworth Foundation, an independent 
non-profit organisation. My focus is to explore innovative ways to 
develop communication and analytical thinking skills amongst youth in 
this country. ARGs, to which I am relatively new, seem like a potential 
way to develop these skills. I'm interested in the 
educational/learning/research aspect of ARGs and how they've been used 
in schools or with youth, out of school.

Looking forward to participating in the list!

--Steve

-- 
Steve Vosloo
Fellow, Communication and Analytical Skills Development
The Shuttleworth Foundation

Tel: +27 21 970 1240 | Fax: +27 21 970 1241
Web: www.shuttleworthfoundation.org
Blog: www.innovatingeducation.wordpress.com

Email disclaimer: wiki.tsf.org.za/EmailDisclaimer




From sjoerdwennekes at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 22 04:20:14 2008
From: sjoerdwennekes at hotmail.com (Sjoerd Wennekes)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 10:20:14 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] Introducing myself
In-Reply-To: <48D75494.9050801@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
References: <48D75494.9050801@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <BAY112-W54A1C8B9B8B843D92AF66EC04B0@phx.gbl>


Welcome!!

----------------------------------------
> Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 10:17:24 +0200
> From: steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org
> To: arg_discuss at igda.org
> Subject: [arg_discuss] Introducing myself
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm based in South Africa at the Shuttleworth Foundation, an independent 
> non-profit organisation. My focus is to explore innovative ways to 
> develop communication and analytical thinking skills amongst youth in 
> this country. ARGs, to which I am relatively new, seem like a potential 
> way to develop these skills. I'm interested in the 
> educational/learning/research aspect of ARGs and how they've been used 
> in schools or with youth, out of school.
> 
> Looking forward to participating in the list!
> 
> --Steve
> 
> -- 
> Steve Vosloo
> Fellow, Communication and Analytical Skills Development
> The Shuttleworth Foundation
> 
> Tel: +27 21 970 1240 | Fax: +27 21 970 1241
> Web: www.shuttleworthfoundation.org
> Blog: www.innovatingeducation.wordpress.com
> 
> Email disclaimer: wiki.tsf.org.za/EmailDisclaimer
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

From luizadolfoandrade at yahoo.com.br  Mon Sep 22 10:32:32 2008
From: luizadolfoandrade at yahoo.com.br (Luiz Adolfo Andrade)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 07:32:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Introducing My Self
Message-ID: <319503.1004.qm@web30301.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hello
?
I?m a new member too. My Name is Luiz Adolfo de Andrade, Phd Student a Federal University of Bahia (UFBA), Salvador - Brazil, and an ARG researcher  at Cyberculture Center? at UFBA. 
My focus is to explore the relationships with ARGs/Marketing and ARGs / Urban Space. I?m a PuppetMaster too, working with Raccord? Productions, Rio de Janeiro. Nice to meet all !!!

Best wishes

Luiz Adolfo de Andrade
Federal University of Bahia
Salvador, Brazil




      Novos endere?os, o Yahoo! que voc? conhece. Crie um email novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail.com.
http://br.new.mail.yahoo.com/addresses

From steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org  Mon Sep 22 11:45:39 2008
From: steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org (Steve Vosloo)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 17:45:39 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
Message-ID: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>

If this topic has been covered on the list already, my apologies. Please can you point me to any people with experience of, or resources related to, running ARGs in schools. 

Thanks,
Steve

-- 
Steve Vosloo
Fellow, Communication and Analytical Skills Development
The Shuttleworth Foundation

Tel: +27 21 970 1240 | Fax: +27 21 970 1241
Web: www.shuttleworthfoundation.org
Blog: www.innovatingeducation.wordpress.com

Email disclaimer: wiki.tsf.org.za/EmailDisclaimer




From varineq at gmail.com  Mon Sep 22 12:05:06 2008
From: varineq at gmail.com (Michelle Senderhauf)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 11:05:06 -0500
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
In-Reply-To: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
References: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <45cb08290809220905la5c4bd3l7cde6eefe4b376cd@mail.gmail.com>

Steve,
You can try the guys at Studio Cypher (www.studiocypher.com) or Thom
Gillespie (http://www.indiana.edu/~slizzard/resume/page.html) - both out of
Indiana University Bloomington.  Thom created the MIME program there and
also runs a class on interactive storytelling in new media.  He uses Dave
Szulborski's book on ARGs as a textbook for the class.  And if I recall
correctly, Studio Cypher started making ARGs while participating in Thom's
MIME program.

The Skeleton Chase ARG is currently being played at IU Bloomington also -
http://www.research.iu.edu/news/stories/0231.html

Michelle Senderhauf



On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 10:45 AM, Steve Vosloo <
steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org> wrote:

> If this topic has been covered on the list already, my apologies. Please
> can you point me to any people with experience of, or resources related to,
> running ARGs in schools.
> Thanks,
> Steve
>
> --
> Steve Vosloo
> Fellow, Communication and Analytical Skills Development
> The Shuttleworth Foundation
>
> Tel: +27 21 970 1240 | Fax: +27 21 970 1241
> Web: www.shuttleworthfoundation.org
> Blog: www.innovatingeducation.wordpress.com
>
> Email disclaimer: wiki.tsf.org.za/EmailDisclaimer
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>

From gupfee at gmail.com  Mon Sep 22 14:28:55 2008
From: gupfee at gmail.com (Gupfee)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 14:28:55 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
In-Reply-To: <45cb08290809220905la5c4bd3l7cde6eefe4b376cd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
	<45cb08290809220905la5c4bd3l7cde6eefe4b376cd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2cbc13f50809221128n422661ey61f7fb480b29c64@mail.gmail.com>

World Without Oil has lessons plans based on the ARG:

http://www.worldwithoutoil.org/metateachers.htm

Marie


>
>
> On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 10:45 AM, Steve Vosloo <
> steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> > If this topic has been covered on the list already, my apologies. Please
> > can you point me to any people with experience of, or resources related
> to,
> > running ARGs in schools.
> > Thanks,
> > Steve
> >
> > --
>
>

From joel_josephson at kindersite.org  Tue Sep 23 11:40:24 2008
From: joel_josephson at kindersite.org (Kindersite Joel)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 18:40:24 +0300
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
References: <mailman.11.1222178402.87008.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <012e01c91d92$b41733e0$6402a8c0@770V>

Steve

I am a partner in a European Union funded education project called ARGuing 
http://arg.paisley.ac.uk/index.php being coordinated by Prof. Thomas 
Connolly (Chair European Association for Games in Education) of University
of West of Scotland.

The project is using an ARG to motivate European students to engage with 
language learning, but is also looking at ways that teachers can utilize our 
work and experience in building and piloting the ARG, within their own work.

I would be happy to offer you any help from our team, if we can. I am in 
Europe, obviously, you are welcome to contact me.

Joel

Joel H Josephson. Executive Director
http://www.kindersite.org 


From morgan at calhoonplay.com  Tue Sep 23 15:50:13 2008
From: morgan at calhoonplay.com (Morgan Calhoon)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:50:13 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Getting my ARG feet wet
Message-ID: <d5c4f7d10809231250l5cf27cb9m9102175799ccc0ba@mail.gmail.com>

Hi!

I'm a graduate student at the University of Buffalo and I'm studying how
large scale, localized ARG games can be used to inform and activate people
in a community. It will most likely involve a lot of large games that spring
up at various locations and then disappear afterwards - kind of flash mob
like. I'm starting to get some ideas together for my thesis project that
will happen in March or April. I've created board games, card games, and
street games, but I've never done a full fledged ARG.

Is there anything I can help someone with as a way to get a little taste of
what it will be like? Any suggestions or words of wisdom? I've been doing a
lot of research, but it's just not the same as hands-on experience. I really
want my thesis project to succeed.

Thanks! Morgan

From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Tue Sep 23 20:32:04 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:32:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] Getting my ARG feet wet
In-Reply-To: <d5c4f7d10809231250l5cf27cb9m9102175799ccc0ba@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d5c4f7d10809231250l5cf27cb9m9102175799ccc0ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1c9df1524c83aadc2197c2163f82917b.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Welcome, Morgan!

Have you participated in any ARGs as a player? If so, which ones? And
what did you learn from them? (I'm always curious about insights from
people looking at a subject with fresh eyes.)

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com



On Tue, September 23, 2008 12:50 pm, Morgan Calhoon wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I'm a graduate student at the University of Buffalo and I'm studying
> how
> large scale, localized ARG games can be used to inform and activate
> people
> in a community. It will most likely involve a lot of large games that
> spring
> up at various locations and then disappear afterwards - kind of flash
> mob
> like. I'm starting to get some ideas together for my thesis project
> that
> will happen in March or April. I've created board games, card games,
> and
> street games, but I've never done a full fledged ARG.
>
> Is there anything I can help someone with as a way to get a little
> taste of
> what it will be like? Any suggestions or words of wisdom? I've been
> doing a
> lot of research, but it's just not the same as hands-on experience. I
> really
> want my thesis project to succeed.
>
> Thanks! Morgan
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>


Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


From michel.mcbride at gmail.com  Wed Sep 24 10:33:17 2008
From: michel.mcbride at gmail.com (Michel McBride-Charpentier)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:33:17 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Getting my ARG feet wet
Message-ID: <32e04c6f0809240733g16243164p1781ec2f2780d91b@mail.gmail.com>

First of all, I would suggest reading the timelines and wikis of previous
ARGs if you're completely unfamiliar with how they play out and develop.

If you've never participated in one before, then there's a great opportunity
coming up with Jane McGonigal's latest game Superstruct. The website just
went live a couple of days ago, but the game officially begins October 6th.

Check it out: http://www.superstructgame.org/

I'm in a similar position, where I have an interest in creating ARGs, but
only very limited exposure and experience with them. I feel that Superstruct
is a perfect introduction to the ARG design and development process because
it involves the creation of content on the part of the players. As I
understand it, you'll be able to create your own stories within the
Superstruct universe using tools such as Youtube and blogs and Facebook and
all the other web applications used in actually designing an ARG.

From Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk  Wed Sep 24 11:07:05 2008
From: Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk (Craig Harkness)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 16:07:05 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
In-Reply-To: <mailman.9.1222264802.21184.arg_discuss@igda.org>
References: <mailman.9.1222264802.21184.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <48DA65A9.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>

Hello all,

I am working in E-learning for the University of Portsmouth's Faculty of Creative and Cultural Industries and I am trying to introduce an educational ARG looking at effectual reasoning and entrepreneurial thinking in association with our Centre for Enterprise . We are currently looking at designing the ARG over the course of this academic year ready for an initial trial in the next and I would welcome any suggestions or advice that this group may have to offer.

Thanks in advance

Craig H





From sjoerdwennekes at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 24 11:28:10 2008
From: sjoerdwennekes at hotmail.com (Sjoerd Wennekes)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:28:10 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
In-Reply-To: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
References: <48D7BDA3.5060506@shuttleworthfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <BAY112-W791FD746F367AA99C2E1AC0450@phx.gbl>

Hi Steve,

I have experience with ARG's in school.
This summer I graduated from art school.
There I follwed the course 'Design for Virtual Theatre and Games', there we had our fair portions of ARG's.
We made them, we studied them and we played them.
The head of this course is Evert Hoogendoorn and he is also active on this SIG.
My school is in The Netherlands and the website is in dutch.
I don't think you can read it, but here is the url.
www.dvtg.nl

Greetings
Sjoerd Wennekes



> Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 17:45:39 +0200
> From: steve.vosloo at shuttleworthfoundation.org
> To: arg_discuss at igda.org
> Subject: [arg_discuss] ARGs in schools
> 
> If this topic has been covered on the list already, my apologies. Please can you point me to any people with experience of, or resources related to, running ARGs in schools. 
> 
> Thanks,
> Steve
> 
> -- 
> Steve Vosloo
> Fellow, Communication and Analytical Skills Development
> The Shuttleworth Foundation
> 
> Tel: +27 21 970 1240 | Fax: +27 21 970 1241
> Web: www.shuttleworthfoundation.org
> Blog: www.innovatingeducation.wordpress.com
> 
> Email disclaimer: wiki.tsf.org.za/EmailDisclaimer
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

From andrhia at gmail.com  Wed Sep 24 11:35:43 2008
From: andrhia at gmail.com (Andrea Phillips)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 11:35:43 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] We have... a calendar! (Also chat announcements)
Message-ID: <5c799fd60809240835j41449fa5ubdabe640a70d0aaf@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry, guys, the beginning of the school year has been a rough time
for me, and it's been a damn-the-torpedoes period for my project on
top of that, so I have a little SIG business that's slid off my plate
and splattered all over the floor. So to speak.

To get started cleaning up my mess, first I'd like to introduce this
shiny new SIG GOOGLE CALENDAR.

You can see it by XML for your RSS readers:
http://www.google.com/calendar/feeds/imhrf2833alcelchdiqk0th6cc%40group.calendar.google.com/public/basic

Or subscribe in iCal for whatever calendar app you use:
http://www.google.com/calendar/ical/imhrf2833alcelchdiqk0th6cc%40group.calendar.google.com/public/basic.ics

Or just look at it in HTML:
http://www.google.com/calendar/embed?src=imhrf2833alcelchdiqk0th6cc%40group.calendar.google.com&ctz=America/New_York

If someone more clever than I could work out how to embed the calendar
into our Wiki page, that would be phenomenal. And if anybody would
like the ability to add or alter events on the calendar, drop me an
email and promise to use your power only for good, and I'll see what I
can do. You're welcome to add in when things like GDC and PICNIC are
going on, since I'm apparently oblivious to these things. :)

ON TO THE CALENDAR ITSELF: If you look closely, you'll notice that the
next chat is at 3am Eastern time tomorrow morning. Europe and
Australia, it's your time to shine! You may also notice that there's a
new formal chat scheduled for Tuesday Oct. 14 at 11am Eastern time. I
was, um, supposed to run one last week, but I missed it on my
calendar. So yeah. Sorry about that, I throw myself at your mercy and
beg forgiveness, you look nice today and do you know you smell good?
etc., etc.

And FINALLY, does anybody know of a way I can schedule reminder emails
about this stuff? Seriously, that would be a tremendous help to me.

-- 
Andrea Phillips
http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
Words * Culture * Interaction

From andrhia at gmail.com  Wed Sep 24 12:01:25 2008
From: andrhia at gmail.com (Andrea Phillips)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 12:01:25 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
In-Reply-To: <48DA65A9.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>
References: <mailman.9.1222264802.21184.arg_discuss@igda.org>
	<48DA65A9.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <5c799fd60809240901h2ba88a18l697d81b6601b34bf@mail.gmail.com>

I'm sure we have tons of suggestions and advice for you, but can you
be a little more specific about what kind of thing you're looking for?
:) Lists of free resources for blogs and email won't help you if
you're interested in interactive game design references, for example.

Also, potential responders, there are rather a lot of people in the
educational space on the list at this point -- so I suspect keeping
this stuff on the list rather than sending it to private email would
be helpful.

Cheers!

On Wed, Sep 24, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Craig Harkness
<Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am working in E-learning for the University of Portsmouth's Faculty of Creative and Cultural Industries and I am trying to introduce an educational ARG looking at effectual reasoning and entrepreneurial thinking in association with our Centre for Enterprise . We are currently looking at designing the ARG over the course of this academic year ready for an initial trial in the next and I would welcome any suggestions or advice that this group may have to offer.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Craig H
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>



-- 
Andrea Phillips
http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
Words * Culture * Interaction

From Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk  Thu Sep 25 10:57:51 2008
From: Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk (Craig Harkness)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 15:57:51 +0100
Subject: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
In-Reply-To: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
References: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <48DBB4FF.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>

Hi Andrea,

I was looking for more design related information, I've done some reading around the subject, Why I Love Bees and The Puppet Master Problem by Jane McGonigal as well as Suit Keen Renovator by J Turner and Ann Morrison have all given me ideas but wouldn't mind some more advice on the development of an ARG design, where to start, potential problems to watch out for etc .

Craig
____________________________________

Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 12:01:25 -0400
From: "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
To: "Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG" <arg_discuss at igda.org>
Message-ID:
	<5c799fd60809240901h2ba88a18l697d81b6601b34bf at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I'm sure we have tons of suggestions and advice for you, but can you
be a little more specific about what kind of thing you're looking for?
:) Lists of free resources for blogs and email won't help you if
you're interested in interactive game design references, for example.

Also, potential responders, there are rather a lot of people in the
educational space on the list at this point -- so I suspect keeping
this stuff on the list rather than sending it to private email would
be helpful.

Cheers!

On Wed, Sep 24, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Craig Harkness
<Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am working in E-learning for the University of Portsmouth's Faculty of Creative and Cultural Industries and I am trying to introduce an educational ARG looking at effectual reasoning and entrepreneurial thinking in association with our Centre for Enterprise . We are currently looking at designing the ARG over the course of this academic year ready for an initial trial in the next and I would welcome any suggestions or advice that this group may have to offer.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Craig H
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org 
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss 
>



-- 
Andrea Phillips
http://www.deusexmachinatio.com 
Words * Culture * Interaction


------------------------------

_______________________________________________
ARG_Discuss mailing list
ARG_Discuss at igda.org 
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss 


End of ARG_Discuss Digest, Vol 37, Issue 18
*******************************************




From morgan at calhoonplay.com  Thu Sep 25 11:00:43 2008
From: morgan at calhoonplay.com (Morgan Calhoon)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 11:00:43 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG_Discuss Digest, Vol 37, Issue 18
In-Reply-To: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
References: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
Message-ID: <d5c4f7d10809250800t2ba9402cy801f9531004b9396@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Michel!

I've tried to participate in a few ARGs that I've found on the unfiction
website, but none of them have lasted very long or players get bored with
them and move on. So I've never played one to its completion. I have read a
bunch of post mortems or guides written by players while playing them.

Looks like I'll start playing Superstruct and see how that works out.

Since I'm planning on doing a localized game, I'm going to use a lot more
real world objects, interactions, and activities - I'm still going to use
the internet, but not as heavily as most have used in the past. I think the
internet is a great way to form a community for ARGs, but the nature of it
still had the potential for players to feel a little removed from the game
and the other participants. I want to see how more face to face interaction
effects the community that forms. Is it stronger? Does it last longer? Does
it continue to grow? Do people use it to accomplish anything?

I really want to test an ARG game that is more specific to the people
playing and the lives they have. I hope it will make players feel more
invested. I know this is somewhat impossible for games that are meant to
involve people from a variety of different geographic areas - so I'm curious
to see what changes and if my predictions are correct. I'm really trying to
find a local non-profit group to work with. There's a couple I'm interested
in, but I'm waiting to see which one ends up working out.

Although I haven't made a functioning ARG yet, I have been doing a lot of
interactive experiments to test people's limits and creativity. It seemed
like an easier way for me to quickly pinpoint which action or activity
worked instead of doing a full fledged game and then trying to figure out
which actions were the problem. It's also pretty easy to get one of my
little experiments together - so if it fails, I'm not too heart broken.

Thanks everyone! Morgan

From nathan at studiocypher.com  Thu Sep 25 13:44:11 2008
From: nathan at studiocypher.com (Nathan Mishler)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 13:44:11 -0400
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG_Discuss Digest, Vol 37, Issue 18
In-Reply-To: <d5c4f7d10809250800t2ba9402cy801f9531004b9396@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
	<d5c4f7d10809250800t2ba9402cy801f9531004b9396@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8fc5b2700809251044h7bddfa5p3f73d0c1f302b8cd@mail.gmail.com>

Hey Morgan,

In the past Studio Cypher has helped run a series of academic conferences
called Ludium that were all in real space, had a game element, and also an
argy sort of lore / alternate world component. We found that our players
(academics, games industry professionals, and lawyers among other things)
played the Ludium the way that ARG players approach args. Some tested
boundries and tried to figure out the limits of the game, some really got
into their role and roleplayed, and some really just wanted to get into the
"interesting bits."

You can see the rules and results for Ludium 2 here

http://www.studiocypher.com/pages/ludium

Indiana University is also currently running an arg with a big real world
component but it just launched and it's very local to the IU campus so I'm
not sure there's much to see or learn from just yet.

On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 11:00 AM, Morgan Calhoon <morgan at calhoonplay.com>wrote:

> Thanks Michel!
>
> I've tried to participate in a few ARGs that I've found on the unfiction
> website, but none of them have lasted very long or players get bored with
> them and move on. So I've never played one to its completion. I have read a
> bunch of post mortems or guides written by players while playing them.
>
> Looks like I'll start playing Superstruct and see how that works out.
>
> Since I'm planning on doing a localized game, I'm going to use a lot more
> real world objects, interactions, and activities - I'm still going to use
> the internet, but not as heavily as most have used in the past. I think the
> internet is a great way to form a community for ARGs, but the nature of it
> still had the potential for players to feel a little removed from the game
> and the other participants. I want to see how more face to face interaction
> effects the community that forms. Is it stronger? Does it last longer? Does
> it continue to grow? Do people use it to accomplish anything?
>
> I really want to test an ARG game that is more specific to the people
> playing and the lives they have. I hope it will make players feel more
> invested. I know this is somewhat impossible for games that are meant to
> involve people from a variety of different geographic areas - so I'm
> curious
> to see what changes and if my predictions are correct. I'm really trying to
> find a local non-profit group to work with. There's a couple I'm interested
> in, but I'm waiting to see which one ends up working out.
>
> Although I haven't made a functioning ARG yet, I have been doing a lot of
> interactive experiments to test people's limits and creativity. It seemed
> like an easier way for me to quickly pinpoint which action or activity
> worked instead of doing a full fledged game and then trying to figure out
> which actions were the problem. It's also pretty easy to get one of my
> little experiments together - so if it fails, I'm not too heart broken.
>
> Thanks everyone! Morgan
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>

From adrijackmarie at gmail.com  Thu Sep 25 14:44:30 2008
From: adrijackmarie at gmail.com (Adrien MARIE)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 20:44:30 +0200
Subject: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
In-Reply-To: <48DBB4FF.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>
References: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
	<48DBB4FF.6679.00AB.0@port.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <0938831B-B5E8-4503-BFE5-15490E29B277@gmail.com>

Hi Craig,

Andrea,

This is something I'd have to know 'bout due to my relative investment  
into the 'design' section for the site.
mea culpa

On 25 Sep 2008, at 4:57, Craig Harkness wrote:

> Hi Andrea,
>
> I was looking for more design related information, I've done some  
> reading around the subject, Why I Love Bees and The Puppet Master  
> Problem by Jane McGonigal as well as Suit Keen Renovator by J Turner  
> and Ann Morrison have all given me ideas but wouldn't mind some more  
> advice on the development of an ARG design, where to start,  
> potential problems to watch out for etc .
>
> Craig
> ____________________________________
>
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 12:01:25 -0400
> From: "Andrea Phillips" <andrhia at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [arg_discuss] Enterprise and ARGs
> To: "Discussion list of the IGDA ARG SIG" <arg_discuss at igda.org>
> Message-ID:
> 	<5c799fd60809240901h2ba88a18l697d81b6601b34bf at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I'm sure we have tons of suggestions and advice for you, but can you
> be a little more specific about what kind of thing you're looking for?
> :) Lists of free resources for blogs and email won't help you if
> you're interested in interactive game design references, for example.
>
> Also, potential responders, there are rather a lot of people in the
> educational space on the list at this point -- so I suspect keeping
> this stuff on the list rather than sending it to private email would
> be helpful.
>
> Cheers!
>
> On Wed, Sep 24, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Craig Harkness
> <Craig.Harkness at port.ac.uk> wrote:
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I am working in E-learning for the University of Portsmouth's  
>> Faculty of Creative and Cultural Industries and I am trying to  
>> introduce an educational ARG looking at effectual reasoning and  
>> entrepreneurial thinking in association with our Centre for  
>> Enterprise . We are currently looking at designing the ARG over the  
>> course of this academic year ready for an initial trial in the next  
>> and I would welcome any suggestions or advice that this group may  
>> have to offer.
>>
>> Thanks in advance
>>
>> Craig H
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARG_Discuss mailing list
>> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Andrea Phillips
> http://www.deusexmachinatio.com
> Words * Culture * Interaction
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss
>
>
> End of ARG_Discuss Digest, Vol 37, Issue 18
> *******************************************
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ARG_Discuss mailing list
> ARG_Discuss at igda.org
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/arg_discuss


From wendeth at wendydespain.com  Thu Sep 25 22:10:11 2008
From: wendeth at wendydespain.com (Wendy Despain)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 19:10:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [arg_discuss] ARG_Discuss Digest, Vol 37, Issue 18
In-Reply-To: <d5c4f7d10809250800t2ba9402cy801f9531004b9396@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.9.1222351203.54110.arg_discuss@igda.org>
	<d5c4f7d10809250800t2ba9402cy801f9531004b9396@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9c8d5834617aae2e943d72c3d1c1dd1a.squirrel@webmail.wendydespain.com>

Hey Morgan,

Can you tell us more about how you run your experiments? (including
how you gather people together for them) It sounds very interesting.

Wendy Despain
quantumcontent.com


On Thu, September 25, 2008 8:00 am, Morgan Calhoon wrote:

> which actions were the problem. It's also pretty easy to get one of my
> little experiments together - so if it fails, I'm not too heart
> broken.